Did Max Verstappen Go Too Far at The Austrian Grand Prix?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ต.ค. 2024
- My view of the Austrian Grand Prix F1 controversies between Max Verstappen and Lando Norris...plus all the other talking points covered.
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People are really "Snowflakes" Barcelona 2024 - Lando push Max on to the grass by half a car width because Max takes avoiding action.... Everybody says it's just hard racing !!!!
Austria 2024 - Lando and Max touch briefly on track because Lando went for a gap that wasn't there after he couldn't make 3 previous torpedo's work ..... Everybody: MAX is such a dirty driver !!!!
Lando's comment about Max not needing to race him because he has a 70 point lead is kind of dumb!!!! ... uhhhm Lando he races everybody that's why he has a 70 point lead !!!
Come on, dangerous 😂. I didn't hear you talk about Lewis who drove Max into the barrier in Silverstone at high speed. Forgot about that?
Silverstone?. Should F1 commenters talk about every incident that is history when they are talking about a more recent one? What about Prost Senna crashing into each other - why didn't F1 Elvis talk about that here, WHY oh WHY???😂
it was Max fault as well, according to those brits, or 'racing incident' at worst, although it was 100% deliberate move, example of dangerous dirty driving.
lets not talk about max v lewis. i dont think i`ve got enough fingers to count the amount of times max has divebombed/moved under braking/ pushed off track lewis. the only reason why there werent more accidents is because lewis backed out for the sake of it. only once he stoped giving in was when incidents started happening.
@@yolinkin He choose the right moment to get his revenge. The impact was 51G. A record.
EVERYBODY WORLD WIDE LOVES these on track fights while on the other side some British race fans who claim to know everything better than the rest of the world, are crying over the rules being broken. Brits want ‘clean and fair’ racing with drivers that move out of the way to allow a clean DRS overtake. It’s ridiculous AND BORING AF !!
And this Silverstone dude blaming Max for declining ticket sales. 😂 He should be thanking Max on his bare knees after this weekend.
And as for the comments on Oscar… DUDE….HE JUST STARTED AT MCLAREN. He will give Lando a hard time in the near future I can promise you that.
Just check the difference in comments from Davide Valsecchi and Jolyon Palmer after the race with Will Buxton. Valsecchi was excited about the hard racing from both drivers....Palmer was just pissed off and blamed everything on Max.
And now at Sky etc they were complaining again that 10 sec penalty wasn't enough for Max for this incident......the irony....
This is pathetic honestly. Its just a hate speech about British people that’s it. it’s completely untrue also.
Makes me laugh you talk like other fans don’t call for hard racing but as soon as there is hard racing like dive bombing all they do is complain…. Which they definitely do…. Just look in this comment section.
If you hate us British fair enough. But you don’t have to spread hate. Makes you no better than a racist.
May I suggest you give Nascar a go
@@nilsthart4154 this is just a hate speech against British people. Your no better than a racist…..
Just look at this comment section max fans call for hard racing…. But in the next breath whin about divebombs. It so hypocritical….
Ultimately what do we want?....boring finishes with one driver 20sec ahead of 2nd place??, or two drivers fighting at the end for every last inch to get the win??. After they have some words and things cool off, they might back off a little bit at silverstone, but don't expect it to stay that way 😏
@f1Elvis: used to think you knew your stuff.. guess the union Jack over your head does affect judgement. McLaren surely protested Max's driving for allegedly moving under braking, no penalty means the stewards had evidence he didn't. Calling Lando going straight out of control a "little bit out of control" is marginalizing the fault. Had he hit Max he would have had 10s penalty for being out of control. Now Max misjudges the space on the outside by a couple of cm, they nudge tyres and all of a sudden it's a really dangerous move? Come on you can't be serious...
Lando could have used his steering wheel and simply veered a bit left and completely avoided contact. I remember Lando pushing Max on the grass in Barcelona at the start, no comment. Here we go usual British whining
It's just simply a fact that Max broke the rules here, if it was Lando I'd say the se thing?
@@F1Elvis Let me get this straight - Lando exceeded track limits multiple times just prior to the incident, he missed turn 2 previously forcing Max off track, and then careens into Turn 2 again this time on the outside puncturing Max"s left rear with his wing. Good so far? Lando needs to get the pacifier out of his mouth and start racing like an F1 champ if he wants to beat one.
Turn 3, my mistake
@@F1Elvis It's a simple fact you need glasses, man. Do you want every British driver to just be let by without a damn fight?
@@Raptor0750 Well, you're wrong about the wing puncturing Max's rear tyre so you didn't get that straight, and not good so far 😁
Dude, watch the analysis by Cameron and Peter Windsor. Your boy Lando Norris was overtaking like a rookie and Max wasn’t moving under breaking, he was exactly following the curve. Everyone every year every time takes that curve that way, it is supposed to be taken that way. Stewards are punishing to outcome and not to offense. That is erratic and purely wrong.
How can you say he wasn't moving he literally drifted to the left. That's moving under braking you div. Max is reknown for it and it's because if him the rule us now enforced lol
@@rnichol22 the track moves slightly to the left before turning to the right. He was exactly following the track. That shouldn’t be considered “moving”. He was giving Lando an ocean of space yet somehow he managed to crash into him.
Norris demonstrated that he is not capable of overtaking on track. The only thing I saw were very late, torpedo moves and mistakes after mistakes. He needed to cut all corners to keep up in his faster car at that stint.
Verstappen defended like we know him and what you should expect from a World Champion. When they touched, it was obvious that Max would close the gap (just like Norris did to Max during the start of the race in Canada btw). I don't know what Norris was hoping to achieve going on the outside of corner 3, it had mission impossible written all over it.
Look at how Leclerc overtook Verstappen there last year to get a tutorial of how to overtake.
So really a lot of waffling and stirring that Verstappen was too aggressive etc, whilst the real story should be that Norris just doesn't have the competence to overtake, whilst driving a much faster car.
And for all the British haters, the way Hamilton catapulted Vertappen at Cobbs in 2021 was the most aggressive thing I have seen since I am watching F1 (since 1994).
Dear Elvis, I love your work as a mechanic at Wheeler Dealers. Maybe stick to the things you're really good at? ;-)
Marc Priestley's comment completely changed my worldview, and how I view max Verstappen and Lando Norris, and after discovering his profound filosofies I will now give away all my worldly goods and will travel around the world barefoot...
