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Regarding what it matters if it's systemic CNS fatigue or psychological fatigue, it actually matters a lot. For one, CNS fatigue causes nocebo effects, whereas the knowledge that it's mental fatigue should be empowering you to push harder. Second, CNS fatigue would have very different programming implications, like reducing workout length, deloading or reducing volume. Not having to worry about these things and knowing you can just keep pushing yourself is very valuable for people in my experience.

Please go to five hard sets of barbell squat and then five hard sets of dead lift, and tell me how much you want to train your forearms afterwards. Psychological fatigue is real. Systemic fatigue is real

I needed this. Thanks chief.

I see this all the time where academic experts talk about direct observation and provide criticisms to the likes of andrew huberman or jordan peterson and say "i really like them and think they are great, but they are categorically incorrect". Cant we just provide the criticism without the pre-amble? Is it just because their followers are such a cult that you are afraid of the backlash? Do you have to bend the knee when they are wrong and deserve the criticism?

Ok, so about a week back i did a 275 bench PR for the first time. I decided to go a 2nd rep on it and it was a huge grind and I was doing the valsava for 10ish seconds and found I was unusually sapped for the rest of the workout and could feel at the very least an unusual increase of cortisol after that lift. I wasn't mentally fatigued, as I was excited about a new PR. I wanted to keep working out. I labeled that as a rare case of CNS fatigue, was that not accurate? What do I call that then?

One thing I would caution about is when looking at studies like the Single vs. Multi-Joint Resistance Exercises one, they often use untrained subjects. Do the same conclusions hold when talking about intermediate or advanced lifters? Typically I see the advice for untrained people is to focus primarily on compounds since you will recover quickly and see lots of growth no matter what. Usually it is advanced lifters that talk about focusing more on growing particular muscles like the biceps using isolation work. (not that I like the isolation/compound terminology, which is obviously very imprecise)

20 sets in 45 minutes??? Maybe its because I try to go to 15 reps because of my joints... but I can AT MOST do 9-12 sets in that time, depending on the exercises. 3 backextensions 3 abs 3 shoulderpress and 3 calves... sure. But even if I do supersets in bench and row it takes me about 30 minutes. Same goes for dips and pullups. What am I doing wrong?

Why aren't you talking about isolation exercises? Especially with dumbells it's super easy to sneak in some dumbell curls or lateral raises in between compound exercises and as you said the cardiovascular effort is minimal.

CNS fatigue is NOT muscle fatigue, but cerebral fatigue. Lifting weights has 2 components: central cerebral activity to control your muscles and local muscle activity. When EITHER (or both) of these two components is compromised, you will be weaker. So it's absolutely possible that after a particularly CNS challenging session your muscles locally are still OK, but your brain finds it much more difficult to contract and coordinate them. The net result is that you can lift less or that your stamina is reduced. 🤓

1) How do rows stimulate the biceps? Seems like the lats and rear delts are doing the pulling. I'm talking bent over rows and cable rows. 2) I heard that it takes one month to recover from doing your 1 rep max. Is that true? After a power lifting meet, how long before someone could do their one rep max again?

Don’t agree with myth no.3 deadlifts and squats do take a lot out of you and recovery time takes longer and can affect output in other lifts

IDK how you call it, but after a leg day I am just unable to make, for example, shoulders. Maybe the name is incorrect, but I think we can agreee that we all feel something that feels like "central fatigue".

No they cant and never will...clickbait...does the sun set in the west? Lets philosophie further....

11:50 So Lyle McDonal was wrong

👍🏻

I have to disagree that the fatigue from a heavy workout is all "mental". When I do a killer leg-day workout, I'm "physically" tired. My energy stores have been used up. I can't immediately follow a brutal leg workout with some other body part. I need to physically rest for a while, let my metabolism catch up, and eat some more food. If I don't rest and jump right into other body part, then that body part will not get the full benefit of a good session. If we didn't need physical rest, then we should be able to do an effective full body workout all in one (long) session. But of course, we know that would not work well.

Myth #3 seems more about what we are calling it than the fatigue itself As for Myth#4 I realised years ago that I have limited time in the gym per week so I decided that only arms and back matter to me so I only train those (yeah boohoo my legs are big enough anyway)

4:02

If you are trying to peak your bench( ie: a real life time PB)then you really need to ease off on squats and dead’s

Cns fatigue or just fatigue what ever you want to call it may be local but when you train your whole body its not local its whole body and it adds up and can hit real fucking hard !

Do you think there is any credence to the idea that Chris Beardsly and Paul Carter put forth, that these high volume studies are actually just showing increased swelling of the muscle from more damage? The main argument against this would be the repeated bout effect, but in the 52 sets study they increased the volume every week or two weeks (dont remember), so according to them that would negate that effect. There is also the idea that swelling would be gone after a just a few days, but they claim that simply isnt always the case, and edema can still be there after 10 days. You would expect 52 sets to cause alot of swelling and for it to last longer, and according to them swelling can increase and decrease somewhat unpredictably anyways. Im planning to test this myself, doing 4 weeks with their lower volume recommendations (12 sets a week biceps and triceps), and then measuring every day for 10 days afterwards, then doing it again with 30 sets for biceps and triceps a week, and measuring the same way.

So, follow up. There was the 52 set study, and Dr Mike and Wolf both joked that obviously you would explode if you tried a ramping progression like this for all muscles. Are you saying that because fatigue is local, you wouldn't and could run something like that for all bodyparts?

