Stephen Krashen and Language Acquisition
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ก.ค. 2024
- 🔥 Learn languages like I do with LingQ: bit.ly/3FBCDWw
Those of us who learn languages typically spend a lot of time engaged in various language learning activities. It's well worthwhile understanding how we learn languages. There is no better source of information on this subject, no better explainer, than Stephen Krashen.
Stephen Krashen's website: www.sdkrashen.com/
0:00 How I was introduced to Stephen Krashen's work.
1:54 The acquisition Learning Hypothesis.
4:20 The Monitor Hypothesis.
5:31 The Input/Comprehension Hypothesis.
7:19 TPR: Total Physical Response.
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How much do you know about Stephen Krashen's theory of language acquisition?
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No matter how useful Krashen's method is, the way you use your glasses is just awesome.
I know. I also want to get some of those for myself.
I saw this comment before the video then 1:20 came around and I was like "HOLD UP!" 🤣
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
😂😂
😂😂
when I learned about Krashen's theory, it all made sense! 😍 I learned English as a kid, but not really at school, but through music, media and books. My pupils asked me to explain certain rules and I would often not know the rule but know how to apply it. Everyone would be like "you have a talent for this". But I do not think I did, I think I was focussing on the right things 😄
What's your first language?
@@Tehui1974 same with me, I'm Russian and I learned English through games, books, videos all in English😌
@@a_nikak hii
hi love you dear
I absolutely relate to this. I failed my English classes in school when I was 15 so I stopped taking English, barely able to form a correct sentence on my own. There there were books that only existed in English that I really wanted to read, so I started reading them, watching English movies with English subtitles, etc. It got to the point that when I wanted to say something in English, the words just spilled out, and then my conscious brain stopped and asked, "wait, what did you just say, you don't even know those words", and it turned out, it was exactly what I meant to say. For years, everybody kept trelling me that my private activities could never replace English lessions at school.
I went on to study English linguistics and turned out to be in the top 10% in the English test in the university entrance exams and never understood what happened. How could it be that I knew English so much better than many of my peers who had had As in school? Then I happened upon Krashen's theory of language acquisition in one of the classes - and it all came together. By accident, I had follwed all of what Krashen had said, down to the point of the free voluntary reading with the comprehensible input. Ever since then I have applied those models whenever I was tutoring someone in English and I always encourage people to just find their favorite tv show or books thereof and start reading/watching instead of learning words and grammar.
And I am in the process of applying the same methods again while learning Japanese.
I didn't learn english till I went to live in an english speaking country,there after at some point I was able to hear what people were saying, then later I was able to understand it too and figure out naturally the meaning....😊
These are like the coolest glasses ever I'm not even joking
Right on, thanks! That's great that the learning material & research is posted freely to all 😃
After living in Taiwan back in 2015-2016, I have been back in Arizona and continued my education in Chinese before switching my major at ASU to Spanish (my second language). However, about two years have passed since I was dedicated to learning Mandarin like I once was. I am ready to get back to it with exposing myself to the language and not putting too much pressure on myself and will continue to gradually work each day. Steve, you always have the right videos ready for the right time. 太感谢了! 加油！
Steve, it was a great to be brought to Krashen again. I studied Masters in Linguistics, and first encountered his work then. As a teacher of English I have encountered so many students who came to listening to English well after years of studying it as written text. The only times I have been successful at acquiring language, it was because I listened first, then learned to read and write it. With Thai, in which I could manage conversation on everyday topics, I learned to speak at aged 22, and I was immersed for six months. I had five Thai aunts and two uncles speaking to me, and getting me to respond meaningfully, and repetitively, in the context of family life in Thailand. I also learned a phonetic script to write down what I had heard. I have only recently started to learn to read, and I am finding that learning Thai writing rules is not helping my progress. It might be better at my level to only try to understand menus and street signs, or simple texts in situ, rather than try to memorise the tone rules in a block. I am now learning French and only began to make real progress when I spent more time listening to as much French as possible. I am extremely interested in whether the French approved order for learning grammar is that effective, as in my case, I always find myself needing to revise the 'simple' rules (like demonstrative articles, when to use 'avoir and 'être', or the gender of nouns).