Its called racing, Max is gonna change nothing. Norris need to look also to his own driving before the crash!
Why? That's exactly how Max has raced his entire career. Are you conveniently forgetting Max's first years in F1. Or 2021 where he and Hamilton drove each other off track every chance they got? The only reason Max hasn't had more incidents in the last few years is because his car was always so far ahead. Otherwise, Max probably would have more incidents.
Selective memory I see
Yes, it's called racing... but there are also rules to this game. I'm a big fan of Max, but that doesn't mean I'll defend him when he mess's up.
@@ccramit stop crying, this is racing, not a Disneyland tour. Pilots are there to win, not to let entitled drivers pass without a fight.
@@ryche.rising there is "without a fight" and then there is driving into other drivers..wich Max did.. It is clear Max is feeling the pressure, something he hasent for nearly 3 years.
Yes, how can you give your objective an honest comment when you are wearing a shirt of the England national team. And then your background at McLaren. In the fight between Max and Lando you see it a bit through English glasses.
It was a milder version of Hamilton v Verstappen Silverstone 2021, with less advantages results for Verstappen this time than Hamilton in 2021.
And who is talking about Lando pushing Max in the grass at the Barcelona start.
But yeah... the dominant British press in F1...
This is Lando's 6th year in F1. Easy to forget Oscar was a rookie last year and what he's already accomplished against a teammate who's been at McLaren this whole time and already made it his own. Oscar's still learning tyre management and adapting to race pace. He's doing all this in a top team while Lando was able to do all this early in his career in a midfield team without the pressure. The fact people like you talk about Oscar as if he's a seasoned driver with a wealth of experience behind him is a testament to his maturity and level headedness so early in his career. Now, just imagine what Oscar's ability will be like once he's leveled up like the rest of the top drivers.
well the last 5 years the mclaren was a shit car compared to now, and compared to the rest of the field
Thank you for that!^
The fact is that Lando went too far with his nose diving, exceeding track limits.
Max had to avoid turning in, to avoid a collision.
He crashed into Max from behind.
Lando's fault.
wait, the same shit that Max did all 2021 season to Hamilton? Pot call kettle fucking black much? You Max fans are fucking idiots.
spare us the double standards
Alonso got the fastest lap in the closing laps.
He was on softs
His only bright spot because he finished 18th with that pit for softs. Aston is awful
@@tarikviaer-mcclymont5762so was max
I don’t think he gets a point for that being outside the top 10.
Biased britt,
Max didnt even stear to the left, see the onboard,
Peter windsor said it right
Yes he did !!!
@@51madmitch u watched onboard ?
Fanboys he drove into him 😂
You realize Peter is a Brit??
@@trance9158He’s Aussie
Peter Windsor seems to have less non-bias view of the situation?
I enjoy listening to both. Although Peter Windsor has an in-built bias to Lewis Hamilton.
He didn't analyse all the corners. He safely chose those bits where it suited he can defend Max. Peter is caring more about his views and clicks.
@@VamsiBattinenielvis didnt analyze anything at all. Just his brit bias that you seem to swallow all too easily since it suits your narrative.
You are allowed one move, if max moves one meter before braking, it’s still legal
@@ajegelin What move? Telemetry showed he didn't turn his wheel to the left. There's nothing inherently wrong with moving under breaking.
A bit harsh on piastri. He was unlucky not to win in Miami. He got a heavy penalty in Italy for blocking when the next race 3 drivers got away with it. He also got robbed of 3rd for qualifying due to a bs call. Why is nobody concerned that Perez can barely finish top 10 in the rbr. Piastri is still new to F1. Give him a chance.
Piastri was not unlucky to not win Miami. He was NEVER GONNA WIN MIAMI. Stop these stupid delusions
Track limits …geez they count for everyone !!! Stop with the bs that you want special rules for Piastri 🤡
@@Redlingstein jeez ok then piastri is shit and shouldn’t be there.
I consider that the lap time being deleted in qualifying was the harshest issue to befall Piastri, on the basis that I understand that there were no track sensors in the area of the track that he allegedly exceeded track limits and the helicopter video was not of a high enough resolution to fully confirm the track limit infringement. However, if you step back from it, he did luck into P2 in that it was due to the collision up front, albeit he was there to pick up the pieces, and make a good pass on Sainz. @Redlingstein for some reason has got very angry about your comment, in the end its just someone's opinion, that's all.
@@pistonbroke70 Thanks. I was pointing out that Oscar is only in his second year and has been unlucky not to score more points. I’m not saying he’s better than anyone else, just thought it’s a bit harsh to judge him like that just yet. Next year the gloves will be off and he will need to be more consistent. There are other drivers on the grid who are performing way under expectations for how long they’ve been in F1 and the car under them.
*Impatience & poor decision making from Lando sending it around the outside*
Go back & watch Max vs Sainz Lap 26 of Austria 2023.
Sainz moves under braking, Max backs off, puts his wheel 'off track'
Uses DRS to pass on the next straight for a clean overtake.
Reminds me of Michael Schumacher tricks
Please stop it. Please take a look a at the race without being biased. Lando and Max were both mega aggresive. Looking at the telematry Max did not move while braking. My respect for Lando dropped a lot for not being reflective on his own performance. Both were at fault. Let's not point fingers.
There is a reason why Max is at 61 GP victories: elbows out and, if necessary, knives out. Schumacher and Senna were no different.
Max is a cheat that the corrupt FIA stewards won't seemingly punish. His behaviour is shameful.
But other great drivers have won without being dirty.
@@paulguitar100not as much, lol
@@WH0oo... Hamilton has many more wins and his racing has been WAY cleaner. In the past we had fewer races, therefore drivers had fewer wins, but Prost, Hakkinen, Fangio, Clark, Andretti, Mansell, etc were much cleaner drivers. Verstappen's behaviour will tarnish his legacy. It's a shame, he has enough talent not to have to do this.
@@paulguitar100 VER on pace to exceed HAM. First seven years, each have 3 WDC. However, VER started younger. If, VER wins '24 WDC, he ties VET with 4 consecutive titles and clips HAM. Anyway, it was a professional foul.
