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@@rnava435 yes it will work. Most importantly is having constant power to all switches and a complete circuit going back to the light. Cannot have any breaks
After 3 weeks of troubleshooting and DIY vid searching I was about throw in the towel and get an electrician. At my last attempt, I found your solution. It works flawlessly on the first go! Kudos to you! You got my like and sub! Thank you!
Electrician here, I have a couple of years in the trade and yet I sort of skimmed through the official manual without reading the disclaimer of "only one motion switch may work in a 3 way circuit". No wonder the actual diagram on the manual didn't work. Was beginning to think i was going crazy. Thanks a ton!
I worked in the occupancy sensor industry for about 15 years. There was a court battle over the patent rights to using a ground return. Long story short, this affected the ability of manufactures to make two sensors work in parallel as suggested here. It is a little complicated legally but some manufactures avoided infringement simply by declaring that a 3 way would not work. In reality, some do. From the example of this video, it looks like it does work.
Just want to say thank you!!! I am no electrician. Had stairway that makes an L shape to garage. Wanted stairway garage light to work either when I pull into garage or top of stairway going down to garage. Looked at your wiring diagram but your actual installation part proved perfect and easy to follow. I guessed right which box had the load, everything worked perfect the first time after install. One caution to note though…. After installing switches and waiting the minute like you did, it took mine over 5 minutes to switch off first. I almost thought I had something wired wrong. Lucky I waited a bit more. Works perfect. Guess I can program them for shorter on time. Thank you again!
I saw the original of this where you said it wont work, but then you realized that we all make mistakes and came back with this one. Kudos to you, nice job.
You prolly dont give a shit but if you are stoned like me atm you can stream pretty much all the latest movies on Instaflixxer. Have been binge watching with my brother for the last few months =)
holy cow, you are a lifesaver!! BTW for anyone using the multi color (ECOELER brand) The pattern is the same: BLUE is capped on both; RED AND BLACK travellers are spliced to the device RED also on both. Thanks again, bud!
Thank you very much. This is just what I needed. I also took a switch apart to see how it works, to feel confident that it was the right way to hook the switches up. But that made me realize that I could have saved $20 by buying single way switches instead.
@@KevinPon. do you know if I can wire a motion sensor switch at one end and a caseta smart switch at the other end so I get motion sensor on one side and a smart switch on other side? (typically for caseta switch, I think they make u wire one end and jumper the other end and put a wireless pico remote there)
Good video! The key for me was finding the power source wire. I guessed wrong on my first try and then used the voltage meter and it was a piece of cake from there.
I just installed 2 TP-Link Kaza Smart Motion sensor dimmers in a hallway using your method and they work flawlessly, what I love the most is the option of being able to control the sensitivity of the sensors from the app and I can also create a schedule if I need to.
Followed this steps & used a Leviton IPSD6 for my basement with incandescent bulb... Leviton IPSD6 on the top of the stairs and one on the bottom.. works perfectly..
This helped me a lot for installing 2 ECOELER 3 Way Motion Sensor Light Switchs in a stair way. There is a post on Amazon by a Donn R. for this switch that helps with using two 3-way sensor switches that leads people here. The only difference for me was the ECOELER has a red and black wire verses 2 black wires as in this video. On the Aux switch I had to connect the black wire from the switch to the black traveler, which was hot coming from the primary switch. Then from the box I tied the other red traveler wire with the other black wire with the red traveler on the switch. Still capped both blues on each end. This worked for me like a charm just like in this video, so thank you very much Kevin for this video.
After seeing this youtube a couple of times, I was able to understand the house wiring and the diagram that came with the switches. Blew off the circuit breaker couple of times, but that is because I installed the first switch before I found your instructional video. So I corrected the connections on the first switch and all went great from there. Thank you Kevin!!!!
Had to comment, this worked beautifully with leviton ips06 motion sensors. I did have an issue where when the lights were to be off, the lights flashed full brightness in a pattern of 0.5 sec on, 1 sec off. was driving me crazy until I read as a troubleshooting step to swap one of the LED bulbs with an incandescent. Did this, and it solved my flashing problem.
Many thanks Kevin for this video...it helped a lot...I have spent 3 days already tinkering on the wiring, and almost gave up, as I have different configuration. The line and load are on the same box. Read through the comments and found what I needed to do. I have Leviton switch...works the same. Keep up the good work!
@@KevinPon. I just wired my second set, this time in the second floor stairs leading to the bedroom...just did it in 15 minutes this time. Thanks for this video!
Good videoing Was going to make one, but I think this guy has it pretty much covered from a to z. I do like how he tested the "udder" ones and not the "other" ones - that made me chuckle.Otherwise this guy's great, This is a great intermediate video as well. I wouldn't call this beginner. I would call this intermediate, and I think you did a great job so congratulations. I'm gonna look at all your udder ones, Just giving you a hard time but I really am gonna go check the other videos out.
I’d like to see the 3 location diagram as well. Thanks, Kevin! Great explanation and demonstration. Any idea why the manufacturer says it cannot be done?
Thank you for the video, Kevin. However, I have a question. It looks like your idea can be described as using two occupancy sensors in single pole mode being connected in parallel. Another words if you’re not using blue wires than why not to make this installation with just two single poles providing they’re almost twice cheaper? Thank you.
Hi Igor, you're very welcome! Good question. You are 100% correct! Will be cheaper using two single pole sensors. I made this video base on the current props I had. A few of my viewers needed my help so I decided to make this video for them. But also to prove Lutron's installation guide that it was possible to install two of these switches when mentioned cannot. Thank you for the comment. Cheers!
This is great - the only minor downside is that it's not operating in true 3-way mode, in that you won't be able to use the 'other switch' to turn off the lights - to turn off the lights you'll just have to wait until the triggered PIR switches off or you manually turn that switch off - pressing the on/off button on the other switch will have no effect. The good news is that either switch will turn on the lights ...
Not a criticism, just an observation: The schematic (wiring diagram) @ 0.57 shows the BLK Hot (Line) wire connects to the "input" of switch #1 and the "input" of switch #2. The "output" of switch #1 connects to the "output" of switch #2 which then connects to the Light bulb (Load). These two switches are simply connected in parallel, that's all. You can use the less expensive MS-OPS2 instead of the MS-OPS5M and get the same results.
Crazy how hard it is to try to find out how to do this. With two Lutron MS-OPS5M motion detectors, there were no instructions on how to do this (ya think they'd publish how to do it, let's say in the case of a stairway like in this video and in my use case). The diagram was perfect for me. Thank you for publishing this!
@@KevinPon. Turning them manually on/off works, but the motion sensor seems to not work each time on them. Any suggestions? I've played with the Lutron settings and such. I'll keep tinkering.
Kevin i did it on one 3-way and got it working 👍 But then I tried it on a different 3 way and one lutron switch was working fine, but the switch other had nothing. It wouldn't turn the light on or off. Followed the exact same instructions that you gave and that worked for the other 3 way. So anyway I've been trying to troubleshoot and I found something I think is a little odd. What does it mean if when using a multimeter: Black lead touching ground + red lead touching black (hot) = 120 v Black lead touching white (neutral) + red lead touching black (hot) = 0 Shouldn't I be getting 120? That's the hot wire for this 3 way set up
@@corbindean1776 That's great news that you got it working on the first one. Now for the the different 3-way hmm that's a bit strange. Yes, you are correct. When touching (hot to neutral), you should get 120v. The possible reason for this is: the white is not spliced correctly on the other end. I assume this 3-way switch was working from the start?
I would remove the switches on both ends and inspect the wires. Start from scratch. Double check if the 14/3 wire is spliced correctly on both ends. Making sure all whites are together and only whites. The travelers and separated and not connected to anything else (red + black). Then one 14/2 wire (black) will be hot to confirm with meter and the other switch 14/2 (black) will be coming from the light with 0 volts to neutral or ground.
Hey I’m just curious since you are back feeding other outlet nothing burned out after time. I’m no electrician just wondering I don’t know how sophisticated those switches are and if it won’t burn them out. Your video helped me out with installation Thx
Worked like a charm! Having similar issues with 3 way smart dimmer + 3 way dumb switch. Do you happen to have a solution for it? Even a professional electrician hasn't been able to figure it out!
