Fantastic DIY Speakers for less than $30!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ม.ค. 2018
- We demonstrate high performance, low cost, unusual audio speakers with a complete explanation of their operation and a guide to how you can construct them yourself.
- วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
My dad built some of these. And they are simply amazing! How could these sound better than $10,000 speakers? I’m hooked on audio since then. My dad is the best dad ever.
Make sure you tell him that!
With the addition of Dirac room correction technology, they become truly fantastic.
Came here for cheap DIY speakers, left with an acoustic masterclasses.
Dang introduction to phononic engineering...
I have found that experience to be par for the course on this channel. Its my favorite science class.
an*
@@faraday9234 😊
@@alejoboxcol 🙂👍 the rule is if a word following a or an starts with a vowel sound you use "an", and if it starts with a consonant sound you use "a". The spelling of the word is unimportant, its the sound the word starts with.
Seeing him standing there with the pop music playing put a smile on my face.
I just woke up my GF at that exact scene, to show her how amazing this is.. :D - She wasn't as impressed as I was
@@TheMadsrn they are never impressed with our youtube videos but they love the memes lol
You know he dances like a teenager in his shop when nobody's there
Didn’t know I’d fine some dope electronic in this video 😅 🎶
Just standing there like "yeah, listen to it baby."
Sheesh, you're long winded... i love it.
I love DIY but at times i find these informational videos just telling you WHAT to do, but im more interested in why to do things. You give us EVERYTHING. beautiful content. thank you sir.
Long windedness is what develops the brain into grasping a new concept. One of the single biggest problems of technology teaching to kids beyond the 2010s. It takes time to grow those memory branches and go deep into a subject. Thoroughness is on of this channels qualities.
Me too. I LOVE to learn. Then I can try to apply the rules of physics my own way.
LONG LIVE THE LONG-WINDED! lol
Forty-three years ago my buddy's uncle demonstrated this very thing in his 1950s-era Marin County home, which had plywood paneling as ceiling material throughout the home. He effectively turned his ceilings into speakers wherever he installed the exciters. It was amazing.
Just a few years prior, another buddy had a pair of exciters that could be screwed to anything to make it into a speaker. I came up with the novel idea of putting them in poly bags and suspending them in his swimming pool. We were blown away by the quality of the sound underwater. It lacked direction and seemed to envelop you completely no matter where you were in the pool. . Robin Trower's Bridge of Sighs never sounded so good, and hasn't since.
Thanks I think i finally have my underwater in the bathtub listening solution.
Yeah this is not new. Lafayette Radio Electronics out of New York made stryofoam speakers in the 70s that were 100% waterproof. They made excellent underwater pool speakers. They sounded ok in air...but not fantastic.
I just get annoyed by tomfoolery.."It's science". No science is based upon repeatable emperical date...not clickbait lmao.
Dude ...that's a total trip thanks for sharing your intense life experiences brew .. totes an amazing comment.
This needs to be made into a video!
Robin Trower is a guitar god. I was going to see him in Paris for my 50th birthday but the show was canceled due to the pandemic.
Wow. So interesting/informative/relatable. I’m not a sound geek, but this 31 minute video has me considering all of the DIY speaker opportunities for every room in my house. Materials... shapes... sizes... colors... music genres...
I totally agree.
This comment sounds fake. Do you know the guy who owns this channel? The comment sounds like fake reviews on a Korean electronic outlet.
This video not only cured my erectile disfunction but it also convinced me to finally accept Jesus into my life and made my hair thicker and darker. All on only 31 minutes!!!
You can hear just how loud that dance music is; 20 watts filling that big room. This is blowing my mind- too cool to say the least.
No, you can't hear how loud it is. 2 x 20W is more than enough to make sounds that can be picked up by a microphone.
// 1:08 Dayton audio exciter
// 1:30 Distributed Mode Loud speakers
// Material needs: high compression strength, high flexion
// materials that meet these: end grain balsa wood, extruded polystyrene foam (XPS), resonant spruce, pallet board (cardboard).
// 9:00 best sound performance per dollar ==> pallet board, XPS (10:30 sanded [for flex] and rounded [for resonant dampening]).
//13:10 longer ratios allow for better frequency distribution and help eliminate resonates
// 17:00 explaining why bigger or longer speakers give more dynamic sound vs even high quality speakers
// 18:00 resonance explanation
// 21:30 explaining 3/5ths rule for resonance dampening on the exciter placement
// 23:30 exciter dampening comparison
//26:22 really clear comparison of high frequency resonance dampening from strategic exciter placement
// 26:45 in home setup, explanation of setup on living room tv with two different speaker types for distribution
// 29:16 real world example
// intense DIY based off this video th-cam.com/video/gGzNkUmPdXc/w-d-xo.html
@Tech Ingredients Youre the peoples champion. The crafted quality to last man. The anti planned obsolescence hero we need. Cutting through the layers of lies and walls built by captured industry and compromised science. 🚧💡🧬💛
@A B. Thanks
22:00. Very golden ratio vibes
@@CoincidenceTheorist i think it's in part informed by musical 5ths, which happens to be apart of the golden sequence. Additionally the cut seems to be a golden ratio, where as a randomized cut may not experience the same issues. I'd be interested in checking some fibbonaci stuff too
Except manufacturer: "The ideal material for mounting an exciter is a thin, lightweight sheet of material with high compressive strength and moderate to high bending strength. The compressive strength of the material has the greatest effect on the treble extension of the resulting ‘speaker’ (affecting ‘detail’ and ‘air’), while the bending strength of the material influences the midrange and low frequency efficiency of the ‘speaker’." So, not high flexion.