I think that Piastri didn’t fall off at the end like he usually does, and made a late pass on Sainz which bodes well, but he has been clearly second fiddle to Norris. The media sucks though. Norris was a fair distance behind Carlos in his first two seasons in F1, and unlike him Carlos was new to the team. Everyone was singing Norris praises then already.
I thought Oscar would have started his F1 career better, but he is getting better, and like Max had to get over his recklessness to become a top driver, Oscar is just managing his tires away from being on that level.
What on earth this is with Piastri? Didn't he just pass Norris on saturday? He has been dangerously close in every race, except Barcelona where the team found a floor damage. Norris is a great driver and Piastri is right around the corner. Mclaren has the most brilliant pairing with Piastri and Norris and if Ferrari doesn't pick up the pace and Perez continues to fight wih the middle, they're gonna be team champions in the end of the season because they both are bringing constant points. Piastri reminds me a lot of Kimi Räikkönen. Calm and smart, not flashy like Alonso but damn near there. He is still learning, hope he doesn't face similar unluckyness that Kimi had.
@@aubanurmi Piastri is a great talent, win 3 major championships on the trot into F1. He has been clearly second to Norris, and his Achilles heel has been tire management. In Monaco he dropped a bunch to Leclerc at the end. In the sprint he was dropping off and clearly holding back Norris. And it has been the case most of the times where he drops off at the end. This Austria feature race was the exception not the norm.
He still has a ton of promise. Not sure why you jumped to the negatives so early. I clearly compare him to Max’s start. And said this could be a turning point.
@@sloppynyuszi I read your comment better and I realized I jumped to my conclusions too fast. Thank you for correcting me. 👍
impeccable driving from Norris == Leaving the track 4x Lo0oL
5 times actually. his 5th offence was T1 lap 63, just a lap before the contract.
The Piastri view is weird. Piastri was second two times in a row and would have won if not the penalty.
If his mum had balls she would be his dad… STOP THESE DELUSIONS!!!!
He would NOT HAVE WON. HE DIDNT. HE WASNT THERE.
Yes, but my bewilderment was toward Marc Priestley, no way Piastri is outshined by Norris like he says. Piastri is showing growth while Norris has been too desperate.
my god the brits may lack petrol but they sure as hell got a load of salt
The Dutch media are saying the same thing so is the French and German. They all can't be wrong.
@@madtrade do you by any chance have a mirror close by?
The Dutch said it’s Verstappens fault. Peter Windsor had a great race analyses, check it out.
I’m a salt miner and these incidents make me very wealthy
The Brits won in the end anyway.
It’s the stupid Verstappen fanboys just lying and changing reality and being hypocrites.
This race sums up why, as an American , I just can't get into, or take F1 seriously. First and foremost, I've never seen a racing sport, other then F1 where they can't figure out giving penalties till hours after the race sometimes. Lando actually ended up with a 5 second penalty, which had that been enforced emedietly, Lando wouldn't even been close enough to pass in the first place. Also, this stupid rule F1 has about a car in the lead and on the inside, must give a car trying to pass enough room........what??? That's against the very essence of auto racing. In American racing, if your behind a car, and you want their position that they earned and is rightfully theirs, then you've got to earn that position the hard way. A car in the lead has every right to that lead and shouldn't have to do anything to help the car behind get by. And another stupid rule is the one of making defensive moves under breaking. Does F1 want more fighting or just more passing, and why do these cars still have DRS? These drivers and new cars have proven over and over again that the new cars can pass with traditional slip stream. DRS has made drivers lazy, and is hiding some drivers lack of talent. If anything from this whole event was dangerous, then in my personal opinion, it was the crazy speed differential that Lando had from DRS as Max was about to turn in and came dive boming in like gang busters. It's not realistic, talented passing, it's a lazy button you push to get a crazy speed differential and takes zero talent. And boy are F1 drivers soft and sensitive, and babyfied. In America, when it comes to racing, we have a saying...."Rubbing Is Racing!
The moving under braking, don't agree there sorry. It's to prevent airplane like crashes up the rear wheels and cars flying into the crowd. Almost happened in indycar a few times, hence those rear wheel farings for a while. Very late moves after a car has committed are highly dangerous in Motorsport.
But here you are🤫
Agreed. Dutch here. Norris complains he should have won several times 'because I have a faster car' and 'Max let me down'. He can't overtake that well so he crossed track limits to gain time and a closer DRS to just pass by.. The cars are to big and heavy, smaller lighter cars would make a bigger difference again. All these babies are such hypocrites watching and playing action games and movies all the time - no problem there with kicking ass.
All your points are wrong and stupid.
“Lando wouldn’t have even got close enough to pass” - yeah because the car magically slows down when a penalty is applied. 😂
Stop bringing idiotic American racing rules into F1. F1 is a no contact sport while in America it’s acceptable to crash to overtake.
You can't get into F1 because, clearly judging by your comment, you aren't bright enough upstairs to understand it
Last week after putting Max three feet onto the grass: "Plenty of space" - Lando Norris
Do you mean like what Max did to Lando immediately after the contact to prevent him from passing?
Max was wrong then.
@@phillydelphia8760watch that overhead. Lando was behind and max moved to the right and lando tried to shoot that gap but had to back off. Nothing max did there was wrong. Too many people aren’t getting facts before making proclamations.
@@matthewmanzi9504 Max kept moving right when Lando was on that line, it looked like a pretty deliberate move to stop Lando passing. Especially as he kept squeezing him out when he knew he was there.
Numerous evaluations by former racers etc have said the same, and they know far better than me or you.
Verstappen made a mistake, and at that point was probably feeling some kind of way. So while it's not the right thing for him to do, it's understandable. It's an unfortunate flash of petulance on his part.
@@chriscollins550but you think max is always wrong, so your opinion doesn’t count
Atleast things getting spicy again. Max complaining when someone races him elbows out.
Let’s goo😂
Whaaw.. this is a big UK driver's promotion video.. half of the point ar just half sided punching points before even real data..
Nothing bad to say about de driver's themselves though. 😢
I wanted to talk about what happened between Norris and Verstappen in the recent races. I understand there's a lot of tension around these incidents, especially with the media coverage.
There are two main things that seem to be bothering all:
Norris' driving: You feel his moves towards Verstappen, like pushing him to the grass in the last race and the dive bomb yesterday and today, were too aggressive and potentially dangerous.
Penalty and bias: You believe the FIA took too long with the penalty for Norris, and there's a bias towards British drivers?
