Thanks again to Magic Spoon for helping sponsoring this video! Use my code APTBREW to get $5 off your delicious, high protein Magic Spoon cereal by clicking this link: sponsr.is/magicspoon_aptbrew
Caution with using pH measurements as a process control parameter. Not only is it a tricky thing to measure in complex fluids, the pH scale is logarithmic. For this reason a pH of 3.2 is different from 3.1. Acidity at pH 4.0 for example it ten times less acidic as 3.0 (but like the Richter earthquake strength scale). Lactobacillus is a big component in the Dairy and fermented food industry. (the most enjoyable food adjunct I have used in my brew was figs - if you can get them or afford them. Lucky I have a large Fig tree in the back yard)
"Listen, I can't come in today, my sour is ready!" "Okay, we understand, you just do what you need to do, alright? And we'll see you tomorrow, okay?" Brings a tear to your eye.
For those not in the US & looking to add the equivalent number of lactobacillus cells, I looked up good belly & it's got 10-20 billion cells per serve, not per container which has 4 serves. So using a whole good belly is about 80 billion cells, or 4 capsules from my local chemist. Love the channel & your presentation style. By far my favourite brewing channel
I've also been into brewing sour beers recently. Been thinking of doing a berliner weisse, and this recipe seems like a great place to start. Thanks for sharing!
Raspberry sours are fantastic. Kriek (sour cherry) may be my favorite. Once I tried a sloppy experiment of apple cider, using frozen apple juice concentrate. After it had fermented, it continued fermenting, and it took me awhile to figure out that it was a lactobacillus fermenting at that stage. It was surprisingly drinkable, not sure how safe it was. lol
Thank you for this!! I’m a big fan of the channel, just started all grain brewing after many many years off….. This is DEFINITELY on my very short list of new brews to try! I used to do some cooking videos, I hope to start those up again and incorporate brewing in there too…you’ve been an inspiration for me to get going on these fun and creative things again!! At a local brew fest last year here in New Orleans, we had some spurs that were new to us and amazing, so, gotta try this soon. Hope you and yours are great and have a great hi Labor Day holiday weekend!!!
I did a Berliner kettle sour with US-05 about 6 weeks ago. I significantly overshot my OG and it ended up being about 7.5%ABV after the fruit fermented out. I added black raspberry, strawberry, and blueberry in secondary. Ohh, my is it fantastic. Some variation of a raspberry sour will definitely be on my rotation.
Great video yet again! I really appreciate your series on soured beers. I am anxious to get started on my own. As soon as I finish drinking my Blonde Ale l'm going to brew your Margarita Gose. Once I get a handle on brewing sours, I'm going to explore souring with water kefir. I make water kefir here at home and I did a little research and found that it has been successfully used to produce sour beers. That should be fun to experiment with. A sour starter with 1/3 cup kefir in 1 liter of 1.040 wort left at 100 degrees for 24 hours is then pitched into the kettle.
Hi Steve, what a great pour yet again. Last time I "aged" 8oz of Tettnanger 5.6% in a paper bag in the garage for a month. The temps here easily get to 100F so pretty much all alpha acids had deteriorated by the end, however, there was plenty of "funk" left and gained from the aging. This way you get herbal/hoppy flavor without the IBU. And if you age it over roasted/toasted wood chips or staves, man, you are in for a treat! Cheers, buddy.
Another great video! l kegged a Berliner last week where I used Philly Sour yeast and for hops I added an ounce of Sorachi Ace. The Philly Sour did a great job of giving me a simple approachable sour beer, which the wife loves. For flavor, I decided to go old school so I have the woodriff and raspberry syrups which can be added to taste. As for the Philly vs Kettle debate, I'm a Philly fan for now.
