i harboured hope that Loghain would serve in Ferelden's Grey Wardens, but after what happened, there's no way they could let him be in Fereldan Sending him to Orlais is an irony so thick that we could've touched and tasted it. No doubt he felt the same, and he hated Orlesians with every fiber of his being. But Logahin is incredibly skilled and competent, not letting him serve would be a great waste
"When your mistakes are public, everyone feels like they're entitled to a personal apology" Say what you will of Loghain, he's still the best villain Bioware ever created.
@@SirChicky To the best of my knowledge, that's not how language works. But I guess you must identify closely with the term. I'm sorry for offending you. Have a nice day!
While it makes more sense that Stroud or Alistair would be Hawkes ally, I think it makes the most sense that Loghain would be ballsy enough to turn on the warden leadership.
Well Stroud is a man of morale, so it would also makes sense for him to go rogue. But about Loghain there is another thing that I like. It's the most sensible to leave him in the Fade. Loghain is an awesome character, but he did commit acts of evil and to be left in the Fade is his redemption. He is an old and tired man, hated by everyone including the Wardens whom he served for a decade, he carries a great burden of guilt and sorrow on his shoulders. To save Hawke and Inquisitor, to make sure that they save the Wardens and fight Corypheus is Loghain's absolution.
@@channel45853 And he did it to raise an army for the Blight. Is it terrible? Definitely yes, but if the Blight isn't stopped then everyone--including elves--will die. It's not like he did it because he hated elves specifically.
Loghain is such a tragic character especially after reading the books. He really is incredibly nuanced and well written. It always makes me sad that I can’t have both Alistair and Loghain.
Yeah, I just can't let Alistair stay pissed and not fight the final battle in DAO with me. I tried recruiting Loghain with hardened Alistair being king and it just did not feel right at all. Loghain's quote about daughters never growing up and Anora's voice when she says "father..." before his death kind of hits me hard, so I wanted to try it however.
I honestly feel bad for this poor bastard. You'll be hard set to find a man who has fallen farther than Loghain. Yeah he was a pain in the ass in Origins but I also get why he did what he did. It seems that he was never destined to have a happy ending.
I don't feel bad. I think Warden Loghain has found an ironic sort of redemption for his actions in Ferelden. Loghain having to join that which he wanted to destroy and break bread with Orlesian Wardens who he hated . . . Meanwhile in a lot of timelines his daughter is still Queen. Not a bad break all things considered.
Loghain's fault was not too much dedication, it was is fear and hatred of orlais that drove him to betray Calain cause Calain wanted to wait for the Orlaisian grey wardens and their troops that's why arguing with him in the landsmeet about Orlais NEVER works!
Vasyear not only that but if you play the dlc in origins you find out that the king was planning/thinking of casting away anora in favour of marrying the empress of orlais. Which I’m guessing in Loghains eyes was more than a little disrespectful to both him and fereldan.
Loghain is probably my favorite non party NPC of the series. His story is so interesting and he's the character with the most development even in Dragon Age Origins itself, he's a villain who believes he's doing the right thing even though he isn't and it's not one of those villains you see in every other game where they're just evil to be evil instead of being evil because they think they have no other choice. I like his Pre Origins Lore too... he was a hero before origins and in origins you give him the option of being a hero again.
I don't think he did anything bad. In DAI, Threnn says King Cailan's army was being overwhelmed and so Loghain made the tactical decision to withdraw and fight another day. Like Iron Bull says the best leaders are the ones willing to make the tough decisions. I still killed him in all my playthroughs though.
"Villain who thinks are doing the right thing" weeeell Cailan WAS indeed planning to break up with Anora and marry with the Orlesian Empress...Aaand the Orlesians would not just leave after that you know..There was a great chance Ferelden might just get occupied again. My Boi Loghain couldn't take that chance. I mean darkspawn are evil and stuff but..If you read the novels you see that Orlesians are not too much different
Didn't most of Loghain's crimes come from a fact that he had Arl Howe in his service? Unlike Loghain, Howe was in it only for personal gain and was just all around bad guy, while Loghain is a complicated character, who (if he survives) is set on a long road to atone for his mistakes. He's daily reminded of what a failure he is and how much he messed up, he suffers internally but still pushes forward.
Loghain if spared becomes a compelling character of redemption. I thought this was one of the better possible plot lines in all of DA:1 (besides your friend turning out to be your true enemy).
i started playing inquisition again and man, I miss Dragon Age. it does not get enough credit for its incredibly written characters and all the possible outcomes that connect the games.
The title of this video, and a lot of people commenting, seem to not know what "cameo" means. It's a brief appearance by known individual in the art. Loghain has a *ROLE* in DA:I. It is not a cameo.
@@blakechandler167 Nah the OP is correct. Loghain actually has a role in DAI that moves the plot forward. That's not a cameo. Connor has what's considered a cameo.
@@r.j.w7924 not really, it can be 1 of 3, Alistair, Loghain or Stroud, if it was only Loghain that could do this he'd be a plot character, but because he can be dead and the story doesn't change he's more of a cameo. Stroud is the one supposed to be the Warden as he's the one Hawke met and adventured with. Stroud is the plot, the other 2 are fan service cameos. I've started dragon age games again because of the da4 announcement lol
@@marcmitchell2288 I'm also replaying DA:I currently lol. But I have to disagree with you. If your choices lead to Loghain being in your DAI playthrough then he has an actual role in the game. If not, he doesn't even appear in the game. None of that qualifies as only a cameo.
@@marcmitchell2288 I loathe "cameo" talk. People keep saying flemeth and hawke have cameos, like nah a cameo is someone appearing in the back ground of a movie or on a newspaper cutting or something, these guys have fully voiced roles and push the plot forwards, they're certainly no cameos
***** Yeah, what I meant by trusting Loghain instead of Alistair, because he was too childish, seems that thing running through the whole family, Maric and Cailan too XD. Glad to hear someone share my same thought, not so many people read the novels and they immediately hated Loghain.
