@@kingiwingi8869 in general, for example if one error or discrepancy in building an engine is found from the design can ruin the car. Because SSG design on how his power works has different attributes, it makes it a hard determination for how blue works and so one. There should just be one way, like how the original SS operates and that’s only to give you a boost in 50x with slight anger issues.
6:50 this is consistent with how Korin once said that souls killed by demons, or just people who are evil enough to classify as demons like king piccolo, don’t go to the afterlife and just wander the universe forever.
@@alessandroarsuffi9227Kami also mentions it later in early dragon ball Z but I’m struggling to find the exact moment… he mentions how because Goku’s soul was headed to the afterlife despite piccolo killing him, piccolo may actually no longer be evil…
I'm glad I'm seeing more theory videos in the fandom. We used to have mr.senpai but he left youtube. Theories aren't just about what is right or wrong but to create a discussion in the fandom.
Despite how casually it's showed off in the anime, Blue is apparently really bad for stamina usage based on what we're told. God is very energy efficient, and seems to have a significant calming effect on the user, making it useful for situations where the raw strength of Blue isn't necessary. Based on how it's presented it also seems to be faster then Blue, allowing you to dart around much smoother and dodge things that Blue wouldn't be able to. This could just be an artistic thing though, I'm not sure if Blue is actually meant to be slower.
he’s right, its really that. ssg has greater speed, even tho ssb has more endurance and raw power, ssg is better for situations ur enemy is not so massively strong
It’s not. It’s just more unique in design, the color red is also more vibrant and pleasing to the eye than blue, Blue is better in terms of power and speed. And since goku and vegeta mastered blue like they did the original SSJ, it’s better in stamina now. Plus blue has the most variations out of all saiyan transformations depending on continuity, like perfected SSB, Blue kaioken and Blue evolved, Evil Berserk controlled blue and Universal blue.
Rare opinion Ik but honestly SSGSS is my favorite form. It combines both Saiyan legends and reinforces the idea that Goku has mastered the Super Saiyan state. Somehow the fact that there is no SSGSS2 or SSGSS3 makes me like it even more because Goku has evolved past needing the upgrades of Super Saiyan. Also blue is a nice color. Yeah it's a recolor but it has a good reason for being one. Golden Great Ape is a recolor for the exact same reason Blue is a recolor. SSGSS gets a lot of hate because of how the anime or specifically the tournament of power handled it but it was great in the manga and in the Broly movie.
I totally agree, it is a wasted form. And the "being absorbed into base form" also is just stupid as both Goku and Vegeta don't fare any better against opponents that are expected to be on par with just regular SSJ forms without any God ki. Like Gohan who is around SSJ3 with his Mystic form and he clearly was weaker before regaining his mystic form putting him back to where he was. Even if Goku was holding back in his SSJ forms, he still wasn't a whole God multiplier beyond Gohan. And now Gohan gains Berserker form without any god ki and just levels the playing field with Goku who is supposedly SSG absorbed into his base, who is now capable of going into his SSJ forms on top of it and then going into SSG again and then going SSB + Kaio-ken and then going MUI which has evolved way beyond what it was vs Jiren. SSG should've been explored better and left to be a standalone form and no "absorbed into base" BS.
No, they should've called it Saiyan God as its Base + God ki. This would make its underwhelming status more understandable because the main Saiyans ignore base form a lot since in Cell Saga Super Saiyan got perfected to a level that they could use that as their base form. So SSG being called Saiyan God would leave the intentional room to grow, and the Saiyans ascension to Super Saiyan God when they try to stack Super Saiyan on Saiyan God. SSG could then evolve into SSGSS through Vegeta to replace Blue Evolution and could then be called God Evolution as its an evolution of Super Saiyan God instead of Blue. This would also make Blue Kaioken be called God Kaioken
This should have been THE god form, and it should have just been expanded upon and evolved with new techniques until perhaps ultra instinct. Which could have been a technique and not a form in its self
Alright I might have a lot of people come at me and probably yell at me to debate them on discord but Goku absorbing Super Saiyan God into base is widely misunderstood by a lot of the fanbase. Yes, Goku did absorb the form but his base isn't God level, he just has the power to tap into that power. The entire reason why Super Saiyan Blue or rather Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan works is because Goku taps into the power of Super Saiyan God and goes Super Saiyan. That means when Goku uses normal SSJ forms, he's not using the power of a Super Saiyan God. I've had this debate before so I know this isn't enough to convince anyone so let me elaborate. After the Beerus fight we never see Goku fight God level opponents in normal SSJ forms. Firstly, Frost needed to resort to cheating against Piccolo to win, the same Piccolo that lost to Tagoma and in a later arc would be confirmed to be weaker than Ultimate Gohan from