We were making our first Mandarin Chinese podcast, and we thought: let's introduce Stephen Krashen's theories as a start!
Krashen was/is one of favorite linguistic theorists since my days at the School for International Training master’s program in teaching back in 1981.
Love hearing you review and break down Krashen. Keep it coming!
The best Professor ever! Gratitude 🙏🏼💖 I hope you are well! greetings from Brazil. 🇧🇷
I really like your channel and the job you do! I'm a language teacher and I've been getting a lot of good insights here!
Perfectly put. It should put people at ease for language learning.
Thank you, Steve, for your videos. They are so helpful for me.
Thank you for this video everything you said is so true, I will start reading Stephen Krashen’s books.
I have taught ESL in the US, Taiwan, and Thailand. Mostly I taught levels 1,2, and 3. I used at least 5-10 minutes of TPR each class period. It was so great to see the students who couldn't spit out a word confidently picking up a pen, pointing to the clock, etc. For higher levels, "strut", "grimace" got the language across just as well. It does take quite a bit of prep time to keep the lessons progressively meaningful
Tau
Leo y entiendo ojala todos los videos hablaras en español
Hello from Taipei! I will use one of your videos about French learning to present in my B1 class!☺️ (The one you said listening is important!🤗)
I really like listening to you and to Dr.Stephen Krashen and I only wish one thing which is meeting on Zoom to talk to you and to Dr.Krashen it would be a great honour for me and to every single person interested in languages. Thank you so much.
Thanks for your summary!!! Best wishes!
Some Japanese learners should bear this in mind. It feels like some take the learning process too seriously, trying to get the grammar and pitch accent down to a T when English non-natives don't seem as concerned with perfectionism. If you think speaking a foreign language perfectly is an automatic pass of acceptance and earns you celebrity treatment, you're dreaming. All this probably to impress natives, albeit trying too hard. English is the 3rd most spoken language, do you see natives getting mindblown by someone who speaks it? Why should others? Maybe it's impressive for 5 seconds but after the fact they know nothing about you. Use the language with the natives and let them decide if they accept you because nobody owes you anything. It's your character that makes the difference.
Language is like a bridge to different cultures and people, but it doesn't have a significant impact on you socially. It's like trying to get a job and all you have is the language, don't expect many opportunities without others skills. Or meeting other natives of your own language, you don't befriend someone because of that one single commonality, right? You must prove your decency which can take time
Some people who are able to get pitch accent down and try to sound like a complete native might be shocked that Japanese are also interested in personally and how well you can have a conversation. Do people think you're interesting in English? No? Why would native-level Japanese change that then?
Here in Brazil I've been seeing a lot of English courses as well as private English teachers advertising "speak as a native". They sell it like a rule, like if you don't speak like a native you won't go anywhere. Why does a Brazilian person HAVE TO speak like an American person? It makes no sense. Whenever my students come up with this idea, which I came to call "perfectionism syndrome" I ask them: "Have you ever seen Asian and European people speaking English? Do they sound native? Why should you?"
Agree for the grammar part, but grammar and pitch accents should not be put into the same category. ( Not saying that I support the concept of learning pitch if it affects one confidence)For the most part pitch accent learners will stress that a word should be taught(or inputted) with it's good prononciation. It does not take that much effort to acquire a good pitching accent if you start learning them at the same time as you learn a word.
Now, if you have been studying japanese for an extensive period of time without bothering about the pitch accent, it will probably be extremely difficult, hence not worth, to go back into the words you already outputted tens of hundreds of times, and learned them again the correct way.
That being said I do agree with you that personality and ideas matters, if you can get communication going with native from your target language your are good :).
I don't know I'm American. I listened to Manuel of easy german for a year speaking german. Then I came across a vid of him speaking english and my mouth dropped. I was genuinely shocked by how good he could speak. I was so used to hearing them speak german. I figured maybe he spoke some english. But i didn't realize he could speak it that good. So when foreigners speak American english it's impressive to me.
