As an Imperial Fists player, using Tor Garadon with heavy hellblasters is so much fun. Having the hellblasters hit on 2s, reroll 1s, and deal 4 damage to vehicles is very satisfying.
It's crazy coincidental that you uploaded this today! I just started building mine, and I spent all morning looking up your older hellblaster videos. Then, 45 minutes later, you upload this!!! Amazing timing!
Thanks for your opinion. I run Black Templar has well and I'm on the fence about buying some Eradicators. I just don't think I need them when I got a Hellblaster squad.
@@MrTrenttness I only think the assault ones are good. They are more versatile, and better then eradicators vs anything not t8. If you have no str8 ranged then eradicators are great. Dont get me wrong. They are more durable and pack a heavy punch. I run both
Honestly, I have put some thought into this and with everything Games Workshop has been doing to speed up the game, it would make more sense if plasma guns did mortal wounds to the models with plasma instead of losing a model as it makes taking plasma on any characters pointless as no one should risk the 1/6 chance to lose the character. Just my thought on it. Could give some interesting combinations for players to try with different armies.
Problem with this is that it will reduce the risk for things like Iron Hands Hellblasters. Even ignoring the Iron Hands specifically, a 5+FNP isn't hard to get for a Marine army, which would make the mortal wounds almost trivial. In a ideal world, this rule would exist only for characters and vehicles, but that would require too much work out into writing.
@@benkaes3657 It would make the 5+++ litany actually useful, and you would still take 2/3 of the mortal wounds. So not exactly trivial. If they did implement a change like this we would probably need to see Plasma Inceptors go up a few more points, but other then that most Space Marine Units with Plasma arent doing too much.
I've been running the rapid fire variant against my friend's Custodes/Knights soup. I find that they do perform well after turn 1 as the knights want to move up to snatch mid field objectives and the two turns of -5 ap is nice. I'm building another squad of 10 for them and magnetizing the arms to see how the heavy variant does. Less shots hurts because I'm a terrible roller, but the higher S and damage would be nice to whipe out the knights a bit earlier.
I use pretty large squads of the heavy ones in my Iron Hands - being able to pay 1 CP to put them in devastator doctrine any turn you want to is dope. In my last game, they were wiping out squads of Plague Marines left and right while overcharging.
Running these as a cover fire unit for black templars is gamechanging. I use a 5 man unit with the assault incinerators with a captain close by to reroll 1s and its an all purpose extermination unit
Perhaps! And they only get worse on crusade campaigns; my little 5 man squad has exploding 6s, damage 2 BEFORE overcharge, hittin on 2s. Enrages anyone in range lmao
If I remember correctly, iron hands has a relic or warlord trait that lets you choose a unit and they re-roll all hit rolls like the CM ability. So what you could do is use impulsor rush with two units of hellblasters and have a CM use his ability and the warlord trait on both units and lay down heavy fire.
The warlord trait you are thinking of is "Target Protocols" and it's only a single hit, single wound and single damage roll. "Mercy is Weakness" 1cp: pick a Friendly IH unit and one enemy unit they wish to attack, the IH unit gets exploding dice. Mix that with some Chaplain hax, and you've got yourself a nasty bit of shooting.
Imperial Fists can make very good use of the heavy incinerators. Like lascannons with better AP and more consistent damage. Add the Tank Hunters strat for more fun.
Well this was good timing, I just bought a box of these yesterday. I have so many Assault Intercessors that I was like I need some Hellblasters that are running at the enemy. I was trying to decide if I should make 2 5 man squads one of Assault and one of Heavy as with the Dark Imperium 5 man squad I would have 15 plasma incinerators.
An alternative I'm heavily considering is Sternguard vets with combi plasma guns Save 40 points per squad, takes Elite instead of Heavy Support slot, and the guns arent that much worse
Definitely going to try building a good sized plasma Dark angels force this year (no death or raven wing), One 10 man assault Hellblasters and two 5 man with heavy plasma, 6 Inceptors with plasma as two 3 man units, one plasma Redemptor (possible 2) or Contemptor dreads , one captain and one lieutenant and maybe add in a repulsor executioner and work around it as a starting force.
I’ve had a lot of success using regular (rapid fire) hellblasters coming out of strategic reserves. A bit cp-pricey, but gaurenteed rapid fire at damage 3 (I play DA so weapons of the dark age) is great at dealing with well large enemy targets that would be otherwise well protected. Now that you did the mathhammer though, I should probably switch over to assault!
I think with these I would run the Hellblaster assault variant squad with an Assault Intercessor squad in an Impulsor. Together they would be a hard hitting option for capturing an enemy-held objective. I suppose, I could replace the Assault Intercessors with Bladeguard Veterans and include the Captain in the Impulsor. But that would be quite a lot of points in 1 transport.
I think you could work them in quite well, a strong close-range murderous ranged unit just behind/screened by your killy melee troops. Your opponent can try to take them out in melee and risk fighting your infantry, or try to out-shoot the hellblasters which could melt most squads with a good roll
I run a squad of assualt plasma with a captain to buff them, they are the point and delete type of unit, middle of the board objective holders. I need to find a way to get them with in range of my buddies riptide.
To be fair the Dark Angels should've had a slide dedicated solely to them. The Greenwing's super doctrine favors the assault and rapid fire incinerators, allowing them to shoot in combat albeit hitting on 4+, Azrael for Chapter Master rerolls and a 4++ against ranged attacks, strats that allow them to fall back and shoot, stratagem that Allows them to go into their preferred doctrine, Weapons from the Dark Age, Line Unbreakable strat that minimizes attacks from hordes in close combat. They just have so much in terms of strats that really do put them head and shoulders above other chapters. Also a stratagem you forgot to mention is Steady Advance. You can't advance but you count as standing still. Might not affect the assault and RF incinerators but you will keep the heavies from the -1 to hit modifier, If I remember correctly.
