Anatta and the Sense of Self by Ajahn Jayasaro, Dhamma Talk, Dharma, Audiobook

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ธ.ค. 2024

ความคิดเห็น • 28

  • @AjarnSpencer
    @AjarnSpencer ปีที่แล้ว +2

    One of the best teaches of the Kammathana lineage in the present day. I am happy to have once crossed paths with him during a Tudong i made in Ubon, around Sirintorn Lake and to Pak Se in Laos. I spent a few days at the Wat Pha Nanachat and moved on to Wat Nong Pha Pong. Ajarn Jayasaro is a great teacher and preserves the heart of the teachings of Ajarn Chah, and the Buddha, and the Dhamma which the Buddha taught. This is a true teacher, who will not lead anybody astray ever.

  • @im103mike2
    @im103mike2 9 ปีที่แล้ว +19

    Thank you for posting these videos...I have no teacher...none is available within 75 miles and he does not speak English LOL.....I depend on posts and subscriptions like these for knowledge. Even though only a few people view these, you are providing essential help to those of us that do watch. Thanks again...this talk was excellent.

  • @porpoisepork
    @porpoisepork 7 ปีที่แล้ว +7

    Thus I heard. On one occasion the Blessed One was living at Benares, in the Deer Park at Isipatana (the Resort of Seers). There he addressed the bhikkhus of the group of five: "Bhikkhus." - "Venerable sir," they replied. The Blessed One said this.
    "Bhikkhus, form is not-self. Were form self, then this form would not lead to affliction, and one could have it of form: 'Let my form be thus, let my form be not thus.' And since form is not-self, so it leads to affliction, and none can have it of form: 'Let my form be thus, let my form be not thus.'
    "Bhikkhus, feeling is not-self...
    "Bhikkhus, perception is not-self...
    "Bhikkhus, determinations are not-self...
    "Bhikkhus, consciousness is not self. Were consciousness self, then this consciousness would not lead to affliction, and one could have it of consciousness: 'Let my consciousness be thus, let my consciousness be not thus.' And since consciousness is not-self, so it leads to affliction, and none can have it of consciousness: 'Let my consciousness be thus, let my consciousness be not thus.'
    "Bhikkhus, how do you conceive it: is form permanent or impermanent?" - "Impermanent, venerable Sir." - "Now is what is impermanent painful or pleasant?" - "Painful, venerable Sir." - "Now is what is impermanent, what is painful since subject to change, fit to be regarded thus: 'This is mine, this is I, this is my self'"? - "No, venerable sir."
    "Is feeling permanent or impermanent?...
    "Is perception permanent or impermanent?...
    "Are determinations permanent or impermanent?...
    "Is consciousness permanent or impermanent?" - "Impermanent, venerable sir." - "Now is what is impermanent pleasant or painful?" - "Painful, venerable sir." - "Now is what is impermanent, what is painful since subject to change, fit to be regarded thus: 'This is mine, this is I, this is my self'"? - "No, venerable sir."
    "So, bhikkhus any kind of form whatever, whether past, future or presently arisen, whether gross or subtle, whether in oneself or external, whether inferior or superior, whether far or near, must with right understanding how it is, be regarded thus: 'This is not mine, this is not I, this is not myself.'
    "Any kind of feeling whatever...
    "Any kind of perception whatever...
    "Any kind of determination whatever...
    "Any kind of consciousness whatever, whether past, future or presently arisen, whether gross or subtle, whether in oneself or external, whether inferior or superior, whether far or near must, with right understanding how it is, be regarded thus: 'This is not mine, this is not I, this is not my self.'
    "Bhikkhus, when a noble follower who has heard (the truth) sees thus, he finds estrangement in form, he finds estrangement in feeling, he finds estrangement in perception, he finds estrangement in determinations, he finds estrangement in consciousness.
    "When he finds estrangement, passion fades out. With the fading of passion, he is liberated. When liberated, there is knowledge that he is liberated. He understands: 'Birth is exhausted, the holy life has been lived out, what can be done is done, of this there is no more beyond.'"
    That is what the Blessed One said. The bhikkhus were glad, and they approved his words.
    Now during this utterance, the hearts of the bhikkhus of the group of five were liberated from taints through clinging no more.
    - SN 22.59