i recommend to add some light colored crystal malts to add a bit more sweetness, maybe 10 to 15 percent. it's helpful to enhance the fruitiness finally
I keep wanting to do a kettle sour, but I find the ease of using the Philly Sour and how it has been great for the beers I've made, I may stay with it for now. Not saying that what you have done is less. For my system the Philly Sour has worked great! I also use a few adjuncts in my brew that may set it a part from normal beers fermented with the yeast. That being said, I do want to do a kettle sour and be able to compare the two to know if I am missing out on something that I have overlooked. That is the fun though of homebrewing!
greetings from Berlin Germany, say i was just wondering why you didn't make a "real" berliner weisse? let me explain what i mean. here in berlin you can get just the sour beer unflavored and then you traditionally you add a flavored syrup to it to your taste. in berlin the tow most popular flavors are raspberry and sweet woodruff (my favored). but why stop there i'm sure that you guys have some nice syrups in the us you could try. and the best part you don't have to do an entire brew for just one flavor.
I did a raspberry kettle sour in March I started trying to sour the batch using 0 fat kefir but eventually had to add a lacto culture. Man did it stink up my apartment while it soured, it took 6 days but I assume it was because the frst two days was just kefir. I’d really recommend using kefir in conjunction it made the sour almost creamy.
You may want to try a catharina sour on your next sour kettle. Little bit more of body and abv. Sour down to 3.3 / 3.2. Guava and vanilia work perfect on it. Cheers and success to your channel
So I took a bit of a risk and didn't. Star San isn't going to sanitize fruit, and you're going to lose some juice that way after you thaw it. Freezing will protect quite well against microorganisms so as long as it is clean when you freeze it you're likely to be fine
Seems like the low pH of the kettle souring would inhibit the raspberries going off, but at me grocery store they go moldy in a few days after purchase…
Did a mango kettle sour a few years back, ph dropped down fast to 3.0 😮.. undrinkable, felt like it stripped the enamel off my teeth and it really put me off sours. Maybe its time to try again.
Bitterness + Sour doesn't work too well, flavor-wise. I've brewed quite a few sours (20+ batches), so a few notes for you: * No need to pitch the whole container of GoodBelly - a few mL is enough. I heard somewhere that the lacto doubles every 50 minutes or so, so by pitching twice as much, you're only really saving 50 minutes. Pitching less also avoids some (but not all) of the yoghurt flavor you can get from these strains. * Don't kettle-sour. Kettle sour gives a somewhat chaotic flavor profile, with some off flavors in the background, and not a very coherent experience. If one instead pitches lacto, and just let it ride (co-pitching yeast after 24-48 hours) it will still end up at about 3.2 ph depending on strain and conditions; but leaves a much clearer, but also more complex flavor profile. Lacto is easy to clean out of kegs (brett is the difficult one). * I make mostly Gose, but have dropped using hops. I found they didn't really add much benefitting the style. * More fruit gives even more color and a much deeper flavor if left for a while. I have tried 1,2, 4, and 6kg of raspberry per 20L, and found that for my style - 4kg/keg is the sweet spot - anything above that didn't add much. At 4kg per keg it gives the beer an extremely crisp fruit flavor already after 1 week, and is intensely fruity after 2. If left for longer it gives a much deeper, darker fruit flavor, which reminds you more of the belgian beers. I rack to kegs / cans after around 6 weeks now, to get that darker, deeper, more complex; yet insanely drinkable beer. * Another cheap (and good) way to get lacto is those vacation tablets for upset stomach. Often contains a wide variety of different lacto strains, and give wildly different results depending on which temperature you let them sour. I currently do 42.5*C for 48h, then drop to 19*C and pitch Sacc, then let that ferment out before pitching berries
Howdy Steve! I’ve been watching your videos trying to understand the beer making process, but I’ve noticed there are a ton a moving parts (so to speak). For instance, starting with what equipment to acquire is already kind of daunting. I don’t want to start buying 1 o 3gal kits, I want to go straight to the 10gal ones (stainless steel, conical, etc). I’m mainly interested in making belgian Westmalle and german wheat beers. So! Could you guide me which equipment to buy to achieve this? Perhaps you already have a guide with this info? Being two different kinds of beers is there specific equipment needed for each one? Thanks in advance!
