UPDATE - 10.1.2020 - On the 14th, Trials of Mana will receive update 1.1.0. The patch adds 2 new difficulty options. One of which, "No Future", can only be selected on NG+. Refer to patch notes for complete changes. Other QoL features include skipping class change cutscenes and credits, costumes carry over when class is reset or in NG+, you can go back to level 1 in NG+, and new goddess statues added. These changes address feedback about how the game's on the easy side, and how NG+ felt kinda moot when you kept your level. UPDATE 7.15.21 - Trials of Mana remake has released on mobile devices. The most significant note is that this version has NO controller support. In return, the game has touch controls, auto battle settings, and cloud saves. As always with mobile versions, YMMV.
AustinSV No problem but the Xenoblade Chronicles Definitive Edition will be my Favorite. I love the history of all video games watching them makes me so happy. Keep up the great work I look forward to the Xenoblade Chronicles Ports & Remake Review video :)
you can't transfer rank 4 (plus need to do post game), so no future is pointless (damn near die in 1 hit if you choose a new character whose level doesn't carry over). Needing pre-knowledge for transferring ??? seeds was a pain too, so you may get stuck on class 2 despite being over level 38; though expert fairly balances if you got setup. Just wanted anyone watching to know that about the updates and yeah still single player as you said 12:20
Seiken Densetsu III has always been and will always be my favorite game of all time. You know the question "if you were stranded on an island and could only listen to one cd/album..." It would be the original OST without any hesitation. Watching this video literally made me redownload Trials of Mana to play through again... lol thank you
To me the new Trials of Mana is a perfect remake, in the sense that it maintained all the aesthetic spirit and general zeitgeist of the original, looks gorgeous without having to go for bleeding edge visual tech (is that *really* what anyone wants of a remake of this type of game? I get why REmakes do that, but this is a completely different art style that was never trying for realism in the first place, as RE games always were), and is extremely fun to play due to all the new and redesigned systems. And it isn't a fundamentally different game, like FF7; it's just the best version of itself it can be. Like, I wouldn't have a problem if FFVI were remade with completely changed stats and boss attacks, a more complex magicite and esper system, more complex character class specific skills, new and rebalanced items, etc... but I would never want it to be remade as an action RPG, just because that's the kind of game Nomura likes. Trials of Mana is the best modern remake of a classic game, in my opinion.
Final fantasy 7 was only turn based as a technical limitation in the first place. A lot of devs want to make them action rpg with strategy and party based aspects, because they CANNN now. In a way they couldn't before reliably at the scale they wanted in an rpg.
@@bobdylan1968 I would like to see the source of this statement. Anyway, they kept the turn based system until Ps2, with FF X-2. The difference between tbs is the pace and focus on strategy rather than smashing buttons.
@@lucasrinaldi9909 it's from the devs themsleves. Just gotta look it up. And yeah, they did. It became routine. And even with those games, they couldn't have made an rpg on that scale, as an action rpg. That would have been rough and very very expensive. But yeah, they didn't know how to keep the scale and craziness of the fights in final fantasy 7, while making it an action game. Think of all the giant monsters and mechs you fight, and how crazy and over the top your abilities are. You think they coulda done that in 1998? Or hell, even the mid 2000s? God of war would have been the closest to hitting that scale as an action game, but it wasn't an rpg with such a deep narrative woven in and numerous characters to control.
@@contentsdiffer5958 I don't necessarily disagree. But at the same time, today if you want to spend the INSANE money they are spending on final fantasy 7 remake, I mean dozens of times more in dev costs, you have to go for mainstream markets. I grew up with final fantasy 7. And I get it that they don't want to risk alienating 15-25 year olds, the same exact demographic the original game had. They can't look for just old fans is my point. And makes sense they are trying to appeal to the same demographic of kids as the original, just today's kids. And I think they did a GREAT job with the combat. I adore the pause to cast and switch characters and all that. It definitely keeps a lot of the strategy. I think it did a good job blending in a bit of that old school turn based flare with all that, into what really needed to be an action game.
So... what you're saying is: Hironobu Sakaguchi (Creator of FF): Hey, lets create a skill/spell system so complicated it takes minutes to scroll through any time you want to use a skill or cast a spell. But have the combat fast paced so you have a split second between inputs so you spend the time mashing buttons. FF Dev: Can't, technical limitations. decades later and Hironobu Sakaguchi leaving the company. Tetsuya Nomura: Now that tech has caught up, let's remake FFVII as I orginally intended as the creator of FF... err as originally intended. Yeah, THAT. Not just because I like that type of game or anything.
The models are nice, but to me they don't have the same charm as the 2D sprites. The game is pretty good but there are some corners cut here and there. It feels weird when they aren't using their weapons and they're just stuck on their backs.... it's so generic and bad feeling compared to the old game where they actually carry them around in a way that makes sense. The backgrounds are pretty but they're not quite as bursting with details like the 2D games. Some things translated very bizarrely like the dancing innkeepers. In the 2D game their animation cycle is cute and fits in with the world....in the 3D game it just looks bizarre and out of place ...instead of dancing it looks more like they're trying to dance but are somehow physically handicapped.
@@flamespear86 when going from fairly abstract sprites into something as detailed as 3d models things like that are bound to happen :/ I have not played the games, but sad that the remake didn’t meet your expectations!
Having only played the demo of the remake on PS4, the beauty of this game's OST is understated, shit is fantastic; even to someone who never played the original.