@@terhohalme you mind rewriting that? I'm not sure what you're trying to say
Here are the facts from the video and an earlier post:
The XPS panels are 1" thick x 24" x 30" (mid to Hi range unit).
It is important to use XPS (Extruded PolyStyrene) panels.
The balsa panels are 1/2" thick x 30" x 36" (Lo to mid range unit).
Balsa panels may also be found as lightweight plywood panels used for commercial signs.
The radius on all panel corners is 4" and the exciters are placed on the back, off center, based on a 2/5, 3/5 rule.
So for example, the exciter on the XPS panel is located 9.6" vs 15.4" from the long sides and 12" vs 18" from the short sides.
These 2 alternate positions works equally well.
As explained in the sugar part of the video, counterweights should be fitted to dampen the resonance of the panels.
Each panel has 4 counterweights - each weighing 1/16 of the (painted) panel weight - are placed on 2/5, 3/5 points in every small rectangle created by the position of the exciter unit.
This is a bit complicated to comprehend, but watch the sugar part of the video closely, over and over until you get it.
Also in the video, there is a good explanation of how and why the selected materials and panel size results in a frequency range of 130Hz-20KHz
The original acoustic exciters used are :
Dayton 25mm DAEX25FHE-4 (4 ea.)
or as alternatives
Dayton 32mm DAEX32EP-4 (4 ea.)
However most likely you will have to source alternate makers units from Ebay, AliExpress, etc.
Links:
Dayton users guide, excellent explanation: www.daytonaudio.com/index.php/exciters-buyers-guide (scroll down)
Living room test song used, for comparison: th-cam.com/video/sGsC98vR4Q4/w-d-xo.html
(Thanks to GlenGlen !) Link to build step by step: projectgallery.parts-express.com/speaker-projects/dml-flat-pannel/
IMHO instead of using an old school bass speaker, you may experiment with a deep frequency exciter.
This is the unit some readers may recognize from a gamers chair, which literally kicks ass, when grenades are thrown in the game etc.
Depending on actual test results such units may be placed under a table top, on the wall, on the floor etc:
www.ebay.com/itm/50MM-Resonanzdampfer-Alle-Resonanz-Lautsprecher-Vibration-Starke-Bass-Speaker-fs/292413284916?hash=item441530a234:g:eCQAAOSww85aer26
Thank you for your time and effort explaining your building methods :-)
Thank You, Thank You, Thank You. James here in Sacramento California but originally from Dublin Ireland by skill set a finish carpenter but performed as a general contractor specializing in kitchen and bathroom remodel. Due to the exhaustive juggling of other trades trying to keep to the start and end dates of the contract, I studied electrical, plumbing, sheetrock, mud, texturing etc etc. Due to the downturn, my age and health I've been looking for my third act performance and with every one of your amazing tutorials, your passion and ability to make MIT level theories understandable to masses, I am again bursting with business ideas for the future. Thank You for rekindling a dampened spirit. Your hands on, blue collar skills mixed with an extensive knowledge base, experience, intellect and genuine love of instruction and teaching is so very, very rare. Considering the number of bad channels on YT, you're truly the diamond in the rough. Thank You. Sheamus.
Do you have a DIY video on the 50mm resonance dampers for bass? Thanks
Thank you!
Thanks CX.
This guy is the science teacher I wish i always had...
Nee lass mal. Der labert nur Blödsinn. Stimmt nämlich nicht was er sich so zusammenreimt.
@@Statist0815 Ich würde es nicht als Unsinn bezeichnen. Aber wenn Sie versuchen wollen, zeigen Sie mir Ihre Videos.
People like this guy are never teachers
If you are watching the video, he is the science teacher you now have.
You can't find teachers like this because they're working.
5 years later, and this is still first on my recommended list after every other DIY speaker video I watch.
Absolutely
You never disappoint with any of your videos! I'm extremely fond of your style and methodology of creating your videos. I became a Mechanical Engineer because I not only wanted to get a formal education on how to create new things, but also wanted to know *why* things do what they do in our world. Then, each one of those little nuggets of knowledge became tools & components to build more complex tools, components, devices, and projects.
In other words, I enjoy the way you show how to build very interesting projects, but truly appreciate how you are extremely adept at explaining what is occurring and why it is doing so!
Thank you for such excellent videos!
Sorry for the microphone quality in this video. We’ve ordered a different model for all of our videos and the next segment in the series. Thanks for watching!
In the beginning of the video everything was fine.. but as you presented the speaker the sound was right focused and really hard to listen.. so what did you change?
Tech Ingredients could you please give a few links of the information source and I am also interested in the European company you talked about. I would love to do some research myself.
So does that mean a Fantastic DIY Microphones for less than $30 video?
haha yes! enclosed in a tin can with string-themed cabling for an old school vibe
Material list?
I would be glad if the speakers and materials were listed in the description.
The information you require is in his previous videos.
Totally agree!!
Please list them so we don't have to search for them in previous videos.
I am not a native English speaker so I don't understand every single word or detail that you say, so please list the materials and speakers!!
@@GaryMcKinnonUFO In the video he names three materials as having the best properties. Balsa panels for low tones, XPS for high tones and some sort of cardboard for both. Which cardboard is it? Could not find it on the net
@@konsstar Hi Konstantin, acoustic material is an area i know very little about i'm afraid, but if you google for cardboard speakers there are some results that look helpful.
@@GaryMcKinnonUFO Thanks!!! I have tried search for all sorts of cardboard but not for the most logical thing "cardboard speakers". I'll try that!
