I get what the Hussite wagon was trying to accomplish, in history, the Czech would use them to construct makeshift palisade walls for their war camps. I suppose reducing incoming damage if a projectile touches its hitbox was meant to reflect that. I honestly think, now that we have the centurion with the Romans, it should provide a static pierce armor bonus in a radios around it to all friendly units in range. Maybe even a slight buff to gunpowder unit damage or accuracy to synergize with the Bohemian civ bonuses too.
I think it should be garrisonable like the ram and just fire extra projectiles the more units you put in to them and it also offers "protection" to the units inside which sort of fits the historical use.
take away its attack and allow it to garrison a number of ranged units; attacks as all of those units with same number of projectiles - would be exactly what it was historically and effectively turn it into a counter-cavalry defence for ranged units
Or give it good anti-cavalerie stats. The whole historical thing about the hussite was that their wagon tactics could absolutely wreck the german heavy cavalerie.
Been saying it since they introduced them. Did a senior paper on the bohemian wars they would make sharp weapons into the wagons so they can't be climbed.
The Hussite wagon could be re-worked to work similar to the Roman's Centurions, giving specific units a buff while nearby. Maybe +1 pierce armor to all units in a radius, or a stronger but more limited buff instead.
I didn't realize the Donjon's didn't gain extra arrows from Sergeants; that would be a great buff for the civ. Also would be cool if they could build some other buildings, though that might be too strong tbh.
The most inexplicable problem with Hussite wagon (for me) is how awkwardly the positioning for the 'moving shield' ability interacts with it being a ranged unit. The units most happy to get shielding from ranged are usually melee units (the meat shield supposed to protect your ranged), but they can't actually use it because they'll be in front of it. And the wagons themselves do somewhat require melee protection because they themselves can't tank melee. They're basically making themselves redundant by being a meat shield that requires you to already have a meat shield.
nah mate it's very simple in practice it's a no micro unit, made only for hand cannoners, you slap 3 of em in a group of boom boys and forget about them, zero micro required, if melee attacks them they get offed by the cannoners, if ranged attacks them, they can't deal with the cannons couse they are naturaly in the way, trash cant deal with them at all , it's the ultimate fire and forget unit. Only thing that counters it is some mangonels or just too much cav
for what I've noticed, Hussite Wagons share the position with melee infantry in regular formations, wich puts them ahead of archers what bothers me is that if you research siege engineers, hussite wagons step side by side with hand canoneers, instead of in front to
nope, you arent wrong, urumi are glass cannons that cannot actually stand in the backlines to dish out damage. So, they are glass cannons that have to wade into fights. Its like you cannot engage with them and must put them behind the elephant archers to help clear out any melee units that close the gap, but then, you will lose your entire army to just three mangonels.
yep, I think they have a lot of potential in specific matchups, especially with the better skirms, but archer/ca are way too common for them to be useful in most matches. But they can trade absurdly well against the right comp, like, against cav/halb they just eviscerate
@@ezrahinkley6132 I've killed paladin with a nice group of fully upgraded Urumi. Yes they suck against ranged but it's so satisfying to just flatten a group of melee units with them.
Its very ironic that Dravidians' melee are glass cannon infantry and light cavalry, while their ranged is elephant archers. If their melee was tankier it would help them tremendously.
Sergeants, make them like the dwarfs from age of mythology😀. Would be cool to see them as a sort of villager. Also the idea of additional arrows for donjon would make them great!
I thought of making them HP centurions: basically each one boost hp of nearby infantry/cavalry (not other serjeants) 1% adding up to 10% to regular swordsman adds 6 hp and knights adds 12, imperial age adds 7 to champions and 14 to cavaliers, wich along their armor reach a slightly better hp than frank cavaliers, but with the extra armor, or it's a bad idea?
Make them Ulfsarks: able to build any building, faster than average infantry, spammable but weak, and you can turn villagers into them at any time just by paying a little gold. Actually I have no idea if any of that would be good, AoM just has really good synergy and the way the different civs work with their unique mechanics is so good. I really wish AoM had taken off instead of AoK. Only without the Atlanteans, those fuckers are way too OP.
for the Sarjeant, i agree they are terrible as a main army composition, however i think they can be great as a post imp raiding tool, if you make Donjons to take map control on the sides and use them to send Sarjeants into your opponents eco as if they were Hussar (8 pierce armor is huge!), and if you want you can even make more Donjons with them if your opponent doesnt react properly (though i'd assume at high level they probably all do) to deny more resources from your opponent.
Exactly. I use Serjeants mostly as raiding units (if I don't need infantry to counter enemy, then it's main force) - while cavalry comes and has to run away as soon as villagers garrison TC or reinforcements arrive, Donjon stays, denies resources even under castle, and produces even more raiding units!
My buff proposals for each of the units: Jaguar Warriors can move through trees Teutonic Knights get a Dark Souls dodge roll on a cooldown, getting them some i-frames and allowing them to close the distance to ranged units Urumi Swordsman start wearing clothes Persians get a Monk bonus with +100% Conversion speed for elephant units so losing them to enemy monks will only be temporary Hussite Wagons can change their form like Trebuchets allowing units to garrison in them in stationary form which grants greatly increased defense as well
I think the Hussite Wagon would be cool as some kind of mobile wall: Up their hitbox, so nothing can pass throu them, when they are close to each other and give them the ability to form a line as a formation. They can keep their low attack, but would be usefull to shield range units and monks and so on fom meeley units. And there would be some nice micro potential with blocking on high level games.
The only time I've gotten Hussite Wagons to work was when my opponent castle dropped me as Koreans and my opponent started flooding my base with War Wagons. The high pierce armor and attack makes them able to counter ranged units very well. But they're so slow and they die instantly to practically any melee unit.
Teutonic Knights are definitley not desrving a spot on this List, they are a amazing part of the ultimate teuton composition with crenelation castles, bbc and onagers. Yes, on open maps in a 1v1 scenario they are missing out on the mobility, but on closed maps especially against civs without bracer or a strong ranged option this unit can be the game winnig move, even if you are just holding a castle in an important spot with them
I think the problem right now is that you are able to use the excellent teutonic champions more effectively due to lower cost, faster production time, and higher speed. The advantage of being able to start creating an army of them before you have a castle cannot be overstated as well. You get +1 armour to barracks/stable units with teutons in castle and imperial, so the champion is already able to tank very well in melee and it makes the knight somewhat redundant.
Flaming camel, I was so sure that would be the nr 1. And it wasn't even an honourable mention...! Seems like they've been buffed enough since your harsh critic of years ago. For me, it iss THE meme UU and unit at large of AoE II.
yeah so for the Hussite wagon... - remove the secondary projectiles so it doesn't get stuck on an interrupted volley when microed - increase the object height so it catches more arrows
I remember watching ZeroEmpires cast Aztec or Mayan mirror matches, or Aztec vs Mayan and sometimes if it was a heavy eagle committment one player would go Jaguar Warrior... but I don't recall ever seing an Aztec player using them since The Forgotten expansion came out.
For urumi, increase attack speed, increase/add a bit of splash damage and increase movement speed a little. Then its truly more representative of the actual urumi swordsman and makes it a bit more viable. Not sure if creation time needs a buff but wouldn't mind that either.