I thought that proximity to failure was one of the most important factors in relation to muscle growth? I know my biceps are no where near failure after several sets of rows. In fact I like to do dumbbell biceps curls after my dumbbell rows. As the weight is about 1/3 and feels so light

Free weights are still better for function. Sure I could do hamstrings and lower back on machines but that's not going to teach me how to pick heavy shit up off the floor.

I cannot thank you and Dr Mike enough for your videos and teachings. Thanks a lot !!!

This guy can’t keep getting away with this

Only #2 is a myth. This was a disappointing video.

You might be saying that to call it CNS fatigue is not a valid statement, but I say that calling it, bro science wouldn’t be a valid technical term either. Most people in the gym that follow the broscience approach just don’t worry about Feit at all in general. If you’re referring to common “science based “ lifters and influencers that might be more accurate. Let’s not put direct semantics into a box, yeah?

Regarding the fractional volume: What if the fractional volume in secondary muscles is just too easy to generate any growth? Isn´t there a minimum intensitiy level that needs to be activated to generate noticeable growth? For example: If my back is close to failure in the barbell row, my biceps may still have 10 reps in the tank. That means you may train your Back with 3 RIP, but your biceps with 10+ RIP. I don´t think you can really count that as muscle adding volume?

I think myth #2 started because lifters are less likely to control the negative when using machines compared to free weights, and controlling the negative is very important for muscle growth.

Man, it's like you purposely got every myth wrong so you could drive up engagement through disagreeing comments. Maybe step outside of the lab for 2 seconds and see the forest through the trees.

Regarding myth #2: Heavy (pound-for-pound) free weight require stronger stabilizing muscles (and connective tissue). Stronger than average stabilizing muscles allow for extraordinary balancing capacity, for example. And cables allow better muscular tension throughout full ROM - especially compared to machines. Regarding myth #3: It is completely possible to execute a 1 RM - using full range of motion and excellent form - and end up with complete muscle failure, not being able to continue on with your training. But I would classify that as 'physical fatigue and exhaustion' - NOT 'mental exhaustion.' As long as the mind is willing, and you've done the very best on that day, it's more likely physical exhaustion. Keep in mind, I'm referring to bro splits here while being natural.

maybe CNS fatigue isn't real for bodybuilding training, but from a strength specific standpoint any strong athlete or coach will argue otherwise. As you get stronger you just cant generate the kind of maximal force output on a lift multiple times in a short period of time. Say my deadlift max is 660lbs, 300kg. I max out today. For most strength athletes, even if they think they're fully recovered would not be able to repeat that performance again 7 days later. I can do a powerlifting meet and my ability to train hard is in the gutter for days after that. Saying heavy lifts just exhaust you is splitting hairs over semantics. The lift has tired you in a way that isn't the same as muscle damage. Talk to any strong strength athlete and they'll tell you. You just cant lift that heavy all the time, even when your muscles feel fine. Exhaustion, CNS fatigue whatever. They're the same thing. Perhaps CNS fatigue would be better represented as extremely high acute stress. Maybe it doesn't affect your CNS in the way that many athletes and coaches think it does, but to sit here and act like there is nothing going on is... stupid.

7:51 You mean V-Shreds Test Boost Max is snake oil??

i stoped doing bicep isolation exersises for years, my arm shrinked like 4-5 cm. now i added curls again for a few weeks and by upper arms have growed like 1.5 cm already. when i row i dont use my biceps. i row with my lats, the dumbell just hang there in my hand

myth 3.: heavy training/fatigue leads to inflammation. inflammation is highly connected to depression. the body signals clearly it needs recovery and one should move as little as possible. also body and mind are one unit. fatigue exists locally but the information is highly processed in the brain, it seems dumb to separate it like that.

If one thinks they can excel in pullups by doing machine pulldowns, they are sorely mistaken.

Bro trying to slip in a mammas joke lol

just came to dislike, never seen so much bs LOL

1:09 you are missing the tree for the woods, I have taught at least 12 people in last 3 years how to pull with their back vs their biceps and the difference is huge. Many people pull with their arms and their arms grow and their back doesn’t. You can certainly do a pull down in a way that your biceps are a primary mover and your back isn’t.

That's interesting. One question that bugs me lately is: should I bulk with a tiny (200cal) surplus for 10 months a year with 16sets/week per muscle or should I bulk with a larger (at least 500cal) surplus for 8 months a year with 20sets/week per muscle? In other words, for the same number of sets in a year during a bulk (16*10 vs 20*8), is there an advantage in eating more to make the bulk shorter and more intense? Or since muscle growth is slow, it's better to keep the bulk for longer by minimizing fat gain?

as someone with chronic pain, sleep apnea, and mental health disorders, the CNS fatigue thing is definitely a true phenomenon. When everything aligns and I feel especially crappy, my max reps for a given weight will reduce by up to 10. I also have to limit the amount of cardio I do as I have a limited battery of energy every day to devote to exercise, otherwise I get really burned out and my lifts start going the other direction. As I have a background in medicine, the term central refers to neurology, and that refers to nerves and the brain. If you are fatigued centrally, you will be fatigued peripherally. Like if what you are saying is true, there is no such thing as fibromyalgia, myalgic encephalomyelitis, or chronic fatigue syndrome, as these disorders primarily deal with the central nervous system being very fatigued due to some unknown cause and that is either causing pain or extreme fatigue peripherally.

Brando in a Streetcar.

How is it that we are not wired to high intensity effort if it is true that for longer than not, we had to push our bodies to collect and hunt food and work and walk and climb to do so, not with a shake waiting at home but sometimes with empty hands that means in a caloric deficit, if all this is true then how is it we because so physically “lazy”?