I knew this guy by the name of Al Wright. He used to work at a particle accelerator but his passion was winding voice coils and building speaker enclosures. The dude was wicked smart. He was an awesome person and I miss him everyday. You remind me A LOT of him, Thanks.
This video serves as an excellent demonstration for how peer-reviewed science could transition more towards video medium rather than written. Very well done and well explained!
Thanks!
I agree with you.
This is the channel I didn't know I was looking for.
I love your explorer-style attitude where you say, "I decided to ignore the recommendation of the manufacturer" and then proceed to test a whole raft of random materials. THAT dogged dedication and persistence is how cool stuff seems to get invented. Those things sound fantastic. I'd love to hear Dixie Dregs Dregs of the Earth over those babies. That used to be my sound system test record.
19:20 What an awesome way to design artistic patterns!
You Sir...
Have just earned yourself another subscriber.
I've been into audio equipment for my entire life.
What you're uploading is 'Pure Gold'.
You got some real knowledge
Presenter: "These speakers function similarly to shaped anti-tank charges."
Me, an idiot gamer, "I understand now."
Except it's wrong. The focussing effect doesn't come from the shape of the radiator but from the fact that it is extended in space, i.e. not a point source. An array consisting of one speaker atop another will have the same horizontal dispersion as a single speaker but focussed vertically. One beside another will have the same vertical dispersion but focussed horizontally. A square array of four will focus the sound both horizontally and vertically. (The fact that the piston is not a point source does affect phase because the outer part won't start moving forward at the same time as the inner part attached to the actuator, but only after a delay depending on the speed of sound in the piston material, but this is not relevant to what is happening for ideal radiators. For them the focussing will happen even though all portions move together.) Excerpting from Harry F. Olson, Elements of Acoustical Engineering, D. Van Nostrand & Co, 1940: "A sphere vibrating radially radiates sound uniformly outward in all directions. A portion of a spherical surface, large compared to the wavelength and vibrating radially, emits uniform sound radiation over a solid angle subtended by the surface at the center of curvature. To obtain uniform sound distribution over a certain solid angle, the radial air motion must have the same phase and amplitude over the spherical surface intercepted by the angle having its center of curvature at the vertex and the dimensions of the surface must be large compared to the wavelength. When these conditions are satisfied for all frequencies, the response characteristic will be independent of the position within the solid angle." Think of it this way: the sound coming from the middle of the cone is hemmed in by the sound coming from the surrounding part of the cone. This causes the (over-) pressure of the sound coming from the middle to be higher than it would be if the middle part were the whole thing, just as though the middle part was radiating into a megaphone. (It's the same for the underpressure but harder to visualize.) The radiation is focused because the radiation coming from the more peripheral parts of the cone acts like an invisible megaphone. The air in front of the middle just can't get out of the way as easily because it is hemmed in by the pressurized air around it.
@@lewisgoudy863 ahhh the here's what I know comment, a good teacher will explain concisely and in a way that is appropriate for his audience. What is true for one student at one level is not going to be true for another.
@@jgdublin I like that: "the here's what I know comment".
@@lewisgoudy863 You have obviously never seen an EFP charge before. lol
@@Justin-bd2dg The physics of shaped charges involves shock. That of loudspeaker mechanisms does not. In the first case, the effective pistons move faster than the local speed of sound: in the explosive charge the reaction front propagates faster than the speed of sound in the explosive, that is, it detonates rather than deflagrates. Similarly, the air-charge boundary that couples the two moves faster than the speed of sound in air (at whatever temperature, pressure, and relative humidity it happens to be at the time).
Per Wikipedia,
Shock waves are formed when a pressure front moves at supersonic speeds and pushes on the surrounding air.[8] At the region where this occurs, sound waves travelling against the flow reach a point where they cannot travel any further upstream and the pressure progressively builds in that region; a high pressure shock wave rapidly forms.
Shock waves are not conventional sound waves; a shock wave takes the form of a very sharp change in the gas properties. Shock waves in air are heard as a loud "crack" or "snap" noise. Over longer distances, a shock wave can change from a nonlinear wave into a linear wave, degenerating into a conventional sound wave as it heats the air and loses energy. The sound wave is heard as the familiar "thud" or "thump" of a sonic boom, commonly created by the supersonic flight of aircraft."
See also M.E.H van Dongen, ed. Shock Wave Science and Technology Reference Library, especially Vols 1 (Multiphase Flows I) and 6 (Detonation Dynamics), Springer, 2007 and 2012.
I am starting to think that this guy just genuinely enjoys the sound of high pitched pure sine waves.
This guy blew the curve in every physics class he ever took.
These videos are hidden gems in the jungles of youtube . Anybody can do anything , but when passion , knowledge ,and dedication meet greatness is born . You are the greatest teacher
I have ever seen and listened to . A big THANK YOU for doing what you do !
If I gotta but a sub tho for any bass past 100 hz then like that cancels out the adorability innovative diy layers / awe factors crazy fast so I’m most confused
"Like shaped anti-tank charges" LOL! That got a little dark out of nowhere! Love this vid!
Expected clickbait... got gold! High 5!
Gives high five
Expected clickbait - subscribed instead.
I finally built some! I used 700mmx400mmx5mm acrylic with a single 20w 4ohm driver on each, placed in the golden ratio for the highs. I'll be pairing them with some bamboo panels once they arrive! They sound beautiful already and I can't wait to experiment more with these!
Thank you TI for the awesome introduction to this intriguing and rewarding hobby!
Man, every now and then TH-cam recommends these, actually interesting videos to me. I'm glad I found this gem of a video.
