7 REAL-World Skills I Wish I Learned in Music School
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ม.ค. 2022
- I SO wish I learned these important skills in music school! I cover the topics of context, finances, management, pedagogy, practicing, life and decisions.
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Nahre sheds a light on things musicians go through, but the rest of us are too afraid to address
absolutely she is realistic but is encouraging!
HOLA HOLA... Just wanted to say that I really love the way you play that piano. You're like an inspiration for me, and I love your work. ¡Muchas gracias! Greetings from Nicaragua! 🇳🇮🇳🇮
Thank you so much!!
Get a glass of water before you die of thirst yo. Lol. Jk.
@@NahreSol Thanks for sharing Nahre. I hope you can share your thoughts on how to come up with melodies and harmonies when you can. Thanks very much.
I have an interesting story along the lines of the academic classical approach needing more grounding in "folk" and other popular traditions.
I got a BA in music from the University of Chicago, where my advisor was Easely Blackwood, a pianist and theoretician specializing in Microtonal music. In 1983 he joined a new chamber ensemble spin-off from the Chicago Symphony called "Chicago Pro Musica", and they recorded an album of early modern pieces and transcriptions, which won a Grammy for Best New Classical Group - not that they didn't deserve it but they probably got a couple dozen votes from Solti, the director of the CSO and the top dog among Grammy winners.
Easely asked me to attend the live recording in a concert hall in downtown Chicago to turn pages for him at the piano, so I stood dutifully by while they recorded one piece after another.
Then they got to a suite by the French composer Martinu, "La Revue de Cuisine", which included a movement in the Charleston dance style, popular in the 1920s'. But their playing was flat and "academic". They didn't *get* the strong syncopation with the short first beat and long accented up-beat on 2, which is understandable if one never watched someone dance the Charleston and was just reading it off the page.
I'm also a dancer and the performance - as we would say today - was a bit cringey and flat by not expressing the hoppy-skippy syncopation that made this jerky dance so fun. So I spoke up during a break and when they let me go on, I danced the Charleston for them on the stage to show the rhythmic character in the body. When they played it again they got the rhythm right, but they had to see the dance to feel the musical character and attack. FWIW, my prof agreed later that this was an important clarification ;-)
Oh wow that’s a great anecdote, thank you for sharing!!
Just a little note, Martinu wasn’t French, he just lived in France.
@@ladakaraskova5474 Thanks, I should have known. I think I was mixing him up with Milhaud(!)
I was a music education major at a university (not a music school like Juliard or Curtis). It's very interesting the difference between music ed and performance majors.
Indeed, I've always been surprised that classical musicians learn scales and arpeggios at an amazing level of facility, but don't understand the theory behind how those scales and arpeggios are used in a composition. Meanwhile in the jazz world, when you learn any scale or arpeggio it is exactly the opposite context: you learn a scale or arpeggio specifically BECAUSE you will use them over a certain chord progression, and you also are expected to learn what non-standard progressions you can use those patterns over -- according to the "accepted" rules of course. Then, finally, it's always understood that your job as a jazz musician is to break the rules, in your own coherent way. 🤓
Interesting distinction, which it seems to me derives from the idiomatic character of jazz soloing - the use of a progression of fixed harmonies with a single voice improvising over them - splitting the difference you could say between harmonies in the chorale style (no scales) and multiple independent polyphonic voices (no "chords").
Since the bebop era this style also emphasized scales heavily. So in the context of such an idiom learning "which scales go with which harmonies" would be essential to musical development.
It's a shame really. Improvisation was a large part of the classical tradition from the Baroque era, through the end of the Romantic era...or thereabouts. Where classical musicians lost their way, I don't have an answer, but it is certainly something that is worth study. Bach, Mozart, Lizt, there is a not-insignificant number of major composers who were well-documented improvisors.
@@ryano.5149 Improvisation is still a important part of classical music. You won't find an organist that can't improvise.
@@prototypeinheritance515 Yes, but when is the last time you attended a solo piano performance with a piece that was an improvisation? Organists are the exception these days, not the rule.
