Love the comments, thanks guys! Many comments from folks correctly questioning the RP600's high sensitivity spec, but whatever the actual spec is many RP600 owners are finding joy with low power amps! The naysayers are merely speculating, based on guessing. When it comes to opinions, they carry more weight when they're based on experience.
Not Steve, but for such large and insensitive speakers I would really consider getting something a bit more powerful. My audio dealer has those speakers and bi-amps them with tubes driving the highs/mids and solid state driving the woofers. I use a similar set up for my Tannoys which are 90dB/w efficient
You open a window on a world of equipment and music quite unlike anyone on the internet. While I might not always share your taste in music, your insights and knowledge are priceless. Thank you.
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay Agree with all you say. I think the problem in understanding that low watt amps can sound great, even outside the midrange, arises from a misunderstanding from audio newcomers without a science background that sensitivity is a logarithmic scale because output is measured logarithmically using dB. Some horn loaded speakers are tens of times more sensitive in linear scale output /watt than the industry typical 90db/W at 1m. This sensitivity level has set modern consumer expectations for amp power without many consumers understanding why that is. It isn't magic, it's physics. Equally, even a modest seeming 3dB/W difference in sensitivity as I experienced in a DALI opticon vs my Fyne Audio F303s made the same CXA60 Cambridge Audio amp at the same volume seem a bit anaemic until I turned it up a smidge and considered the speakers' other attributes. It's subjective of course. There's also Hofmann's iron law and other factors that suggest aiming for higher sensitivity isn't a free lunch from a design perspective, which is why the La Scala is far from svelte. Consumer tastes for modest sized speakers with powerful bass influences the design of those speakers and their amplification requirements. Hence the idea that you need at least 100W/channel and maybe more to really feel the music (and go deaf) The phrase low power is maybe incorrect. "Appropriately powered" amps might be better.
Years ago I listened to a 1watt per channel David Berning amplifier drive a pair of Klipsh floor standing R-f7 speakers to loud levels and the sound was fabulous .
Just finished ACA kit #2. Playing these two amps or the reisong a10 through my Klipsch rp280f speakers, I have no problem filling my large house with music. Great topic, here!
Love my low watt SET Unison Research Simply Italy tube amplifier driving my Pure Audio Project Trio 15. And man, it goes really loud and really deep. Steve is absolutely right.
As one gets older and wiser in the hi-fi game, you begin to realize how less and less you need to "Rock Da House" like when you were much much younger. Steve hit the mark on this one, again. It is vey much about quality over quantity.
"Hey Hun, what should we listen to tonight?" "Um...I dunno. Let's see what Guttenberg is playing." Beyond the music discovery, for me, this was just one of your best videos. Thanks!
Steve, you’re so right. I always thought, the more watts the better. I live in a basement apartment on Long Island and realized after purchasing an onkyo 75 wpc solid state, that I never listen to loud music except for headphone listening. So about 6 months ago I got the A10. I love it!!!!!! I mostly listen to old jazz now, and I’m in audiophile heaven.thanks Steve
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay Would you just go away. Here's an idea, why don't you create a streaming website that caters only to the elites of society such as you claim to be and leave youtube to the rest of us filthy peasants.
Several years ago I built an ELEKIT TU-870R with my son, who was about ten years old at that time. Two watts per channel through a pair of 6BM8s. We hooked it up to my Focal Chorus 706s for testing... holy crap. In every good way, it blew me away. Deep, detailed, airy, and way more 'oomph' than I would ever have expected. No problem filling a decent-sized room with more than enough sound.
I built two Amp Camp Amps over two separate long weekends. I have a fair amount of kit building experience (built many HeathKits back in the day), and the best advice I can give is to take your time and not rush the build. While not a terribly difficult kit to build, it does require going back and forth between two different sets of instructions to get the full picture of how to assemble the chassis and to view the wiring layout. Anyway, my kits worked on the first power-up to the slow and deliberate approach paid off. They are driven in mono-block to a pair of Klipsch RP600 Ms (fed by a Schitt Freya+ preamp with NOS Raytheon mil-spec tubes which are a bit of an overkill). The sound is glorious. I don't quite understand the RP's nay sayers. I totally agree with Steve, i.e. the better you feed the RPs, the better they sound
Hi Andy, did the exact same, aca mono blocks with the RP’s and the Freya plus with some tube rolling. Somehow I like the aca’s running in stereo instead of mono, I find they have better resolution. Did you also try this?
@@ThatsKorny Michael, Before I built the second amp, I was running the first amp, in stereo of course and even that alone sounded very good. I am spending some time with the pair in balanced mono block on a variety of music, but your idea is intriguing. How have you configured the stereo operation? I am still learning all the possibilities! And what tubes do you like?
@@apvalenti I did the same, built amp 1 and played in stereo mode for about 2 months and was very happy with quality, sound stage, reasonable transparency, I rolled a GTE 6sn7 GTB old stock, then supplemented it with the newest REL mini sub, then went to the mono block with the second amp, but seems to have lost something, very neutral and warm but seems to lose a bit of separation. Feel free to email me if you want to talk more, mkornhaber@gmail.com
I bought the Reisong A10 and a pair of Klipsch RP-600M based on your recommendations about half a year ago, and I absolutely love them. I play CDs and Records, and they sound phenomenal. I’m super happy with my system. Thank you, Steve.
Steve listening to you the past few months has motivated me. I pulled my Marantz 4270 out of storage, bought a new cart and stylus for my Technics SL-D2, and am now listening to vinyl again. Since I took the bigger RF-3-II's for the "stereo" I bought a set of the Klipsch RP-160M's for the family room 5 channel AV stuff and am very impressed with those little beasts as well. Thanks for the virtual kick in the tail to get me moving/listening again!
Right on, Steve! I’ve got a pair of Klipsch KG3.2s from the early’90s. I drive them with a Sansui AU-555 integrated amp, 20 watts per channel, that I bought on Rush Street, in Chicago, back in the summer of 1972. The amp rarely gets turned up past 30% power, and it fills my space with luscious, warm music. Still , I do daydream about building an Ampcamp kit! 🔥👍👍
My 807SE amp puts out about 0.3W-0.4 into my 16 ohms Altec speakers. (All designed and built by yours truly.) It does go pretty loud and low, can reach 100dB/m, and I do get potent content below 20Hz. It opened a new dimension on playing Prodigy, LOL! :) Before this little amp, I had no idea Prodigy had such textured and varied bass lines - even on superb systems it sounds as boom - boom - boom... :) Plays Mahler symphonies, Pink Floyd albums and Mike Oldfield's new Return to Ommadawn with the feel of live concerts. Not blow your ears loud, still, loud enough to give a feel of a live rock concert. Indeed, low power amplification is underrated. However, to be truthful, the "little" amp has a massive power supply capable of feeding a 300W amp. The feel of impact and base comes from the reserves of the power supply. The power limits the raw maximum SPL, but tells little otherwise of the sonic qualities. With 86dB/Wm low sensitivity Mirage 760 speakers this same amp puts out about a watt of power, but it's still enough to get a feel as if The Cranberries were having a live concert in my living room. Again, not enough for the hearing impaired, but enough to give a major adrenaline rush - with clear, undistorted sound.
I recently sold my old B&W DM 110i speakers to a gentleman who inherited a vintage Marantz 2010 receiver. With 10WPC, It was a great combination. So much so, that the buyer is now researching turntables and better DACs. So, I guess you can say: “my work here is finally done “.
I have the Klipsch RP 600M , the Kef LS50 with the Reisong A10 and the Denon PM600 NE.The Klipsch with the Reisong A10 sounds fenomenal.I can,t stop listening to this combination the KT88 tubes sounds very good too with a little bit more base as the EL34.Thank you very much for this very nice video👍
I own a monster of an amp with over 125 WRMS x 5. I also have the A10. The monster amp is good for home theater but for music the A10 is sweetest. Also, tube rolling can be a lot of fun as it changes the amps sound. Both amps drive my Elac Debut 2.0 F6s (87dB) very well.
I love conceptual videos like this. I've got a Nobsound 6P1 (that's the tube that powers the input/output) 6.3 W per channel tube amp and I absolutely love it! I got a pair of floor standing Fluance X8LF speakers and they get plenty loud, more than I need and the sound-stage is quite broad and holographic, at least to my ears. The sound is very rich and with the addition of some Russian 6P1P tubes the bass goes down lower than before most wonderfully. I've got a Zen Triode on order and I'm sure it's going to get to me one of these days, but until I'm very satisfied with the watts that I gots. ;) My solid state amp is a Schiit Vidar with 100Watts into 8 ohms and it's very clean and a wonderful amp. But something about tubes makes things better.
I am playing Wharfdale Diamond 9.0's off a 5 watt 6 ohms amp on a secondary system in my conservatory - full of hard surfaces, and while the volume is not there the sound quality is and the volume is more than adequate for the purpose! Able to throw away the cheap speakers that came with the system, utilise redundant speakers and am very satisfied with a result I did not expect.
Hey Steve, this is a great rundown about using low power amps. I got into the DIY audio projects years ago and built from scratch a pair 2A3 single end triode amps from an article in sound practice magazine. They made around 3.5 watts depending on the harmonic distortion. I absolutely loved them, and listened to them exclusively for years. I had them hooked up to ProAc studio 1’s 89 dB or ProAc super towers 90 or 91 dB sensitivities. I have a Conrad-Jonson premier 11,70 watts , that sat in the corner as backup. I was in smaller rooms usually, and I am not a loud listener, but things could get loud enough to bother others in the house. But most importantly, the music was wonderful. I am so glad that you expanded that more power, and better quality are not tied together. All to often quality and quantity are used interchangeably, and this is a great example demonstrating that they are not. Sometimes more is just more.