Thanks!
AntonioKowatsch Ai is getting better
This sounds similar to a speaker system I ran across in the early to mid 70s. I think they were called "PolyPlaner" speakers. They were made completely from polystyrine plastic except for the voice coil/exciter. Mine were about 12" x 16" and sounded great. I had a bar between the kitchen and living room so I replaced some of the wood paneling with two of these and it sounded great. In the open air they were a little 'tinny' with an emphasis on higher frequencies but when mounted in the space under the bar the solid mounting and the resonance of the cabinet space under the bar made them sound really good. At the time I had a Craig 2000 stereo system which was considered fairly high end at the time, and these speakers were comparable to the original Craig speakers except for the power handling capability. At high volume levels they started distorting before the original Craig speakers would.
love this video, i have been trying to figure out a way to build my own speakers and this method seems a lot more simpler than electro static speakers without suffering quality loss.
In our next video in this series, I will perform some calibrated diagnostics as well as introduce some software and hardware to further enhance performance.
what was the thickness of material and final dimmensions?
Will you also discuss construction dimensions and parts? I couldn't tell which Dayton exciter you are using.
The XPS panels are 1' thick x 24" x 30" with 4" radii for the corner rounding. The balsa panels are 1/2" thick x 30" x 36" with 4" radii and the exciters are placed on the back, off center, based on a 2/5, 3/5 rule. So for example, the exciter on the XPS panel is located 9.6" vs 15.4" from the long sides and 12" vs 18" from the short sides. These work equally well.
DAEX32EP-4
DAEX25FHE-4
Thank you for this video, I now know what, where, and most importantly how to bring audio to my shop.
subscribed and looking forward to more videos!
This man has a niche knowledge that makes him and this video fascinating. Clearly, this dude loves sound waves. Keep it up and thank you.
the amazing thing is that he seems to have that niche knowledge of about 1000 topics
Your pejorative comment may be a projection of your inability to fathom the vast body of knowledge that is covered in Tech Ingredients.
@@brucecampbell6133 nailed it
@Luke
This was just a side project, didn't you watch the intro? He does all kinds of stuff.
@@brucecampbell6133 thanks for making my word of the day: pejorative
"Visually that's beautiful, acoustically that's loud as %$&*" I love this channel, as one comment on a different video described, he's like the Mr. Rogers of science. I couldn't agree more, thank you so much for this amazing, amazing content and so much to learn, so so much to learn, each video is like a wonderful science class. Thank you.
Mr. Wizard is more appropriate than Mr. Rogers.
*lousy
The more I watch your work product, the more I enjoy it. You have, obviously, found your true calling. Thank you for your most excellent videos, ideas and information.
21:21 this is getting better and better! I feel like a kid at an amusement park. I can't express how much I'm enjoying this! I had to pause the video to calm down a bit, this is glourious!! thank you so much for sharing your knowledge!
this is possibly one of the coolest videos youtube has ever recommended
I had to smash the like button when he got through explaining how many materials they tested the drivers on. Awesome dedication here!
Man thank you for sharing your knowledge and passion with all of us! I’m really looking forward to building these.
About time someone with Engineering knowledge explains acoustics. Great work and please keep it up...
I’m using a pair of these made from 12x24 inch corrugated styrene panels for tv watching. Best bang for the buck in any audio configuration i have ever put together. Actually, more realistic than any small to medium sized format stereo speakers I have used. All of this guy’s vids are fascinating.
And low profile, thats an important feature in a compact TV room.
Nothing beats a great human using great science to generate such beauty! Thank you very much Mr, for improving my life!!
Thank you so much for all your time and effort here. Simply fantastic!
I have no idea how this ended up on my "recommended" list from TH-cam, but I'm glad I checked it out. Fascinating information and from out of the blue, put a new project on my to-do list. Just great stuff!
Love the speaker/audio subjects! I must admit that one good thing about COVID-19 is that it's gotten me to watch more of your videos again!
My man!!! This is some knowledge I gained within such a small amount of time... Thank you so much for sharing your experience with us... I knoe how much time u have spent to master these speakers...!!! You motivated me to make my own set of speakers.... Thank you! Be safe!!!
we can tell that you love what you do. a lot of people out there kinda just do things. they aren't passionate about it. i can tell you are passionate. and it makes listening to you and this video extremely enjoyable. if only more people were as passionate at what they do.
AvE sent me hear, and I'm glad he did. Most impressive speakers!!
Hi Eric
What vid was it. I follow him but I ended up here on accident
Robi Flego Me too. But was very much thinking about AvE during this vjo. AvE's alter? Same-same, only different.
If you're a patreon you get early access to AVE's vids. It'll drop on youtube within the next day or two.
who asked anything about early acces? why do you just assume he isnt a patron?
Back in my studio recording days we found that the large 4 x 8' 1-2" thick rigid yellow fiber glass panels did an excellent job at absorbing frequencies from about 250hz-20,000khz+ bass on the other hand requires a trap which allows the wide wave to enter into a chamber which then reflects the wave into a beveled edge diffusing the signal. These are easily made from birch plywood and essentially look like L shaped brackets, easy to google a design. As long as you cover the wood surfaces with fiberglass you can effectively eliminate a "room sound". This was great for eliminating standing waves, and unwanted microphone reflections.Some invaluable tools for that job were a cheap $99 table saw, a dril, and a kreg jig. The insulations is about $25 for a 4 x 8' panel. This btw was a cool video and interesting to see how the sound changed with each substrate. A microphone, a vst plugin spectral analyser, and a sine wave sweep will go a long ways if you are interested in seeing exactly what is being diffused vs reflected.
