Great video! People always groan when I say hiker communities are just better than others, but this vid is a great example. Tons of comments that disagree with Tim, and yet it has over 95 percent thumbs up, because people understand and respect what these vids are all about. Try getting that on a sports or political video.
I actually prefer a pad over a under quilt sometimes, depending on temperature of course. Probably the prepper side of me. I can use a sleeping pad for multiple things whereas an under quilt serves one purpose only. Great video Tim.
As you know, I'm a ground dweller...but I did enjoy your video anyway. Even on the ground, I don't fully inflate my pad. It's more comfortable that way.
This is so funny that you made a video on this. I just did a two night backpacking trip in NC. After watching one of your other videos, I decided to pick up a sleeping pad to try out. Just like you said, I wanted more flexibility to go to the ground if I needed to. I got one of the Nemo Tensor insulated pads. They come in a regular wide size ( 72 x 25 x 3), which worked out to be a perfect size for me. It never slipped around in my Dutchware Chameleon. The only thing I noticed is if you leave your arms next to the hammock walls they will get cold. I just threw on another layer and slept great. The temp for both nights got down to just above 40 degrees. Thanks for the info!
Great vid. Also, I tuck the pad into the footbox of my topquilt this way I never slip off and it is easy to change the position if I start to migrate while sleepining. I carry a pad on new trips a lot for the same reason, I may not be in a spot to hang if I'm above treeline or in dense forest. Not much less comfortable than my UQ's
Great info ( as always ) Tim. The few times I have used a hammock. I used a self inflating sleep pad. To STOP. It from slipping around I added some of those grippy rubber mats used in cupboards to keep cups and dishes stable. I used a product similar to gorilla glue ( thin layer). - Everything stayed in place ✔️
Thanks and yea those tricks will help stop the slipping. I didn't think about those rubber mats you find in cupboards but yea that's kind of a perfect hack.
Most times I would prefer to use an under quilt with my hammock however there are occasion particularly in the warmer months that I can see the possibility of using a pad. Thanks for posting.
Great video Tim I just ordered the Dutchware chameleon double layer hammock because I already have a Klymit 4.4 but if I have to I'll get the thermarest but it's about $260 so hopefully my matte will work it is in the mummy shape. I'm thinking if I can't figure this out maybe I should go to and under quilt. I have never slept in a hammock but I've watched all of you guys videos for the last 2 years and dreamed of having one, I'm 65 with a bad back so hopefully this will be the Cure for camping out.
Awesome tips Tim! I have never used a sleeping pad in my hammock yet, but have really been considering it a lot lately. Thanks for sharing the knowledge!
Ya almost had me sold, but I'm an active sleeper. I like my DIY underquilt ($50 total build, tested down to 34°f). My pack is a Gossamer Gear Mariposa with the Sit/back pad. So, I just upgraded to the 3 section pad (2/3 length sleep pad). I got a comfy extra big or extra thick sit pad and an emergency "crap no good hang spot" sleep pad. Works pretty well for me, but HYOH. 😊
I've used my rectangular Nemo in a hammock many times but wonder how a mummy style would work. I do hate slipping off a narrow pad when tent camping. Thinking the new Thermarest Xtherm Neoair
Great tips Tim. Before I had an underquilt I used a piece of relectix or even just a car windshield sun shade and it worked pretty good, but now I do like the underquilt better. A person could use both together for extra warmth if using an underated quilt for the temps your in.
Definitely an excellent tip on how to move your sleeping pad around. And it would be nice to have the versatility to sleep on the ground if needed. Thanks for sharing brother.
It takes me forever to get comfortable with a pad in my hammock. Then as soon as I am finally comfortable: I have to pee and all is lost and have to start again.
You can also pee from you hammock on the ground beside you, just make sure to clear a side so you dont pee on your gear. Unzip sleeping bag, lay horizontally, pull hammock side, wiener out and you're good to go. Yall thank me later! Ha!
IMO the only reason to take a pad is if you're going to be hiking where there might not be any trees/supports to hang from. I live camp and hike on the east coast and don't have that problem. Under Quilts are so much more comfortable and hassle free. But het whatever works, everyone is different! happy trails!
I have the dual layer Blackbird and can get the Xtherm and Xlite in there together. That fixes a lot of issues for me. There's a weight penalty, but I hammock because it's comfortable and not because it's the lightest. And I already have the mats for when I tent.
Nice video Tim. I can relate to the gater wrestling ... my first nite in a hammock was on a pad as well as in a sleeping bag. Took me 15 minutes to get in and settled. And I was soaked in sweat from the effort. And my daughter laughed at me the whole time!! I also have a Paria Recharge XL, which is a bit large for most hammocks. But on a really cold night, it will work. I have since made an underquilt out of space blanket that keeps me warm down to about 32. Lots more comfortable. When it gets colder or in snow, I usually switch to my tent! Hope to head out to Mohican with a buddy this weekend with my BearButt! :)
Enjoy! Should be a nice weekend. Oh man, the combo of a sleeping bag AND a pad gives me the heebie jeebies thinking about it. lol. Major gator wrestling for sure.
Great video Tim! I've been using a sleeping pad in my hammock for the last 3 years and saw no need for an underquilt because of how expensive they are. That has changed recently, however, because I found that hammock gear sells an econ version of their quilts for around 150 dollars depending on the length and temp rating. I bought the 20 degree for that price, and im excited to test it out. I haven't received it yet, so I don't know everything about it. I do know that it is very cost effective and lighter than my current klymit static v insulated pad. Thanks again for the video! I would definitely bring a pad for any trip out west due to the versatility you mentioned.
If you are talking about higher temperatures, it is far easier to use a foam sell pad that rolls out. It keeps its shape far better, and when you don’t need all the extra insulation, it is easier to position at a diagonal
Our physiology must be different. I always set up my hammock with my head slightly above my feet. I've always used pads. Nothing worse than a cold spot that you can't escape. Good info.
I know it. Another benefit compared to a down UQ, no problems with migrating down etc. You do have to try a well adjusted UQ at least once though. Super comfortable.
Funny, I hadn’t seen this video before. I’m doing a Frozen Butt Hang in February and am purchasing a new underquilt for it to go with the Chameleon I’m getting for Christmas. UQ’s have always been so cost prohibitive, but the new Econ ones from several vendors changed my mind. I just can’t sleep comfortably in a hammock with a pad.