I'm not the only one who remembers the Rogue Trader days' version of That Guy who'd field an entire unit of plasma gun (which were god guns back then) marines as a custom squad for his homebrew chapter, right? These figs are GW finally letting That Guy live the dream on steroids, although thankfully they aren't the dominant force the old RT plasma were.
Great deployment tips. Convinced me to go with the assault hellblasters. Looking forward to them immolating themselves and everything to their front in one massive burst of starfire. Should be fun. The survivors can then slink over to sit on some objective.
Nice that you made some Hellblasters support video! Althought I have to say that Hellblasters is a support dependent unit, I try to field 30 Assult Blasters. Since I play *Dark Angels* I play them with Arzael for 4++save, Lieutenant, Chaplain Master of Sancticy(Catechism of Fire & Recitation of Focus), Apothecary. Lazarus is good for the Mortal wounds save if you don't want Azraels Stone Age Model...(But then you lose the 4++ save) I use First Born 5man Tacticals for screening or 5man Infiltrators. Remember to screen good. I Try to get Inceptrors in too. and Lazarus/Jump Captain or Chaplain/Jump Chaplain for support there too
I’d definitely use them as anti-elite/vehicle instead of eradicators in friendly games, eradicators are so unfun to play against. Plus I love plasma weapons (even though I’m a BA player).
Full agree with this, I stopped using my Eradicators in my games when my friend who just started Warhammer had his plague burst crawler walk up, only to be immediately deleted by my Eradicators. I felt bad cause he was disappointed lol.
I love grouping them with a Watchmaster in Dwatch and stacking up the rerolls to wound between xenos hunters and kill team specialisms; great when you really need something truly dead, and they feel a little more friendly than eradicators.
@@GrimmDork Yeah, in a Fortis! I haven't been keeping the intercessors with them so far just to spread out and give myself more units to get on points because DW is already kind of elite. Last game I played, I kept an apothecary around for a minute to heal up some that got nailed with the 1s on a reroll and the 5+ FNP. Lot of help for one unit, but man they do work.
10 man squad with rapid fire plasma incinerators. Dark angels weapons of a dark age. Strategic reserves. Bring a lieutenant. Kill a baneblade in one turn. They literally won a game for me.
Had an Ultramarines lineup, centered around 2 units of assault Hellblasters and Guilliman with 2 Implusors. Gman keeps them a little safer, Tiggy/Chaplain get to ride along in the 6th impostor seats, and that's a nice mobile fire force. Not sure if it wouldnt be strictly better with Bladeguard though, and letting something else shoot
A real benefit for heavy hellblasters is that when they take on death guard they can kill them in one shot (and for dark angels that goes to wotda for terminators)
I thought I liked the assault hellblasters the best but I think I'd rather have the heavy hellblasters because they aren't likely to be fried and their standard charge is okay anyway.
depending on what I'm up against I'll even include hellblasters in my blood angels. If I'm up against dark angels they are my go to terminator squad removal choice, well that and psykers like a librarian dreadnaught or Mephiston
I think it may have a good synergy with BT for their attacks characteristics as they shoot hard and with the assault doctrine on they auto wound on sixes, for securing objectives may be kinda strong, better than normal Crusaders.
@@benjod4549 back in 8th, I’d use 10 dark angels heavy incinerator hellblasters in a bastion. Overcharged they would inflict 3 damage per shot, they always re-rolled 1s to hit since they didn’t move. With the bastion, they had 36” radius bubble of fire, which was pretty intimidating to many enemies. The bastion was decent protection for around 200 points, with toughness 9 and 20 wounds. Later, I would hop them out, and keep them near the chaplain to ignore movement modifiers. Then I would use Weapons of the Dark Age to inflict 4 damage per shot. Haven’t had the chance to try them in 9th. There is a stratagem to ignore movement modifiers to shooting, so it shouldn’t play too differently. I’d use the bastion to protect them from alpha strike, then hop out and go to town. I think a sky shield landing pad might work ok too.
Dark Angels Hellblasters with Azrael and a Lieutenant: hit 35/36 shots fired, wound 35/36 against marines, AP removes a marine's armor save. This all due to their +1 to hit for standing still. In essence a Hellblaster will kill an enemy marine for every single shot they take, making Dark Angels incredibly dangerous as a unit for them. It is kind of insane when one just looks at the raw math of it.
@@wert3155 For maximum theoretical damage output, the normal ones supercharged as if you are in rapid fire range you are killing two marines per Hellblaster.
Hellblasters seem like a load of fun. Imagine pushing up with an ATV and inceptors or whatever then your plasma boys rock up with their guns and overcharge them ALL. Holy moly would that be hilarious. I'm thinking in the lore hellblasters in my chapter are the marines that are slightly overzealous and off their rocker.
as a chaos player i really really hate these things I literally throw everything in my army to get rid of them as quickly as possible, regardless of objectives.
Imperial Fist heavy hellblaster work like a charm, you can improve their cover and since they don't move it mostly stay for the whole game. with tank hunter they fry tanks from afar
I’ve been using two devastator squads. 6man each. One with laz cannons and the other missiles. Only 3 heavys per unit cus I only have that many laz cannons and missile launchers. They have been doing great work in my UM army I tried using hellblasters with heavy weapons but my rolls suck and I always end up killing one. Even with re rolls. The idea of using them with assault variety does peak my interest tho. They might do well in my mobile gun line with just sheer amount of shots. I could field 2 quads of 5 with assault variants for roughly the same as my current build. I’d be sacrificing an extra meat shield but I’m curious to see how the two compare. I’ll try it out.