This is the sort of interesting/helpful comment that should be at the top. ;) Sort it out google algorithms, I know you can do it.
I just watched this again. Latex primer can be painted onto that styrene if you want to get more aggressive with the spray paint.
Mr. Tech, - Y.O.U. are just what TH-cam needed, and what LOTS of people obviously want,... To make this forum more useful, entertaining, and relevant to our lives!!! Bravo!
Excellent technical!! You lay out very understandable audio laws and how doppler and other ways that sound disperses in space. Thank you for the time you took to put this together.
Thanks.
@@TechIngredients Friend, what about *composite* materials? Like, in 26:40, you have one styrofoam panel + one "balsa wood" (?) panel, what if you glue a tiny layer of styrofoam on balsa wood, or even more layers (like styrofoam -> balsa -> styrofoam, or balsa -> styrofoam -> balsa, or styrofoam -> balsa -> aluminum, etc...)? Or put a strip of balsa "somewhere" in a styrofoam panel? Different sizes/shapes/etc... of mixed material? Of course the "sound will sound" (😂) different, etc... But... Maybe the "compensation" of one material over the other can be in the same panel and not on different panels/"speakers"?
"you don't want to use a metal"
*plays music that rings through the plate*
yeah nah, I'm gonna incorporate that into a performance synth, that reverb is amazing
If you haven't seen it, there's a guy on TH-cam (LeoMakes) that made a plate reverb out of fairly cheap Ikea material, I'd recommend giving it a look
@@GargoyleBard I'll check it out, thanks!
Hell ya physical effects are badass. Spring reverb is old school af
Oh man... this is perfect for my new living room speakers!
I cant believe that I was able to understand this experiment. Man!! He's an excellent teacher!
Originally discovering Tech Ingredients while he (Doc) built, tested a step-by-step process of how to build a working Rail Gun, complete with safety concerns, as always, his projects have kept me on this channel. Speakers?? Wow, once again, you have floored me. They reminded me of ribbon speakers until you pulled the curtain back, oh great Oz, to show us a $30 speaker.
Congrats on getting over your 500K goal!!
Very interesting topic! Thank you very much for sharing your expereince with different materials!
With my 25 years of experience in speaker technologies I would put a (maybe flat) sealed enlosure on the back of the panels to get more volume in the bass section. Another possibility is to keep at least a distance of 1.5 metres to every wall. That's why in the demo at 29:14 the panels are unfortunately totally lacking bass.
What you describe at 3:30 is, I think, the general difference in sound quality between dipoles and monopoles. You could test that with the same panel with and without an enclosure.
I would not fully agree with what you say at 29:00 that they do not require a crossover. I would assume that the frequency ranges of both different panels have an overlap over a wide range. The sound would clearly benefit from a crossover then. I'd also assume that there are dips and peaks in the overlapping area, at least due to different speeds of sound in each material and therefore differing acoustical phase. Try it out, it's not that hard to design a crossover. I made a tutorial for 2-way speakers: th-cam.com/video/5Kvl0iBQ0L0/w-d-xo.html.
A second one for fullrange drivers is coming tomorrow.
A material what perfectly fits your description at 5:20 is rubber. This of course has to be attached to a stiff frame. An irregularly shaped foam damping on the edges might also help against resonances (caused by wave reflections on the edges). There's a legendary driver which exactly follows this principle: the Manger MSW.
From metal plates (the higher the speed of sound within the better) I'd expect the most detailed sound if you eliminate the ringing/resonances with a crossover. This might lead to a small plate to shift resonances far enough into treble and a big plate for mids and bass in a 2-way system. Maybe round plates are better because they might have fewer but stronger resonances.
There's an intersting paper about exciters by the German speaker manufacturer Visaton: www.visaton.de/downloads/pdf/visaton_exciter_principles.pdf (also available in German).
Anyway, I now feel the urge to also experiment with exciters. If I do that one day, I'll also make a video about it.
Base is weak with this speaker. The problem with sealing an enclosure on the back is that the principle of a freely vibrating sound generator is lost. The result would be a conventional speaker with a rather heavy, unconventional cone. Restricting the edges in any way will limit the movement toward the center of the panel. A piano doesn't need an enclosure. I am working on applying exciters to much thinner surfaces, unusual shapes and phasing multiple exciters. Your suggestion about rubber is interesting, I will test it.
We are studying these speakers with a calibration system and the initial results show an extremely broad overlap for the different materials. I'm not sure if a cross over would be useful, but it would be simple to try it, so thanks.
Moving away from the wall helps if you have the room.
1.5 meters from every wall? Ain't nobody got space for that!
The base response of these speakers has nothing to do with their proximity to the surrounding walls. This is easy to demonstrate by simply moving one of these speakers to the center of the room; the sound quality remains virtually unchanged. The lack of base response in panel speakers derives from the wavelength of low frequency sounds. A 100Hz sound has a wavelength over 3 meters long. The longest bending mode of a panel with less than a meter of length would require an outboard mass or a stiffness reduction that would undermine its reproduction of higher frequency sounds. Larger panels will do better and they perform as well or better at higher frequencies as well.
As you try other materials, have you given consideration to glass? Heavier than the foam board, but definitely thinner. Rounding corners and hanging with wires could be tricky, and then there's the whole shattering thing to watch out for... But I think it would be an awesome transmitter of sound waves.
Here from AvE.
Now that that's out of the way... I am curious to see if there is further resonance damping, if you cut a wavy pattern into the sides of the panels (kind of like taking your "radii & round-over" efforts to the next level.) This would leave only the flat, front surface as the primary emitter, and might reduce internal reflections, I think?