It's funny how people throw around the term "sound like a native" when nobody can seem to agree on a universal and detailed definition on what that means. Every goal has a reason behind it, so why not explain to the class how that's so important? Listen to That Japanese Man Yuta or Nobita from Japan. Many other non-natives like them can form grammatical sentences in English despite retaining their native accents. If we can understand them just fine, my argument is "who cares?". Developing meaningful connections isn't just about speaking well because it doesn't mean you'll click with everyone you meet. It's a part of life. Next time you meet someone new, speak perfectly and pretend you do nothing much in life. If you can't bring yourself to do it, then I rest my case.
Steve Kauffmann is talking about Stephen Krashen! Loved it! It couldn't be more perfect. Thanks for explaining clearly something that many language tutors learn but easily forget when they start working. I believe in Krashen's theory, and your experience and LingQ are the proof of it!
Español hace mucho que no hace un video para yo poder entender mejor un abrazo fuerte y gracias de antemano por sus consejos me han ayudado mucho...🙂
Hello, Steve, thanks for this remarkably great video and short-review.
It is always useful to hear this explanation from You connected with personal experience.
Wish we could see more detailed explanations of Krashen's theory in next videos! It would be great for all polyglot-society......haven't you thought about it yet?
Suppose you should write a book about Your personal experience and essential features of languages You've studied.
Thanks a lot, anyway, best wishes!
Your videos give me hope!
I think the TPR method of learning seems very effective and should be further developed and emphasized. Happy belated Birthday to you Steve it's always a joy to watch your content. You help me stay motivated and inspire me to do more in language learning keep it up Steve!
Brent Robert I am currently using GPA ( Growing Participator Approach) to language learning which is based on TPR and TPRS to learn Mandarin. I believe that it is the most natural way to learn a language and it is effective.
@@greenwhiskey7 definitely agree. On my third day learning Chinese and today is the first time I have been able to figure out a whole sentence myself, thanks to a content which uses this approach of gestures, image illustrations and pattern recognition. The channel's name is "Slow & Clear Chinese". Really wonderful how much it's effective.
@@greenwhiskey7 do you have any resources for that GPA approach?
@@myownway07 if you you tube search GPA there is a channel that explains everything and if you contact him he will put you in touch with the GPA tutor for whatever language you want to learn if there is a tutor for that language.
@@myownway07 I think the channel is GPA con nexus but I am not sure
I look forward to the future when much more energy will be channeled into making guided comprehensible input for language learners. I've just found the CI Japanese TH-cam Channel, and I love it for my early Japanese learning.
Can I ask what this channel is? I typed in CI japanese but nothing came up.
@@jamestays8416 Comprehensible Japanese
Does anyone know of a channel dedicated to Comprehensible Input channel for beginning Chinese?
That's it. Totally agree😁 works for me and my students as well💪
GREAT! MANY THANKS
Totally true!
thank you sir. Very helpful
I appreciate your efforts
Thank you
thank you
Thanks Steve.
Thank you Sir..it was pretty useful..
The process of learning any language!
Thanku sir, very useful video...
I find Krashen's distinction between learning and acquisition valid, but I'd question the use of the term "subconscious" for acquisition. I think what Krashen refers to as "acquisition" is actually an inductive reasoning process. Analytical abilities are used in the process of learning a language, whether learners are aware of them or not. How else do you work out the meaning of new words if not by turning to your cognitive abilities, whether deductive or inductive? Where do we draw the line when talking about "subconscious"?
Thanks!! This helps
Well said
You guys are amazing
That is such a fascinating topic! I wonder (perhaps you could make a video on it?) whether there is a more effective output: writing or speaking. If there is, how effective would each one be and how can one go on practicing them? Thank you!