Deathwatch Primaris Captain: Ignore overheating, just push the reset button with your thumb next to the trigger and try again. Deathwatch Primaris Captain: While you're at it boys, switch to Tactical doctrine for a couple turns. Deathwatch Primaris Captain: Charge! No, you idiots, I said, charge your shots, not charge the enemy! Why did I have to get the Space Wolves. 3x Fortis Assault Teams (5xIntercessors, 4xHellblasters), 3x Repulsors (twin las and las talon, anti air rockets, frag grenades)
It is a minor benefit, but Space Wolves can put a full ten man squad of the assault hell blasters into strategic reserves for only 1 CP with Cunning of the Wolf, as opposed to the 2 CP it would cost for anyone else. While minor, it does mean that Space Wolves get a bit more efficient options for ten man squads.
they are currently the bane for black legion terminators in my 1000 points games with a friend - without their 3. wound assault hellblasters pretty much wipe a whole squad with ease. Im also playing ultramarines and the stratagem to reroll 1s is so usefull and makes them very independant from any buffing characters. I think they work great now when you just stack up on different strong shooting units in a gunline - with psychic fortress, an apothecary and transhuman they are not a "no brain" target anymore making them quite durable
oh and i might add, that i think in 1000k lists flexibility is key and getting a unit that is quite usefull against tanks and heavy infantry but does not suffer as much against hordes makes them my pick over eradicators (i also do not like plasma inceptors in 1k as much because half your points are in reserve on such a small board) - in 2k lists deepstrike is way more important and you have enough points for more dedicated anti tank stuff like eradicators
I have 15 hellbalsters, never seen a reason to run any of them at the cost. I might try a squad of 5 assault ones out in white scars and see how they do.
If you have a +1 modifier, the natural 1 still causes overcharge damage. If you reroll the 1, the 1 is replaced by the reroll, and if it’s not another 1 you don’t take the overcharge damage.
5 long fang plascannon bois with pack leader and wolf guard carrying plas gun and plasma combi Can dish out a max of 19 plasma shots. 10 hellblasters is only 20. Long fangs can ignore heavy with keen senses 1 cp and can outflank for 1 cp. Deepstrike or outflank a lord beside em for rerolls of gets hot.
Always used a full squad of hellblasters in the old Deathwatch codex and with the new codex it only became better get 10 hellblasters buff them up with a chaplain toss em across the board with a jumppack captain with the beacon angelis and see 10 hellblasters deal a casual 36 ish damage on anything
Is it better to take the sicaran omega instead of 6 heavy hellblasters. Sicaran can move and fire with no penalty, has more toughness and wounds, a bonus heavy bolter, more wounds and doesn't reduce damage output with a 1 to hit (just lose a wound). It costs you a CP to bring but point for point the sicaran seems so much better
see this prompts a question, my friend is definite that nat 1's always fail on overcharge even with buffs. how is this so, as it removes the point of many buffs available. even chapter traits like 8th ed WoTD or current CF ones.
If it's a +hit modifier, they still die on overcharge. If it's a reroll they should be safe. I think that's fair since the +1 to hit is really cheap and common
One great thing with the deathwatch if the ability to put hellblaster in intercessor squads, the biggest issue with the hellblaster beeing their tankiness for their price, like that you can use intercessor as meat shield the same way you use tactical marines to protect their special ou heavy weapon. The assault variant seems to be the best, not only it's the more effiecient but sadly we know what happen most of the time avec using hellblaster ( your ennemy will blast them to death ), to having a greater risk of dying because of overheat isn't that much of an issue ^^ and they are great to counter death guards but also aeldari ( E3 1W, except harly ) and sisters of battle, theses lady won't laugh with their " ignore AP-1 and -2 " when hit by a shower of F6 AP-4 shots ^^ And the heavy variant is great to kill everything with multiples wounds and big tank while having less risk to kill themself compare to the assault variant. Many people don't like them but i do love my plasma teams :) ( i have 5 hellblaster of each types :) )
Personally I think hellblasters are only really good in low point/power games when you don’t have enough points for both anti infantry and tank, and you need more of both, or as a backfield objective holder but in a high number squad like 8 - 10, but for 5 points more you can take 10 intercessors for screening and 3 eradicatiors for good anti tank which I would prefer
I swear by Hellblasters. As a Deathwatch player I mix them in with Intercessors. Five Intercessors to absorb bullets let the five Hellblasters rip into things. Personally I prefer the assault plasma incinerator. Sure, they don't hit S8 even when overcharged, but when you get three shots per model it doesn't really matter. I move this unit every turn and advance a lot of the time, so a mix of assault bolt rifles and assault plasma incinerators keeps the unit mobile and puts out tons of shots. You can threaten Marines with sheer rate of fire, or just mow down a horde of something cheap like Gaunts.
I think Hell blasters would be a great addition to the Space Marines (especially compared to Plasma Inceptors, which are just better), if they had plasma weapons that simply do not kill a model in the hit roll or have a build in re-roll of 1. Right now Inceptors are just better in my opinion.
I'm sorry, but I think you said that Dark Angels could get "entirely safe overcharges" because of their +1 to hit? That's what you said right? Because if so, then no. They blow up on an _unmodified_ roll of a 1. So it doesn't matter if the roll is then modified to a 2 or even a 3, it still blows up.