I think with Aztecs the thing is that it's easier and quicker to go for them instead of waiting for champion. Like I've seen it as a quick answer to oponent going for shotels or karambits and they are what you'd went for if oponent go for UU that would be problematic for champions like Obuch, Serjant but this are civ match up situations and only when oponent goes for his own UU and that's why Jaguar is so rarely seen since there is little reason to field him otherwise as infantry still gets very little play beside post imp and at that point you would be going for your own champs most likely.
Jaguars I agree but it is a 2 part issue: 1: As you said, aztec champions are strong enough for the most part already. Champions are easier to mass being trained at a baracks instead of castle though the cost aint that bad. 2: Aztecs are a native american civ, as such they have no cav units, this leaves them at risk from most factions able to field mounted units. As a byzantine I always grin when I see a native faction on the enemy team knowing my cataphracts are going to crash through them and there is little they can do to stop the horde Tutonic knights are pretty solid in frontline combat, holding their one against most units in a melee and just need something to back them up in ranged. I imagine that in a team game with good coordination, a tueton and britian could make a miserable duo with the knights holding the line and the longbows negating their inablity to handy anything with range. Elephants there only major drawback is the conversion, like the teutons they need something ranged backing them up, however war elephants are stupidly powerful if a fight can be forced, being unmatched in terms of power/pop cap. The conversion neuters them as any AOE vetren is going to use a monk horde against persia, my dad steals the trickle of AI elephants until he has amassed 30 or so then crushes the enemy line with a swarm. I disagree on the wagon. Those things are fucking brutal, I lost hundreds of maxed out cataphracts, paladins and even heavy camels to those fucking carts and the upgraded bombards. Most units have a few approaches to dealing with them, such as all the others on the list, all I can find on how to counter the wagon is butt rush bohemia factions before they get wagons or invest heavily in onagers.
I think the main buff to elephants would be making them resistant to conversions just like light cavalry, that would make so they are still countered by the monks due to how much your enemy gains by converting them but not so hardly. That alone may be good enough, i think halberdier's hard counter can remain since persians have access to trash xbows which decimate them.
yeah i agree war elephants have too many counters. monks, camels, halbs. halbs are insane vs elephants because they have a special anti elephant bonus that stacks on top of anti cav bonus, but persians also have great scout/knight line so its hard to find a good scneario for the chonk bois. the trashbows are fun but expensive to tech into in a regular game. do you think giving them heresy whould be too good as a knight civ or make war elephants very hard to counter or whould it be a good buff?
imo the issue with hussite wagon is how little damage it has. its really tanky and has a ton of pierce armor, but when it comes to killing, it just can't. any melle unit is great vs it, and the goofy extra shots make it really clunky to use. the ranged resist ability is cool, but doesn't work in all ranges and you need your units right behind it, which isn't easy to do in the middle of a battle. and bohemians don't really have a unit with high damage that has low hp to use with the wagon, pikeman/halb also works to tank/meatshield (even though not as good but its a trash unit) but it also defends your archers/handcannons/bbc from cav
Infantry UUs, not surprised. Compare the power level of Infantry UU to Conqs, Mangudai, Leitis, or Coustillier, and most Infantry UU is just not spectacular enough. They need some buffs around the board so that Teutons or Aztecs getting a castle up makes me actually think about how they might suddenly incorporate their UU into their army (in at least some common scenarios). Ideally I think stat/effect buffs and maybe even higher costs to truly differentiate Infantry UU from Champions. If I want a cheap melee unit, most civs with Infantry UU have FU Champs with additional bonuses. Make Infantry UUs a considerably more expensive specialist with a higher to compensate for their cost. TKs should be fearsome tanks, not slow target practice for the opponent's archers or castles. Jaguars could be deadly in melee combat in general (bonus vs cavalry as well maybe?), but poorly armoured and easy to take down from range. However, there is a fundamental challenge in AoE2 w.r.t infantry, and that is the lack of easily accessible hard counters. Either XBows counter infantry hard, in which case they're useless, or they don't, in which case it can be REALLY difficult to deal with an infantry push if slightly behind, as opposed to the possibility of adding Mangonels or Skirms vs XBows and Monks or Pikes vs Knights. Maybe give Scorpions a massive bonus vs infantry? Or in a cursed twist give light cav bonus dmg vs infantry (don't). I don't think Infantry units can be as strong as cavalry or archers until they are as easily counterable.
I remember when it came out, even without wootz steel, people were comparing and saying urimi swordsman was a powerhouse in melle with the aoe charge vs most units
Nice video as always, bro 💪. I thought that the portuguese's unique unit would be here, because of that patch that changed its damage completely, but maybe it is not performing that bad.
There was a patch soon after that added buffs to the organ gun, so it does pretty well now. It's better than the old organ gun against pretty much everything except siege, buildings, or anything with high pierce armor.
Is way worse and needs more protection (Especially vs knights and onagers), but is still pretty amazing vs infantry and archers I can't see this unit being on the list honestly
Urumis in teamgames on maps like nomad where you have enough res and castles, can be strong. But u need a big mass and 4-5 castle production + Opponents without Arbs or at least BBC. Think for 1v1 not viable at all.
I think that i you give hussite wagons ability to garisson units like rams have and if they are ranged units it will shoot additional projectiles kinda like a tower it could be a really cool unit. Some numbers on cost or stats woudl need to change definitely but the concept could be really good in my opinion. They were used as a makeshift baricades wnich soldiers could hide in and shoot from them so it woul dmake sense to me this way.
I never noticed the Hussite Wagon 'breathes' when idle. Maybe the dudes inside can't sit still lol. Also: it may not be awful (honestly idk), but the Ratha is such a weird unit for me that I never make. Just the fact that it can be countered by spears and skirms makes it feel like it has too many counters to be worth it.
Jaguars should have higher atk, +3 to stand out more against Champions, or more armor to take on Infantry better. TK's do a much better job in the anti-Infantry as they can actually take hits. Urumis really need Siege Taxis to get value and some much needed mobility. Dravidians do get cheaper SIege Towers. Biggest problem with Serjeants and Donjons is their low dmg. Donjons don't get more atk with Age ups, only more arrows.
I'm surprised to not see Karambit warrior in the list. That thing dies faster than its produced. About champion being better to use than urumi and jaguars, wouldn't the same hold true for Berserkers and Samurais? Curious to know if those were on your mind for honorable mentions.
3:45 The Urumis are really good for pure melee combat, when the units are packed tightly together. They beat paladins with equal resources on both sides. They also defeat TKs and Boyars.
While I agree making Teutonic knights the bulk of your army is pretty weak, I do believe they have a great situational strength. They create very fast and require no upgrades to be cost effective against +90% of melee units. I often mix them in when facing heavy cavalry, or about any infantry unit this isn't a jaguar, samurai or Dravidian.
I use them every game lmao. They are not an main unit, they are not for attacking. They are great at defending siege and other defensive stuff. They kill palandins 1v1, thats insane. I mix teutonic knights with bbcs, skirms and some cav for raiding after the wall or the castle is going down and it works everytime, well not so good against poles tbf.
Funny that you mention campaign, I did just beat the final Barbarossa campaign mission earlier with Elite Teutonic Knight Spam. They do suck in multiplayer because they are very easy to counter.