+Nina Azara In the comics he's publically killed a room full of Tevinter nobles, killed the prince of Antiva, and gotten captured by the Qunari. It's a wonder he hasn't caused Ferelden to be at war with half of thedas yet.
It's Strange, i wanted to hate Loghain in Origins, yet all i could think about was how to save him. He was a hero once, plus he was a father. What kind of a man executes a father infront of his child? I realized it was his fear, and paranoia of Orlais once again occupying ferelden (which was still fresh in his mind) That drove him to his actions. He couldnt see the Darkspawn as the threat they were all he could see was an invisible threat form Orlais.. So i spared him. Alistair left yes, but i also spared him. Killing Loghain wasn't going to bring Duncan, OR Cailan back. All it would have caused was more death. That is why i spared Loghain. He was an Honorable man once, and i let him get his honor back.
I spared Loghain because I believe that everybody deserves a chance at redemption. But these opportunities do not turn up very often. I let Loghain sacrifice himself in the final battle to regain back his honor and make things right. It is in a way good to see that he is trying to atone by serving the Wardens dilligently (assuming he survived in DA:O). It's not easy to forgive and give someone another chance to make amends and make things right after that person made a serious mistake, I know it's just a game but I mean in general in real life as well.
I wouldn't necessarily call the threat from Orlais invisible, they've conquered countries before under the guise of saving them from the blight, its how their first Emperor Drakon forged his Empire, and they did it to Nevarra in the 3rd blight. Plus Gaider confirmed Celene had planned to take control of the country via a marriage to King Calian. Sure after a certain point the Orlesians would reasonably be seen as necessary to fight the blight, but 4 legions - 20 thousand cavalry from a foreign power entering your country is nothing to scoff at.
Here Lies The Abyss is best with Loghain, in my opinion. Sacrificing him in the Fade just seems like the perfect ending to wrap up his story. I also like how they presented his character in this game, he seems a lot calmer and sort of mellow compared to Origins
Once again when I could kill him, but I can't bring myself to kill a character voiced by Simon "Kain" Templeman. I just can't, both are too awesome to die.
He seems almost... tired. Like a man who has managed to survive this long, but he’s pretty much outlived everyone who cared for him and everyone knows him as a traitor.
Loghain is such a great character, you know tied to the central plot, great writing and voice acting, tragic flaw etc. Too bad DA:O only allowed either him or Alistair.
@Marchingvenusaur the little things went a long way, like speaking to Conner for 5 minutes in Redcliffe, or just hearing a background npc make a nod to a prior event. That's all I REALLY need but these major cameos where so extra
@mikitadou yup, they really jumped the shark by throwing out everyone's world state and claiming it just wouldn't matter. I counted 4 times where the game directly conflicted my world state in DAV. Most notably saying that "Blackwall" and going around with his true identity. Like how is Blackwall going by Thom now if he died? Is he undead? A lyrium ghost? I GUESS HE IS JUST ALIVE OR HARDING IS CRAZY? Because I left him in prison and he I flat out refuse to believe that they wouldn't hang the man who was giving orders to the man they were just about to hang for following them.
i just love the thought of having fem Britquisitor talking with Loghain just coz one of Alix Wilton Regan’s first video game roles was as Loghain’s second in command in Origins. Catherine or Katherine, i think her name was.
Yo Loghain has been through a shit ton, meeting Meric and getting his dad killed, liking a girl whose already already engaged and then end up watching her die, being a traitor, being treated like a traitor and everything going on with the wardens. I'd have already killed myself
People shit on Bioware quite a bit but I give them respect given that it would have been super easy to just write in that Loghain died fighting Darkspawn and not gone to all the trouble to do this when 90% of Origins players would never have spared Loghain on their playthrough. Especially not when it angers Allistair so.
The thing about Loghain is that while he wasn't truely selfish, he DID almost cause Ferelden to fall to the Blight because he was arrogant and certain in his cause. I do not think he betrayed King Cailan without a heavy heart, but at the same time it is unforgivable aswell. He killed one of the most senior Wardens in existance at the same time. The battle at Ostagar could seemingly have been won, but it would only have been a skirmish and not the actual war itself. There was no Archdemon present, so this was just a precursor to what would happen. Though the chance still remains that if Loghain's forces HAD charged in as agreed, they would have dealt a big blow to the Darkspawn horde, but would have had to retreat soon after as they wouldn't have been prepared to face the full force yet. Due to the connection you have with Alistair, I find it impossible to "betray" him by the end. However, Loghain would have made a fine Warden and in time I am sure Alistair would, if not forgive him, atleast see reason in allowing him to live. I haven't truely exhausted all my options, but I would like to find a way to make Alistair a King and Loghain an Grey Warden. I believe that despite what Loghain did, he'd be repenting for his sins by fighting the Darkspawn and he DOES make a difference as you see here. Even being the Senior Warden. Besides, becoming a Grey Warden is a death sentence in itself, just a longer one.
With a tiny, tiny bit of reading I found out that it is actually indeed possible to spare Loghain AND have Alistair as a King.. though hardened. I'm not too sure if I like him being Hardened, as the reason you get so close with him to begin with is because he's idealistic and nice. I suppose being Hardened doesn't mean becoming rude or crass though.. just realistic. I am currently playing a run where I am finishing all three games WITH my own save games transferred to the next game.. so I might just try that.
Hardening is only a boon for Alistair, because it simply helps him to grow a spine. It doesn't even make him selfish, because only hardened Alistair can take one for a team (marry Anora and have Loghain join us), instead of whine to get his own way or become a drunkard. Outside of that Alistair is still Alistair, unlike Leliana who becomes hardened on her own and sets a course for a more bloody way to solve her problems (as we see in Inquisition). Ironically it's Morrigan who gets softened.