So two effects with this method since they are effectively wired in parallel: -I think it may have been noted but I beleive manually shutting off one switch with the paddle won't do anything, you will have to hit the other or wait for the motion to time out. -Technically the load capactity with be shared when both are activated. More a minor point in this day and age of LED *HOWEVER* I note some people saying that you can do this with a MS-OPS2H to save some money since you don't need the 3-way feature of the MS-OPS5M *BUT* the OPS2 is only a 2A switch and the OPS5 is 5A. Something to be aware of if you have a lot of lights on the swich circuit. I.E. with only one activated you may be pushing the limit of a single OPS2. Actually one other thing occurs to me on the first point. I wonder if just wiring the blues together as well would "fake" the two swiches in to thinking the other end was a companion switch and therefore shut themseleves off if the other manual paddle was pressed? I don't know the details of what exact "signal" is sent or level maintainted on the blue line when used in the pseudo 3-way mode.
Hi Kevin this worked like a charm. I have another circuit that has 3 switches, I understand in your comments that another switch can be added in parallel. I'm assuming you could do an unlimited number of switches? Your schematic is perfect and easy to follow. Leviton should hire you. Could you do another schematic for a 3 switch scenario?
I’d like to see the 3 location diagram as well. Thanks, Kevin! Great explanation and demonstration. Any idea why the manufacturer says it cannot be done?
@DamBevers the setup for 3 switches is very similar to the video. You have to have constant power traveling to all 3 locations and have all the white wires connected together. I think the reason the manufacturers don't want to tell you is because they do not want any liability 🍻
I really thanks God for helping me to find your video instruction, it is very good explanation on how to put two sensors in one light because even the manufacturer wants to use the blue wire and that is a mistake , thanks my friend and God bless you. your system work great 😀😀
Hello Kevin, thank you for sharing this brilliant idea! My understand is that now both sensors will work but if one of the switches is shut off manually then the others could not be switched on manually right?
Hi Kevin. Great video. I followed the instructions and its sort of working. Wondering if you can provide some guidance. Both switches have power however the motion is only working on the aux switch. Once motion is triggered on that one I see a blinking light on the master but thats all I get from the master. Even if I try to hit the on/off switch on the master, it does nothing. Thanks in advance.
Hi Matt, thank you. That's a good start that both switches have power but how is your neutral wire hooked up? Are they both connected in parallel together too?
Hi Matt and Kevin - I am having the same issue. My switches do not have any white/neutral wires, so I was forced to skip that portion of the wiring diagram. All I have are black and red (plus the ground). Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated?
Kevin - thanks for the video. My 2nd switch that is fed power only has a single black cable, not two like your example. How does this change the configuration?
@@KevinPon. It has red and black traveler wires and white neutral. The black wire out to the lights is actually in the first box. I was able to figure it out through a few hours of trial and error. This task was made more complicated with a set of bathroom lights/switches in a different part of my house also on the same circuit that must be connected to the first switch to function. Working solution = 1st switch box has 4 black wires (switch, hot, traveler for bathroom lights/switches, and black traveler to 2nd switch) together, 5 white neutrals (all of the above plus the lights) together, and finally the red traveler, black wire for lights, and black 14/3 switch wire together. 2nd switch is wired to white neutral, 14/2 to black traveler that is connected to constant power, and 14/3 to red traveler. Messy but works perfectly.
I recently found myself in this situation. It means that the electrical load is wired from box 1, not box 2 as shown in Kevin's diagram. To solve, you need to figure out which color traveler wire in box 2 (either black or red or white) is transmitting current back to the load in box 1. Typically this will be the wire that is connected to the "common" terminal (the darker of the 3 terminals) on the manual switch you are replacing in box 2. Connect to the black "line out" from your new switch 2 to this "common" wire in box 2. At this point, two of your three traveler wires in box 2 are accounted for - the "common", and the black that you connected to the hot black 14/2 in box 1 as per Kevin's diagram. Connect the white wire from switch 2 to the final unaccounted-for traveler wire in box 2, and in box 1 connect that wire's other end to the neutral white 14/2 wire.
I guess I have a different model of Maestro switch’s that do not have the neutral wire. Is there anyway these could be made to work. I have tried the wiring diagram with no luck. Thanks
I understand your two-switch conversion. Now, suppose you have 4 switches, two 3-way and two 4-way in the middle? I want to put two 3-way motion switches at the two 3-way switch locations... Would my 4-way switches make and break that red traveler wire you show?
Hi Kelvin, Thanks for the great advice. Just wonder does it work if I have one 3-way sensor switch and the other just normal 3-way switch. I install on one side, and found that when I turn off the light from normal 3-way switch. I couldn’t turn on again from the 3-way sensor anymore, and motion sensor won’t work. Only when I flipped the switch from the 3-way to opposite side, then the 3-way sensor work again. Do u know what I missed?
Hi Steven, don't worry you have installed it correctly. It's supposed to do that. The 3 way switch on either side you have it, you still cannot flip it off. That's because the 3-way sensor needs constant power on 24/7. When you flip it off, the power cannot be transferred to the 3-way sensor by the travelers. It's how it is.
Wont the power source be the 14/2 wire always? There are like 3 ways to wire these and if one of the boxes has a 14/2 and a 14/3 wouldn't that be the power source?
I wanted to to do this on my basement stairs as the lights always get left on and they burn out much faster LOL. Does not look like it works if your 3 circuit has one switch that has no neutral. The box at the top of the stairs has 1 14/2 coming from breaker box, 1 14/2 going to light and 1 14/3 going to the other switch at bottom of stairs. This was wired in 2012 and apparently it was up to code them to have a switch with no neutral.
Am I missing something ? Don't you basically now have two sensors working in parallel? Not 3 way anymore. If one switch is on, you have no control of the lights from the other switch. As in, you can't walk past one sensor and then manually turn off the light at the other like the original 3 way switch set up. The OPS5MHWHC can be connected to a standard 3-way switch and keep full function. As in manually turning the lights on or off from either position while keeping full function of the sensor. Granted, you only have one sensor, but in high sensitivity mode, it seems to trigger when entering a large room from either doorway. If I am missing something here, please explain
Yes, I now have two sensors working in parallel. I have an old video showing what would happen if you wired two 3-way occupancy sensor switch the original way. It does not work, therefore the wiring has to be changed. th-cam.com/video/Ma_gWiJ5VEE/w-d-xo.html In a sense it's not 3-way but this is the only option to have two working occupancy sensor working on 14/3 wire that was wired for the original 3-way. It works and people like it 🍻
TH-cam University wins again. My lights are wired through the box with power. Not standard or ideal- but the logic presented in your diagram helped me unfuck my problem. You have another video that’s about 4:50 long on the same subject. It ends with “turns out you can’t do it” - I saw it in the middle of troubleshooting, after having seen this video first (and not knowing they were different). I almost threw my phone. Anyway- this is a helpful video. Your solution works. The other one… isn’t. I guess I’m writing this to let everyone (and you) know to ignore the other one and only focus on the video that’s about 12m long. Thank you again. It’s clear I have more confidence than ability- and tutorials like this help make it look like I know what I’m doing. 😂
Kevin, Can I use one occupancy sensor switch and one normal 3 way switch. Always leave the normal on, and let the motion switch to detect both doors just in your case.
I have a setup like this but I was able to tap into a hot wire from the fan switch in the same gang box as the motion sensor. This provided power to the motion sensor and now both switches work like normal. when you turn on/off the normal 3-way switch the motion sensor clicks and will also turn the light off after 1 minute regardless of which switch is turned on.
Hi Kevin, I do not know if you are still monitoring the comments section, but if you do I have a question. Will your wiring diagram work for a occupancy sensor switch like the TopGreener single pole (No Neutral Required)? This switch accepts only two cables + ground, and it does not need neutral wire (white cable). Maybe the better question is, does your wiring diagram requires always using the neutral (white) otherwise will not work? I think it is awesome you took the time to answer each question on this video. PS If you see this question twice, is that after submitting it the first time it disappeared for me.
Hi Gabriel, if this switch had I neutral wire, I would say yes. Sorry, I cannot confirm that it will work. However, I do know that some switches say neutral wire is not needed, but uses the ground wire as a back door as a neutral. If the ground wire isn't connected the switch won't work. 🍻
@@KevinPon. quick follow up question. After looking at online pictures for the Lutron MS-OPS2-WH, it has two black wires and ground. It does not seem to have a white cable. You mentioned that this could work as a cheaper solution. Is this still the case, even though does not have a white wire (neutral)? Thank you for you time and consideration to my question
Yes, this one will work. If you look in the customer pictures on Amazon. You can see the neutral wire is cover by a green sleeve. It's actually a neutral wire. I don't know why they do it this way. To save a wire/money?
@@KevinPon. sorry i thought they were only vacancy sensor. Yes, I am installing LED strip/tape light under every stair nose from my stairs and I want to have an auto on switch both upstairs and downstairs so that the stairs light up whenever i get close from either side of the stairs. Would that work?