Personally I think Salamanders assault hellblasters using crucible of battle and paired with a shielding unit using self sacrifice is the way to go. The unit is just far too fragile to take without some sort of reliable way to stop them being shot off the board. The primaris stat-line is nowhere near as durable it was when these guys came out in 8th ed they're essentially now just tactical marines armed with an expensive plasma weapon
How exactly did you count the chances of death while overcharging? Isn't it just ⅙ times amount of shots? So to me it would be: 16,7% for Heavy Plasma 33,3% for Rapid-fire Plasma 50% for Assault Plasma How'd you get your numbers? What am I missing?
It's the chance of any result of ANY NUMBER of 1s on 1, 2 and 3 dice. By that simple method you'd calculate and 100% chance of death on any plasma with six shots (but you'd still have the chance to live if you got lucky and didn't roll any 1s, so the chance has to be less than 100%)
These assholes completely shredded my sisters. I'm trying to learn how to beat them. They destroyed my reserve Zephyrim who were trying to deploy and charge, and took out my Retributors with ease.
I prefer eradicators, maybe predator tanks, sometimes even eliminators. I don't use devastators, but only because I run primaris. Hellblasters are too fragile and too expensive. And that's speaking about HS slot. For plasma, inceptors are my choice.
Would anyone be..entirely bothered if I just said I'm not using the pistol this round?like...it looks wayy cooler than the point and I'm not bothered taking off the entire hand to swap it out. Aslong as I don't use it will it still take up points (If I declare I'm not using It pre-battle)
Extremely time consuming when super-charging with Standard (at rapid fire range) and Assault variants. 1 model at a time... Heavy Incinerators work well for Dark Angels and maybe with Imperial Fists.
As an Imperial Fists player, using Tor Garadon with heavy hellblasters is so much fun. Having the hellblasters hit on 2s, reroll 1s, and deal 4 damage to vehicles is very satisfying.
POP GOES THE VEICHLE
What goves them the +1 damage?
@@mikeg8564 The Imperial Fists super-doctrine gives them +1 to damage against vehicles in the devastator doctrine.
@@churchilla5511 ah cool!
@@churchilla5511 that sounds devastating my army would not like that.
Codex: only over charge in the dire moments
Me: *EVERY TURN BE LIKE*
Just declare a crusade so every moment is technically a dire moment. Black Templars life hacks
@@connorjensen9699 the codex approves of this
I mean with the Great Rift rollin through...EVERY DAY BE DIRE
@@KillerOrca true and if there is only war, then everyday is dire
@@virgilromero3252 EXACTLY
It's crazy coincidental that you uploaded this today! I just started building mine, and I spent all morning looking up your older hellblaster videos. Then, 45 minutes later, you upload this!!! Amazing timing!
this is one of the only primaris units I own, so useful.
Looks like i’ll have to add these dudes.
@@HighMarshalBiggusDickus I got them as a side dish when I bought Inceptors. Turns out, I usually run the Hellblasters, but not Inceptors
@@InsongWhang i can definitely see that. Inceptors seem meh when you can bring a melta atv for 85 points.
@@HighMarshalBiggusDickus I don't have ATV's, but I do run Attack Bikes with multimeltas. Cheap, fast, reliable.
@@InsongWhang aye. Tis true.
I use assault hellblasters as a gunline support in my Black templars, there are more dependable then eradicators vs everything except heavy tanks
Thanks for your opinion. I run Black Templar has well and I'm on the fence about buying some Eradicators. I just don't think I need them when I got a Hellblaster squad.
@@MrTrenttness I only think the assault ones are good. They are more versatile, and better then eradicators vs anything not t8. If you have no str8 ranged then eradicators are great. Dont get me wrong. They are more durable and pack a heavy punch. I run both
@@hrvojegrgic-akovic5552
Thanks again!
Azrael as the Capt just using the reroll 1s and the 4++ makes these lads the bomb.
They are great for Dark Angels
Weapons of the dark age on these bad boys
Thats exactly right it also helps on our black knights
For anti tank anti dreadnought, would you say they are better than Eradicators as a dark angels player?
@@rafrecon honestly not really tbh erads are still the best at anti everything
@@rafrecon as dark angels yes but if your running salamanders melta is the way to go
Man i love my Assault Hellblasters with Weapons from the Dark Age
Do you run them with Azrael for rerolls and 4++? I am considering doing a castle list like that and want to know if ppl are finding it effective
@@JohnnyCoyote yeah he’s a must have now. I always bring him with Ezekiel too if you just want your HQ’s to support your main line infantry
@@Axzealot sounds great, thanks!
I run them with Lazarus, WODA, and Pennant of Remembrance. And Grim Resolve. It's ridiculous.
@@norlanderduwallis9074 Nerd.
Honestly, I have put some thought into this and with everything Games Workshop has been doing to speed up the game, it would make more sense if plasma guns did mortal wounds to the models with plasma instead of losing a model as it makes taking plasma on any characters pointless as no one should risk the 1/6 chance to lose the character. Just my thought on it. Could give some interesting combinations for players to try with different armies.
Problem with this is that it will reduce the risk for things like Iron Hands Hellblasters. Even ignoring the Iron Hands specifically, a 5+FNP isn't hard to get for a Marine army, which would make the mortal wounds almost trivial.
In a ideal world, this rule would exist only for characters and vehicles, but that would require too much work out into writing.
@@benkaes3657 How else does a Marine army gain 5+++/6+++ Army-Wide outside of Iron Hands?
@@ashfield4313 Theres a litany to give a 6" bubble of 5+++ against Mortal wounds. No one takes it cus it just doesnt come up often.
@@benkaes3657 It would make the 5+++ litany actually useful, and you would still take 2/3 of the mortal wounds. So not exactly trivial.
