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Or was he just short Or actually a child, but really evil child!?

What in the actual fu-

I think I found the words The show's characterization is a lil bad

Ironic that you have an Adam pfp. But you are right.

How so Genuine critique does make better art afterall

@ because I actually watched a show and I have seen a lot worse movies and shows that I regret watching

@Spinozilla109 Wait so because you've seen worse that makes the show good because it's not outright horrible..?

@ I seen some stuff I wish I never saw

@ horrible atrocities, like Batman and Robin Sharknado, Velma, and countless others

With the Rumbler crying about his adoptive hapa sister sleeping with another man after being punched by his best childhood butt-buddy friend? Yes please.

I mean if you go to heaven and you have a happy life there. will you be happy to see the person that sent you there come by and visit and act like they didn't murder you. The reason why I bring this up is because I'm not trying to guilt trip is just something to bring up I mean for crying out loud I think HH could have really expanded on something like that showing how complicated the situation is. I mean I'm not trying to say Adam is a good person or not because it was clearly thrown out the window the way they portray him I mean for crying out loud this could have been an interesting series where there was no villains except people at each other's throats trying to reach a simple solution without considering what the other side thinks. I don't want to get political but I am a Mexican-American and yes I do agree that America needs to upgrade their border policy. I do get the arguments about people wanting to get a much better life here because America offers a lot of opportunities, but crossing the border illegally isn't the way to start. some people try to make me sound bad by saying "well how the heck are they supposed to know are you telling them that all they're doing for nothing that their dreams are not meant to happen" and the answer I have for that is well if there's a illegal way to immigrate shouldn't there be a legal way to immigrate I mean there's evidence of cartel sending human trafficking victims to America so they can further expand their business there to get more money. not to mention my cousin needed to move here into America after a bunch of gangs forced him to transport drugs while keeping his family hostage. And if we apply the same thinking like the main character of HH does about everybody deserving a second chance how do you think people like my cousin is going to feel if they found out that the people that have been holding his family members hostage and forcing him to transport drugs are you going to be living in the same country as him is it going to make him feel?

It depends on what show you're talking about and what the morality in-universe is. Tell me, is Genocide when someone feels like it such a bad thing that makes someone a villain in your eyes? Then why are Angel Dust and Cherry Bomb not villains when they do the same? A strawman is how you make someone antagonistic by taking away all the arguments, blacks, whites and greys taking away everything until all it's left is a flanderization of the same person with feeble arguments easier to break. They made Adam a bad guy for killing killers who feel no remorse. That's bad writing.

It’s because the writers stripped the nuances of why someone in Adam’s place would actually kill demons in the first place. Instead of having a nuanced reason for why he kills demons they just say: “i kill demons because it’s fun for me to do so and that’s my only reason why”. Note: before anyone mentions Sera, the yearly exterminations were Adam’s idea

@simonpetrikov3992 This

Different settings. Joshua Graham killing the Legion because, he want to defend innocent people who don't know how to fight the Legion. Adam is killing sinners because, there are no good sinners in hell, even if he enjoys killing sinners, you can still be both a good person, while also enjoy killing the thing that only causes problems.

@@engpol-1036 "He who fights with monsters should be careful, lest he thereby become a monster". Again, credit due, Adam is doing some good, but it's both more entertainment for him and his personal angels, and a territorial power move... "Right, for the wrong reasons", may be a good summary.

I'd be shocked if he showed up.

YOOOOO, if you can, post the link here please.

Link the source.😢 🙏

They move PLATFORMS?-💀

nvm, found it old.reddit.com/r/HazbinHotel/comments/1htrd2x/id_say_leading_an_annual_massacre_of_people_you/?tl=fr

Yeah but He’ll is full of Gay Demons so…

Yeah. She shouldn't care about the backlash from religious people. Some of them are just crazy (coming from a religious person). Like....we have stuff like Helltaker for crying out loud, why would hazbin and helluva boss be any different? (Besides helltaker being a harem..thing. It's still Hell). And I think she said being gay doesn't send you to hell because the amount of lgbt people in her fandom and they are also crazy.