Yep. I would add that motivated "Classical" musicians and composers also do exactly as you describe too. I think people like Stravinsky, for one example, was like that....exploring, rule bending & breaking etc. And then there are plenty of jazz musicians who avidly study classical music for ideas.
Hey ! I'm a young classical musician trying to get into music schools (*struggle*) and I just wanted to say thank you for your videos !
It's so inspiring and mind opening to see a classical musician like you making your own path and giving insights on what you're living, it's a great boost of motivation 🤩
And also, I love your music 😊
Thank you back!!
I'll rephrase the guy above words in softer tone. Music graduate struggles financially.
I'm 60, and never went to music school, but over the years have known a few people who did, and it seems to me like nothing much has changed. They obviously learned a lot about (classical) music as a subject, and about performance, but when they left it was... OK, now what? How do I make a living in this field?
Yes…!
You don’t
Now that you have learned everything you have in school, it is up to the "educated" musician to figure out how they will make a living. For example: Marketing one's self to get wedding gigs is a great route. One can find a band to join or create their own band. Solo performance gigs. What "music school" does not focus on is what route to take as a career within the music field. Teaching music is another idea, but it is up to the musician to market themselves and not many have that natural skill or are not confident in themselves. Start with any of these ideas, build a resume, then aim for bigger goals like joining an orchestra or compose jingles for commercials, movies, or for private clients (compose original serenades for people to perform to their loved one for example). I agree, though, that it can be difficult to start your career in music. But, any field within the art field can be hard to make a career out of. Volunteering for senior centers and playing jazz for the elderly is a great way to start building your music resume. Get a spot at your local street fair and perform while promoting yourself for show gigs. Go around your city/town and ask restaurant owners to let you perform a night a week. It takes great work and self sacrifice when starting a career from scratch within the art field. But, when the momentum starts it gets easier.
@@pablovilla7539 well you can, its not like ages ago when royal families gave classical musicians their court performances and subsidised the majority of their expenses
Performing in bars, weddings, session musicians etc, other than that you can branch out to other things like film/tv scores, accompaniments, at theatres, make your own quartet, perform at festivals, release your own music, perform your own music, perform other composers music, join orchestras, music for adverts, music for radio, approach venues to play as ambience (restaurants, cafes, recreation centres etc).
Like everything else you build a profile, same with the arts, always been this way, alot of composers (in old) had their own publishing companies and made pianos, then had public performances, private performances, court musicians, opera house musicians, conductors, wrote theory books ( example schoenberg / berlioz) etc
I think problem is too many people are wanting to be the next big thing then when they get out of school, there's millions of other people wanting to be the next big thing lol, like how many people go through school? Millions upon millions, then obviously you have to navigate through all the bitter losers who don't want you to become successful. It's the same with everything else surely lol you go through school as for example a mechanic then you find a mechanic shop to work at then you might go to a different mechanic or do something else or you might stay at that mechanic ... with mechanics (like building cruise ships or planes or something... with mechanics) like start your own mechanic shop or develop your own mechanic parts / tools . . possibilities are literally endless for literally every profession. For the arts you can draw comics, anime, magazines, advertisements, placards, billboards, design logos, graphic design etc
or you become a criminal and a con man/con woman and a fake it till you make it type, but that's for you to decide
@@bobbybill5806 Maybe these students are just afraid of "choosing" their own careers because they are on their own after graduation. In the school, they got coursework to do, professors might be setting goals for them, or the goals are so straightforward like "get an A in the theory class". But when they finished their study, they have to set their own goals and fulfil them.
Honestly, art field is not so much different from science or maybe every other fields. How many BSc end up in being scientists? Only those with both the talent and will could be. I am a BSc in biology but none of my jobs I did are related to it. I am still living fine and play gigs at local venues occasionally with my musician friends. And for the 1st time, my composition will be premiered at a future gig. I tried to make a living by teaching guitar but, honestly, I much prefer my current lifestyle.
If a piano major think it's a waste to not become a concert pianist, he/she potentially miss out a lot of alternative ways of living that suit him/her. They just have to throw themselves out there and try. Like Rick Beato said, if you live long enough, you would have more than 1 career. They just have to free themselves. Studying music doesn't oblige one to be anything.