If they did implement a change like this we would probably need to see Plasma Inceptors go up a few more points, but other then that most Space Marine Units with Plasma arent doing too much.
@@ashfield4313 black templars have a 5+ fnp for mortal wounds
I think you forgot the hellblasters + ancient combo. Works quite well to get the most out of every single point.
Yes!
I've been running the rapid fire variant against my friend's Custodes/Knights soup. I find that they do perform well after turn 1 as the knights want to move up to snatch mid field objectives and the two turns of -5 ap is nice. I'm building another squad of 10 for them and magnetizing the arms to see how the heavy variant does. Less shots hurts because I'm a terrible roller, but the higher S and damage would be nice to whipe out the knights a bit earlier.
I use pretty large squads of the heavy ones in my Iron Hands - being able to pay 1 CP to put them in devastator doctrine any turn you want to is dope. In my last game, they were wiping out squads of Plague Marines left and right while overcharging.
Used a max squad to do the dirty to morty, Mercy is weakness chap litany and reroll 1s.... let's just say he was looking crispy.afte that
Running these as a cover fire unit for black templars is gamechanging. I use a 5 man unit with the assault incinerators with a captain close by to reroll 1s and its an all purpose extermination unit
Your not the first to do so apparently. I think we found a new psudo-meta
Perhaps! And they only get worse on crusade campaigns; my little 5 man squad has exploding 6s, damage 2 BEFORE overcharge, hittin on 2s. Enrages anyone in range lmao
One competitor is sternguard with combi-plasma. Their advantage is access to drop pods and storm ravens.
And the Sarg can take a melee weapon to help mitigate melee combat.
I love grav on my Strerngaurd, very marine heavy meta and they shred space marines into ribbons
Not sure access to storm raven is an advantage atm with its cost
I’m so confused how you are so consistent with daily uploads!
I’m amazed.
If I remember correctly, iron hands has a relic or warlord trait that lets you choose a unit and they re-roll all hit rolls like the CM ability. So what you could do is use impulsor rush with two units of hellblasters and have a CM use his ability and the warlord trait on both units and lay down heavy fire.
The warlord trait you are thinking of is "Target Protocols" and it's only a single hit, single wound and single damage roll.
"Mercy is Weakness" 1cp: pick a Friendly IH unit and one enemy unit they wish to attack, the IH unit gets exploding dice.
Mix that with some Chaplain hax, and you've got yourself a nasty bit of shooting.
Imperial Fists can make very good use of the heavy incinerators. Like lascannons with better AP and more consistent damage. Add the Tank Hunters strat for more fun.
Well this was good timing, I just bought a box of these yesterday. I have so many Assault Intercessors that I was like I need some Hellblasters that are running at the enemy. I was trying to decide if I should make 2 5 man squads one of Assault and one of Heavy as with the Dark Imperium 5 man squad I would have 15 plasma incinerators.
An alternative I'm heavily considering is Sternguard vets with combi plasma guns
Save 40 points per squad, takes Elite instead of Heavy Support slot, and the guns arent that much worse
Juat started printing 10 of each. Love these guys
First unit I ever bought right here, before I even had a codex! Wish I could use them better in my Minotaurs army
Definitely going to try building a good sized plasma Dark angels force this year (no death or raven wing), One 10 man assault Hellblasters and two 5 man with heavy plasma, 6 Inceptors with plasma as two 3 man units, one plasma Redemptor (possible 2) or Contemptor dreads , one captain and one lieutenant and maybe add in a repulsor executioner and work around it as a starting force.
I love combat squading fortis kullteams with 5 assault hellblasters and auto bolt rifles. So many shots and able to handle tougher models too
I’ve had a lot of success using regular (rapid fire) hellblasters coming out of strategic reserves. A bit cp-pricey, but gaurenteed rapid fire at damage 3 (I play DA so weapons of the dark age) is great at dealing with well large enemy targets that would be otherwise well protected. Now that you did the mathhammer though, I should probably switch over to assault!
I think with these I would run the Hellblaster assault variant squad with an Assault Intercessor squad in an Impulsor. Together they would be a hard hitting option for capturing an enemy-held objective. I suppose, I could replace the Assault Intercessors with Bladeguard Veterans and include the Captain in the Impulsor. But that would be quite a lot of points in 1 transport.
I can't find a way to put them into a BA list. I love them in theory....like...allot. but I just can't field them
I hear ya... there's just too many good close combat options for Blood Angels!
@@kokevinny lol any close combat troop is a good choice for blood angels. I'm still waiting in my jump primaris melee infantry.
I think you could work them in quite well, a strong close-range murderous ranged unit just behind/screened by your killy melee troops. Your opponent can try to take them out in melee and risk fighting your infantry, or try to out-shoot the hellblasters which could melt most squads with a good roll
I run a squad of assualt plasma with a captain to buff them, they are the point and delete type of unit, middle of the board objective holders. I need to find a way to get them with in range of my buddies riptide.
Great video, thanks. Now struggling to decide between assault or heavy for my new Dark Angels force!
Assault lets them fire their way out of melee during Tactical, if that helps.
Smellblasters teehee
This is my fav comment of the day
Gave me a good chuckle
I see what you did there.
To be fair the Dark Angels should've had a slide dedicated solely to them. The Greenwing's super doctrine favors the assault and rapid fire incinerators, allowing them to shoot in combat albeit hitting on 4+, Azrael for Chapter Master rerolls and a 4++ against ranged attacks, strats that allow them to fall back and shoot, stratagem that Allows them to go into their preferred doctrine, Weapons from the Dark Age, Line Unbreakable strat that minimizes attacks from hordes in close combat. They just have so much in terms of strats that really do put them head and shoulders above other chapters.