Speaking as someone who played Secret of Mana and Seiken Densetsu 3 on the SNES (fan translation cart) back in the day, I'll have to say that, unlike the horrid mess that the Secret of Mana remake was... Trials of Mana did a pretty good job by not trying to adhere to the original's mechanics quite so faithfully. Also by not completely butchering the soundtrack. The classic will always hold a dear place in my heart, and generally I prefer that version to the remake (I should rather say re-imagining since it's much more than simply a remake), however even as a grognard neckbeard, I freely admit that the new Trials of Mana is an interesting game, in a completely different way than the original was. It is certainly a FAR superior modernization than the Secret of Mana Remastered by leaps and bounds. And it gives you an option... do you want to play classic mechanics, or do you want a game with more modern concepts that actually leverages the 3d environment? The largest change is the area effect skills and spells. In the SNES era, any area effect spell was screen-wide. This led to certain maneuvers and spells which were seen as much more powerful, such as the Full Screen Techs (FST's). This also made (as an example) Hawke's Ninja Master hecka OP by having a 1MP multi-target Shuriken spell that could easily one-shot sweep entire screens of enemies. By leveraging the 3d environment, it implemented area effect placements for both you and your enemies. This makes certain fights FAR more dynamic. Instead of just having to tank the damage and heal through it (or by using the same exploit from Secret of Mana to heal over the damage and negating it entirely), you can actually move around to dodge the area effects. It also makes the multi-target and AoE spells much less 'win buttons' for sweeping and require at least some aiming or tactical usage. It also meant enemies were more free to use multi-target or area effect skills more often without it feeling cheap, since there are now ways to dodge the effects. The only caveat to that is the lack of multiplayer functionality, which is especially a shame given that the ally AI is as dumb as a sack of rocks and won't dodge enemy AoE attacks, despite only needing to move a few steps over. This could have been a truly amazing game to play with friends and family, specifically *because* of the more dynamic combat mechanics. The AI was derpy in the original, but it generally didn't cause you too many problems in combat because positioning was less important. Now that positioning and dodging area effects is so much more important, while the AI is actually improved, it feels *painful* to see them just stand in the area and get blasted, when you know your buddy would've reacted to it better. I won't say either is 'better' or 'worse' than the other, because it really has become an apples to oranges comparison. They're two very different games with very different mechanics that just so happen to share the same plot and characters. If you feel retro, go with the SNES era version. If you want something more modern, go with Trials of Mana remastered.
@Retrogamer Dell Well, Collection of Mana has the original SNES version ported forward, so there's very little difference between that version and the translated ROM. In addition, you get the classic Secret of Mana game, so two for the price of one I would say is worth it. To be polite and legal, I'd say go ahead and get Collection of Mana. You get two really good games for one price.
My grip with the original SD3 is how buggy it is, like seriously half of the stuff doesn't work, also how slow the menu is and that stupid decision to make you walk at the pace of a snail in battle, honnestly because of these the SNES version is just not fun to play at all, for me once you remove the nostalgia factor it's just a mediocre game and they never bother to fixed these on the rerelease. Outside of nostalgia I see no reasons to come back to the original SNES version. That being said there is a mod called Sin of Mana for the SNES version, which I fucking love and play hundred of hours in it.
I've only played the remake, but I know what you mean about the dumb AI. I've watched them like "are they.. are they gonna stand... ok time to do some quick character change and manue...." then by the point I'm like... f it. I have 99 candies
Some of the official localization choices are weird to me (Benevodon has such a bad mouthfeel) and the text is so hard to read. Still, a fantastic achievement. The remake looks great but I can't get past the voices and the, uh, fan service. I'll have to try at some point again...
I had a friend who had the Japanese version of SD3 and let me borrow it. Always hoped we would see the game in the US some day, cause damn it was hard trying to play it in Japanese haha.
Trials was a really good remake, the graphics were not amazing but good, the remastering of music was perfect, i would everyone recommend to play remake and original, but for newcomers, maybe the remake is more accessible?
I always enjoy the supposition of Nintendo not bringing it over partly due to the bugs. Then we get Secret of Evermore.... with its own set of bugs. It also had two ways to softlock the game with one allowing you to save and ruin your game. And to add more trivia. Dex and Luck affect the trap roulette. Luck affected the amount of "ok" and traps. Obviously, more luck meant more "OK."Dex affected the speed. It was a bit ironic though. Hawkeye could get reliable with it, but with a high enough luck would have no traps. But that was practically end game.
Holding the button to attack was unreliable in sd3. It's always best to learn to time the button press. The only exception is when you need your character to move faster in combat.
I held off on this because the Secret of Mana remake just didn't land with me at all. The original of that game has yet to be improved upon, for me personally. But Trials of Mana, wow! I just bought this on Steam in Feb 2024 here. A friend of mine was streaming it on Twitch and it finally piqued my interest. I was not expecting SquareEnix to finally get a Mana remake right. Wasn't a fan of some of the pixel remasters, hate how they've ported Chrono Trigger, etc. As an old school gamer, I would definitely recommend Trials of Mana remake to anyone. Somehow they finally managed to preserve the good stuff, and rework the bad stuff. The charm is still there, that is unless you really prefer the pixel aesthetic of the originals. I'm kind of that way, but I'll call this an exception. Details are all touched on in this great video. The companion AI is still weird, but that's almost a signature Mana game tradition at this point.
I played the original with the english patch emulated on PC as my first JPRG ever... been hooked on the genre ever since. Got the remake in my Switch backlog somewhere slated for 2023 😂
Still a little bummed out by kevin's grapple techs missing in the remake. I get that it would be too hard to render it but it cuts the fun factor of his class by half
I finally got this on my 3DSXL emulated and I am so happy I chose to experience it for the first time with this version I decided to go with. I’m loving it, and I’m trying to get in touch with the joyful, nostalgic side of happier times. Trying to get in touch again with the happier me. Thank you for the review! I think just trying to experience the original allows me to experience it more authentically as that time period was my childhood years lol amazing era in gaming!
The remake is really good. The downsides are only not allowing coop and Jagan's voice. I always imagined him with a deep and scary voice as a vampire. In the remake his voice sounds as silly like a joker. I really got shocked. I don't blame the actor for this, but square decision on how to represent the character
When i saw the dps checks i knew deep inside something was wrong, i remember the feeling i got when i saw Dragon Emperor deal his breath attack and he had to go offscreen to do it with his little animation while being invulnerable, that's something the remake never could do well, every major boss had a unavoidable/skippable party-wipe type of attack, such attacks did not transition well into the remake, unless you bring a really low dps type of party or mess up your stats somehow. Co-op would've made this game incredibly good if tit had a decent and naturally integrated Expert/No-future difficulty in mind, and not just a last minute patch meant to be played with the most broken skills you unlock near the end of the game and postgame.
