I'm an MMA practitioner, and there's a general message from our community on how inaccurate most hand-to-hand fight scenes are, and it's great to see someone with the know-how actually analysing the medieval weapon-based combat scenes as well. Keep up the fine work.
The Sand Snakes were one of the major letdowns of the series for me. I had them spoiled after the Oberyn fight and they were described to me as all fighting like Oberyn (ie. All very skilled). Don't think anyone one of these would have lasted very long against the mountain. Seems to me they needed good stunt doubles for the fight scenes because this was underwhelming. So was their story to be fair.
AlexThomson1000 Tyene wasn't a let down. A let up, more like. She had two very nice things about her. But nah, Oberyn was a renowned fighter and a man (sorry, girls), he was clearly better. Oberyn would've skewered one-handed Jaime with minimal trouble, while the Sand Snakes couldn't hit the guy once.
AlexThomson1000 Yea, I think it was an issue of the actors. Pedro Pascal took to the choreography better and they had a better stunt man. Here, there were more shots of the actresses up close so they couldn't use stunt women for many of the shots I guess.
Gage Godwin I never said he didn't..in fact I mentioned that. Pedro did I would say 20% of the scene with the stunt man taking up the other percent. But Pedro took to the choreography well enough that the transition between the close ups with him and the far shots wasn't to jarring in terms of choreography. The Viper vs the Mountain fight had a good many wide shots though so the stunt man was in there most of the time. This fight took place a lot closer to the camera so the actors had to do a good bit of the fighting..and of course actors aren't stunt men. It is a common problem in film and television.
+ayy lmao Ugh it's annoying because Pedro Pascal managed the spear spinning so well in season 4. Well whether it was him or a stunt double. Either way, he made it look graceful. That's what Obara is supposed to be doing but instead it just looks ridiculous. They need to give those actresses some better choreography and more time to prepare.
***** Mostly due to fantasy stories/games where the agile class wears light skimpy armor and daggers. The perception where by bows don't need strength and bigger muscles = better swordsman is inaccurately represented. Bows actually require quite abit of strength to use and being quick with a sword is better than being strong with a sword.
Hi! A reply to the whip-section. While a whip by itself is not an effective weapon, with some upgrading it can be. In the 18-19 centuries hungarian herdsmen were famous of tying a small metal ball to the end of their whips before fights. As the whips end travels at soundspeed - which gives its voice - the ball has such force as when shot from a pistol. There are records of herdsmen/highwaymen fighting in free companies during the 1848-49 revolutionary war crushing imperial solders heads using these ballwhips
I don't know why there's this fascination with complex and acrobatic moves in TV/movie combat. I think that the most impressive combat I can recall seeing, in a major Hollywood movie, was by Brad Pitt's Achilles in "Troy." While there were some of the usual aerial bits involved, there was also a certain economy of movement that you would expect from a seasoned fighter. It was get in fast, kill, and move on.
As for 'whip girl's' constant twirling, it seems she's only doing the beginner's move which involves whirling it above your head before making it crack.
Speaking of whips and how ineffective they are, there's a scene in the movie Underworld where a vampire took out 2 silver whips to take on a werewolf and at first, he seemed like he was keeping him at bay but one of his whips actually got stuck on something and he got killed
Whips are not as ineffective as you'd think. Any weapon with a range or extended reach really needs room to use. For example the Japanese Kusarigama it's sickle and chain ball. The sickle is the secondary weapon whole the chain and ball is the main weapon. Example the spear isn't useful against someone with a dagger within a close narrow corridor due to the less room to swing it let alone if you stab and miss you'll be dead
Just a quick comment about the whip. Whips will do huge amounts of damage to a person. remember that the tip of the whip is moving faster than the speed of sound when it cracks (cracking is it breaking the sound barrier). It will slice soft tissue very easily. There are also instances of it breaking bone on impact. I have seen cows (who's hide is much thicker than ours) with very deep wounds from a person who accidentally hit them with a stock whip. Though I do agree that a whip is a poor weapon against an armed attacker (unless you are very good with it)
Juan Gonzalez I disagree, this is still much better than the swordfight between Jaime and Brienne. That fight would be better with some bad cutting to hide how slow and clumsy that fight was.
No, the capture of yunkai is the worst. This is a close second, but for my money i was not actively laughing my ass off at the camera work in this fight. Yunkais fight was just.... Omglol
scholagladiatoria Gladiator. I had good memories of this film that I saw as a kid. Tried to watch it recently and I had to shut if off during the first battle because it was so cringe-inducing (flaming arrows, no formation, armors, STONE WARHAMMER,...) I want closure Matt.
CZProtton you're right, i had forgotten about him since he usually just fires off a few pyromancies before i kill him; totally forgot that he has a notched whip, even though he drops it on death.
Pariah Definately. In the Karl Tanner fight you actually felt like the double daggers style could more than hold its own against a 1H sword. Second this call for a future video Matt
oooSKYLIGHTooo Of course the primary problem was that the Jon Snow in the movie was primarily using Longclaw one-handed in many fight scenes, largely negating the advantage of a hand-and-a-half sword. His fight scene with Orell for example was ridiculous, it should have lasted barely five seconds had he been using his sword properly. Gregor Clegane fight with Oberyn was also shameful in how he mostly used what's clearly a two handed sword mostly one handed.
+John Huang I thought in the Mountain's case that he's clearly not a great fighter who uses his size more than anything. He's definitely strong enough to swing his giant sword one handed and never bothered to actually use it like it was intended.
+Matthew Kozachek It gives a distinct advantage in reminding the audience that they are female. Also, wouldn't you hesitate a moment in disbelief if you realized that your opponent was wearing heels? That's a tactical advantage!
Not uncommon, historically. Those are not stick-like heels, those are big, flat heels, also common in men's shoes that don't really have a disadvantage since you are anyway only walking on the heel and ball of your foot.
Matt, did you know that there's this weird argument that pops up in roleplaying game circles from time to time, about how whips should be more effective? Usually it starts with some whip enthusiast with a poor grasp of weapons coming in and starting a rant about how whips do too little damage in D&D and how they can mess someone up in real life and tear into them and all that. Buzzwords about "supersonic speeds" and "shockwaves" are usually brought to bear, and it gets confused and silly. Handily enough, these arguments usually die down as soon as someone has the presence of mind to point out that swords, which are weapons actually meant to kill someone, do 1d8 points of damage, and that whips are literally designed to not to kill the thing being struck with them. Although sometimes it just spurs the proponent on and makes them start claiming how whips can actually break skulls and crack limbs. Such is roleplaying game arguments.
I know this is a zombie thread, but there are plenty of historical accounts of bullwhips or an especially brutal russian whip called a knout killing people. In the case of the knout, it was used as a method of execution at times, and a highly skilled hand with that whip could apparently snap someones spine and kill them with one stroke. However, this was being done to people tied to a stake and unable to move. Are whips effective weapons in my opinion? Christ no, it's far too difficult, far too limited, far to vulnerable to being yanked clean out of the wielder's hands. It's a silly concept. Matt's comments on closing with someone foolish enough to think a whip is a serious combat weapon seem pretty hard to argue with. Although you would have to hope you were not up against one of those truly skilled whipmeisters (or whatever they call themselves), because there are plenty of recorded examples of people who could pick sparrows out of the air with a whip, so they could certainly take an eyeball out... But then such skill was freakish and a cause for wonder, so your odds seem good! However the fact is that whips can do enormous damage, and while the training and practice required is intense, truly talented hands with a whip can do amazing things. Thinks they would accomplish, in the context of combat, far easily with some more effective weapon than a stupid whip. Does your gaming buddy wear a fedora covered in Doritos crumbs and 'study the blade', as well?