Who knows why youtube serves up videos the way they do. I'm jealous, new gear is always fun but I agree the econ line makes the cost much more manageable. I'm fortunate in that this works for me. It depended on the pad. The xtherm is just about perfect for me.
I just cannot get comfortable in a hammock without a pad. That is the primary reason I have one. Use a klymit insulated pad in my Warbonnet Ridge Runner. Really flattens out the lay. Not much movement when pad is placed in between the double layer. Under quilts do look cozy though.
I never show them but I do have a couple of hammocks and I tried this method and it can be very comfortable. Unfortunately for me I'm way to restless of a sleeper and wind up fighting the pad and hammock. Back to the ground I go 😆 but great info for the cold weather hangers.
You sure you don't want to send them to me? ;) I think the UQ system is more comfortable but I love to the have the option of ground sleeping if need be.
Great tip Tim.. I think I would only go to a pad if there was a possibility that I might need to ground sleep. I just wish some of these Items were more reasonably priced. I have seen under quilts that were $400+ 4 season ground mats are the same. It makes it hard for people to get started with prices like that. But we make it happen because we love it. Tha ks for the info brother
I figured I would chime in here. I agree top quilts and underquilts can get pricey that being said there is a lot of work that goes into making them, ie baffles filling it, etc. If you are on a budget or just don't want to spend a whole lot of money right now. I would strongly recommend going with synthetic and or non-baffled versions of TQ'S OR Uq's Arrowhead Equipment makes some very inexpensive quilts. I think I paid $100 dollars for my first Quilt. Granted it was not down or baffled but it got the job done. I still have it and let some of my buddies use it or if it gets really cold I double it and use it to make a full length underquilt. www.arrowhead-equipment.com/
Jaxx Drinkwater I am using a snugpak under blanket right now it isnt great but it does keep me comfortable to around 7°c and its heavy. I would like something to get me to about 0c quilt or blanket I dont care it just cant be $400. Thanks for the tip on arrowhead I will check out their stuff. $100 with exchange and shipping would be around $180. Still not bad.
Before my wife got an underquilt, we actually put a Klymit Static-V sleeping pad inside of her sleeping bag. A little cumbersome to get in and out of but no worries of cold spots or the pad sliding around on cold nights.
We're the lucky ones. Some people do have trouble with the slipping around. Once I got used to the pad I don't see myself going back except for on more camping style trips.
I am going to try some reflective bubble foil + a 3/4 sleeping pad as my hammock is two layered I can fill the middle layer with insulation and have my pad directly under me.
I just use my surplus 3 piece sleep system whole or in parts, depending on the situation. It works out great for me and it was given to me so, didn't cost me a dime.
Now Tim, I had to Stop the video at throw away your underquilt!!! Underquilts are the direction I have been leaning towards after fighting to many nights with a pad..You better have a persuasive argument!! LOL Agree on the deflating. I like the foot pad Idea, I do fight with my feet sliding off. Thanks for the video...but still headed towards an underquilt :)
good vid tim for hammock sleepers , and a good option for just in case of going to the ground.. wrestling gators is a little to much for me, my system is some what different .. ..bill
I sold my HG underquilt and prefer a down filled sleeping pad instead.. I sometimes use a piece of 1/8 foam ( the stuff used to recover pool tables) to keep the pad in one spot. There is a learning curve but you get very good at using a pad. And as mentioned...you can always go to ground as needed. Thanks for the video, very helpful.
Oh so many puns here. Lol out of context I mean. ... smiling. ... Tim I watched it because I wanted to learn. I did learn, I have a roll up pad. It is very soft. Thanks
So nothing like revisiting an old topic but question: What is the lowest temp you have gone down to with using a pad. I have the xlite and anticipate that Ill end up bringing the 10 degree underquilt until i can squeeze a winter weight pad but I was curious as to the comfort level and what your expierience has been. Sorry I missed you at the meetup, and thanks!
No problem, and I loved your shirt! I think we just missed each other in the parking lot on the way out! D'Oh!! I've used the xtherm down in the teens without an issue. I'll freely admit that I have to take care not to touch any part of the hammock of the pad. The xlite combined with the UQ should make you set for around those temps as well.
hi tim first off thanks for the video, I was hearing about double layer hammocks, that have a sleep pad pocket, and was wondering what were your thoughs? or would it be best just to keep looking for a good hang before one hands over there cash? as they are different then a tent, and I have used them for years.
+jonnyfly69 I touch on the double layer hammock in the description. Some people like them better for sleeping pads but honestly I find them more annoying. I like being able to grab ahold the pad when I adjust. The sleeping pad pocket can make that more difficult. If you're new to hammock camping I have a playlist BUT you should also check out shugemery here on TH-cam. TONS of good and detailed information.
Hey what is that hanging bag you use in the video? The one hanging above your hammock. I've been trying to find something like that that isn't overpriced eno
I've been hammock camping for years. I have tried using pads but never liked them. There fine if you sleep on your back and don't move during the night. I would much rather have an under quilt any day. But to each their own , "HYOH". I have found the best way to use a pad is to use a double layer hammock.
If you have your hammock a little tighter you will sleep more comfortable, also buying a hammock that's double layered like the Tenth Wonder XL you can slip the pad between the hammock sheets. I have sewn along two sides so the pad slips in to my hammock.. it doesn't move about, I sleep very comfortably.. happy days.
just got an xlc, I get discomfort on my neck from pressure on back of my head, knee/leg over-extension & lack of support under my lower back. wondering if a pad like this would help, but the price of some is a big piece of an underquilt. first things first I guess.
How tall are you? One common things I suggest is making sure your foot end is higher than your head end (start with six inches higher and work your way up) to see if that helps with the pain. As far as the pad I'd try buying a cheaper and heavy (costco, thermarest etc. about $40) pad thats self-inflating with some foam in it as well. For example (www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000MNBLXU). It's cheaper and it'll give you some idea if a pad would help. Good luck!