the Buu Saga. Goku needed Super Saiyan against this Frost and was noticeably taking damage in base. If Goku's base was just God level, what would be the point in transforming just to hold back? Against people like Krillin, Goku had a clear objective but if Goku's base is just God level, he'd have no reason to go SSJ and on top of that, the explanation for SSB wouldn't make sense. Goku used SSJ2 and was more or less equal to Trunks. Yes he was holding back a bit but he wasn't super suppressed in the sense he was using 1% of his power. He fought Goku Black as an SSJ2 but remember, even SSJ2 Trunks was able to put up a fight against Goku Black a few times and he was far from God level. In the tournament of power we find out that SSJ2 Goku is equal to Ultimate Gohan in the Buu Saga. Before you say Gohan rivals SSB, I'll get to that in a second. Before Goku and Gohan fought, Gohan said this is my current full power which was revealed to be the same strength he had in the Buu Saga. He'd later awaken more of his power against SSB Goku so it contradicts nothing. Every instance of Goku and Vegeta fighting God level opponents in lesser forms has always been in base except for the Beerus fight which was a one time thing. We know Goku and Vegeta can use the power of SSG without going SSG so using the Copy Vegeta arc or the Monaka episode doesn't work especially since in the former, Goku goes SSB instead of SSJ implying he was using the power of SSG the entire time. If not it's an outlier considering SSJ2 Trunks was not Gotenks level and Goku needed SSJ2 against Ultimate Gohan who was stronger than Gotenks but not by that much. Every instance of Goku fighting in SSJ in Super has been against Non-God level opponents. Don't believe me, rewatch Goku and Vegeta vs Universe 9. If you believe Goku's base is just God Level and by going SSJ3 he becomes 400 times stronger than SSG, that means that every time Goku has used SSJ in Super, you'd have to head canon he was using less than a percentage of his power when in that form.
But honestly, that percentage being exponentially enough to perform the crazy feats he does is still viable. These characters scale to Universal solidly. The sheer amount of energy output calculated with that would make 1%, 10%, and 50% of it more than enough to Blow up the earth and even a few solar systems, as we usually see characters state in the show, such as Beerus. The power percentage moves with the amount of power. And even more proof of this is Goku being quadruple godly fatigued in the T.O.P. by the end and still pulling off everything he did. His base got stronger after absorbing the god energy. To ascend to blue, he can just toggle Godly essence and turn Super Saiyan. The godly essence itself isn't an amp on its own, since Goku doesn't naturally use God Ki.
@@GRANDMALICE Yeah and I don't doubt Goku's base is powerful. Hell, even after the tournament of power his base got stronger. I just don't believe his natural base was God-level in ROF based on how he performed against Frost(A foe even Piccolo stood a chance against) and every other foe he used normal SSJ against especially the danger trio. I have no evidence but it wouldn't surprise me if Goku's current base was stronger than Buu Saga Vegito. Being Buu Saga Ultimate Gohan level in SSJ2 then getting around 20 times stronger after the tournament of power goes to show you how strong Goku is regardless of whether or not you believe his base is just as strong as SSG.
It really seems like the staff working on the Super anime were not on the same page, with some treating Goku and Vegeta like gods in base, and others not. It’s quite frustrating, and it really makes me appreciate how simple it is in the manga.
@@blitzes3177 It kind of shows. A good example of this would be Kefla. In episode 115, the narrative was that Goku was stronger in Blue but Kefla stood a chance because he was low on stamina. They even had Goku nearly one-shot her with Kaioken. But then episode 116 comes around and Kefla suddenly rivals the Spirit Bomb and is implied to be on par with Ultra Instinct Goku as a Super Saiyan 2.
I agree with you but nobody is convinced. Also even Without absorbing God power the power scaling in Super is absolutely broken. Everybody and their mother is stronger than Bu. If we even take into account that base Goku is God level then it's all completely ridicolous and God level means nothing. Moreover blue would have no sense because regular Ssj would already be ssj ki mixed with God ki...
3:50 Goku theorized the whole Beerus>Vegito based off the blows he received which didn't kill him, if they were so astronomically stronger, Goku would have died
@@ZarrarTheLegendary I mean, the power that he showed against Goku in that context? Probably but I doubt it says ssg>Fusion ssj3 multiplier given that Goku grew in power due to the ritual
I just hope when the DBS anime comes back and they start adapting the Moro and Granola arch they don't forget that Goku and Vegeta are stronger in the anime than in the manga. I hope they adjust the villains and Z Fighters power to match what was show in the anime
What if they made it so goku absorbed ssg into base and super saiyan only because he was using his normal ki with those two forms right with the god ki after the ritual?? So it could be like super saiyan become super super saiyan god to replace ssb
there's just one thing I don't get, super Saiyan is a 50x multiplier of the individuals base power, so how is his base power as you said half his ssj power, wouldn't it be 1/50th of that power?