@@charlesparr1611 Yeah, sure. I'm not saying that it's impossible to kill someone with a whip or similar. In an execution situation, you can certainly kill them with a hefty length of woven leather or similar (or with the knout you mention). But then, as you point out, if you have a person tied to a post, you can kill them with pretty much anything. A rock, a spoon, a tiny scalpel, pretty much anything will do. You can certainly do impressive tricks with a whip, and in a pinch someone really skilled might be able to leverage that, but a whip just has nothing going for it in an actual armed combat scenario. Any damage it can do can be done better with another weapon, armor (or even thick clothing) will eat away much of its effectiveness, and it requires so much time and space to leverage that someone will just rush you and stab you. It's easy to understand why it's often used in fiction, though. It's flashy and cool.
+USUVA Aivar Probably the only redeeming scene in the whole episode, I liked the part of the braavosi water dancing vs jorah it really showed how deadly they can be
"It suffers from... not very clear editting, it's difficult to tell what's going on, who's fighting who" Welcome to modern filmmaking, where it's more important to edit everything into a blur than let your audience have any idea what the hell's actually going on.
If I remember correctly, there are two main teams in GoT, one for the North (who is shooting in Scotland and Northern Ireland plus some Iceland I think) and another one for the South-things which is set partly in Croatia and/or North Africa. Since they have two teams, it makes sense they have in fact a pair of stunts doubles, fight choregraphers, etc... The difference of quality in fights that is rightly mention between the two places is most certainly, partly to do with this. Or there is one choregrapher that does his/her job better while cold-headed...
I like how you review fights based not only on realism but on how well they work visually - even in a 'realistic' medieval fantasy like this, the fights still have to be cinematic.
Greatest Jerry Seinfeld joke never told: "Why is she twirling it around? Why is with the spin, spin, spin?" Ace! IMHO: one of the worst examples of a "pretty form" from wushu that's been incorporated into far too many "European" medieval films.
2:20 Got a question about viability of whips. In the 5th book, Selmy meets a pit fighter turned squire who uses a whip in his left hand to trip people and stab people with a sword in his right. Is that possible in real life?
When I watched the episode I figured there had to be a reason why the scene seemed so rushed. I thought the location with the garden and palace was spectacular and it turns out it was shot in the garden of a royal palace in Seville, Spain, The Alcázar of Seville. The filmmakers might have had very limited time to do this. The Sand Snakes were silly in general, but had they gotten a much better action scene they could've been ok.
Fred Williamson That one was painful to watch, Jorah using a longsword with one hand and that last guy with the spear should not have had his left arm in a working state!
HatcheDWheeL It seemed Jorah using an Arming Sword,that rolling stab and the spearman playing darth maul was more stupid for me(Maul was very fucking fast at least).
I have to inquire as well as to how "Tyene" (dagger girl) was holding the daggers and if that was actually ideal. I've heard that holding them backhand in a slashing manner is actually less ideal then both forward (as it tends to leave the wrist more exposed too often), and actually I can almost see a point where this would strike true as when Bronn is pulling the parry while drawing move, she had an opening on him with the off hand (in this case the right hand) dagger were it facing forward, but instead it was still in a slashing backhand.
Hey Matt i was wondering if you could do a review of the fighting inside castle black at the battle of castle black, i'd like to see what you think of Ser Alliser vs Tormund and Jon vs Styr (the thenn with the excessive axe)
This scene shows how rubbish the sand snakes are at fighting. If they could actually fight, Jaime would be dead in the first 5 seconds and they'd be ganging up on Bronn. I don't get how someone who is supposedly good at fighting with a spear can't kill someone who supposedly can't handle a sword with the left hand.
Very very interesting video, thank you! I look forward to more fight breakdowns, but wanted to share a few fights, from the series or otherwise, that you could use for future videos. The ones that immediately spring to mind are Jaime vs Ned from S1, The Hound vs Beric from S2/3(?), Jon "best trained swordsman on the show" Snow vs Karl from S4 etc, but another I'd be really interested in seeing a breakdown/critique of would be Achilles vs Hector from Troy. Just a few ideas there. Many thanks :) Edit: It would also be very cool if you could break down the Barristan vs 15 Sons of the Harpy. Was it realistically portrayed? Could the best swordsman in the world really lay out 14 "on the job trained" Harpies before falling? etc
Please review the swordfight between Justin and Jenner at the end of The Secret of NIMH. Since I was 3 it's been one of my favorites, and is still my favorite movie fight of all time. Not just swordfight, but fight in general. Personally I think it looks better than the other one's I've seen you review, but I'm very curious for an expert opinion. Thanks as always for your time and what you do.
Hi Matt! Love your videos sir! I have it in my heart to get some gear from the Hema store. So just a thought sir, I have seen one whip practitioner use the handle end for a more mace like application, also I have seen it being used in close quarters and a baton in wrist locks and such. My reference is: Anthony DeLongis and there is a video entitled "Bullwhip Expert Anthony De Longis" that is on youtube He does not go into using handle as a mace but he has another where he does.
The spear twirl thing was as you said, weird. But two thing were done by it, Jamie lived and it showed a connection to Prince Oberyn (their father). I think they tried to make it a fighting style for dornish people (in the book they are known for their use of spears) but to me that takes away from Oberyn. We are told that he traveled all over and fought in gladiator pits. Thus the twirling was in fact for show, something he might have picked up. Here with her it,.. well its too much. On a side note, their lack of dorne scenes, locations, and characters is disturbing. They better not mess up the iron islands.
It might be edited that way because the editor might have had not alot of room in the provided material. Fighting sequences are recorded in little straps most of the time so the editor was probably just doing what he could.
scholagladiatoria Are you considering reviewing the fight scene between Sandor Clegane and Berric Dondarrion? I think its the best choreographed 1 on 1 fight of the entire show, and also uses heater shields and arming swords, as opposed to the more frequent hand-and-a-half sword fights of the show - a rather underused and underrated weapon combination I find...
This is one of the first video's of yours I've ever watched so I don't know if you know but I also have sky and if you hold the play button it puts the video in slow-motion, thought it might help with the reviews to see techniques easier.
My understanding is that a real bull whip can do some major damage when used by an expert. It could pretty much destroy your face with one hit but has a host of weaknesses that make it a poor choice as a combat weapon. She would have been better off with some form of pole arm.
GoT is filmed in Northern Ireland and Croatia, and they do shoot both locations simultaneously. Maybe the Belfast unit has the better fight choreographer, since Kit Harrington and Stephen Dillane look pretty damn good in their fight scenes.
***** I can't stand when fights get edited with lots of cuts like this one. I don't want to see the attack from seven angles while it's in transit; I want to see the attack so that I can make sense of the fight.
Rob McCune Yeah, good fights are hard to choreograph, and I imagine they're just as hard to edit. I personally really like the dojo fight from Ninja 2, although I had to watch it a second time to figure out why I was impressed by it.