I'm so glad for the remake. I tried to play the original, but combat felt super clunky compared to Secret of Mana. The movement in combat took on this stop-and-go jerkiness that made it a pain trying to avoid normal attacks. Then I got to a bridge scene where the enemies reacted to spells cast on them with a 1-hit KO counterattack and when I asked about it I found out that a few enemies in the game had gimmicks like that. So I just gave up and didn't try again until the remake came out. I'm so glad it happened. I still think SoM is the superior game story-wise, tho. I remember it, whereas I couldn't tell you anything that happened in Trials in spite of beating it and enjoying it while I was playing. It just didn't stick.
4:11 I forgot about the roulette wheel, which is probably why they took out agility as well given luck would pass for the same with hawkeye. 6:48 stamina was really useless in the game unless playing on expert/no future, let alone you had to hoard extra points before changing classes (or pay more to reset unless new game+). Good note with the chain abilities. 9:23 didn't know Kevin sounded better in Japanese, but yeah Charlotte was awful lol VA even blocked me on IG for a post mocking.
Amazing review and comparison thank you so much! I am also going as Angela Duran and Lise! And good to know about being able to turn off quest markers. Looking forward to playing this!
I love the game regardless of it's flaws. Great story and gameplay it made everyone have to think about what they were going to do with characters they chose.((Seiken Densetsu 3)en port)
@@minuk3y Yes, because the shader is dependent on the game resolution and the emulator will set the entire frame's resolution based on the highest resolution mode used in the frame.
A fan of both the original and the new one, not sure which one i like most. But I wish they would port the Secret of Mana remake to the Switch. I do feel this game would have been freaking amazing if they had a bigger budget and time.
i played the original a LOT. with the translation of course. then come the remake. i played it for 10h on pc but didnt have time to continue it. bought it on switch for quick access. i am on my 4th playthrough i am over 130 hours in lol its one of the best remakes around
I love the remake so much. I beat it in just a few sittings, and then played it again with totally new characters. Watching this makes me want to play it a 3rd time.
I love videos like this and I love the history of the game really interesting and fun to watch. I'm watching this after buying Xenoblade Chronicles Definitive Edition for my Nintendo Switch. It's a great game and I love it. You should check it out and if you can make a review on its ports and its remake.
Although the remake is really good, I like the snes version MUCH better. There's a romhack called Sin of Mana that fixes pretty much all the major issues and bugs and rebalances the classes to all be useful. It's the best way to play in my opinion.
Unfortunately, I haven't the ability to play the remake, but since I have to rely on emulation, there are also patches for at least the fan-translated original that fix the bugs such as giving Dex and Luck their intended effects, rebalance the classes, and include a few quality of life enhancements such as a pair of patches that lessen the EXP requirement per level and give you more gold per enemy defeated, so you don't have to grind for EXP or gold. However, most of them don't work for a rom of the new version. Of course, I know the whole thing with piracy, but we did touch on the fan-translation, which might be considered a form of piracy, itself? I don't know. Companies may think they're fine, but I'm sure they're a grey area legally.
That’s easy, you should play BOTH. They’re both different in the way they play. The remake has all sorts of passive abilities you can simply attach to characters making all classes effectively different in the remake vs the original Angela’s Magus class is probably the biggest example, it works MUCH MUCH better in the remake, you have passives that increase her defense while casting and making her immune to knockback where you didn’t before. I felt like the Magus class in Seiken Densetsu 3 was HORRIBLE unless your fighting bosses, now it nukes everything no problem. Magus can now even sacrifice the team’s health in exchange for more damage Duran’s Duelist class is better now too as it has some passives that make him do more damage. It’s still arguably not as good as his Dark-Light class, but it has a purpose outside of Dark Sabre. Like Magus, Duelist has a passive that can sacrifice HP in exchange for more damage Bottom line, the remake is a more “complete” version of the original that I introduces passive abilities and a newer combat system. It’s the type of remake that’s hard to call BETTER, just a different version of one of the best 16-bit RPGs ever made One thing that holds true from the original is how nice it is to have someone capable of casting Healing Light and more so, Healing Light + as well as Twinkle Rain. Without Charlotte, you’ll want to consider having Duran or Kevin take a particular class which always felt kinda forced to me It’s of course possible to play without a healer, my very first SD3 playthrough I used Duran, Kevin and Angela and all went Dark path, but that requires using a lot of items.
There should be proper Unreal Engine 3D remakes of the FFL trilogy of the SaGa series. I don’t want a lazy port without a remake. A remake is better than a remaster, as a remake feels like a new game.
On the topic of voice acting, who are the VAs for the 6 main characters? I only recognize Hawkeye’s and Riesz’s, and have heard them have much better direction in Fire Emblem Three Houses.
i can attest to the original trials of mana not telling you where to go, i got lost at the part when you had to navigate the pot holes that sent you to another random pothole, never went back to the game cause i couldn't figure out how to get to the objective.
I'm finding the ToM remake to be a bit on the easy side compared to the SNES version but a lot of that was because the SNES version was very spiky in places and some of the mechanics were buggy (crits not registering). Some of the boss fights I've done so far are def better and I think the overall class balance is better (IE Duran/Angela on the same team to get their story bits isn't as bad mechanically as it was in the SNES version, since both were basically damage dealers and all the buffing and debuffing had to be handled by their 3rd character and items.
Granted I enjoyed the Secret of Mana Remake that released a year or so prior to this, but something tells me the backlash would have been less severe if it was remade like this game.
10:09 Weird. What happened with the snare, kick and bass in the original? Did you grab a bad rip? Because some videos of TH-cam have that problem. Edit: Here's how the original song should sound. th-cam.com/video/7cKDXhvMXnU/w-d-xo.html
You can hear it on headphones. You may have been listening to it through a mono speaker like your phone. To put it simply, there's a thing called "mid-side" audio which is what you think it is; sound coming from the sides & sound coming straight down the middle. I can hear that something happened with this mix where the kick, snare, & bass were exclusively in the sides with no mid information, meaning the audio information will be completely gone for a speaker only outputting mono/mid sound. Hope this helps!
8:25 this is my only gripe with this remake, this help was not necesary the game is already accesible with the new features, this marker was not necesary.
To me, Secret of Mana's main draw was the local multiplayer. This "Trials of Mana" remake with 3rd person 3D rotating camera doesn't look very local-multiplayer friendly. I'll stick with the SNES emulator version.
you can't blame the dubbed it how the character and script was written for Charlotte I find it cute I was annoyed at first but I got used to it and wasn't that bad
Yeah, it's _clunky._ And something is up with the button mapping. Like having a different confirm button in the menu than in the rest of the game. I forget. It's a pretty darn _cool_ menu, but a nuisance to use.
