Loveliest ,most handsome ,impeccable dressed, articulate, poised man ever I've seen & heard perform Many times in Boston. Especially treasured is his memory with georgious singer MICHELE at Milton concert.. So generously he has given many new or upcoming music artists a start in his band.DE DANNON. Well what a gift & wonder of this world 🌎 FRANKIE GAVIN IS.
Just had the good fortune to see this fine Master Class. Thank you very much Mr. Gavin for such an informative class. Linda Caul (just learning to play the fiddle)
Re: the angle of the bow Q asked at about 5:30 on this clip. On a properly haired bow (and they aren't always rehaired correctly) the bow hairs act as a ribbon. Classical style tilts the bow away from the bridge, so that only the very edge of this ribbon contacts the string. It takes a lot of control to sustain long notes with pure and even tone, and classical technique requires extreme efficiency to pull maximum tone and volume out of the instrument. Even when classical music becomes more rhythmic, the bow remains tilted to a degree, because it allows precision of attack. Unless they also master the folk fiddling technique, classical violinists can sound almost too clean to be authentic fiddlers. This degree of precision is rare to non-existent in other genres. More rhythmic styles (Irish, old time fiddling etc) that employ the full range of shuffles and bounces use a flatter bow and a heavier hand to punctuate the bow action. An analogy to ponder: consider that a fiddle bow is like the tires of a bicycle. Skinny street tires allow the bicycle to nearly float along the road and move very quickly with minimal friction (ribbon edge, classical). But go off road and you need stouter mountain bike tires to weather the bumps (flatter bow, Irish, fiddling). --the musings of a classically trained violinist who struggles to fiddle
+Ann Mesrobian Very interesting. In fact I often wonder whether most of today's young Irish fiddle players don't have some degree of classical training themselves - there certainly is a cleanliness and precision to their playing that wasn't often seen in the past. Frankie alludes to that at 42:30.
+Wafaloo You are spot on. Some will snipe and say classical training is too rigid but nothing compares to a solid foundation of good technique and posture when it comes to navigating around an instrument as touchy as a violin/fiddle. Another almost dead give-away on classical training is how the person holds the bow. Almost nobody lacking classical background holds the bow the way it's "supposed to" be held, with the hand on the frog. It is so much easier to grab the stick somewhere in the middle, and use the frog as a counter balance. This means the player can only use part of the bow which doesn't matter for rhythmic bow shuffles but severely limits a more lyrical style where long melody notes and phrasing is important. Body posture is also an essential component of good playing, but even classically trained folks can have bad posture. Things are improving now, partly due to increased understanding of the importance of core strength, the popularity of pilates training, etc. Many old-school classical musicians (all instruments) were trained to keep body motion to a minimum, something that might be desirable in a symphony or chamber music setting lest individual people become a distraction to the whole. But really, sitting dead still while pulling or blowing emotionally moving music out of an instrument causes other tensions to develop. I am glad to see that the old rigid-statue-poker-face ideals are gradually relaxing in symphonies and smaller ensembles so that a degree of individual expression is allowed as part of the whole.
Many of these guys would probably have no formal training...sound production etc might be foreign territory ...neither would they agree with classical training. If you listen to trad flute players the picture is worse..often poor rasping sound /frequent octave skipping/dreadful posture /poorish intonation/ little variety in tone colour/tight embuchure..however if you go back to the earlier exponents of excellence and listen to Paddy Carty/Paddy Taylor you can see what was in the tradition....it is not easy to be that good ,but it can be taught to a pupil with the requisite aptitude
I love this video and have a lot of respect for Frankie Gavin and his music, but I think it’s fair also to say that some of the claims he makes would be really quite contentious in the eyes of many fiddlers, including at professional level. He himself talks about economy of effort, but then playing ‘really loud’, however you achieve it, is going to take more effort, and will extract a certain tone from the fiddle that wouldn’t suit every player’s tastes (compared to many fiddlers he has quite a crunchy, choppy, staccato sort of sound). He also talks about using the wrist for primarily short bow strokes, but you watch videos of Bobby Casey and he sometimes slurs a number of notes into a surprisingly long bow stroke, using much more arm - but then of course, he sounds very different! So it’s not that there’s a ‘right and wrong’ as such, but it depends on what sort of sound that you’re going for, and I only wish that Gavin would clarify a bit more in this video that the principles he outlines are not necessarily definitive.