@Denam Josephine noted in one of the war table missions that Alistair was no politician; the peace talk between Orlais and Ferelden could easily go sideways if it weren't for Josephine's mediation and Orlais' reluctance to start another war in their current state. Alistair is a good man, but he needs either Eamon or Anora at his side. He cannot rule on his own.
"Though the chance still remains that if Loghain HAD charged in as agreed, they would have dealt a big blow to the darkspawn horde." No, they won't. Even if they managed to kill every darkspawn at Ostagar, it wouldn't dealt a significant blow to the horde. Why? Because *the Fifth Blight horde is greater than any of the previous Blights (Codex entry: Stalata Negat);* even greater than the First Blight which had enough numbers to annihilate the dwarven empire and wage war against all of Thedas for 190 years. Ten thousand casualties or so means little to the darkspawn; not when they number in the millions.
All of these commenters saying that Loghain was a well-written character with tons of nuance and development are all gonna lose their shit when the Veilguard "secret ending" basically just says SCREW YOU and that Loghain (and many other great characters) was basically just controlled by some unseen puppetmaster.
How cool would it of been if you actually meet the Hero of Ferelden here, and so in the final choice instead of choosing between a select warden and 2nd protagonist you actually have to pick between your 2 previous characters, the strong and silent type warden and the sarcastic Champion
Then Hawke would be the most chosen to die, we literally build our Warden up from the ground, where as Hawke is his own person that we push in different ways.
Don't forget that he is tainted. I don't know what the specific effects are but look at Duncan and Riarordan, they were old grey wardens but had no grey hear as well.
he wasn't ruined. people turn bad, shit happens. I prefer good villains who are realistic, to good guys who are unrealistic. I mean, he did what he thought he had to if you look at everything pertaining to him.
He has to be 65 or older in this. I always kill him in DO, so its nice to see this. I hated his guts my first play through, and then I started to read the books, and then I was having mix feelings. Its just like fighting the mages if I side with Templars, because I'm killing Alistair's mother, even if he does not know that. So many feelings!!!
I don't think that the unnecessary retcons like Alistair's mother being some random elven mage we've never heard about should be taken seriously. Alistair's mother was a servant and a human, Alistair's half-sister is Goldanna, also a human. Or are we supposed to throw that entire segment away just because some inquisition writer decided they wanted him to be different for the sake of it, related to a character he doesn't even get to have any worthwhile interactions with?
It's so weird hearing his voice come out of a face that only looks like Loghain in the most minimal way possible. I want to have more on-screen Loghain but haven't done a Dark Ritual world state because I think the self-sacrifice at the end of DAO is the best end to his story and also I don't want to look at Not-Loghain. (I miss the little braids.)
I used Loghain's head mod for my Inquisitor for Dragon Age: Inquisition because I wanted him as a Reincarnation of the character even though my warden had killed the guy in Origins.
I always found it odd that they gave all these different options for which Warden might be helping Hawke, but didn't also include the possibility that it be one of their siblings if you had let Carver or Bethany join the Wardens. It would have been awesome to see Carver and Hawke working together again. It would have also made the decision to leave one of them behind, WAY more difficult. Although I'm sure Hawke wouldn't have let either one of his/her siblings stay behind in his/her place.
bruh i literally never even considered he'd be Hawke's "grey warden friend" in place of either Alistair or Stroud. Did not know this was a possibility until right now and I feel dumb. XD
Loghain used to think Wardens were Fables of Legend . Look at him now ,from a Power hungry Tyrant ex-general to a Senior GW of the Order . I think Majority DAO ppl either allow Alistair kill Loghain or Hero Warden kill him. But,still recounting of Loghain's past crimes: Selling Elves in the Alienage to Tevinater /Locking up his Own daughter to speak against him/Swaying Denerim's Court perception upon him & using the propaganda to pin faults on the Grey wardens/ Abandoning King Callian by withdrawing /Hiring Antivan Crows Zevran to assassinate the Hero of Feraldan/Hire a Blood mage to poison Arl-Eamon,etc .
Corrupt is probably not the right word here, everything he did in Origins was aimed at further strengthening Ferelden, which in and of itself is not that bad a goal...
tillmannfischer Ok, so Him resorting to Heinous acts of Slavery-- Selling Elves in the Alienage to Tevinater /Locking up his Own daughter to speak against him/Swaying Denerim's Court perception upon him & using the propaganda to pin faults on the grey wardens/ Abandoning King Callian by withdrawing /Hiring Antivan Crows Zevran to assassinate the Hero of Feraldan/Hire a Blood mage to poison Arl-Eamon . Not a bad goal to claim the Throne ...But,of GW are allow to conscript people with serious criminal records & disavow that to fight with em
"They will never truly consider me theirs" - is a very nice line, considering he killed the entire order in Ferelden and nearly sentenced all of Thedas to another apocalypse by preventing the living ones from working.
Probably back in the Free Marches, Stroud was the warden you meet in DA2. Alistair can replace him for one part (if he's still an grey wander) Loghain however doesn't show up since he was stationed in Orlais. Since most people kill Loghain and make Alistair king they needed an third Warden to be Hawkes contact hence Stroud comes back.
