A very interesting series Keith ,just shows how complex modern mining methods are now ,where they have chemists ,and laboratories who figure out the best and most economical and productive ways to extract what was perhaps once considered low grade . Thanks for your efforts in producing this fine series ,cheers .
Thank you. Also, don't forget the geologists, mineralogists, geophysicists, mining engineers, and mathematicians who figure out where the ore is and what needs to be done to get it.
@@hardrockuniversity7283 @Hard Rock University I am very interested in gold geology but am not geologist.I was very curious to gold geology and i have lots of questions.I watched all of your videos and found answers to my questions.I feel myself as a gold geology student in Hard Rock University while i watch your great videos.All of your lessons are very very helpful.
@@akdenizyoldas67 Thank you very much for the heart warming words. I will continue to try to live up to the ideals my viewers deserve. It seems to be going well, if a bit slower than expected, and I hope to keep making more interesting, informative, and useful videos as I improve. Sincerely Yours, Keith H Bowen
@@akdenizyoldas67 I do not have a degree, but I have 10 yaers experience in open pit/heap leaching and decades of prospecting and experimentation. I am far from the best, but I can pull my weight in the right circumstances.
Hi Arne, I am interested in the wet chemistry idea. I have been following a gold refining series by a TH-cam author by the name of Sreetips. Sreetips does refining of gold, silver and platinum group metals from various sources including jewellery (both plated and Karat), computer scrap and even jewellers wax! In the main he uses simply Hydrochloric, Sulphuric and Nitric Acids. I am sure his methods could be utilised to dissolve metals from crushed ores in sequences, particularly if the ore is mainly a quartz or silica and therefore will not dissolve in these acids. Also gold will not dissolve in these acids used singularly, so use these acids on the ore to remove base and precious metals other than gold first before using aqua regia to get your gold into solution to be rinsed free from the ore and then precipitated out and smelted. These first wash acids can be treated by cementing out according to the metals reactivity table to selectively recover a product ready for smelting ending with iron that is virtually worthless anyway. The wet waste can be treated with copper metal and then iron to render it non toxic for disposal, the resulting slimes would be precious metals ready for further extraction, refining and smelting. The rinsed crush slurry I would bury to remove risk of fine silica particles getting into the air when it dries.. the fumes I am unsure how to treat these to render them harmless.. possibly the Nitric oxide gas could be fed through a water bath to remake Nitric acid? Chlorine gas.. I have no clue about.. needs research. Nitric acid can be self manufactured to cut on chemical/shipping costs.. I am not sure about Hydrochloric? A dangerous exercise in the fumes that are produced though (chlorine gas and nitric oxide gas), proper fume extraction and chemical addition practices would need to be developed and followed to also prevent runaway reactions. I am only concerned that ores being from nature may contain elements that could possibly react adversely in the treatment process and produce some unforeseen hazard. So this is my idea in progress, I think about chemically treating ultra fine concentrates from crushes.. I have even seen a gold layer settle from the water I did keep from panning and did dry it out.. so was thinking if it gets that fine no mechanical means would work surely.. chemicals?! Keith? I think that is your name.. Thank you for another thought provoking video!
Good video Keith. You forgot the powder horn and the winnowing blanket. LOL In certain locations long ago, it was eyes and hands picking up loose gold. Too bad those opportunities are no longer, except for underwater sniping. Good point on the gold pan. It's amazing how useful and irreplaceable it is. Stay cool. Hope you still get to AK someday.
If I remain erect and metabolizing oxygen much longer I am confident I will. Heading out to New York on Tuesday for two months of prospecting and adventures.
Another thing done by means of the fleece/sheeps hide. It has lanolin in it that tends to grab and hold the microfine gold found carried by certain river waters. Letting it wave in the river flow over time provided the "golden fleece".
I would seriously give anything to spend one week mining with you! I'm not joking one bit either. I'm chasing quartz veins in the Black Hills mountains Custer SD. If you ever need a hand I'd do it for free. Just say when. You have a lot of knowledge and that is better than gold, but the gold ain't bad either.
Yeah well hard Rock University you are one of the most knowledgeable people I've heard on the whole internet about the recovery of gold and many other valuable minerals thanks I have a question though you were talking about gravity circuits and electroplating and you said maybe someone would come up with a new way of method would it be possible to dope the situation to create the gold or concentrate the gold I would like to collaborate a little bit more or or sit down and talk about a recovery system I know where there's a lot of sulfide lots and lots it's everywhere around here
Hard Rock University Do you offer a service to look at a few samples? No assay, just a first impression. I have a load mine but this is new-ish for me. I prefer not to pull out tons of worthless rock.