I know this video’s kind of old, but did you try changing your scaling options in your graphics card’s control panel? On NVIDIA cards, I have to set scaling to happen on the GPU and then set it to Keep Aspect which has always corrected 4:3 games being stretched on my 16:9 monitor. I assume the same would be true about 16:9 -> 21:9
@@RaifSeverence I never implied anyone wanted it stretched 🤨 He just ran into an issue with the PC version being stretched to an incorrect aspect ratio, and it didn’t seem like he thought to check his GPU’s control panel to fix it.
Wish they did this like dragon quest 11. Both 2d and 3d on the cart. And the the same for the rest of the mana games. Instead of a full 3d remake dor trials, a pokemon like remake for secrets, and just the sprite upgrade for legends. Then all the 2d ones in a separate collections except legends on its own cart. So messed up. Not mention secrets remake is only on ps4.
Just out of curiosity why did they remake this? Its out for the switch in 2d and the game looks good for an snes game. Is it one of those nintendo only things like the remake of Dragon Quest 7? I know nintendo often translates games and wont release them on other platforms.
@@davidhill8565 The dimensions doesn’t determine what a remake is - Sword of Mana is 2D yet it’s still a remake - Adventures of Mana & Secret of Mana ‘18 are 2.5D and are remakes Remakes are projects rebuilt from the ground up plain and simple.
I remember playing this emulated on zsnes in like 2001 and using the button that plays the game faster to level up classes really quickly. TBH I'm not interested in playing the remake.
I played through the demo for the SD3 remake a few times, and... I dunno, it was alright, but the animations and English voice acting felt really insipid. It certainly didn’t help that I started with Charlotte, with the awful acting and her weirdly unmoving gigantic block of hair. I also really didn’t care for the verticality they added to the game. The jumping mechanics felt stiff and floaty at the same time, and whether in platforming or fights, the whole system felt like it had been awkwardly tacked on. I understand the original isn’t goinng to be as appealing for some modern players, but it’s still one of my favorite games, and I wish more people in the West had the chance to experience it before the remake.
I never liked Seiken Densetsu 3's graphics, they looked dark and muddy to me compared to the brightness of Secret of Mana. SD3 sprites seem less detailed too. Good game anyway though. You kinda get used to the voice acting in Trials of Mana. Except Charlotte. Whoever decided on that baby-lisp needs to be shot out of Bon Voyage's cannon, preferably into the sun.
I don't know, the voice acting seems fine for the most part, it's just a few characters who stick out as bad. The most common theory I've heard is that they either had no voice direction at all, or a bad voice director.
Yeah the VA was absoultely fine. Its funny how he brought up Charlotte as a sample of "bad voice acting" when her voicework was fine, if don't like the quirk of her "cutesy" speech, thats still not bad VA.
I think breath of the wild is the perfect example of an open world game that doesn't hold your hand because the world is crafted so wherever you go, there will always be something to do. Some games say that they are true open world games but the game isn't actually designed for freedom of choice. So it's ok if someone is upset about an open world game that gets them lost because it's world is designed for marker following.
![What is Seiken Densetsu 3? [Trials of Mana] - SNESdrunk](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/vSTwjVnlNss/mqdefault.jpg)
UPDATE - 10.1.2020 - On the 14th, Trials of Mana will receive update 1.1.0. The patch adds 2 new difficulty options. One of which, "No Future", can only be selected on NG+. Refer to patch notes for complete changes. Other QoL features include skipping class change cutscenes and credits, costumes carry over when class is reset or in NG+, you can go back to level 1 in NG+, and new goddess statues added. These changes address feedback about how the game's on the easy side, and how NG+ felt kinda moot when you kept your level.
UPDATE 7.15.21 - Trials of Mana remake has released on mobile devices. The most significant note is that this version has NO controller support. In return, the game has touch controls, auto battle settings, and cloud saves. As always with mobile versions, YMMV.
AustinSV No problem but the Xenoblade Chronicles Definitive Edition will be my Favorite. I love the history of all video games watching them makes me so happy. Keep up the great work I look forward to the Xenoblade Chronicles Ports & Remake Review video :)
you can't transfer rank 4 (plus need to do post game), so no future is pointless (damn near die in 1 hit if you choose a new character whose level doesn't carry over). Needing pre-knowledge for transferring ??? seeds was a pain too, so you may get stuck on class 2 despite being over level 38; though expert fairly balances if you got setup. Just wanted anyone watching to know that about the updates and yeah still single player as you said 12:20
You should know: your GPU drivers can be configured to pillarbox the output so that your screen doesn't stretch it in any way.
Both Trials and Legend of Mana games got ported to Xbox.
Thank you for mention the fan translation
Love both ''Collection of Mana'' and the remake!
Seiken Densetsu III has always been and will always be my favorite game of all time. You know the question "if you were stranded on an island and could only listen to one cd/album..." It would be the original OST without any hesitation. Watching this video literally made me redownload Trials of Mana to play through again... lol thank you
To me the new Trials of Mana is a perfect remake, in the sense that it maintained all the aesthetic spirit and general zeitgeist of the original, looks gorgeous without having to go for bleeding edge visual tech (is that *really* what anyone wants of a remake of this type of game? I get why REmakes do that, but this is a completely different art style that was never trying for realism in the first place, as RE games always were), and is extremely fun to play due to all the new and redesigned systems. And it isn't a fundamentally different game, like FF7; it's just the best version of itself it can be. Like, I wouldn't have a problem if FFVI were remade with completely changed stats and boss attacks, a more complex magicite and esper system, more complex character class specific skills, new and rebalanced items, etc... but I would never want it to be remade as an action RPG, just because that's the kind of game Nomura likes. Trials of Mana is the best modern remake of a classic game, in my opinion.
Final fantasy 7 was only turn based as a technical limitation in the first place.
A lot of devs want to make them action rpg with strategy and party based aspects, because they CANNN now. In a way they couldn't before reliably at the scale they wanted in an rpg.
@@bobdylan1968 I would like to see the source of this statement. Anyway, they kept the turn based system until Ps2, with FF X-2.