Tim Watson Thanks for the suggestions, ill work at it. Im 5'7" The two trees in my yard that I have been learning on are at the upper end of the recommended distance (17-18 ft). After doing my best to account for all the setup factors im aware of, (30° angle - foot end higher & closer to its tree - ridgeline tension) I seem to only get the hammock to a minimum functioning height off the ground, & then altering something at that point usually results in the ridgeline to tight or the hammock touching the ground (when im in it). Perhaps when I get out in the field more ill find that its all in the tree distance, though it would be nice to be able to reach higher up the tree :-) Also still finding the best place to position myself in once inside. Theres a comment in the setup instructions that came with the hammock about laying with your eyes even with the farthest side tieout & the other at chest level, - the meaning of this hasn't registered with me yet. All in all there's enough things to play with to find the best option. I'll look into a pad such as you mentioned, thanks for your reply. Happy hammocking to you!
what about comfort? I just spent my first night in a hammock and found I was much more comfortable when using a half inflated sleeping pad then without, nothing to do with being warm, just the comfort of laying in the hammock. Maybe I didn't have it strung up right?
I have always used a sleeping pad. I can't imagine sleeping in a hammock without one really. As much struggle as I have had to get comfortable in a hammock, I will always use one.
Same here. I've hammock camped all summer with a Solite small (9oz). It's a bit narrow at 20" though. I haven't had a problem with cold feet, even though it's short for me - I just wear polyester fleece socks (1.5oz) available at the dollar store.
You do a good job of stressing sleeping on a diagonal. I find most the videos showing an underquilt the are like a banana so it defeated the purpose of hammock comfort That looked like the widest pad I have ever seen. What do you think of a arrest or Ridgecrest foam pad..
I find that me knees ache when sleeping in the hammock. I try to go at a diagonal to get as flat as possible but the curve of the hammock still strain my knees. Any thoughts?
The two things I usually recommend are hanging your foot end higher (play around with how high) or putting a pillow/clothes/fleece jacket under your knees. Have you tried those?
Tim Watson I mostly tried a sort of side sleeping. With the putting the feet higher does the blood run to your head? Thanks for the tips I'll have to try them.
I did an underquilt once and must have done it wrong cause I froze. Problem was the temp dropping 10 degrees cooler than forecasted. I would have been alright if it weren't for breezes blowing between the quilt and hammock. Pads are a sure thing so I went with them instead.
That is another benefit. You're guaranteed no cold spots through a good pad. With the UQ you have to make sure it has a good sag or is cinched properly OR have to worry about migrating down with some quilts.
The UQ was probably not cinched up against the hammock correctly. Just this past weekend, my friend tried an UQ for the first time. We had strong winds on night. I was crosswise to the wind, so my rainfly blocked it all for me. He was not, and the wind ran right under his fly. and it's not that big (it's a Hennessy set up). BUT, all he felt was a light breeze on his face, and stayed warm all night.
Great tip and great video Tim. Personally, I find it's too much fiddling with the pad, especially on those cold nights when you have to pee and then need to get back in the hammock then have to straighten everything all over again... sucks.That's just me but whatever works for someone I say stick with it. If I had to go to ground... then (Barcolounger) :)
I agree the pad is fiddly,. I use a pad when I take may hammock and there are shelters, gives me the options on where to sleep. You don't want to pee in the middle of the night if it's a cold night, the amount of heat that is lost getting in and out. If you stop drinking 2 hours before you go to sleep you will not have to get up,,. you simply don't have enough fluid in you to fill your bladder, you will make it till the morning.
Tim thanks for the video. I converted from tent to hammock camping so I already had the insulated pad but it never occurred to me what a difference a few less breaths make in keeping my pad from launching. All the best!
@@TimWatsonOutdoors Thanks for the quick reply. I'm trying to decide whether to get an insulated pad or an underquilt. Your argument is compelling, but still thinking. For those reading my above comment, I should point out I've taken my XLite down to 15 comfortably on the ground, with a 0 degree bag. But got cool at 48 in a hammock.
Tim Watson Sams had a sleeping pad that was really light weight, compact, and wouldn’t take up much room at all. I think I’ll get one the next time they have them.
Tim Watson , it also looks like you have the large 77x25? I assume that helps eliminate cold knees when you side sleep - so your knees are not hitting cold hammock?
Great video. I do not think hammocks are good for people that toss and turn a lot during sleep. I am one of those and also alternate between sleeping on my back and side sleeping. That is why i have never tried hammocks and the other reason is wherever I go mostly in desert location there are lots of rocks but not enough trees.
I'm in Florida so my pad is a better option. My pad fit in a double layer and doesn't move once it's in place. My hammock is also a double nest and that makes a difference.
Interesting video, I’ve always slept with an underquilt. I’ve never used a sleep pad but I’m thinking of trying them out next cold weather season. Thanks for the video and now I’m thinking about wrestling with gators. That was funny.
It's not bad if you use the sleeping bag as a quilt. You're going to lose the insulation under you by crushing it with your body weight anyway. If you're trying to get into it like a sleeping bag then that's hard enough without a pad. 😀
How about an Amok hammock or possibly a double layered hammock like one of the Hennessey hammocks. This is a great opportunity for hammock manufacturers.
Some people like the double layers better for a pad but I find that it can get more slippery unless you use some material to stop the slipping. I actually prefer the single layer because I can hold and adjust the pad myself if needed.
As a side sleeper, I just can’t see myself in a hammock. It also seems to technical. My Terra Nova tent stands in 20 seconds. Mat, Sleeping bag& I’m ready. I can turn at night without having to put anything back in place.
Ok. But what about being in a sleeping bag (mummy especial?)? It's impossible to all thing you have shown. It's the only way to use a quilt in the hammock, but even thou using sleeping pad doesn't allow you to attach quilt to the pad, because you couldn't make any pad adjustments.
Use the sleeping bag as a quilt. Don't zip it all the way. There is no need to attach the bag to the pad. Maybe a future follow up video is necessary to help.
For more years then I care to remember ( to many ) I have used a self inflating sleeping pad in my hammock.My favorite is the self inflating Therm-a-rest full length mummy pad. I inflate it about 1/2 to 3.4 inflation for use in the hammock. I have used a Neo Air but it is better in the tent then the hammock due to it's 2 .1/2 inch thickness. Don't get me wrong I have used a under quilt and really like it but I still prefer the sleeping pad. It sure is nice to have when you use your hammock as a solo tent on those rare occasions. One benefit I enjoy is that on a warm to hot evening you can lay in the hammock with nothing under you. Then when the dreaded chilly butt syndrome starts you can slide the pad under you and get comfortable. Heck you can even use it half on and half off depending on your comfort level. On really warm summer nights a 3/4 length pad is ideal. If you are using a double bottom Hammock like a Warbonnet Blackbird then cheat and slide the pad in-between the two bottom layers.