@@triac777 The first question is where are you located? That would have a major impact on how much rock could be sent easily. The next question is what information are you looking for precisely? Some things I can do well, some things I would have to get assistance (such as laboratory assays or mineralogical analysis).
@@hardrockuniversity7283 I am in the San Gabriel Mountains of Southern California near the Big Tujunga mining area. I would be interested on what process would be best for a particular sample. I have two mines, one with sulfides and one with free mill. I am told that the sulfide mine ores are of a decent grade. I have a jaw crusher and a flail crusher so I can generate 100- samples. So far the only thing I have panned out of my samples is pyrite. Iron Pyrite as far as I can tell. It looks like gold but does nothing in the company of Hg. I guess I should mine the dirty brown quartz rather then the yellow quartz? Should I even bother with sulfide ores? Is there a good (maybe inexpensive) assay lab that you could recommend? These mines are patented load mines and have produced moderate gold ore in the past. For me it is my weekend happy place. It is at best a micro-operation so far. I wouldn't bother asking so many questions, but you seem to be the man with the knowledge and I am in the need of learning. I have been binge watching your videos but there is so much to learn and so many ways to get the Au from the ground. Thank you. My e/m is thisoldminer@gmail.com .
Metal detector and shovel are good " tools" or method. I dont speak from experience, I only know what I've seen on this here "you tube" world. Vidieos for days, I thank you much.
what do you think of the 911 metallurgist floatation units for small scale? can froth floatation capture pyrite gold? I have 400g/ ton in my sulphides (arsenopyrite)
I don't know much about them in particular, but he seems like a reasonable person and flotation is a common method of recovering arsenopyrite. Getting the gold OUT of the arsenopyrite is a different matter. 911 metallurgist seems vastly more knowledgeable than me on that subject.
I have to admit I am really skeptical about gold "sticking" to rubber or silicone mats. Lots of vendors make lots of claims with no science to back it up whatsoever.
I haven't seen any real science on the issue, but there are loads of industry anecdotes about rubber belting making a good surface for separating very fine gold from finely crushed rock. Someday I hope to do a good test.
@@hardrockuniversity7283 There are other youtubers making Silicone Rubber mats claiming very good results. Alan Robertson in Montana has done a lot along those lines. He claims the rubber being (hydrophobic, ie the water tends to bead when sitting on it, as do many carwaxes)) tends to hold onto Gold. Lanolin is said to have the same properties.
Too often we little guys let money slip thru our fingers. For example, if we do order an assay it's usually limited to "precious metals" to save a few bucks. Why would that matter? Well, did you know one of the "contaminants" in the Kennecott Copper Mine in Utah was once discarded (molybdenum) and for the past dozen years, or more, brings them $30 million each month. Rarely does a mineral travel by itself and if you are processing ore for one mineral, there may be others readily available that are discarded with the bath water, so to speak. Also, some processes are propitiatory, they don't even file a patent application because their work would be stolen the day their patent application hit the patent office. Here's an example: Soap has a fat loving chemical at one end of the soap molecule and a water loving chemical attached to the other end, so it can mix with water and grab fats and oils from our clothes at the same time. Well, there are mineral processing chemicals that basically do the same thing (not to clean clothes) but to attach to one mineral and basically ignore others. Pretty cool chemistry. Always enjoy your posts!
Very good information. I would like to know more about front flotation process to concentrate gold ore or copper ore. I am living in a 3rd world country and doesn't have bachelor degree to understand completely books about front floation. I am a micro microsmall scale miner, and i know the risk of using mercury, so i was looking forward to change the common system using here such as cyanidation ang mercury amagamation. If anybody here can provide me a simple process and reagent for fronth flotation it was very very very very much helpfull.
I am not personally experienced in flotation. It is a very common method though for some metals. Do you have any colleges or equivalent close by where you could ask?
@@hardrockuniversity7283 despite being a common method, here in 3rd world country was very new method. What common here is mercury method. So i like to learn this common method of yours :) . I don't have any college friend related to this field to teach me how. After all not all college graduate here in the third world country has enough knowledge to compete or even match-up such as 1st world country. I hope you can atleast give me some techinically for flotation.
@@JasonLee-ed9fy What country are you in and what kind of ore are you working with? The details are very dependent on what you are trying to extract and what you are trying to get it out of?
