Are schools producing Generation Snowflake?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ต.ค. 2024
- Claire Fox’s recent book ‘I Find That Offensive’ argues that British schools are socialising students into a mindset of hypersensitivity and victimhood. Others reject this critique, insisting upon the importance of tackling problems of bullying and emotional distress through greater intervention in schools. But do young people really need so much protection from everyday life?
Filmed at the Battle of Ideas, the speakers are Claire Fox, director of the Institute of Ideas; Mike Boulton, professor of psychology, University of Chester; Kathryn Ecclestone, professor of education, University of Sheffield; Dr Pooky Knightsmith, mental health ambassador. The chair is Kevin Rooney, politics teacher and head of social science, Queen’s School, Bushy.
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When I was a organic chemistry TA in grad school, I had no problem telling my students when their work was terrible. I got back evaluations in which I was compared to Darth Vader, Hitler, and the drill instructer from Full Metal Jacket. God, I love it when they flatter me :)
this girl in the striped shirt talking about how she's strong and resilient, yet she's about to cry because of words that were said less than 30 seconds ago and weren't even directed at her...
what?
I like how her shirt matches the backgrounds
Why are they trying to turn university into a kindergarden?
... willing slave that sees a digital rectangular as the reality. Their parents and grandparents where enslaved by stupid ideals, without knowing that life is really in your body, and it will not help to project anything on out their. Snowflakes are a hyper version of that, sort of instant digital influenced ideal idiot.
It's all to make you dare not criticize totalitarian leftism.
Grown adults f--king bully each other. I'm not saying to let your kid get beat to pulp, but teaching them to lay down and play victim in the face of a bully is teaching them to fail at life...
thanks Mom & Dad
Matthew Morton ha, yes, we certainly need to learn how to handle bullies early on bc it is a real life phenomenon we might face at any age.
organicstorm Thank you! I feel crazy over here lol But really, I get "bullied" all the time by people. My parents, my friends, my colleagues. Bullying as an idea is just trying to get your way by use of some force, be it physical or financial. And in a world of 7 billion+, were all trying to get our way lol
Man does my generation hate the next xD
When it comes to safe spaces, when I was at school the safest place was the library. Your support network was your friends.
You are not going to get along with everybody (you can be civil) but not everybody will never see eye to eye on every issue.
There are no snowflakes, just ideological bullies. People are victims because victimhood confers power.
Joe S It is often the shortest messages which are the most insightful. Wise words indeed Joe, I have induced the same from my observations.
The second part of your comment is correct. Yet there are definite snowflakes!
Well I'd like to give my opinion. I was overprotected as a child, and was really never allowed to fall on my arse and learn to pick myself up. I ended up struggling with anxiety and depression. And turned to Alcohol and drugs to deal with it.
I struggled for years, actually decades. And man did I suffer... But for me, and I'm only talking about myself, but until I finally decided to take responsibility for not only my life, but how I felt, how I reacted to what other ppl said or did, that was the only way out. It was tough, and took alot of hard work, and help from others who cared enough to be honest with me, instead of feeling sorry for me.
Today life is good, I don't let what others say or do bother me. I take responsibility for my life and how I feel. People need to remember, unless you are dealing with a mental illness. You have a choice in how you feel. You really do. I just choose that no matter what the hell happens today, I'm going to make the best of it. Of course I have days and sometimes weeks when I get miserable. Usually the first bit of winter in Canada here. But that's life! Just keep going, it always gets better.
You wanna build your self esteem? Do esteeming things. You want to become resilient? Well that came to me pretty easy, as long as I remember where I came from. Sometimes the best thing in a day, is that I'm no longer where I was years ago. Be grateful for what you got. No matter how much it is. It's an actual fact, that if you have 20$ to your name, a roof over your head, (even if that is a tiny apartment btw) and enough food for the day. You are richer than 70% of the rest of the world.
And I feel bad for this generation. I see it all over. And they are in for a tough ride. And when it comes down to it, it is the Parents fault first of all for all this over protective shit going on. Teacher's are just compounding the problem. And it's also the result of western society having it sooo easy for so long.