Have loved music since a young child, played 3 instruments, but realized I would never be able to play at the level I wanted to listen to. I have all the respect in the world for you and all those who have that mental, physical and emotional ability to create the music that affects me so deeply. Thank you so much for the enormous effort and passion you have put into making the world a better place to live in. :)
Good video.
I went to a very conservative music school, where everything was very tradtional, and rule-bound. I was a Theory-Comp major, and we were taught/expected to do everything the way it had always been done (no parallel 5ths/8ves allowed, etc). No deviation from the rules of traditional Composition and Counterpoint. Creativity was strongly discouraged (even graded down). The school's main focus in Music Composition was "20th Century Classical Music": 12-Tone Music, Atonal Music, and you were expected to compose strictly in those styles, with the attendant rules. The Music History courses were strictly traditional: Western Classical Music, with a focus on memorizing who composed what, in what year, with practically no analysis, context or discussion.
My main instrument was guitar, and they only taught traditional (mostly Baroque) Classical guitar, with all the rules/restrictions/boring exercises that went with it (i.e. no creativity/improv/interpretation of your own/choice of repertoire/etc). My final year I ended up very bored and discouraged, and changed to a "double major" (Psych/Music).
I finished my Bachelor's degree, but looking back, I wish I had chosen another, more practical major instead (one of my Theory/Comp professors had even suggested that if I expected a real career after graduating, the "smart choice" would be to major in Music Education - "that's where the job's are" he said. I looked into it, but it was even more rule-bound, structured and dull,so I stuck with Theory/Comp).
My advice would be that before you commit to a Music school, visit with the teachers/counselors/staff, and make sure they will be teaching what you are actually interested in. Then again, it might be worth considering spending that time and money buiiding your own studio, recording, and learning to promote your career yourself. These days there are so many options: TH-cam/Social Media/etc.
Music school is so strange in that you need to know a substantial amount and have some experience and a plan before even getting in! Not many other fields are like that! And then there’s the credit overload each semester, going from 8am-10pm six days a week non stop, horror stories of finding a practice room at 2am, etc.
Fortunately, I was a pedagogy major, so I learned how to teach, how to run a studio, etc, and I did so very successfully for a number of years until I burnt out (so now it’s just a hobby job on the side), but for most people who go through music school, this isn’t the case-you are expected to go on to your Master’s and DMA, or they just dump you out into the world and hardly wish you good luck!
I appreciated the comment on how modern music is just a tiny slice of what is discussed. I was afraid of music written after Brahms until I got to spend time driving around Anthony de Mare when I was an undergrad. That changed my life! Now, modern music is mostly all that I do (aside from people begging me for requests from the canon), and I couldn’t be happier and constantly refreshed!
Very true…! Thank you…
Nahre, 300% agree with you, especially for the points concerning career development. Here in Italy, the only thing that's often suggested (for pianists) is to propose yourself as a piano accompanist for singers, as it's very requested. Not that's necessarily a bad thing, but in my opinion having someone educating and instructing you to properly fulfil YOUR road (based off your own passions and interests) is not only useful for your living, but also for giving you the right motivation and mindset to carry on in the pursuit of your objective. Especially in the last years of your musical education, Conservatoires should focus more on these topics you listed in this video rather than focusing on repeating the same subjects over and over again.
BTW. Those cutscenes were absolutely wholesome, as always.. Keep up with your amazing content!!
Thank you for your comment!! Yes - while I agree that there is a lot to cover in music school on just music itself, there’s a missing link between that and actually becoming a career musician.
@@NahreSol Let's hope music schools in general will evolve for the best!!