    • @polymathica
      @polymathica 7 ปีที่แล้ว

      Albinotron, it is a beautiful sutta and so clear, but sometimes I wish there were a teacher who was well-learned in both the Theravada and the Mahayana traditions who could explain how this sutta relates to the "Flower Garland" sutra-in both a historical and supramundane sense. Anatta and sunyata seem to be both entwined with and in denial of each other. I thought I had the insight for about ten seconds while listening to one of Thich Nhat Hanh's talks today, but it didn't last. Now I can't remember exactly what I thought and the feeling of a passed lightbulb moment is all that remains. Stupid impermanent mind. :( The more I practice, the harder I feel Ajahn Jayasaro's analogy of the path to enlightenment being like a game of Snakes 'n' Ladders.

    • @fablekeys
      @fablekeys 6 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      @@polymathica "Freed from the classification of consciousness, Vaccha, the Tathagata is deep, boundless, hard to fathom, like the sea."
      With any residual conceit a person is not freed from the classification of consciousness. Regarding what is under the classification of consciousness to be self, the possessions of self or related to self. Because they regard self to be under the classification of consciousness when that consciousness changes there is agitation. This being the case there is bondage, there is the fetter called conceit.
      I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was staying in Savatthi, at Jeta's Grove, Anathapindika's monastery. Then the wanderer Vacchagotta went to the Blessed One and, on arrival, exchanged courteous greetings with him. After an exchange of friendly greetings & courtesies, he sat to one side. As he was sitting there he asked the Blessed One: "How is it, Master Gotama, does Master Gotama hold the view: 'The cosmos is eternal: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'The cosmos is not eternal: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'The cosmos is finite: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'The cosmos is infinite: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'The soul & the body are the same: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'The soul is one thing and the body another: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'After death a Tathagata exists: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'After death a Tathagata does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'After death a Tathagata both exists & does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: 'After death a Tathagata neither exists nor does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless'?"
      "...no..."
      "How is it, Master Gotama, when Master Gotama is asked if he holds the view 'the cosmos is eternal...'... 'after death a Tathagata neither exists nor does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless,' he says '...no...' in each case. Seeing what drawback, then, is Master Gotama thus entirely dissociated from each of these ten positions?"
      "Vaccha, the position that 'the cosmos is eternal' is a thicket of views, a wilderness of views, a contortion of views, a writhing of views, a fetter of views. It is accompanied by suffering, distress, despair, & fever, and it does not lead to disenchantment, dispassion, cessation; to calm, direct knowledge, full Awakening, Unbinding.
      "The position that 'the cosmos is not eternal'...
      "...'the cosmos is finite'...
      "...'the cosmos is infinite'...
      "...'the soul & the body are the same'...
      "...'the soul is one thing and the body another'...
      "...'after death a Tathagata exists'...
      "...'after death a Tathagata does not exist'...
      "...'after death a Tathagata both exists & does not exist'...
      "...'after death a Tathagata neither exists nor does not exist'... does not lead to disenchantment, dispassion, cessation; to calm, direct knowledge, full Awakening, Unbinding."
      "Does Master Gotama have any position at all?"
      "A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.' Because of this, I say, a Tathagata - with the ending, fading away, cessation, renunciation, & relinquishment of all construings, all excogitations, all I-making & mine-making & obsessions with conceit - is, through lack of clinging/sustenance, released."
      "But, Master Gotama, the monk whose mind is thus released: Where does he reappear?"
      "'Reappear,' Vaccha, doesn't apply."
      "In that case, Master Gotama, he does not reappear."
      "'Does not reappear,' Vaccha, doesn't apply."