Hi, my name is Carey, and I'm a tube-a-holic. I'm running an Emotiva SE8 subwoofer (for bass management, as well as bass extension) into an A10 driving Klipsch RB 61 IIs. I have the Klipschs on stands as near field monitors at my computer desk, and 80 db average is no problem. I could go higher, but I value my hearing. ;-D I find the combination of the A10 and the Klipsch bookshelves amazing. The A10 measures as being rolled off above 2,000 Hz, but that's not a problem, because the Klipsch speakers are bright enough (especially near field) that they balance each other out. Next year, I'm planning on setting up a dedicated listening room. I'm looking at a Boyuurange Reisong A50 (300B tubes, 7.6 wats/channel) driving either Klipsch RP-600Ms, Triangle Genese Trios, or Zu Dirty Weekends. I'm leaning towards the Dirty Weekends, depending on when Zu offers them again.
Chuck Harris 6 years ago I built Engineer, Gordon Rankin's "Bugle 45" power amp. It uses the 1930's # 45 tube capable of only 2 watts output power. I built speaker cabinets 47 inches tall, 24 inches wide and 16 inches deep. In the bottom of the speaker cabinet is an "Eminence Delta Pro" 15 inch speaker, with 80 ounce magnet and 101.6 db sensitivity. In the top of the speaker cabinet is a JBL 939 midrange and tweeter configuration at 94 db sensitivity. An Eico ST 84 preamp with upgrades, which drives the Power Bugle 45 amp. You can't believe the "sound quality" and how loud this thing can get. I will never get rid of it.
I remember my school time and somebody I knew well who wanted to start his own what we called back then "drive in disco", basically a DJ with his gear. Only he did not have all gear yet. Just many records, two idler wheel turn tables and speakers. But I had an old 1X30W Philips tube amplifier with 6 mono mixing channels. And I lend it to him. This one X 30W amplifier was enough to power a party of about 100 people and rock the joint. Later he added a 2 x 175 W RMS, amplifier to his gear and then an other friend of mine build an additional 2 x 250W RMS amplifier + two more speakers (if you powered it on, the lights would dip for the inrush current) By that time you could literally empty the venue by turning up the volume knob.
Hi Steve, I follow your tips. I bought a pair of RP-600M. Now I drive it with a DIY amplifier class AB with old Japan MOS J50 and K135; great music come out from the klipsch. I m starting to build a tubes amplifier with EL84 valves ( like Dacwere, 2W per channel). Thanks a lot
Mega OT. Who is the typical audiophile. 1. Mostly male. 2. Mostly middle age or aged. 3.His musical interest goes beyond one genre. 4. Insatiable curiosity about hi fi components. 5.His best speaker his the next one. 6 Dedicates at least one hour of pure musical listening daily. 7.He's happy with background music while doing other things. 9. While watching movies pays a lot of attention to the sound effects and considers a real torture having no other option but incorporated TV speakers. 10. His audiophile's best friend rig sounds better even though it is cheaper then his. Did I forget anything. Open for suggestions
I assembled Japanese DIY Elekit TU-8200R SET amp with 8 WPC and plugget it into Omega Alnico high output monitors (USA) with 97 dB. The volume pot cannot exceed 9 o'clock if I do not want to disturb my neighbors. An excellent combination, a beautiful sound.
Amp power, in a given iteration, and how far to get with its stated wattage output is relative to speaker efficiency and the overall load it presents, as has been pointed out. Some speakers with complex, passive cross-overs can drain many a (on paper) higher powered amp so to make its rated output power and claimed speaker sensitivity a nebulous number - i.e.: far lower than what specs would suggest - just as well as a rugged, well-developed PSU of a power amp can make few watts seem somewhat "larger" being more resilient to speaker load. The perhaps more pressing matter is maintaining an effortless presentation at every SPL one would care for (not least live levels) with a range of speaker loads and typically low to moderate sensitivity, and this mostly requires much more power than one would imagine, while it may seem at first that less would do.
I’ve had my 2.3 watt Decware for about 2 months with RP600Ms. Recently purchased a set of Heresy IVs and they sound awesome, plenty enough volume for my taste!
Hi Steve. Recently I moved to low power amps and really liked them. I think they do something, like the immediacy and coherence of sound that few expensive high power amps can do. However I am struggling to find makers of high sensitivity speakers. Despite the big low sensitivity ecosystem, the high sensitivity looks like limited to few popular brands like Klipsch, Zu audio and omega and other more expensive like Devore fidelity and audio note. Would you make a video about high sensitivity loudspeaker, the makers and your opinion about this market?
Steve it's not apples to apples but man my little 5 watt tube guitar amp hooked up to a 2x12 cabinet absolutely rips....easily keeps up with a heavy handed drummer. My 35 watt tube integrated hifi plays way louder than practical and always sounds dynamic while also being very inviting sounding.
@@solarfall2728 yup. As posted, not an apples to apples comparison. But if a five watt tube guitar amp can drive two 12 inch speakers to volumes that keep up with a heavy handed drummer it is worth noting. The idea that high power = better is misunderstood in general, not just with hifi enthusiasts.
Steve, I previously commented on your A10 review video, but I'll comment again here. I'm absolutely smitten with my A10 combined with my Klipsch R-15Ms. I recently purchased R-51Ms with this amp in mind but the R-15Ms are slightly more sensitive, and being somewhat shallower, look better in the room where I have the A10. This combination can play louder than I have ever played music in this room, and the amp doesn't break a sweat. Thanks for leading me down the path to better sound.
Another great review video from Steve. Steve said he wanted to hear about others' experiences with low power tube amps, so here's mine. The speakers that I use with the low power tube amps: Main speakers: Caintuck Audio Betsy open baffle speakers (95 dB per Watt efficiency in the open baffle dipole configuration, 5.9 Ohm nominal impedance) Subwoofer: Caintuck Audio 12" Alpha Bass open baffle powered subwoofer (with Dayton Audio SA-100 100 W subwoofer plate amplifier with crossover) handling frequencies at 125 Hz and below. Super Tweeters: Aperion Audio MKII Planar-Ribbon Super Tweeter Pair with the high pass frequency set at 10 kHz The low power tube amps that I use: MP-301 Mk3 Deluxe: 6.5 W per channel Thumbnail review: Most punchy and dynamic of the three amps listed here. Best pace, rhythm, and timing (PRAT) of these three amps. Excellent clarity with some tubey richness and resonance, but not as rich and resonant as the other two amps. Special affinity with guitar recordings. KOHSTAR Old Buffalo 6C19 Tube amplifier: 6 W per channel Thumbnail review: Midway in punchiness, dynamics, PRAT, and tubey richness of these three amps. A great all rounder. Cayin HA-1A version 1: 1.2 W per channel Triode mode 2.2 W per channel Ultralinear mode Thumbnail review: Punchier and more dynamic in Ultralinear mode, but richer and more resonant in Triode mode. Even in Ultralinear mode, it is not quite as punchy and dynamic as the Old Buffalo. In Triode mode, it is the richest and most resonant of these three amps. However, it's lack of dynamics and punch make it unsuitable for large orchestral works and high power rock, pop, soul, and blues music. But it is the best of these three amps for more laid back and intimate recordings. All three amps have excellent soundstage depth and width, with the soundstage expanding well beyond the outer sides of the speakers if the recording has that spatial information, such as the Chesky binaural recording of Wycliffe Gordon's album "Dream of New Orleans." Instrument localization is very good, but not with artificially etched edges so that the sounds have a more natural and realistic blend or connectivity throughout the soundstage such as I have heard in live, unamplified concerts. The images have body and weight - there's meat on the bones, as they say. Transients are fairly fast, but not artificially nor edgily fast, and there is very good sustain of the note decays. Tonality is excellent with faithful reproduction of instrumental timbres and overtones. The bass is fairly taut and articulate, but not as taut and articulate as some other speakers and subwoofers used with higher powered solid state amplifiers. That being said, the bass is definitely not muddy, wooly, nor flabby with these amps and speakers, but neither is it the last word in tightness and articulation. Note that I listen in a small room in the near-field of the speakers about 4-5 feet away from the speakers with the speakers about 3 feet from the wall behind them. I like jazz, standards, broadway, exotica, blues, soul, folk, classical, opera/lieder, and some pop-rock music, but not hard, metal, punk, or grunge rock.
Used an Audio Innovations (defunkt UK company) series 300 which claimed 12wpc but on review produced about 9wpc. The little pentode tubes produced a really lively sound full of musical expression and instrumental timbre. It made all the solid state amps sound sterile. Worked great with B&W 110 and Impulse H6 horn loaded loudspeakers. Moved on to a KT88 kit amp at 28wpc. This was better at low bass and more even sounding but lost some of the immediacy of the 9wpc amp and failed to pull out as much of the micro dynamic expression and emotion, whether it be rock guitar playing, vocals, classical or even Japanese drumming. I still have both amps and the horns; you’ve made me think about getting them set up again.
I have a Audion Silver Night 300B power tube amp with volume control,it is rated at only 7 watts in pure class A,no feedback and hard wired,my speakers are from Audiovector the R-1 Signature,i play in a small room only 4x5 meters and boy its sounds really good deep bass and very transparant and above all very smooth.
I have my Klipsch Heresy's for main L and R, using that A10 tube amp, its feeding from Denon X3500H AVR pre-outs. This works for movies too, i just calibrated the A10 amps own volume knob + pre-out levels to match the other speakers. I settled to Denon's pre-out level at almost max and the A10 volume knob only needs to be around 9 clock for best signal to noise ratio, calibration to match the ref volume scale displayed on the Denon's display. I rarely go over 80dB in my apartment so this works nicely ! I can now listen whole day without any fatigue compared to plain Denon's solid state. Currently using 6N2P-EV pre and Tung-Sol EL34B power tubes.