Welcome Steve
awesome...I am learning mandarin with much DISCIPLINE
Thanks
thanks a lot
good job men keep going 👍
I'm following you from Algeria 2nd year master student- Didactics -
Good video
In the language acquisition we have two independent ways of developing language ability. One is a subconscious process and other deliberate effort . First one is primarily naturally as a subconscious process and that we learn at school, do not help us very much. Second hypothes is the natural order which we are going to acquire the elements of a language. Natural order is not based on simplicity and complexity, it is immune to deliberate teaching. Third one is that monitor hypothes is that the monitor our knowledge of grammar can make only a very small contribution to language acquisition because there are so many rules on the grammar. And so few of them know all of these. Forth hypothes is that is input compression which is the most significant one and works one. There is no individual variation. We can learn once we have acquired sort of the previous things we learn from the context. You cant output your way to language acquisition. It is input.
I had to study some of his SLA theories and other language teaching methods and approaches years ago, while also having learned a few languages... I think all of these methods or approaches have up sides and down sides. In a real teaching scenario nowadays, some teachers would apply multiple theories and approaches to one single class based on communicative language teaching (CLT). Comprehensible input is about acquiring the language from materials that are slightly higher than one's current level, and that one learns the best though people or things they can understand. I don't think it's discouraging speaking or writing.
I want the same glasses)
Thank you, Steve, for your videos. They are so helpful for me. I need learn Academic writing in Sociology, can you help me.
Cool glasses 🤓!
What's easier, Steve; total physical response, gesture, mood or looking it up in the dicionary?
Hi sir !!! Hello from Antony !!!))
I've never seen glasses that break apart in the middle like that before
Hi Steve, can you tell me where I can buy your glasses, it's really cool.
Hello Steve!
Hi Steve, at 8:28 you say Krashen has a lot of research to back up what he says. I think it is only fair to mention that multiple academic linguists have criticised Krashen for not supporting his claims with empirical evidence and for relying on studies that are not academically sound.
Well, that's false. He has supported his claims with empirical evidence, as for the methodology of the studies. There is no way to commit to a large scale scientific study of language acquisition, or if there is, it hasn't been done by anyone. Krashen or not.
@@dharmadefender3932 The point is that not all of his claims are supported by empirical evidence, and some of the studies he himself relies upon are not academically sound.
@@adiands850 Well, I know Chomsky's LAD isn't supported by empirical evidence. So I agree to an extent.
❤️
Those glasses are lit 👌
My problem is how to find material that are either interesting and comprehensible in the early stage of learning.
Really need Vietnamese on LingQ
Steve, I subtitled this video in Portuguese for my grandmother who's trying to learn English. Do you think you could maybe add my subtitles to your video, so I could more easily share it to more people?
Does this theory applies to other realms of learning like math and science ,or it's only for language ?
I find the natural approach that you suggest amazing, and it works very well to my French (as a student). However, what I notice teaching English and Portuguese to immigrants is that most people simple aren't able to commit to spend time with the language they are studying. It is a bit like dieting. If you want to lose weight, you don't need some doctor monitoring you, but some people aren't able to reach a goal unless they have to show progress to some third person. So how can I help them?
Maybe have them read a chapter of a book, children’s book, article, something appropriate for their level. Have them summarise the contents of the material to you. You want them just to demonstrate they understood the message in the material, but it doesn’t matter which specific words they did or didn’t understand.
I think that the main means to acquire the language skills and accelerate it is love. First we have to learn to love the people and their language and their culture and the country where they live etc.
Freshly baked CELTA teacher here. At the school where I took the course and exam, they kind of hated Krashen. This particular Cambridge-related English-teaching organisation has arrived at a number of quite ineffective methods which nevertheless fawn on the learners and keep them sitting in on lessons.
👍🏻
How can I convert this video into a text please?
Estou aqui tentando colocar inglês na minha cabeça! E estou conseguindo!
Fico feliz de ver uma brasileira aqui, pra cima!!
No, you can’t.
Since Stephen Krashen says that you aquire language because you are interested in it. So grammar lovers aquire language not because grammar rules work but because they are interested in the way grammar is interacting with the language, which maintains interest and then running the words through the grammar process provides th exposure to the language. So the grammar loving people aquire language though time with the language and interest in it,and it is an illusion that the traditional way works
I have a question. Is input the solution for those who already use wrong forms because they learned it wrong? Because it seems to me that it isn't. I mean if I think of native speakers who make certain mistakes even after 30 years despite the fact that they hear correct grammar all day, every day, I become unsure that it works.