Came back after watching this earlier to say the same thing. He merely is back feeding either switch while the other is triggered by motion. I see no problem with this.
Thanks Kevin. In my 3 ways outlet I found there were 2 traveller wires( one black one red) with brass screws and 1 black wire with black screw. I have replaced one of outlets and red wire is on left and black wire(traveller) is on right & above black screw. So I have 2 questions 1. Can I exchange two traveller wires location , switch into red wire on right and black wire on left ❓2. Do I need to match the same traveller wires locations between my 2 three way outlets such as both of red wires on left with brass screw, both of black traveller wires on left with brass screw thank you：）
Hello there, I have never exchanged the travellers but I do believe it will still work the same. Just as long the black screw gets the correct wire on both 3-ways 🍻
@@KevinPon. hey brother will it work the same for this switch is the wiring the same thanks for your help like usual ECOELER 3 Way Motion Sensor Light Switch, Neutral Wire Required, if u want u can also email me at larrynypd@aol,com plus if u have a address i will send u a nypd shirt
I just installed these motion detector switches at the end of 2 hallways. I used your wiring diagram, and they all work perfectly. Looking at your wiring configuration, I understand that they are no longer 3 way switches, just a motion detector sensor with a constant hot, and a common switch leg. Thank you for the excellent wiring diagram.
Basically to make it clear. For both boxes - splice all the neutral together - splice ground - splice both traveller with device - splice power with device I'm I correct ???
Pretty much. Your pt. 3 is for splicing the lighting side. You can watch this video, it's for a 4-way but it's the same process. th-cam.com/video/nf6u03Q8cWw/w-d-xo.html 🍻
I’m a little confused. Both of mine have 4 wires going to the switches because the ground is on the switches. Where are the grounds going for the motion sensor wires?
Hello are there such motion sensor switches that can be installed on stairs that require 3 switches because there are 3 levels to the building? Do you know any? I think that may be considered 4-way switch?! Am i correct?
Hello, if there are 3 switches that control the same set of lights. Then there will be two 3-ways and one single 4-way in the middle. You can check out this video for more explanation. Cheers! th-cam.com/video/9pOdotxdYp0/w-d-xo.html
Correct me if I’m wrong, but couldn’t you use a pair of the cheaper single-pole motion sensors instead? When you don’t use the blue wire, you’re using these in single-pole mode, right? This wiring is simply two separate single pole switches feeding the same light. It works because they’re both on timers. Which is to say: I think it’s brilliant!
Hi Kevin, I have a 3way controlling a staircase and wish only to control top of staircase with a 3way Lutron motion switch and the bottom a standard 3 way switch. Unfortunately the power feed is into the bottom switch standard 3 way, and as per fine print it’s not supported in that configuration. Can I use your diagram and replace your switch one with standard 3way?
Unfortunately once you have one motion switch installed. You cannot use the manual switch. The sensor needs constant 24/7 power. Even if the sensor is installed on the side with the feed you won't be able to switch the manual 3-way off. Once the manual is switched off. The sensor cannot turn the light back on 🍻
@@KevinPon. Haha, sorry I can use motion to turn on my lights and they will timeout out and go off 🥳 I can use the button to turn on the lights then turn them off...🥳 But if motion is what turns on the lights the buttons aren''t able to be used to turn them off .😞
Ah yes then you will have to wait for it to timeout. In 1 minute the soonest it can turn off by itself for the lowest setting. I wished they had a 30 second setting 🍻
@@KevinPon. my question is if I did something wrong because I cannot use the button to turn the light off if motion originally turned it on. But on other single pole ones I can use both. It is motion OR button but you can't turn it off with the button if you didn't originally turn it on that way.
@@aliciawilliams3687 oh I see. So if you installed yours just like the way I have it. Two of them. I am assuming both motion sensors have been triggered. If you press one to turn off. That switch it off however you still have one more to turn off. You must turn them both off in order for the light to shut off. There is another way where you can just have 1 motion sensor installed on your 3-way system. The other end have to spice wires to keep the power loop complete. That is where box you won't be installing another motion switch and having it blanked off. I hope this answers your question 🍻
Kevin, great video. I'm wondering, is it possible to use just one motion sensor switch and a regular switch on the other side? I've done it and have to leave the regular switch always on as you mentioned but the problem is that switch becomes useless. If I want to turn on the lights from the regular switch I'm not able to, the system can only be operated from the motion sensing switch.
Thank you! Yes that is correct. The entire 3-way circuit can only be controlled by the motion sensor. You cannot turn off the switch. If your regular switch is off, it completely turns everything off and cuts the power to the motions sensor 🍻
@@KevinPon. I really appreciate the quick reply! What's weird is that for about a week if I'd turn off the regular switch when the light was off but then turn it back on, it would turn on the lights. Now it turns it on for a split second but then turns off. Do you know why that is?
@@juancaps the regular switch, normally you leave it on 24/7. The motion switch is working normally but it just doesn't know that the regular switch is turned off. When it turns on the light is probably very dim is because you have turned off the regular switch
So what I didn’t see was if both sensors are “on” and set to watch for motion, will one sensor keep the power on with out timing out? And if the other is out of sight from the other location would it do the same and keep the lights on?
there are different types of Lutron Maestro Motion Sensor Switches on Amazon. Please, tell me which one I need to make same connection as on this video? Thank you
This is the one I used in the video www.amazon.com/Lutron-Electronics-MS-VPS5MH-WH-Maestro-Vacancy/dp/B008SE3GBU/ref=sr_1_21?keywords=lutron+motion+sensor+light+switch&qid=1659137233&sprefix=lutron+motion+%2Caps%2C154&sr=8-21 Need one with neutral wire to work. Cheers!
@@asa9999 this one has more reviews. But in the pictures they are identical. Model number is different but they look the same. www.amazon.com/Lutron-MS-OPS5M-WH-Single-Pole-Multi-Location-MS-OPS5MH-WH/dp/B005WM3C42/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=OPS5M-WH&qid=1591491398&sr=8-1
Brilliant video. I have a pathway in my house that involves 4 lights which are all 3 way switches. I have wanted to make the pathway motion activated for years and now I think I can! Background - The switches for 2 of the lights are not "line of sight" so I need them both switches to be motion-activated and I will wire them as you have suggested. My question pertains to the other 2 lights which are in the same "line of sight" (ie, motion in the hallway would probably be picked up by either the switches being motion-activated switches. I'm trying to decide if there would be any benefit in using 2 motion activated switches even for these lights. Would the switches act differently when one is in the off position and one is in the off position (as you demonstrated at the end of this video) based on whether I use one or two motion-activated switches in the circuit? Also, these switches will be in a box that has a GE Smart Switch, do you anticipate that being a problem? I saw one post that seemed to indicate that activating the Smart Switch caused the motion activated switches to be triggered. Thanks for posting great content and also commenting on our questions. I have been using TH-cam for DIY for decades and you are the first Channel that I ever subscribed to!
Hi Steve! Thank you very much for subscribing! It means a lot. To answer your first question. If you have your switches wired as per diagram. It does not matter whether one of the other is on or off or even both on. They are wired in "parallel". In other words having two switches in different locations that does the same job. As for GE smart switch, I don't have any experience with them. I'll have to Google it. I'll get back to you on that. 🍻
Hello Kevin here is my dilemma I have one older model IPS06 which has no rear wires coming out, and one of there newer design , model DOS05 which has the wires like yours and cant for the life of me figure this out. Could you have a look and advise?😢
I wired it as described, and the switches work on motion, but the lights are coming on every 4 minutes all by themselves. I have taped over the motion sensors to see if it would stop, no luck. Any ideas? I might return these and go with a single pole as some of the comments said.
The tape must be fully covering the sensors but I assume they are. Sounds like one or maybe both are faulty switches. Yes single pole would be the cheaper option 🍻
Great video with easy-to-follow instructions. I installed 2 sensors in my garage - upstairs and downstairs but only the upstairs are working. Do you know why this is the case?
Hi Tony, the circuit must not be complete. There needs to be constant power going to both switches and also all the neutral wires must be used in the same circuit. Or the switch could be faulty but you can switch it to upstairs and see if it makes a difference 🍻
@@KevinPon. how do you test if the circuit is faulty? both switches were working properly before I installed the sensors. Now, only 1 sensor works at a time. My friend was telling me that I need to follow your testing procedures at the end to make it work, which I try. But just couldn't get both sensors to work.