3:20 the problem with urumis is that they're an anti-infantry unit on a civ that doesn't struggle against infantry, so they're stuck in a weird place in terms of niche regarding the civ. Also, the charge attack only works when you can actually retreat from the engagement after, which they currently can't. If they got a speed boost then maybe they could fill that niche better, or maybe the charge attack could apply to buildings to have a makeshift siege unit. It's a really cool unit imo, it just doesn't have a place in 1v1 and infantry in general is not favored in team games EDIT: the biggest war elephant nerf was to their sound design ;-; give us back the cool trumpet sounds 😂 (I do agree persians are the problem overall. I can't wait for their rework)
teutonic knight with ram or siege tower is fine. urumi with elephant archer is good jaguar warrior compliment champ, siege, eagle warrior and monk but still not good enough as not cost effective enough as cant beat samurai, urumi warrior and buff legionnaire. if they cost effective vs buff legionnaire, it will do
Jaguar Warriors have been around since forever, and stat-wise they're fine, but my main quarrel with the unit is that they cannot even chase the infantry units they are supposed to counter. I'd give them a chargeable sprint ability, akin to a zealot from SC2, maybe even with the bonus dmg on impact. You could use them to assault enemy lines by quickly closing the gap, or in ambushes, you know, like a...jaguar.
2:00 What do you think about giving them +1 pierce armor? It would buff them against their biggest weaknesses, and yet they could still be countered by said weaknesses.
Poor Jaguar Warriors. They're an infantry counter when infantry is rarely the main thing anyone tries to end the game with. Even Japanese and Vikings, "infantry" civs, prefer to use arbalests.
I love the hussite wagon :( ..but I admit it's rather bad compared to other unique units :D Though not useless, but very situational. I find it best to use in castle age, before bombard canons come out or there are too many monks around, drop a castle and push with them and they are actually quite difficult to deal with if you mix in with some pikemen. On some specific maps, like Amazon tunnel you can even use their support bonus, but yeah, in most cases it just doesn't work.
Honestly: I think Jaguar Warriors should make like Legionnaire and replace Aztec champions, give them some kind of...something? Else for their unique. Thematically a fast raider would be pretty good but I can't say I'm a pro in balance. It just feels like, yes. They are basically replaced by champion. Why not...replace champion? Adjust stats so they don't get broken by it.
1:55 only non-elite TKs have been buffed in receiving more melee armor (5 -> 7) alongside more attack (12 -> 14) and HPs (70 -> 80). I think it is justified because they were clearly underpowered and not on par with elite TKs. Other than that, both TKs and ETKs received buffs in speed (0.65 -> 0.8) and cost (85F 40G -> 85F 30G).
In theory it should work. The Hussite Wagon has one range less than archers and skirmishers, so it should protect them. The problem is that no one stays still long enough for that to pay off. Eventually, you have to love. That’s when the Hussite Wagon’s micro problems rear it’s ugly head. It doesn’t fire a new main projectile until _all_ its projectiles are fired. _Firing again resumes where it it last left off._ It really needs to be able fire everything all at once. That would solve so many issues with this unit.
Jaguar Warriors suck. If you are Aztecs you already have the edge in infantry mirror. Plus opponents won't be making the spear line against you. Teutonic Knights are a bit better. They are a good siege escort and dominate most melee fights. Against certain compositions like Frank Paladin + Axemen or Malian Gbeto + Cav combo. Dravidians need a tank to protect their Elephant Archers. Urumi Swordsmen, Light Cavalry, or Battle Elephants don't cut it. Other useless units: Condotierri, for Italians themselves. Its only purpose is a fast Imperial Age counter to gunpowder, but Italians are not in dire need of that. Shotels, I get disappointed whenever I make these. Decent raiders but are so fragile and have less of a bonus against buildings. Organ Guns, they do crap damage and spread compared to scorpions. It didn't help that they got nerfed in the patch.
The wagon is only really good vs brits or another archer civ. A few wagons can smash archer balls vs ppl that dont have melee units with their archers. Otherwise, yeah, they need love.
The useless wagon should have high armor (both types ) as well as unique option to auto stand sideways against enemy units. It is not the best place for archers so when units are garrisoned additional gunpowder projectiles should add
hussite wagons want to reduce the dmg taken by units behind them except that generally speaking, once you have a sizable ammount of UUs AND other ranged units youre probaly both just patrolling into each other with little micro, meaning the wagons get shot first and the micro that does exist temds to be with large arb groups that 1 shot your units regardless
Ofcourse he doesnt like the Wagon, it's the only unit in the game that's worse if you micro it, because then it continues it's shot cycle xD , the unit is perfect if you cant be arsed to micro it, put 3-4 of em in the archer group and just forget about them, they will naturally always be in front to protect them and be fine.Its such a dumb unit you dont need to do anything ":D
I think the Hussite wagon should just provide a flat pierce armor buff to units in a radius similar to the centurion's melee attack buff. Not sure it would solve the issue with them altogether, but it would mostly remove the micro issue.
I think the issue with the Urumi Swordsman is that it would ideally be used the same way you use the Shotel Warrior. It does not have the speed the Shotel warrior has though so it ends up sucking. Also, the Urumi Warrior does not seem to work against buildings (I think) which is a major drawback. I too am sad the Teutonic Knight is not better. To me it has always been the coolest looking unit in the game. It has such an ominous look, it is scary to see coming against you. The only success I've had with it is garrisoning them in rams then having them jump out and join in attacking building. Evan the non-Elite excels against buildings.
Hussite wagon is fine, it actually works great for lower elo team game players. Not a lot of micro in an xbow xbow fight, have literally 1-2 of those guys can really help. As a 1600 player I also died hard against a Hussite Wagon play on nomad as they can sit under a tax and kill all the vils that can’t fit in your tc at the start of castle
Maybe its because of the type of game we play. My friends and i play AoE like a Total War lol. Huge battles. Sometimes PVP, sometimes PVE. Not the 'Attack early and dont let them do anything' like the pros do. The enemy AI can be ruthless in Extreme. One of my friends use the Hussite wagon and have helped us immensely by absorbing the enemy aggro. Specially when they have like 400 missile units. I guess they work on those situations only.
For war elephants I think they should only be converted at short distances (like siege). Also, mahouts should be more expensive but change its effect to "war elephants receive no bonus damage"
The problem with that is some civs suddenly become completely unable to deal with them if Monks don't work. You need 5 halbs or 6 pikes for just an even fight so getting surprised by even a small group can cause problems. If both your changes were implemented then Persians would be absolute cancer on arena and other closed maps.
I think the biggest change to war elephants should be Pykes dealing like +42 instead of the insane 62? That and maybe a little less food cost on the unit
Urumi swordsmen as basicly a swarm/raiding unit, not meant to fight on equal terms. They´re quiet fast and hit quiet hard for their cost. I´d say they´re a surprise unit. But other Units just do it better most of the time and can actually fight. Also never use Urimi in the default formation! always spread them out in staggered formation or don t use them at all. I´d love to see the Woad Raider buffed slightly.
Just an idea to throw out there: I think a bonus that could spice up the Jaguar Warrior is to give it a tiny (1 or 2) max HP boost upon defeating a non-siege unit. I think it would be best to have it needed to be healed, so that it could be incentive to build Jaguars to punish trash spam and mix in the beefy monks. Let me know if I'm crazy, because I do realise it's not very reliable and is also a little situational.