There must be a balance between input and grammar, but I think that there should be more input than grammar. If you want to speak correctly, study grammar, but only the rules won't help you to communicate. Even those people who speak "wrong" can communicate well and are very fluent.
in austria we have a lot of gernan dialects. different words, different pronounciations and also grammar differs a lot from high german. many people are not surrounded by good grammar. even in newspapers you will find terrible mistakes. to be exposed to correct grammar you have to read a lot. and i mean literature. not many people read nowadays.
OK
Bizarre seeing this proponent's name. I've only seen Krashen's name in my textbooks and related literature.
"The brain is a pattern recognition machine". We've just got to keep feeding it in the right way I guess.
Not if the machine is faulty.
@@LesserMoffHootkins profound.
Hi i am learning english
OK no se como decir esto así que recurrire al español señor yo vi el método del imput comprensible con mr salas eso me ayudo a conseguir un buen nivel de inglés pero me siento estancado quería buscar otros métodos el de mr salas si funciona aprendo palabras y cosas nuevas todos los días aveces busco gramática etc eso es una ayuda a el método del imput comprensible para hacelerar el aprendizaje y entender más rápido las cosas lo que pasa es que busque otros métodos lo malo es que no encuentro nada más útil siguen aviendo clases tontas o videos tontos dando recomendaciones por que si, ver videos etc eso es imput pero no explican el por que así que decidí venir a ver su video y usar el poco inglés que se y tratar de entenderlo considero que el mejor método que hasta ahora e usado a sido el imput comprensible es un salva vidas lo malo es que igual tarda en aprender uno osea en clases y solo clases tardaría 10 años en adquirir el b1 pero con el imput eso se consigue en 5 meses dependiendo de que tanto le dedique al día eso es muy bueno pero yo busque mejores métodos y no pillo ninguno mejor xd si no pillo nada me quedare con el imput comprensible y que al imput no se lo quita solo se le suma para ayudar al aprendizaje más rápido
So many people say they understand Spanish much more than they can speak. Does this disprove Krashen's hypothesis of Comprehensible Input? Essentially we have many many data points of people who have taken in a lot of the Spanish language but can't speak it very well. How would Krashen make sense of this fact? Does he directly address this somewhere? Deny that it happens? Down play it? Or something else?
Those glasses get my ADD triggered 😂
I think I missed few points, thinking how they are
nice glasses : )
Steve, eu acho que se você falasse um pouco mais devagar você poderia ajudar mais as pessoas e teria mais seguidores. Às vezes, mesmo com legenda fica muito difícil acompanhar seu raciocínio.
O seu conteúdo é rico, mas possui vocabulário avançado.
It’s not that he speaks quickly, however you aren’t ready to listening that things, listen to more and more and you’re gonna reach it
When he started the video, I thought he was talking about himself in the third person, then I realized he's Kaufmann, not Krashen...
Lol that would be pretty funny if it was a video bragging about how he is the best explainer of language acquisition
I used to get them mixed up with I first discovered the online language learning community lol. Then, I saw them on a video together and was soon able to tell the difference.
I'm no troll but I would just like to say that I sometimes wonder how much teaching people like Stephen Krashen have actually done. There are innumerable examples he gives that suggest his practical experience may be limited. One such example is his claim that it's impossible to actively learn how to use question tags because the rule is so complicated. But how can he deny that once we've practised something often enough we gradually stop thinking about the rule? Learning a language is like any other skill, whether it be learning to ski, play tennis or cook - once we become proficient, we stop thinking about the basics but we do need that initial input (in the form of grammar in language learning) to be able to start off on the right foot. As I've said elsewhere, why be so dogmatic as to rule out the usefulness of both grammar-based teaching and comprehensible input. Why does one have to exclude the other? As J. Cartwright commented, it would also only be fair to mention the fact that Krashen has been criticized by a number of academics and authors, including the highly-respected Michael Swan.