A hundred years ago kids where faking their mothers signature to join the army at 15 years old to go to war. Millions and millions killed. Then decades to rebuild after the wars. Since then though, we have gained tremendous wealth, and especially after the Cold War ended, we have got real lax. Today a lot of children are so self centered, due to being brought up with helicopter parenting, or the exact opposite, no parenting at all. It has really thrown our entire society through a loop. The I Phones and social media don't help much either.
And the worst part is I feel we are headed for some real challenging times ahead. If you are a history nut like I am, you can see that whether it's another big war, or a major Global depression, which I think it will be. Especially after those massive tax cuts in the US, and the lack of a middle class to fuel the world's economy. Plus the Eurozone teetering. Oh and Trump himself obviously. We need these young adults to be ready to take on some serious trouble coming all our ways.
It just sometimes feels like the Perfect Storm. I think the next 20 years is going to be a flipping nightmare.
Bullying will NEVER be gone because it's part of the human condition.
Replacing education with psychological ‘support’: spot on!
Psychological is needed for everyone
It is okay to feel angry or upset about ideas. It is not okay to stop people from expressing ideas that make you feel uncomfortable.
57:46 - demonstrating exactly what they are talking about! Almost too emotional to speak after hearing differing opinions.
she sounds like that feminist idiot off harry potter that keeps running round demonising men lol...........not for what she says but for the quavering cry baby voice.
the problem with anti bullying is now if you are a kid and you are forced to defend yourself against the bully and you beat him up you are called a bully, its defeatism, only the victor is punished, same for "mutual combat" situations as an adult, so really one is empowered to go around picking fights and if they win great if not they are a victim
57:50 "Im resilient" - Obviously not resilient.
Having taught in university and now watching my offspring in their teens, this was a good listen, thank you. To me it seems that depending how issues are conflated it becomes possible to reach any set of conclusions, even the most crazy and daft ones. Separation of real mental illness from being angst ridden and attention seeking is crucial but not simple in practice. The same applies with the whole safe space, trigger warning shuts down open intellectual debate. Without open debate we all end up with institutions of training and indoctrination rather than actual education.
sureseam yes, and one could also argue that obsessive attention seeking qualifies as a mental health issue, which makes the delineation even harder. sometimes I think most of these issues could be boiled down to lack in actual parental attention. at the same time we have this helicopter parenting style which appears contradictory, but might actually be the ultimate height of it - I see young university students trying to please their parents' and societal expectations and being over all quite disoriented about who they are and who they want to be ... very strange to me, I think I never felt insecure in myself to the degree where I would say something like "I need to find myself" - I imagine this sort of feeling to be very disconcerting.
organicstorm - thank you for your response. Thoughts to add: firstly kids need to understand that going onto the rugby pitch of life means you will get the occasional bruise - just like everyone else. Secondly: the opportunities for psychotherapy will expand until they run out of other people's money to spend on it - there is no limit to demand.
Because I was being bullied at school I had to learn to defend myself!
It forced me to grow up and toughen up.
One day when I was walking home from school on plain daylight a stranger tried to kidnap me.
He put his arm around me and tried waking me into a building.
I was able to stay calm, play along, faked an asthma attack, loosened his grip and was able to run away looking for help.
If it wasn’t that I truly needed and wanted to toughen up to stand up to school bullies, im sure I wouldn’t have been able to get away from a real sick fuck!
As a teacher I remember the video packages being shown on the public screens at a major school arts festival. Lots of footage of kids preparing for the event with lots of talking heads to camera about the experience. In amongst all the "It's amazing" and "I love it" sound bytes was a student saying "It's great feeling safe with my friends". You could tell that this was something drummed into this child that fun and enjoyment meant "feeling safe". That in amongst all of this stimulation and these great experiences of performing in a large arena setting the best part for this child (and that it was a byte picked in the editing for the big screens) was feeling safe. I saw that footage over again and that bit really stuck out for me.
When adults are allowed to rant in University in a way that would put them on leave in the workforce or put into the hospital for a 24 psych hold, there is a massive problem. Those ranting emotionally unstable and hysterical students are validated. It's insanity.
I wonder if Pooky is aware that students have been allowed to trample all over the rights of others. I hope it is not the same in the U.K but here in America they are taught incredibly vague definitions for coercion, harassment and assault that come no where near the legal definitions. They in fact go against Supreme Court ruling. They have been using these definitions for the last 17 years. It's not the first time this has happened either. In the early 1990s there was a very similar situation on college campuses after 1970s radical feminist theories were pushed in the classroom. The same theories that had been spawning panics, the violations of others rights and false accusations in our country at large for 20 years at that point.