Apparent Ferret Thanks, I haven't seen that one, since it's on Netflix I will check it out soon. I had the Raid movies in mind when I made that comment, though they're probably not news to you. While you are right that fights are hard to choreograph, shoot and edit, low budget martial arts films, and films from the past do it better than big budget Hollywood films. They basically use the gimmick of showing a close up shaky mess that switches between shots so fast it looks fast and violent, but there is no way to tell what is going on. It's a stylistic choice that sadly became popular after the Bourne films. Anyway rant over. Though I wouldn't necessarily hold it against a TV show like Game of Thrones as much because it's a T.V. with limited time and budget.
Rob McCune I've been meaning to see the raid movies. Fair warning about "Ninja 2" the movie itself isn't all that great, but the fight scenes are fairly well done. As far as lower budget movies doing better fight scenes goes, I suspect it is in part do to not having the budget to do the same fancy post editing that big budget movies can do. So they have to do better on everything else, which is what makes for a good fight anyways. I don't really hold poor fight scenes against anything that isn't billed as "action" and from what I gather, GoT seems to be more about the interpersonal relations of the characters. I'm speculating though, since I've never sat down to watch the show.
Hey Matt, I have a sort-of Game of Thrones related question: In a man-at-arms: reforged video I saw (If you haven't heard of it, it's a youtube show in which blacksmith recreate blades from pop culture) they were in the process of forging a longsword, and the blacksmith commented on the fuller: "They call it a fuller or bloodgrouve because when you stab someone the fuller will allow you to release the vacuum, so your point does not stick in the body." I had my doubts about this statement (as far as I know fullers were only added to make a blade lighter) but what do you think?
scholagladiatoria Even if the fight has it's flaws, I think it should be lauded for at 3:13 providing the answer to the debate about gripping daggers point up or point down: use both :P
Also, you forgot to mention that whips don't magically tie knots around what they hit. If someone hits you in the arm with a whip, it's not going to form a secure, tight loop that can be used to control that arm. That is another persistent myth about whips, but they do not work that way. If they did, they would be terrible for their intended purpose of controlling livestock. Would you really want to be securely tied to the leg of an angry bull?
+scholagladiatoria Nice video! I was wondering if you could do a video about Water Dancing in Game of Thrones, any fight would do. Examples are: Syrio against the Kings Guard in season 1 or the fight where Jorah is in the pits, and maybe you could extend the video into the whole fight right up until the Son of the Harpies attacked.
You know what hurts more? Getting stabbed with a sword or spear. Actual fighters can deal with pain and any amount of armor, even if it's just leather armor will a strike with a whip not hurt at all. Maybe if you're lucky you could try to trap an arm or leg, but you'd be better off with a real weapon trying to kill them instead of being cute with a whip. If you actually want to tangle them up AND THEN kill them, use a net. That net + trident stuff gladiators used was not a joke - it worked.
My friend you know the cracking sound the whip makes? That's the tip breaking THE SOUND BARRIER, yeah it hurts A LOT, it isn't just a punch or something, it can tear flesh and has a enourmous range. It is a good weapon for distraction. That's why they used it to tame lions, motherfucking killing machines animals.
Ivo Wilson Yeah they use it to TAME lions, not to kill them. They use it to tame lions because it hurts the lion WITHOUT seriously injuring it and the sound scares the lion. It also DOESN'T hurt if you're wearing anything heavier than cloth. If you're using a whip, you are depriving yourself of a REAL weapon in its place - a REAL weapon you could do more than lightly wound unarmored people and maybe wrap someone's arm up with. Whips are not good weapons when you are fighting to the death you can't seriously wound someone with it - it relies on intimidation. What happens when your opponent with a real weapon and armor sees you have a whip, and just charges you? Are you going to hope you can use your whip to trip them up before they stab you? Sounds like a piss poor plan to me. Edit: Whips don't have "ENORMOUS" range. They have about the range of a spear or poleaxe. And either of those weapons are fantastic and wounding and killing people, unlike whips.
The maneuver you mentioned... Rebeat / Rebatte / etc... I tried to find out how this was spelled and where I can find some more infos on this. I often see someone attacking with the back end of a spear, never found out how this was properly called. Any help here would be appreciated =)
Please take a look at the fighting in the up coming videogame "For Honor" and see how they stack up with reality. If you have a chance. Knights, Vikings, and Samurai dueling combat.
Thank you. There was so much ire from fans about the fight, that a contrarian in me wanted to defend it with some evidence. I did like the prime from Bron, although the weapon looked like a Kilic for me, mainly from the episode when Jamie cathes it with his golden hand, I know tht de Longis teaches whip techniques for actors, but this one is clearly not one of his fights
Whip girl: only reason I could possibly see her doing the flourishes for was distraction (like the tassels on Chinese spears) and her role was probably more as support, than actual offence (IMO, a valid tactic, but could have been executed way better). About closing, now I only have done sca rattan fighting, experimented with some sca fencing, and done foam fighting....so I get a lot of practice with no real danger.,,, but I am very shirt, short arms and prefer short weapons unless using a spear or glaive of some sorts, as I cannot compete in the "reach game". I will often bait, fake, or feint, to provoke an attack. While the begin, I set up a defensive maneuver, close and reposte....using their movement towards me and me moving on an angle towards them (to reduce my personal effort needed to Close) to attack from at their flank, instead of front, due to the openings caused by their own attack. That all being said....if I fail, generally the worst I get is a bad bruise....so I cannot fairly compare my sport experience with bladed, especially posioned, weapon of my foes. LOL. I'd also like to mention, that at least in the show, the poison that got Bronn, was a contact, not injury poison. ...so really, to touch his flesh with the flat, or a graze, not a cut, was all that was needed... Overall totally agree with the editing and cinematography and some actions the seemingly inexperienced moves and tactics seemed odd. But I'm sure stranger things have happened in both sport combat and real life or death combat where training is forgotten, or slip ups happen. My only complaint about the characyers, as I've not read the books is they should more annoying when they talk....but like real people, opposed to characters, not everyone sounds pleasing.
The bullwhip may not be the optimal weapon but you should check out Antony delongis (I think that's how to spell his name) he is a fight choreographer and has a lot of positive things to say about the whip as a personal weapon. I think though that he focuses on more modern self defense and not historical combat, but it's interesting to think about in terms of this fight scene.
I think knowing that you normally know all the characters names and refer to the Sand Snakes as "*instert weapon here* girl" speaks volumes about how awful they are.
There is one martial art style that uses a whip, it's a Fillipino style, but it incorporates a long knife or shortsword into it, and I don't know that it was ever actually used in warfare. I should thing it wasn't, it seems more like something that would be used by a farmer if he was attacked while tending his animals, more of an improv "well it's better than a fist" thing.
scholagladiatoria Again Great breakdown as always you should do more of these =) I couldn't help but notice that you mentioned the girl with a whip and her lack purpose in the fight many times. I agree with you that a whip is pretty useless in a fight, but I think the "whip girls" role in this fight is just as you said... being theatrical. To make splash in order distract and keep jaime and bronn of balanced while fighting the other girls. in my understanding Fighting styles in Braavos have always being somewhat unconventional, so this kind of sneaky tactics are not of limits in my mind. One other thing what i noticed is that whip girl was attacking both Jaime and Bronn at first but then she mostly attacked Bronn. I think she noticed jaime wasn't much of threat to the spear girl to fight alone so she focused more on Bronn. Anyway this is only my opinion, but what do you think about it?
How about a review of the fight in Game of Thrones s4 e5 at Craster's Keep, between Jon Snow and that guy with two knives? I think he's pretty handy, myself.