I have an RME ADI-2 DAC feeding two balanced monoblock Amp Camp amps powering a pair of Zu Omen DWs. Not only does it sound superb, it can get uncomfortably loud in my room. And I like loud. That said, as monoblocks they put out 15 watts each. But for the money, it's killer.
If you don't need to give yourself permanent hearing damage and tinnitus by listening at deafening concert hall headbanging volume levels, you don't need a lot of power. I have a Jolida JD102B 25w/channel EL84 integrated amp, which I converted from ultralinear to triode operation, cutting the power in half, and I use to drive a pair of small Cerwin Vega SL5M bookshelf speakers which have sensitivity of only 85db, and I still never get past 9 to 10 o'clock on the volume control on the Jolida in my small room, before it's too loud for my ears to handle, but it still sounds gloriously lifelike, dynamic, and three dimensional. It's all about good synergy between components.
My first amp, circa 1967, was an 8 watt either Heatkit or Dynaco amp, with my dad’s garrard TT and a pair of Koss gel filled headphones. Sounded great to me. Maybe it’s time to go back and try one of these.
I use a couple of TA2024 Class D power amps hooked up to a pair of low-efficiency Acoustic Energy AE1 MK2 speakers with a Creek OBH-22 passive pre and it's sublime! The amplifier set up shifted my Cyrus Pre and mono blocks and even an Audio Note Pre I had at one stage. I've also tried the AEs with some serious watts from Rotel and I stick with the tiny Class D box. The boss at Audio Note UK called me a 'heathen'... It was in jest, absolute top bloke as are you Steve :D I have a few other set ups with Alexander SE2 speakers, TDL Studio 0.5s and so on but all powered by the little amps. I try other amps but keep coming back to these. The circuit board is the Helder HiFi TA2024 Mk2.
Owned a Sansui 200 receiver with 5 wpc RMS with 1% THD. It was powerful enough and sounded sweet. I miss it Naim makes 50 watt amps that drive any speaker. Thing is, you only get 3dB each time you double power. It takes 10dB to make sound seem twice as loud and 6dB to make sound appreciably louder. So, take my 5w Sansui (you should!). Double it twice to 20w to get only 6dB. You have to get 30w to make it seem twice as loud. To do that again, you need 180 watts per channel! So, the first watt is surely very important as we rarely exceed that on decently sensitive loudspeakers after all.
Moved from Naim Xs to Reisong A10 with BW 706s2 and totally happy. Miss some grunt, punch and pace?...maybe, but now I can hear music whithout the sensation of disturbing everybody
Cheers Steve, you have had me smiling tonight! Neither my main or office system makes it to 10W and they continue to surprise those that get to sit and listen and them. Speaker choice is all important and both have a pair of single driver Omega Loudspeakers.
I love my old and simple but well-made form follows function design Don Garber Fi 2A3's, the 3.5 watts really surprised me. Can drive the 86dB 2-way speakers on hand but really better suited to the 89 - 90dB 2-way's (and higher), all of the "easy-load" speaker category. Still, at comparable listening levels, there is an "ease", a difference in terms of speed and dynamics when driving the 92dB Mark Audio or the 96dB Fostex wide-band drivers in my collection of gear. I'm now leaning toward front horn designs. Perhaps one of these days I'll get to play around with something from Voxitiv and or Cube Audio F8 Neo drivers. Btw, how about giving us single-digit SET amp reviews of some of the 2K - 12K $$$ range? I'd like to have a better idea of what's worth having these days and what to run from, not that I'd expect you to address the latter, LOL! You know, going on specs, build quality, and parts used, I'm having a hard time understanding how some of the current products are getting away with what they are charging. A lot of expensive gear with slick-looking cosmetics on the outside only to have cheap circuit boards and low-cost parts written up to give the impression of quality parts when they're anything but. Years spent in bookstores (remember bookstores?), reading Vacuum Tube Valey and Glass Audio (most articles were over my head), have me critically looking at product and wanting to barf when I see what the new gear cost, even on the used market! Oh, and maybe review a kit like the Bottlehead new MonoAmour 2A3 and Elekit TU-8600S?
Funny to see remarks about the RP-600M’s. I’ve owned them for about a year. They’re quite amazing . The price has dropped a little making them an absolute bargain. I recently added the REL 5 Ti subwoofer and I’m just blown away by my sound sound system.
Thanks, Steve, for your insightful reviews. Long ago, I settled on a Cary 300-SEI amp, matched to Jamo Concert 8 speakers, and I have never wanted to upgrade these. I have admired your views since the old Listener days.
@@seanmangan2769 I’m running the DECware SE84UFO, so am already familiarly with the 6BQ5/EL84. Currently running a pair of very nice 7189a for output; the room is small so I never want for volume. My second setup will be a much larger room, and Kevin from glowinthedark.com has said very good things about 6L6 SE amps. :)
I understand you review new equipment. That said i recently rediscovered a vintage kenwood KA-701. It is not about the wattage (60 watts) it is about the involvement into the music. No caps in the audio stages makes it very precise and speedy without being edgy. And it is known to have one of the best phono stages. The level of detail, depth, soundstage and detail blows away alot of current gear. No, it is not a romantic sounding amp. But it gets out of the way and brings the performers into the room. And the reason, I bring this amp up, $200 - $450 street price. Fits right in your low power amp price range.
I voiced the amp camp amp and the korg B1 preamp on a pair of Klipsch RP 5000 S speakers after I constructed both. They were all a gift for my son and the sound was amazingly powerful for such a low wattage amplifier. Another commentor suggested to choose which way you want to go and I think that’s the best answer.
I have the Reisong using with 35 year old Castle Chester speakers sensitivity is 90db never have volume above 60% on volume knob plenty loud enough and so magical
Soo, I've got a Marantz PM6006 (45W in 8ohms). I focused more on having a pair of speakers that were easier to drive and finally settled on the Triangle Borea BR03, which is a GREAT match. I get the soundstage, the punchyness, the clarity I need from this system and it's also relatively affordable. Just completed my setup with a Network Streamer, the NA6006, from the same range and man, do these sound impressive together! (With Ecrosse RCA analogue cables) Also, to top things up, I learned that Spotify is launching lossless CD-quality streaming (with Spotify Connect, supported by the NA6006!) later this year, what a treat!
For the 600m, do keep in mind that the 96gb claimed isn't across the frequency spectrum. While they do hit 96db for a certain frequency range, much of the speaker's range is a good 10db less .
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac I was really impressed with the pair I had and I wouldn't want to dissuade anyone from trying these. I did expect more from a 96db rated speaker, especially after running some Zu's with the exact same gear. When that didn't quite pan out as expected I was a bit peeved to see how they came up with that number. In my room they did Ok with a little power and I think they were killer when I gave them a lot.
Funny I come across this while being lazy in the garage listening to music and looking through TH-cam.. I’ve got 2,000 square-feet down here, and all I use is a 28 year old Sony 2-channel stereo powering a pair of Infinity Reference 2000.3 bookshelf speakers with about 15 watts each. Clean, clear, and loud enough to fill the space to my liking.
I'm using Klipsch R 51m at 93dm and Q acoustic 3050 floor standers at 92db. I use them both with my home built single ended 4w class A valve amp and they sound fantastic.
Hi, last summer I bought the Reisong A10 which I use together with DIY Cornwall clones, Klonwall. I also use a Schitt preamplifier for my Lenco L78S. Plenty of quality sound in my 25 x 20 feet living room. All equipment bought after your recommandations Steve. Couldn't be happier with a total investment of only 1700 euro. I am also going to buy the RP 600 I think, out of curiosity. Maarten, Netherlands
Pure gold Steve. It's what we need to hear about Audio. I'm running dual Leak TL12s at 12 watts each and I use them to drive the infamous ELAC UB 5s. The sound is surprisingly good but, of course, I'm always wondering what more efficient speakers would do. Thanks for this video
I hope this one gets lots of views as it couldn't be more spot-on. I run either an 18 watt First Watt SIT3 with a Pass P12 pre or an 8 watt Boyuu Reisong a50 both with a Denefrips Pontis DAc. I am in a smallish room with speakers of my own design and build. I have yet to find myself wishing for more volume or dynamics.
My amp has 0 watts. It's the best amp ever, because I get to imagine how great it would sound instead of actually hearing any sound, and not being satisfied with the sound.
I went from a stereo power amp, 2x20 watt (300b tubes), to two monos 2x1,5 watt (45 tubes) from TW Acustic, Germany, and I got so much in quality. The TWs will stay forever in my system. My speakers are 96dB in sensitivity.
Audiophiliac is so right. First time I ever heard such a low watt tube amp in a store it just blew my mind. But I have a problem/lack of knowledge here. Will 50 year old KLH model 30 acoustic suspension speakers work with these low power amps?
Great topic! Just went through this process myself but got slightly different results. Have a Decware Zen and tried 1) KEF q150 about 86db and 2) Klipsch 600m about 96db And if I’m honest BOTH speakers after about 80db with any bass in the track whatsoever started clipping/distorting quite audibly. (Acoustic / lighter music you could go up to 85db with clean sound.) it was just too quiet under 80db for me to enjoy the music in my smaller 10x12 room. So my next move was trying some Omega monitor speakers rated at 94-95db BELOW the Klipsch but clean volume is almost DOUBLE! Klipsch over rating the sensitivity?? No comparison in volume. Can hit 85-90db cleanly on the Omegas. Wanted to share in case anyone else thinking of these combinations. Decware is 2.3 watts and sounds unbelievably good. But only a HANDFUL of speakers match it in my opinion. Reisong A10 at 6 watts may drive the Klipsch to a nicer volume I’d guess.