The difference between tbs is the pace and focus on strategy rather than smashing buttons.
@@lucasrinaldi9909 it's from the devs themsleves. Just gotta look it up.
And yeah, they did. It became routine. And even with those games, they couldn't have made an rpg on that scale, as an action rpg. That would have been rough and very very expensive.
But yeah, they didn't know how to keep the scale and craziness of the fights in final fantasy 7, while making it an action game.
Think of all the giant monsters and mechs you fight, and how crazy and over the top your abilities are. You think they coulda done that in 1998? Or hell, even the mid 2000s? God of war would have been the closest to hitting that scale as an action game, but it wasn't an rpg with such a deep narrative woven in and numerous characters to control.
@@contentsdiffer5958 I don't necessarily disagree.
But at the same time, today if you want to spend the INSANE money they are spending on final fantasy 7 remake, I mean dozens of times more in dev costs, you have to go for mainstream markets.
I grew up with final fantasy 7. And I get it that they don't want to risk alienating 15-25 year olds, the same exact demographic the original game had.
They can't look for just old fans is my point. And makes sense they are trying to appeal to the same demographic of kids as the original, just today's kids.
And I think they did a GREAT job with the combat. I adore the pause to cast and switch characters and all that. It definitely keeps a lot of the strategy. I think it did a good job blending in a bit of that old school turn based flare with all that, into what really needed to be an action game.
So... what you're saying is:
Hironobu Sakaguchi (Creator of FF): Hey, lets create a skill/spell system so complicated it takes minutes to scroll through any time you want to use a skill or cast a spell. But have the combat fast paced so you have a split second between inputs so you spend the time mashing buttons.
FF Dev: Can't, technical limitations.
decades later and Hironobu Sakaguchi leaving the company.
Tetsuya Nomura: Now that tech has caught up, let's remake FFVII as I orginally intended as the creator of FF... err as originally intended. Yeah, THAT. Not just because I like that type of game or anything.
The 3d models and the shading are gorgeous!
True
The models are nice, but to me they don't have the same charm as the 2D sprites. The game is pretty good but there are some corners cut here and there. It feels weird when they aren't using their weapons and they're just stuck on their backs.... it's so generic and bad feeling compared to the old game where they actually carry them around in a way that makes sense. The backgrounds are pretty but they're not quite as bursting with details like the 2D games. Some things translated very bizarrely like the dancing innkeepers. In the 2D game their animation cycle is cute and fits in with the world....in the 3D game it just looks bizarre and out of place ...instead of dancing it looks more like they're trying to dance but are somehow physically handicapped.
@@flamespear86 when going from fairly abstract sprites into something as detailed as 3d models things like that are bound to happen :/ I have not played the games, but sad that the remake didn’t meet your expectations!
@@flamespear86 Had pretty much same thoughts.
Having only played the demo of the remake on PS4, the beauty of this game's OST is understated, shit is fantastic; even to someone who never played the original.
HOLY SH.. I grew up with this game. Seeing the remake made me literally cry. Thank you for this video.
Love your efforts for covering changes.
Thank you!
Speaking as someone who played Secret of Mana and Seiken Densetsu 3 on the SNES (fan translation cart) back in the day, I'll have to say that, unlike the horrid mess that the Secret of Mana remake was... Trials of Mana did a pretty good job by not trying to adhere to the original's mechanics quite so faithfully. Also by not completely butchering the soundtrack.
The classic will always hold a dear place in my heart, and generally I prefer that version to the remake (I should rather say re-imagining since it's much more than simply a remake), however even as a grognard neckbeard, I freely admit that the new Trials of Mana is an interesting game, in a completely different way than the original was. It is certainly a FAR superior modernization than the Secret of Mana Remastered by leaps and bounds. And it gives you an option... do you want to play classic mechanics, or do you want a game with more modern concepts that actually leverages the 3d environment?
The largest change is the area effect skills and spells. In the SNES era, any area effect spell was screen-wide. This led to certain maneuvers and spells which were seen as much more powerful, such as the Full Screen Techs (FST's). This also made (as an example) Hawke's Ninja Master hecka OP by having a 1MP multi-target Shuriken spell that could easily one-shot sweep entire screens of enemies. By leveraging the 3d environment, it implemented area effect placements for both you and your enemies. This makes certain fights FAR more dynamic. Instead of just having to tank the damage and heal through it (or by using the same exploit from Secret of Mana to heal over the damage and negating it entirely), you can actually move around to dodge the area effects. It also makes the multi-target and AoE spells much less 'win buttons' for sweeping and require at least some aiming or tactical usage. It also meant enemies were more free to use multi-target or area effect skills more often without it feeling cheap, since there are now ways to dodge the effects.
The only caveat to that is the lack of multiplayer functionality, which is especially a shame given that the ally AI is as dumb as a sack of rocks and won't dodge enemy AoE attacks, despite only needing to move a few steps over. This could have been a truly amazing game to play with friends and family, specifically *because* of the more dynamic combat mechanics. The AI was derpy in the original, but it generally didn't cause you too many problems in combat because positioning was less important. Now that positioning and dodging area effects is so much more important, while the AI is actually improved, it feels *painful* to see them just stand in the area and get blasted, when you know your buddy would've reacted to it better.
I won't say either is 'better' or 'worse' than the other, because it really has become an apples to oranges comparison. They're two very different games with very different mechanics that just so happen to share the same plot and characters. If you feel retro, go with the SNES era version. If you want something more modern, go with Trials of Mana remastered.
@Retrogamer Dell Well, Collection of Mana has the original SNES version ported forward, so there's very little difference between that version and the translated ROM. In addition, you get the classic Secret of Mana game, so two for the price of one I would say is worth it.
To be polite and legal, I'd say go ahead and get Collection of Mana. You get two really good games for one price.
My grip with the original SD3 is how buggy it is, like seriously half of the stuff doesn't work, also how slow the menu is and that stupid decision to make you walk at the pace of a snail in battle, honnestly because of these the SNES version is just not fun to play at all, for me once you remove the nostalgia factor it's just a mediocre game and they never bother to fixed these on the rerelease. Outside of nostalgia I see no reasons to come back to the original SNES version.
That being said there is a mod called Sin of Mana for the SNES version, which I fucking love and play hundred of hours in it.