There is certainly a lot out there and unfortunately the equipment market is so broad it gives you choice paralysis. I'll be eventually putting something out there but I highly encourage you to not invest a ton of money into the equipment and the process before you get started because a lot of people find out they don't want to do all the work once they get started. I'd recommend checking out the anvil foundry or brewzilla line of systems first since theyre going to get the job done without too much investment and ferment in a steel bucket like what anvil makes. That would get you the ability to make a damn good belgian or german beer without too much exposure
This was cool! Did you leave the kettle at 100 degrees for the 36 hours that you were letting the goodbelly do it’s thing? Edit - ah never mind. Just saw you confirm the 100 degrees in the fermentation plan section. Thanks!
Are there any issues doing a non sour beer in the same equipment after using lac.bac in this way? I've always delayed doing a sour after reading you should have dedicated fermentation gear due to them being hard to clean out, cheers
None whatsoever. The boil kills all the bacteria, and the wort going into the fermenter is completely sterile. You only have to segregate equipment if you're pitching Bacteria after the boil
I'm getting back into brewing, because I want a 3-3.5% beer, with 4 grams of carbs per 12 oz., that is much cheaper than in the stores, not that I could even get that in the stores.
I don't think you'll be able to get that macros. 4 grams per 12 floz is barely 1g per 100ml. That would require the beer to ferment out almost complete, so the starting gravity should be no more thab 5-6 Plato. Worth a try though.
Not sure about an actual number but it's basically just a hair narrower than what you would typically mill Barley malt with since the kernels are smaller
Don't know if it helps, but my mill is set by a credit card (flat portion, no raised numbers) which is about .035". Maybe that could be a starting point? I don't brew a lot of wheat beers as wheat is usually about 10-15% of my grist when I use it.
Hey Steve, what brand of spring water do you use? It may just be where i live but the spring water i see in my local grocery store is extremely high in bicarb at around 300ppm
Yeah that's why I said plus or minus. Thing is the lacto will also consume sugars in the souring phase, plus there is no way to get an even distribution of sugars with the fruit in the bag. More trouble than its worth
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Thanks again to Magic Spoon for helping sponsoring this video! Use my code APTBREW to get $5 off your delicious, high protein Magic Spoon cereal by clicking this link: sponsr.is/magicspoon_aptbrew
Caution with using pH measurements as a process control parameter.
Not only is it a tricky thing to measure in complex fluids, the pH scale is logarithmic. For this reason a pH of 3.2 is different from 3.1. Acidity at pH 4.0 for example it ten times less acidic as 3.0 (but like the Richter earthquake strength scale).
Lactobacillus is a big component in the Dairy and fermented food industry.
(the most enjoyable food adjunct I have used in my brew was figs - if you can get them or afford them. Lucky I have a large Fig tree in the back yard)
"Listen, I can't come in today, my sour is ready!"
"Okay, we understand, you just do what you need to do, alright? And we'll see you tomorrow, okay?"
Brings a tear to your eye.
Hahaha if only that was how things worked!
For those not in the US & looking to add the equivalent number of lactobacillus cells, I looked up good belly & it's got 10-20 billion cells per serve, not per container which has 4 serves. So using a whole good belly is about 80 billion cells, or 4 capsules from my local chemist.
Love the channel & your presentation style. By far my favourite brewing channel
Thanks for adding the Degrees Celsius and Kilograms conversions, appreciated
Always!
I've also been into brewing sour beers recently. Been thinking of doing a berliner weisse, and this recipe seems like a great place to start. Thanks for sharing!
Glad to help out!
That’s a purdy lookin beer!!!!! Love Berliner Weisse, I need to brew one again soon, cheers 🍻
Thanks Brian! It's delicious, and pretty easy to make!
you should try to make a barrel aged oud broun
I gotta get me a barrel first! But man would I love to
@@TheApartmentBrewer I've been wanting to try it but it's a huge undertaking. you're an awesome brewer. I love all of your videos.