Jags - Classic unit but honestly belong to the wrong civ. Aztec already have arb, UT skirm, monks, champs and siege to deal with infantry. T Knights - This civ also already has similar champions and also armored knights. Guess easy way to buff is increase their speed ever so slightly. Or an extra pierce armor. Urumi - Yeah 0 pierce armor is such a joke. Just buff that 1 or 2. Infantry UU that dies to frikkin skirms. Some speed would be cool since civ has mobility issues but would probably be busted with the charge attack. War ele - Wonky meme unit overall. Is there even a way to buff these so they’re fair for all ELO and all maps? Waiting for that civ redesign. Sergeants - Beefy but unable to do the damage. Question is which age you want them to be viable in. I hate tower plays to I say castle or imp. Just a weird suggestion - maybe make UT so they can be created fast from TCs instead? That way, you can pump them out fast once tech comes, and do it again later for shock value. Hussite - Yeah I get the idea. But Hera is absolutely right. Maybe make them able to fortify, for another pierce armor and defense range? So they’re bad when mobile but useful to take over hills. Don’t think I want them to be good by themselves, we already have war wagon for that.
But if your opponent is on full archers, which is quite common, just having 5-6 Hussite wagons on the battlefield is enough to stop any archer army, or push into his base. Wagons don’t kill archers very quickly but they are very resistant to arrows, they can sit under town Centers and harass enemy villagers. Unless your opponent invests in some melee units he won’t be able to do anything to stop you. Why don’t people use the wagons against archers in early Castle age? On paper it seems so effective.
The biggest problem with Hussite wagons is their firing animation. The first projectile (the big one) does the 17/20 damage, then they do two rounds of spray projectiles that do 1 damage, like mangonels. They must finish the whole animation before they'll fire the big shot again. This is the biggest problem the unit has, if they could be micro'ed they would be quite strong in small groups, like tanky war wagons but with the damage of a jannisary.
urumi swordsmen are really awkward. id like to see them move a bit faster.or (preferably) be a bit cheaper, then they could fill a similar role to Karambits being a cheap disposable infantry unit that dies really fast to pierce damage but trading population efficiency and rock bottom price for a slightly more expensive unit that specializes in burst damage
Teutons can get the Crusader as an unique unit. Basically a beefed up Paladin with conversion resistance and small bonus damage against infantry (or +1 range with their lance if that's too OP). Their weakness will be their cost, training time and speed
I feel like beside pike-spam, most infantry are useless. There's not even an incentive to use them as all non-infantry units can effortlessly shred them. The devs really should rework the whole infantry system.
The germans have kinda hussite wagons as their special unit instead of the Dragoons (anti cav cav) in Age of Empires 3. And it rips and tears ass. Maybe something similar for the AoE2 wagons?
Maybe Hussite Wagons should work similar like the Fambaa Shield Generator from Star Wars: Galactic Battlegrounds (Star Wars AoE2), units behind (or around) the wagon have a second bar like the Shrivamsha Rider.
Seargants are surprisingly effective against archer play and they beat most mid game infantry matchups. Sicilians are a blast to play infantry aggression into one tc castle drop with kt and ram transition. Any sergeants that survive fuedal are still viable on castle with +2 armor.
The hussite wagon should totally work somewhat like a siege ram; allowing units to jump inside and receive reduced damage while slightly increasing the attack of the wagon.
ideas for fixing some of the problems of these units: 1 Jaguar Warriors should move faster maybe not as fast as an Eagle Warrior but at least faster than the champion so they can catch better enemy units making them a preferable unit overall than the champion. 2 Teutonic Knight should cost less also Teutons may need a extra bonus for Siege Towers or rams ( i think the slow movement of the Teutonic Knight is part of the personality of this unit so in order to mantain that flavor but in order to improve in some way their mobility then tyou may use the Siege Towers). 3 urumi swordsman should get some pierce armor and perhaps their charge attack may have to be better. 4 The war elephant for me is ok, perhaps a slight cost reduction may enable this unit to become more playable. 5 yes Serjeants garrisoned in donjons should make donjons to fire more arrows, that wiould be more synergical for the Donjon rush. the idea of them enable to repair siege units and ships could also be nice. 6 The hussite Wagon should be enabled to transport foot units like a ram, also their damage reduction quirk should be improved or fixed in order to actually work, and perhaps their Hp or pierce armor should also be increased in order to actually work as a mobile wall that shoots
![ตีสิบเดย์ [FULL] | ตัวตึง! ปากกล้า! ท้ารบ! "ทนายไพศาล เรืองฤทธิ์"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/pU3dXTsaBVc/mqdefault.jpg)
0:57 that monk watching the sheep being killed between two relics in front of a monastery 💀
Aztecs, bro 😳 it is all about sacrifice haha
Tame sight, considering they used to sacrifice humans
Yeah imagine he was chopping up another vil 😮
Have you ever noticed the blood on the steps of an Aztec monastery? 💀
@@cxzact9204 maaaaaan, that is a nasty detail!! Good eyes 👏👏
When Urumi swordsman manage to approach a clump-up group of units and do their charge attack, this whole group of units get a mangonel shot.
I get what the Hussite wagon was trying to accomplish, in history, the Czech would use them to construct makeshift palisade walls for their war camps. I suppose reducing incoming damage if a projectile touches its hitbox was meant to reflect that. I honestly think, now that we have the centurion with the Romans, it should provide a static pierce armor bonus in a radios around it to all friendly units in range. Maybe even a slight buff to gunpowder unit damage or accuracy to synergize with the Bohemian civ bonuses too.
Agree - the Centurion is such a better implementation of this idea.
I think it should be garrisonable like the ram and just fire extra projectiles the more units you put in to them and it also offers "protection" to the units inside which sort of fits the historical use.
Hussite wagons is invented mostly against cavalry charges. on the contrary, it is weak against cavalry in the game.
@@Asterix958 specially Magyar Hussars, wich should be cutted as warm lard xD
Hope the devs see your comment, the pierce armor around idea sounds amazing.
They should make Hussite Wagon able to garrison ranged units. Then it would actually provide utility and act as a mini siege tower
this
take away its attack and allow it to garrison a number of ranged units; attacks as all of those units with same number of projectiles - would be exactly what it was historically and effectively turn it into a counter-cavalry defence for ranged units
Or maybe give it a radius where units get extra pierce armor
Or give it good anti-cavalerie stats. The whole historical thing about the hussite was that their wagon tactics could absolutely wreck the german heavy cavalerie.
Been saying it since they introduced them. Did a senior paper on the bohemian wars they would make sharp weapons into the wagons so they can't be climbed.
Hera: Why can't you just be normal?😭
Hussite Wagon: *Spits gunpowder
1111
The Hussite wagon could be re-worked to work similar to the Roman's Centurions, giving specific units a buff while nearby. Maybe +1 pierce armor to all units in a radius, or a stronger but more limited buff instead.
+1 pierce armor would be insane, in some matchups it literally cuts damage by half.
0:57 Monk watching the animal sacrifice 😆
Villager: At least it's not me 😢☠
I didn't realize the Donjon's didn't gain extra arrows from Sergeants; that would be a great buff for the civ. Also would be cool if they could build some other buildings, though that might be too strong tbh.