I have been wanting to ask one question regarding Game of Thrones/A Song of Ice and Fire. When Jaime lost his right hand, he's then completely helpless in combat with his left hand. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that the masters of old taught people to train with both hands? Because then you wouldn't be absolutely helpless if your better hand got wounded. So, if Jaime is the best swordsman in the Kingdoms he should be at least decent with his weaker hand as well. At least that was something I thought was really odd in the books and series.
Icarian Well................ yes some fencing treatises say to train the left hand, but putting that in context, it's clear that this probably wasn't normal. My view is that having some training with the non-dominant hand is good, but not to the detriment of your training for the dominant hand. It would be silly to cut down on training your main hand, in order to train the hand you may never need.
I've seen whips take off a rattlesnakes head before but a whip wrapping around something, staying, and then unwrapping on will is just ridiculous same thing with Indiana Jones. Also a whip takes skill time and a whole lot of range to do any damage so while it's capable of cutting and possibly breaking small bones any opponent with half a brain could prevent it from happening.
btw. spinning a spear is actually a pretty good technique in "closer combat" if u arent out to kill the opponent. On the first side it disatracts while you are still able to get into any needed form fast enough, on the other side attacking is hard for the opponent (especially with a shorter sword) because if he tries to stab, it is pretty hard to keep the sword in hand, while the stick hits it (physics mate, more speed, bigger momentum :P u mostly will use the spear then too, cause you cant hold it that strong, but with a fast dagger you are in advantage). (im more used to staff-techniques, so im usually not about to harm. but controlled spinning is vs onehanded swords pretty legit (not vs 2handed, cause their blade is longer then half your staff...))
since you did do some comments on vikings tv show do you care maybe to elaborate one thing i did noticed in show. Some of main characters have some kind leather straps around right fist. Is there some special purpose of that?
I would say that, apart from certain techniques, the things that bother me the most are the stances and the timing of all of the girls involved in this fight. I sincerely think that the scene suffers from a severe form of "bad acting" (like every other scene in Dorne), and the lack of athleticism makes it even more un-plausible. Matt, what do you think about the dual wilding dagger stance? I would probably have the "icepick-grip" on my left hand, so I can hook and defend with it, and the "sabre-grip" on my right to have more stabby power.
scholagladiatoria Hey man, great review, this is just the first video I saw from you. So are just covering medieval type fight scenes? Because right now Daredevil has one of the best fight scenes on tv and I hope you could cover some of them. Also Arrow has some great fight scenes with melee weapons specially those with katana. I'm not sure if you watch or know those shows but I would really like to here your review on them.
I'd love to see a review of the first parking garage fight in the original Highlander. Highlander is remembered as "awesomne swordfight movie!" but I rewatched it a few weeks ago on Netflix, and the fights - especially that first one - were just comedically awful. A detailed deconstruction of that fight really shows off how little sense these things can make if the scene isn't well thought out.
A bull whip can be used to bind quite effectively. She should have been aiming for his neck or legs. With the legs, him trying to move around would be what causes him to topple over.
lakshen47 Yep, now you need to hit a person with a weapon that is faster and longer than yours. It depends on alot of factors. The main glaring one being her strength to restrain him. If the whip isn't pulling against itself, using it's tensile strength to knock him over, she is going to have to use her strength to do so.
Luciffrit She may have the luck to wrap the whip around his legs, but if he then grabs the whip, they've both got an equally good grip on her weapon, and he's still got a sword. So basically, she's dead. Even if he does fall, he's still got a sword. If she doesn't succeed in wrapping it around his legs, and he just run towards her with his sword, she's dead.
Not great cinema but the few years ago recent Solomon Kane movie had an intersting mix of firearms, backsword?, longsword, and other bladed and impact weapons. Interesting time period setting at the early part of the gunpowder age.
I'm an MMA practitioner, and there's a general message from our community on how inaccurate most hand-to-hand fight scenes are, and it's great to see someone with the know-how actually analysing the medieval weapon-based combat scenes as well. Keep up the fine work.
The Sand Snakes were one of the major letdowns of the series for me. I had them spoiled after the Oberyn fight and they were described to me as all fighting like Oberyn (ie. All very skilled). Don't think anyone one of these would have lasted very long against the mountain.
Seems to me they needed good stunt doubles for the fight scenes because this was underwhelming. So was their story to be fair.
AlexThomson1000 Tyene wasn't a let down. A let up, more like. She had two very nice things about her. But nah, Oberyn was a renowned fighter and a man (sorry, girls), he was clearly better. Oberyn would've skewered one-handed Jaime with minimal trouble, while the Sand Snakes couldn't hit the guy once.
AlexThomson1000 Yea, I think it was an issue of the actors. Pedro Pascal took to the choreography better and they had a better stunt man. Here, there were more shots of the actresses up close so they couldn't use stunt women for many of the shots I guess.
AlexThomson1000 Bron summed it up best: "You fight quite good...., for a little girl"
Gage Godwin
I never said he didn't..in fact I mentioned that. Pedro did I would say 20% of the scene with the stunt man taking up the other percent. But Pedro took to the choreography well enough that the transition between the close ups with him and the far shots wasn't to jarring in terms of choreography. The Viper vs the Mountain fight had a good many wide shots though so the stunt man was in there most of the time. This fight took place a lot closer to the camera so the actors had to do a good bit of the fighting..and of course actors aren't stunt men. It is a common problem in film and television.
AlexThomson1000 Yeah, they were supposed to be dangerous, but not necessarily with weapons and not that straightforward as Oberyn...
girl is trying to become a helicopter with all that spinning.
+ayy lmao Ugh it's annoying because Pedro Pascal managed the spear spinning so well in season 4. Well whether it was him or a stunt double. Either way, he made it look graceful. That's what Obara is supposed to be doing but instead it just looks ridiculous. They need to give those actresses some better choreography and more time to prepare.
She got Petey Pablo playing in her period correct ear buds.
Are you assuming her gender?! Maybe she identifies as an attack helicopter!
Girls always figth with two daggers and no armour in movies or books. Because they are suppose to be "quick". I hate that cliche.
***** Don't forget holding a war bow at full draw for over a minute.
***** well in general, girls are smaller and physically weaker than men. No pointing competing with brute strength, they would usually lose.
Harvey Kent Thats why they should have armour and better weapon not vice versa.
***** Brienne of Tarth is your type of battle-woman =)
***** Mostly due to fantasy stories/games where the agile class wears light skimpy armor and daggers. The perception where by bows don't need strength and bigger muscles = better swordsman is inaccurately represented. Bows actually require quite abit of strength to use and being quick with a sword is better than being strong with a sword.
Hi!
A reply to the whip-section. While a whip by itself is not an effective weapon, with some upgrading it can be. In the 18-19 centuries hungarian herdsmen were famous of tying a small metal ball to the end of their whips before fights. As the whips end travels at soundspeed - which gives its voice - the ball has such force as when shot from a pistol. There are records of herdsmen/highwaymen fighting in free companies during the 1848-49 revolutionary war crushing imperial solders heads using these ballwhips
I don't know why there's this fascination with complex and acrobatic moves in TV/movie combat. I think that the most impressive combat I can recall seeing, in a major Hollywood movie, was by Brad Pitt's Achilles in "Troy." While there were some of the usual aerial bits involved, there was also a certain economy of movement that you would expect from a seasoned fighter. It was get in fast, kill, and move on.
As for 'whip girl's' constant twirling, it seems she's only doing the beginner's move which involves whirling it above your head before making it crack.