      "...both does & does not reappear."
      "...doesn't apply."
      "...neither does nor does not reappear."
      "...doesn't apply."
      "How is it, Master Gotama, when Master Gotama is asked if the monk reappears... does not reappear... both does & does not reappear... neither does nor does not reappear, he says, '...doesn't apply' in each case. At this point, Master Gotama, I am befuddled; at this point, confused. The modicum of clarity coming to me from your earlier conversation is now obscured."
      "Of course you're befuddled, Vaccha. Of course you're confused. Deep, Vaccha, is this phenomenon, hard to see, hard to realize, tranquil, refined, beyond the scope of conjecture, subtle, to-be-experienced by the wise. For those with other views, other practices, other satisfactions, other aims, other teachers, it is difficult to know. That being the case, I will now put some questions to you. Answer as you see fit. What do you think, Vaccha: If a fire were burning in front of you, would you know that, 'This fire is burning in front of me'?"
      "...yes..."
      "And suppose someone were to ask you, Vaccha, 'This fire burning in front of you, dependent on what is it burning?' Thus asked, how would you reply?"
      "...I would reply, 'This fire burning in front of me is burning dependent on grass & timber as its sustenance.'"
      "If the fire burning in front of you were to go out, would you know that, 'This fire burning in front of me has gone out'?"
      "...yes..."
      "And suppose someone were to ask you, 'This fire that has gone out in front of you, in which direction from here has it gone? East? West? North? Or south?' Thus asked, how would you reply?"
      "That doesn't apply, Master Gotama. Any fire burning dependent on a sustenance of grass and timber, being unnourished - from having consumed that sustenance and not being offered any other - is classified simply as 'out' (unbound)."
      "Even so, Vaccha, any physical form by which one describing the Tathagata would describe him: That the Tathagata has abandoned, its root destroyed, made like a palmyra stump, deprived of the conditions of development, not destined for future arising. Freed from the classification of form, Vaccha, the Tathagata is deep, boundless, hard to fathom, like the sea. 'Reappears' doesn't apply. 'Does not reappear' doesn't apply. 'Both does & does not reappear' doesn't apply. 'Neither reappears nor does not reappear' doesn't apply.
      "Any feeling... Any perception... Any fabrication...
      "Any consciousness by which one describing the Tathagata would describe him: That the Tathagata has abandoned, its root destroyed, made like a palmyra stump, deprived of the conditions of development, not destined for future arising. Freed from the classification of consciousness, Vaccha, the Tathagata is deep, boundless, hard to fathom, like the sea. 'Reappears' doesn't apply. 'Does not reappear' doesn't apply. 'Both does & does not reappear' doesn't apply. 'Neither reappears nor does not reappear' doesn't apply."
      When this was said, the wanderer Vacchagotta said to the Blessed One: "Master Gotama, it is as if there were a great sala tree not far from a village or town: From inconstancy, its branches and leaves would wear away, its bark would wear away, its sapwood would wear away, so that on a later occasion - divested of branches, leaves, bark, & sapwood - it would stand as pure heartwood. In the same way, Master Gotama's words are divested of branches, leaves, bark, & sapwood and stand as pure heartwood.
      "Magnificent, Master Gotama! Magnificent! Just as if he were to place upright what was overturned, to reveal what was hidden, to show the way to one who was lost, or were to carry a lamp into the dark so that those with eyes could see forms, in the same way has Master Gotama - through many lines of reasoning - made the Dhamma clear. I go to Master Gotama for refuge, to the Dhamma, and to the Sangha of monks. May Master Gotama remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for refuge, from this day forward, for life."
      "Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta: To Vacchagotta on Fire" (MN 72), translated from the Pali by Thanissaro Bhikkhu. Access to Insight (BCBS Edition), 30 November 2013, www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.072.than.html .

  • @MrCanigou
    @MrCanigou 9 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    "it doesn't mean there is no self, it means it's not permanent" somewhere in this wise vid. Thank you for sharing it.
    Is it irrelevant to ask when and where this was recorded ?