Same here seems like a good death for him and useful reason for keeping him alive in Orgins.... Although I also have this feeling keeping him alive will be useful in a later game.(Plus Hawke I *think* could survive)
After leaving the Champion, somehow manage to survive & conqured the Fade. Hawke become corrupted and led a demonic army out & marching toward Skyhold. From the Forts window the inquisition saw the whole thing, the Inquisitor looks at his council & companions and can only say one thing... "Well...s#@t." X_X
Perhaps this isn't the best place to start the conversation but since both Alistair and Loghain can pop up I figured why not. Is anyone else a little put off by the fact that neither Hawke nor the Inquisitor are Wardens? I mean I get that the Warden (DA:O) needs something to make him stand out but It just feels weird. It's like In Mass Effect 2 and 3 where you can go around without getting your Specter status re-confirmed. I just feel my character is naked without the title. More so for Dragon Age, without a Warden main character they are just out of the loop not privy to even common knowledge about the Warden order.
marco dat phoenix not really, loghain will take the warden spot, as long as he's alive, alistair is either executed, left the party or becomes a king unwillingly
Rabid Ducking Oreo Milkshake You need to go through a cave and out the other end. This guide should help: www.ign.com/wikis/dragon-age-inquisition/Wyrm_Hole
More than two years have passed and yet I can't get it - how in seven hells is Loghain is Hawke's contact? Warden Alistair and Warden Stroud might be encountered in DA2, unlike Loghain. IMO, thay had to give him different role - I'd sacrifice Stroud without second thoughts (scene is yet another letdown - why not give an epic boss fight with Nightmare?) and have Hawke alive.
![Alistair cameo (King, Warden, Drunk) [all options] | Dragon Age 2](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/E2WIvguoWk4/mqdefault.jpg)
The irony in loghain its hilarious. He hated the grey wardens and orlais and now is the senior GREY WARDEN in ORLAIS
"Fate has a twisted sense of humor it seems."
As Loghain himself once said
i harboured hope that Loghain would serve in Ferelden's Grey Wardens, but after what happened, there's no way they could let him be in Fereldan
Sending him to Orlais is an irony so thick that we could've touched and tasted it. No doubt he felt the same, and he hated Orlesians with every fiber of his being. But Logahin is incredibly skilled and competent, not letting him serve would be a great waste
hahaha life is a bitch
Taste bitter ness voice
Facts. Thought it was a good punishment for Dragon Age orgins. But I married the queen, and allstair became a drunk, so iwas indifferent about it
No one told me Willem Dafoe was gonna be in this game.
lol, I know right?
Kelsey looks a bit like Willem Dafoe as well xD
Iron Bull is definitely Johnny SIns lol
@@koukaibi LMAO
"When your mistakes are public, everyone feels like they're entitled to a personal apology"
Say what you will of Loghain, he's still the best villain Bioware ever created.
Not even the villain, but an antagonist.
The illusive man would disagree.
@@glowhoo9226 Eh. He's kinda like that guy in school who acts mysterious but is just an incel.
@@xethified "incel" this word loses all meaning when thrown around willy nilly.
@@SirChicky To the best of my knowledge, that's not how language works. But I guess you must identify closely with the term. I'm sorry for offending you. Have a nice day!
wierd how loghaine looks ten years younger when its 10 years later
+Spencer West Darkspawn blood does wonders for your skin
He used blood magic to steal Teagan's youth.
More than ten years. Fifteen at least
No, Inquisition is 10 years after the Fifth Blight, aka 10 years after DAO.
yeah right? though he'd be all white hair by now. he's original model looked 50ish
While it makes more sense that Stroud or Alistair would be Hawkes ally, I think it makes the most sense that Loghain would be ballsy enough to turn on the warden leadership.
One thing that can be said about Loghain is is that he is not afraid of making hard choices if he deems them the right ones.
@@Dragon_Lair It's too bad that most people often mistook his pragmatism as evil.
Well Stroud is a man of morale, so it would also makes sense for him to go rogue. But about Loghain there is another thing that I like.
It's the most sensible to leave him in the Fade. Loghain is an awesome character, but he did commit acts of evil and to be left in the Fade is his redemption. He is an old and tired man, hated by everyone including the Wardens whom he served for a decade, he carries a great burden of guilt and sorrow on his shoulders. To save Hawke and Inquisitor, to make sure that they save the Wardens and fight Corypheus is Loghain's absolution.
@@brahmantyoihsan5938 he sold elves into slavery
@@channel45853 And he did it to raise an army for the Blight. Is it terrible? Definitely yes, but if the Blight isn't stopped then everyone--including elves--will die. It's not like he did it because he hated elves specifically.
Loghain became Willem Dafoe? The Blight has done good thing. Lol.
"Truth is like the blight you can shut it out for a time but it ain't ever goin away"
Loghain is such a tragic character especially after reading the books. He really is incredibly nuanced and well written. It always makes me sad that I can’t have both Alistair and Loghain.
? You can have Alistair become king and have Loghain live as a Warden, though
DutchGuyMike Alistair Hates you if you let Loghain live, so I can technically have both but I’m not happy about it.
I wish I could have them both too :D
Makes it all the more tragic.
Yeah, I just can't let Alistair stay pissed and not fight the final battle in DAO with me. I tried recruiting Loghain with hardened Alistair being king and it just did not feel right at all. Loghain's quote about daughters never growing up and Anora's voice when she says "father..." before his death kind of hits me hard, so I wanted to try it however.
That line should've been "How did you end up as an enemy of the Wardens AGAIN?"
That's a matter of perspective. The Wardens were destroying themselves.
Such an amazing voice actor
The same as Kain!
I KNEW IT
I honestly feel bad for this poor bastard. You'll be hard set to find a man who has fallen farther than Loghain. Yeah he was a pain in the ass in Origins but I also get why he did what he did. It seems that he was never destined to have a happy ending.
I don't feel bad. I think Warden Loghain has found an ironic sort of redemption for his actions in Ferelden. Loghain having to join that which he wanted to destroy and break bread with Orlesian Wardens who he hated . . . Meanwhile in a lot of timelines his daughter is still Queen. Not a bad break all things considered.
@MJSpiritual: Loghain has a child so he got atleast one happy ending in his life...
"I, more than anyone, know the cost of too much dedication."
Loghain's fault was not too much dedication, it was is fear and hatred of orlais that drove him to betray Calain cause Calain wanted to wait for the Orlaisian grey wardens and their troops that's why arguing with him in the landsmeet about Orlais NEVER works!