Here’s a good example of Casey’s bowing: th-cam.com/video/Glof1yEAKt4/w-d-xo.html Compared to the other fiddlers in the video, I would say his playing looks more relaxed due to the longer, slurred bow strokes, rather than despite them - surely in that sense using more arm could in fact be a truer economy of effort than lots of shorter, faster strokes?
Frankie inspired me to play Irish fiddle in 1977. I wish he would talk more about interpreting the tunes and phrasing more. Jaunty, introspective, clever etc. Also I'd like to hear more about how he lilts the ornaments and variations in his head. He has such confidence and immediate response with his playing that it is difficult to show that inner voice.
if you put too much pressure on the bow you actually drive the sound down into the instrument. it's more about being able to apply the pressure fairly evenly along with correct bow speed evenly across the bow.
well, they can also become natural through use, without really knowing what a third or sixth is technically. for example i listen to my partner test various options on her banjo to see what sounds right, then she goes with that. this seems to have carried over into her fiddle.
His bow-hand wrist is clearly very relaxed and light. So where does all the pressure, force and strength come from, which by default must be being exerted, in order to get that powerful tone using only a tiny fraction of the bow? Is it index-finger pressure? It doesn't look like it...
No, just that it's different and that some trained classical players have difficulty in adapting their technique and often have an issue in interpreting the music. It's all down to experience really, neither is superior or inferior.
IE “WORLD LAUNCH” The transformation of Rap MC SANDUCK- THE VOICE OF RAP Music: The nation / MC SANDUCK th-cam.com/video/qmlrdShzISo/w-d-xo.html Engraver / Publisher: Emmanuel Francisco Junior-Sony Music-/ Amar.art.br / ECAD All copyright, editorial in Ireland by www.imro.ie/
Loveliest ,most handsome ,impeccable dressed, articulate, poised man ever I've seen & heard perform
Many times in Boston.
Especially treasured is his memory with georgious singer MICHELE at Milton concert..
So generously he has given many new or upcoming music artists a start in his band.DE DANNON.
Well what a gift & wonder of this world 🌎 FRANKIE GAVIN IS.
Brilliant clip...I really enjoyed listening to the master. Is it any wonder our beautiful Irish Traditional Music is loved worldwide.
This was so interesting to watch. Frankie is not only a great fiddle player, but makes this teaching session so informative.
Just had the good fortune to see this fine Master Class. Thank you very much Mr. Gavin for such an informative class. Linda Caul (just learning to play the fiddle)
I really love this. Great advice from a master fiddler!
This is amazingly helpful. Really invaluable, thank you so much
Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Always the smart and snappy dresser..!!
Re: the angle of the bow Q asked at about 5:30 on this clip. On a properly haired bow (and they aren't always rehaired correctly) the bow hairs act as a ribbon. Classical style tilts the bow away from the bridge, so that only the very edge of this ribbon contacts the string. It takes a lot of control to sustain long notes with pure and even tone, and classical technique requires extreme efficiency to pull maximum tone and volume out of the instrument. Even when classical music becomes more rhythmic, the bow remains tilted to a degree, because it allows precision of attack. Unless they also master the folk fiddling technique, classical violinists can sound almost too clean to be authentic fiddlers. This degree of precision is rare to non-existent in other genres. More rhythmic styles (Irish, old time fiddling etc) that employ the full range of shuffles and bounces use a flatter bow and a heavier hand to punctuate the bow action.
An analogy to ponder: consider that a fiddle bow is like the tires of a bicycle. Skinny street tires allow the bicycle to nearly float along the road and move very quickly with minimal friction (ribbon edge, classical). But go off road and you need stouter mountain bike tires to weather the bumps (flatter bow, Irish, fiddling).
--the musings of a classically trained violinist who struggles to fiddle
+Ann Mesrobian Very interesting. In fact I often wonder whether most of today's young Irish fiddle players don't have some degree of classical training themselves - there certainly is a cleanliness and precision to their playing that wasn't often seen in the past. Frankie alludes to that at 42:30.
+Wafaloo You are spot on. Some will snipe and say classical training is too rigid but nothing compares to a solid foundation of good technique and posture when it comes to navigating around an instrument as touchy as a violin/fiddle.
Another almost dead give-away on classical training is how the person holds the bow. Almost nobody lacking classical background holds the bow the way it's "supposed to" be held, with the hand on the frog. It is so much easier to grab the stick somewhere in the middle, and use the frog as a counter balance. This means the player can only use part of the bow which doesn't matter for rhythmic bow shuffles but severely limits a more lyrical style where long melody notes and phrasing is important.