Constitutional Lawyers have been monitoring the violations of rights, due process and a growing intolerance on liberal American college campuses since 2001. They have handled a disturbing number of cases. School papers and art have been censored by seemingly hyper sensitive students who simultaneously harass, threaten and harshly punish other students for microaggressions. Students have been charged with racial harassment and expelled for reading non fictional library books about the KKK, more specifically Notre Dame students fighting them, because someone was triggered and made uncomfortable by the book cover (2008).
A federal lawsuit was recently filed and I hope it will address several problems. In 2011 a Department of Education Civil Rights Office sent out a directive written by a 2004 college graduate and survivor seeking justice that demanded colleges change the way they handle rape and harassment cases or lose funding, while ignoring proper legal protocols. They broke the law in an effort to punish others more harshly and swiftly after tales of faux campus rape epidemics (there are rapes but no sound evidence of epidemics). Something some universities had been doing without expressed permission for some time anyway. It resulted in a 400% increase in sexual assault accusations.
Much of this due to absurd affirmative/enthusiastic consent policies that massively over reach, cause confusion and attempt to micromanage every aspect of college students lives. People have been charged with sexual misconduct - sexual assault (depending on the schools conduct codes) and expelled for giving an ex a good morning kiss without asking for permission first, 3 years before the charge was made. Students have been charged with sexual misconduct - coercion- assault and expelled for saying things like, "Don't you love me?" or "If you don't want to have sex I will find someone who will" after asking if their partner is interested in sex. Coercion requires threats, intimidation and non physical force. Students have been taught pleading questions and statements about not wanting to be in a sexless relationship, which others have the right to make, are the same as someone threatening to ruin your job, family, education, and life if you do not have sex with them. They have been taught coercion is anything that hurts their feelings, gives them a twinge of discomfort and anything they don't want to hear. Just like bullying. They have been taught a night of consensual sex was in fact not consensual because their ex did not continue to ask for consent before every kiss or touch. They have been taught one beer invalidates the consent they once willingly gave. They, just as the ones before them, are victimologists who make a mockery out of serious crimes, water down serious offenses to an absurd degree teach people to not trust their own consensual decisions, slap actual rape victims through the face in the process and happily destroy others lives on a whim.
Litigation and documentation over the last 40 years shows a dangerous blatant targeting and abuse of "others", trampling of rights, mass false accusations and excessive punishment every single time 1970s 2nd Wave RadFem aka Victimology feminism & SoJus theories are put in action.
This reminds me of a Kurt Vonnegut story where a constitutional amendment was adopted that required everyone to be equally beautiful, graceful etc. So, the handsome ballet dancer had to wear a mask and a ball and chain, so that he was no more adept at dancing as anyone else.
Polly's Shore i8iii
Polly's Shore iii
Polly's Shore ni
You had me at, "Sort of".
Can't really recall the last time I was subjected to so many people that talked so much but said nothing
Excellent points about the excessive number of behavioral therapies in schools. This same trend in America kicked off with adults therapy obsessions that they demanded be implemented into schools. It started off slowly years ago and then amped up in the mid 80s & 90s with focus on lower grade elementary students. It has taken precedence over education and done a great deal of damage. It makes me furious. Schools should not be conducting what are essentially psychological experiments, considering most have failed miserably, on children. It needs to be removed all together. A couple of useless guidance counselors and nice ladies with puppets used to be sufficient.
^ Note I am talking about younger kids in this situation and the parasitic excesses in all levels of education. I find the use of "children" by some on the panel who might push puppies and coloring books, in relation to legal adults, to extremely creepy. It reminds me of the ritual sex abuse hysteria of the 70s - 90s where grown women were allegedly recovering traumatic memories of forgotten ritual sex abuse (let that sink in), with the help of feminist and religious traumatologist (all regression quacks), were obsessively called "the children". This level of infantilization is deeply unsettling, and usually comes with an observation of people getting worse, not better. It resulted in multi million dollar malpractice lawsuits.
I also have no idea how people equate curbing the dangerous excess with silencing people.