Does this mean that the SSJ G ritual is like regular SSJ G but Yamoshi's Spirit gives Goku temporary immortality as if he was in the otherworld I imply this since Goku has a healing factor in this form 🤔
I think the god profit that. Beruis seen is some what gotta be vageta or has to be a person related to him if u see in the film it’s a person that look like vageta but us fans thought it was yamoshi but I think yamoshi is related to vegeta that would explain why his dad a king and he’s a prince on the new planet for the sayians
goku retained power from fighting at that level.. if goku had went god then fought vageta then nothing would have changed... like the GOD himself stated simply fighting in that form at this power pushed his base to new heights or did you forget what the cat said at the end of the fight ?
Sounds like some complete bs they just made Goku put up a good fight against beerus but realistically Goku would have died at least if it was in the original dragon ball z series when shit actually made sense
It’s amazing how one error on basic SSG functionality can cause a domino effect for the rest of super
What error?
@@kingiwingi8869 in general, for example if one error or discrepancy in building an engine is found from the design can ruin the car. Because SSG design on how his power works has different attributes, it makes it a hard determination for how blue works and so one. There should just be one way, like how the original SS operates and that’s only to give you a boost in 50x with slight anger issues.
6:50 this is consistent with how Korin once said that souls killed by demons, or just people who are evil enough to classify as demons like king piccolo, don’t go to the afterlife and just wander the universe forever.
Please, can you point me out where Kirin said that? I can't remember the occasion... Thank you!
@@alessandroarsuffi9227Found it! It’s in chapter 162 page 80 of dragon ball!
@@alessandroarsuffi9227Kami also mentions it later in early dragon ball Z but I’m struggling to find the exact moment… he mentions how because Goku’s soul was headed to the afterlife despite piccolo killing him, piccolo may actually no longer be evil…
I'm glad I'm seeing more theory videos in the fandom. We used to have mr.senpai but he left youtube. Theories aren't just about what is right or wrong but to create a discussion in the fandom.
ill do my best
Someone tell me WHY SSG is Better than SSB BRUH…..
Despite how casually it's showed off in the anime, Blue is apparently really bad for stamina usage based on what we're told. God is very energy efficient, and seems to have a significant calming effect on the user, making it useful for situations where the raw strength of Blue isn't necessary. Based on how it's presented it also seems to be faster then Blue, allowing you to dart around much smoother and dodge things that Blue wouldn't be able to. This could just be an artistic thing though, I'm not sure if Blue is actually meant to be slower.
It's just not, these TH-camrs make up stuff for views
he’s right, its really that. ssg has greater speed, even tho ssb has more endurance and raw power, ssg is better for situations ur enemy is not so massively strong
It’s not. It’s just more unique in design, the color red is also more vibrant and pleasing to the eye than blue, Blue is better in terms of power and speed. And since goku and vegeta mastered blue like they did the original SSJ, it’s better in stamina now. Plus blue has the most variations out of all saiyan transformations depending on continuity, like perfected SSB, Blue kaioken and Blue evolved, Evil Berserk controlled blue and Universal blue.
Rare opinion Ik but honestly SSGSS is my favorite form. It combines both Saiyan legends and reinforces the idea that Goku has mastered the Super Saiyan state. Somehow the fact that there is no SSGSS2 or SSGSS3 makes me like it even more because Goku has evolved past needing the upgrades of Super Saiyan. Also blue is a nice color. Yeah it's a recolor but it has a good reason for being one. Golden Great Ape is a recolor for the exact same reason Blue is a recolor. SSGSS gets a lot of hate because of how the anime or specifically the tournament of power handled it but it was great in the manga and in the Broly movie.
Ssg was to under used they should of expanded on it rather than making blue
I totally agree, it is a wasted form. And the "being absorbed into base form" also is just stupid as both Goku and Vegeta don't fare any better against opponents that are expected to be on par with just regular SSJ forms without any God ki.
Like Gohan who is around SSJ3 with his Mystic form and he clearly was weaker before regaining his mystic form putting him back to where he was.
Even if Goku was holding back in his SSJ forms, he still wasn't a whole God multiplier beyond Gohan.