Body posture is also an essential component of good playing, but even classically trained folks can have bad posture. Things are improving now, partly due to increased understanding of the importance of core strength, the popularity of pilates training, etc. Many old-school classical musicians (all instruments) were trained to keep body motion to a minimum, something that might be desirable in a symphony or chamber music setting lest individual people become a distraction to the whole. But really, sitting dead still while pulling or blowing emotionally moving music out of an instrument causes other tensions to develop. I am glad to see that the old rigid-statue-poker-face ideals are gradually relaxing in symphonies and smaller ensembles so that a degree of individual expression is allowed as part of the whole.
Many of these guys would probably have no formal training...sound production etc might be foreign territory ...neither would they agree with classical training. If you listen to trad flute players the picture is worse..often poor rasping sound /frequent octave skipping/dreadful posture /poorish intonation/ little variety in tone colour/tight embuchure..however if you go back to the earlier exponents of excellence and listen to Paddy Carty/Paddy Taylor you can see what was in the tradition....it is not easy to be that good ,but it can be taught to a pupil with the requisite aptitude
Frankie has just tossed out the window everything I was taught about bow pressure and grip!!!!
I love this video and have a lot of respect for Frankie Gavin and his music, but I think it’s fair also to say that some of the claims he makes would be really quite contentious in the eyes of many fiddlers, including at professional level. He himself talks about economy of effort, but then playing ‘really loud’, however you achieve it, is going to take more effort, and will extract a certain tone from the fiddle that wouldn’t suit every player’s tastes (compared to many fiddlers he has quite a crunchy, choppy, staccato sort of sound). He also talks about using the wrist for primarily short bow strokes, but you watch videos of Bobby Casey and he sometimes slurs a number of notes into a surprisingly long bow stroke, using much more arm - but then of course, he sounds very different! So it’s not that there’s a ‘right and wrong’ as such, but it depends on what sort of sound that you’re going for, and I only wish that Gavin would clarify a bit more in this video that the principles he outlines are not necessarily definitive.
Here’s a good example of Casey’s bowing: th-cam.com/video/Glof1yEAKt4/w-d-xo.html
Compared to the other fiddlers in the video, I would say his playing looks more relaxed due to the longer, slurred bow strokes, rather than despite them - surely in that sense using more arm could in fact be a truer economy of effort than lots of shorter, faster strokes?
Frankie inspired me to play Irish fiddle in 1977. I wish he would talk more about interpreting the tunes and phrasing more. Jaunty, introspective, clever etc. Also I'd like to hear more about how he lilts the ornaments and variations in his head. He has such confidence and immediate response with his playing that it is difficult to show that inner voice.
if you put too much pressure on the bow you actually drive the sound down into the instrument. it's more about being able to apply the pressure fairly evenly along with correct bow speed evenly across the bow.
fuckin legend. thanks for uploading
A list of the questions would help.
double stops are great if you understand harmony
well, they can also become natural through use, without really knowing what a third or sixth is technically. for example i listen to my partner test various options on her banjo to see what sounds right, then she goes with that. this seems to have carried over into her fiddle.
His bow-hand wrist is clearly very relaxed and light. So where does all the pressure, force and strength come from, which by default must be being exerted, in order to get that powerful tone using only a tiny fraction of the bow? Is it index-finger pressure? It doesn't look like it...
The reel played at 27:30 Is Master Crowley's, right? But right after it, he plays another tune, or is it still crowley's?
+Carlos Montenegro , think its called "The glen of Atherlow" or "Laferty's reel".
It's actually The Glen of Aherlow, also known as Lafferty's
th-cam.com/video/sKnXKeKkeY8/w-d-xo.html
22:34 do somebody help's me to find the title ?
Thanks
22:34 Tripping Up the Stairs
What is that tune at 22:30?
It's a jig called Tripping up the stairs I believe.
So is he saying that fiddle is more difficult than classical violin?
No, just that it's different and that some trained classical players have difficulty in adapting their technique and often have an issue in interpreting the music. It's all down to experience really, neither is superior or inferior.
we can''t hear the questions, maybe get an audio expert involved in the etc
he should tune his G :-)
This is great. A lot of it seems to be ,just SWING. Take the weight off 1 and 3 and accent 2 and 4.
IE
“WORLD LAUNCH” The transformation of Rap
MC SANDUCK- THE VOICE OF RAP
Music: The nation / MC SANDUCK
th-cam.com/video/qmlrdShzISo/w-d-xo.html
Engraver / Publisher: Emmanuel Francisco Junior-Sony Music-/ Amar.art.br /
ECAD All copyright, editorial in Ireland by www.imro.ie/