Chuck has it right, I love being able to choose how much of myself is on the pad in the warmer months. It's nice to have options. @Lou there is some sliding in a double layer. I'd suggest using some velcro sticker pieces OR those rubberized shelving material someone mentioned in the comments. That should do a nice job for you.
Tim covered the main one with the stickers or anything non slip. I get the mattress in position and with it being under inflated it tends to stay in position for me. I like it under inflated since it will conform to all of your body and the hammock. The hammock supports and forms to all of your body at the same time so why not have the mattress do the same. The fuller the inflation the more the mattress will tent to squirm and move around on you. Remember you are using the mattress as insulation and not something to keep the roots or rocks from poking you in the back.
Tim Watson ...Tim yeh was thinking along same lines as have that shelf like material that I would use on the Therm-a-rest and made (had so long forgot brand name) specifically stop sleeping bags from migrating from one side of the tent to the other and have it packed to see how works in this proposed setup. Thankyou for feedback..and will definitely try and comeback with comment on how it fared out for me.
A bit late to the party but I much prefer my under blanket. I have the Neo XTherm and a double hammock and gave it a test yesterday and felt I lost around 70% of the comfort of why we hammock instantly despite trying various levels of inflation. Under quilts are so good and worth the bulk.
a good Winter-Tarp (completly closeable), x-therm by Thermarest, DD-Hammock Overquilt, Odlo X-Warm underwear and for the feet nice diving-inner-boots (from my drysuit) ... keeps me warm and comfy on Winter-Tours at -20°C ... the worst Thing that could happen if you have to pee at night... but there are other Solutions for this :P
Ah, the pee bottle. I'm fortunate the midnight potty break doesn't impact me much. I think people would be surprised with how warm the x-therm keeps me. I'm a cold sleeper and I don't get any cold spots. Like sleeping on an electric blanket.
I've been using a chameleon hammock and underquilt sleeping diagonally and I shit you not I went to REI bought a REI flash air hammock and a flash pad laying straight with legs slightly bent and slept 100 times better
just got a double layer hammock with a zipper between layers, yet to try out but looks good, i am going to try it out this weekend www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01EPSSEAU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 looks like a lot less screwing around
He's too busy having a comfortable night's sleep no matter what the ground conditions are. 😋 Slope? Rocks? Mud? None of these are things hammock folks worry about!
UQ is warmer, more comfortable, lighter, easier to use, pack and unpack. Worth every penny. Ridgerunner with 20° Lynx, cant get more comfortable than that imo.
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Great video! People always groan when I say hiker communities are just better than others, but this vid is a great example. Tons of comments that disagree with Tim, and yet it has over 95 percent thumbs up, because people understand and respect what these vids are all about. Try getting that on a sports or political video.
I actually prefer a pad over a under quilt sometimes, depending on temperature of course. Probably the prepper side of me. I can use a sleeping pad for multiple things whereas an under quilt serves one purpose only. Great video Tim.
Good point. I'll also choose the mutli purpose/use whenever I can.
Good video. Cold arms and shoulders are a challenge on pads. But a thick wool sweater helps (less effected by pressure from hammock).
As you know, I'm a ground dweller...but I did enjoy your video anyway. Even on the ground, I don't fully inflate my pad. It's more comfortable that way.
Ha! Thanks Cat. I wasn't sure how this one would come out with me slipping around on a pad in a hammock. :)
This is so funny that you made a video on this. I just did a two night backpacking trip in NC. After watching one of your other videos, I decided to pick up a sleeping pad to try out. Just like you said, I wanted more flexibility to go to the ground if I needed to. I got one of the Nemo Tensor insulated pads. They come in a regular wide size ( 72 x 25 x 3), which worked out to be a perfect size for me. It never slipped around in my Dutchware Chameleon. The only thing I noticed is if you leave your arms next to the hammock walls they will get cold. I just threw on another layer and slept great. The temp for both nights got down to just above 40 degrees. Thanks for the info!
Awesome! Yea, the cold elbows is the only downside for me. Another layer takes care of it or pulling my arms in closer.
Great vid. Also, I tuck the pad into the footbox of my topquilt this way I never slip off and it is easy to change the position if I start to migrate while sleepining. I carry a pad on new trips a lot for the same reason, I may not be in a spot to hang if I'm above treeline or in dense forest. Not much less comfortable than my UQ's
I have a large rectangle bag that my sleeping pad goes into nicely. We all move together
Great info ( as always ) Tim.
The few times I have used a hammock. I used a self inflating sleep pad. To STOP. It from slipping around I added some of those grippy rubber mats used in cupboards to keep cups and dishes stable.
I used a product similar
to gorilla glue ( thin layer). - Everything stayed in place ✔️
Thanks and yea those tricks will help stop the slipping. I didn't think about those rubber mats you find in cupboards but yea that's kind of a perfect hack.
Most times I would prefer to use an under quilt with my hammock however there are occasion particularly in the warmer months that I can see the possibility of using a pad. Thanks for posting.
Great video Tim I just ordered the Dutchware chameleon double layer hammock because I already have a Klymit 4.4 but if I have to I'll get the thermarest but it's about $260 so hopefully my matte will work it is in the mummy shape. I'm thinking if I can't figure this out maybe I should go to and under quilt. I have never slept in a hammock but I've watched all of you guys videos for the last 2 years and dreamed of having one, I'm 65 with a bad back so hopefully this will be the Cure for camping out.
Awesome tips Tim! I have never used a sleeping pad in my hammock yet, but have really been considering it a lot lately. Thanks for sharing the knowledge!
Glad it was helpful!
Ya almost had me sold, but I'm an active sleeper. I like my DIY underquilt ($50 total build, tested down to 34°f). My pack is a Gossamer Gear Mariposa with the Sit/back pad. So, I just upgraded to the 3 section pad (2/3 length sleep pad). I got a comfy extra big or extra thick sit pad and an emergency "crap no good hang spot" sleep pad. Works pretty well for me, but HYOH. 😊
How has rhat setup worked out so far?
I've used my rectangular Nemo in a hammock many times but wonder how a mummy style would work. I do hate slipping off a narrow pad when tent camping. Thinking the new Thermarest Xtherm Neoair
Great tips Tim. Before I had an underquilt I used a piece of relectix or even just a car windshield sun shade and it worked pretty good, but now I do like the underquilt better. A person could use both together for extra warmth if using an underated quilt for the temps your in.
