Reef Tank Carbon Dosing - HOW TO Lower your nitrates with VINEGAR
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ต.ค. 2024
- Carbon Dosing can lower your nitrates and phosphates. Controlled additions of vinegar or vodka can reduce your nitrates and phosphates
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Great video, thanks for the information 🙂
You’re welcome White Noise! 👍🏻😊
thank you for your video! I have research several products on carbon dosing. I started to have confused tank syndrome by reading the forums online of various ways of carbon dosing. its chaos. my reef is at 50ppm nitrate with 0.25 phos. I started today dosing 2ml of vinegar. (150gallon) system. I was having to do 40 gallon water changes in order to lower anything. I also cut back on feeding. I'm starting out slow and observing and testing to see any changes. it was great to watch a video where another reefer was actually doing what they said instead, of pushing a brand of chemical. thank you again!
Hi CJ, lowering nitrate through carbon dosing takes time. Could be months, however lots of reef keepers are successful doing it. Just go slow. Some times high nitrate could be as simple as to high of a bio load. If you haven’t tried a macro algae refugium, I might suggest that. I feed my tanks a lot, but have low bio load, and keep trace nitrate. I do have a refugium. If everything in your tank looks good, then don’t panic about 50ppm. 👍🏻good luck 😊
@@TOMReefer thank you for your response. I do have a refugium. nitrates have been coming down. its around 22 now. I am keeping a close eye on my parameters to see how the carbon dosing affects everything. so far so good! I am being careful to not bottom out phosphate and nitrate.
Good job CJ, sounds like you are on the right track👍🏻
hi @c.j.macmahon8714 , I'm in your same situation, how is going dosing the vinegar? im starting today too, after saw this video and your note. thanks to @TOMReefer too for this very interesting video
Good luck Alex👍🏻😊and thanks!
Hi Tom, excelente video and really interesting. Question: When dosing thru the ATO is 7ml for ATO water volume or for the whole system water volume. I’m dealing with high phosphate and nitrates and want to give a try to this option. Thanks
I believe I posted a formula for this. Possibly in the comments it’s very experimental but when calculating your portions you have to calculate how much ATO water goes into your tank daily which would correlate to how much vinegar you put in your ATO.
Thanks Tom.
Great video, Tom! this video is super helpful! Thank you for taking the time to make this video. Your acropora looks stunning as well.
Thanks Dave! I’m curious to see how the next few weeks go. 👍🏻😊
My tank was 6 months and i over dosed Vodka. The next morning my tank looked like milk. Some of my corals suffered and i never did that again. Now my tank is over a year old with lots of coral. My Phos Nitrate are undetectable, i feed often. The corals are consuming all of it. I continue to feed heavy.
Just be careful like Tom said.
I looked the same the day after a vodka bender!
What was "overdosed" (how many did you put in) and why did you do that?
1ml per 25 gallon is a clear guideline.
@@Harolddespui
Not 1 ml
It's 0.1 ml per 25 gallon as starting
Awesome, this really helped me understand Vinegar dosing. 🙌🏻❤️🙏🏻🇨🇦 Thanks from Canada!
Great to hear! 😃👍🏻
Did you ever notice what the Hannah phosphate checker gives you a different reading literally every time you use it at least mine does and I know that I'm using it correctly
No? Hmmmm? That hasn’t done that for me?
Love all your videos I normally love Hannah checkers had good success with my alkalinity and calcium. I got one for the phosphate about drug me crazy because you do it 10 times and you get 10 different answers some of the some of them extremely different. I just wonder how many people check it once and then just take that as the answer little do they know if they do it three more times I'll get three different answers or at least that's my luck and I'm pretty careful. Make sure I do it, right
Glad you like the vids. 😊it’s possible it’s just defective? Or possibly scratches on the glass tubes you use? I’ve tested multiple times in a row and they’ve come out the same each time.
I've been using vinegar for several months now but have seen reports from Tropic Marin that it fuels cyanobacteria. They sell a longer chain carbon they say is better as cyano can't use it. Anyone have any thoughts on this?