It sometimes seems that "therapy culture" as you described it, is a replacement for religion -- confession and the like. Rather than the college providing psychological services, I'm sure those clinics and doctor's offices would pop up on their own around campus thanks to mummies and daddies paying for care for their kids.
John Stewart well, I have met a number of young adults with serious mental health issues and having therapists close by to help them out instead of leaving them to figure it out by themselves probably also prevents a lot of suicides. of course there are different approaches to therapy and not all are equally effective, but from my second hand experiences it usually helps those in trouble to find better strategies to handle reality without simply resorting to blaming others for their problems. to take charge of their own lives. I only went to my school therapist once, so I didn't actually receive therapy, but I found it quite helpful to get an outsider's perspective of my issue at the time. she didn't step in to help me out, just acted more as a sounding board.
I think it is important to take a few steps back and ask ourselves by which standards we expect students to live by, and what the fundamental ideological framework behind these standards are. There is a reason why we find ourselves at a precipice, and it is time to unearth that reason and radically reconfigure our feelings, thoughts and practices about what it means to be alive today.
Why is it only now that we must equip children to manage bullying? This isn't new but why is it such a challenge today. Working in psychiatry I can tell you that huge numbers of young people who believe they have mental health problems simply don't. They just don't tolerate being upset. That isn't a psychiatric condition.
Also at 57:42 - 'I am so angry my voice is quivering but I can tolerate things that upset me' yawns
It's one thing to be brave to talk about something difficult, entirely another to try to change it. The latter seems to be lacking. Instead, people wish to run away from it and justifying it through the discussion.
ALL points are valid in this discussion - but more worrying than on-line bullying (you can just switch off) is knife crime in the young in the U.K.
I love how savage the really young kids in the audience were, as opposed to college age ppl.
Especially the young girl saying "i'm resilient" but was about to cry
It's possible to define resilience in such a way that it could make people weaker. Elevating someone as a brave little soldier overcoming the nasty thing, when they should be taught that the nasty thing is just part and parcel of everyday life, will lead to people needing to rely on being resilient when others are unaffected and they'll end being viewed by others as fragile rather than anything else. The woman commenting around the 57 minute mark is an example of this. She may be mentally resilient but she isn't mentally tough.
short answer to the video title: yes
Proof that excuse for everything
Claire Fox is absolutely correct.
I am SO glad to be in mid-middle age, and away from these people. Bravo Claire Fox.
Yes they have been messing up humans for many years my dad wouldn’t let me go to collage because of it and I’m in my 40’s - Raylene Price
Bullying is where a group of people or a person who is stronger picks on a weaker person simple as. However I agree if you decide to express a certain opinion and get easily offended when people reply with an opinion you don't like that is not bullying.
This is the UK what terrible adversities are our young people faced within educational establishments?
I have noticed that Mothers do seem to be overly protective of their children.
As an Assistance Weblos Leader, I was walking on egg shells (Being overly cautious about what I did!), because the Mothers were concerned about me not being Nurturing enough. The Fathers and the CUBMASTER (A mother that noticed that her son couldn't wait for the Weekly Weblos Den Meeting.) demanded evidence that I was being mean to the Cub Scouts (8 to 10 Year old).
The Mothers couldn't offer any, because the PACK Activity, held in plain view of the parents, that I Refereed was voluntary and the Cub Scouts CHOSE to attend it every month. Even when I took one of the Boys back to their parents due to them not showing GOOD SPORTSMANSHIP (As I defined it, "Acting Like a Cub Scout".), they came back to the Activity the next month.
In time, the mothers requested their young boys (3-7 Years old) be allowed to participate in the Activities (I invited the young boys in as Guests, of course, that subjected them to the same rules.): the Father's prediction of the "boys will grow up" was recognized by the mothers in the end, but that first year wasn't easy for me.
What do panels like this one achieve?
That last lady says "child" when referring to university students. She is a practioner of youth worship who praises the superficial. I'm sure she thinks a teen who cares about bullying but steals is a good person. Her values are warped.
In Canada women took over both primary and secondary education 50 years ago. Seems women need adult supervision.
I'm an adult that suffers from bipolar depression and dislike emos for their pathetic trivialization of depression but was surprised to be won over (to an extent) by the defense case for generation snowflake.