Vasyear not only that but if you play the dlc in origins you find out that the king was planning/thinking of casting away anora in favour of marrying the empress of orlais.
Which I’m guessing in Loghains eyes was more than a little disrespectful to both him and fereldan.
Loghain is probably my favorite non party NPC of the series. His story is so interesting and he's the character with the most development even in Dragon Age Origins itself, he's a villain who believes he's doing the right thing even though he isn't and it's not one of those villains you see in every other game where they're just evil to be evil instead of being evil because they think they have no other choice. I like his Pre Origins Lore too... he was a hero before origins and in origins you give him the option of being a hero again.
this! I love loghain.
I don't think he did anything bad. In DAI, Threnn says King Cailan's army was being overwhelmed and so Loghain made the tactical decision to withdraw and fight another day. Like Iron Bull says the best leaders are the ones willing to make the tough decisions.
I still killed him in all my playthroughs though.
"Villain who thinks are doing the right thing" weeeell Cailan WAS indeed planning to break up with Anora and marry with the Orlesian Empress...Aaand the Orlesians would not just leave after that you know..There was a great chance Ferelden might just get occupied again. My Boi Loghain couldn't take that chance. I mean darkspawn are evil and stuff but..If you read the novels you see that Orlesians are not too much different
Didn't most of Loghain's crimes come from a fact that he had Arl Howe in his service? Unlike Loghain, Howe was in it only for personal gain and was just all around bad guy, while Loghain is a complicated character, who (if he survives) is set on a long road to atone for his mistakes. He's daily reminded of what a failure he is and how much he messed up, he suffers internally but still pushes forward.
He's not a non party npc tho, you can recruit him in origins.
Homeboy Loghain back in action
Every friend group has the Traitor/War Criminal, and we love him just like that.
"Oh no he's hot!!!"
+Jennifer Winn Squidward xD
Jennifer Winn Literally my reaction
No
I could literally hear that 🤣 dying
Loghain if spared becomes a compelling character of redemption. I thought this was one of the better possible plot lines in all of DA:1 (besides your friend turning out to be your true enemy).
i started playing inquisition again and man, I miss Dragon Age. it does not get enough credit for its incredibly written characters and all the possible outcomes that connect the games.
The title of this video, and a lot of people commenting, seem to not know what "cameo" means. It's a brief appearance by known individual in the art. Loghain has a *ROLE* in DA:I. It is not a cameo.
Daniel D. It is kinda brief.
@@blakechandler167 Nah the OP is correct. Loghain actually has a role in DAI that moves the plot forward. That's not a cameo. Connor has what's considered a cameo.
@@r.j.w7924 not really, it can be 1 of 3, Alistair, Loghain or Stroud, if it was only Loghain that could do this he'd be a plot character, but because he can be dead and the story doesn't change he's more of a cameo. Stroud is the one supposed to be the Warden as he's the one Hawke met and adventured with. Stroud is the plot, the other 2 are fan service cameos. I've started dragon age games again because of the da4 announcement lol
@@marcmitchell2288 I'm also replaying DA:I currently lol. But I have to disagree with you. If your choices lead to Loghain being in your DAI playthrough then he has an actual role in the game. If not, he doesn't even appear in the game. None of that qualifies as only a cameo.
@@marcmitchell2288 I loathe "cameo" talk.
People keep saying flemeth and hawke have cameos, like nah a cameo is someone appearing in the back ground of a movie or on a newspaper cutting or something, these guys have fully voiced roles and push the plot forwards, they're certainly no cameos
Loghain's an awesome character, I don't care what the haters think, it's the truth.
+Giannis k. I agree! and I love his character even more in the novel, Loghain is the man I can trust, not Alistair.
***** Yeah, what I meant by trusting Loghain instead of Alistair, because he was too childish, seems that thing running through the whole family, Maric and Cailan too XD. Glad to hear someone share my same thought, not so many people read the novels and they immediately hated Loghain.
+ImmortalDragonLord He, Varric and The Architect are my favorites.
That's why his head was rolling on my floor :)
+Nina Azara In the comics he's publically killed a room full of Tevinter nobles, killed the prince of Antiva, and gotten captured by the Qunari. It's a wonder he hasn't caused Ferelden to be at war with half of thedas yet.
This to me is the ultimate outcome that you could just not foresee from Origins. Such a great redemption story!
I'm only here to hear Kain's voice once more,Simon Templeman is the best actor voice for anti heroes
It's Strange, i wanted to hate Loghain in Origins, yet all i could think about was how to save him. He was a hero once, plus he was a father. What kind of a man executes a father infront of his child? I realized it was his fear, and paranoia of Orlais once again occupying ferelden (which was still fresh in his mind) That drove him to his actions. He couldnt see the Darkspawn as the threat they were all he could see was an invisible threat form Orlais.. So i spared him. Alistair left yes, but i also spared him. Killing Loghain wasn't going to bring Duncan, OR Cailan back. All it would have caused was more death.
That is why i spared Loghain. He was an Honorable man once, and i let him get his honor back.
Justin Robertson Well said, mate :3
I spared Loghain because I believe that everybody deserves a chance at redemption. But these opportunities do not turn up very often. I let Loghain sacrifice himself in the final battle to regain back his honor and make things right.
It is in a way good to see that he is trying to atone by serving the Wardens dilligently (assuming he survived in DA:O).
It's not easy to forgive and give someone another chance to make amends and make things right after that person made a serious mistake, I know it's just a game but I mean in general in real life as well.
Justin Robertson I cut the bastard in half. Zero fucks given. my king has been avenged!
I wouldn't necessarily call the threat from Orlais invisible, they've conquered countries before under the guise of saving them from the blight, its how their first Emperor Drakon forged his Empire, and they did it to Nevarra in the 3rd blight. Plus Gaider confirmed Celene had planned to take control of the country via a marriage to King Calian. Sure after a certain point the Orlesians would reasonably be seen as necessary to fight the blight, but 4 legions - 20 thousand cavalry from a foreign power entering your country is nothing to scoff at.