Hi Tom, vinegar is hit or mis. Don’t know about the carbon?
Great video, thank you. Can I use Apple Cider Vinegar?
Hi Henrich, Apple Cider Vinegar, is not recommended because it has other ingredients that can fowl your tank. Thus, distilled white vinegar is recommended. Thanks for watching! 👍🏻😊
Hi Tom. Interesting topic and nice video. Definitely this hobby is amazing, and to much thing to learn. Thank for the sharing.
Hi Jean, yes different! Thanks for watching😊👍🏻
What’s the dosing measurement for direct tank use. I don’t have a kalk setup. Thanks
Start at 5ml per 25 gal per day. Week 1. Test. Then 10ml week 2 test.
@@TOMReefer thank you.
@ro19978 YW!
Very interesting. I took your advice on kalkwasser and it really made a difference
Great! 👍🏻
Vinegar dosing safe for fish only marine tank to control NO3 ?
@@arpanpharma2734 I would just use water change as N03 reduction. Larger the better for fish only. Keep in mind that fish only can tolerate far higher N03 that a reef tank.👍🏻
yes , thank you tom ,can i get your mail id?
@arpanpharma2734 tomreefer1@gmail.com
Very informative and perfect timing. Thank you
Good to hear Kenneth 😊👍🏻
Interesting concept great job on this week's video
Thanks Christopher! 😊👍🏻
Great video Tom.
Hi Nate, thanks! It’s a bit tricky, but worth experimenting with👍🏻
Another good one dude... I've also heard of using vodka or sugar aswell never actually tried it out tho so can't say if it works or not
Vodka is very common to use. Just costs more 😃
Awesome video bud..I been tossing this idea around nitrates been hovering bout 30..but I just wonder how much to actually dose?...75 gal
Hi Carter, you have to experiment a bit. It depends on how much evaporation your tank uses up through your ato. My 75 is using 5 gallons per week. I start with 20mls and will do that for several weeks. You should test nitrate each week. If it starts coming down just keep using 20 mls. If it doesn’t after 2 weeks, increase to 30mls per 5 gallons. Continue this progression until you see your nitrate coming down. Then stay with that Amount. 👍🏻
Thank you Tom. Great content. 😍
YW!
Are used to vodka does my reef tank but I guess I’ll have to do some research because I can’t remember why I did great video!
Hey RG, vodka is actually used more frequently then vinegar when carbon dosing. It’s 8 times more potent, however I chose vinegar, because I’m using it in my ATO. 👍🏻😊and a lot less $$ 🤪
Thanks Tom
YW Bamacher! 😊👍🏻
I’ve dosed 80ml and No3 has only come 4ml 😂 but I also see my PH drop dramatically when dosing 80ml all at once. Then PH slowly rises. I really don’t see Vinegar in helping reduce a substantial amount of No3. Maybe I’m doing something wrong.
How long have you been doing 80ml? How large is your tank?
@@TOMReefer 100gals. Started at 20ml for one week tested. Then 40ml then tested. Then 60ml to 80ml to where I am at.
Good video!!
Thanks Rhombifer👍🏻
Hi TOM, should I need to remove my Activated Carbon when dosing vodka or vinegar? Thank you.
Hi Erwikson, no not necessary 😊👍🏻
How many ml per gallon? Manually
Hi Jorge, from a qualified chart, I used 0.4ml per 10 gallons daily. Here is a link to the chart
www.reef2reef.com/threads/vinegar-dosing.565159/
Good explanation Tom.
Thanks Mark! 👍🏻😊
Great video,
Thanks Pedro!👍🏻😊
I am a big fan of vinegar on my fries. While you are carbon dosing you can have a nice meal. Win Win Tom, win win! Question for Water Change Wednesday: Your favorite beer, and your favorite ALL TIME coral.