I built a Reisong A9, which I think is very similar to the A10 in a different chassis. It is a revelation. I suggest trying some old stock 6SL7 preamp tubes. There is a lot of tweaking to try, check out DIY audio.
I also have an A9. It quit working (just hums loud). Someday I'll get around to fixing it. Nice sounding little amp. Using a Riesong MT-88 mk II right now. Way overkill for my 100dB EV speakers, but I was thinking someday of getting small speakers and figure it doesn't hurt to have too much power on hand. I love the sound I get with it!
gurdyman1 mine has very low hum, but using 91 db audio monitor silver S6. I want to get a pair of Klipsch eventually. I see that some mod increase the filter cap, size. The west problem with mine was the input jacks were junk. I ditched the jacks and switching board and went with a DPST switch to select and new phono jacks. The supplied preamp tubes has different gain, which really became apparent when switching to 6SL7. I added grid resistors cathode bypass caps to the preamp tubes as well. Very simple mods.
It is not low wattage per se that makes the sound good. It's the simplicity and purity of a small single ended tube or class-A SS amp that makes them sound so transparent and un-artificial. They can be great with any speaker but unbeatable with high-efficiency speakers
I thought about your comment and would like to add that also the small need of current, a simple acdc supply with only little interaction with the amplified music has a positive influence.
My favourite low power amplifier in my collection will always be my Quad II valve mono power amps from back in the 50;s. I'm sure they push more than they state, but are magnificent with my Quad electrostatic 57's, and also my Klipsch La Scala.. audio heaven.
I have a pair of Antique Sound Labs monoblock amplifiers rated at 8 watts. And a pair of Klipsch Heresy HWO speakers. The sound is astonishing and will blow you out of the room. Now I'm curious to see how low in watts I can go with them.
I have a collection of 70's monster receivers. Like the Kenwood model 11G. But my Reisong A10 just blows me away. Not sure it could drive a sub but a fantastic amp.
Again a very nice video Steve, great music reviews. My humble 2 cents as a rule of thumb for small amps....and yes, they can sound like they were built by angels. The efficiency of the speaker is important information about the interaction with a petite amplifier but it does not tell the whole story. Some types of speakers actually always work well with small amplifiers, full horns, so also in the bass, such as a Klipsch LaScala and small bookshelf speakers, as here in the video. In these two cases, the small amplifier does not have to control a large bass cone, but the speaker dampens itself quite well. There are large conventional bass speakers with high efficiency. Some might work well, such as Steve's Cornwalls, because the bass diaphragm is relatively hard sprung, just like in a guitar amp. I'd be interested in Steve's impression of whether that works. But I have, for example, big old 15 inch Tannoy Canterbury in normal bass reflex cabinets. They don't work at all with small amps, like my Leak Stereo 20 or an Audion 300B. Even if the efficiency of the Tannoy is huge. A small 6 watt amp can't drive the big heavy bass cone in a controlled way if it is soft sprung and has 260 liters of air in the cabinet. Therefore, with small amplifiers in combination with speakers with high efficiency, my tip is to take small bookshelf speakers or bass horns or bigger speakers with a stiff cone suspension.
Bit of a counterpoint. I have some 88db speakers (Swan Diva 4.1) I was powering with a Rotel RA 1520 rated (conservatively they say) at 2 x 60 watts per channel for many years. On a hunch I then subbed in a class D power amp, first a Crown XLS 1002 at 200+ watts per channel and then a XTZ a300 at 300 watts per channel. Oh my god pumping all those watts into low efficiency speakers completely changed the game. The speakers came alive and I could hear every nuance of every note and the proverbial veil was lifted. Nothing subtle about it. I ended up fronting with an inexpensive tube pre amp to bring a little tube goodness to it but I can't imagine deliberately underpowering speakers again.
I've written here on this channel's comments area a number of times about my system... a Decware SE84UFO amplifier.. 2.3 wpc with CJ PV5 preamp manufactured in 1984 and Zu Omen MKII DW's with clarity caps. As Zu's Sean Casey talks about in his famous TH-cam interview with John Atkinson... After mechanical inefficiencies, heat and crossovers eat up all the power maybe ONLY a half watt actually reach the drivers in your acoustic suspension style box speaker. For me, the conclusion is that full range designs of guys like Harry Olson and Klipsch are far better for home audio. They are far more sensitive and utilize the far higher quality and purer signal from a single ended triode designed amp which requires NO negative feedback to stabilize it. Steve Deckert of Decware has his own transformers made that deliver a fast and more "true to life" sound than just about anything I've used in 60 years of home audio... so sensitive and transparent that it really brings out the very special attributes of my PV5. The Zu's make my system possible and really compliment and augment what the Decware and PV5 bring to the table. My listening session this weekend included LP's of The Philadelphia Orchestra and Boston Pops. Philly Orch in the late 50's and early 60's were at their pinnacle with their own huge sound. They had a way of doubling on the instrument parts. As a result they were very difficult to record ... overwhelmed many recording systems of the day but when they got it right... My point is that in my 12'x15' room, loud and dynamic was overwhelming which drove my wife to go shopping(the real reason why this hobby is getting expensive ... lol)... in this respect I disagree with Stevey G. Your preamp plays a huge roll in getting a big sound out of a Decware low wattage amp. Steve Deckert has recommended his ZSTAGE gain stage to augment your sound sources ... maybe use in lieu of a preamp for larger, more pure sonics and I will be looking to check this out. In short, in my experience starting as a little kid in early 60's, the acoustic suspension speaker concept as a departure from the far more efficient designs which preceded it has led home audio down a 60 year rabbit hole of wasted materials and energy consumption. In this case bigger is not better!
I keep thinking about the 8W per channel Western Electric tube amps driving WE horns in all those theatres. When I hear these systems in a demo, they are really hard to beat at any price. I run 110W OTL triode monoblocks (Transcendent design). Tubes without transformers have all the crystal clear dynamic punch of solid state but with the palpable tone of triodes. The interesting thing is you can remove half of the tubes and the identical amp runs at 25w / channel. They sound great, but a lot is missing. The low end grunt disappears.
Isn't it also a matter of what Class the amp is using? I used to have a Copland 30W tube amp (Class A) and it played absolutely beautiful and loud, but that amp was very expensive. I now have a Yamaha 2-channel streaming receiver with KEF Q550 and it works really well, but question is if I should look at a tube amp instead to get some more body to the sound?
Love the comments, thanks guys! Many comments from folks correctly questioning the RP600's high sensitivity spec, but whatever the actual spec is many RP600 owners are finding joy with low power amps! The naysayers are merely speculating, based on guessing. When it comes to opinions, they carry more weight when they're based on experience.
Hello Steve, do you know if there is a match between my B&W Nautilus 805 (88dB) and the Luxman L-550AX Mk II (2x20 watt class A / 8 ohm) amp?
Not Steve, but for such large and insensitive speakers I would really consider getting something a bit more powerful. My audio dealer has those speakers and bi-amps them with tubes driving the highs/mids and solid state driving the woofers. I use a similar set up for my Tannoys which are 90dB/w efficient
@@landishagerty6571 B&W 805 are the smallest speakers of the Nautilus serie...
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay excuse me General what was the name of that amplifier?
My experience has been that the RP600M plays no louder than a 89 db rated KEF IQ3 on a 5 watt EL84 se amp.
You open a window on a world of equipment and music quite unlike anyone on the internet. While I might not always share your taste in music, your insights and knowledge are priceless. Thank you.
Thanks for being there!
These album recommendations are golden
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay Agree with all you say. I think the problem in understanding that low watt amps can sound great, even outside the midrange, arises from a misunderstanding from audio newcomers without a science background that sensitivity is a logarithmic scale because output is measured logarithmically using dB. Some horn loaded speakers are tens of times more sensitive in linear scale output /watt than the industry typical 90db/W at 1m. This sensitivity level has set modern consumer expectations for amp power without many consumers understanding why that is. It isn't magic, it's physics. Equally, even a modest seeming 3dB/W difference in sensitivity as I experienced in a DALI opticon vs my Fyne Audio F303s made the same CXA60 Cambridge Audio amp at the same volume seem a bit anaemic until I turned it up a smidge and considered the speakers' other attributes. It's subjective of course. There's also Hofmann's iron law and other factors that suggest aiming for higher sensitivity isn't a free lunch from a design perspective, which is why the La Scala is far from svelte. Consumer tastes for modest sized speakers with powerful bass influences the design of those speakers and their amplification requirements. Hence the idea that you need at least 100W/channel and maybe more to really feel the music (and go deaf) The phrase low power is maybe incorrect. "Appropriately powered" amps might be better.
Always so nice to hear you talk about the music you test your hardware on. So much passion and enthusiasm! Thanks for sharing it with us all. 🙂
Years ago I listened to a 1watt per channel David Berning amplifier drive a pair of Klipsh floor standing R-f7 speakers to loud levels and the sound was fabulous .
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay
Queerical, Spherical, diabolical denizens of the deep.
Just finished ACA kit #2. Playing these two amps or the reisong a10 through my Klipsch rp280f speakers, I have no problem filling my large house with music. Great topic, here!
Love my low watt SET Unison Research Simply Italy tube amplifier driving my Pure Audio Project Trio 15. And man, it goes really loud and really deep. Steve is absolutely right.