@@tc333888 hmm that's very strange. Can you double check the wire diagram with what you have connected. It should've worked. I still think it's not wired completely, something it's complete that it's not providing power back to the light
My current setup is two 2-Gang Toggle Wall Plates with 2 switches at each end of a hallway. I would like to replace this with two 2-Gant Rocker Wall Plates with 2 single pole Luton Auto On/Off switches. Would this allow Auto On/Off or manual On/Off from either side of the hallway?
Kevin , how do i simply bypass sensor mode. My tenant does not want the light going on automatically in one room. I dont know how to set that up..I only know how to adjust tomes and modes
@@KevinPon. .Hi Kevin. Thanks. Ive done just that. Im Glad u validated my method.. I was scratching my head thinking there was some simple programming i was missing .
Hi Kevin, I bought two levinton 3-way switches, not sure which I'm doing wrong, best i can do is have it flicker the lights on for a few seconds, then it shuts off again. my hot 14-2 is on same side as the 14-3 traveller and the 2nd location only has a single 14-3 into it? let me know if you can help more, thank You
Hello, the important key is to have constant power going to both switches. Just like how I have it in my wire diagram. Also all the neutral wires are connected 🍻
I have power running though the light and then to switch. White wire coded as black at switch. How would I make this work for two occupancy sensors controlling light.
Hi Kevin, Thanks a lot for your great demo and explanation! I have a 4 way light ( 3 switches) on stairway. I need when step up the stair , light is on (first floor), and same when step down stair (top floor) which has a 4 way switch, can I use the second sensor on top floor? Here is the actual config I have: - 1st floor 3way switch, I replace it using 3way sensor, it's working fine - middle floor, looks like I have a 3way with dimmer - top floor, I have a 4 way switch but no neutral only red and black wires on each side I read one of your replies that the 4 way can be replaced with an occupancy sensor? How do I do that to power the 2nd sensor? Single pole sensor or 3 way sensor? You mentioned also other alternative as making the 4 way switch to become a single pole? Can you explain more on detail how this can be achieved? Any help is greatly appreciated!
Hello there & thank you! To clarify you want to replace your 4-way switch with a motion sensor switch correct? The main thing is that to get that to work. All of your switch box must all have constant source of power running to it. They all need the white neutral wire. There must be some white wires in your 4-way switch?
@@KevinPon. Thanks Kevin for quick reply. Yes, that's correct. I'm going to pull the 4 way switch out to see if I see the neutral wire. Should it be there at first place? If not, I'm stuck?
@@cpm5303 the thing is you have a 3-way dimmer. That will have to get replaced with a motion sensor as well. The entire setup will not fully function properly. It will cut a break in the constant power carry out for the entire setup. If you look at my drawing the whole setup needs constant power running to all switches.
@@KevinPon. I pulled out the 4 way switch, it does have 2 black wires joined on the back, I will guess it is the neutral ones? Are the travellers wires the ones connected to the box? So should I replace it with a 3way sensor, right? Looks like you said I need to change the dimmer too, I need to use then Lutron 3way sensor with dimmer, right? When I open the existing dimmer, I have only 3 wires and I see it is also 3 wires on the lutron 3way dimmer sensor? It it the good one? I like to have the dimmer sensor, can it be used for my setup? Will that sensor dimmer working too to light on automatically like the other two?
@@cpm5303 The travellers are connected to the 4-way switch. Take a look at this picture of the 4-way switch to see if your switch is wired just like this: images.app.goo.gl/eUEuw4k9tER9bYCt6 The 3 way sensor can stay but you will have to replace the 3-way dimmer unless you find a motions sensor with a dimmer 3-way if it’s available. The setup will not work if you keep your dimmer it has to be replaced with a motion sensor because you have to have constant flow of power to all switches. Cannot have a break. The dimmer causes the break. Lutron are good dimmers but you don’t have to buy this brand. Other dimmers work too. Yes, sensor dimmers will work the same with automatic functions.
![สาวเมืองเพชร - ธีเดช ทองอภิชาติ [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kEt7F9PvO3I/mqdefault.jpg)
*NEW Video* 3x motion sensor switch on 4-way circuit th-cam.com/video/6kYjr4_MwqQ/w-d-xo.html
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So they are both being used as single pole? Two single would turn on one light?
@@rnava435 yes and yes 🍻
@@KevinPon. I have 3 switches to a light would 3 single pole switches work also?
@@rnava435 yes it will work. Most importantly is having constant power to all switches and a complete circuit going back to the light. Cannot have any breaks
@@KevinPon. thanks much appreciated just subscribed to you
After 3 weeks of troubleshooting and DIY vid searching I was about throw in the towel and get an electrician. At my last attempt, I found your solution. It works flawlessly on the first go! Kudos to you! You got my like and sub! Thank you!
Thank you Omar! I am very happy my video helped you! 🍻😁
Electrician here, I have a couple of years in the trade and yet I sort of skimmed through the official manual without reading the disclaimer of "only one motion switch may work in a 3 way circuit". No wonder the actual diagram on the manual didn't work. Was beginning to think i was going crazy. Thanks a ton!
That diagram that came with the switch is crap.. :)
Exactly says wire of different color, wtf.
@@karlrex2757
I worked in the occupancy sensor industry for about 15 years. There was a court battle over the patent rights to using a ground return. Long story short, this affected the ability of manufactures to make two sensors work in parallel as suggested here. It is a little complicated legally but some manufactures avoided infringement simply by declaring that a 3 way would not work. In reality, some do. From the example of this video, it looks like it does work.
Just want to say thank you!!! I am no electrician. Had stairway that makes an L shape to garage. Wanted stairway garage light to work either when I pull into garage or top of stairway going down to garage. Looked at your wiring diagram but your actual installation part proved perfect and easy to follow. I guessed right which box had the load, everything worked perfect the first time after install. One caution to note though…. After installing switches and waiting the minute like you did, it took mine over 5 minutes to switch off first. I almost thought I had something wired wrong. Lucky I waited a bit more. Works perfect. Guess I can program them for shorter on time. Thank you again!
You're very welcome. That is wonderful! Glad to hear everything went well! 🍻
I saw the original of this where you said it wont work, but then you realized that we all make mistakes and came back with this one. Kudos to you, nice job.
Thank you very much 😊
You prolly dont give a shit but if you are stoned like me atm you can stream pretty much all the latest movies on Instaflixxer. Have been binge watching with my brother for the last few months =)
holy cow, you are a lifesaver!! BTW for anyone using the multi color (ECOELER brand) The pattern is the same: BLUE is capped on both; RED AND BLACK travellers are spliced to the device RED also on both. Thanks again, bud!
😁 you are very welcome!! 🍻
Hey can you explain in details please
Thank you very much. This is just what I needed. I also took a switch apart to see how it works, to feel confident that it was the right way to hook the switches up. But that made me realize that I could have saved $20 by buying single way switches instead.
My pleasure Bruce! Yes you are 100% correct. Single way switches will work as well 🍻
@Francis Man if you send me your email. I'll get back to you asap
@@KevinPon. I e-mailed you thanks.
@@fcpman40 email sent. I hope you'll understand it 🍻
@@KevinPon. do you know if I can wire a motion sensor switch at one end and a caseta smart switch at the other end so I get motion sensor on one side and a smart switch on other side? (typically for caseta switch, I think they make u wire one end and jumper the other end and put a wireless pico remote there)
This just saved me.
I was stumped on how to get both sensors to work.
Good video! The key for me was finding the power source wire. I guessed wrong on my first try and then used the voltage meter and it was a piece of cake from there.
I just installed 2 TP-Link Kaza Smart Motion sensor dimmers in a hallway using your method and they work flawlessly, what I love the most is the option of being able to control the sensitivity of the sensors from the app and I can also create a schedule if I need to.
Amazing!! Thanks for sharing 🍻
Followed this steps & used a Leviton IPSD6 for my basement with incandescent bulb... Leviton IPSD6 on the top of the stairs and one on the bottom.. works perfectly..
This helped me a lot for installing 2 ECOELER 3 Way Motion Sensor Light Switchs in a stair way. There is a post on Amazon by a Donn R. for this switch that helps with using two 3-way sensor switches that leads people here. The only difference for me was the ECOELER has a red and black wire verses 2 black wires as in this video. On the Aux switch I had to connect the black wire from the switch to the black traveler, which was hot coming from the primary switch. Then from the box I tied the other red traveler wire with the other black wire with the red traveler on the switch. Still capped both blues on each end. This worked for me like a charm just like in this video, so thank you very much Kevin for this video.
You're very welcome Charles! Brings me joy when I can help others 😁🍻
Were your motion sensor switches the ones that turn on automatically, or just vacancy sensor?