My favorite beer?😃 I’ve had a few favorites over the years! Depending on the weather, location, event etc.. haha😃 Corona lime on the beach with Silvija, 🤔Yuengling is a good one! And no favorite coral. Anything I can keep alive and growing is beautiful in reef keeping 😃👍🏻
@@TOMReefer Nice. Corona Lime is a favorite of mine as well. Its severed very well standing around a bbq as lamb skewers or chops are being cooked and served fresh and hot off the grill!
Would the acetic acid not make minerals that it dissolves more bio available to the corals ?
Hey Trevor, maybe? That would be a question for Randy Holmes Farley, he’s a reef keeper and chemist I’ve followed for a long time. My guess is that dosing such small amounts of acetic acid, won’t make too much of a difference. I’m not sure on this one. Good question. Here’s a link, check it out if you want reefkeeping.com/joomla/index.php/current-issue/article/116-vinegar-dosing-methodology-for-the-marine-aquarium
Thinking about doing this or getting Nopox? Why didnt you just go with Nopox?
Hey James, I don’t know anything about Nopox? Now I’ll read up on it. 😊I heard of it but never researched it. I really was just using vinegar to dissolve more of my Kalkwasser in my ATO. Then realized I might be able to experiment with it.
Questions, Why not sugar? I see most people using vinegar or vodka, is there any reason not using sugar? Thanks
Hi By Time, most experience reef keepers have said they’ve been more successful with vodka and vinegar. Not to many know exactly why. But sugar reported browning of corals, and cyano outbreaks. So most keep to vodka and vinegar because of better results. 😊👍🏻
Tom, your content is spot on. 🫶🏼🪸🐚
Thanks Cassie! I’m glad you’re finding it helpful👍🏻😊
Better Water Change WED question: Will a couple (or at the most three), uneaten 2mm pellets impact water quality? I ask because i,m always syphoning them out. But its such a pain. Love to hear your thoughts?
Hey Steven! Not really. I mean if you over feed to a point where there is a lot sitting on the bottom over time, nutrients/phosphate would accumulate. If you have a refugium and or skimmer, you’ll be fine. Don’t hassle yourself 🤪 check your nitrate phosphate once a month after leaving uneaten food, see it it goes up😊👍🏻
@@TOMReefer I do have a skimmer, and only one "pet" fish in a 30 gallon Extra Tall - a Maroon Clownfish named Hot Pot. He shares the tank with a Turbo Snail named Gary. :) Thanks!
You’re fine then! Just test once a month. Fish only can tolerate quite high levels of nitrate and phos. 👍🏻
What about sugar .. some people dose sugar which one is better ?
Hi ajiiss, I’ve never used sugar, so not sure.
So Tom I’m evaporating approximately 3 gallons a week. How much vinegar would you say add to my ato ?
I have a 3 gallon reservoir for an ATO
Hi McKenzie, start with 5ml per gallon for the week. And test nitrate weekly. Don’t increase for 4-6 weeks. It takes time for results to show. Keep testing. Make sure you continue water changes 👍🏻see what happens after 6 weeks.
Do you run your skimmer 24/7 or do you cycle it on and off. I have heard that if you carbon dose and run skimmer all the time you can actually remove the bacteria that your carbon dosing for
Hey Brandon, the skimmer keeps the oxygen levels up. I’ve read varied info on what you are saying. I really don’t think the skimmer removes the bacteria. What causes the lowering of the nitrate, is the additional bacteria that is added because of the dosing. IMO you don’t really export nitrate with the skimmer, the nitrate is just taken up by the new bacteria. This is why carbon dosing is a bit grey in some areas. 👍🏻😊
@@TOMReefer well because of your videos I bought a reef glass skimmer and tried using it off and on...still trying to get it dialed in...maybe do a video on how the foam should look!!
Try adjusting it so the foam in it’s more settled stage, about an inch below the Reef Glass logo. This location has worked well for me. When it foams up, the brown sludge forms in the top 2 inches of the tube. The more liquid skimate goes into the collection cup. Maybe I can mention Wednesday 👍🏻
@@TOMReefer will do..thank you sir..mine seems to keep surging..foam is sporadic and goes up and down like a fountain
How far out of the water is it sticking, and where is it located in your tank?