As one gets older and wiser in the hi-fi game, you begin to realize how less and less you need to "Rock Da House" like when you were much much younger. Steve hit the mark on this one, again. It is vey much about quality over quantity.
"Hey Hun, what should we listen to tonight?" "Um...I dunno. Let's see what Guttenberg is playing." Beyond the music discovery, for me, this was just one of your best videos. Thanks!
Steve, you’re so right. I always thought, the more watts the better. I live in a basement apartment on Long Island and realized after purchasing an onkyo 75 wpc solid state, that I never listen to loud music except for headphone listening. So about 6 months ago I got the A10. I love it!!!!!! I mostly listen to old jazz now, and I’m in audiophile heaven.thanks Steve
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay Would you just go away. Here's an idea, why don't you create a streaming website that caters only to the elites of society such as you claim to be and leave youtube to the rest of us filthy peasants.
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay Every time steve release a new video here you come spewing incoherent drivel, always talking down at everyone.
@GeneralCurtis3LeMay wow, listen to “private” troller. Surprised anyone gives you one watt of their time. Including your wife
Several years ago I built an ELEKIT TU-870R with my son, who was about ten years old at that time. Two watts per channel through a pair of 6BM8s. We hooked it up to my Focal Chorus 706s for testing... holy crap. In every good way, it blew me away. Deep, detailed, airy, and way more 'oomph' than I would ever have expected. No problem filling a decent-sized room with more than enough sound.
Whatever works for you is the way to go. Regardless of the 'opinions' of others. :D
Amen, brother!
Steve, I absolutely love your videos. You have to be one of the most relatable audiophiles out there. Always entertaining yet always informative.
I built two Amp Camp Amps over two separate long weekends. I have a fair amount of kit building experience (built many HeathKits back in the day), and the best advice I can give is to take your time and not rush the build. While not a terribly difficult kit to build, it does require going back and forth between two different sets of instructions to get the full picture of how to assemble the chassis and to view the wiring layout. Anyway, my kits worked on the first power-up to the slow and deliberate approach paid off. They are driven in mono-block to a pair of Klipsch RP600 Ms (fed by a Schitt Freya+ preamp with NOS Raytheon mil-spec tubes which are a bit of an overkill). The sound is glorious. I don't quite understand the RP's nay sayers. I totally agree with Steve, i.e. the better you feed the RPs, the better they sound
Hi Andy, did the exact same, aca mono blocks with the RP’s and the Freya plus with some tube rolling. Somehow I like the aca’s running in stereo instead of mono, I find they have better resolution. Did you also try this?
@@ThatsKorny Michael, Before I built the second amp, I was running the first amp, in stereo of course and even that alone sounded very good. I am spending some time with the pair in balanced mono block on a variety of music, but your idea is intriguing. How have you configured the stereo operation? I am still learning all the possibilities! And what tubes do you like?
@@apvalenti I did the same, built amp 1 and played in stereo mode for about 2 months and was very happy with quality, sound stage, reasonable transparency, I rolled a GTE 6sn7 GTB old stock, then supplemented it with the newest REL mini sub, then went to the mono block with the second amp, but seems to have lost something, very neutral and warm but seems to lose a bit of separation. Feel free to email me if you want to talk more, mkornhaber@gmail.com
I bought the Reisong A10 and a pair of Klipsch RP-600M based on your recommendations about half a year ago, and I absolutely love them. I play CDs and Records, and they sound phenomenal. I’m super happy with my system. Thank you, Steve.
yep im getting up in years and the low lush power of tube amps ROCK my world
I am using a 6.5 W per channel integrated amp with a pair of 90dB B&Ws and it works very well indeed!!!
Steve listening to you the past few months has motivated me. I pulled my Marantz 4270 out of storage, bought a new cart and stylus for my Technics SL-D2, and am now listening to vinyl again. Since I took the bigger RF-3-II's for the "stereo" I bought a set of the Klipsch RP-160M's for the family room 5 channel AV stuff and am very impressed with those little beasts as well.
Thanks for the virtual kick in the tail to get me moving/listening again!
Right on, Steve! I’ve got a pair of Klipsch KG3.2s from the early’90s. I drive them with a Sansui AU-555 integrated amp, 20 watts per channel, that I bought on Rush Street, in Chicago, back in the summer of 1972. The amp rarely gets turned up past 30% power, and it fills my space with luscious, warm music. Still , I do daydream about building an Ampcamp kit! 🔥👍👍
My 807SE amp puts out about 0.3W-0.4 into my 16 ohms Altec speakers. (All designed and built by yours truly.) It does go pretty loud and low, can reach 100dB/m, and I do get potent content below 20Hz. It opened a new dimension on playing Prodigy, LOL! :) Before this little amp, I had no idea Prodigy had such textured and varied bass lines - even on superb systems it sounds as boom - boom - boom... :) Plays Mahler symphonies, Pink Floyd albums and Mike Oldfield's new Return to Ommadawn with the feel of live concerts. Not blow your ears loud, still, loud enough to give a feel of a live rock concert. Indeed, low power amplification is underrated. However, to be truthful, the "little" amp has a massive power supply capable of feeding a 300W amp. The feel of impact and base comes from the reserves of the power supply. The power limits the raw maximum SPL, but tells little otherwise of the sonic qualities. With 86dB/Wm low sensitivity Mirage 760 speakers this same amp puts out about a watt of power, but it's still enough to get a feel as if The Cranberries were having a live concert in my living room. Again, not enough for the hearing impaired, but enough to give a major adrenaline rush - with clear, undistorted sound.
I recently sold my old B&W DM 110i speakers to a gentleman who inherited a vintage Marantz 2010 receiver. With 10WPC, It was a great combination. So much so, that the buyer is now researching turntables and better DACs. So, I guess you can say: “my work here is finally done “.
I built a Decware DIY SE84 amp and use it with a pair of Tekton Mini Lore's in my office. It is a fantastic combo.
I have the Klipsch RP 600M , the Kef LS50 with the Reisong A10 and the Denon PM600 NE.The Klipsch with the Reisong A10 sounds fenomenal.I can,t stop listening to this combination the KT88 tubes sounds very good too with a little bit more base as the EL34.Thank you very much for this very nice video👍
I own a monster of an amp with over 125 WRMS x 5. I also have the A10. The monster amp is good for home theater but for music the A10 is sweetest. Also, tube rolling can be a lot of fun as it changes the amps sound. Both amps drive my Elac Debut 2.0 F6s (87dB) very well.
I love conceptual videos like this. I've got a Nobsound 6P1 (that's the tube that powers the input/output) 6.3 W per channel tube amp and I absolutely love it! I got a pair of floor standing Fluance X8LF speakers and they get plenty loud, more than I need and the sound-stage is quite broad and holographic, at least to my ears. The sound is very rich and with the addition of some Russian 6P1P tubes the bass goes down lower than before most wonderfully. I've got a Zen Triode on order and I'm sure it's going to get to me one of these days, but until I'm very satisfied with the watts that I gots. ;) My solid state amp is a Schiit Vidar with 100Watts into 8 ohms and it's very clean and a wonderful amp. But something about tubes makes things better.
I am playing Wharfdale Diamond 9.0's off a 5 watt 6 ohms amp on a secondary system in my conservatory - full of hard surfaces, and while the volume is not there the sound quality is and the volume is more than adequate for the purpose! Able to throw away the cheap speakers that came with the system, utilise redundant speakers and am very satisfied with a result I did not expect.
Hey Steve, this is a great rundown about using low power amps. I got into the DIY audio projects years ago and built from scratch a pair 2A3 single end triode amps from an article in sound practice magazine. They made around 3.5 watts depending on the harmonic distortion. I absolutely loved them, and listened to them exclusively for years. I had them hooked up to ProAc studio 1’s 89 dB or ProAc super towers 90 or 91 dB sensitivities. I have a Conrad-Jonson premier 11,70 watts , that sat in the corner as backup. I was in smaller rooms usually, and I am not a loud listener, but things could get loud enough to bother others in the house. But most importantly, the music was wonderful.
I am so glad that you expanded that more power, and better quality are not tied together. All to often quality and quantity are used interchangeably, and this is a great example demonstrating that they are not. Sometimes more is just more.
I love my Reisong Boyuu A10 amp paired with Klipsch Forte 3 speakers. It's very musical combination and comfortably fills a very large room.
Peter Booth I bet it sounds great, looking for a pair of them or similar for my A9
Another awesome video. You are churning out awesome content at the moment and it’s keeping me sane during lockdown. Big love from the U.K.!
Thanks for watching!
I think we’ve found Waldo
@@PanAmStyle took your time though. I’ll count you hide this time.
Hi, my name is Carey, and I'm a tube-a-holic.
I'm running an Emotiva SE8 subwoofer (for bass management, as well as bass extension) into an A10 driving Klipsch RB 61 IIs. I have the Klipschs on stands as near field monitors at my computer desk, and 80 db average is no problem. I could go higher, but I value my hearing. ;-D
I find the combination of the A10 and the Klipsch bookshelves amazing. The A10 measures as being rolled off above 2,000 Hz, but that's not a problem, because the Klipsch speakers are bright enough (especially near field) that they balance each other out.
Next year, I'm planning on setting up a dedicated listening room. I'm looking at a Boyuurange Reisong A50 (300B tubes, 7.6 wats/channel) driving either Klipsch RP-600Ms, Triangle Genese Trios, or Zu Dirty Weekends. I'm leaning towards the Dirty Weekends, depending on when Zu offers them again.