It would be great to chat about these points:
Reviewing the incidents: We could look at replays and discuss the maneuvers from a racing perspective. Were they within the rules, or were they overly aggressive?
Penalty details: Maybe we can discuss on why Norris didn't serve the 5 second penalty? Which means does he have to serve the pentaly in next race or British media or fans will say it's ok, we can ignore this one.
Media coverage: Let's talk about how media portrays these situations. Do you think there's a national bias, or is it more about the specific incidents?
As a Brit, there does seem to be a national bias against Verstappen from those who work at Sky.
Wasn't Johnny Herbut one of the stewards today?
He's a bias Brit.
Yes, I'm a Brit, but I agree with Peter on this. LN was too dive bomb happy, and was determined to get past, by what ever means.
Yawn stop going on about British Media. Max has been allowed to get away with terrible driving for years, he even got a championship because of it.
@@DJKav he must have worked really hard then to convince the other three non Brit stewards in Austria to agree Max was to blame for the incident.
Meh, Max has always been a "rough" ,some would even say dirty, driver. I respect his stance, and that he is in it, to win it.
Obviously the answer is YES. He received a penalty from the stewards. The question is "was a penalty sufficient and how do we stop a driver acting in such a way in future".
There is no rule on moving under breaking
Yes, George definitely 'lucked out' but to quote a phrase once used by your old boss Ron Dennis - 'To finish first, First you have to finish'.
All the great champions I can remember have been ruthless and have incurred in this kind of questionable behavior
Hamilton , Schumacher, Senna,
Yes, almost all. Never been the case with Hamilton interestingly.
@@F1Elvis Yeah, Silverstone wasn't on purpose ofcourse.
@@pauillacwine263Silverstone was the result of being bullied on track for several races by Max's driving style and then basically having enough of it.
@@ab8jeh Hamilton was humiliated in the sprint race the day before. He couldn't handle it anymore, just like Lando couldn't handle it in Austria after being beaten fair and square in Canada, Spain and Austria sprint. The thing is, if you're a non British driver, it's barely impossible to be treated objectively. Ask Schumacher, ask Alonso, ask Vettel. It's pathetic.
@@pauillacwine263 Hamilton is washed these days completely agree. What's that got to do with what I'm saying from 2021?
Drivers need to stand up to bullies like Max if their team keeps facilitating them. Guy is surrounded by yes men.
If you use your brain, it is simple. It’s motoracing. If you can put someone on the grass, you should take it like a man, or a boy in lando’s case, you must avoid a collision with two tires on the grass, or curb.
9:28, Fernando got fastest lap
With no points for it. Bad F1 rule. Must be in the top 10 to get a point for it.
@@vaughnhoplamazian5209 no, of course not. All the Zhou's, Mazepin's and Latiffi's of the world would put on softs in the final lap to scrape up some points. Just imagine all the accidents. It's a great rule.
@@vaughnhoplamazian5209 it's not a bad rule, without it none of the back markers would bother racing for positions, they'd just try to get fastest lap
Genuine question: Does anyone know if the Dutch pundits have automatic Max bias?
I see valid comments of British bias, and it exists, but I’m curious if a direct people like the Dutch take Max’s side by default?
Peter Winsor can't blaim Max Verstappen.
Max didn’t move on his onboard, Lando ran into him
Go watch both onboards!
They tell the story.
It is shocking how much hate max gets for being an aggressive and entertaining racer… the British bias reinforced by the media and broadcasters is absolutely ridiculous and this narrative will be poison in silverstone. I’ve seen so many drivers make on the edge moves and the reaction is so different, Fernando Alonso is a prime example and there are very recent situations you could refer back to. Max is a generational talent and he fights hard, that’s why every wheel to wheel battle he’s involved in is so exciting.
British fans are emotionally unstable
Delusional! The onboards show exactly the opposite of what you apparently hallucinated.
Look, Ive been fan of you for years and know you have a soft spot for Mclaren, but I think you should have taken a step back and calmed down before posting.
There is NO rule about moving under braking. The rule you are talking about got removed 3 GPs later after it was introduced (funnily enough, only driver who got penalized for it was Seb, not Max). As with everything in F1, all we have at this point are very ambiguous and grey area rules which state that dangerous, erratic etc. moves can be reported to stewards.
You need to step back and calmly rewatch the "incident." I think Peter Windsor covered it well. Max did not move under breaking, there was pretty much no steering wheel input. The corner itself naturally curves to the left a bit. Secondly, it was fairly standard incident, drivers squeeze eachother and move under braking ALL THE TIME. Hell, we have multiple examples of the exact corner with Max & Sainz, Lewis & Seb which were both much worse.
Did Max technically deserve penalty? Yes. But the incident itself wasnt bad at all, it just had a huge consequence. I am 100% confident that if they didnt get punctures, this wouldnt have resulted in penalty. It was good close racing, they were both pushing the limit. Landos divebombs were the type that Max got crucified for in 2021.
The response and collective meltdown from mainly British fans is insane. Just a week ago we had Leclerc & Stroll both cause collisions out of spite. Lando himself pushed Max to the grass which was 10 times more dangerous than any move this weekend, yet people laughed it off.
I really hope this is a one off video and I dont have to unsubscribe from a channel that Ive otherwise enjoyed for years.
This ^
@bitemyshite You provide no arguments whatsoever. Keep calm, Brits. Stewards will protect your golden goose
I am a Lando fan myself, it was heartbraking to see him so down afterwards but in a word by Verstappen himself, my god you can't overtake him by divebombing. Note: I hated it when he was doing it to Lewis, still respect the guy and his skills.
You’re the first person to address what I thought was the most dangerous part. Max trying to push Lando off the track while on 3 wheels. That could have killed someone. He no longer has a car that’s a second a lap or more faster than everyone and now he’s reverted right back to being the proverbial bull in a China shop. He’s a fast driver. But he’s also a dangerous driver when he’s actually under pressure. And he always has been.
It does look like he tried to push Lando off track but Max might have been trying to get off the racing line. Cars were coming up from behind.
@@seano51 I won’t say that’s not possible. But I think that’s really giving him the benefit of the doubt. Lol.
@@jonkerr2050it's called a 3x WDC who knows every point matters.