After seeing this youtube a couple of times, I was able to understand the house wiring and the diagram that came with the switches. Blew off the circuit breaker couple of times, but that is because I installed the first switch before I found your instructional video. So I corrected the connections on the first switch and all went great from there. Thank you Kevin!!!!
Glad to hear you have solved the problem! You're very welcome Hamid! 🍻
Had to comment, this worked beautifully with leviton ips06 motion sensors. I did have an issue where when the lights were to be off, the lights flashed full brightness in a pattern of 0.5 sec on, 1 sec off. was driving me crazy until I read as a troubleshooting step to swap one of the LED bulbs with an incandescent. Did this, and it solved my flashing problem.
That's awesome news my friend! Glad you figured it out 🍻
Worked great - was nice to have a proper wiring diagram to go with this. And you did a nice job explaining the process
Thank you! Much appreciated 🍻 😊
I performed the installation for 2 3way switches and just set one switch to manually turn on and auto-off and it works great
Great work Eric! 🍻
Many thanks Kevin for this video...it helped a lot...I have spent 3 days already tinkering on the wiring, and almost gave up, as I have different configuration. The line and load are on the same box. Read through the comments and found what I needed to do. I have Leviton switch...works the same. Keep up the good work!
Thank you and you're very welcome Jerry! Glad to hear my video helped! Yup, this will work on all brands of switches. 🍻
@@KevinPon. I just wired my second set, this time in the second floor stairs leading to the bedroom...just did it in 15 minutes this time. Thanks for this video!
Thank you for the guide Kevin! Was hitting my head against the wall on this until I found your video.
My pleasure 😁🍻
Good videoing Was going to make one, but I think this guy has it pretty much covered from a to z. I do like how he tested the "udder" ones and not the "other" ones - that made me chuckle.Otherwise this guy's great, This is a great intermediate video as well. I wouldn't call this beginner. I would call this intermediate, and I think you did a great job so congratulations. I'm gonna look at all your udder ones, Just giving you a hard time but I really am gonna go check the other videos out.
Worked like a charm. Thank you!
@@trevfunk6668 Awesome!! 🍻
Man, you are the best! you saved me. My wife almost kills me, 5 days with no light in the hall way, hahahaha
I’d like to see the 3 location diagram as well.
Thanks, Kevin!
Great explanation and demonstration.
Any idea why the manufacturer says it cannot be done?
Thank you for the video, Kevin. However, I have a question. It looks like your idea can be described as using two occupancy sensors in single pole mode being connected in parallel. Another words if you’re not using blue wires than why not to make this installation with just two single poles providing they’re almost twice cheaper? Thank you.
Hi Igor, you're very welcome! Good question. You are 100% correct! Will be cheaper using two single pole sensors. I made this video base on the current props I had. A few of my viewers needed my help so I decided to make this video for them. But also to prove Lutron's installation guide that it was possible to install two of these switches when mentioned cannot. Thank you for the comment. Cheers!
Read my mind. Great question and saves money! Should write Lutron as it's a no-brainer necessity to have this wiring option available!
This is great - the only minor downside is that it's not operating in true 3-way mode, in that you won't be able to use the 'other switch' to turn off the lights - to turn off the lights you'll just have to wait until the triggered PIR switches off or you manually turn that switch off - pressing the on/off button on the other switch will have no effect.
The good news is that either switch will turn on the lights ...
Is there a work-around for this, maybe by doing something with the blue wires?
Not a criticism, just an observation: The schematic (wiring diagram) @ 0.57 shows the BLK Hot (Line) wire connects to the "input" of switch #1 and the "input" of switch #2. The "output" of switch #1 connects to the "output" of switch #2 which then connects to the Light bulb (Load). These two switches are simply connected in parallel, that's all. You can use the less expensive MS-OPS2 instead of the MS-OPS5M and get the same results.
I was working with the props I had but that is 100% correct. Good observation Chris! 🍻
I was wondering why a single pole could not be used instead of the 3-way switch???
Yes you can. I was using with what I had 🍻
Thanks I got it to work, it cures my problem with my garage lights, again thanks
That is wonderful! Congratulations on your success! Your most welcome 🍻
According to your wiring diagram, you can install two 2-ways motion sensors to make light working as a 3-ways circuit.
Yes that is correct. I made this video as many requests 🍻
Great video. Thanks !
Crazy how hard it is to try to find out how to do this. With two Lutron MS-OPS5M motion detectors, there were no instructions on how to do this (ya think they'd publish how to do it, let's say in the case of a stairway like in this video and in my use case). The diagram was perfect for me. Thank you for publishing this!
Happy it all worked out! 🍻
@@KevinPon. Turning them manually on/off works, but the motion sensor seems to not work each time on them. Any suggestions? I've played with the Lutron settings and such. I'll keep tinkering.
Amazing job Kevin! What a rewarding journey! Can't wait to try it out myself!
Thank you Corbin! Yes, indeed!
Kevin i did it on one 3-way and got it working 👍 But then I tried it on a different 3 way and one lutron switch was working fine, but the switch other had nothing. It wouldn't turn the light on or off. Followed the exact same instructions that you gave and that worked for the other 3 way. So anyway I've been trying to troubleshoot and I found something I think is a little odd.
What does it mean if when using a multimeter:
Black lead touching ground + red lead touching black (hot) = 120 v
Black lead touching white (neutral) + red lead touching black (hot) = 0
Shouldn't I be getting 120? That's the hot wire for this 3 way set up
@@corbindean1776 That's great news that you got it working on the first one. Now for the the different 3-way hmm that's a bit strange. Yes, you are correct. When touching (hot to neutral), you should get 120v. The possible reason for this is: the white is not spliced correctly on the other end. I assume this 3-way switch was working from the start?
@@KevinPon. yes it was. That's what has me confused
I would remove the switches on both ends and inspect the wires. Start from scratch. Double check if the 14/3 wire is spliced correctly on both ends. Making sure all whites are together and only whites. The travelers and separated and not connected to anything else (red + black). Then one 14/2 wire (black) will be hot to confirm with meter and the other switch 14/2 (black) will be coming from the light with 0 volts to neutral or ground.
Thanks! This helped me replace 1 of my 2 switches with an occupancy sensor too.
Worked perfectly. Thank you so much
You're very welcome! 🍻
Thank you very much for creating this video. This helped me a lot. 😀
Glad to hear 😄🍻
Hey I’m just curious since you are back feeding other outlet nothing burned out after time. I’m no electrician just wondering I don’t know how sophisticated those switches are and if it won’t burn them out. Your video helped me out with installation Thx
Hello there, nothing burned out. Just simply doing a parallel circuit 🍻
Worked like a charm! Having similar issues with 3 way smart dimmer + 3 way dumb switch. Do you happen to have a solution for it? Even a professional electrician hasn't been able to figure it out!
So two effects with this method since they are effectively wired in parallel:
-I think it may have been noted but I beleive manually shutting off one switch with the paddle won't do anything, you will have to hit the other or wait for the motion to time out.
-Technically the load capactity with be shared when both are activated. More a minor point in this day and age of LED *HOWEVER* I note some people saying that you can do this with a MS-OPS2H to save some money since you don't need the 3-way feature of the MS-OPS5M *BUT* the OPS2 is only a 2A switch and the OPS5 is 5A. Something to be aware of if you have a lot of lights on the swich circuit. I.E. with only one activated you may be pushing the limit of a single OPS2.
Actually one other thing occurs to me on the first point. I wonder if just wiring the blues together as well would "fake" the two swiches in to thinking the other end was a companion switch and therefore shut themseleves off if the other manual paddle was pressed? I don't know the details of what exact "signal" is sent or level maintainted on the blue line when used in the pseudo 3-way mode.
Hi Kevin this worked like a charm. I have another circuit that has 3 switches, I understand in your comments that another switch can be added in parallel. I'm assuming you could do an unlimited number of switches?
Your schematic is perfect and easy to follow. Leviton should hire you. Could you do another schematic for a 3 switch scenario?
I’d like to see the 3 location diagram as well.
Thanks, Kevin!
Great explanation and demonstration.
Any idea why the manufacturer says it cannot be done?
@DamBevers the setup for 3 switches is very similar to the video. You have to have constant power traveling to all 3 locations and have all the white wires connected together. I think the reason the manufacturers don't want to tell you is because they do not want any liability 🍻
This is like some CIA-Jimmy Hoffa-Hudini information here! Been looking for this for a while . Thanks!