Hey Tom, one thing i don't understand yet about carbon dosing is how the skimmer will take the bacteria (plus consumed nitrates) out? Because i always thought than only anaerobic bacteria can consume nitrates, and they are deeply hidden in rock/substrate etcetera. They don't float around in the water column ready for being skimmed.
Hi Henno, the easiest way I can explain it Is, the carbon (dosing) is food for the bacteria. It helps increase the amount of bacteria, therefore increasing a better nitrogen cycle, thus lowering nitrate. Skimming only plays a small role 👍🏻😊
@@TOMReefer Thanks Tom. Found also more info on R2R. When a bacteria population grows, it consumes N and P. The excess of bacteria (including the consumed N and P) lands in the water column and is exported by the skimmer.
So the skimmer plays an important role in this too.
is there any diffrent between distilled viniger and whit vinegar? ı have white one? thank you..
Hi ERALP, White vinegar usually is distilled. But it usually says distilled on the label. 👍🏻
@@TOMReefer thank you very much
Put vinegar in filter or direct to aquarium ????
Hi Jekky, if you are dosing direct, but it directly into the aquarium in a high flow area. Be careful on amount. Do your research.👍🏻😊
@@TOMReefer thanks my bro, god bless you
Do you also run your carbon with all that
Hi Isidro, yes, I have a filter bag of carbon in the overflow box next to the return pump. 👍🏻
Can I use Braggs Apple Cider Vinegar?
No, it has to be white distilled 👍🏻
Hi, Tom. My 75g reef has 40ppm no3 and 0.03 ppm po4. I give viniger dose but not with ato. Last I give 3ml per day viniger dose. But didn't get any positive result. Could you please tell me how could I reduce no3 of my tank to 10 ppm ? And with maintaining the chart if I have to change water then after that day how much viniger I have to dose ? Start from last before water change or start from the beginning?
Hi Sukanta, the easiest way to lower your N03 is water changes. 50% . You might want to try adding a refugium to reduce your nitrate. The vinegar method takes a lot of trial and experimentation. There is no perfect answer and amount. 👍🏻
@@TOMReefer yes i did 50% water change. and after vinegar dose 3ml per in my 280l tank no3 comes to 30ppm from 40ppm. and po4 is0.03ppm. But then nitrate is not reducing anymore even vinegar dose giving high. it stopped actually. so, can you tell me what i have to do in this situation ? can i dose vinegar every day ? i mean continuously a month, a year ?
Vinegar dosing is still very experimental. I wouldn’t rely on vinegar dosing to reduce nitrate A refugium with chaetomorpha algae, and large water changes at 50%, two in one week could work.
Also, 30ppm is not that high no3
Hi, do i need a skimmer for this to work?
Hi Sammy, no, I’ve never used a skimmer on my 10 gallon 👍🏻
@@TOMReefer Great, thank you!
could i just run a air stone 24/7 in the sump of my 20 waterbox? instead of a skimmer?
i know it wont be the same, but the water will be rich with oxygen
Hi Pocket, most oxygenation occurs at the surface. So I’m not so sure the skimmer does all that much. The principal of the vinegar dose, is to increase bacteria. I’ve been doing it in my 10 gallon with no skimmer. But I’m only adding 15ml weekly. So? I’m still in the experimental stage. The air bubbler may just cause micro bubble flowing through your return pump.
Very interesting topic, I love the chemistry/biology aspect of the hobby. I've heard about carbon dosing in the form of vodka although only in very large reef tanks. Wouldn't it eliminate problems with the acidity of the water?
I would also like to know your take on phytoplankton, maybe a future video?
Appreciate your work!
Hi 60l reef, my early experiences was large tanks, however I’m seeing great results on the nanos. Just very cautious with amount. I tried phytoplankton for a short time, and didn’t give it enough time. I wasn’t seeing any difference in my coral. So I discontinued it. 👍🏻thanks for the kind words😊
i am struggling to keep my nitrate up, currently struggling with dino outbreak due to very low no3 and po4.