Raspberry sours are fantastic. Kriek (sour cherry) may be my favorite. Once I tried a sloppy experiment of apple cider, using frozen apple juice concentrate. After it had fermented, it continued fermenting, and it took me awhile to figure out that it was a lactobacillus fermenting at that stage. It was surprisingly drinkable, not sure how safe it was. lol
Nice!
Thank you for this!!
I’m a big fan of the channel, just started all grain brewing after many many years off…..
This is DEFINITELY on my very short list of new brews to try!
I used to do some cooking videos, I hope to start those up again and incorporate brewing in there too…you’ve been an inspiration for me to get going on these fun and creative things again!!
At a local brew fest last year here in New Orleans, we had some spurs that were new to us and amazing, so, gotta try this soon.
Hope you and yours are great and have a great hi
Labor Day holiday weekend!!!
I'm glad you enjoyed it! Would love to start seeing you put some content out there! Cheers and happy labor day weekend!
I did a Berliner kettle sour with US-05 about 6 weeks ago. I significantly overshot my OG and it ended up being about 7.5%ABV after the fruit fermented out. I added black raspberry, strawberry, and blueberry in secondary. Ohh, my is it fantastic. Some variation of a raspberry sour will definitely be on my rotation.
Wow, quite a strong sour but sounds great!
Try a Kiwifruit Sour, 2kg of Kiwifruit 🥝 , Rakau hops, Huell Mellon hops
That sounds fantastic!
Great video yet again! I really appreciate your series on soured beers. I am anxious to get started on my own. As soon as I finish drinking my Blonde Ale l'm going to brew your Margarita Gose. Once I get a handle on brewing sours, I'm going to explore souring with water kefir. I make water kefir here at home and I did a little research and found that it has been successfully used to produce sour beers. That should be fun to experiment with. A sour starter with 1/3 cup kefir in 1 liter of 1.040 wort left at 100 degrees for 24 hours is then pitched into the kettle.
Really glad you enjoyed the video! The kefir option sounds really interesting, I wish I'd explored this more!
Hi Steve, what a great pour yet again. Last time I "aged" 8oz of Tettnanger 5.6% in a paper bag in the garage for a month. The temps here easily get to 100F so pretty much all alpha acids had deteriorated by the end, however, there was plenty of "funk" left and gained from the aging. This way you get herbal/hoppy flavor without the IBU. And if you age it over roasted/toasted wood chips or staves, man, you are in for a treat! Cheers, buddy.
That's a really interesting idea! I love the complexity!
Perfect summertime beer
Another great video! l kegged a Berliner last week where I used Philly Sour yeast and for hops I added an ounce of Sorachi Ace. The Philly Sour did a great job of giving me a simple approachable sour beer, which the wife loves. For flavor, I decided to go old school so I have the woodriff and raspberry syrups which can be added to taste. As for the Philly vs Kettle debate, I'm a Philly fan for now.
Nice! Glad it worked out great for you!
i recommend to add some light colored crystal malts to add a bit more sweetness, maybe 10 to 15 percent. it's helpful to enhance the fruitiness finally
Thanks for the recommendation!
I keep wanting to do a kettle sour, but I find the ease of using the Philly Sour and how it has been great for the beers I've made, I may stay with it for now. Not saying that what you have done is less. For my system the Philly Sour has worked great! I also use a few adjuncts in my brew that may set it a part from normal beers fermented with the yeast. That being said, I do want to do a kettle sour and be able to compare the two to know if I am missing out on something that I have overlooked. That is the fun though of homebrewing!
Nothing wrong with that method either! I really enjoyed my philly sour gose just as much, its way easier no doubt.
Looks good - nice color on that beer too.
Thank you!
Awesome video yet again! Are you using the new Claw Hammer whirlpool arm or your custom made one?