I've only played the remake, but I know what you mean about the dumb AI. I've watched them like "are they.. are they gonna stand... ok time to do some quick character change and manue...." then by the point I'm like... f it. I have 99 candies
Some of the official localization choices are weird to me (Benevodon has such a bad mouthfeel) and the text is so hard to read. Still, a fantastic achievement. The remake looks great but I can't get past the voices and the, uh, fan service. I'll have to try at some point again...
Great video dude! Im about to wrap of FF7R and I'm chomping at the bits waiting to play Trials remake, seems like a perfect summer game. 👌
I had a friend who had the Japanese version of SD3 and let me borrow it. Always hoped we would see the game in the US some day, cause damn it was hard trying to play it in Japanese haha.
Trials was a really good remake, the graphics were not amazing but good, the remastering of music was perfect, i would everyone recommend to play remake and original, but for newcomers, maybe the remake is more accessible?
I will buy both😊👍
I always enjoy the supposition of Nintendo not bringing it over partly due to the bugs. Then we get Secret of Evermore.... with its own set of bugs. It also had two ways to softlock the game with one allowing you to save and ruin your game.
And to add more trivia. Dex and Luck affect the trap roulette. Luck affected the amount of "ok" and traps. Obviously, more luck meant more "OK."Dex affected the speed. It was a bit ironic though. Hawkeye could get reliable with it, but with a high enough luck would have no traps. But that was practically end game.
Holding the button to attack was unreliable in sd3. It's always best to learn to time the button press. The only exception is when you need your character to move faster in combat.
I held off on this because the Secret of Mana remake just didn't land with me at all. The original of that game has yet to be improved upon, for me personally.
But Trials of Mana, wow! I just bought this on Steam in Feb 2024 here. A friend of mine was streaming it on Twitch and it finally piqued my interest. I was not expecting SquareEnix to finally get a Mana remake right. Wasn't a fan of some of the pixel remasters, hate how they've ported Chrono Trigger, etc.
As an old school gamer, I would definitely recommend Trials of Mana remake to anyone. Somehow they finally managed to preserve the good stuff, and rework the bad stuff. The charm is still there, that is unless you really prefer the pixel aesthetic of the originals. I'm kind of that way, but I'll call this an exception. Details are all touched on in this great video.
The companion AI is still weird, but that's almost a signature Mana game tradition at this point.
@@MinecraftMartin thanks for your input
I played the original with the english patch emulated on PC as my first JPRG ever... been hooked on the genre ever since. Got the remake in my Switch backlog somewhere slated for 2023 😂
Still a little bummed out by kevin's grapple techs missing in the remake. I get that it would be too hard to render it but it cuts the fun factor of his class by half
The Sei in Seiken is pronounced like the word say, not like the word sigh. Sai in Japanese would be pronounced like sigh.
I was expecting to be corrected on mana but I will keep this in mind, thank you
Had a classmate named Seiko and our substitute teacher pronounced out Psycho. Lmao
I finally got this on my 3DSXL emulated and I am so happy I chose to experience it for the first time with this version I decided to go with. I’m loving it, and I’m trying to get in touch with the joyful, nostalgic side of happier times. Trying to get in touch again with the happier me. Thank you for the review! I think just trying to experience the original allows me to experience it more authentically as that time period was my childhood years lol amazing era in gaming!
Sheesh bragging much?
thank you so much for the video. easily one of the best layed out review i watched.
The remake is really good. The downsides are only not allowing coop and Jagan's voice. I always imagined him with a deep and scary voice as a vampire. In the remake his voice sounds as silly like a joker. I really got shocked. I don't blame the actor for this, but square decision on how to represent the character
Ive addicted this game and played through it in different charac cominations.
When i saw the dps checks i knew deep inside something was wrong, i remember the feeling i got when i saw Dragon Emperor deal his breath attack and he had to go offscreen to do it with his little animation while being invulnerable, that's something the remake never could do well, every major boss had a unavoidable/skippable party-wipe type of attack, such attacks did not transition well into the remake, unless you bring a really low dps type of party or mess up your stats somehow.
Co-op would've made this game incredibly good if tit had a decent and naturally integrated Expert/No-future difficulty in mind, and not just a last minute patch meant to be played with the most broken skills you unlock near the end of the game and postgame.
I'm so glad for the remake. I tried to play the original, but combat felt super clunky compared to Secret of Mana. The movement in combat took on this stop-and-go jerkiness that made it a pain trying to avoid normal attacks. Then I got to a bridge scene where the enemies reacted to spells cast on them with a 1-hit KO counterattack and when I asked about it I found out that a few enemies in the game had gimmicks like that. So I just gave up and didn't try again until the remake came out. I'm so glad it happened. I still think SoM is the superior game story-wise, tho. I remember it, whereas I couldn't tell you anything that happened in Trials in spite of beating it and enjoying it while I was playing. It just didn't stick.
They're both great. I wish the Collection of Mana came out on PC too, but I guess we can always emulate the original ones.
or emulate the collection too. i see why they did it with them being Nintendo console exclusives but still
4:11 I forgot about the roulette wheel, which is probably why they took out agility as well given luck would pass for the same with hawkeye.
6:48 stamina was really useless in the game unless playing on expert/no future, let alone you had to hoard extra points before changing classes (or pay more to reset unless new game+). Good note with the chain abilities. 9:23 didn't know Kevin sounded better in Japanese, but yeah Charlotte was awful lol VA even blocked me on IG for a post mocking.
Amazing review and comparison thank you so much! I am also going as Angela Duran and Lise! And good to know about being able to turn off quest markers. Looking forward to playing this!
I love the game regardless of it's flaws. Great story and gameplay it made everyone have to think about what they were going to do with characters they chose.((Seiken Densetsu 3)en port)
"I love the game regardless of it is flaws"
The text in Trials of Mana SNES is higher resolution because the SNES mode-switches mid-frame to display the text.
@@soundspark so that explains why my crt shader suddenly looks different when displaying text
@@minuk3y Yes, because the shader is dependent on the game resolution and the emulator will set the entire frame's resolution based on the highest resolution mode used in the frame.
whoa, whoa, whoa!
no co-op?
this is the main reason me and my sibling had fun back then.
but still, the demo is charming. straight nostalgia.
really helpful video man 😀 I NEED TO PLAY THIS GAME😍
A fan of both the original and the new one, not sure which one i like most. But I wish they would port the Secret of Mana remake to the Switch. I do feel this game would have been freaking amazing if they had a bigger budget and time.