He saw his client murdering someone and he did nothing to stop him, he didn't tell anyone about it or prevent his future murders

@erikakoti2910 So he didn't tell anyone that someone he Knew was killing people, wow that really is lame

A sin of omission ​@connorludwig8472

@@erikakoti2910 This is so stupid. Murder witnesses in real life usually do not report the crime, because they are too afraid (not exactly their fault, it is a psychological problem).

Agreed. They should have went a bit farther to explain everyone’s sins.

arent they at hell already who gives a shit hell can never stand up to heaven we all saw how defensless everyone was against adam alone lucifer is canonically stronger than all of the 7 rings of hell combined hell cant pose a threat to heaven 2nd a rehabilitation program (charlies idea) is much much better than eliminating "bad people" they are already in hell who gives a shit like for example if u sinned and went to hell does that mean u should be killed ?

​@@Purpleguy04 they simply don't believe in idea of redemption

@@5P_OFFICIAL i am talking about people who are defending mass slaughter not about the angels in the show

@@Purpleguy04 well, its mass slaughter of sinners, not of normal people

What if the sinner who wanted to be redeemed was a murder, abuser, and rapist? Would it be right to their victims to allow them the chance into Heaven?

The show is made so the angels are in the wrong. There is no reason why the angels don't know how one gets to heaven or hell since they built it, they have to know bc they created the rules

Wrong. Charlie's mindset is that everybody can be redeemed. That is factually wrong. There are some things you can't come back from. Also, how would a victim react if the person that k1lled or r4ped them was now happy in heaven? Ever thought about that? In real life you'd want someone like that to rot in prison for life for what they did to somebody. So why is it different for characters like Alastor? I get it, he's charismatic, but he's a murdering maniac. Adam too can be seen as a murdering maniac but he's killing those who deserve it after doing unspeakable evil in life (and death as well). Adam is on the right side on this. Not to mention the fact that we have a bunch of sinners as protagonists, Alastor most of all. Nothing will ever convince me he deserves redemption, no matter how much the fandom want to empathize with him.

@faith518 You are right. Again, the show doesn't even try to question charlie's mindset.

@@camerondalton1495I mean, considering heaven and hell in HH setting is a reflection of the prison system in some way, I think it is dubious to think that keeping em locked in instead of rehabilitating em is pretty fuck up. Murderers, rapists, etc. should have a second chance is what I am saying.

Only problem with this comment is you gotta indent it more. Hard to read otherwise.

Prescisly thats exactly what I was thinking I would like to also add that Adam is inherilty evil not because he is rude or anything like that the reason imo is that he wants and likes to kill it is not a duty for him its a pleasure and sure someone might say that "he is killing the bad guys so who cares" but he isnt killing only bad people but also those who try to be better like the crew from hazbin Adam by trying to stop them from becoming better people shows that he isnt for the people in hell to become better people and potentially go to heaven but he just wants and likes to kill them because they are demons and he only sees the world in black and white that narrow minded view doesnt help bad people turn good but upkeeps the status quo perhaps in the real world it is not advisiable to forgive everyone but in hell? when everyone is already dead and cant to any harm to noone? why not give those people a chance and Adam by refusing to allow change will remain as the bad guy

Thanks 😅

Just watched the rest of the video i still stand by my points that he is evil by the standard of the bible.

Like ok on that last point: i have an example. You know the covenant? The prophets wanting to begin the great journey? THEY WERE RIGHT TO DO SO BECAUSE OF THE FLOOD. Yet im betting youd still root for humanity yeah?

And you don't see the problem? The problem is that they don't even know what it is that takes you to heaven and if Adam is evil (under your observation) then Why hasn't he been thrown into hell? So What is the rule for going to hell? Apart from the obvious sins

@@el-gonza its possible that because he was the first human and thus also the first father there were no sins yet to commit. Its also quite possible hell simply wasnt a thing yet as assumedly by the stories that are told in the series both Lucifer and Adam were doing their own things at roughly the same time. If Adam came after Lucifer had already been cast into hell Lillith would not have taken the apple.