Fuck Loghain, damn asshole he was.
Here Lies The Abyss is best with Loghain, in my opinion. Sacrificing him in the Fade just seems like the perfect ending to wrap up his story. I also like how they presented his character in this game, he seems a lot calmer and sort of mellow compared to Origins
Naah, Wardens need their commander, and I also want to see what they do with him next
Once again when I could kill him, but I can't bring myself to kill a character voiced by Simon "Kain" Templeman. I just can't, both are too awesome to die.
He seems almost... tired. Like a man who has managed to survive this long, but he’s pretty much outlived everyone who cared for him and everyone knows him as a traitor.
Is it just me or...Loghain just looks damn good in Frostbite 3...
He looks ridiculously hot with that new design... Oh my...
Loghain is such a great character, you know tied to the central plot, great writing and voice acting, tragic flaw etc. Too bad DA:O only allowed either him or Alistair.
I will never get over how rewarding it was to see my DAO choice pay off like that.
Yeah like people say what they will about Inquisition but it treated your choices with gravity and respect.
@Marchingvenusaur the little things went a long way, like speaking to Conner for 5 minutes in Redcliffe, or just hearing a background npc make a nod to a prior event. That's all I REALLY need but these major cameos where so extra
We should cherish that more. As it looks like it was the last time that it will ever happen with DA.
@mikitadou yup, they really jumped the shark by throwing out everyone's world state and claiming it just wouldn't matter.
I counted 4 times where the game directly conflicted my world state in DAV.
Most notably saying that "Blackwall" and going around with his true identity.
Like how is Blackwall going by Thom now if he died? Is he undead? A lyrium ghost? I GUESS HE IS JUST ALIVE OR HARDING IS CRAZY? Because I left him in prison and he I flat out refuse to believe that they wouldn't hang the man who was giving orders to the man they were just about to hang for following them.
Loghain! He lives! And looks quite handsome I must say.
i just love the thought of having fem Britquisitor talking with Loghain just coz one of Alix Wilton Regan’s first video game roles was as Loghain’s second in command in Origins. Catherine or Katherine, i think her name was.
Cauthrien
Yo Loghain has been through a shit ton, meeting Meric and getting his dad killed, liking a girl whose already already engaged and then end up watching her die, being a traitor, being treated like a traitor and everything going on with the wardens. I'd have already killed myself
People shit on Bioware quite a bit but I give them respect given that it would have been super easy to just write in that Loghain died fighting Darkspawn and not gone to all the trouble to do this when 90% of Origins players would never have spared Loghain on their playthrough. Especially not when it angers Allistair so.
The thing about Loghain is that while he wasn't truely selfish, he DID almost cause Ferelden to fall to the Blight because he was arrogant and certain in his cause. I do not think he betrayed King Cailan without a heavy heart, but at the same time it is unforgivable aswell. He killed one of the most senior Wardens in existance at the same time. The battle at Ostagar could seemingly have been won, but it would only have been a skirmish and not the actual war itself. There was no Archdemon present, so this was just a precursor to what would happen. Though the chance still remains that if Loghain's forces HAD charged in as agreed, they would have dealt a big blow to the Darkspawn horde, but would have had to retreat soon after as they wouldn't have been prepared to face the full force yet.
Due to the connection you have with Alistair, I find it impossible to "betray" him by the end. However, Loghain would have made a fine Warden and in time I am sure Alistair would, if not forgive him, atleast see reason in allowing him to live.
I haven't truely exhausted all my options, but I would like to find a way to make Alistair a King and Loghain an Grey Warden. I believe that despite what Loghain did, he'd be repenting for his sins by fighting the Darkspawn and he DOES make a difference as you see here. Even being the Senior Warden. Besides, becoming a Grey Warden is a death sentence in itself, just a longer one.
With a tiny, tiny bit of reading I found out that it is actually indeed possible to spare Loghain AND have Alistair as a King.. though hardened. I'm not too sure if I like him being Hardened, as the reason you get so close with him to begin with is because he's idealistic and nice. I suppose being Hardened doesn't mean becoming rude or crass though.. just realistic. I am currently playing a run where I am finishing all three games WITH my own save games transferred to the next game.. so I might just try that.
Hardening is only a boon for Alistair, because it simply helps him to grow a spine. It doesn't even make him selfish, because only hardened Alistair can take one for a team (marry Anora and have Loghain join us), instead of whine to get his own way or become a drunkard. Outside of that Alistair is still Alistair, unlike Leliana who becomes hardened on her own and sets a course for a more bloody way to solve her problems (as we see in Inquisition). Ironically it's Morrigan who gets softened.
@Denam Josephine noted in one of the war table missions that Alistair was no politician; the peace talk between Orlais and Ferelden could easily go sideways if it weren't for Josephine's mediation and Orlais' reluctance to start another war in their current state.
Alistair is a good man, but he needs either Eamon or Anora at his side. He cannot rule on his own.
"Though the chance still remains that if Loghain HAD charged in as agreed, they would have dealt a big blow to the darkspawn horde."
No, they won't. Even if they managed to kill every darkspawn at Ostagar, it wouldn't dealt a significant blow to the horde.
Why? Because *the Fifth Blight horde is greater than any of the previous Blights (Codex entry: Stalata Negat);* even greater than the First Blight which had enough numbers to annihilate the dwarven empire and wage war against all of Thedas for 190 years.
Ten thousand casualties or so means little to the darkspawn; not when they number in the millions.
All of these commenters saying that Loghain was a well-written character with tons of nuance and development are all gonna lose their shit when the Veilguard "secret ending" basically just says SCREW YOU and that Loghain (and many other great characters) was basically just controlled by some unseen puppetmaster.