Also a stratagem you forgot to mention is Steady Advance. You can't advance but you count as standing still. Might not affect the assault and RF incinerators but you will keep the heavies from the -1 to hit modifier, If I remember correctly.
I'm not the only one who remembers the Rogue Trader days' version of That Guy who'd field an entire unit of plasma gun (which were god guns back then) marines as a custom squad for his homebrew chapter, right? These figs are GW finally letting That Guy live the dream on steroids, although thankfully they aren't the dominant force the old RT plasma were.
Great deployment tips. Convinced me to go with the assault hellblasters. Looking forward to them immolating themselves and everything to their front in one massive burst of starfire. Should be fun. The survivors can then slink over to sit on some objective.
My hell blasters are a bunch of mrk 3 marines with plasma rifles.
Nice that you made some Hellblasters support video!
Althought I have to say that Hellblasters is a support dependent unit, I try to field 30 Assult Blasters.
Since I play *Dark Angels* I play them with Arzael for 4++save, Lieutenant, Chaplain Master of Sancticy(Catechism of Fire & Recitation of Focus), Apothecary.
Lazarus is good for the Mortal wounds save if you don't want Azraels Stone Age Model...(But then you lose the 4++ save)
I use First Born 5man Tacticals for screening or 5man Infiltrators.
Remember to screen good.
I Try to get Inceptrors in too.
and Lazarus/Jump Captain or Chaplain/Jump Chaplain for support there too
I’d definitely use them as anti-elite/vehicle instead of eradicators in friendly games, eradicators are so unfun to play against. Plus I love plasma weapons (even though I’m a BA player).
Full agree with this, I stopped using my Eradicators in my games when my friend who just started Warhammer had his plague burst crawler walk up, only to be immediately deleted by my Eradicators. I felt bad cause he was disappointed lol.
I love grouping them with a Watchmaster in Dwatch and stacking up the rerolls to wound between xenos hunters and kill team specialisms; great when you really need something truly dead, and they feel a little more friendly than eradicators.
Do you take them in a Fortis kill team? It so, do you combat squad or keep the intersessors as ablative wounds?
@@GrimmDork Yeah, in a Fortis! I haven't been keeping the intercessors with them so far just to spread out and give myself more units to get on points because DW is already kind of elite. Last game I played, I kept an apothecary around for a minute to heal up some that got nailed with the 1s on a reroll and the 5+ FNP. Lot of help for one unit, but man they do work.
10 man squad with rapid fire plasma incinerators. Dark angels weapons of a dark age. Strategic reserves. Bring a lieutenant. Kill a baneblade in one turn. They literally won a game for me.
What did the LT do?
@@slingshotmaster99 reroll wound rolls of 1
I'm rocking heavy hellblasters with ultra marines so I can walk and shoot. Been realy nice for table control
Trying them out in my first blood angels incursion list I needed something to handle some good shooting
Had an Ultramarines lineup, centered around 2 units of assault Hellblasters and Guilliman with 2 Implusors. Gman keeps them a little safer, Tiggy/Chaplain get to ride along in the 6th impostor seats, and that's a nice mobile fire force.
Not sure if it wouldnt be strictly better with Bladeguard though, and letting something else shoot
A real benefit for heavy hellblasters is that when they take on death guard they can kill them in one shot (and for dark angels that goes to wotda for terminators)
Recently picked up a box of these guys for my Space Wolves.
Been waiting for this update!
Woot woot!
More Deathwatch
I thought I liked the assault hellblasters the best but I think I'd rather have the heavy hellblasters because they aren't likely to be fried and their standard charge is okay anyway.
Have you thought about making similar videos for middle earth strategy battle game?
Tor Garadon mixed with Hellblasters and Heavy Intercessors is so fucking awesome.
depending on what I'm up against I'll even include hellblasters in my blood angels. If I'm up against dark angels they are my go to terminator squad removal choice, well that and psykers like a librarian dreadnaught or Mephiston
I think it may have a good synergy with BT for their attacks characteristics as they shoot hard and with the assault doctrine on they auto wound on sixes, for securing objectives may be kinda strong, better than normal Crusaders.
Heavy plasma incinerator, get these and you just win.
how u play them? mine always dead before i can use them nicely
Nah, just looking at the weapon profile, I can't kill them because I use the guard
@@benjod4549 back in 8th, I’d use 10 dark angels heavy incinerator hellblasters in a bastion. Overcharged they would inflict 3 damage per shot, they always re-rolled 1s to hit since they didn’t move. With the bastion, they had 36” radius bubble of fire, which was pretty intimidating to many enemies. The bastion was decent protection for around 200 points, with toughness 9 and 20 wounds.
Later, I would hop them out, and keep them near the chaplain to ignore movement modifiers. Then I would use Weapons of the Dark Age to inflict 4 damage per shot.
Haven’t had the chance to try them in 9th. There is a stratagem to ignore movement modifiers to shooting, so it shouldn’t play too differently. I’d use the bastion to protect them from alpha strike, then hop out and go to town. I think a sky shield landing pad might work ok too.
Dark Angels Hellblasters with Azrael and a Lieutenant: hit 35/36 shots fired, wound 35/36 against marines, AP removes a marine's armor save. This all due to their +1 to hit for standing still.
In essence a Hellblaster will kill an enemy marine for every single shot they take, making Dark Angels incredibly dangerous as a unit for them. It is kind of insane when one just looks at the raw math of it.
What plasma variant are these?