Speaking of whips and how ineffective they are, there's a scene in the movie Underworld where a vampire took out 2 silver whips to take on a werewolf and at first, he seemed like he was keeping him at bay but one of his whips actually got stuck on something and he got killed
Whips are not as ineffective as you'd think. Any weapon with a range or extended reach really needs room to use. For example the Japanese Kusarigama it's sickle and chain ball. The sickle is the secondary weapon whole the chain and ball is the main weapon.
Example the spear isn't useful against someone with a dagger within a close narrow corridor due to the less room to swing it let alone if you stab and miss you'll be dead
Between sandsnakes and Jamie with one hand that fight was horrible. But Bron as always made a good show.
Just a quick comment about the whip.
Whips will do huge amounts of damage to a person. remember that the tip of the whip is moving faster than the speed of sound when it cracks (cracking is it breaking the sound barrier). It will slice soft tissue very easily. There are also instances of it breaking bone on impact. I have seen cows (who's hide is much thicker than ours) with very deep wounds from a person who accidentally hit them with a stock whip.
Though I do agree that a whip is a poor weapon against an armed attacker (unless you are very good with it)
This fight scene was the worst in the series.
Juan Gonzalez There were a few bad ones, but yes, this was probably the worst.
Juan Gonzalez I disagree, this is still much better than the swordfight between Jaime and Brienne. That fight would be better with some bad cutting to hide how slow and clumsy that fight was.
No, the capture of yunkai is the worst. This is a close second, but for my money i was not actively laughing my ass off at the camera work in this fight. Yunkais fight was just.... Omglol
Altorin Haha, I had forgotten about that one. Omglol is a good description indeed. =)
I come from the future, Boyo. It gets worse.
Could you do one of the boarding of the Acheron from "Master and Commander?" I would really like to see you talk about that movie.
Nicolas Azaña Schnedler-Meyer Yes it's on my list.
scholagladiatoria Great!
scholagladiatoria Gladiator. I had good memories of this film that I saw as a kid. Tried to watch it recently and I had to shut if off during the first battle because it was so cringe-inducing (flaming arrows, no formation, armors, STONE WARHAMMER,...)
I want closure Matt.
Nicolas Azaña Schnedler-Meyer That was the one where the one arm kid ignored orders and ran over with a pistol in hand right?
Will nonya i think that was them pressing an unexpected advantage
I remebered this video and when an enemy in Dark Souls attacked me with a whip, I charged him down and killed him. It worked.
which enemy? which dark souls? you mean pvp, right? or was there some whip wielding enemy i missed?
pizda matii The King with the wierd hat that invades you in the Painted World of Ariamis. He is an NPC, so it is not PvP.
CZProtton
you're right, i had forgotten about him since he usually just fires off a few pyromancies before i kill him; totally forgot that he has a notched whip, even though he drops it on death.
pizda matii He tried to whip me once, then I went into town on his face from up close. Killed him before he made another attack.
Ok
Looked better in your video than the first time I watched it. Maybe Karl Tanner vs John Snow in a future video?
Pariah Definately. In the Karl Tanner fight you actually felt like the double daggers style could more than hold its own against a 1H sword. Second this call for a future video Matt
oooSKYLIGHTooo
Of course the primary problem was that the Jon Snow in the movie was primarily using Longclaw one-handed in many fight scenes, largely negating the advantage of a hand-and-a-half sword. His fight scene with Orell for example was ridiculous, it should have lasted barely five seconds had he been using his sword properly. Gregor Clegane fight with Oberyn was also shameful in how he mostly used what's clearly a two handed sword mostly one handed.
Pariah I second that. And the fighting pits scenes with Jorah should also be reviewed.
+John Huang I thought in the Mountain's case that he's clearly not a great fighter who uses his size more than anything. He's definitely strong enough to swing his giant sword one handed and never bothered to actually use it like it was intended.
@@servebotfrank4082 Aye, it's mentioned in the books that he's all size and malice - with little acumen. Perhaps a little low cunning.
We all know that Matt is smart, but these TV and movie reviews are just genius. I learn so much, so effortlessly, by watching these videos.
Also why are they wearing high heeled shoes?
+Matthew Kozachek It gives a distinct advantage in reminding the audience that they are female. Also, wouldn't you hesitate a moment in disbelief if you realized that your opponent was wearing heels? That's a tactical advantage!
Not uncommon, historically. Those are not stick-like heels, those are big, flat heels, also common in men's shoes that don't really have a disadvantage since you are anyway only walking on the heel and ball of your foot.
They're wearing the same type of shoes as Oberyn did.
They can take them off in a pinch and beat their opponent to death with them.
Review the fights in the arena, in the 9th episode !
(before the Sons of the Harpy reveal themselves)
***** I will :-)
***** I thought Jorah's first fight was more exciting, though it wasn't really a 'fight' in the same sense, just pretty beastly.
+scholagladiatoria
You never did. :c
Sorry ladies, Dancing with the Stars is next door
Those aren't sand snakes, those are extras from prince of persia. I hope they give them a makeover the way they did with Daario Naharis.
I genuinely love that you watch this show Matt.
7:01 dagger girl stands in place confused instead of attacking the vulnerable target.
Please do more of these, this was very entertaining.
Matt, did you know that there's this weird argument that pops up in roleplaying game circles from time to time, about how whips should be more effective? Usually it starts with some whip enthusiast with a poor grasp of weapons coming in and starting a rant about how whips do too little damage in D&D and how they can mess someone up in real life and tear into them and all that. Buzzwords about "supersonic speeds" and "shockwaves" are usually brought to bear, and it gets confused and silly.
Handily enough, these arguments usually die down as soon as someone has the presence of mind to point out that swords, which are weapons actually meant to kill someone, do 1d8 points of damage, and that whips are literally designed to not to kill the thing being struck with them. Although sometimes it just spurs the proponent on and makes them start claiming how whips can actually break skulls and crack limbs.
Such is roleplaying game arguments.
I know this is a zombie thread, but there are plenty of historical accounts of bullwhips or an especially brutal russian whip called a knout killing people. In the case of the knout, it was used as a method of execution at times, and a highly skilled hand with that whip could apparently snap someones spine and kill them with one stroke. However, this was being done to people tied to a stake and unable to move.
Are whips effective weapons in my opinion? Christ no, it's far too difficult, far too limited, far to vulnerable to being yanked clean out of the wielder's hands. It's a silly concept. Matt's comments on closing with someone foolish enough to think a whip is a serious combat weapon seem pretty hard to argue with. Although you would have to hope you were not up against one of those truly skilled whipmeisters (or whatever they call themselves), because there are plenty of recorded examples of people who could pick sparrows out of the air with a whip, so they could certainly take an eyeball out... But then such skill was freakish and a cause for wonder, so your odds seem good! However the fact is that whips can do enormous damage, and while the training and practice required is intense, truly talented hands with a whip can do amazing things. Thinks they would accomplish, in the context of combat, far easily with some more effective weapon than a stupid whip.
Does your gaming buddy wear a fedora covered in Doritos crumbs and 'study the blade', as well?
@@charlesparr1611 Yeah, sure. I'm not saying that it's impossible to kill someone with a whip or similar. In an execution situation, you can certainly kill them with a hefty length of woven leather or similar (or with the knout you mention). But then, as you point out, if you have a person tied to a post, you can kill them with pretty much anything. A rock, a spoon, a tiny scalpel, pretty much anything will do.