😂👍🏻🍻
I really thanks God for helping me to find your video instruction, it is very good explanation on how to put two sensors in one light because even the manufacturer wants to use the blue wire and that is a mistake , thanks my friend and God bless you. your system work great 😀😀
Glad to help brother! 😁🍻
Hello Kevin, thank you for sharing this brilliant idea! My understand is that now both sensors will work but if one of the switches is shut off manually then the others could not be switched on manually right?
Thank you! If one is switched off manually, the other switch can still turn the light on or off 🍻
Hi Kevin. Great video. I followed the instructions and its sort of working. Wondering if you can provide some guidance. Both switches have power however the motion is only working on the aux switch. Once motion is triggered on that one I see a blinking light on the master but thats all I get from the master. Even if I try to hit the on/off switch on the master, it does nothing. Thanks in advance.
Hi Matt, thank you. That's a good start that both switches have power but how is your neutral wire hooked up? Are they both connected in parallel together too?
Hi Matt and Kevin - I am having the same issue. My switches do not have any white/neutral wires, so I was forced to skip that portion of the wiring diagram. All I have are black and red (plus the ground). Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated?
Kevin - thanks for the video. My 2nd switch that is fed power only has a single black cable, not two like your example. How does this change the configuration?
Hi DW! Oh boy. Just to confirm. You only have 1 black wire that's it? No white or red?
@@KevinPon. It has red and black traveler wires and white neutral. The black wire out to the lights is actually in the first box. I was able to figure it out through a few hours of trial and error. This task was made more complicated with a set of bathroom lights/switches in a different part of my house also on the same circuit that must be connected to the first switch to function. Working solution = 1st switch box has 4 black wires (switch, hot, traveler for bathroom lights/switches, and black traveler to 2nd switch) together, 5 white neutrals (all of the above plus the lights) together, and finally the red traveler, black wire for lights, and black 14/3 switch wire together. 2nd switch is wired to white neutral, 14/2 to black traveler that is connected to constant power, and 14/3 to red traveler. Messy but works perfectly.
@@sdsfive I am glad you got it all figured out! Job well done! 🍻
I recently found myself in this situation. It means that the electrical load is wired from box 1, not box 2 as shown in Kevin's diagram. To solve, you need to figure out which color traveler wire in box 2 (either black or red or white) is transmitting current back to the load in box 1. Typically this will be the wire that is connected to the "common" terminal (the darker of the 3 terminals) on the manual switch you are replacing in box 2.
Connect to the black "line out" from your new switch 2 to this "common" wire in box 2. At this point, two of your three traveler wires in box 2 are accounted for - the "common", and the black that you connected to the hot black 14/2 in box 1 as per Kevin's diagram. Connect the white wire from switch 2 to the final unaccounted-for traveler wire in box 2, and in box 1 connect that wire's other end to the neutral white 14/2 wire.
Awesome man. Just had to wire it up and glad I found your video. Thanks alot
😎🍻
I guess I have a different model of Maestro switch’s that do not have the neutral wire. Is there anyway these could be made to work. I have tried the wiring diagram with no luck. Thanks
Honestly thank you
😊
I understand your two-switch conversion. Now, suppose you have 4 switches, two 3-way and two 4-way in the middle? I want to put two 3-way motion switches at the two 3-way switch locations... Would my 4-way switches make and break that red traveler wire you show?
Hi Kelvin,
Thanks for the great advice.
Just wonder does it work if I have one 3-way sensor switch and the other just normal 3-way switch. I install on one side, and found that when I turn off the light from normal 3-way switch. I couldn’t turn on again from the 3-way sensor anymore, and motion sensor won’t work. Only when I flipped the switch from the 3-way to opposite side, then the 3-way sensor work again. Do u know what I missed?
Hi Steven, don't worry you have installed it correctly. It's supposed to do that. The 3 way switch on either side you have it, you still cannot flip it off. That's because the 3-way sensor needs constant power on 24/7. When you flip it off, the power cannot be transferred to the 3-way sensor by the travelers. It's how it is.
You are my magician! It works! Thank you so much!
😂 my pleasure my friend! 🍻
Looking at the graph, I guess one caveat we won't be able to turn off the circuit using only one switch if the other is on right?
Correct
Great video. Helped me out so much. Thanks
You're very welcome! 🍻🍻
This is a great video. It will help me lots. Thank you so much!
My pleasure my friend 🍻
Wont the power source be the 14/2 wire always? There are like 3 ways to wire these and if one of the boxes has a 14/2 and a 14/3 wouldn't that be the power source?
@BassManStrikes yes, only 1 out of the 2, 3-ways switch will have the constant power (feed) 14/2 and the other one will be the 14/2 switch leg 🍻
I wanted to to do this on my basement stairs as the lights always get left on and they burn out much faster LOL. Does not look like it works if your 3 circuit has one switch that has no neutral.
The box at the top of the stairs has 1 14/2 coming from breaker box, 1 14/2 going to light and 1 14/3 going to the other switch at bottom of stairs. This was wired in 2012 and apparently it was up to code them to have a switch with no neutral.
You are the bestesis!!!! Thanks Bro!!!!!!!!
😄 you're very welcome! 🍻
thanks you this helped me out so much you have no idea
Am I missing something ?
Don't you basically now have two sensors working in parallel?
Not 3 way anymore.
If one switch is on, you have no control of the lights from the other switch.
As in, you can't walk past one sensor and then manually turn off the light at the other like the original 3 way switch set up.
The OPS5MHWHC can be connected to a standard 3-way switch and keep full function. As in manually turning the lights on or off from either position while keeping full function of the sensor.
Granted, you only have one sensor, but in high sensitivity mode, it seems to trigger when entering a large room from either doorway.
If I am missing something here, please explain
Yes, I now have two sensors working in parallel. I have an old video showing what would happen if you wired two 3-way occupancy sensor switch the original way. It does not work, therefore the wiring has to be changed. th-cam.com/video/Ma_gWiJ5VEE/w-d-xo.html
In a sense it's not 3-way but this is the only option to have two working occupancy sensor working on 14/3 wire that was wired for the original 3-way. It works and people like it 🍻
TH-cam University wins again.
My lights are wired through the box with power. Not standard or ideal- but the logic presented in your diagram helped me unfuck my problem.
You have another video that’s about 4:50 long on the same subject. It ends with “turns out you can’t do it” - I saw it in the middle of troubleshooting, after having seen this video first (and not knowing they were different). I almost threw my phone.
Anyway- this is a helpful video. Your solution works. The other one… isn’t. I guess I’m writing this to let everyone (and you) know to ignore the other one and only focus on the video that’s about 12m long.
Thank you again. It’s clear I have more confidence than ability- and tutorials like this help make it look like I know what I’m doing. 😂
Thank you for commenting. I enjoyed the read. I am glad it all worked out in the end. Cheers mate! 🍻
Kevin, Can I use one occupancy sensor switch and one normal 3 way switch. Always leave the normal on, and let the motion switch to detect both doors just in your case.
Yes you can that's what I have in my mudroom. Just make sure never switch off the normal 3-way switch🍻
I have a setup like this but I was able to tap into a hot wire from the fan switch in the same gang box as the motion sensor. This provided power to the motion sensor and now both switches work like normal. when you turn on/off the normal 3-way switch the motion sensor clicks and will also turn the light off after 1 minute regardless of which switch is turned on.
So to be clear in your diagram both sensor switches are single pole?
Hello, I made this video based on request. 2x 3-way sensors. But yes single pole options will work and also cheaper alternative 🍻
You saved the day dude
😁🍻
Would this work with a lutron motion dimmer on both or one end? Thanks for the video!
You can have both working just like in the video. Would be the same steps and ignore the blue wire part. Cheers!
Hi Kevin, I do not know if you are still monitoring the comments section, but if you do I have a question. Will your wiring diagram work for a occupancy sensor switch like the TopGreener single pole (No Neutral Required)? This switch accepts only two cables + ground, and it does not need neutral wire (white cable). Maybe the better question is, does your wiring diagram requires always using the neutral (white) otherwise will not work?
I think it is awesome you took the time to answer each question on this video.
PS If you see this question twice, is that after submitting it the first time it disappeared for me.
Hi Gabriel, if this switch had I neutral wire, I would say yes. Sorry, I cannot confirm that it will work. However, I do know that some switches say neutral wire is not needed, but uses the ground wire as a back door as a neutral. If the ground wire isn't connected the switch won't work. 🍻
@@KevinPon. quick follow up question. After looking at online pictures for the Lutron MS-OPS2-WH, it has two black wires and ground. It does not seem to have a white cable. You mentioned that this could work as a cheaper solution. Is this still the case, even though does not have a white wire (neutral)?