Oscar very unlucky not to get a lucky win. Sounds odd? Well the qualifying penalty was harsh. The lap 1 skirmish with Leclerc then Perez that went on, Perez lucky not to get penalty. Some classy moves, kept his tyres alive despite the dirty air. Not equal to Lando but plenty to say that his position didn't show how good his performance actually was.
Agreed. Oscar is doing a great job and developing well. Marc comparing him to Perez is absurd!
To be fair, I initially though it was 100% on Max, but I've seen a post on twitter where someone put it side by side with an onboard from some previous Austrian GP where Max comes up on the outside of Leclerc and Leclerc is moving left in the same way as Max and leaves a very similar amount of room. But Max in that instance moves left a bit further onto the kerb himself to avoid contact and then does the classic switchback coming out of the corner. So effectively Lando could have moved over a bit more to avoid the contact as well, so I'm leaning more towards an unfortunate racing incident now.
there is comment out there that Lando was attempting this but the speed differential caused by the DRS caused the attempt to fail. I think that assessment may be accurate.
Verstappen should’ve left a car’s width regardless. Not Norris’s job to just move outta the way
@@QAZWSX545 there was a lot of track left. The track limit is all four wheels over the line, not only your left wheels touching the line, the curb is part of the track.
You've got to stand up to bullies.
@@DriveLikeAManiacThe kerb is NOT part of the track for that rule. All the drivers know this.
I think it was max his fault but you can tell lando is very impatient and wants it too much almost desperate and ofcourse a lot less experienced, dive bombing his car all the time in that corner
Beautiful background!! Nature and F1 chat…. Doesn’t get better!
Johnny Herbert is such a nice peaceful man
more of a Lando's spokesperson, fact is these British reporters* cant handle the fact that Max humbles them every damn time.
Pathetic behavior !
Max said he didn't move under braking. He said he brakes and then moves. That's an interesting perspective! The intent is moving in the braking zone, not whether or not your foot is in the brake.
Are you explaining the rules to Max? 😂😂😂
@@PaulKoelman Yeah! Cos I'm much better at F1 than Max! 😆😆😆
I get your point. But it did seem splitting hairs.
Now that I've listened to the rest of the video, I must dispute your statement that the Maclaren was faster than the Red Bull. If that were the case, then why was Lando over 7 seconds down prior to the bad pit stop. If Red Bull had done their usual stellar pit stop, Lando would have still been 7+ seconds back going into the final laps. Lando's car might -- might -- have been faster, but Lando is not Max. Full stop.
Are some confusing the “braking zone” with actual braking…. Seems max did in interview saying “only i know when l’m braking”. (Apart from the telematics of course) but the rule is no moving in the braking zone….NOT no moving when you’re braking. Moving when you’re braking doesn’t affect others as much as moving when others are braking is dangerous. Total difference. He was in the braking zone and moved - broke the “verstappen” rule remember the rule created because Max does this.
Yummy British tears 😋🤤😋🤤
Max claimed he was NOT steering under braking.
I had moved my steering wheel and then braked.
Or
I had released the brakes and THEN moved my steering wheel.
@@quigglyzThat's exactly right. Always with a long-winded explanation served with a little bit of 'holier than thou' attitude. 😂
Peter Windsor thinks he did not move under braking and claimed he could see on the onboard cam he kept his stearing weel straight.
@@michielbrouwer3606 windsor is a liar.
Ouch.. this is a pathetic take Marc. Ouch ouch ouch.
Lando nearly took Max out on two corners by coming in like a rocket completely out of control. Remember Lando nearly took Max out on Spain bcz tyre on grass is accident waiting to happen, Nico & Lewis crashed out on similar incident. This at worst is a racing incident bcz Lando was quite aggressive too.
Well said
I agree, we now have some actual competitive racing happening from top to bottom in the points positions. Norris was definitely out of bounds on his dive bomb move, but I believe that it was a result of his frustration over Verstappen's previous moves under braking and double moves. Stock up on the popcorn....the British Grand Prix is going to be a barn burner.
Lando had every right to go for that move. He did that move in the sprint and made the corner.
@@macman6107 I thought you were referring to the divebomb where he went off the track. If you’re not, then lando did nothing wrong if you’re referring to the contact where Lando is on the outside. Max left a cars width on the outside. Lando committed and was going straight and max moved across and made contact. Did exactly what he did to Bottas at Monza 2018 so it’s 100% Max’s fault.
@@macman6107 there was no move that happened at turn 1. All the moves Lando tried were at turn 3 where the original dive bomb from the sprint was.
@@macman6107 I was referring to the dive-bomb Lando made where he ended up going off the track in the race which was exactly the same move he made during the sprint. He was on the inside and made the corner in the sprint. He didn't make the corner in the race. The original comment was related to "Lando's failed divebomb" so
I don't know what incident you're referring to or what your issue is. He was on the inside in both situations so they are the same. The only difference is Lando didn't get it right in the race
@@tombardsley3081 I was referring to his dive bomb when he locked up and pushed Max off track.
Oscar has only had 33 races and was screwed over in qualifying, so lay off Oscar 🤡
that was odd
@@Slipstream_merchant this comment reminds of the guy begging the internet under his bed sheets to leave Britney alone.
He is a highly paid driver with lots of credentials. We can be harsh. To be fair the fact he didn’t drop off 20 seconds at the last 10 laps does show a sign of improvement. As for screwed in qualifying? He had all four tires off the track, what do you want the stewards to do?
Oscar screwed himself. Period. Track limits is the same for all. Geez.
@@sloppynyuszi Big deal, he gained no time from it
@@Redlingstein and? He gained no time
One thing that I slightly disagree is with the statement that Max didn't leave a room for Lando. Technically, yes, he didn't leave a car width, so does Lando at the start of the previous race. What I'm saying is that 99.99% of the time, if you don't leave room for a full car width but still give enough room for the other car to be classified as being inside the track, the stewards will just ignore it, thus Max didn't really do anything that hasn't been done by basically almost everyone, even Lando himself.
As for pushing Lando after the collision, like you've said, you don't know exactly what is happening but still persisted with the fact that Max being petulant. So basically you ignored everything about what you said about being out of control and lean heavily on Max doing bad things. This is low.