Thanks for the reply.. ☺
Just 300% agreement? Not 348%? (^0^) Poor old 100% just isn't good enough these days.
sei italiano? il tuo inglese è perfetto. complimenti
@@alexandraulmer9361 Grazie mille!! I think it has to do with me writing lyrics in English, along with translating into Italian the lyrics of my favourite songs for a better understanding of them.. :)
I’m going to assume that everyone (or at least most of us) with a music degree realize this ‘after’ school. The biggest issue is that most people who are ‘teaching’ at these conservatories/universities don’t really know how to do this either and don’t have answers for this, let alone experience enough outside these institutions. They went straight from school into academics very often. Most of their ‘concerts’ are of the format: “let’s do a festival and organize concerts for other professors so I get invited too” (often for peer review or tenure track purposes) where the majority of the audiences are students or other musicians that play the same instrument. The musicians we often look up to or know ‘before’ going to (higher Ed) schools are so rare but somehow universities are convincing us that this is ‘within reach’. Often I wondered after a wall of degrees, I wasn’t better of spending all that money on a private instructor. Hard to answer of course, but the skills you mention (or the lack thereof) most of us face the the hard way unfortunately, while I believe it doesn’t have to be. Teaching at academies / colleges for a while now, I also realized very quickly that it’s nearly impossible to change the mindset of decision makers / administration. I fight as hard as I can but I fear the monster is too hard to battle. These institutions have a money making mindset and ‘change’ is a hard sell.
On point.
There are private instructors who teach how to make money in the industry and how to teach and make money doing it.
A great number of points, especially about taking the time to study with a personal music coach on your chosen instrument. All the academic subjects are great, but those topics (music theory, musicology) should be spaced out over a lifetime not crammed into 4 or 5 hellishly hectic, high-pressure years. I found my theory classes were way too fast paced, and dropped out for that reason; where what I needed was to find a coach (ear training and melodic dictation were my downfall) and study at my own pace. But I did not know what to ask for and let the academic slave divers push me along.
I recently took on a project of reviewing music theory and counterpoint on my own and there were whole universes of discourse in those books that I never had time to dwell on when I was in college. But I gathered that none of the other students had the time either and most of them hated music theory and musicology. Really pathetic.
Totally agree with all these points. I had really good training at my music schools, but found that once I’d left, there was no one there to really show me what to do next, and the transition out of school wasn’t really something that was addressed while we were there. Learning to be your own manager is really hard, at least it is for me. Still figuring it out. I think the last few years definitely haven’t made it easier for music graduates.
Absolutely true, and I have been making my way as a free lance independent teacher, church musician, occasional gigs, for over 35 years! The last few years and now with the pandemic have pushed me into teaching online, and I have to say, the marketing part has always been hard for me.
@@francesschaefer Yes, I took on a great deal of online teaching as a way to make it through! Very challenging work. Only just starting really to be able to have viable performance work again here in Australia.
AH thank you for bringing attention and starting such a healthy narrative around this subject. I graduated Juilliard in ‘17 and you hit it right on the money. Couldn’t agree more. Jyard needs to hire you to teach this full-time
oh Nahre that post-it note on the forehead strikes home for many many aspiring artists!!!!
That last one could go for just about any major in the arts and humanities. I spent ten years in college and came out without an academic or creative job, and next to no skills in coping with or navigating the modern commercial workplace. For a long time now I've just been working as a security guard. I'm kind of glad that due to scholarship money and grants I came out of it without any serious debts like many others, but dealing with the bitterness and disillusionment is still a struggle.
Yes that last one is very raw and complex… I don’t have a good solution for that but I thought it was worth mentioning
I had a similar experience and I was barely able to hold on to the music skills. I turned to composition and derived some satisfaction from that but only after the Digital Audio workshop technology came off the horizon. But this society in the USA is really not supportive of the efforts people put into the arts, the situation you are in is mostly not your fault.
Due to a kind of whipsaw situation, art and music schools (especially music schools though) get pushed into shoving students though impossible heavy curricula expectations and there's no opportunity for genuine learning or preparing for real world situations.
Ironically, in my situation, I wish the admissions process had been a bit tougher; someone needed to tell me to study another 18 months with my piano teacher and then come back and seek admission. But I rushed into academia, they took me on and it did not work out.