@@hardrockuniversity7283 Philippines my friend. The kind of ore were working with was different, vary to location. But the most common is oxide ore and sulfide. But that kind of ore was not a big deal here because common practice here is to use intensive cyanidation reaching 1%-2% cyanide concentration. What these method become uneconomically is when were processing gold ore with high content of copper and a gold ore with is low grade + being contaminated by other consuming cyanide mineral. So introducing this flotation method will somehow solve this common problem of processing gold-copper ore, low grade ore, and some refractory ores. Our country are keep banning mercury and cyanide, but didn't even offer anything alternative to use. They prefer people to die by starving. Quite headache here. I try to read some information about flotation, and i already understand some aspect of it. Right now, i need guidance for knowledge people and find where to get the reagent for trial.
I saw a video somewhere a while ago where they were using palm fiber to line sluice boxes and recover very fine gold. But, for the life of me, I can't find it again. There are other gravity methods that might work well to recover the gold and sulfides, but I can't think of any that would be simpler or cheaper in your circumstances Her is a video on some alternatives. I don't know how good it is as I don't have time right now to watch it. th-cam.com/video/RVayq2zA_3Q/w-d-xo.html Flotation might work well in your case, but would require some equipment and chemicals that might be hard to come by or expensive. It will also vary a lot between ores, so it might not be easy to use a central mill for a lot of small mines. It would depend on circumstances.
A very interesting series Keith ,just shows how complex modern mining methods are now ,where they have chemists ,and laboratories who figure out the best and most economical and productive ways to extract what was perhaps once considered low grade . Thanks for your efforts in producing this fine series ,cheers .
Thank you. Also, don't forget the geologists, mineralogists, geophysicists, mining engineers, and mathematicians who figure out where the ore is and what needs to be done to get it.
You are the generous man who shares his valuable infos and experiences about gold Geology and gold minening.Thank u very much.
You are most welcome. I hope it helps.
For some strange reason I can see the start of your next comment in the notifications screen, but the whole comment won't show. Could you re-post it?
@@hardrockuniversity7283 @Hard Rock University I am very interested in gold geology but am not geologist.I was very curious to gold geology and i have lots of questions.I watched all of your videos and found answers to my questions.I feel myself as a gold geology student in Hard Rock University while i watch your great videos.All of your lessons are very very helpful.
@@akdenizyoldas67 Thank you very much for the heart warming words. I will continue to try to live up to the ideals my viewers deserve.
It seems to be going well, if a bit slower than expected, and I hope to keep making more interesting, informative, and useful videos as I improve.
Sincerely Yours,
Keith H Bowen
@@akdenizyoldas67 I do not have a degree, but I have 10 yaers experience in open pit/heap leaching and decades of prospecting and experimentation. I am far from the best, but I can pull my weight in the right circumstances.
A few more methods to consider:
Electro-chemistry
Wet chemistry
Iodine leach
Electro-winning
General subject is known as "Extractive Metallurgy"
Hi Arne, I am interested in the wet chemistry idea.
I have been following a gold refining series by a TH-cam author by the name of Sreetips. Sreetips does refining of gold, silver and platinum group metals from various sources including jewellery (both plated and Karat), computer scrap and even jewellers wax!
In the main he uses simply Hydrochloric, Sulphuric and Nitric Acids.
I am sure his methods could be utilised to dissolve metals from crushed ores in sequences, particularly if the ore is mainly a quartz or silica and therefore will not dissolve in these acids.
Also gold will not dissolve in these acids used singularly, so use these acids on the ore to remove base and precious metals other than gold first before using aqua regia to get your gold into solution to be rinsed free from the ore and then precipitated out and smelted.
These first wash acids can be treated by cementing out according to the metals reactivity table to selectively recover a product ready for smelting ending with iron that is virtually worthless anyway.
The wet waste can be treated with copper metal and then iron to render it non toxic for disposal, the resulting slimes would be precious metals ready for further extraction, refining and smelting.
The rinsed crush slurry I would bury to remove risk of fine silica particles getting into the air when it dries.. the fumes I am unsure how to treat these to render them harmless.. possibly the Nitric oxide gas could be fed through a water bath to remake Nitric acid?
Chlorine gas.. I have no clue about.. needs research.
Nitric acid can be self manufactured to cut on chemical/shipping costs.. I am not sure about Hydrochloric?
A dangerous exercise in the fumes that are produced though (chlorine gas and nitric oxide gas), proper fume extraction and chemical addition practices would need to be developed and followed to also prevent runaway reactions.
I am only concerned that ores being from nature may contain elements that could possibly react adversely in the treatment process and produce some unforeseen hazard.