You can certainly do impressive tricks with a whip, and in a pinch someone really skilled might be able to leverage that, but a whip just has nothing going for it in an actual armed combat scenario. Any damage it can do can be done better with another weapon, armor (or even thick clothing) will eat away much of its effectiveness, and it requires so much time and space to leverage that someone will just rush you and stab you.
It's easy to understand why it's often used in fiction, though. It's flashy and cool.
I'd love to see you do the fight scene from season 5 when Jorah is in the fighting pits. It's edited extremely well.
+USUVA Aivar Probably the only redeeming scene in the whole episode, I liked the part of the braavosi water dancing vs jorah it really showed how deadly they can be
Writers always give female fighters whips because they like the idea of a woman with a whip.
They've obviously never been hit with a whip.
"It suffers from... not very clear editting, it's difficult to tell what's going on, who's fighting who"
Welcome to modern filmmaking, where it's more important to edit everything into a blur than let your audience have any idea what the hell's actually going on.
If I remember correctly, there are two main teams in GoT, one for the North (who is shooting in Scotland and Northern Ireland plus some Iceland I think) and another one for the South-things which is set partly in Croatia and/or North Africa. Since they have two teams, it makes sense they have in fact a pair of stunts doubles, fight choregraphers, etc... The difference of quality in fights that is rightly mention between the two places is most certainly, partly to do with this.
Or there is one choregrapher that does his/her job better while cold-headed...
I like how you review fights based not only on realism but on how well they work visually - even in a 'realistic' medieval fantasy like this, the fights still have to be cinematic.
valinor100 Absolutely, I accept this is TV and not real life. However I think in many cases they could make better TV with better martial technique.
i enjoy these reviews of fights, keep em coming
Greatest Jerry Seinfeld joke never told: "Why is she twirling it around? Why is with the spin, spin, spin?" Ace!
IMHO: one of the worst examples of a "pretty form" from wushu that's been incorporated into far too many "European" medieval films.
I haven't let it play, I have to get ready for how brutal this is going to be
The whip is for Crowd Control. lol
2:20 Got a question about viability of whips. In the 5th book, Selmy meets a pit fighter turned squire who uses a whip in his left hand to trip people and stab people with a sword in his right.
Is that possible in real life?
+Daemon Redfield I think the weird gladiator technique of using a net + Trident is even more viable in a fight than that.
+Jove Gajo This, it would most definitely be viable. Just not as usefull as a net/trident
When I watched the episode I figured there had to be a reason why the scene seemed so rushed. I thought the location with the garden and palace was spectacular and it turns out it was shot in the garden of a royal palace in Seville, Spain, The Alcázar of Seville. The filmmakers might have had very limited time to do this.
The Sand Snakes were silly in general, but had they gotten a much better action scene they could've been ok.
I love how he calls Nymeria "whip girl" XD
Are they wearing high heels? If you look at 03:20, you can see they are pretty high.
Why would you wear that in a fight?
I've never watched a single episode of Game of Thrones or The Sapranos, but I gave you thumbs up anyway. And, I learned a new word "Rebat"
Do the same for the episode 9 arena fight scene
Fred Williamson That one was painful to watch, Jorah using a longsword with one hand and that last guy with the spear should not have had his left arm in a working state!
HatcheDWheeL hence, a video on it would be fun to watch
HatcheDWheeL It seemed Jorah using an Arming Sword,that rolling stab and the spearman playing darth maul was more stupid for me(Maul was very fucking fast at least).
I have to inquire as well as to how "Tyene" (dagger girl) was holding the daggers and if that was actually ideal. I've heard that holding them backhand in a slashing manner is actually less ideal then both forward (as it tends to leave the wrist more exposed too often), and actually I can almost see a point where this would strike true as when Bronn is pulling the parry while drawing move, she had an opening on him with the off hand (in this case the right hand) dagger were it facing forward, but instead it was still in a slashing backhand.
Hey Matt i was wondering if you could do a review of the fighting inside castle black at the battle of castle black, i'd like to see what you think of Ser Alliser vs Tormund and Jon vs Styr (the thenn with the excessive axe)
This scene shows how rubbish the sand snakes are at fighting. If they could actually fight, Jaime would be dead in the first 5 seconds and they'd be ganging up on Bronn. I don't get how someone who is supposedly good at fighting with a spear can't kill someone who supposedly can't handle a sword with the left hand.
Andy Lee She was too busy trying to become a helicopter.
Sand Snakes are redeemed in the next scene they are in.
***** yee boi
neanderthor66 And then they were back to crap again. "Bad poosee"
neanderthor66 Oh yes they are.
neanderthor66 heheh redeemed
Very very interesting video, thank you! I look forward to more fight breakdowns, but wanted to share a few fights, from the series or otherwise, that you could use for future videos.
The ones that immediately spring to mind are Jaime vs Ned from S1, The Hound vs Beric from S2/3(?), Jon "best trained swordsman on the show" Snow vs Karl from S4 etc, but another I'd be really interested in seeing a breakdown/critique of would be Achilles vs Hector from Troy. Just a few ideas there. Many thanks :)
Edit: It would also be very cool if you could break down the Barristan vs 15 Sons of the Harpy. Was it realistically portrayed? Could the best swordsman in the world really lay out 14 "on the job trained" Harpies before falling? etc
angelfire1987
I think he already did Hector and Achilles, but I second Ned and Jaime from season 1.
Murdo2112 holy crap thanks! watching that tonight :D
Please review the swordfight between Justin and Jenner at the end of The Secret of NIMH. Since I was 3 it's been one of my favorites, and is still my favorite movie fight of all time. Not just swordfight, but fight in general. Personally I think it looks better than the other one's I've seen you review, but I'm very curious for an expert opinion. Thanks as always for your time and what you do.
Hi Matt! Love your videos sir! I have it in my heart to get some gear from the Hema store.
So just a thought sir, I have seen one whip practitioner use the handle end for a more mace like application, also I have seen it being used in close quarters and a baton in wrist locks and such. My reference is: Anthony DeLongis
and there is a video entitled "Bullwhip Expert Anthony De Longis" that is on youtube
He does not go into using handle as a mace but he has another where he does.
A "rebat" or "rebeat" (9:00)? How do you spell that exactly?
The spear twirl thing was as you said, weird. But two thing were done by it, Jamie lived and it showed a connection to Prince Oberyn (their father). I think they tried to make it a fighting style for dornish people (in the book they are known for their use of spears) but to me that takes away from Oberyn. We are told that he traveled all over and fought in gladiator pits. Thus the twirling was in fact for show, something he might have picked up. Here with her it,.. well its too much.
On a side note, their lack of dorne scenes, locations, and characters is disturbing. They better not mess up the iron islands.
It might be edited that way because the editor might have had not alot of room in the provided material. Fighting sequences are recorded in little straps most of the time so the editor was probably just doing what he could.
Matt has a good point last season most of the fights in the north looked pretty good but the fights in the south were slow and clunky.
Could you do a video on the Bronn vs Sir Vardis trial by combat fight from season 1?
scholagladiatoria Are you considering reviewing the fight scene between Sandor Clegane and Berric Dondarrion?
I think its the best choreographed 1 on 1 fight of the entire show, and also uses heater shields and arming swords, as opposed to the more frequent hand-and-a-half sword fights of the show - a rather underused and underrated weapon combination I find...
I'd love to see your take on the Brienne / The Hound fight. I found it to be really enjoyable to watch.