The issue is not about leaving enough room or Max being "questionably" petulant, but moving under braking and you should focus on that instead of trying to piling up problems. There were already several occasions even after regulation being set about moving under braking that drivers didn't get penalized for that. This is the main issue. I don't like seeing driver moving under braking, but at the same time they never really penalize anyone that did it. At best, they gave a warning first. So if the stewards doesn't want to penalize those moves then it will keep happening and this time we see a high profile collision because of it. And remember that the penalty that being given to Max was not because of moving under braking but for causing a collision, which again highlights stewarding problem that something bad need to happen before penalty is given.
Also that last race highlighted another ongoing problem which was penalty decision didn't come fast enough. While it is a lot better than in previous seasons, but it is still too slow, especially for something that should be obvious. Like Lando track limit violation, which the last one was super obvious but they only call it after the collision, which is useless. I'm using Lando as an example because it is high profile, but there are plenty of others that I think can be called faster, like Lewis crossing the pit lane white line on entry or Perez speeding. It is something that can be quickly called but still needed few laps to get the decision. This kind of thing definitely can affect the race (not always, but in a tight battle, definitely).
In the end, it was 100% Max's fault. He got 10s. It is fair. It is much less worse than when Lewis punted Max. Max simply got lucky that he managed to still continue while Lando was unlucky that the puncture ended up the way it was, thus shredded a lot of his car. It is probably not the team that need to straighten Max but FIA where they need to enforce moving under braking more seriously because otherwise it is a fair game, which again, I don't like seeing it but it is what it is.
Against British drivers, there is no amount of PR that will ever redeem RBR or Max in the eyes of the hugely biased British dominated F1 press and pundits. That includes you @elvis. It’s a lost cause.
Marc, outstanding review 👍😉
The crash was one thing. The, then trying to crash into him again twice by swerving to block lando after puncture, knowing his race was over, was truly cu*ty
How about Lando’s divebombs Verstappen had to evade?
@@judsonzimmerman8831he had to evade them, as you put it, because max moved under braking. Stop being so ridiculous. Lando did nothing wrong.
@@FormulaProg Lando hit Max, not the other way around. He was desperate and lost his mind
@@MartinRiggs1820 Max moved while braking, forcing the back car to take avoiding action. You simply can't be at threshold braking (the tyre limit) as they are and then be able to steer around the guy in front of you while he is playing silly buggers. i.e. typical Max bulls**t. The tyres don;t offer up more grip than what they re already maximising for the braking.
This is why "cant move under braking" is a rule, otherwise you'd have the rear car torpedoing the front car all the time.
I do not know how difficult an F1 car is to drive with only 3 wheels... not to mention only 1 power wheel.... if my understanding of physics is correct... if you apply only power to the right rear tire... the car will have a tendency to fish tail to the right... this would be the normal path of a car with only 1 tire on the rear of their car...
Max claimed he was NOT steering under braking.
I had moved my steering wheel and then braked.
Or
I had released the brakes and THEN moved my steering wheel.
In that interview he said: “Only I know when l’m braking”
If you have put your steering wheel in a different position and then apply the brakes, you still are moving in a different direction.
Maybe the rule 'No moving during braking in the corners' should be better defined...
The stewards have all data…they know exactly what he does and doesn’t do. Stop pretending you all know better.
@@Redlingstein I just quote. I don't pretend anything...
The stewards should make all these data public, so we'll know if Peter Windsor and Max Verstappen are right or not.
Marc, please watch the onboard from Max just before the collision. You'll see that he keeps his steering wheel absolutely straight. So no moving in the braking zone there and no turning into Lando. It seems you Brits are unable to be unbiased when it comes to British drivers. Lando getting it wrong whilst lunging it to the inside of the corner is "a slight mistake", Lando pushing Max onto the grass in Spain is "hard racing" but Max and Lando colliding is a deadly sin on Max's behalve. You're about as toxic as Buxton and Palmer in that regard.
Honestly this is nothing new in F1..... it was inevitable. Max hasn't been challenged like this since he won his first title. And back then it was just like this with him and Hamilton. Regardless of how much he's matured, deep down he's still max who does not want to be passed by anyone. Friends or not Lando has his number, and it's going to get ugly. He was certainly being very aggressive diving in at the last second, but who hasn't done that?. I might put a little more blame in Max, but Lando can carry at least some responsibility for it.
I think MV and CL was duelling a fair bit first half of 2022, after the RB DNFs first few races, or did you miss the 2022 season?
@PixelProfessor those were mutually running each other off of the track, there was no moving under braking
Lando has won ONE race. One. Also, Max had him smoked if not been for that crap pit stop. You English have your heads way too far up your…
@@tarikviaer-mcclymont5762 What's wrong with that? Nothing
Yum, please keep crying. I enjoy your years 🤤🤤🤤🤤
How is it dangerous for Verstappen to brake if Lando is alongside him? Lando is braking later, and there's plenty of room on the left and in front of him. What is Lando's game plan for being so close, so late? Where does he want to go? If Verstappen had to turn into the corner, he would be turning while braking. Their rear wheels made contact; Lando was beside him, not behind him. I don't get it. There was a lot of track available. And if you want to overtake, shouldn't you avoid the car in front of you?
Exactly...a racing incident to me.
The moving under braking happened earlier when Landon was going down the inside and is a very dangerous thing. He moved to defend the inside line in the last incident but then swung back to the outside to get a better run out of the corner when the contact happened which is more than the one move you are allowed to defend.
There isn’t room on the left. Lando was literally on the Kerb when they touched.
Stop lying and changing reality. Max fans with their stupid propaganda
@@paperplane-db8qf Are you saying there was not any kerb left? if he was prepared to go on the kerb for three inches why not another inch? If you look at how other racers have used that kerb you will see there is lots of room left. Or are you saying Lando had nowhere to go and crashing was the only option?
@@paperplane-db8qf That kerb is very low profile, drivers can easily drive over it. You can find countless of examples on the internet about the same corner with exact same incidents. Last year Sainz pushed Max completely off in the same way, Max was pretty much completely over the kerb to avoid contact.
Max was questionable on some of the braking but in the contact incident he slightly moved left but I disagree with you saying he didn’t leave a cars width. If you look at the replay there was actually a lot of space still left for Lando. That’s my opinion anyway as a Ferrari fan I haven’t any bias on this just pain for Charles and relief Sainz got a podium hope Ferrari can improve
Sky (Ant David) used video evidence, Max definitely did not leave a cars width. I assume there is also data showing steering angle and braking to prove movement in the brakung zone. He also ran Lando off the track onto the grass afterwards.