So this is my idea in progress, I think about chemically treating ultra fine concentrates from crushes.. I have even seen a gold layer settle from the water I did keep from panning and did dry it out.. so was thinking if it gets that fine no mechanical means would work surely.. chemicals?!
Keith? I think that is your name.. Thank you for another thought provoking video!
Always enjoy your videos Keith! Thanks sir!
You're welcome.
Good video Keith. You forgot the powder horn and the winnowing blanket. LOL
In certain locations long ago, it was eyes and hands picking up loose gold. Too bad those opportunities are no longer, except for underwater sniping. Good point on the gold pan. It's amazing how useful and irreplaceable it is. Stay cool. Hope you still get to AK someday.
If I remain erect and metabolizing oxygen much longer I am confident I will. Heading out to New York on Tuesday for two months of prospecting and adventures.
@@Riverwalker1 I think it was somewhere in Spain they did something like that. Hydraulic mining without pumps.
Another thing done by means of the fleece/sheeps hide. It has lanolin in it that tends to grab and hold the microfine gold found carried by certain river waters. Letting it wave in the river flow over time provided the "golden fleece".
@@arne6787 Hmmm... I wonder if that could be used as an effective collector?
@@hardrockuniversity7283 Worth a try, some kind of experimental setup. Maybe they were using Lanolin on the carbon granules as the "oil" you spoke of.
I would seriously give anything to spend one week mining with you! I'm not joking one bit either. I'm chasing quartz veins in the Black Hills mountains Custer SD. If you ever need a hand I'd do it for free. Just say when. You have a lot of knowledge and that is better than gold, but the gold ain't bad either.
I would be happy to consider it this summer when I may need help. The decision would be up to the claim owner.
Yeah well hard Rock University you are one of the most knowledgeable people I've heard on the whole internet about the recovery of gold and many other valuable minerals thanks I have a question though you were talking about gravity circuits and electroplating and you said maybe someone would come up with a new way of method would it be possible to dope the situation to create the gold or concentrate the gold I would like to collaborate a little bit more or or sit down and talk about a recovery system I know where there's a lot of sulfide lots and lots it's everywhere around here
You can email me at HardRockU@outlook.com and we can discuss details in private.
Very informative. Thank you for the explanations. It looks like table separation for me.
It could be. Make sure you test before you buy though.
Hard Rock University Do you offer a service to look at a few samples? No assay, just a first impression. I have a load mine but this is new-ish for me. I prefer not to pull out tons of worthless rock.
@@triac777 The first question is where are you located? That would have a major impact on how much rock could be sent easily. The next question is what information are you looking for precisely? Some things I can do well, some things I would have to get assistance (such as laboratory assays or mineralogical analysis).
@@hardrockuniversity7283 I am in the San Gabriel Mountains of Southern California near the Big Tujunga mining area. I would be interested on what process would be best for a particular sample. I have two mines, one with sulfides and one with free mill. I am told that the sulfide mine ores are of a decent grade. I have a jaw crusher and a flail crusher so I can generate 100- samples. So far the only thing I have panned out of my samples is pyrite. Iron Pyrite as far as I can tell. It looks like gold but does nothing in the company of Hg. I guess I should mine the dirty brown quartz rather then the yellow quartz? Should I even bother with sulfide ores? Is there a good (maybe inexpensive) assay lab that you could recommend? These mines are patented load mines and have produced moderate gold ore in the past. For me it is my weekend happy place. It is at best a micro-operation so far. I wouldn't bother asking so many questions, but you seem to be the man with the knowledge and I am in the need of learning. I have been binge watching your videos but there is so much to learn and so many ways to get the Au from the ground. Thank you. My e/m is thisoldminer@gmail.com .
@@triac777 Will try email...
Metal detector and shovel are good " tools" or method. I dont speak from experience, I only know what I've seen on this here "you tube" world.
Vidieos for days,
I thank you much.
You are most welcome. I hope they are helpful.
Keith
Have you had much to do with icon i 150 type concentrators? What are the best methods to collect midlings also?
I have never used a centrifugal concentrator and don't know hardly anything about them, or their capabilities. Sorry... :-)
What about making a tank leach in a 55 gallon drum or a flotation setup on the same scale? That would qualify for micro scale mining.
It certainly could.
Hello sir, do you have the reagent need for flotation and procedure? I would like to give it a shot if that system will work to me.
I do not have any reagents for flotation.
@@RockingJOffroad I think he was trying to contact me. We are talking on another video. Sorry
@@RockingJOffroad thank you for replying. :)
Great info I found it enlightening!