I use these on my sailboat. This gives me the ability to have music/sound (I also have one for my marine communications radio) on any boat surface I want. I have them stuck to the inside surface of my cockpit for a no-holes speaker!
Nice! Have you stuck them on your hull and played music for the whales and dolphins?
I have yet to watch one of your videos and not come away with a sense of awe. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and intellect with us!
Your demonstration really was 10 out of 10! Thank you my friend.
Quite interesting. I'm amazed at how inexpensive each speaker/sound board is, especially considering the quality of the sound. What I find even more fascinating is the patterns in the sugar sprinkles. Thank you for sharing your results. As usual you never disappoint, no matter what the subject is.
Thanks for all your work producing theses videos. The wealth of knowledge and inspiration is just amazing.
Thanks. That's nice to hear.
Big Thanks from Sydney/Australia ...will give it a go ...did this back in the 1960 or so, a teenager, with big cardboard boxes & rudimentary actuaters . This is a great innovation .
Having a crossover for your home speaker setup would still be a good idea as the efficiency of the drivers will improve if they have to reproduce less frequenties.
How does this channel not have millions of subscribers? Very high quality information!
We're on our way. Your comment helps. Linking and referring helps a lot and is appreciated.
The quality of video and sound aren't there yet. Look at the difference between this channel and a channel like Veritasium.
@@Silmerano Veritasium is certainly more polished (and I like that channel very much as well), but I can build things with the information found in this channel. So what I meant is that the information within the video is very useful/actionable, not that the video/audio itself is particularly professionally produced.
@@damonsisk4270 I was just saying it's very rare for a channel to have millions of subscribers without that polish.
The answer is in your comment... Very high quality content...Let us not forget how dumb the masses can be lol.
I'd be interested to see a frequency-amplitude graph measured from these DIY speakers and for comparison the same measurement for some commercial speakers.
Make sure to plot the price too.
@@digitalradiohacker You get what you pay for.
@@Oneness100
No you don't.
I recently rebuilt some VERY expensive crossovers from a car audio install. The internal resistors were rated 5W, despite the speakers that came with the set being rated at 250WRMS. I'm aware that the 250 number is AC and the 5W number is (hopefully) continuous, but were the lifted PCB traces and charred glass fibre really required?
You RARELY get what you pay for nowadays. People are just too easily pleased and too quick to accept the throwaway society forced on us.
I'm not saying that cheap junk is decent quality, but spending money is NO guarantee of quality either. To get decent clobber, you have to understand what you are buying, not just throw credit cards at it.
@@digitalradiohacker were those xovers made by an installer, and used to divide multiple components on one amp channel?
Its pretty rare to see a xover built by a mfr fail.
@@batvette
No, they were OEM.
They clearly didn't do the AC RMS to DC calculations correctly, and as a result, the resistors became so hot they cracked their ceramic bodies, lifted the PCB traces and charred the fibreglass substrate.
Another example of marketing over engineering.
This seems ideal for disguising speakers into furniture. Saving this for future DIY projects
This gentleman just explained what Mr. Klipsch figured out years ago, just different verbiage. Then begins, how do I make an enclosure acceptable for mass production. Excellent job sir! Really! Greatly appreciated!!
Thank you for the interesting video. I would like to point out a few things for anyone more interested in the details of audio reproduction, below.
You mentioned that traditional coned speakers are like a piston. But for clarification these audio exciter elements are also a piston. In fact this device is just the voice coil and motor of a traditional speaker element but without the cone attached. Magnetostatic panel speakers are also "pistons" albeit the configuration of the voice coil, magnetic field and the driver diaphragm are different. Electrostatic speakers, as you know, do not rely on magnetic interaction but instead to voltage differential, but ultimately it too is just a "piston", a mechanical surface, pushing air.
The only type of speaker element I can think of that isn't a piston is the plasma speaker. You should research those if you want to learn more about a building a speaker that isn't a piston pushing air.
And just for further clarification:
The reason why traditional speaker elements use a cone diaphragm instead of a flat surface like in the speakers you built here, is that a cone offers a good combination of stiffness and light weight. The demonstration you show between 20 and 26 minute mark beautifully shows this: because the speaker element is flat and not optimally stiff, the edges of the diaphragm move at different velocity to the place where the driver is mounted which means that the sugar does not move all at once. This happens with both plates but the weighted plate has fewer resonant frequencies.
What you are demonstrating there is the inherent weakness of a flat driver which isn't uniformly pushed. The different velocities at centre and edge will in fact create distortion in the audio. You should repeat your test with a coned element and a magnetostatic speaker to really see the difference between a good driver and an optimal driver.
Furthermore traditional speaker elements are typically enclosed in a box to reduce the dipole effect which, in the case of panel speakers like this, means that the speaker is outputting the same signal but in negative phase from the back. Both magnetostatic and electrostatic dipoles also do this, which is why they are less popular than boxed speakers. To get the best sound out of a dipole speaker you will need to place it optimally like Marius Loubeeka mentioned below. This is because the negative phase sound from the back is reflected from the back wall and leads to, you guessed it, phase cancellation.
Finally if you are serious about building speakers I would recommend investing in a measurement microphone and making sure that your audio samples are like for like. Cheap good measurement microphone for example is the Behringer ECM8000. When publishing listening samples always record at equal distance and equal volume, and preferably normalise the audio samples in post.
I'll be happy to further explain any of the above.