@@klaatuzogran4503 Telemetry showed he didn't turn his wheel to the left.
@@MartinRiggs1820he veered left . Lando was going straight so Max did move across
these british commentators , need to stop being so bloody biased ,whenever there is a incident involving a british driver . it was plain to see to see that lando , who was dive bombing at every corner , that it would be a matter of time ,before it ended up in a car to car contact . max has no obligation to move aside for lando ,it,s lando,s job to safely pass max . and max is well within his right to defend ,but lando went a bit overboard . but soon as the incident happened ,the british commentators blamed max straight away . and i,ve noticed this a few times ,when hamilton and russell have made overly ambitious overtakes ,the commentators have sided with them straight away . apart from david coulthard . the way lando was dive bombing every corner , it was only going to end in disaster . i,ve seen this behaviour before from lando and also russel back in the f2 days .that does,nt work in f1 . and as far as i can see ,he got what he deserved . and i do not support a driver purely on there nationality .i support a driver because of there Personality . and just looking at this video,s title annoys me . because it should say who was at fault max or lando ?? not did max go too far . which implies you,ve already made your mind up ,what a surprise .
Your deluded honestly deluded. Max’s moving under braking was crazy for one and he caused the crash simple as that. That’s not debatable max moved left and crash into lando. Regardless off the dive bombs max proved the day before they can race like this completely fine…that’s hard racing and not crashing
British biased…🥴 what a winers …the British media. Blind spot for Lando’s dirty driving. Btw…I don’t believe Lando is a real friend of Max. He always talks bad about Max in various interviews. He is also getting arrogant since Miami.
OK the fact max and lando spend most of their free time together. It's not British biased at all. Go listen to the Dutch media they are saying the same thing as the British and so is the French and German. They all can't be wrong.
Go elsewhere then
Yeah, Norris has 1 race win in 5.5 years and now he thinks he is next Senna 😎
Max gained even more points for the standings. Simply lovely.
Doesn't matter. He'll win the championship anyway this year, but he'll still be remembered as a child who never grew up. Maybe he will be an adult one day, but not if he keeps being surrounded by yes men.
You r Landos child.
Max didn't move under breaking. He steered the car slightly to the left and after that started breaking in a straight line. Because that straight line goes slightly to the left of the track it looks like he is moving under breaking but really is not. Norris is the one who hits Verstappen first and Verstappen already has a puncture when they hit each other for the second time. The stewards only seem to have looked at the second time they hit each other and gave Verstappen a penalty for that. In my opinion it is Norris who was driving dangerously during this race with several dive bombs on Verstappen.
Untrue go watch the Antony Davis analysis the data. Max turns he's wheel three time's before the corner moving over then moving again when lando try a different line.
Because verstappen never dive bombs…
The overhead shows that this is correct. Too many people are going off the regular shot and not seeing what actually happened.
@@chriscollins550 What move? Telemetry showed he didn't turn his wheel to the left.
@@MartinRiggs1820 no it doesn't. He turns he wheel two times in the corner and three times coming up to the corner. The fia have even released a repot. But then you would probably argue with them too and the data.
Max doesnt back down. The driver on the grid should know that.
Did Lewis moved under breaking at the hungaroring? If you think max did in austria, what do you think Lewis did?
IMO, because of RB superior car performance MVs latent immaturity, when it comes to being challenged, has become just that, "latent". His racing skill is so apparent while leading by a margin, but he reverts to "petulance" in the fray. His immaturity will not allow him to concede to being over-matched, and he will crash and burn to prevent coming in behind another driver. Same as it always was, no? He will not go down without a dirty fight, for sure.
Sorry but you have no f.. clue what you on about, go and watch some other channels than telling here some bias British fanboy bs.. or perhaps fix some cars. Sky is an international broadcasted channel and have monopolistic stand on the grid.. they should be as neutral as possible! Obviously and its very very very clear they are not!The hate against Max its actually getting abnormal and embarrassing, and YES ITS ALL BRITISH media and commentators who creates this, (yes @F1Elvis you too).
Well, you can’t say it that max is a nut-head 🤷🏻♀️ i can! Always driving the same way, the difference is that with a good car, he race himself, now the car is suffering, therefore, the idiotic movements comeback! 🤷🏻♀️ easy! The worst model for youngsters in F1, 🤨 sad! And fans encourage that! Another ms 🙄
Serious question.... do people remember the epic battles between Prost and Senna? How about between Schumacher and everybody. Racing is a sport of skill and most of all nerve and bravery. Always has been, always will be. if you want racers who give up position because the guy behind them is faster, F1 racing might not be for you.
Marc why can't i use seedstream is it my phone being a 2017 Samsung. I have the latest Android update but still not compatible. Cheers Dave
No data indeed. Just insinuations in your vid. Few facts though. Max moved slightly. There was however more than enough space for Lando, he just didn't use it. He probably didn't want to move after his failed dive-bomb the previous lap. Both at fault I think. Racing incident at most.
PLEASE STUDY PETER WINDSOR TAKE ON IT ... He vindicated Max Verstappen big time! ... No joke!
Verstappen, Schumacher, all do the same things to win. Lando, Mansell, Prost, nice, but don’t have the killer instinct. Multiple World Champions. Hamilton has been the same as Max & Michael.
Hey Marc,
So Yuki got a fine of 40K for using the R-word. Apart from the fact that others have used it (Verstappen among others, even used the M-word (that sounds like the Mongolian nationality) which in the South of the Netherlands and Belgium is a normal swear word) with no repucussions at all, Yuki only started to learn to actually speak English some years ago when he started in F3. Before that, he only knew English from school. So I have two related questions.
- Don't you think the 40k fine was too harsh, especially for someone who's first language hardly uses any swear words and thus for whom it's easy to mistakes around the use of these words?
- Also, is the F1 paddock the right place to learn to speak properly? I mean, since he's based in Italy with his team and also lives there, he speaks Italian in his private surroundings apart from Japanese. So the paddock is all that remains...
He ahso.
Yes, its harsh - he's only repeating what he's overheard whilst here.