I'm using theirs now
greetings from Berlin Germany, say i was just wondering why you didn't make a "real" berliner weisse? let me explain what i mean. here in berlin you can get just the sour beer unflavored and then you traditionally you add a flavored syrup to it to your taste. in berlin the tow most popular flavors are raspberry and sweet woodruff (my favored). but why stop there i'm sure that you guys have some nice syrups in the us you could try. and the best part you don't have to do an entire brew for just one flavor.
I did a raspberry kettle sour in March I started trying to sour the batch using 0 fat kefir but eventually had to add a lacto culture. Man did it stink up my apartment while it soured, it took 6 days but I assume it was because the frst two days was just kefir. I’d really recommend using kefir in conjunction it made the sour almost creamy.
That's a really interesting idea!
lallemand Wildbrew Sour Pitch + 12HRs + US05. Never done me wrong. Pre acidify to 4.5 with lacto or sour malt. Then hit 3.5ish. 👌👌
Very nice!
I would recommend a Duchesse De Bourgogne kettle soured beer. I made one several years ago and it’s a complicated and intricate flavor. Malty and sour
Like a classic Flanders Red ale? I had one or two at the Duchesse De Bourgogne brewery a few years ago and it was amazing
@@TheApartmentBrewer exactly
You may want to try a catharina sour on your next sour kettle. Little bit more of body and abv. Sour down to 3.3 / 3.2. Guava and vanilia work perfect on it. Cheers and success to your channel
Sounds delicious!
Thanks for this! Do you need to sanitize the raspberry’s?
So I took a bit of a risk and didn't. Star San isn't going to sanitize fruit, and you're going to lose some juice that way after you thaw it. Freezing will protect quite well against microorganisms so as long as it is clean when you freeze it you're likely to be fine
Seems like the low pH of the kettle souring would inhibit the raspberries going off, but at me grocery store they go moldy in a few days after purchase…
Did a mango kettle sour a few years back, ph dropped down fast to 3.0 😮.. undrinkable, felt like it stripped the enamel off my teeth and it really put me off sours. Maybe its time to try again.
Wondering if going to low on the pre-acid was why the lacto finished early?
Maybe? Who knows?
great video!
Thanks!
Bitterness + Sour doesn't work too well, flavor-wise. I've brewed quite a few sours (20+ batches), so a few notes for you:
* No need to pitch the whole container of GoodBelly - a few mL is enough. I heard somewhere that the lacto doubles every 50 minutes or so, so by pitching twice as much, you're only really saving 50 minutes. Pitching less also avoids some (but not all) of the yoghurt flavor you can get from these strains.
* Don't kettle-sour. Kettle sour gives a somewhat chaotic flavor profile, with some off flavors in the background, and not a very coherent experience. If one instead pitches lacto, and just let it ride (co-pitching yeast after 24-48 hours) it will still end up at about 3.2 ph depending on strain and conditions; but leaves a much clearer, but also more complex flavor profile. Lacto is easy to clean out of kegs (brett is the difficult one).
* I make mostly Gose, but have dropped using hops. I found they didn't really add much benefitting the style.
* More fruit gives even more color and a much deeper flavor if left for a while. I have tried 1,2, 4, and 6kg of raspberry per 20L, and found that for my style - 4kg/keg is the sweet spot - anything above that didn't add much. At 4kg per keg it gives the beer an extremely crisp fruit flavor already after 1 week, and is intensely fruity after 2. If left for longer it gives a much deeper, darker fruit flavor, which reminds you more of the belgian beers. I rack to kegs / cans after around 6 weeks now, to get that darker, deeper, more complex; yet insanely drinkable beer.
* Another cheap (and good) way to get lacto is those vacation tablets for upset stomach. Often contains a wide variety of different lacto strains, and give wildly different results depending on which temperature you let them sour. I currently do 42.5*C for 48h, then drop to 19*C and pitch Sacc, then let that ferment out before pitching berries
Thanks for the info!