Thank you for you time and consideration to my question
Yes, this one will work. If you look in the customer pictures on Amazon. You can see the neutral wire is cover by a green sleeve. It's actually a neutral wire. I don't know why they do it this way. To save a wire/money?
thanks for the tips. how about a 4way switch? same thing on the 3rd box?
It's a similar process. Most importantly it needs constant power and complete circuit is active 24/7. Cheers!
@@KevinPon. Kev you genius. I’m stuck. Would appreciate some help. I have emailed you. Thanks.
i want to do this but i have a 4way in the middle of two 3-way switches … can i make both 3ways sensors and keep the 4way as a regular switch???
You're amazing. 🎉
Thank you! 🍻😎
Thank you for this video. Would this work with two auto-on 3way switches?
Do you mean like the switches I have? They are auto on
@@KevinPon. sorry i thought they were only vacancy sensor. Yes, I am installing LED strip/tape light under every stair nose from my stairs and I want to have an auto on switch both upstairs and downstairs so that the stairs light up whenever i get close from either side of the stairs. Would that work?
@@KevinPon. I just rewatched the full video and paid more attention. This just made my day, thank you. I liked and subscribed to your channel.
Thank you for subscribing! Yes it will work. Same idea but yours will be LED strip 🍻
@@KevinPon. Much respect to you and your knowledge. Thank you so much.
Hey Kevin, based on this, could you do with 2 single pole motion sensor switch considering that the blue wire isnt used? Thanks
Yes 100% Tom. You got it!
Came back after watching this earlier to say the same thing. He merely is back feeding either switch while the other is triggered by motion. I see no problem with this.
Thanks Kevin. In my 3 ways outlet I found there were 2 traveller wires( one black one red) with brass screws and 1 black wire with black screw. I have replaced one of outlets and red wire is on left and black wire(traveller) is on right & above black screw. So I have 2 questions 1. Can I exchange two traveller wires location , switch into red wire on right and black wire on left ❓2. Do I need to match the same traveller wires locations between my 2 three way outlets such as both of red wires on left with brass screw, both of black traveller wires on left with brass screw thank you：）
Hello there, I have never exchanged the travellers but I do believe it will still work the same. Just as long the black screw gets the correct wire on both 3-ways 🍻
@@KevinPon. Thank you for your help Kevin! It works ! 😽👏
Awesome!! 😁🍻
Good job it works i ready install 2 of them
Awesome news Luis! Good job man! 🍻
@@KevinPon. hey brother will it work the same for this switch is the wiring the same thanks for your help like usual ECOELER 3 Way Motion Sensor Light Switch, Neutral Wire Required, if u want u can also email me at larrynypd@aol,com plus if u have a address i will send u a nypd shirt
@@larrynypdlt2065 🙋🏻♂️ absolutely! I can help you out! 😁 I would love an NYPD shirt! I'll send you an email brother
@@KevinPon. hey Kevin, I have the same Ecoeler 3 way light switch. Would you mind sharing your solution with me?
My email is mdover4@yahoo.com
I just installed these motion detector switches at the end of 2 hallways. I used your wiring diagram, and they all work perfectly.
Looking at your wiring configuration, I understand that they are no longer 3 way switches, just a motion detector sensor with a constant hot, and a common switch leg. Thank you for the excellent wiring diagram.
Job well done Jerome!! Thank you! 🍻
Hello Kevin, can I use this installation method for 4 way light switch?
Hi Dee, yes it's possible. It's all about the wiring method. The sensor need to have constant power for it to operate.
What happens if you don’t have any neutral wires ? Only the two travelers and power at each switch ?
No neutral at all?? That's very odd
@@KevinPon. no neutral wires were ran . I ended up grounded them as the paper said and it worked . Thanks for you video 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
@toco002 you're very welcome! I was just about to tell you the ground wire will be your last option 🍻
Basically to make it clear. For both boxes
- splice all the neutral together
- splice ground
- splice both traveller with device
- splice power with device
I'm I correct ???
Pretty much. Your pt. 3 is for splicing the lighting side. You can watch this video, it's for a 4-way but it's the same process. th-cam.com/video/nf6u03Q8cWw/w-d-xo.html 🍻
I’m a little confused. Both of mine have 4 wires going to the switches because the ground is on the switches. Where are the grounds going for the motion sensor wires?
Hello are there such motion sensor switches that can be installed on stairs that require 3 switches because there are 3 levels to the building? Do you know any? I think that may be considered 4-way switch?! Am i correct?
Hello, if there are 3 switches that control the same set of lights. Then there will be two 3-ways and one single 4-way in the middle. You can check out this video for more explanation. Cheers! th-cam.com/video/9pOdotxdYp0/w-d-xo.html
Can this be done on Kasa motion single pole switch(KS200M)? they are not 3 way switches
Yes you can. Just follow the steps and ignore the blue wire. Neutral wire is required! 🍻
Correct me if I’m wrong, but couldn’t you use a pair of the cheaper single-pole motion sensors instead? When you don’t use the blue wire, you’re using these in single-pole mode, right?
This wiring is simply two separate single pole switches feeding the same light. It works because they’re both on timers. Which is to say: I think it’s brilliant!
Bingo! You are absolutely correct. Additional note, neutral wire is required 🍻
Hi Kevin, I have a 3way controlling a staircase and wish only to control top of staircase with a 3way Lutron motion switch and the bottom a standard 3 way switch. Unfortunately the power feed is into the bottom switch standard 3 way, and as per fine print it’s not supported in that configuration. Can I use your diagram and replace your switch one with standard 3way?
Unfortunately once you have one motion switch installed. You cannot use the manual switch. The sensor needs constant 24/7 power. Even if the sensor is installed on the side with the feed you won't be able to switch the manual 3-way off. Once the manual is switched off. The sensor cannot turn the light back on 🍻
THANK YOU FOR THIS! Question, though. It appears the on/off button and motion sensor are an either OR situation 🤔... Did I do something wrong?
Hi Alicia, can you please repeat the question? 😂 I don't understand
@@KevinPon. Haha, sorry
I can use motion to turn on my lights and they will timeout out and go off 🥳
I can use the button to turn on the lights then turn them off...🥳
But if motion is what turns on the lights the buttons aren''t able to be used to turn them off .😞
Ah yes then you will have to wait for it to timeout. In 1 minute the soonest it can turn off by itself for the lowest setting. I wished they had a 30 second setting 🍻
@@KevinPon. my question is if I did something wrong because I cannot use the button to turn the light off if motion originally turned it on. But on other single pole ones I can use both. It is motion OR button but you can't turn it off with the button if you didn't originally turn it on that way.
@@aliciawilliams3687 oh I see. So if you installed yours just like the way I have it. Two of them. I am assuming both motion sensors have been triggered. If you press one to turn off. That switch it off however you still have one more to turn off. You must turn them both off in order for the light to shut off. There is another way where you can just have 1 motion sensor installed on your 3-way system. The other end have to spice wires to keep the power loop complete. That is where box you won't be installing another motion switch and having it blanked off. I hope this answers your question 🍻
Kevin, great video. I'm wondering, is it possible to use just one motion sensor switch and a regular switch on the other side? I've done it and have to leave the regular switch always on as you mentioned but the problem is that switch becomes useless. If I want to turn on the lights from the regular switch I'm not able to, the system can only be operated from the motion sensing switch.
Thank you! Yes that is correct. The entire 3-way circuit can only be controlled by the motion sensor. You cannot turn off the switch. If your regular switch is off, it completely turns everything off and cuts the power to the motions sensor 🍻
@@KevinPon. I really appreciate the quick reply! What's weird is that for about a week if I'd turn off the regular switch when the light was off but then turn it back on, it would turn on the lights. Now it turns it on for a split second but then turns off. Do you know why that is?
@@juancaps the regular switch, normally you leave it on 24/7. The motion switch is working normally but it just doesn't know that the regular switch is turned off. When it turns on the light is probably very dim is because you have turned off the regular switch
So what I didn’t see was if both sensors are “on” and set to watch for motion, will one sensor keep the power on with out timing out? And if the other is out of sight from the other location would it do the same and keep the lights on?
When either one of them is still timing out, the lights will be on. Both of them has to time out completely for the lights to be off. Cheers mate!
Thank you very much
What happens if you press the button to manually turn it on or off on one of the locations
It will turn on and off normally only if the other sensor cannot sense you and is off.
@@KevinPon. thanks a lot kevin
Hi Kevin.
Will this method work for Leviton DOS05, 2 sensor switches for One Light?
Hi Luis, yes it will work. It's the same installation as the one in my video 🍻
Thanks bro. Can I just buy a single pole switches instead 3 ways for saving money? Or it won’t work?