Thank you.
what do you think of the 911 metallurgist floatation units for small scale? can froth floatation capture pyrite gold? I have 400g/ ton in my sulphides (arsenopyrite)
I don't know much about them in particular, but he seems like a reasonable person and flotation is a common method of recovering arsenopyrite. Getting the gold OUT of the arsenopyrite is a different matter. 911 metallurgist seems vastly more knowledgeable than me on that subject.
I have to admit I am really skeptical about gold "sticking" to rubber or silicone mats. Lots of vendors make lots of claims with no science to back it up whatsoever.
I haven't seen any real science on the issue, but there are loads of industry anecdotes about rubber belting making a good surface for separating very fine gold from finely crushed rock. Someday I hope to do a good test.
@@hardrockuniversity7283 There are other youtubers making Silicone Rubber mats claiming very good results. Alan Robertson in Montana has done a lot along those lines. He claims the rubber being (hydrophobic, ie the water tends to bead when sitting on it, as do many carwaxes)) tends to hold onto Gold. Lanolin is said to have the same properties.
@@arne6787 I'll just have to try different surfaces on my table I guess. with enough ore I can try a lot of possibilities.
Too often we little guys let money slip thru our fingers. For example, if we do order an assay it's usually limited to "precious metals" to save a few bucks. Why would that matter? Well, did you know one of the "contaminants" in the Kennecott Copper Mine in Utah was once discarded (molybdenum) and for the past dozen years, or more, brings them $30 million each month. Rarely does a mineral travel by itself and if you are processing ore for one mineral, there may be others readily available that are discarded with the bath water, so to speak. Also, some processes are propitiatory, they don't even file a patent application because their work would be stolen the day their patent application hit the patent office. Here's an example: Soap has a fat loving chemical at one end of the soap molecule and a water loving chemical attached to the other end, so it can mix with water and grab fats and oils from our clothes at the same time. Well, there are mineral processing chemicals that basically do the same thing (not to clean clothes) but to attach to one mineral and basically ignore others. Pretty cool chemistry. Always enjoy your posts!
Yep, the surface chemistry of minerals and reagents is a mind boggling complex matrix of options. So many ideas- so little time...
Very good information. I would like to know more about front flotation process to concentrate gold ore or copper ore.
I am living in a 3rd world country and doesn't have bachelor degree to understand completely books about front floation.
I am a micro microsmall scale miner, and i know the risk of using mercury, so i was looking forward to change the common system using here such as cyanidation ang mercury amagamation. If anybody here can provide me a simple process and reagent for fronth flotation it was very very very very much helpfull.
I am not personally experienced in flotation. It is a very common method though for some metals. Do you have any colleges or equivalent close by where you could ask?
@@hardrockuniversity7283 despite being a common method, here in 3rd world country was very new method. What common here is mercury method.
So i like to learn this common method of yours :) .
I don't have any college friend related to this field to teach me how. After all not all college graduate here in the third world country has enough knowledge to compete or even match-up such as 1st world country.
I hope you can atleast give me some techinically for flotation.
@@JasonLee-ed9fy What country are you in and what kind of ore are you working with? The details are very dependent on what you are trying to extract and what you are trying to get it out of?
@@hardrockuniversity7283 Philippines my friend. The kind of ore were working with was different, vary to location. But the most common is oxide ore and sulfide. But that kind of ore was not a big deal here because common practice here is to use intensive cyanidation reaching 1%-2% cyanide concentration. What these method become uneconomically is when were processing gold ore with high content of copper and a gold ore with is low grade + being contaminated by other consuming cyanide mineral.
So introducing this flotation method will somehow solve this common problem of processing gold-copper ore, low grade ore, and some refractory ores.
Our country are keep banning mercury and cyanide, but didn't even offer anything alternative to use. They prefer people to die by starving. Quite headache here.
I try to read some information about flotation, and i already understand some aspect of it. Right now, i need guidance for knowledge people and find where to get the reagent for trial.
I saw a video somewhere a while ago where they were using palm fiber to line sluice boxes and recover very fine gold. But, for the life of me, I can't find it again. There are other gravity methods that might work well to recover the gold and sulfides, but I can't think of any that would be simpler or cheaper in your circumstances
Her is a video on some alternatives. I don't know how good it is as I don't have time right now to watch it.
th-cam.com/video/RVayq2zA_3Q/w-d-xo.html
Flotation might work well in your case, but would require some equipment and chemicals that might be hard to come by or expensive. It will also vary a lot between ores, so it might not be easy to use a central mill for a lot of small mines. It would depend on circumstances.
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