3:05 "Bois, I'm sendin' in my fully upgraded Elite Chicken Legs!"
“Did you guys win any campaigns with this unit?” 😂
The most inexplicable problem with Hussite wagon (for me) is how awkwardly the positioning for the 'moving shield' ability interacts with it being a ranged unit. The units most happy to get shielding from ranged are usually melee units (the meat shield supposed to protect your ranged), but they can't actually use it because they'll be in front of it. And the wagons themselves do somewhat require melee protection because they themselves can't tank melee. They're basically making themselves redundant by being a meat shield that requires you to already have a meat shield.
nah mate it's very simple in practice it's a no micro unit, made only for hand cannoners, you slap 3 of em in a group of boom boys and forget about them, zero micro required, if melee attacks them they get offed by the cannoners, if ranged attacks them, they can't deal with the cannons couse they are naturaly in the way, trash cant deal with them at all , it's the ultimate fire and forget unit. Only thing that counters it is some mangonels or just too much cav
for what I've noticed, Hussite Wagons share the position with melee infantry in regular formations, wich puts them ahead of archers
what bothers me is that if you research siege engineers, hussite wagons step side by side with hand canoneers, instead of in front to
Also rams fill the niche of being a pierce dmg shield while complimenting ranged units in destroying structures. Wagons don't compliment anything.
nope, you arent wrong, urumi are glass cannons that cannot actually stand in the backlines to dish out damage. So, they are glass cannons that have to wade into fights. Its like you cannot engage with them and must put them behind the elephant archers to help clear out any melee units that close the gap, but then, you will lose your entire army to just three mangonels.
yep, I think they have a lot of potential in specific matchups, especially with the better skirms, but archer/ca are way too common for them to be useful in most matches. But they can trade absurdly well against the right comp, like, against cav/halb they just eviscerate
@@ezrahinkley6132 I've killed paladin with a nice group of fully upgraded Urumi. Yes they suck against ranged but it's so satisfying to just flatten a group of melee units with them.
Its very ironic that Dravidians' melee are glass cannon infantry and light cavalry, while their ranged is elephant archers. If their melee was tankier it would help them tremendously.
Sergeants, make them like the dwarfs from age of mythology😀. Would be cool to see them as a sort of villager. Also the idea of additional arrows for donjon would make them great!
Really good at mining gold and stone but terrible on other resources?
I thought of making them HP centurions: basically each one boost hp of nearby infantry/cavalry (not other serjeants) 1% adding up to 10%
to regular swordsman adds 6 hp and knights adds 12, imperial age adds 7 to champions and 14 to cavaliers, wich along their armor reach a slightly better hp than frank cavaliers, but with the extra armor, or it's a bad idea?
@@stylesrjor even just regular amounts on stone and gold and worse than regular villagers on food and wood
Make them Ulfsarks: able to build any building, faster than average infantry, spammable but weak, and you can turn villagers into them at any time just by paying a little gold.
Actually I have no idea if any of that would be good, AoM just has really good synergy and the way the different civs work with their unique mechanics is so good. I really wish AoM had taken off instead of AoK. Only without the Atlanteans, those fuckers are way too OP.
@@Oberon4278 #fuckbraindeadatttyplayers
for the Sarjeant, i agree they are terrible as a main army composition, however i think they can be great as a post imp raiding tool, if you make Donjons to take map control on the sides and use them to send Sarjeants into your opponents eco as if they were Hussar (8 pierce armor is huge!), and if you want you can even make more Donjons with them if your opponent doesnt react properly (though i'd assume at high level they probably all do) to deny more resources from your opponent.
Exactly. I use Serjeants mostly as raiding units (if I don't need infantry to counter enemy, then it's main force) - while cavalry comes and has to run away as soon as villagers garrison TC or reinforcements arrive, Donjon stays, denies resources even under castle, and produces even more raiding units!
My buff proposals for each of the units:
Jaguar Warriors can move through trees
Teutonic Knights get a Dark Souls dodge roll on a cooldown, getting them some i-frames and allowing them to close the distance to ranged units
Urumi Swordsman start wearing clothes
Persians get a Monk bonus with +100% Conversion speed for elephant units so losing them to enemy monks will only be temporary
Hussite Wagons can change their form like Trebuchets allowing units to garrison in them in stationary form which grants greatly increased defense as well
I think the Hussite Wagon would be cool as some kind of mobile wall: Up their hitbox, so nothing can pass throu them, when they are close to each other and give them the ability to form a line as a formation. They can keep their low attack, but would be usefull to shield range units and monks and so on fom meeley units. And there would be some nice micro potential with blocking on high level games.
The only time I've gotten Hussite Wagons to work was when my opponent castle dropped me as Koreans and my opponent started flooding my base with War Wagons. The high pierce armor and attack makes them able to counter ranged units very well. But they're so slow and they die instantly to practically any melee unit.
Jaguar Warriors and Teutonic Knights both look cool as hell, apparently aesthetics don't correlate with performance
Teutonic Knights are definitley not desrving a spot on this List, they are a amazing part of the ultimate teuton composition with crenelation castles, bbc and onagers. Yes, on open maps in a 1v1 scenario they are missing out on the mobility, but on closed maps especially against civs without bracer or a strong ranged option this unit can be the game winnig move, even if you are just holding a castle in an important spot with them
I think the problem right now is that you are able to use the excellent teutonic champions more effectively due to lower cost, faster production time, and higher speed. The advantage of being able to start creating an army of them before you have a castle cannot be overstated as well. You get +1 armour to barracks/stable units with teutons in castle and imperial, so the champion is already able to tank very well in melee and it makes the knight somewhat redundant.
Halbs + Champ does the same work, cheaper and does not rely on castles
suurely teutonic knights are better than jaguars? maybe their fast creation time could give them a slight edge for some defense situations?
Flaming camel, I was so sure that would be the nr 1. And it wasn't even an honourable mention...! Seems like they've been buffed enough since your harsh critic of years ago. For me, it iss THE meme UU and unit at large of AoE II.
the level of pure disgust that flows through the ether when Hera talks about Hussite wagon...
yeah so for the Hussite wagon...
- remove the secondary projectiles so it doesn't get stuck on an interrupted volley when microed
- increase the object height so it catches more arrows
I remember watching ZeroEmpires cast Aztec or Mayan mirror matches, or Aztec vs Mayan and sometimes if it was a heavy eagle committment one player would go Jaguar Warrior... but I don't recall ever seing an Aztec player using them since The Forgotten expansion came out.
For urumi, increase attack speed, increase/add a bit of splash damage and increase movement speed a little. Then its truly more representative of the actual urumi swordsman and makes it a bit more viable. Not sure if creation time needs a buff but wouldn't mind that either.
Urumi should be having splash damage. That's the whole point about having an urumi. Otherise it just becomes a useless patta.
Urumi and Shotels are just useless
@@fuyoutubecknah, shotels are fine. They train faster than urumis and are good at raiding.
@@user-iz2tm5ih4e ok fair enough
Easy way to make the hussite wagon is to make it fire all projectiles at once and massively reduce frame delay. It's then at least usable.
Yeah, their attack mechanic is a big fail. Need to remove small projectiles or allow to shoot all projectiles at once.