@@el-gonza alot of sins have something to do with other people. And since there weren't many around there really wasnt much Adam could have done to be sent to hell. Like a sheltered rich kid thats never been told "no" hes simply in heaven due to circumstance and the environment he was brought up in.

i can count with my hand who are misunderstood...Sir pentious, that one guy who drowned and Rita...yeah thats it, if you want me to make it longer, then we have Angel dust, a few sinners that suffer in the song of happy day in hell, and...well thats it. and for the last time, ONLY ADAM and extermination is bad, most of heaven is not bad

​@@Sonic2024freedomera Angel Dust was in mafia. He killed people. He DEFINENTLY deserves to be in hell.

The show has no nuance sometimes I think I'll quit cuz I don't even think they'll focus on the redemption part of it anymore

Heaven is not evil, i will never get that idea and i don't know where that comes from, when Heaven does not even know about the extermination and only the higher ups know (that is calling venezuela Evil because of the president)actually thats Sera reason, Adam reasons is because he founds it fun. By the way, not even in the context of him giving her a merciful death, because ignoring the senselessness that would be, if you die in hell as a sinner, your vital energy returns to hell as Eyes, and you are permanently in a nothing where you see yourself.

@Sonic2024freedomera its so obvious that heaven basically has zero worldbuilding compared to hell Cuz like hell has all these rings and species and the way you look reflects your sins and life and the way you died and theres diffirent districts and towns and you can become an overlord and do soul contracts.. And heaven... Is just a good place Idk its just so boring to me The show feels like it consistently chooses the easiest option and its really annoying

@@explodingpartyhats5438 In fact, heaven has the same mechanic of "you become what you were in life" and all that will be done in season 2 or with the advancement of the series (because apparently people say that Hazbin has no world building, but also they say that everything should not be released in season 1...what)

You said what I've wanted too 10x better✨

angel is neutral, Husk is complicated (he was an overlord) and now he is owned by Alastor, Alastor just does stuff for himself, Niffty is...well...Niffty, Vaggie was an excorcists in the past, Sir pentious. ..actually he is fine, or maybe not, more or less, Charlie is the only good one and she is the only one who can't even go to Heaven. and we are assuming that Hazbin Hotel was always going to make a Rick and Morty or Bojack Horseman level mega complex (the inspiration, but that, inspiration) also Adam is not right in any action he has done, mostly because of his own intentions, it sounds good on theory, but thats on theory, in the doing...yeah

Johan Liebert

@@Sonic2024freedomera ... Who?

Maybe they meant more threatening?

Thank you, didn't want the video to be longer then it needed to be.

It's stated by viv that hellborn aren't targeted.

What the show seemed to be going for was questioning how those judgements are made, and wether or not they actually hold weight, but so little focus is put on that element of the show it winds up feeling undercooked.

@@sebastienholmes548 i still wonder why people keep ignoring that point

many people actually love Adam (the hispanic part of the fandom adores him ALOT, yeah also the english side too). They are already in hell, trapped and can't get out, basically all this is out of pure sadism and that's it, it's like going to jail and killing a criminal, who can't get out of jail under any possible way, that's not true. is doing justice, that is being a sadist

@Sonic2024freedomera true but I mean if a guy goes to jails to kill r@pists, murderers, etc for enjoyment at least me myself would hv more sympathy for him than the r@pist he's killing. Doesn't mean I agree with him or think it's the right thing to do. It seems like the show ironically tries to paint Adam in a black and white 100% evil villian fashion while at the same time claiming that things aren't black and white

@@iy8-z1o It's not about sympathy, because Adam definitely hasn't proven that he deserves sympathy, nor have sinners, but you can tell when someone does something so cruel, they look more like the criminals they kill rather than someone who thinks he is doing the right thing, he is not thinking he is doing the right thing, he thinks what he is doing is fun, and he cannot get punished for it because they are evil, when what he is doing is evil even the people are evil. It's like thinking that stealing from a thief doesn't make you a thief.