I agree. Good point about the reflectix. It'll do in a pinch for sure.
Some of my worst leg cramps have after long hiking days and adjusting my pad this way. It can be tortuous.
Definitely an excellent tip on how to move your sleeping pad around. And it would be nice to have the versatility to sleep on the ground if needed. Thanks for sharing brother.
thanks!
One reason I use a double layer hammock is to be able to use a pad without it moving around so much. Works well.
Hey! What pad do you use? Do you need to use something wide like the klymit wide or the klymit hammock V?
It takes me forever to get comfortable with a pad in my hammock. Then as soon as I am finally comfortable: I have to pee and all is lost and have to start again.
The late night pee bottle might be needed. Like you said though that is nice about the UQ. Makes getting in and out easier.
You can also pee from you hammock on the ground beside you, just make sure to clear a side so you dont pee on your gear. Unzip sleeping bag, lay horizontally, pull hammock side, wiener out and you're good to go. Yall thank me later! Ha!
@@LazyRadagast that's next level laziness, I love it
IMO the only reason to take a pad is if you're going to be hiking where there might not be any trees/supports to hang from. I live camp and hike on the east coast and don't have that problem. Under Quilts are so much more comfortable and hassle free. But het whatever works, everyone is different! happy trails!
Ha, agreed, different strokes for different folks. I agree that the UQs are more comfortable but I pretty much use a pad exclusively now.
Greetings from Poland! Nice video! This pad is 6x more expensive than my hammock :(
I have a thermarest x therm but it's rectangular have you tried the rectangular one in a hammok before?
I have the dual layer Blackbird and can get the Xtherm and Xlite in there together. That fixes a lot of issues for me.
There's a weight penalty, but I hammock because it's comfortable and not because it's the lightest. And I already have the mats for when I tent.
Nice video Tim. I can relate to the gater wrestling ... my first nite in a hammock was on a pad as well as in a sleeping bag. Took me 15 minutes to get in and settled. And I was soaked in sweat from the effort. And my daughter laughed at me the whole time!! I also have a Paria Recharge XL, which is a bit large for most hammocks. But on a really cold night, it will work.
I have since made an underquilt out of space blanket that keeps me warm down to about 32. Lots more comfortable. When it gets colder or in snow, I usually switch to my tent! Hope to head out to Mohican with a buddy this weekend with my BearButt! :)
Enjoy! Should be a nice weekend. Oh man, the combo of a sleeping bag AND a pad gives me the heebie jeebies thinking about it. lol. Major gator wrestling for sure.
Great video Tim! I've been using a sleeping pad in my hammock for the last 3 years and saw no need for an underquilt because of how expensive they are. That has changed recently, however, because I found that hammock gear sells an econ version of their quilts for around 150 dollars depending on the length and temp rating. I bought the 20 degree for that price, and im excited to test it out. I haven't received it yet, so I don't know everything about it. I do know that it is very cost effective and lighter than my current klymit static v insulated pad. Thanks again for the video! I would definitely bring a pad for any trip out west due to the versatility you mentioned.
Yea, hammock gear's econ quilts can't be beat right now. I think it's the best value I've seen around for a long time.
Good info, this may be the way I go for awhile. I like the idea of being able to go to ground when necessary too.
Versatility ftw!
That looks very comfortable!
If you are talking about higher temperatures, it is far easier to use a foam sell pad that rolls out. It keeps its shape far better, and when you don’t need all the extra insulation, it is easier to position at a diagonal
Foam cell pad are great when starting out with hammocks
I prefer the compfort of a pad, and I also use a under quilt when really cold. My Klymit insulated pad works great.
I used a klymit pad for a while too. For me it just isn't as comfortable on the ground. I think the baffle design is what does it.
Our physiology must be different. I always set up my hammock with my head slightly above my feet. I've always used pads. Nothing worse than a cold spot that you can't escape. Good info.
I know it. Another benefit compared to a down UQ, no problems with migrating down etc. You do have to try a well adjusted UQ at least once though. Super comfortable.
Funny, I hadn’t seen this video before. I’m doing a Frozen Butt Hang in February and am purchasing a new underquilt for it to go with the Chameleon I’m getting for Christmas. UQ’s have always been so cost prohibitive, but the new Econ ones from several vendors changed my mind. I just can’t sleep comfortably in a hammock with a pad.
Who knows why youtube serves up videos the way they do. I'm jealous, new gear is always fun but I agree the econ line makes the cost much more manageable. I'm fortunate in that this works for me. It depended on the pad. The xtherm is just about perfect for me.
I just cannot get comfortable in a hammock without a pad. That is the primary reason I have one. Use a klymit insulated pad in my Warbonnet Ridge Runner. Really flattens out the lay. Not much movement when pad is placed in between the double layer. Under quilts do look cozy though.
UQs are cozy but I love the flexibility that this gives me. Our way is cheaper too. :)
I never show them but I do have a couple of hammocks and I tried this method and it can be very comfortable. Unfortunately for me I'm way to restless of a sleeper and wind up fighting the pad and hammock. Back to the ground I go 😆 but great info for the cold weather hangers.
Thanks Tony! I agree, a fight does happen for some people.
Great video. Thanks for letting me know about this. I have a Dream Hammock Sparrow on the way. Asymmetrical lay, wide as possible.
Hi, does a 11ft long hammock is ok to put a sleeping pad in (TAR xlite neoair regular wide) or a 12ft hammock is better ?
I prefer 11ft hammocks. 12 feet is too long for me but I don’t know how tall you are.
@@TimWatsonOutdoors 6ft and the sleeping pad is a TAR regular wide.
I’m 6’1” and 11ft is fine for me with a Max wide pad.
Good tip for the budget minded Tim. I prefer my underquilt. -ATB Adam 🐢
You sure you don't want to send them to me? ;) I think the UQ system is more comfortable but I love to the have the option of ground sleeping if need be.