" Learning a language is like any other skill"
That's very unlikely. Learning a language is not a cerebral skill like math or science. If it were, then people who lack intelligence would not be able to acquire language. That's simply not the case. Grammar teaching doesn't work for the simple reason that nobody who actually speaks another language can give grammatical explanations of their own language. Nobody actually knows the grammar. Obviously, then, the knowledge of grammar didn't contribute to acquisition if they didn't know the grammar.
@@dharmadefender3932 Just one question - have you ever taught a language?
@@TheHaining You can't teach language.
I'm not a language-learning expert but I can give you some advices and you can implement it to your language learning journey if you want. I learn the language for 2-3 months by reading and listening and not looking up to any grammar rules and when I feel that I'm used to these grammar rules, I pass to the next grammar level and study it for like 1 week. In that 1 week, I learn more detailed grammar rules than the rules such as "-s" adds in English as mentioned in the video by studying them like I'm studying for my exams. After learning both minor and major rules, I get back to my reading and listening part, which is briefly comprehensible input part, and after passing 2-3 months like that, I get back to learning grammar and repeat it. It works well for me.
In the example of question tags he’s not saying we can’t learn it, practice it and become highly competent in the skill of using question marks appropriately. He’s saying we don’t necessarily learn by being taught.
Grammar based teaching often hinders comprehensible input based learning when then grammar rules are taught first. If we learn the rule first we’re so focused on learning the rule and looking out for the rule that we fail to learn via normal acquisition. Part of our brain actually closes off the natural acquisition pathways because our focus is on learning rules rather than just noticing things. If we focus solely on comprehensible input we notice things, even without our conscious effort or realisation. Once we notice something, we can review the grammar rule and we actually learn the rule faster because we can immediately apply it in our brains to something we have seen already, in context.
Although Krashen's work has clearly contributed a great deal to the field of SLA and language learning & teaching, my main criticism is that the 'learning' mode of L2 appropriation remains under the yoke of being TAUGHT a language (by someone else). Obviously, the idea that a language (or anything else, for that matter) can 'transmitted' from one person to another is perhaps our greatest, most fundamental pedagogical error. Learning must ultimately be done by the learner. Learners' learning depends on favorable conditions and meaningful social interaction to occur. But we mustn't underestimate factors such as more mature learners' skill & will to learn. The idea that our efforts to learn interferes with acquisition, as Krashen claims, is far too simplistic. The relationship between conscious, deliberate effort and strategy to learn, on the one hand, and the effective 'acquisition' of 'automated' language proficiency, on the other, is far more complex and multidimensional than Krashen's hypothesis would have us believe.
I am not sure about the natural order concept, what is natural for some languages is not natural for others, just saying
Meu sonho de vida é ter um óculos igual ao do senhor kaufmann.kkkkkk
I know I'll be ignored again, but Krashen's ideas aren't completely viable. i+1 is not controversial in its basic interpretation-all learning and skills development are done best when people are engaging in things at the appropriate level. The zone of proximal development (ZPD) and deliberate practice are other terms that are relevant, although Krashen dismissed deliberate practice as having relevance for language learning.
Here’s the thing. Krashen says “only” quite a bit, so someone like Luca Lampariello can’t, according to Krashen, possibly learn a language because he does bidirectional translation and memorizes vocab (with his word spider webs and other techniques).
You mentioned LinQ and looking up words to make them comprehensible. This is a good idea, but its not Krashen’s take. If he were talking to you directly about this, he would skip over this topic quickly and direct the conversation elsewhere.
If I understand you correctly, you're saying that there's value in deliberate studying including memorization and learning grammar concepts. I completely agree with that. I do think that immersion, simply listening, reading, and even speaking and writing are essential, but I think that deliberate learning of concepts and vocab offers a solid base to learn with much greater efficiency.
I think it's somewhat like driving a car. Obviously you learn more driving than reading the books, but you do need to actually learn the rules of traffic and the meaning of the signs, etc.
@@calebw8189 Krashen says its his way or no way. Everything you describe could work for some language learners. Krashen would say it wouldn't.