I think with Aztecs the thing is that it's easier and quicker to go for them instead of waiting for champion. Like I've seen it as a quick answer to oponent going for shotels or karambits and they are what you'd went for if oponent go for UU that would be problematic for champions like Obuch, Serjant but this are civ match up situations and only when oponent goes for his own UU and that's why Jaguar is so rarely seen since there is little reason to field him otherwise as infantry still gets very little play beside post imp and at that point you would be going for your own champs most likely.
Jaguars I agree but it is a 2 part issue:
1: As you said, aztec champions are strong enough for the most part already. Champions are easier to mass being trained at a baracks instead of castle though the cost aint that bad.
2: Aztecs are a native american civ, as such they have no cav units, this leaves them at risk from most factions able to field mounted units. As a byzantine I always grin when I see a native faction on the enemy team knowing my cataphracts are going to crash through them and there is little they can do to stop the horde
Tutonic knights are pretty solid in frontline combat, holding their one against most units in a melee and just need something to back them up in ranged. I imagine that in a team game with good coordination, a tueton and britian could make a miserable duo with the knights holding the line and the longbows negating their inablity to handy anything with range.
Elephants there only major drawback is the conversion, like the teutons they need something ranged backing them up, however war elephants are stupidly powerful if a fight can be forced, being unmatched in terms of power/pop cap. The conversion neuters them as any AOE vetren is going to use a monk horde against persia, my dad steals the trickle of AI elephants until he has amassed 30 or so then crushes the enemy line with a swarm.
I disagree on the wagon. Those things are fucking brutal, I lost hundreds of maxed out cataphracts, paladins and even heavy camels to those fucking carts and the upgraded bombards. Most units have a few approaches to dealing with them, such as all the others on the list, all I can find on how to counter the wagon is butt rush bohemia factions before they get wagons or invest heavily in onagers.
I think the main buff to elephants would be making them resistant to conversions just like light cavalry, that would make so they are still countered by the monks due to how much your enemy gains by converting them but not so hardly. That alone may be good enough, i think halberdier's hard counter can remain since persians have access to trash xbows which decimate them.
yeah i agree war elephants have too many counters. monks, camels, halbs. halbs are insane vs elephants because they have a special anti elephant bonus that stacks on top of anti cav bonus, but persians also have great scout/knight line so its hard to find a good scneario for the chonk bois. the trashbows are fun but expensive to tech into in a regular game. do you think giving them heresy whould be too good as a knight civ or make war elephants very hard to counter or whould it be a good buff?
imo the issue with hussite wagon is how little damage it has. its really tanky and has a ton of pierce armor, but when it comes to killing, it just can't. any melle unit is great vs it, and the goofy extra shots make it really clunky to use. the ranged resist ability is cool, but doesn't work in all ranges and you need your units right behind it, which isn't easy to do in the middle of a battle. and bohemians don't really have a unit with high damage that has low hp to use with the wagon, pikeman/halb also works to tank/meatshield (even though not as good but its a trash unit) but it also defends your archers/handcannons/bbc from cav
I wonder how many of these units would make it into the top 5 coolest units
The sound of many jaguars fighting is just pleasant. 11
True tbh
Infantry UUs, not surprised. Compare the power level of Infantry UU to Conqs, Mangudai, Leitis, or Coustillier, and most Infantry UU is just not spectacular enough. They need some buffs around the board so that Teutons or Aztecs getting a castle up makes me actually think about how they might suddenly incorporate their UU into their army (in at least some common scenarios). Ideally I think stat/effect buffs and maybe even higher costs to truly differentiate Infantry UU from Champions. If I want a cheap melee unit, most civs with Infantry UU have FU Champs with additional bonuses. Make Infantry UUs a considerably more expensive specialist with a higher to compensate for their cost. TKs should be fearsome tanks, not slow target practice for the opponent's archers or castles. Jaguars could be deadly in melee combat in general (bonus vs cavalry as well maybe?), but poorly armoured and easy to take down from range.
However, there is a fundamental challenge in AoE2 w.r.t infantry, and that is the lack of easily accessible hard counters. Either XBows counter infantry hard, in which case they're useless, or they don't, in which case it can be REALLY difficult to deal with an infantry push if slightly behind, as opposed to the possibility of adding Mangonels or Skirms vs XBows and Monks or Pikes vs Knights. Maybe give Scorpions a massive bonus vs infantry? Or in a cursed twist give light cav bonus dmg vs infantry (don't). I don't think Infantry units can be as strong as cavalry or archers until they are as easily counterable.
I remember when it came out, even without wootz steel, people were comparing and saying urimi swordsman was a powerhouse in melle with the aoe charge vs most units
Nice video as always, bro 💪. I thought that the portuguese's unique unit would be here, because of that patch that changed its damage completely, but maybe it is not performing that bad.
There was a patch soon after that added buffs to the organ gun, so it does pretty well now. It's better than the old organ gun against pretty much everything except siege, buildings, or anything with high pierce armor.
@@ericfalley thanks man, I forgot the name of it, and they fix it quickly! Hope they do the same with transport ships 😌
Is way worse and needs more protection (Especially vs knights and onagers), but is still pretty amazing vs infantry and archers
I can't see this unit being on the list honestly
"Dishonorable mentions" would seem more appropriate given the nature of this list.
Urumis in teamgames on maps like nomad where you have enough res and castles, can be strong. But u need a big mass and 4-5 castle production + Opponents without Arbs or at least BBC. Think for 1v1 not viable at all.
I think that i you give hussite wagons ability to garisson units like rams have and if they are ranged units it will shoot additional projectiles kinda like a tower it could be a really cool unit. Some numbers on cost or stats woudl need to change definitely but the concept could be really good in my opinion. They were used as a makeshift baricades wnich soldiers could hide in and shoot from them so it woul dmake sense to me this way.
I had the same feeling about urumi, when i tried them (in situations where they were supposed to shine), was an absolutely disaster.
In rajendra #3, the chalukia empire just obliterate your urumis with their elephant archers and arbalest 😢
I never noticed the Hussite Wagon 'breathes' when idle. Maybe the dudes inside can't sit still lol. Also: it may not be awful (honestly idk), but the Ratha is such a weird unit for me that I never make. Just the fact that it can be countered by spears and skirms makes it feel like it has too many counters to be worth it.
Jaguars should have higher atk, +3 to stand out more against Champions, or more armor to take on Infantry better. TK's do a much better job in the anti-Infantry as they can actually take hits.
Urumis really need Siege Taxis to get value and some much needed mobility. Dravidians do get cheaper SIege Towers.
Biggest problem with Serjeants and Donjons is their low dmg. Donjons don't get more atk with Age ups, only more arrows.
I'm surprised to not see Karambit warrior in the list. That thing dies faster than its produced. About champion being better to use than urumi and jaguars, wouldn't the same hold true for Berserkers and Samurais? Curious to know if those were on your mind for honorable mentions.
I have not seen the video but I imagine that the top 1 will be the bohemian cart, because I always hear you say that it is useless
Bohemian Cart is Hussite Wagons copyright distinct knock-off.
the teutonic knight makes up for his uselessness with that awesome cape! you forgot to mention that bro
3:45 The Urumis are really good for pure melee combat, when the units are packed tightly together. They beat paladins with equal resources on both sides. They also defeat TKs and Boyars.