One of the most interesting things was the retroactive name change, in 2020 now officially changing the snes title to Trials of Mana
They should remake these, worth while games.
The mana series, Illusion of gaia...Secrets of evermore, Chrono fu**** trigger.
Would rather just play the remake since I just got it, and I am playing Sword of Mana, Secret of Mana, and Trials of Mana...
Legend of Mana is best Mana
i played the original a LOT. with the translation of course. then come the remake. i played it for 10h on pc but didnt have time to continue it. bought it on switch for quick access. i am on my 4th playthrough i am over 130 hours in lol its one of the best remakes around
The remake is soo fun. I've always thought tales (the og 2d) was a better action jrpg than mana series, but this remake changed that perspective
I love the remake so much. I beat it in just a few sittings, and then played it again with totally new characters. Watching this makes me want to play it a 3rd time.
I’ve beat this game 6 times already and I still want to play it more 😅
I love videos like this and I love the history of the game really interesting and fun to watch. I'm watching this after buying Xenoblade Chronicles Definitive Edition for my Nintendo Switch. It's a great game and I love it. You should check it out and if you can make a review on its ports and its remake.
Xenoblade DE is an absolute blast.
Legend of mana and the new trials of mana is nuts how good they are
2:52 A new class tier? :O
7:32 4 tiers of classes = 9 classes? :OOOOOO
For me PC version ran at solid 4K resolution, 60fps, even when the game had Denuvo. I think I was running a 7700K and a GTX 1080 at the time.
nice and instructive video, congrats.
Can you make a video about different versions of Final Fantasy 6?
Although the remake is really good, I like the snes version MUCH better. There's a romhack called Sin of Mana that fixes pretty much all the major issues and bugs and rebalances the classes to all be useful. It's the best way to play in my opinion.
Unfortunately, I haven't the ability to play the remake, but since I have to rely on emulation, there are also patches for at least the fan-translated original that fix the bugs such as giving Dex and Luck their intended effects, rebalance the classes, and include a few quality of life enhancements such as a pair of patches that lessen the EXP requirement per level and give you more gold per enemy defeated, so you don't have to grind for EXP or gold. However, most of them don't work for a rom of the new version.
Of course, I know the whole thing with piracy, but we did touch on the fan-translation, which might be considered a form of piracy, itself? I don't know. Companies may think they're fine, but I'm sure they're a grey area legally.
Not really, if you dump your own ROM from the cart you own (there pretty cheap still in Japan) patching your own backup is not illegal
That’s easy, you should play BOTH. They’re both different in the way they play. The remake has all sorts of passive abilities you can simply attach to characters making all classes effectively different in the remake vs the original
Angela’s Magus class is probably the biggest example, it works MUCH MUCH better in the remake, you have passives that increase her defense while casting and making her immune to knockback where you didn’t before. I felt like the Magus class in Seiken Densetsu 3 was HORRIBLE unless your fighting bosses, now it nukes everything no problem. Magus can now even sacrifice the team’s health in exchange for more damage
Duran’s Duelist class is better now too as it has some passives that make him do more damage. It’s still arguably not as good as his Dark-Light class, but it has a purpose outside of Dark Sabre. Like Magus, Duelist has a passive that can sacrifice HP in exchange for more damage
Bottom line, the remake is a more “complete” version of the original that I introduces passive abilities and a newer combat system. It’s the type of remake that’s hard to call BETTER, just a different version of one of the best 16-bit RPGs ever made
One thing that holds true from the original is how nice it is to have someone capable of casting Healing Light and more so, Healing Light + as well as Twinkle Rain. Without Charlotte, you’ll want to consider having Duran or Kevin take a particular class which always felt kinda forced to me
It’s of course possible to play without a healer, my very first SD3 playthrough I used Duran, Kevin and Angela and all went Dark path, but that requires using a lot of items.
You and nick930 are the best TH-cam channel for direct comparison.🥳
Ive played trials of mana kn switch handheld all the way and did not notice any problem with it
There should be proper Unreal Engine 3D remakes of the FFL trilogy of the SaGa series. I don’t want a lazy port without a remake. A remake is better than a remaster, as a remake feels like a new game.
I'm a simple person
I usually just play whatever looks best or the newer version (remake/remaster)
On the topic of voice acting, who are the VAs for the 6 main characters? I only recognize Hawkeye’s and Riesz’s, and have heard them have much better direction in Fire Emblem Three Houses.
I honestly wish they would give this remake treatment to Secret of Mana or Secret of Evermore as well.
i can attest to the original trials of mana not telling you where to go, i got lost at the part when you had to navigate the pot holes that sent you to another random pothole, never went back to the game cause i couldn't figure out how to get to the objective.
I'm finding the ToM remake to be a bit on the easy side compared to the SNES version but a lot of that was because the SNES version was very spiky in places and some of the mechanics were buggy (crits not registering). Some of the boss fights I've done so far are def better and I think the overall class balance is better (IE Duran/Angela on the same team to get their story bits isn't as bad mechanically as it was in the SNES version, since both were basically damage dealers and all the buffing and debuffing had to be handled by their 3rd character and items.
I still enjoyed sprite based jrpg video games. Wish they make more jrpg games for the switch, specially from square enix.
Granted I enjoyed the Secret of Mana Remake that released a year or so prior to this, but something tells me the backlash would have been less severe if it was remade like this game.
Buy a PS4 version if:
-You have a PS4 Pro or PS5
-You have a 4K TV
Glad to own both of these :)
While the new version of Trials of Mana looks nice i still prefer the OG version as i grew up with that one.
I really wish they had released both versions of Trials in one collection.
yeah I immediately switched to Japanese voice acting. and I havent even heard Charolette yet. the crimson wizards english va was enough lol
10:09 Weird. What happened with the snare, kick and bass in the original? Did you grab a bad rip? Because some videos of TH-cam have that problem.