Both went too far, Max gets the most flack because he caused the contact. Norris also drove like a madman the first couple of attempts he made, while Max was defending over the limit. Don't act like both aren't to blame here. Norris also could've tried setting up a switchback to get past at turn 4, since it was clear turn 3 wasn't going to happen. I don't like that all F1 pundits hop on the Verstappen hate wagon (F1TV and Sky already showed mega bias towards Norris). I fear that Silverstone will have a very toxic atmosphere because of this next week, and I hope the British media ask their fans to keep in check.
Nothing to do with British media nor any media about how fans behave. They are in no position to tell anybody anything.
@@classicraceruk1337 You must've not been around 2021 when Sky literally asked fans not to boo Hamilton/Mercedes at Zandvoort.
totally agree, it's difficult to tell what exactly happened but Peter Windsor had a more neutral and more knowledgable response to the situation- Elvis worked for McLaren and maybe that combined wth the British slant made it overly bias!
@Muse4games Both went too far? Lando was doing what Max would’ve done, lunging where he had the chance. More importantly, he managed to keep the car on track after the first missed apex at turn 3. But what Max did every time in the braking zone was just egregious. He was like a child who couldn’t accept defeat and had to resort to moves which eventually caused a collision. It’s not British bias, it’s just that you can’t defend Max after three moves while he moved under braking. Maybe I have only watched the race 3 times. But maybe it needs more attention.
@@ImRivendill That’s why I said ignore the media, did you not read what I said. Anybody’s that believes anything that is said in the media is very stupid. They have been caught out time and time again with corrupt practices. Make your own decisions on reliable evidence that you have researched yourself.
Oscar is in in his second season. Norris has been there 6 years. Oscar has out qualifying Lando and in the sprints. He’ll get there. He’s better than Russell. He almost got Russell albeit starting P7 and Russell starting P3. Piastri is a star! He’ll be a World Champion in the right car. I hope he has it but 1.5 seasons doesn’t prove anything. Always the case but without the equipment you’re nowhere.
Love the scenery.
Lando will back off in future. Max is owning the psychological game. Max giving up one race to make sure Lando hesitates next time there is a gap, not great sportsmanship but it's what wins world championships.
There is nothing special about Max crashing with other drivers. Sometimes other drivers may need that position more than Max does.
And... That is why MAX is 3 times WC with just 26 years old.
You will never be a legend, behaving like everyone else.
Sorry Norris, more luck on the next life.
We need the battles! Racing! Too many years of drivers just driving off into the distance. Oh, the years of Schumacher & Mansell or Senna & Prost. The 60’s!
Now i know why i stopped listening to elvis, years ago. what a load of bs. First of all max didnt move the road was leaning right which makes it look like he was moving to the left while infact he just drove straight. secondly he sya when lando pushed max ofline it was slightly , maybe a little lando but goes hard when it exactually becomes a crash the other way aroiund. Because max avoided and lando didnt which is the whole point!Many incidents happen in that corner but most like max and hamilton took avoiding actiona against lando and sainz did hamilton. But yeah english go full on while lots of drivers like leclerc, piastri, sainz , perez etc had incidents and are i guess not intresting enough to talk about . Its trying to push max of his throne in favor of an english driver............
With the fastest car you should be able to pass cleanly. What did he do at the outside, wasnt possible.
It would have been cleanly if Max hadn’t blocked him with aggressive unnecessary driving, why he got a 10 second penalty, 2/10ths quicker on a lap not exactly a massive difference.
exactly he had to overtake on the inside. so lando's fault, because wrong position, it will always give contact like that.
I think CL and MV did it last year, CL did the same as MV today, but MV last year, took more left kerb to avoid contact, and then cut across the apex behind CL to pass CL, as CL took a longer arc.
I thought max was clearly a dangerous. Even the one where lando locked up Max turned slightly into landos line and lando had to also adjust slightly. He may have locked up anyway but max certainly knew he was making it harder for lando. I remember max doing this to Ricciardo when they were teammates several times and then again in his battles with Lewis. Max is a very dangerous driver.
Lando ' The Torpedo ' Norris, is a divebomb amateur. What you expect from a outside divebomb.
Lando was desperate, and a Lando desperate (same as Russel) does stupid things.
Such was the same od slurs and junk talk from Horner, blaming everyone and taking no responsibility, Iwas waiting for "Hamilton tried to kill Max" by being on track comment
Max is the modern Senna and Schumacher. The Brits like to see snowflakes drivers haha. Max is oldskool and Norris has to learn that you don`t get a win for free.
Senna said to Mansell, you have to be a bastard to be No 1.
What you just said applies to Max as well. Enough trying to justify his reckless driving and cracking under pressure.
@@trance9158 I don't think he cracked under pressure. More a case of You shall not pass.
The main issue was the second part of this incident. Max purposely pushed Lando off the track after the initial collision. That for me was completely out of order and dangerous. Max should definitely be punished for this particular part of what happened.
Not to mention that RedBull, in Max's case at least, have used their allotted engine assignment for the year.
Such incidents surely only lead to the potential that this will be breached. If not that, that a gearbox will be wasted through excess lateral forces being applied to it.
Not sure how far they're through their gearbox allocation to be fair though.
you are clearly biased i am sorry. "I always had great respect for you Elvis but it seems it now has all gone out the window" : This is what you are doing, max makes one bad move in years and thats it, all is over, he is back at square one. Never have I heard an Englishman react like that when lewis or lando or any other english driver has made a mistake.
Like you said in your video, you don’t got all the data. Maybe next time make a video until you have that. Now you are speculating and in my opinion you are not spot on. Maybe watch PW reaction.
The reason the Red Bull is so beautifully balanced is because they have a chip on both shoulders.....they never see a modicum of fault in anything they do ever....
Elite banger racing, sporting behaviour gone out the window, exactly the same in all other so called sports, (spoilt children)?
If we agree that max deserved a penalty, the penalty given was meaningless in light of the distance between him and the drivers behind. Either max should have been given a larger penalty to make a difference in that race or he should have been given a grid penalty in the next race. Max got away with it!
Bull you should listen to the podcast from Peter Winsor. its so easy to blame the Dutchman as always.
When you have access to both onboards and the telemetry like the stewards did then yes it’s easy to apportion blame and award a penalty.
The funny thing is of course that the whole British F1 Max hate brigade including the F1TV crew are all referring to a non existent rule. That is the level of F1 British journalism.
British fans are emotionally unstable and don't like racing