While I agree making Teutonic knights the bulk of your army is pretty weak, I do believe they have a great situational strength.
They create very fast and require no upgrades to be cost effective against +90% of melee units.
I often mix them in when facing heavy cavalry, or about any infantry unit this isn't a jaguar, samurai or Dravidian.
I use them every game lmao. They are not an main unit, they are not for attacking. They are great at defending siege and other defensive stuff. They kill palandins 1v1, thats insane. I mix teutonic knights with bbcs, skirms and some cav for raiding after the wall or the castle is going down and it works everytime, well not so good against poles tbf.
I'd like to see a list of top 5 civs to play hussar-cav archer (where cav archer can also be a unique unit)
Funny that you mention campaign, I did just beat the final Barbarossa campaign mission earlier with Elite Teutonic Knight Spam. They do suck in multiplayer because they are very easy to counter.
The problem I have with war elephants is that they are so slow! It feels like your asking a building to move!
Maybe do an most underated unique unit. And you better put Keshik on it
great stuff Hera, keep it up
Great list! Really enjoy content like this.
3:20 the problem with urumis is that they're an anti-infantry unit on a civ that doesn't struggle against infantry, so they're stuck in a weird place in terms of niche regarding the civ. Also, the charge attack only works when you can actually retreat from the engagement after, which they currently can't. If they got a speed boost then maybe they could fill that niche better, or maybe the charge attack could apply to buildings to have a makeshift siege unit.
It's a really cool unit imo, it just doesn't have a place in 1v1 and infantry in general is not favored in team games
EDIT: the biggest war elephant nerf was to their sound design ;-; give us back the cool trumpet sounds 😂 (I do agree persians are the problem overall. I can't wait for their rework)
Imo they are much better as anti heavy cav, but they are kind of too expensive and fragile to work against mixed comps.
Urumi swords having a charge attack is a misdesign to me. They should just do blast/splash damage on every attack. And maybe even have 1 range.
teutonic knight with ram or siege tower is fine.
urumi with elephant archer is good
jaguar warrior compliment champ, siege, eagle warrior and monk but still not good enough as not cost effective enough as cant beat samurai, urumi warrior and buff legionnaire. if they cost effective vs buff legionnaire, it will do
Jaguar Warriors have been around since forever, and stat-wise they're fine, but my main quarrel with the unit is that they cannot even chase the infantry units they are supposed to counter. I'd give them a chargeable sprint ability, akin to a zealot from SC2, maybe even with the bonus dmg on impact. You could use them to assault enemy lines by quickly closing the gap, or in ambushes, you know, like a...jaguar.
2:00 What do you think about giving them +1 pierce armor? It would buff them against their biggest weaknesses, and yet they could still be countered by said weaknesses.
I loved the little civ-specific scenes you built. Really fun idea :)
Poor Jaguar Warriors. They're an infantry counter when infantry is rarely the main thing anyone tries to end the game with. Even Japanese and Vikings, "infantry" civs, prefer to use arbalests.
I love the hussite wagon :(
..but I admit it's rather bad compared to other unique units :D Though not useless, but very situational. I find it best to use in castle age, before bombard canons come out or there are too many monks around, drop a castle and push with them and they are actually quite difficult to deal with if you mix in with some pikemen. On some specific maps, like Amazon tunnel you can even use their support bonus, but yeah, in most cases it just doesn't work.
Castle drops on arena are lovely with them. If your opponent sucks lol because onagers obliterate them
Teutonic knight? Its the real elephant of the game.
Honestly: I think Jaguar Warriors should make like Legionnaire and replace Aztec champions, give them some kind of...something? Else for their unique. Thematically a fast raider would be pretty good but I can't say I'm a pro in balance. It just feels like, yes. They are basically replaced by champion. Why not...replace champion? Adjust stats so they don't get broken by it.
1:55 only non-elite TKs have been buffed in receiving more melee armor (5 -> 7) alongside more attack (12 -> 14) and HPs (70 -> 80). I think it is justified because they were clearly underpowered and not on par with elite TKs.
Other than that, both TKs and ETKs received buffs in speed (0.65 -> 0.8) and cost (85F 40G -> 85F 30G).
In theory it should work. The Hussite Wagon has one range less than archers and skirmishers, so it should protect them. The problem is that no one stays still long enough for that to pay off. Eventually, you have to love. That’s when the Hussite Wagon’s micro problems rear it’s ugly head. It doesn’t fire a new main projectile until _all_ its projectiles are fired. _Firing again resumes where it it last left off._
It really needs to be able fire everything all at once. That would solve so many issues with this unit.
Jaguar Warriors suck. If you are Aztecs you already have the edge in infantry mirror. Plus opponents won't be making the spear line against you. Teutonic Knights are a bit better. They are a good siege escort and dominate most melee fights. Against certain compositions like Frank Paladin + Axemen or Malian Gbeto + Cav combo. Dravidians need a tank to protect their Elephant Archers. Urumi Swordsmen, Light Cavalry, or Battle Elephants don't cut it.
Other useless units: Condotierri, for Italians themselves. Its only purpose is a fast Imperial Age counter to gunpowder, but Italians are not in dire need of that. Shotels, I get disappointed whenever I make these. Decent raiders but are so fragile and have less of a bonus against buildings. Organ Guns, they do crap damage and spread compared to scorpions. It didn't help that they got nerfed in the patch.
The wagon is only really good vs brits or another archer civ. A few wagons can smash archer balls vs ppl that dont have melee units with their archers. Otherwise, yeah, they need love.
Glad flaming camels weren't on the list. I think people are finally realizing that it is actually really good in some situations.
The useless wagon should have high armor (both types ) as well as unique option to auto stand sideways against enemy units. It is not the best place for archers so when units are garrisoned additional gunpowder projectiles should add
No mention of the Flaming Camel? You have you pay a Imp Unique Tech to just get them, and they really aren't that good as an anti cav unit.
hussite wagons want to reduce the dmg taken by units behind them
except that generally speaking, once you have a sizable ammount of UUs AND other ranged units youre probaly both just patrolling into each other with little micro, meaning the wagons get shot first
and the micro that does exist temds to be with large arb groups that 1 shot your units regardless
Ofcourse he doesnt like the Wagon, it's the only unit in the game that's worse if you micro it, because then it continues it's shot cycle xD , the unit is perfect if you cant be arsed to micro it, put 3-4 of em in the archer group and just forget about them, they will naturally always be in front to protect them and be fine.Its such a dumb unit you dont need to do anything ":D
I think the Hussite wagon should just provide a flat pierce armor buff to units in a radius similar to the centurion's melee attack buff. Not sure it would solve the issue with them altogether, but it would mostly remove the micro issue.
I think the issue with the Urumi Swordsman is that it would ideally be used the same way you use the Shotel Warrior. It does not have the speed the Shotel warrior has though so it ends up sucking. Also, the Urumi Warrior does not seem to work against buildings (I think) which is a major drawback.
I too am sad the Teutonic Knight is not better. To me it has always been the coolest looking unit in the game. It has such an ominous look, it is scary to see coming against you. The only success I've had with it is garrisoning them in rams then having them jump out and join in attacking building. Evan the non-Elite excels against buildings.
Hera: seargents are useless.
YouPudding: Hold my beer...