This is one of the first video's of yours I've ever watched so I don't know if you know but I also have sky and if you hold the play button it puts the video in slow-motion, thought it might help with the reviews to see techniques easier.
My understanding is that a real bull whip can do some major damage when used by an expert. It could pretty much destroy your face with one hit but has a host of weaknesses that make it a poor choice as a combat weapon. She would have been better off with some form of pole arm.
GoT is filmed in Northern Ireland and Croatia, and they do shoot both locations simultaneously. Maybe the Belfast unit has the better fight choreographer, since Kit Harrington and Stephen Dillane look pretty damn good in their fight scenes.
Melee is pretty much never edited well - actors aren't skilled enough and fights are stages in general. This century is like a shaky cam galore :/
***** I can't stand when fights get edited with lots of cuts like this one. I don't want to see the attack from seven angles while it's in transit; I want to see the attack so that I can make sense of the fight.
***** There are some movies with well edited fights in recent years, but they are not mainstream or from America.
Rob McCune
Yeah, good fights are hard to choreograph, and I imagine they're just as hard to edit. I personally really like the dojo fight from Ninja 2, although I had to watch it a second time to figure out why I was impressed by it.
Apparent Ferret Thanks, I haven't seen that one, since it's on Netflix I will check it out soon. I had the Raid movies in mind when I made that comment, though they're probably not news to you. While you are right that fights are hard to choreograph, shoot and edit, low budget martial arts films, and films from the past do it better than big budget Hollywood films. They basically use the gimmick of showing a close up shaky mess that switches between shots so fast it looks fast and violent, but there is no way to tell what is going on. It's a stylistic choice that sadly became popular after the Bourne films.
Anyway rant over. Though I wouldn't necessarily hold it against a TV show like Game of Thrones as much because it's a T.V. with limited time and budget.
Rob McCune I've been meaning to see the raid movies. Fair warning about "Ninja 2" the movie itself isn't all that great, but the fight scenes are fairly well done.
As far as lower budget movies doing better fight scenes goes, I suspect it is in part do to not having the budget to do the same fancy post editing that big budget movies can do. So they have to do better on everything else, which is what makes for a good fight anyways.
I don't really hold poor fight scenes against anything that isn't billed as "action" and from what I gather, GoT seems to be more about the interpersonal relations of the characters. I'm speculating though, since I've never sat down to watch the show.
Whenever I see a whip in a fight, I think of George Hamilton's Zorro comedy.
Another great fight review man :)
I hope you will also do the fight between Ser Barristan Selmy and the Sons of the Harpy.
Hey Matt, I have a sort-of Game of Thrones related question: In a man-at-arms: reforged video I saw (If you haven't heard of it, it's a youtube show in which blacksmith recreate blades from pop culture) they were in the process of forging a longsword, and the blacksmith commented on the fuller: "They call it a fuller or bloodgrouve because when you stab someone the fuller will allow you to release the vacuum, so your point does not stick in the body." I had my doubts about this statement (as far as I know fullers were only added to make a blade lighter) but what do you think?
scholagladiatoria Even if the fight has it's flaws, I think it should be lauded for at 3:13 providing the answer to the debate about gripping daggers point up or point down: use both
:P
also, what is with the dagger girl's stans at 3:12?
it looks like she learned it from some RPG. Is it just me who thinks that?
can you do the galdiator fights later in the season? they had some really funny spins and bad techniques in them
Will you do a review of the fight between the hound and aria vs the the guys at the inn? My favorite fight in the series
Gotta love the reviews.
Also, you forgot to mention that whips don't magically tie knots around what they hit. If someone hits you in the arm with a whip, it's not going to form a secure, tight loop that can be used to control that arm. That is another persistent myth about whips, but they do not work that way. If they did, they would be terrible for their intended purpose of controlling livestock. Would you really want to be securely tied to the leg of an angry bull?
Would you consider doing a fight review for the dueling scene between Inigo Montoya and Wesley from The Princess Bride?
+scholagladiatoria Nice video! I was wondering if you could do a video about Water Dancing in Game of Thrones, any fight would do. Examples are: Syrio against the Kings Guard in season 1 or the fight where Jorah is in the pits, and maybe you could extend the video into the whole fight right up until the Son of the Harpies attacked.
whips hurt.... a LOT and can definitely be used in the manner as shown, wrapping around a limb
And dsitracting
You know what hurts more? Getting stabbed with a sword or spear. Actual fighters can deal with pain and any amount of armor, even if it's just leather armor will a strike with a whip not hurt at all. Maybe if you're lucky you could try to trap an arm or leg, but you'd be better off with a real weapon trying to kill them instead of being cute with a whip.
If you actually want to tangle them up AND THEN kill them, use a net. That net + trident stuff gladiators used was not a joke - it worked.
I didnt mean to sound as if I disagreed with anything you just said. just that a whip can be used as it was in the video Lindy showed.... nothing more
My friend you know the cracking sound the whip makes?
That's the tip breaking THE SOUND BARRIER, yeah it hurts A LOT, it isn't just a punch or something, it can tear flesh and has a enourmous range. It is a good weapon for distraction.
That's why they used it to tame lions, motherfucking killing machines animals.
Ivo Wilson Yeah they use it to TAME lions, not to kill them. They use it to tame lions because it hurts the lion WITHOUT seriously injuring it and the sound scares the lion.
It also DOESN'T hurt if you're wearing anything heavier than cloth. If you're using a whip, you are depriving yourself of a REAL weapon in its place - a REAL weapon you could do more than lightly wound unarmored people and maybe wrap someone's arm up with. Whips are not good weapons when you are fighting to the death you can't seriously wound someone with it - it relies on intimidation. What happens when your opponent with a real weapon and armor sees you have a whip, and just charges you? Are you going to hope you can use your whip to trip them up before they stab you? Sounds like a piss poor plan to me.
Edit: Whips don't have "ENORMOUS" range. They have about the range of a spear or poleaxe. And either of those weapons are fantastic and wounding and killing people, unlike whips.
The maneuver you mentioned... Rebeat / Rebatte / etc... I tried to find out how this was spelled and where I can find some more infos on this. I often see someone attacking with the back end of a spear, never found out how this was properly called. Any help here would be appreciated =)
Please take a look at the fighting in the up coming videogame "For Honor" and see how they stack up with reality. If you have a chance.
Knights, Vikings, and Samurai dueling combat.
Could you do a review of the Daznak's pit fights with Jorah in Episode 9? Those fights looked very good.
Thank you. There was so much ire from fans about the fight, that a contrarian in me wanted to defend it with some evidence. I did like the prime from Bron, although the weapon looked like a Kilic for me, mainly from the episode when Jamie cathes it with his golden hand, I know tht de Longis teaches whip techniques for actors, but this one is clearly not one of his fights
Do you know anything about the historical military application of camels? Especially in regions where horses were readily available
Just thinking would a whip be better if it had metal or something sharp at the end of it
Whip girl: only reason I could possibly see her doing the flourishes for was distraction (like the tassels on Chinese spears) and her role was probably more as support, than actual offence (IMO, a valid tactic, but could have been executed way better).
About closing, now I only have done sca rattan fighting, experimented with some sca fencing, and done foam fighting....so I get a lot of practice with no real danger.,,, but I am very shirt, short arms and prefer short weapons unless using a spear or glaive of some sorts, as I cannot compete in the "reach game". I will often bait, fake, or feint, to provoke an attack. While the begin, I set up a defensive maneuver, close and reposte....using their movement towards me and me moving on an angle towards them (to reduce my personal effort needed to Close) to attack from at their flank, instead of front, due to the openings caused by their own attack.