Wrong Mr Many Words. A Piston generally travels in a straight line like a .....piston in an ICE engine so as such ANY panel speaker by nature CAN'T act as a singular circle in a tube as regular speakers are - a circular "cylinder" pushing air. So whatever terminology you want to use for multi planed methods of pushing air at different times in 3D space unlike what an x-y axis speaker cone does - don't call it a dumb piston because that's not how acoustics work. A driver? Yes but that's not the point at all here or are you slow? You seem not to know about how an acoustic guitar works where the "different velocities" of the wood carefully braced produces no distortion by design. Have you heard a carbon fiber acoustic guitar? Again, a 'mechanical surface pushing air" as you say in no way has to be a piston and with panels it isn't. Sounds to me like if you are old school you need a refresher on cheap - and a refresher on simple 'transmission line' speaker tech and stop all your blather and obfuscation about electrostatic and "what you need" - remember - $30.
@@cuda426hemi Whether or not you are correct is completely overshadowed by the fact that you are a jackass.
Hey, what if we make a cone shape with 9 small flat panels attached with angles and use it with a single speaker at the middle panel.
@@cuda426hemi A dick. Look in the mirror to see one.
Well in actuality all speakers have to function in what you call a piston fashion, as all sound is is pressure differentials traveling through the air. In order to generate those differentials you must push or pull the gas that fills the space. Period. So no plasma speakers are not different at all, they work by heating the air, hot air takes more space so it displaces the surrounding gas, this creates a preasure wave. In effect the plasma speaker just uses the air itself as the piston element, the one caveat to ths is that unlike any other contemporary element there is no dipole effect (the gas expands in all directions, so there is no out of phase wave in the opposite direct).
As for your point about the shape of the diaphragm being conical, I'm sure that directing the sound is a useful additional feature of that dimension. I'd like to add that perhaps using voice coils of particular shape (I.e. taht of the panel) or placing smaller voice coils in strategic locations around the panel (such as the corners, middle of the sides, and center) would overcome the stiffness deficit.
thank you.
The nlightn panels I had from carlsbor, back in the early 2000s, were amazing. They had 5 drivers, I think. 100w input. The guys who made them said that the placement was more of an art than science, and 2 of the drivers were out of phase with the other two. I guess that's an active version of the passive damping you've used.
They really shone when used in reflective environments - we had a party in an old warship, and the JBL speakers made the place into an echoing hell. Put the flat panels into the mix and suddenly all the reflections kinda went away. Some interaction between the chaotic wavefront and the pistonic wave front
Tectonic audio makes huge ones of these, with ribbon tweeters for the high frequency fidelity
I was a bouncer at a large nightclub for about 6 years, and I gotta say, when I go to a bar as a patron now I behave exactly like you do at 14:30 😆, and after a good buzz I get a little crazy and behave like you at 15:30 with just a hint of head nodding.
Love your videos - you've sent me down a learning rabbithole and I can't think of a better use for my spare time than learning!
I also couldn't help but notice your counterweighted plate with 2 iterations of the 2/5 - 3/5 rule applied looks like the fractal orientation that many renaissance paintings adhere to in terms of focal points. Music for the eyes!
Thank you for the comprehensive explanation, VERY interesting! I might build some of these to pair with my home audio subwoofer
Building my office/mancave. Going to dedicate my whole back wall to making these panel speakers. Thanx to you.
😎👌
Aluminum, 9:23
Sqaure Extruded Polystyrene, 11:19
Balsa Wood End Grain, 12:01
Long Extruded Polystyrene 13:21
Balsa Wood and Polystyrene End Grain Stereo Pair: 14:30 :
(Save me by Deamn)
Final Extruded PolyStyrene and Balsa Wood 4 speaker System: 29:11
Aluminium
I
@@Erksah68 shut up europoor
Aluminum seems to have the most bass ?
@@luis100002 god thanks i was started to think i'm alone haha
Have you experimented with the ideal thickness of the material(s) or maybe even a graduated thickness from one end (or corner) to the other? sanding or shaving the polystyrene/balsa might not be all that difficult, and could possibly preproduce the same effects as adding/removing counterweights.
Outstanding video and a wonderful idea as is!!!
I've made over a thousand Native American Style flutes and nothing beats cross gain wood for sound. Will be making some speakers like this using that wood. Cross grain woods come off in small pieces if you use a block plane on them. You can get wider boards so I'll band saw them thin then run the boards through a larger sander. Four or five passes will erase a pencil line so when their flat they'll be ready for the test. Thank you for this tip, great video.
Great video! Also came over from Ave have a couple of speakers laying around, looking forward to trying this! Also my dogs took notice to your vid!! I also loved the line "whatever this is science " Thanks!
My neighbors dog started barking like crazy too. 😄
I may have missed it, but what was the recommendation as far as panel thickness and the sound properties it introduces?
Wow very very impressed by you and your knowledge and the down to earth explanation of the speaker build. You have motivated me to build a pair of these speakers. Thank you.
I am surprised it took me so long to find this channel, however, I'm glad I did. I have only watched a few of your videos so far, but I can already tell I will enjoy the rest of them. Thank you for providing this content.
Sure and welcome.
I also found this from AvE.
I've tinkered with this type of speaker before, wish I had this excellent analysis/testing back then. My attempts were with CNC'ing some flex points in aluminum covered polyfoam insulation board.
When I saw that APU thing at the start I knew this was going to be good and subscribed before you even got to the speakers. =)
Thanks! Just wait, here comes the jet.
My Honda Ridgeline has exciters attached to the inside of the composite (plastic) truck bed panels. Sounds amazing.