The urumi swordsmen can trade against Frank Paladins, but yeah against archers they're cooked.
Hussite wagon is fine, it actually works great for lower elo team game players. Not a lot of micro in an xbow xbow fight, have literally 1-2 of those guys can really help.
As a 1600 player I also died hard against a Hussite Wagon play on nomad as they can sit under a tax and kill all the vils that can’t fit in your tc at the start of castle
I think it would be fair for war elephants to have their speed upgraded. In real life elephants can run like 25 mph so the speed in AOE is ridiculous.
1:44 "What is love baby dont Hurt me "😭😭😭😭😭
Maybe its because of the type of game we play.
My friends and i play AoE like a Total War lol. Huge battles. Sometimes PVP, sometimes PVE. Not the 'Attack early and dont let them do anything' like the pros do.
The enemy AI can be ruthless in Extreme. One of my friends use the Hussite wagon and have helped us immensely by absorbing the enemy aggro. Specially when they have like 400 missile units. I guess they work on those situations only.
Anyone here after TheViper's game with Urumi?
Same 😁
For war elephants I think they should only be converted at short distances (like siege). Also, mahouts should be more expensive but change its effect to "war elephants receive no bonus damage"
The problem with that is some civs suddenly become completely unable to deal with them if Monks don't work. You need 5 halbs or 6 pikes for just an even fight so getting surprised by even a small group can cause problems.
If both your changes were implemented then Persians would be absolute cancer on arena and other closed maps.
I think the biggest change to war elephants should be Pykes dealing like +42 instead of the insane 62?
That and maybe a little less food cost on the unit
Urumi swordsmen as basicly a swarm/raiding unit, not meant to fight on equal terms. They´re quiet fast and hit quiet hard for their cost. I´d say they´re a surprise unit. But other Units just do it better most of the time and can actually fight.
Also never use Urimi in the default formation! always spread them out in staggered formation or don t use them at all.
I´d love to see the Woad Raider buffed slightly.
Just an idea to throw out there: I think a bonus that could spice up the Jaguar Warrior is to give it a tiny (1 or 2) max HP boost upon defeating a non-siege unit. I think it would be best to have it needed to be healed, so that it could be incentive to build Jaguars to punish trash spam and mix in the beefy monks.
Let me know if I'm crazy, because I do realise it's not very reliable and is also a little situational.
Jags - Classic unit but honestly belong to the wrong civ. Aztec already have arb, UT skirm, monks, champs and siege to deal with infantry.
T Knights - This civ also already has similar champions and also armored knights. Guess easy way to buff is increase their speed ever so slightly. Or an extra pierce armor.
Urumi - Yeah 0 pierce armor is such a joke. Just buff that 1 or 2. Infantry UU that dies to frikkin skirms. Some speed would be cool since civ has mobility issues but would probably be busted with the charge attack.
War ele - Wonky meme unit overall. Is there even a way to buff these so they’re fair for all ELO and all maps? Waiting for that civ redesign.
Sergeants - Beefy but unable to do the damage. Question is which age you want them to be viable in. I hate tower plays to I say castle or imp. Just a weird suggestion - maybe make UT so they can be created fast from TCs instead? That way, you can pump them out fast once tech comes, and do it again later for shock value.
Hussite - Yeah I get the idea. But Hera is absolutely right. Maybe make them able to fortify, for another pierce armor and defense range? So they’re bad when mobile but useful to take over hills. Don’t think I want them to be good by themselves, we already have war wagon for that.
But if your opponent is on full archers, which is quite common, just having 5-6 Hussite wagons on the battlefield is enough to stop any archer army, or push into his base. Wagons don’t kill archers very quickly but they are very resistant to arrows, they can sit under town Centers and harass enemy villagers. Unless your opponent invests in some melee units he won’t be able to do anything to stop you. Why don’t people use the wagons against archers in early Castle age? On paper it seems so effective.
How about the missionairy? Or the flaming camel? They seem to be almost completely useless for anything but meming.
I only factored units from castles
The biggest problem with Hussite wagons is their firing animation. The first projectile (the big one) does the 17/20 damage, then they do two rounds of spray projectiles that do 1 damage, like mangonels. They must finish the whole animation before they'll fire the big shot again. This is the biggest problem the unit has, if they could be micro'ed they would be quite strong in small groups, like tanky war wagons but with the damage of a jannisary.
The legendary Caped Crusader is on this list??? How could you Hera??? :P
urumi swordsmen are really awkward. id like to see them move a bit faster.or (preferably) be a bit cheaper, then they could fill a similar role to Karambits being a cheap disposable infantry unit that dies really fast to pierce damage but trading population efficiency and rock bottom price for a slightly more expensive unit that specializes in burst damage
Maybe Jaguar Warrior and Teutonic Knight become the Imp. Upgrade to Longswords. (Like the Legionary.) -> Aztecs and Teutons gain another Unique Unit.
Teutons can get the Crusader as an unique unit. Basically a beefed up Paladin with conversion resistance and small bonus damage against infantry (or +1 range with their lance if that's too OP). Their weakness will be their cost, training time and speed
I remember at the beginning hussite wagon rush on arena was nearly unstoppable. And it was 0 fun to play against 🤔
Wasnt redemption monks enough to kill it?
I feel like beside pike-spam, most infantry are useless. There's not even an incentive to use them as all non-infantry units can effortlessly shred them. The devs really should rework the whole infantry system.
The germans have kinda hussite wagons as their special unit instead of the Dragoons (anti cav cav) in Age of Empires 3.
And it rips and tears ass.
Maybe something similar for the AoE2 wagons?
Maybe Hussite Wagons should work similar like the Fambaa Shield Generator from Star Wars: Galactic Battlegrounds (Star Wars AoE2), units behind (or around) the wagon have a second bar like the Shrivamsha Rider.
The problem with Dravidians is the entire civ can be countered with skrims.
Slowest civ in the game. They make the Teutons look fast.
Seargants are surprisingly effective against archer play and they beat most mid game infantry matchups. Sicilians are a blast to play infantry aggression into one tc castle drop with kt and ram transition. Any sergeants that survive fuedal are still viable on castle with +2 armor.
The hussite wagon should totally work somewhat like a siege ram; allowing units to jump inside and receive reduced damage while slightly increasing the attack of the wagon.
ideas for fixing some of the problems of these units: 1 Jaguar Warriors should move faster maybe not as fast as an Eagle Warrior but at least faster than the champion so they can catch better enemy units making them a preferable unit overall than the champion.
2 Teutonic Knight should cost less also Teutons may need a extra bonus for Siege Towers or rams ( i think the slow movement of the Teutonic Knight is part of the personality of this unit so in order to mantain that flavor but in order to improve in some way their mobility then tyou may use the Siege Towers).
3 urumi swordsman should get some pierce armor and perhaps their charge attack may have to be better.
4 The war elephant for me is ok, perhaps a slight cost reduction may enable this unit to become more playable.
5 yes Serjeants garrisoned in donjons should make donjons to fire more arrows, that wiould be more synergical for the Donjon rush. the idea of them enable to repair siege units and ships could also be nice.
6 The hussite Wagon should be enabled to transport foot units like a ram, also their damage reduction quirk should be improved or fixed in order to actually work, and perhaps their Hp or pierce armor should also be increased in order to actually work as a mobile wall that shoots