That all being said....if I fail, generally the worst I get is a bad bruise....so I cannot fairly compare my sport experience with bladed, especially posioned, weapon of my foes. LOL.
I'd also like to mention, that at least in the show, the poison that got Bronn, was a contact, not injury poison. ...so really, to touch his flesh with the flat, or a graze, not a cut, was all that was needed...
Overall totally agree with the editing and cinematography and some actions the seemingly inexperienced moves and tactics seemed odd. But I'm sure stranger things have happened in both sport combat and real life or death combat where training is forgotten, or slip ups happen.
My only complaint about the characyers, as I've not read the books is they should more annoying when they talk....but like real people, opposed to characters, not everyone sounds pleasing.
The bullwhip may not be the optimal weapon but you should check out Antony delongis (I think that's how to spell his name) he is a fight choreographer and has a lot of positive things to say about the whip as a personal weapon. I think though that he focuses on more modern self defense and not historical combat, but it's interesting to think about in terms of this fight scene.
Very good, more of this kind of video please
I think knowing that you normally know all the characters names and refer to the Sand Snakes as "*instert weapon here* girl" speaks volumes about how awful they are.
There is one martial art style that uses a whip, it's a Fillipino style, but it incorporates a long knife or shortsword into it, and I don't know that it was ever actually used in warfare.
I should thing it wasn't, it seems more like something that would be used by a farmer if he was attacked while tending his animals, more of an improv "well it's better than a fist" thing.
THE FIGHT IS CRAP AND FULL OF TERRORS!!!
Btw, nice video! ^^ I really enjoy your reviews!
Best regards,
The Lord of Light.
Is there a video about Tormund vs Thorne?
Can you make a video about the fight in the pit of episode 9?
Could you make a video on the armor in Game of Thrones?
scholagladiatoria
Again Great breakdown as always you should do more of these =)
I couldn't help but notice that you mentioned the girl with a whip and her lack purpose in the fight many times. I agree with you that a whip is pretty useless in a fight, but I think the "whip girls" role in this fight is just as you said... being theatrical. To make splash in order distract and keep jaime and bronn of balanced while fighting the other girls. in my understanding Fighting styles in Braavos have always being somewhat unconventional, so this kind of sneaky tactics are not of limits in my mind.
One other thing what i noticed is that whip girl was attacking both Jaime and Bronn at first but then she mostly attacked Bronn. I think she noticed jaime wasn't much of threat to the spear girl to fight alone so she focused more on Bronn. Anyway this is only my opinion, but what do you think about it?
How about a review of the fight in Game of Thrones s4 e5 at Craster's Keep, between Jon Snow and that guy with two knives? I think he's pretty handy, myself.
Matt needs to extend the awkward pause after the 'cheers!'. Maybe fill it up by whistling a tune or something.
10:14 Ainsley Harriot?
I have been wanting to ask one question regarding Game of Thrones/A Song of Ice and Fire. When Jaime lost his right hand, he's then completely helpless in combat with his left hand. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that the masters of old taught people to train with both hands? Because then you wouldn't be absolutely helpless if your better hand got wounded. So, if Jaime is the best swordsman in the Kingdoms he should be at least decent with his weaker hand as well.
At least that was something I thought was really odd in the books and series.
Icarian Well................ yes some fencing treatises say to train the left hand, but putting that in context, it's clear that this probably wasn't normal. My view is that having some training with the non-dominant hand is good, but not to the detriment of your training for the dominant hand. It would be silly to cut down on training your main hand, in order to train the hand you may never need.
Oh PS Matt, you might have commented on the high heel boots the ladies where wearing.
I've seen whips take off a rattlesnakes head before but a whip wrapping around something, staying, and then unwrapping on will is just ridiculous same thing with Indiana Jones. Also a whip takes skill time and a whole lot of range to do any damage so while it's capable of cutting and possibly breaking small bones any opponent with half a brain could prevent it from happening.
btw. spinning a spear is actually a pretty good technique in "closer combat" if u arent out to kill the opponent.
On the first side it disatracts while you are still able to get into any needed form fast enough, on the other side attacking is hard for the opponent (especially with a shorter sword) because if he tries to stab, it is pretty hard to keep the sword in hand, while the stick hits it (physics mate, more speed, bigger momentum :P u mostly will use the spear then too, cause you cant hold it that strong, but with a fast dagger you are in advantage). (im more used to staff-techniques, so im usually not about to harm. but controlled spinning is vs onehanded swords pretty legit (not vs 2handed, cause their blade is longer then half your staff...))
since you did do some comments on vikings tv show do you care maybe to elaborate one thing i did noticed in show. Some of main characters have some kind leather straps around right fist. Is there some special purpose of that?
Could you the review the fight scene between Alliser Thorne and Tormund Giantsbane in season 4 episode9, please?
I would say that, apart from certain techniques, the things that bother me the most are the stances and the timing of all of the girls involved in this fight.
I sincerely think that the scene suffers from a severe form of "bad acting" (like every other scene in Dorne), and the lack of athleticism makes it even more un-plausible.
Matt, what do you think about the dual wilding dagger stance? I would probably have the "icepick-grip" on my left hand, so I can hook and defend with it, and the "sabre-grip" on my right to have more stabby power.
scholagladiatoria Hey man, great review, this is just the first video I saw from you. So are just covering medieval type fight scenes? Because right now Daredevil has one of the best fight scenes on tv and I hope you could cover some of them. Also Arrow has some great fight scenes with melee weapons specially those with katana. I'm not sure if you watch or know those shows but I would really like to here your review on them.
So whip girl is the support, the spear girl is the carry and the daggers girl is the assasin character. Clear enough.
I'd love to see a review of the first parking garage fight in the original Highlander.
Highlander is remembered as "awesomne swordfight movie!" but I rewatched it a few weeks ago on Netflix, and the fights - especially that first one - were just comedically awful. A detailed deconstruction of that fight really shows off how little sense these things can make if the scene isn't well thought out.
It would be nice if you could do one of these from one of the Hounds fight scenes. To me they look like actual fights more than most fights in GoT.
VompoVompatti I agree, and a couple of his fights are on my to-do list.
A bull whip can be used to bind quite effectively. She should have been aiming for his neck or legs. With the legs, him trying to move around would be what causes him to topple over.
Yes but 1v1, it's not that great.
Depends if the person has faced such a weapon before. Cutting through a bullwhip in flight would be quite the task.
Luciffrit You don't have to cut through it, only the person wielding it.
lakshen47 Yep, now you need to hit a person with a weapon that is faster and longer than yours. It depends on alot of factors. The main glaring one being her strength to restrain him. If the whip isn't pulling against itself, using it's tensile strength to knock him over, she is going to have to use her strength to do so.
Luciffrit She may have the luck to wrap the whip around his legs, but if he then grabs the whip, they've both got an equally good grip on her weapon, and he's still got a sword. So basically, she's dead.
Even if he does fall, he's still got a sword.
If she doesn't succeed in wrapping it around his legs, and he just run towards her with his sword, she's dead.
Not great cinema but the few years ago recent Solomon Kane movie had an intersting mix of firearms, backsword?, longsword, and other bladed and impact weapons. Interesting time period setting at the early part of the gunpowder age.