Howdy Steve! I’ve been watching your videos trying to understand the beer making process, but I’ve noticed there are a ton a moving parts (so to speak). For instance, starting with what equipment to acquire is already kind of daunting. I don’t want to start buying 1 o 3gal kits, I want to go straight to the 10gal ones (stainless steel, conical, etc). I’m mainly interested in making belgian Westmalle and german wheat beers. So! Could you guide me which equipment to buy to achieve this? Perhaps you already have a guide with this info? Being two different kinds of beers is there specific equipment needed for each one? Thanks in advance!
There is certainly a lot out there and unfortunately the equipment market is so broad it gives you choice paralysis. I'll be eventually putting something out there but I highly encourage you to not invest a ton of money into the equipment and the process before you get started because a lot of people find out they don't want to do all the work once they get started. I'd recommend checking out the anvil foundry or brewzilla line of systems first since theyre going to get the job done without too much investment and ferment in a steel bucket like what anvil makes. That would get you the ability to make a damn good belgian or german beer without too much exposure
@@TheApartmentBrewer thank you for your advice. I’ll be looking forward to future content about your brewers and setup!
This was cool! Did you leave the kettle at 100 degrees for the 36 hours that you were letting the goodbelly do it’s thing?
Edit - ah never mind. Just saw you confirm the 100 degrees in the fermentation plan section. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed the video! Yeah you want to try and keep consistent temps the entire time it is souring.
For the low ph, could you have added a bit more HCO3 before hitting your boil to kill off the lacto?
I think the pH drop from 3.15 to 3.09 is 100% due to the US-05, but I suppose I could have tried to adjust the pH back up before.
How do you stop the raspberries from bringing in bacteria to you beer?
The low pH and the freezing process is enough to prevent most Bacterial growth in general, but you can sanitize them if you wish.
Giddam, so dramatically disappeared she at 04:15... betcha it's all about those strange "ungrained serials" ;)
I see you went with spring water vs distilled. Is there a reason why?
$$$
Are there any issues doing a non sour beer in the same equipment after using lac.bac in this way? I've always delayed doing a sour after reading you should have dedicated fermentation gear due to them being hard to clean out, cheers
None whatsoever. The boil kills all the bacteria, and the wort going into the fermenter is completely sterile. You only have to segregate equipment if you're pitching Bacteria after the boil
@@TheApartmentBrewer sweet, I'll have a go
Kveik yeast?
I'm getting back into brewing, because I want a 3-3.5% beer, with 4 grams of carbs per 12 oz., that is much cheaper than in the stores, not that I could even get that in the stores.
I don't think you'll be able to get that macros. 4 grams per 12 floz is barely 1g per 100ml. That would require the beer to ferment out almost complete, so the starting gravity should be no more thab 5-6 Plato. Worth a try though.
Steve, since you brought it up, what is the correct mill gap for malted wheat?
Not sure about an actual number but it's basically just a hair narrower than what you would typically mill Barley malt with since the kernels are smaller
Don't know if it helps, but my mill is set by a credit card (flat portion, no raised numbers) which is about .035". Maybe that could be a starting point? I don't brew a lot of wheat beers as wheat is usually about 10-15% of my grist when I use it.
Hey Steve, what brand of spring water do you use? It may just be where i live but the spring water i see in my local grocery store is extremely high in bicarb at around 300ppm
I use Poland spring for the most part, may be hard to find outside the US
Are any German homebrewers here? What would be a good substitute for the "Goodbelly" juice?
You're probably best just using a lactibacillus pitch from a yeast company instead
Greek yogurt works well for me, unflavored and low fat if you can
Looks sweet. Think the haze is pectin or wheat?
It's most definitely NOT sweet haha. Haze is probably wheat, I expect it to go away in time
@@TheApartmentBrewer hehe woops sorry, looks great*
you didnt took a reading after you added the fruit. probably the beer is over the 4 abv
Yeah that's why I said plus or minus. Thing is the lacto will also consume sugars in the souring phase, plus there is no way to get an even distribution of sugars with the fruit in the bag. More trouble than its worth