​@@Sonic2024freedomerathing is that in hazbin's hell people dont suffer, so they dont even serve their punishment, bruh

@@5P_OFFICIAL People don't suffer? Would you understand if the idea that hell is infinite, constant fire wasn't seen, but that people don't suffer? That's false. In the series it is seen that there are sinners who have their houses burned down, or who kill each other (there is a district that is basically a constant war) the cannibals devour the dead bodies, but because almost all of them are immortal for being sinners, they regenerate. (except if they kill you with angelic weapons) the overlords have MILLIONS of souls, and the treatment they give to those souls is not the prettiest, Husk when he was an Overlord bet the souls as if they were money, Alastor has Husk and Niffty as if they were his slaves (although Niffty doesn't care, Husk clearly does not want to be chained) Vox controls people to buy his products, Valentino, well we already know what that guy does, Zestial with just His presence makes people want to hurt themselves or want to run away. The only reason hell doesn't seem so horrible is because we see it from the perspective of the princess of hell, and she is the third most powerful being in hell (and apparently the only pacifist in all of hell) and she has very high protection. I'd say it's better for everyone if Adam hadn't done anything.

Gonna repeat what I've said on the other comments. Imagine if you're in a serious business to solve a serious problem, and your first impression is them showing their illustrations using fucking crayons. If you think that's stupid, congratulations you understand that Charlie is a freaking idiot, and why Adam doesn't take her seriously. And when it comes to genocide, look I understand it's a difficult subject, however if the group of people only do is harm other people and provide NOTHING else? Then it's warranted. Sure maybe they are some sinners that are trying to be good, or someone was forced to eat others, however the show itself doesn't mention that fact, nor does a good job defending the sinners.

@@engpol-1036 1. Adam did not take the meeting as something serious, he took it as a joke and spent the whole time talking about himself, eating and making fun of Charlie, and he did not even went physically, he just put a hologram and thats it (and this is BEFORE he even saw the drawings of Charlie) 2. sinners only hurt each other, yes there is IMP and they kill humans at the request of sinners, but IMP is an exception, not something so common (besides, most people who kill go to hell anyway) sinners can't get out of the ring of pride, much less can they go to heaven to truly be a danger, they are like prisoners on an island thousands of kilometers away from civilization. 3. In fact there are at least 2 sinners who are known to be good, or at least not so bad (one is a counselor who drowned and the other is a girl who was decapitated by a demon infestor) but those appear in Helluva boss soooo...

​@@engpol-1036 Not everyone who goes to hell, in-universe, is evil. Take a look at episode 3 of season 1 of Helluva Boss where they are hired to kill a bunch of teenagers and other randos on the beach. Surely not EVERYONE who got killed was DESERVING of eternal damnation. Also, if the goal of hell was to inflict as much suffering as possible, I think killing would actually be giving them mercy. Hell, I would not be surprised if there were people who stood out in the open during exterminations just to end their suffering. The writing is not great, which I agree with you. That question you pulled up, is it okay for bad people to be redeemed if their victims have to live next to them. That is such an interesting question. The actual answer is irrelevant, what matters is that the question is being discussed in the first place, but the show doesn't do that. As for your point of the exterminations being good because it's against bad people, I feel that invites ugly follow-ups. Is it wrong to rape a rapist? Is it wrong to murder a murder? Is it wrong to be racist towards a racist? Again, the answer is irrelevant, if the writing was good, these are things that would have been asked.

Adam is ignoring the grayness, he is not being gray, he is being black and white

Do you think Hazbin Hotel or Helluva Boss have any legitimate writing issues?

@Sonic2024freedomera He was written that way 1 dimensional antagonist It makes him less interesting only glad they defeated him cuz he's obnoxious

Where, You can't just say "in the bible" and disdapear, do you have an idea of how Big that book is

this show doesn't explain what is a sin and it's not based on the bible or any other religion at that.