Hi Borin, I wish I had low phosphates! Haha. However, I wouldn’t want to deal with dinos. Some reefers dose no3 and po4 to raise them, just be careful not to overdose if you choose to dose. Evidence shows a bit higher no3 and po4 helps eliminate dinos. 👍🏻
Hey Tom, It's been a year. Are you still carbon dosing? Great vid, btw!
Hi Roli, I’ve stopped the carbon dosing. No particular reason. I might try it again on my 10 gallon. Maybe drip dose it instead of in my ATO. 👍🏻Thanks!
Hmmm. Very interesting!
A little more science 😊👍🏻
Does this help with lowering alkalinity?
Hi Honey, it’s not really meant to be used for lowering Alk. The Vinegar is dosed in very small amounts. If you are doing regular water changes, or supplementing with 2 part, then you won’t notice it to lower ALk. 👍🏻
I worked at shop rite when I was in school lol
Haha! Shop rite, my favorite place 😃👍🏻 btw! Your skimmer is all boxed up, going out tomorrow am. Don’t forget you need an air pump! I use the Stellar 10. It’s very quiet and just the right size for the skimmer. 😊
Great video. Except that it's quicker to lower phosphate takes days compared to nitrate can take months. Also vinegar lowers phosphate better than nitrate and vodka better for nitrate than phosphate. Hope all is well.
Nope carbon dosing is more for nitrate. It does lover phosphate but not as good .
And phosphate is bound in the sand and rocks 😂 you got the wrong information 😂😂
He didn’t get that info from me. So many misinformed reefers out there? 🙃
you from the philly area? cuz you sound like it!lol
Hey Phil’s Nano Reef, 😃From Jersey. Maybe some Philly crossed the River 🤪love Philly, go down lots. After NYC ofc 😁
my water smell bad but i check my nitried 0.5 yellow color
Hey tiny reef tank, test/check for ammonia and nitrite. 👍🏻
5 gallon reef tank: Should I dose vinegar ?
You don’t have to. Water change can lower nitrate. I experimented for fun.
@@TOMReefer thank you! Question: my aquarium is fully of bioload, he was doing great until yesterday! I added 50 small hermit crabs 🐚 for a sudden growth of brown algae around the tank, this morning some corals were looking with white spots and stressed. This is not the first time after adding a new organism, that’s why I don’t like to add any other animal to my tank but some people recommend me add more hermit 🐚 and was only a cleaning crew. I did a water change 50% like I always do when this issue happens, 1 shot of nitrifying bacteria and activated carbon. Any comments regarding this issue?
@@TOMReefer last parameter for this week: Alk: 9.3
CALCIUM: 450
PHOSPHATE: 0
NITRATE: 4
MAGNESIUM: 1,350
Those are good excellent parameters 👍🏻
My pH went way too high started killing all my cleanup crew
I have not had that experience?
If the vinegar is a source of food for the nitrafying bacteria and thus they multiply and you get the benefits...then is it the increase of nitrafying bacteria the key here. Colouration is all because the nitrafying bacteria reduce nitrates?
The cons make it quite scary to dose vinegar, I wonder if there are other ways to grow the bacteria that is safer. Maybe buy Dr Tim's and dump it? Hmm
Hi Rudra, I researched a bit of Dr. Tim’s NP Active Pearls. They are just another source of carbon. So you could use that. However, the pellets put in dissolve at a fixed rate, every tank is different, and experimentation would still be necessary. Personally I wouldn’t choose to carbon dose at all, but I’m using vinegar in my ato with kalkwasser, so I thought I would take it one step further. Vodka is a more popular choice for carbon dosing. It’s not completely clear why coloration in sps takes place. Some sps keepers prefer a higher nitrate to achieve color. So? 😊
the cuts in the video are a bit all over the place. U maybe no what ur saying or talking about but most of us do not
If you are a beginner, you really don’t need a video like this one. Using vinegar for nitrate reduction as a more advanced principle. Try searching for more how to videos 👍🏻