Chuck Harris
6 years ago I built Engineer, Gordon Rankin's "Bugle 45" power amp. It uses the 1930's # 45 tube capable of only 2 watts output power. I built speaker cabinets 47 inches tall, 24 inches wide and 16 inches deep. In the bottom of the speaker cabinet is an "Eminence Delta Pro" 15 inch speaker, with 80 ounce magnet and 101.6 db sensitivity. In the top of the speaker cabinet is a JBL 939 midrange and tweeter configuration at 94 db sensitivity. An Eico ST 84 preamp with upgrades, which drives the Power Bugle 45 amp. You can't believe the "sound quality" and how loud this thing can get. I will never get rid of it.
At 17.5 WPC the tubed Dynaco "Stereo 35" is still a lovely amplifier with 6BQ5 tubes! Drives my Klipsch RP-600, and my KEF LS50 perfectly! Lovely!
The stereo 35 is a lovely amp! Plays pure music, it is a massively underrated masterpiece.
I remember my school time and somebody I knew well who wanted to start his own what we called back then "drive in disco", basically a DJ with his gear. Only he did not have all gear yet. Just many records, two idler wheel turn tables and speakers. But I had an old 1X30W Philips tube amplifier with 6 mono mixing channels. And I lend it to him. This one X 30W amplifier was enough to power a party of about 100 people and rock the joint.
Later he added a 2 x 175 W RMS, amplifier to his gear and then an other friend of mine build an additional 2 x 250W RMS amplifier + two more speakers (if you powered it on, the lights would dip for the inrush current) By that time you could literally empty the venue by turning up the volume knob.
Your new room setup...yay!
Hi Steve, I follow your tips. I bought a pair of RP-600M. Now I drive it with a DIY amplifier class AB with old Japan MOS J50 and K135; great music come out from the klipsch. I m starting to build a tubes amplifier with EL84 valves ( like Dacwere, 2W per channel). Thanks a lot
Mega OT. Who is the typical audiophile. 1. Mostly male. 2. Mostly middle age or aged. 3.His musical interest goes beyond one genre. 4. Insatiable curiosity about hi fi components. 5.His best speaker his the next one. 6 Dedicates at least one hour of pure musical listening daily. 7.He's happy with background music while doing other things. 9. While watching movies pays a lot of attention to the sound effects and considers a real torture having no other option but incorporated TV speakers. 10. His audiophile's best friend rig sounds better even though it is cheaper then his. Did I forget anything. Open for suggestions
Seeking headphones that sound like a room, then trying to get the room to sound like headphones.
If he has a wife she must always listen first when he newly positions and angles his speakers, which happens two times a month.
@@heinzr9734 So true.Given mine is absolutely a niet,niet lady she is always in front of some unpleasant surprises.
I assembled Japanese DIY Elekit TU-8200R SET amp with 8 WPC and plugget it into Omega Alnico high output monitors (USA) with 97 dB. The volume pot cannot exceed 9 o'clock if I do not want to disturb my neighbors. An excellent combination, a beautiful sound.
Amp power, in a given iteration, and how far to get with its stated wattage output is relative to speaker efficiency and the overall load it presents, as has been pointed out. Some speakers with complex, passive cross-overs can drain many a (on paper) higher powered amp so to make its rated output power and claimed speaker sensitivity a nebulous number - i.e.: far lower than what specs would suggest - just as well as a rugged, well-developed PSU of a power amp can make few watts seem somewhat "larger" being more resilient to speaker load. The perhaps more pressing matter is maintaining an effortless presentation at every SPL one would care for (not least live levels) with a range of speaker loads and typically low to moderate sensitivity, and this mostly requires much more power than one would imagine, while it may seem at first that less would do.
I’ve had my 2.3 watt Decware for about 2 months with RP600Ms. Recently purchased a set of Heresy IVs and they sound awesome, plenty enough volume for my taste!
Be great to hear more from you.
Hi Steve. Recently I moved to low power amps and really liked them. I think they do something, like the immediacy and coherence of sound that few expensive high power amps can do. However I am struggling to find makers of high sensitivity speakers. Despite the big low sensitivity ecosystem, the high sensitivity looks like limited to few popular brands like Klipsch, Zu audio and omega and other more expensive like Devore fidelity and audio note.
Would you make a video about high sensitivity loudspeaker, the makers and your opinion about this market?
Steve it's not apples to apples but man my little 5 watt tube guitar amp hooked up to a 2x12 cabinet absolutely rips....easily keeps up with a heavy handed drummer. My 35 watt tube integrated hifi plays way louder than practical and always sounds dynamic while also being very inviting sounding.
Guitar tube amps are not the same as the ones for home audio. The tubes in a guitar amp get overdriven on purpose.
@@solarfall2728 yup. As posted, not an apples to apples comparison. But if a five watt tube guitar amp can drive two 12 inch speakers to volumes that keep up with a heavy handed drummer it is worth noting. The idea that high power = better is misunderstood in general, not just with hifi enthusiasts.
Must be a Champ?
@@orwhat24 it's a milkman amp, basically a champ but built by a single craftsman with high end components. Killer little amp.....
Steve, I previously commented on your A10 review video, but I'll comment again here. I'm absolutely smitten with my A10 combined with my Klipsch R-15Ms. I recently purchased R-51Ms with this amp in mind but the R-15Ms are slightly more sensitive, and being somewhat shallower, look better in the room where I have the A10. This combination can play louder than I have ever played music in this room, and the amp doesn't break a sweat. Thanks for leading me down the path to better sound.
Another great review video from Steve.
Steve said he wanted to hear about others' experiences with low power tube amps, so here's mine.
The speakers that I use with the low power tube amps:
Main speakers: Caintuck Audio Betsy open baffle speakers (95 dB per Watt efficiency in the open baffle dipole configuration, 5.9 Ohm nominal impedance)
Subwoofer: Caintuck Audio 12" Alpha Bass open baffle powered subwoofer (with Dayton Audio SA-100 100 W subwoofer plate amplifier with crossover) handling frequencies at 125 Hz and below.
Super Tweeters: Aperion Audio MKII Planar-Ribbon Super Tweeter Pair with the high pass frequency set at 10 kHz
The low power tube amps that I use:
MP-301 Mk3 Deluxe: 6.5 W per channel
Thumbnail review: Most punchy and dynamic of the three amps listed here. Best pace, rhythm, and timing (PRAT) of these three amps. Excellent clarity with some tubey richness and resonance, but not as rich and resonant as the other two amps. Special affinity with guitar recordings.
KOHSTAR Old Buffalo 6C19 Tube amplifier: 6 W per channel
Thumbnail review: Midway in punchiness, dynamics, PRAT, and tubey richness of these three amps. A great all rounder.
Cayin HA-1A version 1: 1.2 W per channel Triode mode
2.2 W per channel Ultralinear mode
Thumbnail review: Punchier and more dynamic in Ultralinear mode, but richer and more resonant in Triode mode. Even in Ultralinear mode, it is not quite as punchy and dynamic as the Old Buffalo. In Triode mode, it is the richest and most resonant of these three amps. However, it's lack of dynamics and punch make it unsuitable for large orchestral works and high power rock, pop, soul, and blues music. But it is the best of these three amps for more laid back and intimate recordings.
All three amps have excellent soundstage depth and width, with the soundstage expanding well beyond the outer sides of the speakers if the recording has that spatial information, such as the Chesky binaural recording of Wycliffe Gordon's album "Dream of New Orleans." Instrument localization is very good, but not with artificially etched edges so that the sounds have a more natural and realistic blend or connectivity throughout the soundstage such as I have heard in live, unamplified concerts. The images have body and weight - there's meat on the bones, as they say. Transients are fairly fast, but not artificially nor edgily fast, and there is very good sustain of the note decays. Tonality is excellent with faithful reproduction of instrumental timbres and overtones. The bass is fairly taut and articulate, but not as taut and articulate as some other speakers and subwoofers used with higher powered solid state amplifiers. That being said, the bass is definitely not muddy, wooly, nor flabby with these amps and speakers, but neither is it the last word in tightness and articulation.
Note that I listen in a small room in the near-field of the speakers about 4-5 feet away from the speakers with the speakers about 3 feet from the wall behind them. I like jazz, standards, broadway, exotica, blues, soul, folk, classical, opera/lieder, and some pop-rock music, but not hard, metal, punk, or grunge rock.
Used an Audio Innovations (defunkt UK company) series 300 which claimed 12wpc but on review produced about 9wpc. The little pentode tubes produced a really lively sound full of musical expression and instrumental timbre. It made all the solid state amps sound sterile. Worked great with B&W 110 and Impulse H6 horn loaded loudspeakers. Moved on to a KT88 kit amp at 28wpc. This was better at low bass and more even sounding but lost some of the immediacy of the 9wpc amp and failed to pull out as much of the micro dynamic expression and emotion, whether it be rock guitar playing, vocals, classical or even Japanese drumming. I still have both amps and the horns; you’ve made me think about getting them set up again.
I have a Audion Silver Night 300B power tube amp with volume control,it is rated at only 7 watts in pure class A,no feedback and hard wired,my speakers are from Audiovector the R-1 Signature,i play in a small room only 4x5 meters and boy its sounds really good deep bass and very transparant and above all very smooth.
I have my Klipsch Heresy's for main L and R, using that A10 tube amp, its feeding from Denon X3500H AVR pre-outs. This works for movies too, i just calibrated the A10 amps own volume knob + pre-out levels to match the other speakers. I settled to Denon's pre-out level at almost max and the A10 volume knob only needs to be around 9 clock for best signal to noise ratio, calibration to match the ref volume scale displayed on the Denon's display. I rarely go over 80dB in my apartment so this works nicely ! I can now listen whole day without any fatigue compared to plain Denon's solid state. Currently using 6N2P-EV pre and Tung-Sol EL34B power tubes.