If all this safe space shit helps mental health issues to be dealt with properly then I'm all for it, so long as truth and fact rule supreme. As a scientist I refuse to be told that the truth can't be said.
i think teachers should first take a six month flight attendant course so they will know how to make their students "safe & comfortable". if students feel triggered they can take the crash position.
Today my 12-13 year old girl students complained about a boy classmate that looked them weirdly. I was fascinated by the absurdity of it. One of them tried to imitate that expression, and I realised they were talking about an expression he does often, yet he does it to me too and I'm a 26 year old guy. But they though he was sexually harassing them or something. 🤦♂️
Lol @ 23:50 "Pookey" (obvious SJW and generation snowflake defender who couldn't resist this opportunity to talk about her own issues) thinks this generation needs more flattering.
The answer is certainly YES.
that Vulcan woman has made some very good points. the man introducing could use an ironed shirt if there are any wahmen reading this .
If one views education as preparation for adulthood , learning to handle offence is perhaps the most valuable lesson we could impart . Quite frankly , the world couldn't give a tinkers damn for our feelings . Listening to anti-bullying speakers justify their existence is sickening . It is of note that it is in their interest to continue to fail , continue to expand definitions , continue to siphon resources that could be better spent . They've even invented an entire pseudo-science with it's own terminology. I've named the two on this panel Mr. Obfuscate and Ms. I'm the cool aunt .
very orwellian ... the modern generation is under control and the "fack off " attitude has gone ...my grand kids climb trees , play on their own .. they are the back lash to the modern 20 year olds :-)
The anti-bullying guy makes me sick.
Well said David!
The title of this video..... does anyone even need to ask this question
here's a better one. If you have kids what are you going to do about it?
Yes. Incompetent device driven no hopes and losers. Why even ask the question?
Not only schools, but this epidemic of broken homes with an absent father is a big factor too. Father make kids resilient. Mothers make whimps. Also, daycare is a scary place for children because of the other children. Children are monsters. Daycare is simply too many of them in one room all day without family ties and almost no adult supervision. They try and get a feeling of safety back during the rest of their lives to make up for these first 4 years of constant dread.
carolineleiden I went to daycare five days a week and absolutely loved it. I think most other children loved it too. Where did you get the idea daycare is scary? It's basically a place where children can play with toys they don't have at home. Of course they have to get used to it first, but after a while it's awesome (my daycare at least). I don't think daycares are to blame for unresilient adults.
This Mike Boulton lad is a lunatic. In the game a lifetime trying to socially engineer children in the Progressive image, acknowledges they haven't got it right, have made thinkgs worse, yet still thinks he has something worth listening to and is the man for the job. Bloody leave children alone, Mike.
I find this clip triggering! help me!
Wow,craziness ,how much money have they actually made on these books? Create an issue,then write a book about it,and make millions...hmmm,,as we have all seen a huge number of self writers becoming rich,,no wonder.,
I hate saying this, but for your own (legal well being) good... Please fire the incredibly dangerous and ignorant man calling college students "the children" while lamenting their never ending vague and watered down bullying. He is more than likely the one spawning them to bully others. What's her dog name is slightly more reasonable but a danger as well. I think she can level out, though. He's hopeless
It's simple: Too many women in the education system leads to spoiled adults later in life and a spoiled generation. The education is too feminized and the teachers don't get much respect in the classroom. Everybody knows that the male teachers get more respect from their students compared to the female ones. It's like the father, the male figure who sets the boundaries and punishes for transgressing them, is too absent from the family. Education is like an extended family and the percentage of male and female teachers there ideally should be equal in order to keep the balance of reward and punishment, of tolerance and its boundaries, of rights and duties, taken in their overall symbolism as the pillars of any education. This way students would learn in equal measure through the female teachers in their school years what is tolerance and why it's important in life and at the same time through their male teachers that tolerance is a good thing only when you know where its limits are, the limits that must not be transgressed.
yes they are. full fucking stop. btw im year 8 so i would know
Bravo Claire Fox.
Is he saying "sex farms?"
Mike is one of the most sensible speakers in the panel
Folk like Mike have ruined generations of children.
Fucking child abuse
How stupid do they think we are? We don't walk round believing we are suffering more than other generations, we just don't, okay?!
Another all-white panel!!!