Edit: Here's how the original song should sound.
th-cam.com/video/7cKDXhvMXnU/w-d-xo.html
You can hear it on headphones. You may have been listening to it through a mono speaker like your phone. To put it simply, there's a thing called "mid-side" audio which is what you think it is; sound coming from the sides & sound coming straight down the middle. I can hear that something happened with this mix where the kick, snare, & bass were exclusively in the sides with no mid information, meaning the audio information will be completely gone for a speaker only outputting mono/mid sound.
Hope this helps!
When will chrono trigger get a remake
8:25 this is my only gripe with this remake, this help was not necesary the game is already accesible with the new features, this marker was not necesary.
I can think of some pairs of things that translated well to 3D!
To me, Secret of Mana's main draw was the local multiplayer. This "Trials of Mana" remake with 3rd person 3D rotating camera doesn't look very local-multiplayer friendly. I'll stick with the SNES emulator version.
The environments look fine in the remake, but I'm still not sold on Mana characters in 3D.
you can't blame the dubbed it how the character and script was written for Charlotte I find it cute I was annoyed at first but I got used to it and wasn't that bad
Strangely i was waiting to do the remake when i finish off the original but i got impatient so i went ahead and started it.
Original SD3 Rom port for the emotion
Remake for the gameplay
The menu’s responsiveness in Collection of Mana is really slow. Was it like that in the Super Famicom version too?
Yeah, it's _clunky._ And something is up with the button mapping. Like having a different confirm button in the menu than in the rest of the game. I forget.
It's a pretty darn _cool_ menu, but a nuisance to use.
I know this video’s kind of old, but did you try changing your scaling options in your graphics card’s control panel? On NVIDIA cards, I have to set scaling to happen on the GPU and then set it to Keep Aspect which has always corrected 4:3 games being stretched on my 16:9 monitor. I assume the same would be true about 16:9 -> 21:9
That's good and all, but you assume people want their games stretched, I I know I for one don't like my games being streched.
@@RaifSeverence I never implied anyone wanted it stretched 🤨 He just ran into an issue with the PC version being stretched to an incorrect aspect ratio, and it didn’t seem like he thought to check his GPU’s control panel to fix it.
Do you plan on updating the video with the release of the mobile version?
Wish they did this like dragon quest 11. Both 2d and 3d on the cart. And the the same for the rest of the mana games. Instead of a full 3d remake dor trials, a pokemon like remake for secrets, and just the sprite upgrade for legends. Then all the 2d ones in a separate collections except legends on its own cart. So messed up. Not mention secrets remake is only on ps4.
The English voice acting could be better but Angela voice actor is pretty good.
E!
Frelia king sounded amazing esp in the postgame battle.
the voice acting is... MOSTLY fine.
i say mostly because then we have chawlettes adawable and annoying veebahl tick.
Just out of curiosity why did they remake this? Its out for the switch in 2d and the game looks good for an snes game. Is it one of those nintendo only things like the remake of Dragon Quest 7? I know nintendo often translates games and wont release them on other platforms.
It’s not a remaster it’s a remake
Yes, if it were a remaster, it would still be in 2D or be in 2.5D. Remake > Remaster
@@davidhill8565
The dimensions doesn’t determine what a remake is
- Sword of Mana is 2D yet it’s still a remake
- Adventures of Mana & Secret of Mana ‘18 are 2.5D and are remakes
Remakes are projects rebuilt from the ground up plain and simple.
i wish they remaked legend of mana like this.
How is the steam deck experience of trials remake?
I remember playing this emulated on zsnes in like 2001 and using the button that plays the game faster to level up classes really quickly. TBH I'm not interested in playing the remake.
Only thing i found bad about the remake is that difficulty is broken. Every difficulty is easy 😋
Finished the original on a reproduction cart last year. It still really wasn't that difficult of a game.
You should try the two new difficulty modes they’ve added. The game is hard as heck now
@@mercutiolavantine5584 im already on the hardest difficulty. its still easy 🤣
@@shinra358 even in expert mode or no future mode?! The game is not too easy, you’re just too strong 🤣
@@mercutiolavantine5584 indeed 🙃
strange that gba never got this game and cool games like : melfand stories (snes) , treasure hunter g , ghost sweeper mikami (snes)
I played through the demo for the SD3 remake a few times, and... I dunno, it was alright, but the animations and English voice acting felt really insipid. It certainly didn’t help that I started with Charlotte, with the awful acting and her weirdly unmoving gigantic block of hair. I also really didn’t care for the verticality they added to the game. The jumping mechanics felt stiff and floaty at the same time, and whether in platforming or fights, the whole system felt like it had been awkwardly tacked on.
I understand the original isn’t goinng to be as appealing for some modern players, but it’s still one of my favorite games, and I wish more people in the West had the chance to experience it before the remake.
Wish the remake was done in the old style 2d instead.
After beating the remake, I still prefer the original, the post game content in the remake is dissapointing.
One thing I didn't like is the 4th class change since it made the 3rd class decision kinda useless.
I never liked Seiken Densetsu 3's graphics, they looked dark and muddy to me compared to the brightness of Secret of Mana. SD3 sprites seem less detailed too. Good game anyway though.
You kinda get used to the voice acting in Trials of Mana. Except Charlotte. Whoever decided on that baby-lisp needs to be shot out of Bon Voyage's cannon, preferably into the sun.
Wow there was a lot of weird things about original 😅
The gameplay plays exactly like FF7 remake
I don't know, the voice acting seems fine for the most part, it's just a few characters who stick out as bad. The most common theory I've heard is that they either had no voice direction at all, or a bad voice director.
Yeah the VA was absoultely fine. Its funny how he brought up Charlotte as a sample of "bad voice acting" when her voicework was fine, if don't like the quirk of her "cutesy" speech, thats still not bad VA.
The Japanese voices are really good
Play both
So, which one?
ooh dear think I'll stick to the one on the Snes then. There's a charm to it that you can't recreate into 3d it would seem
both
I don't know why , if it's because I rarely enjoy videogames nowadays but the remake feels kinda off to me
Fans: i want an open world where i have to figure things out.
Also fans: i dont know where to go. I need markers to guide me.
Baaaruuuuuuuuuh.........
I think breath of the wild is the perfect example of an open world game that doesn't hold your hand because the world is crafted so wherever you go, there will always be something to do. Some games say that they are true open world games but the game isn't actually designed for freedom of choice. So it's ok if someone is upset about an open world game that gets them lost because it's world is designed for marker following.