Great tip Tim.. I think I would only go to a pad if there was a possibility that I might need to ground sleep. I just wish some of these Items were more reasonably priced. I have seen under quilts that were $400+ 4 season ground mats are the same. It makes it hard for people to get started with prices like that. But we make it happen because we love it. Tha ks for the info brother
I figured I would chime in here. I agree top quilts and underquilts can get pricey that being said there is a lot of work that goes into making them, ie baffles filling it, etc. If you are on a budget or just don't want to spend a whole lot of money right now. I would strongly recommend going with synthetic and or non-baffled versions of TQ'S OR Uq's
Arrowhead Equipment makes some very inexpensive quilts. I think I paid $100 dollars for my first Quilt. Granted it was not down or baffled but it got the job done. I still have it and let some of my buddies use it or if it gets really cold I double it and use it to make a full length underquilt. www.arrowhead-equipment.com/
Look at the Hammock Gear Econ Quilts. Decent prices for quality stuff
Jaxx Drinkwater I am using a snugpak under blanket right now it isnt great but it does keep me comfortable to around 7°c and its heavy. I would like something to get me to about 0c quilt or blanket I dont care it just cant be $400. Thanks for the tip on arrowhead I will check out their stuff. $100 with exchange and shipping would be around $180. Still not bad.
Yea, I don't think hammock gear's econ quilts can be beat. It's pretty impressive what they offer.
Tim Watson I will have to check them out and see if they will ship to Canada
Tim thanks for your videos! I use an eno double nest and just got a eno airlift mattress for it, and this video was super helpful
Before my wife got an underquilt, we actually put a Klymit Static-V sleeping pad inside of her sleeping bag. A little cumbersome to get in and out of but no worries of cold spots or the pad sliding around on cold nights.
We're the lucky ones. Some people do have trouble with the slipping around. Once I got used to the pad I don't see myself going back except for on more camping style trips.
I started with a sleeping pad and it didn't take me long to make an underquilt. After that it didn't take long to purchase one from EE.
I've come full circle. Started with a pad, went to the UQ and now back to the pad! :D
I am going to try some reflective bubble foil + a 3/4 sleeping pad as my hammock is two layered I can fill the middle layer with insulation and have my pad directly under me.
That will work as well. 👍
Could you put some Velcro on the pad and rig it so it doesn't move you think? Looks like the pad might be comfy it wasn't moving all over
Yes, you could use that OR some of that rubber shelving material someone mentioned in the comments. I just don't want the extra weight. :)
I just use my surplus 3 piece sleep system whole or in parts, depending on the situation. It works out great for me and it was given to me so, didn't cost me a dime.
Now Tim, I had to Stop the video at throw away your underquilt!!! Underquilts are the direction I have been leaning towards after fighting to many nights with a pad..You better have a persuasive argument!! LOL
Agree on the deflating. I like the foot pad Idea, I do fight with my feet sliding off. Thanks for the video...but still headed towards an underquilt :)
Ha! Don't let me talk you out of it! UQs will be more comfortable in general for most everyone. I pretty much use a pad exclusively now though.
good vid tim for hammock sleepers , and a good option for just in case of going to the ground.. wrestling gators is a little to much for me, my system is some what different ..
..bill
I know it! Your system works for you though.
I sold my HG underquilt and prefer a down filled sleeping pad instead.. I sometimes use a piece of 1/8 foam ( the stuff used to recover pool tables) to keep the pad in one spot. There is a learning curve but you get very good at using a pad. And as mentioned...you can always go to ground as needed. Thanks for the video, very helpful.
Oh so many puns here. Lol out of context I mean. ... smiling. ... Tim I watched it because I wanted to learn. I did learn, I have a roll up pad. It is very soft. Thanks
Lol, glad you learned something. When I first started using a pad in a hammock it was like wrestling a gator. :)
So nothing like revisiting an old topic but question: What is the lowest temp you have gone down to with using a pad. I have the xlite and anticipate that Ill end up bringing the 10 degree underquilt until i can squeeze a winter weight pad but I was curious as to the comfort level and what your expierience has been. Sorry I missed you at the meetup, and thanks!
No problem, and I loved your shirt! I think we just missed each other in the parking lot on the way out! D'Oh!! I've used the xtherm down in the teens without an issue. I'll freely admit that I have to take care not to touch any part of the hammock of the pad. The xlite combined with the UQ should make you set for around those temps as well.
Tim Watson Thanks! Your the best!
I used this exact setup on the PCT. Got that same silnylon from Ripstop by the roll too. ;)
hi tim first off thanks for the video, I was hearing about double layer hammocks, that have a sleep pad pocket, and was wondering what were your thoughs? or would it be best just to keep looking for a good hang before one hands over there cash?
as they are different then a tent, and I have used them for years.
+jonnyfly69 I touch on the double layer hammock in the description. Some people like them better for sleeping pads but honestly I find them more annoying. I like being able to grab ahold the pad when I adjust. The sleeping pad pocket can make that more difficult. If you're new to hammock camping I have a playlist BUT you should also check out shugemery here on TH-cam. TONS of good and detailed information.
Hey what is that hanging bag you use in the video? The one hanging above your hammock. I've been trying to find something like that that isn't overpriced eno
I've been hammock camping for years. I have tried using pads but never liked them. There fine if you sleep on your back and don't move during the night. I would much rather have an under quilt any day. But to each their own , "HYOH". I have found the best way to use a pad is to use a double layer hammock.
Get a 4-5 inch pad. Coupled with a throw pillow and microbead pillow to rest on.Thank me later.
If you have your hammock a little tighter you will sleep more comfortable, also buying a hammock that's double layered like the Tenth Wonder XL you can slip the pad between the hammock sheets. I have sewn along two sides so the pad slips in to my hammock.. it doesn't move about, I sleep very comfortably.. happy days.
just got an xlc, I get discomfort on my neck from pressure on back of my head, knee/leg over-extension & lack of support under my lower back.
wondering if a pad like this would help, but the price of some is a big piece of an underquilt.
first things first I guess.
How tall are you? One common things I suggest is making sure your foot end is higher than your head end (start with six inches higher and work your way up) to see if that helps with the pain.
As far as the pad I'd try buying a cheaper and heavy (costco, thermarest etc. about $40) pad thats self-inflating with some foam in it as well. For example (www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000MNBLXU). It's cheaper and it'll give you some idea if a pad would help. Good luck!
Tim Watson
Thanks for the suggestions, ill work at it.
Im 5'7"
The two trees in my yard that I have been learning on are at the upper end of the recommended distance (17-18 ft).
After doing my best to account for all the setup factors im aware of, (30° angle - foot end higher & closer to its tree - ridgeline tension)
I seem to only get the hammock to a minimum functioning height off the ground, & then altering something at that point usually results in the ridgeline to tight or the hammock touching the ground (when im in it).
Perhaps when I get out in the field more ill find that its all in the tree distance, though it would be nice to be able to reach higher up the tree :-)
Also still finding the best place to position myself in once inside.