I agree with you. I know I have benefited from reading grammars in a language I was learning written for native speakers of that language. Would that count as Comprehensible Input (good), or as metalinguistic monitoring (bad)...?
@@ailblentyn Now there's a question... Comprehensible input if you are reading a lot, understanding it, and enjoying it. Metalinguistic monitoring if you're using what you learn. I'll be thinking about this question all day.
I think you're just misunderstanding the Input Hypothesis.
"Krashen dismissed deliberate practice as having relevance for language learning. "
>When did he ever say that? He says deliberate practice has limited effect, not zero."
"Here’s the thing. Krashen says “only” quite a bit, so someone like Luca Lampariello can’t, according to Krashen, possibly learn a language because he does bidirectional translation and memorizes vocab (with his word spider webs and other techniques)."
>But by doing that, he's turning input into comprehensible input. His method completely supports Krashen's theory.
"You mentioned LinQ and looking up words to make them comprehensible. This is a good idea, but its not Krashen’s take. If he were talking to you directly about this, he would skip over this topic quickly and direct the conversation elsewhere."
>Nope. They've already had that conversation. Krashen likes LingQ and bought a subscription. He also likes to use a dictionary to look up words while reading a foreign book every once in a while. You've made up a fake scenario.
I respect your experience as a polyglot as well as Krashen's research, but I find that this "comprehensible input is the only God of language learning" approach to be quite dogmatic. Certainly the bulk of your vocab and feel for gramar will derive from input, in a subconscious fashion, let's say. But having *some* conscious formal study of the basic vocabs and grammar structures not only makes you more aware of the way the language works (and saves you a lot of deciphering time) but also cements your previous unconscious gains from input.
As for speaking early, it indeed does not help with acquisition, but repeating words and phrases in the language does make for a good mouth-training, not to mention it helps with recall. Just my 2 cents.
'but I find that this "comprehensible input is the only God of language learning" approach to be quite dogmatic.'
Good thing Steve isn't saying that. Whatever that means.
There's nothing wrong with learning grammar and talking. Krashen likes to learn grammar and speak to people in foreign languages himself. The key point is that language acquisition can't happen without a lot of comprehensible input, and the role of deliberate study is limited. If you want to learn grammar and speak, no one's saying you shouldn't, not even Krashen.
Krashen is really overrated in the internet language learning community. What he calls "Acquisiton" is just learning in psychology and there is no strict line between learning and acquisiton. Since we are adults we can think abstractly and that helps with learning, too (Also this is why vocabulary look-ups work. We can think those words as adults unlike children.). (Please check the book **Fundamental concepts of language teaching by Hans Heinrich Stern** for more information.)
@@rimenahi The reason he's popular is because he helped popularize the idea that you can't be fluent just through deliberate study and that you need a lot of input to a world that still thinks formal study is king. The fact that there are other soft science buzzwords that mean the same thing doesn't disprove that.
@@GongTheHawkeye Looking through Steve's videos of just the past few months, I see the title "Do NOT study grammar" and "Don't speak in your target language".
@@GongTheHawkeye I definitely didn't say that his ideas are invalid or disproved. He made an amazing contribution as you stated. What I'm saying is you can deliberately memorize words, study grammar, learn about the language and then with input all of those become automatic. But if you listen to Krashen, he used to say Learning does not contribute to acquisiton in any way, which is not really true.
Like si venís por el recuperatorio de didáctica y ya te tomaste 3 monsters jaja
I learnt english by just watching gaming videos, all day as a kid. I didnt knew any grammer.
I didn't know any grammar*
چۆن قوڕت کردە سەرمان
You need a great deal of practice to learn language
Too bad many elementary school teachers use Krashen's ideas incorrectly. Krashen talks about learning a language, while the teachers apply his ideas to teaching reading and writing. By skipping grammar and phonetics, they produce million upon million of high school graduates who cannot read in their native language, English. It is like "Why Johnny can't read" has not been written.
He ignored or at least underestimatrd the role of practice in learning a second language.
You need to learn the HOW before you learn the WHY.
No. Just no.
Learn by age seven, or give up.