I have an RME ADI-2 DAC feeding two balanced monoblock Amp Camp amps powering a pair of Zu Omen DWs. Not only does it sound superb, it can get uncomfortably loud in my room. And I like loud. That said, as monoblocks they put out 15 watts each. But for the money, it's killer.
I am using the late Don Garber's Fi X4 (Type 46) amplifier at 1.5 watts/channel. Great sound with horn speakers. I am a happy man.
If you don't need to give yourself permanent hearing damage and tinnitus by listening at deafening concert hall headbanging volume levels, you don't need a lot of power. I have a Jolida JD102B 25w/channel EL84 integrated amp, which I converted from ultralinear to triode operation, cutting the power in half, and I use to drive a pair of small Cerwin Vega SL5M bookshelf speakers which have sensitivity of only 85db, and I still never get past 9 to 10 o'clock on the volume control on the Jolida in my small room, before it's too loud for my ears to handle, but it still sounds gloriously lifelike, dynamic, and three dimensional. It's all about good synergy between components.
My first amp, circa 1967, was an 8 watt either Heatkit or Dynaco amp, with my dad’s garrard TT and a pair of Koss gel filled headphones. Sounded great to me. Maybe it’s time to go back and try one of these.
My first amp was a Dynaco SCA-80Q - not low power (40wpc) and solid state, but nice and still works. First headphones were Koss Pro 4AA.
I use a couple of TA2024 Class D power amps hooked up to a pair of low-efficiency Acoustic Energy AE1 MK2 speakers with a Creek OBH-22 passive pre and it's sublime!
The amplifier set up shifted my Cyrus Pre and mono blocks and even an Audio Note Pre I had at one stage.
I've also tried the AEs with some serious watts from Rotel and I stick with the tiny Class D box. The boss at Audio Note UK called me a 'heathen'... It was in jest, absolute top bloke as are you Steve :D
I have a few other set ups with Alexander SE2 speakers, TDL Studio 0.5s and so on but all powered by the little amps.
I try other amps but keep coming back to these. The circuit board is the Helder HiFi TA2024 Mk2.
Owned a Sansui 200 receiver with 5 wpc RMS with 1% THD. It was powerful enough and sounded sweet. I miss it
Naim makes 50 watt amps that drive any speaker.
Thing is, you only get 3dB each time you double power. It takes 10dB to make sound seem twice as loud and 6dB to make sound appreciably louder. So, take my 5w Sansui (you should!). Double it twice to 20w to get only 6dB. You have to get 30w to make it seem twice as loud. To do that again, you need 180 watts per channel! So, the first watt is surely very important as we rarely exceed that on decently sensitive loudspeakers after all.
Moved from Naim Xs to Reisong A10 with BW 706s2 and totally happy. Miss some grunt, punch and pace?...maybe, but now I can hear music whithout the sensation of disturbing everybody
Cheers Steve, you have had me smiling tonight! Neither my main or office system makes it to 10W and they continue to surprise those that get to sit and listen and them. Speaker choice is all important and both have a pair of single driver Omega Loudspeakers.
I love my old and simple but well-made form follows function design Don Garber Fi 2A3's, the 3.5 watts really surprised me. Can drive the 86dB 2-way speakers on hand but really better suited to the 89 - 90dB 2-way's (and higher), all of the "easy-load" speaker category.
Still, at comparable listening levels, there is an "ease", a difference in terms of speed and dynamics when driving the 92dB Mark Audio or the 96dB Fostex wide-band drivers in my collection of gear. I'm now leaning toward front horn designs. Perhaps one of these days I'll get to play around with something from Voxitiv and or Cube Audio F8 Neo drivers.
Btw, how about giving us single-digit SET amp reviews of some of the 2K - 12K $$$ range? I'd like to have a better idea of what's worth having these days and what to run from, not that I'd expect you to address the latter, LOL!
You know, going on specs, build quality, and parts used, I'm having a hard time understanding how some of the current products are getting away with what they are charging. A lot of expensive gear with slick-looking cosmetics on the outside only to have cheap circuit boards and low-cost parts written up to give the impression of quality parts when they're anything but. Years spent in bookstores (remember bookstores?), reading Vacuum Tube Valey and Glass Audio (most articles were over my head), have me critically looking at product and wanting to barf when I see what the new gear cost, even on the used market!
Oh, and maybe review a kit like the Bottlehead new MonoAmour 2A3 and Elekit TU-8600S?
Funny to see remarks about the RP-600M’s. I’ve owned them for about a year. They’re quite amazing . The price has dropped a little making them an absolute bargain. I recently added the REL 5 Ti subwoofer and I’m just blown away by my sound sound system.
Thanks, Steve, for your insightful reviews. Long ago, I settled on a Cary 300-SEI amp, matched to Jamo Concert 8 speakers, and I have never wanted to upgrade these. I have admired your views since the old Listener days.
I run an 8 watt per channel Eastern Electric minimax 6bm8 based power amp, it's dynamic, rich, textured and liquid. Gets loud. Makes music!
This all day, every day 👍🏼 My next low power amp will be a 6L6 single ended
The 6BQ5 and 6CA7 have also been in some pretty sweet amps!
@@seanmangan2769 I’m running the DECware SE84UFO, so am already familiarly with the 6BQ5/EL84. Currently running a pair of very nice 7189a for output; the room is small so I never want for volume. My second setup will be a much larger room, and Kevin from glowinthedark.com has said very good things about 6L6 SE amps. :)
I understand you review new equipment. That said i recently rediscovered a vintage kenwood KA-701. It is not about the wattage (60 watts) it is about the involvement into the music. No caps in the audio stages makes it very precise and speedy without being edgy. And it is known to have one of the best phono stages. The level of detail, depth, soundstage and detail blows away alot of current gear. No, it is not a romantic sounding amp. But it gets out of the way and brings the performers into the room. And the reason, I bring this amp up, $200 - $450 street price. Fits right in your low power amp price range.
I voiced the amp camp amp and the korg B1 preamp on a pair of Klipsch RP 5000 S speakers after I constructed both. They were all a gift for my son and the sound was amazingly powerful for such a low wattage amplifier. Another commentor suggested to choose which way you want to go and I think that’s the best answer.
Steve: thanks for doing the video. This is the topic I have been waiting for you to discuss.
rp600 and Pass Amp Camp Amp is a great combo!
Single amp or monoblocks?
@@jonlaws4493 Either. You can build as a stereo unit or monobloc.
@@joshscism2351 I meant which is best option.?
@@jonlaws4493 I built one. I can only imagine two would be fantastic.
I have the Reisong using with 35 year old Castle Chester speakers sensitivity is 90db never have volume above 60% on volume knob plenty loud enough and so magical
Thanks for this video - I'm using RP600m and A10 - with Gold Lion Tubes also have the Vista Audio Spark - first version...
Soo, I've got a Marantz PM6006 (45W in 8ohms). I focused more on having a pair of speakers that were easier to drive and finally settled on the Triangle Borea BR03, which is a GREAT match. I get the soundstage, the punchyness, the clarity I need from this system and it's also relatively affordable. Just completed my setup with a Network Streamer, the NA6006, from the same range and man, do these sound impressive together! (With Ecrosse RCA analogue cables) Also, to top things up, I learned that Spotify is launching lossless CD-quality streaming (with Spotify Connect, supported by the NA6006!) later this year, what a treat!
For the 600m, do keep in mind that the 96gb claimed isn't across the frequency spectrum. While they do hit 96db for a certain frequency range, much of the speaker's range is a good 10db less .
Right, but it sounded wonderful with all three amps under review here.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac that's what matters at the end of the day
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac I was really impressed with the pair I had and I wouldn't want to dissuade anyone from trying these. I did expect more from a 96db rated speaker, especially after running some Zu's with the exact same gear. When that didn't quite pan out as expected I was a bit peeved to see how they came up with that number. In my room they did Ok with a little power and I think they were killer when I gave them a lot.
Funny I come across this while being lazy in the garage listening to music and looking through TH-cam.. I’ve got 2,000 square-feet down here, and all I use is a 28 year old Sony 2-channel stereo powering a pair of Infinity Reference 2000.3 bookshelf speakers with about 15 watts each. Clean, clear, and loud enough to fill the space to my liking.
I'm using Klipsch R 51m at 93dm and Q acoustic 3050 floor standers at 92db. I use them both with my home built single ended 4w class A valve amp and they sound fantastic.
I use a 9 watt per channel 300B amplifier with high efficiency horn speakers. I can easily drive them to lease-breaking levels.
I occasionally run my Zvex tube amp, rated 3/4 watt at 8 ohms, so I know what you're talking about. People don't realize how loud 1 watt really is.
Hi, last summer I bought the Reisong A10 which I use together with DIY Cornwall clones, Klonwall. I also use a Schitt preamplifier for my Lenco L78S. Plenty of quality sound in my 25 x 20 feet living room. All equipment bought after your recommandations Steve. Couldn't be happier with a total investment of only 1700 euro. I am also going to buy the RP 600 I think, out of curiosity. Maarten, Netherlands
Pure gold Steve. It's what we need to hear about Audio. I'm running dual Leak TL12s at 12 watts each and I use them to drive the infamous ELAC UB 5s. The sound is surprisingly good but, of course, I'm always wondering what more efficient speakers would do. Thanks for this video
Leak owner here, definitely try more sensitive speakers, you will be amazed.
Glad I watched this, just ordered q acoustics 3020 to replace the speakers on my Denon DT-1 and was concerned about only having 15 watts per channel.