Theres a comment in the setup instructions that came with the hammock about laying with your eyes even with the farthest side tieout & the other at chest level, - the meaning of this hasn't registered with me yet.
All in all there's enough things to play with to find the best option.
I'll look into a pad such as you mentioned, thanks for your reply.
Happy hammocking to you!
what about comfort? I just spent my first night in a hammock and found I was much more comfortable when using a half inflated sleeping pad then without, nothing to do with being warm, just the comfort of laying in the hammock. Maybe I didn't have it strung up right?
Epic video Tim - thanks!
Exact video I needed. Thank you!
I have always used a sleeping pad. I can't imagine sleeping in a hammock without one really. As much struggle as I have had to get comfortable in a hammock, I will always use one.
You should try the UQ at least once. It is comfortable when adjusted correctly.
Been using my ridge rest pad in my hammock for years. Never had a problem
Sweet! You and me are the minority it seems. I always see UQs whereever I go.
Same here. I've hammock camped all summer with a Solite small (9oz). It's a bit narrow at 20" though. I haven't had a problem with cold feet, even though it's short for me - I just wear polyester fleece socks (1.5oz) available at the dollar store.
What temperature range do you use it in? Do you use a quilt or sleeping bag?
You do a good job of stressing sleeping on a diagonal. I find most the videos showing an underquilt the are like a banana so it defeated the purpose of hammock comfort
That looked like the widest pad I have ever seen. What do you think of a arrest or Ridgecrest foam pad..
Thanks, it's the xtherm large. A ridgerest or foam pad would work fine as well. Depending on the temp I know some people who use a yoga mat.
I find that me knees ache when sleeping in the hammock. I try to go at a diagonal to get as flat as possible but the curve of the hammock still strain my knees. Any thoughts?
The two things I usually recommend are hanging your foot end higher (play around with how high) or putting a pillow/clothes/fleece jacket under your knees. Have you tried those?
Tim Watson I mostly tried a sort of side sleeping. With the putting the feet higher does the blood run to your head? Thanks for the tips I'll have to try them.
Nope, I don't notice a head rush or any problems like that.
Hammer and Neil you probably need a different length hammock. One longer would be my guess.
I did an underquilt once and must have done it wrong cause I froze. Problem was the temp dropping 10 degrees cooler than forecasted. I would have been alright if it weren't for breezes blowing between the quilt and hammock. Pads are a sure thing so I went with them instead.
That is another benefit. You're guaranteed no cold spots through a good pad. With the UQ you have to make sure it has a good sag or is cinched properly OR have to worry about migrating down with some quilts.
The UQ was probably not cinched up against the hammock correctly. Just this past weekend, my friend tried an UQ for the first time. We had strong winds on night. I was crosswise to the wind, so my rainfly blocked it all for me. He was not, and the wind ran right under his fly. and it's not that big (it's a Hennessy set up). BUT, all he felt was a light breeze on his face, and stayed warm all night.
Great tip and great video Tim. Personally, I find it's too much fiddling with the pad, especially on those cold nights when you have to pee and then need to get back in the hammock then have to straighten everything all over again... sucks.That's just me but whatever works for someone I say stick with it. If I had to go to ground... then (Barcolounger) :)
Oh I get that for sure. I've gotten better with practice but I feel you with the midnight pee break.
I agree the pad is fiddly,. I use a pad when I take may hammock and there are shelters, gives me the options on where to sleep. You don't want to pee in the middle of the night if it's a cold night, the amount of heat that is lost getting in and out. If you stop drinking 2 hours before you go to sleep you will not have to get up,,. you simply don't have enough fluid in you to fill your bladder, you will make it till the morning.
Tim thanks for the video. I converted from tent to hammock camping so I already had the insulated pad but it never occurred to me what a difference a few less breaths make in keeping my pad from launching. All the best!
Totally agree at my age you pee more than once a night
Awesome I will have to try this with my new sleeping pad
How low can you go with your XTherm? I look my XLite down to 48 last weekend and got a little cool.
18 is my personal record. I'm sure it can do lower.
@@TimWatsonOutdoors Thanks for the quick reply. I'm trying to decide whether to get an insulated pad or an underquilt. Your argument is compelling, but still thinking.
For those reading my above comment, I should point out I've taken my XLite down to 15 comfortably on the ground, with a 0 degree bag. But got cool at 48 in a hammock.
Tim for hammock camping with a pad do you recommend the neo xtherm over the xlite, for the weight savings does the xlite have enough R value.
I use the xtherm year round because I sleep cold. I've never used the xlite but honestly have considered it for late spring to early fall.
Dafter using an under quilt, I don't think I could use a pad again, but it would be nice to have one if you need to go to ground.
+Scott Taylor agreed!
Tim Watson
Sams had a sleeping pad that was really light weight, compact, and wouldn’t take up much room at all. I think I’ll get one the next time they have them.
Good tip, and awesome shirt!
Thanks!
Are those socks water shoes or minimalist shoes?
Do any hammock companies make a hammock with a inflatable pad sleeve? Double layered isn’t efficient enough.
Tim, how low can the xtherm go in a hammock - temp wise? What’s the lowest temperature you’ve used it in and were still comfortable? Thanks, Dan
I think that’s pretty dependent on the person. I’ve done 19 and started to feel a little cool because of the wind under the hammock.
Tim Watson, thank you!
Tim Watson , it also looks like you have the large 77x25? I assume that helps eliminate cold knees when you side sleep - so your knees are not hitting cold hammock?
Yes and yes.
I needed this video Tim! Many thanks from Oregon! ... Mike
Sweet! You're welcome!
Nice ESB shirt. & i just switched to eno hotspot and thermarest solite
From a gi poncho under quilt now I cowboy camp when I find myself sans trees
Great video. I like hammock better then an air mattress.
Way more comfortable for me too!
Great video. I do not think hammocks are good for people that toss and turn a lot during sleep. I am one of those and also alternate between sleeping on my back and side sleeping. That is why i have never tried hammocks and the other reason is wherever I go mostly in desert location there are lots of rocks but not enough trees.
I'm in Florida so my pad is a better option. My pad fit in a double layer and doesn't move once it's in place. My hammock is also a double nest and that makes a difference.