And now Gohan gains Berserker form without any god ki and just levels the playing field with Goku who is supposedly SSG absorbed into his base, who is now capable of going into his SSJ forms on top of it and then going into SSG again and then going SSB + Kaio-ken and then going MUI which has evolved way beyond what it was vs Jiren.
SSG should've been explored better and left to be a standalone form and no "absorbed into base" BS.
@@Diglo1that’s how the manga treats it. There is never a point where they say it was absorbed, and God is used in every arc except SuperHero.
@@Diglo1it makes no sense to have them reach those heights just to make broly and gohan catch up or pass them
No, they should've called it Saiyan God as its Base + God ki. This would make its underwhelming status more understandable because the main Saiyans ignore base form a lot since in Cell Saga Super Saiyan got perfected to a level that they could use that as their base form. So SSG being called Saiyan God would leave the intentional room to grow, and the Saiyans ascension to Super Saiyan God when they try to stack Super Saiyan on Saiyan God. SSG could then evolve into SSGSS through Vegeta to replace Blue Evolution and could then be called God Evolution as its an evolution of Super Saiyan God instead of Blue. This would also make Blue Kaioken be called God Kaioken
@@ryanthecringeanimator9541 Yh
This should have been THE god form, and it should have just been expanded upon and evolved with new techniques until perhaps ultra instinct. Which could have been a technique and not a form in its self
It was revealed that ui is a technique not a form, it only appears that way because of how goku uses it
Alright I might have a lot of people come at me and probably yell at me to debate them on discord but Goku absorbing Super Saiyan God into base is widely misunderstood by a lot of the fanbase. Yes, Goku did absorb the form but his base isn't God level, he just has the power to tap into that power. The entire reason why Super Saiyan Blue or rather Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan works is because Goku taps into the power of Super Saiyan God and goes Super Saiyan. That means when Goku uses normal SSJ forms, he's not using the power of a Super Saiyan God. I've had this debate before so I know this isn't enough to convince anyone so let me elaborate.
After the Beerus fight we never see Goku fight God level opponents in normal SSJ forms. Firstly, Frost needed to resort to cheating against Piccolo to win, the same Piccolo that lost to Tagoma and in a later arc would be confirmed to be weaker than Ultimate Gohan from the Buu Saga. Goku needed Super Saiyan against this Frost and was noticeably taking damage in base. If Goku's base was just God level, what would be the point in transforming just to hold back? Against people like Krillin, Goku had a clear objective but if Goku's base is just God level, he'd have no reason to go SSJ and on top of that, the explanation for SSB wouldn't make sense. Goku used SSJ2 and was more or less equal to Trunks. Yes he was holding back a bit but he wasn't super suppressed in the sense he was using 1% of his power. He fought Goku Black as an SSJ2 but remember, even SSJ2 Trunks was able to put up a fight against Goku Black a few times and he was far from God level. In the tournament of power we find out that SSJ2 Goku is equal to Ultimate Gohan in the Buu Saga. Before you say Gohan rivals SSB, I'll get to that in a second. Before Goku and Gohan fought, Gohan said this is my current full power which was revealed to be the same strength he had in the Buu Saga. He'd later awaken more of his power against SSB Goku so it contradicts nothing.
Every instance of Goku and Vegeta fighting God level opponents in lesser forms has always been in base except for the Beerus fight which was a one time thing. We know Goku and Vegeta can use the power of SSG without going SSG so using the Copy Vegeta arc or the Monaka episode doesn't work especially since in the former, Goku goes SSB instead of SSJ implying he was using the power of SSG the entire time. If not it's an outlier considering SSJ2 Trunks was not Gotenks level and Goku needed SSJ2 against Ultimate Gohan who was stronger than Gotenks but not by that much. Every instance of Goku fighting in SSJ in Super has been against Non-God level opponents. Don't believe me, rewatch Goku and Vegeta vs Universe 9. If you believe Goku's base is just God Level and by going SSJ3 he becomes 400 times stronger than SSG, that means that every time Goku has used SSJ in Super, you'd have to head canon he was using less than a percentage of his power when in that form.
But honestly, that percentage being exponentially enough to perform the crazy feats he does is still viable. These characters scale to Universal solidly. The sheer amount of energy output calculated with that would make 1%, 10%, and 50% of it more than enough to Blow up the earth and even a few solar systems, as we usually see characters state in the show, such as Beerus. The power percentage moves with the amount of power. And even more proof of this is Goku being quadruple godly fatigued in the T.O.P. by the end and still pulling off everything he did. His base got stronger after absorbing the god energy. To ascend to blue, he can just toggle Godly essence and turn Super Saiyan. The godly essence itself isn't an amp on its own, since Goku doesn't naturally use God Ki.