Loghain Mac Tir is already a Senior Warden. The Orlesian Wardens can't accept him as a BROTHER a HERO WHO DROVE OFF THE ORLESIAN EMPIRE IN FERELDEN.
Well they definently did better with Hawke and Logain than they did Alistair.
Logain looks downright destroyed full of guilt and regret in this if you chose to spare him
I had no idea that you can meet him in Inquisition. My boy lives YESS.
I love Loghain, one of the best characters in the entire series
Loghain here is how I imagine Kain from Legacy of Kain looked like before he became a vampire
He still looks weird to me not wearing massive plate mail
simon templemen is one heck of a voice actor. best voice acting role he played was kain in the legacy of kain game series
How cool would it of been if you actually meet the Hero of Ferelden here, and so in the final choice instead of choosing between a select warden and 2nd protagonist you actually have to pick between your 2 previous characters, the strong and silent type warden and the sarcastic Champion
Then Hawke would be the most chosen to die, we literally build our Warden up from the ground, where as Hawke is his own person that we push in different ways.
Loghain, as played by Willem Dafoe apparently.
Oh kain how we miss you so much .... please come back to the community we need you again
Loghain looks too young here. He should at least have some gray in his hair, maybe a little more wrinkles as well.
I was wondering about the hair too. 10 years yet didn't age as much. O_o
Lazer Beard not everyone age the same🙄
Don't forget that he is tainted. I don't know what the specific effects are but look at Duncan and Riarordan, they were old grey wardens but had no grey hear as well.
@@puffkitty007 Maybe the taint in their blood works as an embalming fluid, keeping them fresh
@@puffkitty007 he is older than both by 20 years old
He even looks a bit like Kain in this
KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAn!
Not gonna lie.... Logain and Samson..... I would romance either one lol
he wasn't ruined. people turn bad, shit happens. I prefer good villains who are realistic, to good guys who are unrealistic. I mean, he did what he thought he had to if you look at everything pertaining to him.
+Gaunjee Major Every villain is the hero of their own story
Prince consort Last time i imported this world state. I had a bug with DAO cameo mentioning King Alistair so i never made it this far.
nice, Simon Templeman -Blood Omen Legacy of Kain
tbh i wish the next game was about the hero of ferelden trying to solve this the calling thingy.
I wonder why alistair didn’t hear the calling if he is made king. He seemed perfectly fine at redcliffe.
Alistair is a lovable character, but he is a dumbass. He probably blamed it on the digestion issues caused by royal cuisine or something.
Gods the writing was compelling then...
He has to be 65 or older in this. I always kill him in DO, so its nice to see this. I hated his guts my first play through, and then I started to read the books, and then I was having mix feelings. Its just like fighting the mages if I side with Templars, because I'm killing Alistair's mother, even if he does not know that. So many feelings!!!
62
I don't think that the unnecessary retcons like Alistair's mother being some random elven mage we've never heard about should be taken seriously. Alistair's mother was a servant and a human, Alistair's half-sister is Goldanna, also a human.
Or are we supposed to throw that entire segment away just because some inquisition writer decided they wanted him to be different for the sake of it, related to a character he doesn't even get to have any worthwhile interactions with?
Why does he look ten years younger than he did ten years ago?
i'd spare logain everytime in the landsmeet...
yep, in the very first playthough, I spared him, married his dauther...and became a king...I did not see that coming tbh
Man i would love to see your character sliders, shes beautiful
O hey I did not know Willem Dafoe was in this game.
It's so weird hearing his voice come out of a face that only looks like Loghain in the most minimal way possible. I want to have more on-screen Loghain but haven't done a Dark Ritual world state because I think the self-sacrifice at the end of DAO is the best end to his story and also I don't want to look at Not-Loghain. (I miss the little braids.)
I love that voice. It always makes me think of Cain. Why haven't those games been remade?
Wow, thanks for this video, a rarity. Loghain seems much less like an asshole here. Guess 10 years as a Warden did him good.
I used Loghain's head mod for my Inquisitor for Dragon Age: Inquisition because I wanted him as a Reincarnation of the character even though my warden had killed the guy in Origins.
Where did you get that badass staff Solas is wearing? It looks sweeeet!!
Sorry I don't remember but it's either a random drop or I bought it in Val Royeaux. It's not a schematic.
I hope you're keeping well and safe
Sweet Maker... he's hot.
Compared to Logain Ablar? Lol.
I always found it odd that they gave all these different options for which Warden might be helping Hawke, but didn't also include the possibility that it be one of their siblings if you had let Carver or Bethany join the Wardens. It would have been awesome to see Carver and Hawke working together again. It would have also made the decision to leave one of them behind, WAY more difficult. Although I'm sure Hawke wouldn't have let either one of his/her siblings stay behind in his/her place.
bruh i literally never even considered he'd be Hawke's "grey warden friend" in place of either Alistair or Stroud. Did not know this was a possibility until right now and I feel dumb. XD
Loghain has the voice of Kain from Legacy of Kain (Simon Templeman), yet his model looks like it was based on Kevin Conroy.
Loghain went from hated to, hated but interesting and creative...hmm.
I don't even recognize Loghain!
Loghain used to think Wardens were Fables of Legend . Look at him now ,from a Power hungry Tyrant ex-general to a Senior GW of the Order . I think Majority DAO ppl either allow Alistair kill Loghain or Hero Warden kill him. But,still recounting of Loghain's past crimes:
Selling Elves in the Alienage to Tevinater /Locking up his Own daughter to speak against him/Swaying Denerim's Court perception upon him & using the propaganda to pin faults on the Grey wardens/ Abandoning King Callian by withdrawing /Hiring Antivan Crows Zevran to assassinate the Hero of Feraldan/Hire a Blood mage to poison Arl-Eamon,etc .