No problem! Absolutely, yes you can. As long it requires a neutral wire 🍻
@@KevinPon. thanks bro
@@KevinPon. where u live bro?
@@KevinPon. my single pole Lutron does not have neutral!
@@ethanpn2003 Canada 🇨🇦
there are different types of Lutron Maestro Motion Sensor Switches on Amazon. Please, tell me which one I need to make same connection as on this video? Thank you
This is the one I used in the video www.amazon.com/Lutron-Electronics-MS-VPS5MH-WH-Maestro-Vacancy/dp/B008SE3GBU/ref=sr_1_21?keywords=lutron+motion+sensor+light+switch&qid=1659137233&sprefix=lutron+motion+%2Caps%2C154&sr=8-21
Need one with neutral wire to work. Cheers!
@@KevinPon. thanks
@@asa9999 this one has more reviews. But in the pictures they are identical. Model number is different but they look the same. www.amazon.com/Lutron-MS-OPS5M-WH-Single-Pole-Multi-Location-MS-OPS5MH-WH/dp/B005WM3C42/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=OPS5M-WH&qid=1591491398&sr=8-1
@@KevinPon. that is what I use, it doesn’t seem to work😢
Not sure why. Do I need t to use the exact ones that you used?
Brilliant video. I have a pathway in my house that involves 4 lights which are all 3 way switches. I have wanted to make the pathway motion activated for years and now I think I can! Background - The switches for 2 of the lights are not "line of sight" so I need them both switches to be motion-activated and I will wire them as you have suggested. My question pertains to the other 2 lights which are in the same "line of sight" (ie, motion in the hallway would probably be picked up by either the switches being motion-activated switches. I'm trying to decide if there would be any benefit in using 2 motion activated switches even for these lights. Would the switches act differently when one is in the off position and one is in the off position (as you demonstrated at the end of this video) based on whether I use one or two motion-activated switches in the circuit?
Also, these switches will be in a box that has a GE Smart Switch, do you anticipate that being a problem? I saw one post that seemed to indicate that activating the Smart Switch caused the motion activated switches to be triggered.
Thanks for posting great content and also commenting on our questions. I have been using TH-cam for DIY for decades and you are the first Channel that I ever subscribed to!
Hi Steve! Thank you very much for subscribing! It means a lot. To answer your first question. If you have your switches wired as per diagram. It does not matter whether one of the other is on or off or even both on. They are wired in "parallel". In other words having two switches in different locations that does the same job. As for GE smart switch, I don't have any experience with them. I'll have to Google it. I'll get back to you on that. 🍻
If the GE Smart Switches are controlling different lights. I don't see them interfering with the other switches. Cheers!
Can I use 3 3-way motion sensors to control the lights? I want to install in its floor , 3 hallways. Thanks.
Yes, absolutely. You will have to parallel the circuit. All 3 switches must be wired to have constant power 🍻
Hello Kevin here is my dilemma I have one older model IPS06 which has no rear wires coming out, and one of there newer design , model DOS05 which has the wires like yours and cant for the life of me figure this out. Could you have a look and advise?😢
How did you troubleshoot without the volt meter?
Are you able to add in a 3rd switch? Would you just be wiring 5 wires together instead of 3?
Yes you can. Parallel circuit 🍻
Thank you for your help!!!
Glad I could help 😁🍻
Yes!!! Thank you so much
My pleasure my friend! 😁🍻
I wired it as described, and the switches work on motion, but the lights are coming on every 4 minutes all by themselves. I have taped over the motion sensors to see if it would stop, no luck. Any ideas? I might return these and go with a single pole as some of the comments said.
The tape must be fully covering the sensors but I assume they are. Sounds like one or maybe both are faulty switches. Yes single pole would be the cheaper option 🍻
Great video with easy-to-follow instructions. I installed 2 sensors in my garage - upstairs and downstairs but only the upstairs are working. Do you know why this is the case?
Hi Tony, the circuit must not be complete. There needs to be constant power going to both switches and also all the neutral wires must be used in the same circuit. Or the switch could be faulty but you can switch it to upstairs and see if it makes a difference 🍻
@@KevinPon. how do you test if the circuit is faulty? both switches were working properly before I installed the sensors. Now, only 1 sensor works at a time. My friend was telling me that I need to follow your testing procedures at the end to make it work, which I try. But just couldn't get both sensors to work.
could you please let me know specific steps I need to take to correct this? Thanks for all your help!
I think I have the same problem as Matt Gelber below. Both sensor have power but only one works - in my case it is the upstairs power source sensor.
@@tc333888 hmm that's very strange. Can you double check the wire diagram with what you have connected. It should've worked. I still think it's not wired completely, something it's complete that it's not providing power back to the light
My current setup is two 2-Gang Toggle Wall Plates with 2 switches at each end of a hallway. I would like to replace this with two 2-Gant Rocker Wall Plates with 2 single pole Luton Auto On/Off switches. Would this allow Auto On/Off or manual On/Off from either side of the hallway?
Yes, the single pole will work. Will be the same wiring 🍻
Kevin , how do i simply bypass sensor mode. My tenant does not want the light going on automatically in one room. I dont know how to set that up..I only know how to adjust tomes and modes
Hi Bob, the only way to bypass that is by covering up the sensor 🍻
@@KevinPon. .Hi Kevin. Thanks. Ive done just that. Im Glad u validated my method.. I was scratching my head thinking there was some simple programming i was missing .
Hi Kevin, I bought two levinton 3-way switches, not sure which I'm doing wrong, best i can do is have it flicker the lights on for a few seconds, then it shuts off again. my hot 14-2 is on same side as the 14-3 traveller and the 2nd location only has a single 14-3 into it? let me know if you can help more, thank You
Hello, the important key is to have constant power going to both switches. Just like how I have it in my wire diagram. Also all the neutral wires are connected 🍻
I have power running though the light and then to switch. White wire coded as black at switch. How would I make this work for two occupancy sensors controlling light.
Hi Kevin,
Thanks a lot for your great demo and explanation!
I have a 4 way light ( 3 switches) on stairway. I need when step up the stair , light is on (first floor), and same when step down stair (top floor) which has a 4 way switch, can I use the second sensor on top floor?
Here is the actual config I have:
- 1st floor 3way switch, I replace it using 3way sensor, it's working fine
- middle floor, looks like I have a 3way with dimmer
- top floor, I have a 4 way switch but no neutral only red and black wires on each side
I read one of your replies that the 4 way can be replaced with an occupancy sensor?
How do I do that to power the 2nd sensor? Single pole sensor or 3 way sensor?
You mentioned also other alternative as making the 4 way switch to become a single pole?
Can you explain more on detail how this can be achieved?
Any help is greatly appreciated!
Hello there & thank you!
To clarify you want to replace your 4-way switch with a motion sensor switch correct?
The main thing is that to get that to work. All of your switch box must all have constant source of power running to it. They all need the white neutral wire. There must be some white wires in your 4-way switch?
@@KevinPon. Thanks Kevin for quick reply. Yes, that's correct. I'm going to pull the 4 way switch out to see if I see the neutral wire. Should it be there at first place? If not, I'm stuck?
@@cpm5303 the thing is you have a 3-way dimmer. That will have to get replaced with a motion sensor as well. The entire setup will not fully function properly. It will cut a break in the constant power carry out for the entire setup. If you look at my drawing the whole setup needs constant power running to all switches.
@@KevinPon. I pulled out the 4 way switch, it does have 2 black wires joined on the back, I will guess it is the neutral ones? Are the travellers wires the ones connected to the box? So should I replace it with a 3way sensor, right? Looks like you said I need to change the dimmer too, I need to use then Lutron 3way sensor with dimmer, right? When I open the existing dimmer, I have only 3 wires and I see it is also 3 wires on the lutron 3way dimmer sensor? It it the good one? I like to have the dimmer sensor, can it be used for my setup? Will that sensor dimmer working too to light on automatically like the other two?
@@cpm5303 The travellers are connected to the 4-way switch. Take a look at this picture of the 4-way switch to see if your switch is wired just like this: images.app.goo.gl/eUEuw4k9tER9bYCt6
The 3 way sensor can stay but you will have to replace the 3-way dimmer unless you find a motions sensor with a dimmer 3-way if it’s available. The setup will not work if you keep your dimmer it has to be replaced with a motion sensor because you have to have constant flow of power to all switches. Cannot have a break. The dimmer causes the break. Lutron are good dimmers but you don’t have to buy this brand. Other dimmers work too. Yes, sensor dimmers will work the same with automatic functions.
Thank you Kevin!
You're very welcome my friend 🍻