@@wert3155 For maximum theoretical damage output, the normal ones supercharged as if you are in rapid fire range you are killing two marines per Hellblaster.
@@thunderscourge Assult + Chaplain support is my cup of tea.
(with Azrael and Lieutenant ofc)
@@setaripantheon8801 Okay? Don't see how that is relevant unless you meant to respond to someone else.
Thats how plasma works in the lore from what I remember, not even ceramite works too well against it.
I have 2, 5 man squads for my dark angels. Any other chapter I would run eradicators
Hellblasters seem like a load of fun. Imagine pushing up with an ATV and inceptors or whatever then your plasma boys rock up with their guns and overcharge them ALL. Holy moly would that be hilarious. I'm thinking in the lore hellblasters in my chapter are the marines that are slightly overzealous and off their rocker.
Forget the name of the strat but for the DA firing into melee is useful
That’s just part of Tactical Doctrine, shoot assault and RF at BS5+
as a chaos player i really really hate these things
I literally throw everything in my army to get rid of them as quickly as possible, regardless of objectives.
Can you please make videos about the fellblade and falchion ?
Imperial Fist heavy hellblaster work like a charm, you can improve their cover and since they don't move it mostly stay for the whole game. with tank hunter they fry tanks from afar
Missing point: space wolfs: 1cp outflank stratagem
I’ve been using two devastator squads. 6man each. One with laz cannons and the other missiles. Only 3 heavys per unit cus I only have that many laz cannons and missile launchers. They have been doing great work in my UM army I tried using hellblasters with heavy weapons but my rolls suck and I always end up killing one. Even with re rolls. The idea of using them with assault variety does peak my interest tho. They might do well in my mobile gun line with just sheer amount of shots. I could field 2 quads of 5 with assault variants for roughly the same as my current build. I’d be sacrificing an extra meat shield but I’m curious to see how the two compare. I’ll try it out.
5 with assault versions and in an impulser to move them pop out then buff from Chaplin
The heavy ones would shine really well against plague marines
Deathwatch Primaris Captain: Ignore overheating, just push the reset button with your thumb next to the trigger and try again.
Deathwatch Primaris Captain: While you're at it boys, switch to Tactical doctrine for a couple turns.
Deathwatch Primaris Captain: Charge! No, you idiots, I said, charge your shots, not charge the enemy! Why did I have to get the Space Wolves.
3x Fortis Assault Teams (5xIntercessors, 4xHellblasters), 3x Repulsors (twin las and las talon, anti air rockets, frag grenades)
so, is there any successor chapter tactics that are notable for working with them?
It is a minor benefit, but Space Wolves can put a full ten man squad of the assault hell blasters into strategic reserves for only 1 CP with Cunning of the Wolf, as opposed to the 2 CP it would cost for anyone else. While minor, it does mean that Space Wolves get a bit more efficient options for ten man squads.
Does the +1 to hit rolls of a chaplain's recitation of focus litany make it so rolls of 1 count as 2 and don't explode when overcharged?
No. Dies in natural 1
they are currently the bane for black legion terminators in my 1000 points games with a friend - without their 3. wound assault hellblasters pretty much wipe a whole squad with ease. Im also playing ultramarines and the stratagem to reroll 1s is so usefull and makes them very independant from any buffing characters. I think they work great now when you just stack up on different strong shooting units in a gunline - with psychic fortress, an apothecary and transhuman they are not a "no brain" target anymore making them quite durable
oh and i might add, that i think in 1000k lists flexibility is key and getting a unit that is quite usefull against tanks and heavy infantry but does not suffer as much against hordes makes them my pick over eradicators (i also do not like plasma inceptors in 1k as much because half your points are in reserve on such a small board) - in 2k lists deepstrike is way more important and you have enough points for more dedicated anti tank stuff like eradicators
Well duh, vanilla chaos doesn't have their codex and all the things that will come with it, like 3wound termies.
Great against Death Guard
I equiped mine with assault cuz i liked more the design and i like to have more dakka lol
I use the Dark imperium ones sure it's the worst gun but I just say it's a good one ;)
@@MaggieMop that works too ^^
I have 15 hellbalsters, never seen a reason to run any of them at the cost. I might try a squad of 5 assault ones out in white scars and see how they do.
Guess I’m running mine as assault. Surprising stats
I was under the impression that a natural 1, reroll or not, had you take the overcharge damage in 9th?
If you have a +1 modifier, the natural 1 still causes overcharge damage. If you reroll the 1, the 1 is replaced by the reroll, and if it’s not another 1 you don’t take the overcharge damage.
@@joekrampus1154 ah! Thank you for the clarification
Giving plasma inceptors blast tilted hard against these.
how do devastators with plasma cannons compare to hellblasters?
5 long fang plascannon bois with pack leader and wolf guard carrying plas gun and plasma combi
Can dish out a max of 19 plasma shots.
10 hellblasters is only 20.
Long fangs can ignore heavy with keen senses 1 cp and can outflank for 1 cp.
Deepstrike or outflank a lord beside em for rerolls of gets hot.
I have like 20, please make them work
Always used a full squad of hellblasters in the old Deathwatch codex and with the new codex it only became better get 10 hellblasters buff them up with a chaplain toss em across the board with a jumppack captain with the beacon angelis and see 10 hellblasters deal a casual 36 ish damage on anything
What do you think about heavy hellblasters x10 with the thor garadon buff ? They could move without penalty because they hit on 2+ all the time.