  • @jamienaru
    @jamienaru 8 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Beautiful, eloquent and clear. please keep up this talks. Is there a way or place to download Ajahn Jayasaro mp3?
    metta
    j

    • @jasonherterich2751
      @jasonherterich2751 8 ปีที่แล้ว

      dharmaseed.org - there's an endless free supply of dharma talks available there

    • @jamienaru
      @jamienaru 8 ปีที่แล้ว

      +Jason Herterich 1. No, there are not. 2. And , not by Jayasaro: " Is there a way or place to download Ajahn Jayasaro mp3?' I found a source. thank you.

  • @sizzla123
    @sizzla123 9 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    And then, as you move into those pre-paved moments, and as that future becomes your present, you fine-tune it by saying, This, is what I now want. ~ Abraham Hicks
    Anatta Metta =)

    • @dhammagenuineteachingsofth1461
      @dhammagenuineteachingsofth1461  9 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      AUSPICIOUS KONDOR As usual, thank you for the quote, my friend! Metta on Metta!

    • @sizzla123
      @sizzla123 9 ปีที่แล้ว

      Dhamma: Genuine Teachings of the Buddha and His Noble Disciples Fine tuned Metta!!! =)

    • @laufangcheng7917
      @laufangcheng7917 8 ปีที่แล้ว

      good

  • @KenTheoriaApophasis
    @KenTheoriaApophasis 9 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    "the soul is the only refuge" Dn 2.154 - Gotama Buddha
    "the soul is permanent (niccam), the chartioteer (sarathi)" - Udana , Sutta Nipata - Gotama Buddha
    This video is pure lies

    • @laapasakuna
      @laapasakuna 9 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      +Theoria Apophasis Misquoted. Check better your references.

    • @KenTheoriaApophasis
      @KenTheoriaApophasis 8 ปีที่แล้ว

      ***** youre a demon, since you just said the KHANDHAS (which are "mara" SN 1.96 in sutta) are the "REFUGE"
      you just said MARA (the empirical self, the psycho-physical) = REFUGE
      that makes you a demon :)
      like a common fool you confuse the self (khandhas) with the Self/Attan/Atman/Nous/Citta
      common mistake for an intellectual pedestrian

    • @yleecoyote2619
      @yleecoyote2619 8 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      I did not realize that you are insane...you need help.

    • @RBCraneGongfu
      @RBCraneGongfu 7 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      ¨atta¨ or ¨atman¨ do not only translate as the big Self or soul, it can also be used to refer to the conventional idea of¨oneself¨, so it is not the common translation your are quoting. Those passages mean that ultimately, nobody can save you but yourself, that's all. It is unclear why people would want to make a new religion out of Gotama if all he said was only the same thing already found in the Upanishads, or why he would bother debating with brahmins if he had the exact same position as they did. People try to defend the existence of the big Self with all the rage and anxiety that is characteristic of their little ego self, which means that at the end of the day, weither there is the Atman or not, those aggressive defenders of Atman haven't even dealt with their little self yet.

    • @laapasakuna
      @laapasakuna 7 ปีที่แล้ว

      I agree with your interpretation of the passage, though I do not like expressions like "their little ego self" or "aggressive defenders of Atman."

  • @helpandbehelped
    @helpandbehelped 7 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    so monotone

  • @BillSikes.
    @BillSikes. 7 ปีที่แล้ว

    My god, listening to him is like listening to the living dead, a lifeless goon !

    • @polymathica
      @polymathica 7 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      strake750 I agree that he has a calm, even delivery and dry sense of humor, but that's what I love about him. He reaches me on my wavelength. If you desire a more animated teacher, try Ajahn Brahm or Ajahn Sumedho. Ajahn Brahm is a master of "skillful means."

    • @Bonsoirmonamie
      @Bonsoirmonamie 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      In your even older age have you come to be more respectful or not?

    • @BillSikes.
      @BillSikes. 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@Bonsoirmonamie
      Sounds to me like he's out of his brains on tranquilizers 🤪🤣🤣