Cool! I'm throwing out my underquilts right now
I'm one of the few people I know who can dispose of those properly. Sending you the address now. 😜
Interesting video, I’ve always slept with an underquilt. I’ve never used a sleep pad but I’m thinking of trying them out next cold weather season. Thanks for the video and now I’m thinking about wrestling with gators. That was funny.
in 85+ degree temps is getting cold an issue?
At lows of 85 probably not.
I have never been able to easily get into a sleeping bag in a hammock. Throw in a pad and I think these suggestions will be very difficult.
It's not bad if you use the sleeping bag as a quilt. You're going to lose the insulation under you by crushing it with your body weight anyway. If you're trying to get into it like a sleeping bag then that's hard enough without a pad. 😀
How about an Amok hammock or possibly a double layered hammock like one of the Hennessey hammocks. This is a great opportunity for hammock manufacturers.
Some people like the double layers better for a pad but I find that it can get more slippery unless you use some material to stop the slipping. I actually prefer the single layer because I can hold and adjust the pad myself if needed.
As a side sleeper, I just can’t see myself in a hammock. It also seems to technical.
My Terra Nova tent stands in 20 seconds. Mat, Sleeping bag& I’m ready.
I can turn at night without having to put anything back in place.
I've use a closed cell foam pad down to about 30 degrees never an issue.
Ok. But what about being in a sleeping bag (mummy especial?)? It's impossible to all thing you have shown. It's the only way to use a quilt in the hammock, but even thou using sleeping pad doesn't allow you to attach quilt to the pad, because you couldn't make any pad adjustments.
Use the sleeping bag as a quilt. Don't zip it all the way. There is no need to attach the bag to the pad. Maybe a future follow up video is necessary to help.
I put my pad inside a bivy bag, between bivy and sleepingbag. Works perfect with hammoc and you Stay on the pad all night!✌️
There's a place for both the pad and the quilt but I have more places to use the quilt.
Is this the guy from Beerfest???
For more years then I care to remember ( to many ) I have used a self inflating sleeping pad in my hammock.My favorite is the self inflating Therm-a-rest full length mummy pad. I inflate it about 1/2 to 3.4 inflation for use in the hammock. I have used a Neo Air but it is better in the tent then the hammock due to it's 2 .1/2 inch thickness. Don't get me wrong I have used a under quilt and really like it but I still prefer the sleeping pad. It sure is nice to have when you use your hammock as a solo tent on those rare occasions.
One benefit I enjoy is that on a warm to hot evening you can lay in the hammock with nothing under you. Then when the dreaded chilly butt syndrome starts you can slide the pad under you and get comfortable. Heck you can even use it half on and half off depending on your comfort level. On really warm summer nights a 3/4 length pad is ideal.
If you are using a double bottom Hammock like a Warbonnet Blackbird then cheat and slide the pad in-between the two bottom layers.
Chuck Littleton ...Hey Chuck...does it slid around on u in the double bottom or any issues that you have experienced or tips. Thanks. Loi
Chuck has it right, I love being able to choose how much of myself is on the pad in the warmer months. It's nice to have options. @Lou there is some sliding in a double layer. I'd suggest using some velcro sticker pieces OR those rubberized shelving material someone mentioned in the comments. That should do a nice job for you.
Tim covered the main one with the stickers or anything non slip. I get the mattress in position and with it being under inflated it tends to stay in position for me. I like it under inflated since it will conform to all of your body and the hammock. The hammock supports and forms to all of your body at the same time so why not have the mattress do the same. The fuller the inflation the more the mattress will tent to squirm and move around on you. Remember you are using the mattress as insulation and not something to keep the roots or rocks from poking you in the back.
Tim Watson ...Tim yeh was thinking along same lines as have that shelf like material that I would use on the Therm-a-rest and made (had so long forgot brand name) specifically stop sleeping bags from migrating from one side of the tent to the other and have it packed to see how works in this proposed setup. Thankyou for feedback..and will definitely try and comeback with comment on how it fared out for me.
A bit late to the party but I much prefer my under blanket. I have the Neo XTherm and a double hammock and gave it a test yesterday and felt I lost around 70% of the comfort of why we hammock instantly despite trying various levels of inflation. Under quilts are so good and worth the bulk.
Great. Not just what,not just how, but also why.
Ha, I do my best. :)
you did that like a pro haha id probably fall out and meet face to earth lol
lol. That made me laugh. "Face to earth" 😂😂
a good Winter-Tarp (completly closeable), x-therm by Thermarest, DD-Hammock Overquilt, Odlo X-Warm underwear and for the feet nice diving-inner-boots (from my drysuit) ... keeps me warm and comfy on Winter-Tours at -20°C ... the worst Thing that could happen if you have to pee at night... but there are other Solutions for this :P
Ah, the pee bottle. I'm fortunate the midnight potty break doesn't impact me much. I think people would be surprised with how warm the x-therm keeps me. I'm a cold sleeper and I don't get any cold spots. Like sleeping on an electric blanket.
Alright Tim, maybe I’ll try sleeping in a hammock again
Woot! :)
I've been using a chameleon hammock and underquilt sleeping diagonally and I shit you not I went to REI bought a REI flash air hammock and a flash pad laying straight with legs slightly bent and slept 100 times better
Guys.. Tuck your mat into the sleeping bag. That way it stays mostly in place.
Good insight
thanks!
Ty for the share
👍
just got a double layer hammock with a zipper between layers, yet to try out but looks good, i am going to try it out this weekend
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01EPSSEAU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
looks like a lot less screwing around
I usually do have butter in my hammock, but it's for other purposes.
Think you should just give up the hammock... your halfway there with a pad... tents will be on sale soon... black friday sales...😂
🤔 NEVER! lol!
Come on Tim, go back to the dark side haa
He's too busy having a comfortable night's sleep no matter what the ground conditions are. 😋 Slope? Rocks? Mud? None of these are things hammock folks worry about!
@Benjamin P Show me two bad trees on the trail and I will sell you beach front property on the center of Florida.
UQ is warmer, more comfortable, lighter, easier to use, pack and unpack. Worth every penny. Ridgerunner with 20° Lynx, cant get more comfortable than that imo.
Hey I agree on the more comfortable and easier to unpack but I'd debate on the lighter and warmer part. :)
@@TimWatsonOutdoors You are correct. There are some really light pads out there. I should clarify, my UQ is lighter than the pad I was using.
Stick with an under quilt. Sleeping pads are uncomfortable and they don’t really keep you warm even if they are insulated.