If they remain stationery and are Dark angels does that really give entirely safe overcharges? I just heard that’s not the case from a few sources :(
Is it better to take the sicaran omega instead of 6 heavy hellblasters. Sicaran can move and fire with no penalty, has more toughness and wounds, a bonus heavy bolter, more wounds and doesn't reduce damage output with a 1 to hit (just lose a wound). It costs you a CP to bring but point for point the sicaran seems so much better
They are unreal in UM armies especially with RG and apothecary and a libby giving 5++.
Which weapon type?
Heavy 10 man squad, captain Lazarus, Grim Resolve, WotDA, overcharge.
4 wounds at strength 9, reroll ones, +1 to hit. No more dreadnought.
see this prompts a question, my friend is definite that nat 1's always fail on overcharge even with buffs. how is this so, as it removes the point of many buffs available. even chapter traits like 8th ed WoTD or current CF ones.
If it's a +hit modifier, they still die on overcharge. If it's a reroll they should be safe.
I think that's fair since the +1 to hit is really cheap and common
One great thing with the deathwatch if the ability to put hellblaster in intercessor squads, the biggest issue with the hellblaster beeing their tankiness for their price, like that you can use intercessor as meat shield the same way you use tactical marines to protect their special ou heavy weapon.
The assault variant seems to be the best, not only it's the more effiecient but sadly we know what happen most of the time avec using hellblaster ( your ennemy will blast them to death ), to having a greater risk of dying because of overheat isn't that much of an issue ^^ and they are great to counter death guards but also aeldari ( E3 1W, except harly ) and sisters of battle, theses lady won't laugh with their " ignore AP-1 and -2 " when hit by a shower of F6 AP-4 shots ^^
And the heavy variant is great to kill everything with multiples wounds and big tank while having less risk to kill themself compare to the assault variant.
Many people don't like them but i do love my plasma teams :) ( i have 5 hellblaster of each types :) )
Assault version def interesting now. Def a good unit.
Personally I think hellblasters are only really good in low point/power games when you don’t have enough points for both anti infantry and tank, and you need more of both, or as a backfield objective holder but in a high number squad like 8 - 10, but for 5 points more you can take 10 intercessors for screening and 3 eradicatiors for good anti tank which I would prefer
What option came with the dark imperium hellblasters?
Vanilla Rf, pretty sure
I swear by Hellblasters. As a Deathwatch player I mix them in with Intercessors. Five Intercessors to absorb bullets let the five Hellblasters rip into things. Personally I prefer the assault plasma incinerator. Sure, they don't hit S8 even when overcharged, but when you get three shots per model it doesn't really matter. I move this unit every turn and advance a lot of the time, so a mix of assault bolt rifles and assault plasma incinerators keeps the unit mobile and puts out tons of shots. You can threaten Marines with sheer rate of fire, or just mow down a horde of something cheap like Gaunts.
How do you survive 3 full units of heavy?
Thanks
I just love plasma
I think Hell blasters would be a great addition to the Space Marines (especially compared to Plasma Inceptors, which are just better), if they had plasma weapons that simply do not kill a model in the hit roll or have a build in re-roll of 1. Right now Inceptors are just better in my opinion.
I'm sorry, but I think you said that Dark Angels could get "entirely safe overcharges" because of their +1 to hit? That's what you said right? Because if so, then no. They blow up on an _unmodified_ roll of a 1. So it doesn't matter if the roll is then modified to a 2 or even a 3, it still blows up.
I thought bolter discipline only works on bolter weapons and the hell blaster dont have bolter weapons
It just seems like there's always some other unit that can do a better job, with most of them not risking suicide via fusion bomb
Personally I think Salamanders assault hellblasters using crucible of battle and paired with a shielding unit using self sacrifice is the way to go. The unit is just far too fragile to take without some sort of reliable way to stop them being shot off the board. The primaris stat-line is nowhere near as durable it was when these guys came out in 8th ed they're essentially now just tactical marines armed with an expensive plasma weapon
I think Milking DA AssBlasters (heh) is beat way of using them. Overcharge, then WotDA for 3 D3 shots!
How exactly did you count the chances of death while overcharging? Isn't it just ⅙ times amount of shots?
So to me it would be:
16,7% for Heavy Plasma
33,3% for Rapid-fire Plasma
50% for Assault Plasma
How'd you get your numbers? What am I missing?
It's the chance of any result of ANY NUMBER of 1s on 1, 2 and 3 dice. By that simple method you'd calculate and 100% chance of death on any plasma with six shots (but you'd still have the chance to live if you got lucky and didn't roll any 1s, so the chance has to be less than 100%)
@@auspextactics I'm not really getting it.. could you walk me through how you're counting it?
@ashm Ah I see.. thanks for the explanation
Dark Angels with weapons of the dark age is tasty.
These assholes completely shredded my sisters. I'm trying to learn how to beat them. They destroyed my reserve Zephyrim who were trying to deploy and charge, and took out my Retributors with ease.
Imperial Fists hellblasters with Assault Plasma incenerator chew through Plague Marines
I prefer eradicators, maybe predator tanks, sometimes even eliminators. I don't use devastators, but only because I run primaris. Hellblasters are too fragile and too expensive. And that's speaking about HS slot. For plasma, inceptors are my choice.
Would anyone be..entirely bothered if I just said I'm not using the pistol this round?like...it looks wayy cooler than the point and I'm not bothered taking off the entire hand to swap it out. Aslong as I don't use it will it still take up points (If I declare I'm not using It pre-battle)
Extremely time consuming when super-charging with Standard (at rapid fire range) and Assault variants.
1 model at a time...
Heavy Incinerators work well for Dark Angels and maybe with Imperial Fists.
I roll the whole squad, and then have d10/8/6/4 on hand to randomly roll out who overheated saves me a lot of time.