Corrupt is probably not the right word here, everything he did in Origins was aimed at further strengthening Ferelden, which in and of itself is not that bad a goal...
tillmannfischer Ok, so Him resorting to Heinous acts of Slavery--
Selling Elves in the Alienage to Tevinater /Locking up his Own daughter to speak against him/Swaying Denerim's Court perception upon him & using the propaganda to pin faults on the grey wardens/ Abandoning King Callian by withdrawing /Hiring Antivan Crows Zevran to assassinate the Hero of Feraldan/Hire a Blood mage to poison Arl-Eamon .
Not a bad goal to claim the Throne ...But,of GW are allow to conscript people with serious criminal records & disavow that to fight with em
Tatsumi Anime Superhero Fan Tevinter*
***** righttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt ty
Lmar daggerwolf
So everyone not having your agenda as their top priority is a "scheming bitch"?
He looks like Norman osborn from spider man.
I can't find the final part (in the fade) of this mission with loghain T.T
I actually spared his life in my firts playthrough, and killed him in my second
Willem Dafoe appearance+Simon Templemann's voice(Kain from Legacy Of Kain)=Deadly combo!
"They will never truly consider me theirs" - is a very nice line, considering he killed the entire order in Ferelden and nearly sentenced all of Thedas to another apocalypse by preventing the living ones from working.
As if the other Wardens were any better. Care to remind us what they did in Inquisition?
I'm bringing blackwall when I meet loghain
I came here to hear Simon templeman talk for 7 minutes
Is that really THE voice of Kain of Blood Omen/Soul Reave?!
He needs to sleep
He kinda looks like Willem Dafoe. Not sure if I got the spelling right.
It's ironic that Hawke is working with Logain considering that Logain almost got him killed at Ostagar, lol
Looks totally different
I forgot this was an option xD
Did Loghain get younger in the last ten years?
Planning to spare logain on my dwarf noble playthrough while making alistair king
What happens to Stroud then? Is he with the other Wardens? Does Loghain also replace him in DA2?
Probably back in the Free Marches, Stroud was the warden you meet in DA2. Alistair can replace him for one part (if he's still an grey wander) Loghain however doesn't show up since he was stationed in Orlais.
Since most people kill Loghain and make Alistair king they needed an third Warden to be Hawkes contact hence Stroud comes back.
Thank you for the summary, now I know who I'm going in the Fade. ;D
Sacrifice Loghain.
Same here seems like a good death for him and useful reason for keeping him alive in Orgins....
Although I also have this feeling keeping him alive will be useful in a later game.(Plus Hawke I *think* could survive)
After leaving the Champion, somehow manage to survive & conqured the Fade. Hawke become corrupted and led a demonic army out & marching toward Skyhold. From the Forts window the inquisition saw the whole thing, the Inquisitor looks at his council & companions and can only say one thing... "Well...s#@t." X_X
The Legacy of Ghain.
If your hero is with Anora and here is Loghain. Alistair? He is a drunkard, dead? Is there any mention of him or what happened to him?
Aya Miyu He's a drunkard, but haven't found any mention of him
G
Loghain is so cool but in this cameo he looks nothing like original Loghain. I almost not recognize him.
Perhaps this isn't the best place to start the conversation but since both Alistair and Loghain can pop up I figured why not.
Is anyone else a little put off by the fact that neither Hawke nor the Inquisitor are Wardens? I mean I get that the Warden (DA:O) needs something to make him stand out but It just feels weird.
It's like In Mass Effect 2 and 3 where you can go around without getting your Specter status re-confirmed. I just feel my character is naked without the title. More so for Dragon Age, without a Warden main character they are just out of the loop not privy to even common knowledge about the Warden order.
I'm hoping the next game has Wardens at the front again, with Griffons. Maybe centered in Antiva? Accents everywhere.
hippiebrother3 I was actually thinking that Tevinter would be the next stop for the series, but Antiva would be great as well.
This almost makes me wish I had Xbox Live Gold, so I could use Warden's Keep and create my own backstory. WHO THE FUCK IS STROUD!?
Stroud is a warden from dragon age 2 who helps save your sibling if you decide to make them a grey warden. Not too important but he's there.
He’s so babygirl
how do you get Loghain. I went to dragon age keep several times and kept my warden alive but I always get boring old stroud.
Loghain must survive the fifth blight, im not sure about editing the keep from inquisition itself cause i dont have inquisition... yet.
marco dat phoenix not really, loghain will take the warden spot, as long as he's alive, alistair is either executed, left the party or becomes a king unwillingly
Hey Willem
How do you get this cameo? I only get the Stroud one.
+SpiyderUnit01 Import a World State where Loghain survives Dragon Age: Origins.
I wonder if it's possible to get the armor Loghain/Stroud/Alistair wears.
I don't know about armor, but you can get a schematic for it in Wyrm Hole quest in Crestwood.
Speaking of that quest, I got to the area the Wyvern is said to be at, but there was nothing but some Veridium, a note and a sack.
Rabid Ducking Oreo Milkshake
You need to go through a cave and out the other end. This guide should help: www.ign.com/wikis/dragon-age-inquisition/Wyrm_Hole
I got a blue and gold version from a dragon in Crestwood, then I tinted it to the same colour as the wardens. Voila
They could have done a better job with the faces. They look like ME2-ME3 imports
why did most of us get Stroud instead of him?
Because most people killed him in DAO and made Alistair king.
Shame... he was a great and complex character.
More than two years have passed and yet I can't get it - how in seven hells is Loghain is Hawke's contact? Warden Alistair and Warden Stroud might be encountered in DA2, unlike Loghain. IMO, thay had to give him different role - I'd sacrifice Stroud without second thoughts (scene is yet another letdown - why not give an epic boss fight with Nightmare?) and have Hawke alive.
anyone feel like their movements are distracting? the way they shake their heads especiall
Seriously? I actually kept him alive on dragon age origins and later and he still didn't show up in inquisition!
Import from Dragon Age Keep then
Scion of Balance