I hope this one gets lots of views as it couldn't be more spot-on. I run either an 18 watt First Watt SIT3 with a Pass P12 pre or an 8 watt Boyuu Reisong a50 both with a Denefrips Pontis DAc. I am in a smallish room with speakers of my own design and build. I have yet to find myself wishing for more volume or dynamics.
My amp has 0 watts. It's the best amp ever, because I get to imagine how great it would sound instead of actually hearing any sound, and not being satisfied with the sound.
Yea, I got the same brand, sounds great in my head!
transparency is superb ...
The 3-D imaging is heavenly I have to get one of those systems of yours
We've just invented Tele fi ( Telepathic Fidelity) yeah yeah !! Go us go us!!
Currently using the Reisong A10 with a pair of 96db KLH Kendall towers, that 6wpc does an amazing job!
Hmmmm....I have wondered about those speakers.
I went from a stereo power amp, 2x20 watt (300b tubes), to two monos 2x1,5 watt (45 tubes) from TW Acustic, Germany, and I got so much in quality. The TWs will stay forever in my system. My speakers are 96dB in sensitivity.
Recently found a rare pair of vintage high sensitivity Isofonic and using them with a vintage single ended RCA tube amp. Gorgeous sound
Audiophiliac is so right. First time I ever heard such a low watt tube amp in a store it just blew my mind. But I have a problem/lack of knowledge here.
Will 50 year old KLH model 30 acoustic suspension speakers work with these low power amps?
If you want your musicians to sound as though they were down the hall and around the corner, yes.
Great topic! Just went through this process myself but got slightly different results.
Have a Decware Zen and tried 1) KEF q150 about 86db and 2) Klipsch 600m about 96db
And if I’m honest BOTH speakers after about 80db with any bass in the track whatsoever started clipping/distorting quite audibly.
(Acoustic / lighter music you could go up to 85db with clean sound.) it was just too quiet under 80db for me to enjoy the music in my smaller 10x12 room.
So my next move was trying some Omega monitor speakers rated at 94-95db BELOW the Klipsch but clean volume is almost DOUBLE! Klipsch over rating the sensitivity??
No comparison in volume. Can hit 85-90db cleanly on the Omegas.
Wanted to share in case anyone else thinking of these combinations. Decware is 2.3 watts and sounds unbelievably good. But only a HANDFUL of speakers match it in my opinion. Reisong A10 at 6 watts may drive the Klipsch to a nicer volume I’d guess.
My favorite combo is the zen amp and the klipsch 600 with custom crossovers.
I built a Reisong A9, which I think is very similar to the A10 in a different chassis. It is a revelation. I suggest trying some old stock 6SL7 preamp tubes. There is a lot of tweaking to try, check out DIY audio.
I also have an A9. It quit working (just hums loud). Someday I'll get around to fixing it. Nice sounding little amp. Using a Riesong MT-88
mk II right now. Way overkill for my 100dB EV speakers, but I was thinking someday of getting small speakers and figure it doesn't hurt to have too much power on hand. I love the sound I get with it!
gurdyman1 mine has very low hum, but using 91 db audio monitor silver S6. I want to get a pair of Klipsch eventually. I see that some mod increase the filter cap, size. The west problem with mine was the input jacks were junk. I ditched the jacks and switching board and went with a DPST switch to select and new phono jacks. The supplied preamp tubes has different gain, which really became apparent when switching to 6SL7. I added grid resistors cathode bypass caps to the preamp tubes as well. Very simple mods.
It is not low wattage per se that makes the sound good. It's the simplicity and purity of a small single ended tube or class-A SS amp that makes them sound so transparent and un-artificial. They can be great with any speaker but unbeatable with high-efficiency speakers
I thought about your comment and would like to add that also the small need of current, a simple acdc supply with only little interaction with the amplified music has a positive influence.
My favourite low power amplifier in my collection will always be my Quad II valve mono power amps from back in the 50;s. I'm sure they push more than they state, but are magnificent with my Quad electrostatic 57's, and also my Klipsch La Scala.. audio heaven.
Quad II with LaScala works very well together, I listened to this combination for several years and still have this gear in my small collection.
I am currently using a 12-watt amplifier by Sophia Electric. It is beautiful and it sounds surprisingly powerful!
HiFiKlubben Stavanger, 🇳🇴, played B&W803D3 with a 80watts NAD, and they played Loud! And fairly good
Very agree that is why I love 45 SE 2 watts. with 90db Speaker or higher
Love the 600M even blow me away after the GR research upgraded crossovers! Oh boy
I have a pair of Antique Sound Labs monoblock amplifiers rated at 8 watts. And a pair of Klipsch Heresy HWO speakers. The sound is astonishing and will blow you out of the room. Now I'm curious to see how low in watts I can go with them.
I have a collection of 70's monster receivers. Like the Kenwood model 11G. But my Reisong A10 just blows me away. Not sure it could drive a sub but a fantastic amp.
My favourite amp is the Sansui AU-101. It is rated at 15 watts per channel but I would take that sound over almost any other amp I own.
Steve, that Max Richter album is something else, I still have about a half of it to get through, but man, that's enjoyable!
Nice points. Wish these choices were available when I was young. Looks like one could put together an amazing hi-fi on the cheap. Thanks.
"Call the cops, CRAZY LOUD!!" ~Steve Guttenburg~ (AUDIOPHILIAC)
Again a very nice video Steve, great music reviews.
My humble 2 cents as a rule of thumb for small amps....and yes, they can sound like they were built by angels.
The efficiency of the speaker is important information about the interaction with a petite amplifier but it does not tell the whole story. Some types of speakers actually always work well with small amplifiers, full horns, so also in the bass, such as a Klipsch LaScala and small bookshelf speakers, as here in the video. In these two cases, the small amplifier does not have to control a large bass cone, but the speaker dampens itself quite well.
There are large conventional bass speakers with high efficiency. Some might work well, such as Steve's Cornwalls, because the bass diaphragm is relatively hard sprung, just like in a guitar amp. I'd be interested in Steve's impression of whether that works.
But I have, for example, big old 15 inch Tannoy Canterbury in normal bass reflex cabinets. They don't work at all with small amps, like my Leak Stereo 20 or an Audion 300B. Even if the efficiency of the Tannoy is huge. A small 6 watt amp can't drive the big heavy bass cone in a controlled way if it is soft sprung and has 260 liters of air in the cabinet.
Therefore, with small amplifiers in combination with speakers with high efficiency, my tip is to take small bookshelf speakers or bass horns or bigger speakers with a stiff cone suspension.
Bit of a counterpoint. I have some 88db speakers (Swan Diva 4.1) I was powering with a Rotel RA 1520 rated (conservatively they say) at 2 x 60 watts per channel for many years. On a hunch I then subbed in a class D power amp, first a Crown XLS 1002 at 200+ watts per channel and then a XTZ a300 at 300 watts per channel. Oh my god pumping all those watts into low efficiency speakers completely changed the game. The speakers came alive and I could hear every nuance of every note and the proverbial veil was lifted. Nothing subtle about it. I ended up fronting with an inexpensive tube pre amp to bring a little tube goodness to it but I can't imagine deliberately underpowering speakers again.
I've written here on this channel's comments area a number of times about my system... a Decware SE84UFO amplifier.. 2.3 wpc with CJ PV5 preamp manufactured in 1984 and Zu Omen MKII DW's with clarity caps.
As Zu's Sean Casey talks about in his famous TH-cam interview with John Atkinson... After mechanical inefficiencies, heat and crossovers eat up all the power maybe ONLY a half watt actually reach the drivers in your acoustic suspension style box speaker.
For me, the conclusion is that full range designs of guys like Harry Olson and Klipsch are far better for home audio. They are far more sensitive and utilize the far higher quality and purer signal from a single ended triode designed amp which requires NO negative feedback to stabilize it.
Steve Deckert of Decware has his own transformers made that deliver a fast and more "true to life" sound than just about anything I've used in 60 years of home audio... so sensitive and transparent that it really brings out the very special attributes of my PV5.
The Zu's make my system possible and really compliment and augment what the Decware and PV5 bring to the table.
My listening session this weekend included LP's of The Philadelphia Orchestra and Boston Pops. Philly Orch in the late 50's and early 60's were at their pinnacle with their own huge sound. They had a way of doubling on the instrument parts. As a result they were very difficult to record ... overwhelmed many recording systems of the day but when they got it right...
My point is that in my 12'x15' room, loud and dynamic was overwhelming which drove my wife to go shopping(the real reason why this hobby is getting expensive ... lol)... in this respect I disagree with Stevey G. Your preamp plays a huge roll in getting a big sound out of a Decware low wattage amp.
Steve Deckert has recommended his ZSTAGE gain stage to augment your sound sources ... maybe use in lieu of a preamp for larger, more pure sonics and I will be looking to check this out.
In short, in my experience starting as a little kid in early 60's, the acoustic suspension speaker concept as a departure from the far more efficient designs which preceded it has led home audio down a 60 year rabbit hole of wasted materials and energy consumption. In this case bigger is not better!
I keep thinking about the 8W per channel Western Electric tube amps driving WE horns in all those theatres. When I hear these systems in a demo, they are really hard to beat at any price.
I run 110W OTL triode monoblocks (Transcendent design). Tubes without transformers have all the crystal clear dynamic punch of solid state but with the palpable tone of triodes. The interesting thing is you can remove half of the tubes and the identical amp runs at 25w / channel. They sound great, but a lot is missing. The low end grunt disappears.
Isn't it also a matter of what Class the amp is using? I used to have a Copland 30W tube amp (Class A) and it played absolutely beautiful and loud, but that amp was very expensive. I now have a Yamaha 2-channel streaming receiver with KEF Q550 and it works really well, but question is if I should look at a tube amp instead to get some more body to the sound?