@thewitchidolsachika6682 The show is definitely inspired by religions But they wanted to make their own spin on things so they can tell a good story, problem is they didn't make any rules for what gets you into hell or heaven soo... Ya get left confused

@@slimer44producciones3 fair point, semi counterpoint. Google

Heaven doesn't even know about the exterminations, Sera only approves them, she doesn't look at anything, Adam's only order apparently is "kill all sinners for the whole day" and that's it. and the show is not even about Christianity at all

@@Sonic2024freedomera My only issue with the argument which I see a lot is the show isn't about Christianity but yet uses multiple figures FROM the Bible. Adam, Abel, Metatron, Saint Peter, Lucifer, Eve and Lilith to name the most common. If Vivzy isn't writing bible fanfiction I don't know how else this can be excused? I wouldn't be surprised if Jesus doesn't show up at some point as some weird caricature of what she thinks Jesus is.

@@Kushrada why is this a problem?

@@Sonic2024freedomera Its concerning that so many people argue vivzys heaven and hell isn't based on Christianity when it is? Like I'm fine with it being an altered, warped or debased interpretation of it, again Bible fanfiction but its odd that its handwaved en masse that its not supposed to be Christen Heaven and Hell by fans when it is?

I’ve watched both shows, yeah, she’s probably insecure or hurt, why? Well it isn’t wrong being insecure but like, she makes all the villains one sided, Ozmodeus from HB with Fizzaroli (the embodiment of Lust and a Imp Jester who’s a celebrity) are set up in episode seven to seem live villains who would rival even the strongest character so far, and the main character both mentally and physically, but no, instead they just threw it away, he really seemed like a unique villain along with Season 1 Striker, but they threw it all away, and the villains are all assholes who are one sided say cuss words and threatened the “fun guys” of the shows

I mean, he is the Dick Master. The first Dick, all humanity came from his nuts. The show tries to paint it like misogyny but its a literal fact, he is the father of mankind and sinners are his worthless children, waking stains of his legacy on Earth. So when he exterminates sinners it is a deeply personal affair, one he takes a personal, direct hand in. Its easy to play off his joking behavior as juvenile because lets face it it is but that's not all it is. Sinners aren't just a legacy of failures in gods light but also servants of Lilith who the series props up as hells defacto leader and source of inspiration over Lucifer, and Ironically while the series does this they also show her chilling in heaven Beach side as her people are being slaughtered due to a secreted alliance in Heaven she isn't just aware of but to some degree aids. Adam is both an unwitting pawn and an unsung Hero of Heaven as Sera keeps their exploits hidden, something Adam is shown to be uncomfortable with, we see multiple times he is proud of his work and dislikes Heaven keeps it on the down low. At the end of the day he fought for what he believed in with true, pure convictions. He fought monsters and was incapable as seeing them as anything but monsters even in his final moments because in all of history not a single sinner redeemed themselves. The sad irony being the first Sinner to do so only happened to do so due to Adams direct involvement and intervention. He died ignorant that he had a direct hand in redeeming the first sinner ever. Do I think vivziepop thought of any of that when making the show? Hell no, but that's part of Adams charm, he was ironically the most HUMAN of the cast in all the best and worst ways and on some level most viewers resonate with that.

@@avery2041 When exactly did Charlie say that sinners are innocent? Point out the exact episode and scene. There's a difference between saying that a person can be redeemed and that they did nothing wrong. Only an idiot doesn't know.

​@@LeonReal77 While i don't know if Charlie directly said that, that is how shes portraying them to the angels. That's why the line comes up at all in reference to the sinners.

It may have been the angel girl actually. I know she said something along the lines of "those poor innocent souls!" Charlie seems implied that she thinks ALL of them are simply uwu innocent beans

Allegedly she wants to make a third show focused on Humans/Earth and its supposed to be the evilest setting of them all. And honestly there's something novel about that, show how Humanity can supersede the literal incarnations/manifestations of sin itself...but yeah it will likely just be more degenerate cringe.