I thought it was electrostatic?
A very in depth research on the subject and an awesome presentation with great flow that doesn't create confusion on the information provided.
You win the internet today. I thoroughly enjoyed this video.
as a hobby audio producer this makes me really happy to listen to lol
I always enjoy the depth and detail of your videos, thank you!
As always. Detailed, informative and creative. Thank you for the content!
Outstanding work, I am sooo glad I subscribed. Best thing this year so far! Thank You so much from Canada!
Great video, I really like DIY with stuff like this. Keep up the great work!
I wish I had a mentor like you when I was younger. Great job.
fascinating demonstration on resonance and I really applaud your thoroughness examining such a variety of different materials. Very informative.
I adore your content. There aren't many intellectuals making videos that stay on topic, and don't tarnish or withhold data.
Thank you!
Perfect background *speaker for the digital piano.*
This could simulate the wooden soundboard in the digital piano.
epSos.de Also very unobtrusive in the space.
That's a good idea...
Piano soundboards work very differently to this. They're tuned for the frequencies produced by the piano strings to accentuate the sound. You will probably also excite the strings, causing them to vibrate over the music.
Don't get me wrong, I full endorse the idea out of curiosity, but you may find that it doesn't give you the effect that you're after. I actually once did an IR response on a piano and stuck it through a digital convolution reverb, which gave some pretty interesting results.
Please do a video if you ever get around to trying this!
Monicky2 IR?
@@brainmind4070 Impulse response, aka a recording of how the piano responds to the sound the strings produce
What I love about your videos is that not only are they INCREDIBLY well made, I always learn something new from them.
And as some have said numerous times in your comments in multiple videos, your content is impossible to skip, and even if I'm a little bit stressed at the time of watching, somehow, I forget about it and my stress induced brain-fog fades as I get hyped for the NERD shit being presented to me in a fashion that makes you feel smart, but also genuinely make you smarter and motivates one to learn more.
TL;DR you a cool dude.
Incredibly well made. Whoever edits them has a bright future in making 1990s straight to VHS Christian movies.
I would love for you to revisit your home speakers by making a complete diy surround sound system with more of these speakers. Thanks so much for all of your videos through the years.
We did a couple of months ago. Check it out.
@Tech Ingredients Thanks for replying. Was that the one with the sound booth? I did watch that and loved it. I was thinking more about making a surround sound system for the living room to watch movies. I also wanted to ask if you thought these exciters would be good Dayton Audio DAEX25 Sound Exciter Pair
They are smaller and attach in 4 locations instead of one location. They have 3 arms attaching in the center plus 3 arms attach. I would put the link but it is huge.
Years ago Yamaha had such a speaker they made for Fender that used a foam diaphragm, but it was polygonal, and the sides were all different lengths. With the offset of the driver, there were a lot of different resonant wavelengths created.
Awesome I've got the build a pair of these speakers. I just love your videos they're great.
In the special FX industry, we paint extruded polystyrene by first painting the surface using a heavy solids water-based paint, such as craft store gesso (traditionally a mixture of hide-glue and chalk, now there are synthetics). Then give it a light sanding, clean it with a tack cloth, and then spraypaint as regular. If lazier, you can use craft store acrylic and just be happy; or follow a basecoat of white or neutral grey acrylic, adequate drying time, and the spraypaint of your choice. Make the first coat of spraypaint just a super light dusting.
Spraying at a long distance can cause the spraypaint to not adhere properly, which can cause it to wear much more quickly.
Fantastic content. I might have to add this to my project list.
The water based glue prep was the technique described in the Part Express project galley description of these speakers. We elected to use the simple spray paint technique because the micro-porous surface created during the sanding process is beneficial to the sound quality and provides some recessed surface to protect the paint. Nevertheless, these panels are quite fragile by nature and need careful handling..
Kilz might work in place of gesso too. It uses VM&P naphtha for thinner which is harmless to most plastics.
Maybe a water soluble dye like india ink in a spray bottle would work
came here for cheap speakers left a master, you are amazing , im going to integrated this to my studio, and add this to my tv for movies you are a talented guy
I have worked in audio engineering for nearly 40 years and have always been intrigued by NXT (here in the UK)/DML systems. However I have never heard them, what is the stereo image like. All the known physics of stereo/immersive sound shows that point sources are better at conveying position and generating sound fields. The Quad ELS systems use a series of concentric rings that are energised via a delay line (time 0 is in the centre) as the wave length increases the outer bigger rings are energised at a time 10s of micro seconds later. By placing the the actuator in the centre and cutting a series of concentric circles using a V cut V with one vertical side would break up resonances and possible delay the signal as it propagates to the edge. Thanks for the interesting video.
Damn you crazy audiophile! Those are some amazing speakers for their power rating.
Also, if it hasn't been mentioned yet, the exact speaker is DAEX25FHE-4. Currently $8.25 on Parts Express, not including shipping.
FuzzyWuzzy thanks, I was surprised not to find a list of materials or at least a link to a web page with those details.
Exciters like these can be purchased cheaply pretty much anywhere. I think the exact kind isn't very important.
Formaldehyde Eyeball
They sell and have stores worldwide.
Thank you was wondering about that
I finally got some time to make these and OMG ! Tech Ingredients was right !! Now I can get rid of my Towers !! Now my Son wants some lol. I played some Jadyn Rylee music thru them also lol. Now that was GOOOD ! I haven't even messed with the EQ yet lol
yep - I came here from AVE and I also subscribed to your channel. It looks exciting some of the things you are working on- I wanna see what shakes out!
Yump. I already ordered a pair of the exciters