@@GRANDMALICE Yeah and I don't doubt Goku's base is powerful. Hell, even after the tournament of power his base got stronger. I just don't believe his natural base was God-level in ROF based on how he performed against Frost(A foe even Piccolo stood a chance against) and every other foe he used normal SSJ against especially the danger trio. I have no evidence but it wouldn't surprise me if Goku's current base was stronger than Buu Saga Vegito. Being Buu Saga Ultimate Gohan level in SSJ2 then getting around 20 times stronger after the tournament of power goes to show you how strong Goku is regardless of whether or not you believe his base is just as strong as SSG.
It really seems like the staff working on the Super anime were not on the same page, with some treating Goku and Vegeta like gods in base, and others not. It’s quite frustrating, and it really makes me appreciate how simple it is in the manga.
@@blitzes3177 It kind of shows. A good example of this would be Kefla. In episode 115, the narrative was that Goku was stronger in Blue but Kefla stood a chance because he was low on stamina. They even had Goku nearly one-shot her with Kaioken. But then episode 116 comes around and Kefla suddenly rivals the Spirit Bomb and is implied to be on par with Ultra Instinct Goku as a Super Saiyan 2.
I agree with you but nobody is convinced. Also even Without absorbing God power the power scaling in Super is absolutely broken. Everybody and their mother is stronger than Bu.
If we even take into account that base Goku is God level then it's all completely ridicolous and God level means nothing. Moreover blue would have no sense because regular Ssj would already be ssj ki mixed with God ki...
3:50 Goku theorized the whole Beerus>Vegito based off the blows he received which didn't kill him, if they were so astronomically stronger, Goku would have died
They would be able to hold on against beerus for longer but vegito wouldn't be enough to stop him.
@@ZarrarTheLegendary I mean, the power that he showed against Goku in that context? Probably but I doubt it says ssg>Fusion ssj3 multiplier given that Goku grew in power due to the ritual
It actually doesn't necessarily mean SSG>Vegito, since both were weaker than Beerus.
I still wonder to this day why we never got any info about yamoshi, especially not in any of the super movies
Toriyama likely forgot about him.
8:50
The panel kinda similar to SGG Sparking Zero's ultimate attack
I just hope when the DBS anime comes back and they start adapting the Moro and Granola arch they don't forget that Goku and Vegeta are stronger in the anime than in the manga. I hope they adjust the villains and Z Fighters power to match what was show in the anime
I missed the moment where explains why isn't SSJ(god absorbed)=SSJB
What if they made it so goku absorbed ssg into base and super saiyan only because he was using his normal ki with those two forms right with the god ki after the ritual??
So it could be like super saiyan become super super saiyan god to replace ssb
there's just one thing I don't get, super Saiyan is a 50x multiplier of the individuals base power, so how is his base power as you said half his ssj power, wouldn't it be 1/50th of that power?
Does this mean that the SSJ G ritual is like regular SSJ G but Yamoshi's Spirit gives Goku temporary immortality as if he was in the otherworld
I imply this since Goku has a healing factor in this form 🤔
I think the god profit that. Beruis seen is some what gotta be vageta or has to be a person related to him if u see in the film it’s a person that look like vageta but us fans thought it was yamoshi but I think yamoshi is related to vegeta that would explain why his dad a king and he’s a prince on the new planet for the sayians
DOES THE GOAT REPLY
Lmao i guess not
😂
@@MajinBird Wwwww
Why don’t they wish every saiyan alive to one planet 🧐 bc there has to be more
goku retained power from fighting at that level.. if goku had went god then fought vageta then nothing would have changed... like the GOD himself stated simply fighting in that form at this power pushed his base to new heights or did you forget what the cat said at the end of the fight ?
Hello how are you I am andar the watar 😴😴😴
Stupid cat 😾didn't know the difference between Sayian God and Super Sayian God.
Sounds like some complete bs they just made Goku put up a good fight against beerus but realistically Goku would have died at least if it was in the original dragon ball z series when shit actually made sense
You mean to say the Original DBZ series, when characters were just weaker.
@@GRANDMALICEyeah
Z didnt make much sense either dawg
First
Blue goku or god keep it 100%
@@JRuckGod
@@JRuckgod
Sorry but nowhere in the Movie, Anime, or Manga was Yamoshi ever brought up. And nowhere was it shown that Goku was talking to unseen being.
Toriyama brought up Yamoshi in an interview
@@Slapnuts9627 All he said was the first SSJ God was Yamoshi. Nothing about his spirit being there for the ritual.
FIRST