@@Kushrada zoophobia?

@@Sonic2024freedomera Is that what's she's calling it? Only heard bits and pieces so far. Again I think its an interesting Idea for her to do, am just unsure how it'd go considering Hell of a boss to me isn't that good while Hazbin is good but just needs some better pacing and focus.

@@Kushrada no, it is another story about hell

Were they actually threatening living humans?

@@ethancox9737 I.M.P. do it for a living, although they are hellborn. As for sinners, I dunno. Is it ever said they aren't a threat?

@@seabass5892 Right, I remember them.

@@ethancox9737 I.M.P are hellborn paid by sinners to go to earth to kill Humans, in most cases creating more Sinners. This kills humans and accelerates Hells population Crisis. So yes, Sinners are a direct threat to Humanity as even in hell they can spread misery, loss and death to Earth.

@@Kushrada that actually makes so much sense lol! I completely overlooked that, but yeah, I.M.P is literally making Charlie’s goal harder and harder to reach

You can be both, doing a good thing, while still enjoy killing the thing that only causes problems.

@engpol-1036 You're absolutely wrong. If you enjoy killing people, you are evil. There is absolutely no argument about it. The fact that there are terrible people in hell is no excuse. Take, for example, Marvel's Punisher. One of the few qualities that keeps him from being a villain is that he's not a psychotic sadist. He kills people, but does it only out of duty. Second, the overpopulation in hell is not causing heaven any problems at all. The fear of an uprising sounds like nothing more than paranoia. Let's add the fact that Adam decided to double the attacks with no other reason than desire. Carmilla herself pointed out how much the population fell that year. Oh, I almost forgot, the majority of heaven is completely unaware of this whole matter, so again, it's not causing them any problems. Its pathetic how hard you're trying to be right.

@@LeonReal77 Sinner claws wrote this comment.

@@LeonReal77 A lot of things in the pilot were retconned in order to fit the new story. Since in the original story the exterminations were done in the means to deal with overpopulation and heaven was likely aware of them. In this new one however, it's done to keep hell from rising against heaven and not to deal with overpopulation since in the beginning Charlie knows this is the real reason while reading it out of a book so it's not "hell's population is out of control". Adam is nothing more than a strawman and is evil, we are supposed to feel no sympathy for him, so of course he would say lines such as these. His death along with Sir Pentious's were jokes when it could have been epic, like Adam could have had a beam struggle with Sir Pentious's ship while Sir Pentious could have done serious damage to Adam.

@@LeonReal77 "The fact that there are terrible people in hell is no excuse" Sinners live in HELL for a reason, they're all murderers, rapist, cannibals and much more. If anything you could make an argument that Sinners are worse than the Hellborn. Should the Hellborn suffer with food and resource problems due to the ever consuming and ever growing horde Sinners, which they have no way of regulating? "Punisher kills people, but does it only out of duty" So is Adam, he takes orders from Sera and God to kill sinners, what's your point? You are right about Sera being paranoid and heaven not having an overpopulation problem.

So... If the situation had a completely different context resulting in a completely different moral debate??

Not really, since it's still a child in Hell.

@@engpol-1036 Wait, I forgot about that. They're still in hell, that child somehow did something to deserve going to hell anyway.

@@engpol-1036 You're sure it wouldn't change your opinion at all?

​@@ethancox9737 The kid's in hell my guy. We see that many demons don't strictly have to look the age they were when they died. And while the show is trying to laud the mystery of what qualifies as sin or not, we can really only work from our understanding. If the one under threat was human, or angel, that would probably change it. But this is a sinner. Regardless of if the marks are of a cannibal or anything else, they're there for an in universe reason.

also, redemptions logically can only coexist with exterminations, because there obviously won't be enough redemptions per year to counter the hell's ever increasing population, so you still need someone to clean it up for you.