I'd just like to say that the work you put into your videos and social media does not go unnoticed. As a young artist trying to improve on the "sell yourself" aspect of music, it's really inspiring to watch your Instagram shorts (for example) and not only get great musical ideas but also see someone who's gotten to the high level of video quality that you have. Editing is *hard*, and I really like how you do it. Thanks :)
NAHRE SOL! Your videos + ingenuity/ individuality always make my day. Please never stop doing what you love. 🧡🧡🧡
Thank you kindly! ☺️
Great video and great points - I absolutely believe that music schools will need to evolve to accommodate the market their students are entering into and I think we're at the beginning of that transition. I studied harp at RAM and while I got so much out of being there, I felt very much the same about what was missing as I think you do about your time studying - the narrow focus on core repertoire and orchestral experience doesn't reflect the broad range of professions that musicians go into after graduating and leaves us figuring out vital things like self promotion and recording for ourselves. I did get some time learning about practice methods, jazz and the folk origins of the harp, but really only tasters - it seemed more like you were expected to follow those things up by yourself, if you had the time, and the difficulty there is that it sends the message that those things aren't as important. I think that can be really confusing as a student if you already have a strong idea of where you're going and it isn't either becoming a soloist or joining an orchestra.
"How to make a living".....Honestly, a foundational education on that subject starting from grade school could be feasible. Then when you're in your more specialized education, maybe that "make a living" education can be more tailored to leverage your skills.
Honestly, I see a bunch of things on your list that apply to life in general: How to practice(learn). How to teach. How to improvise. How to walk away. Your videos are always insightful, and not always in obvious ways.
Thank you!!
Once again…I am no musician, but so many of these wishes apply to so many areas of specialization and to how aware we are of ourselves and of the reality we live in! So many life skills, so many skills we could be taught that would help us with insight into who we are as people as well as artists, musicians, actors, programmers…so much of the educations we receive is so narrowly focused! There are things we could be taught in high along these lines that would be SO helpful as we move forward with finding out who we each really are. This was an excellent video that once again transcends your specialty. Thanks.
Yep. I was lucky enough to understand that juggling the business and promotional aspects of being a musician were beyond me and I switched my focus to engineering mid-college. I admire musicians that can do it it takes to be a professional. Thanks for this video!!!!
Thank you so much for this content! It’s been so inspiring. Your channel is a rare gem in the vastness of the Internet.
I really appreciate you including that last point about pivoting. I started my undergrad as a mechanical engineering major, and pivoted to Music Education after a year. I stuck with that (graduated with an education degree, and I have a teaching license), but pivoted to a performance degree in euphonium for my master's. Now I'm looking at academics - the plan is to get a PhD in musicology and teach at the university level. And there have been countless smaller pivots besides those big three. (Also, I started my master's degree with three other euphonium players, and they have all pivoted as well. One dropped out and is getting paid to play on a cruise ship. The other two started out planning on auditioning for military bands, but one is now looking at music administration and the other is paving his own path writing electro/pop/euphonium music and whatnot. Pivoting is *normal* and *expected*.)
I love your videos so much and find that you are a great teacher! You break things down in a very logical manner and communicate very articulately
Thanks for continuing to do what you do!
Very, very enlightening video! Amazing advice Nahre!!!
Wonderful lessons in this piece, Nahre, thank you so much for sharing!
Yes Yes YESSSS!!!!! Awesome channel and wonderful insights :)))) Good luck Nahre :))))
OMG! This is so important to talk about! Thanks, I will definitely share with my students! I love your videos by the way 😘
I'm not a musician, but a historian, and I really can relate to all what you said. And this is one more example of your unique, enjoyable and fun style of educational videos. Wll never get tired of it.:)
Thank you so much!!
Your passion and enthusiasm permeate each and every video you post. As a late late entrant to the magical world of piano playing I find your input and advice inspirational and very helpful. Many thanks!
So well expressed and lots of great ponders for musicians at any stage of growth - appreciated!
I always appreciate your sincere honesty. You have so many good points about the reality we all face and I appreciate you speaking up about it. We all feel it sometimes and I wish more people would talk about it.
Thank you so much for your honesty and voice. So true, especially about the teaching guidance and improvisation. I'm a Jazz buff and middle school music teacher and love hearing your fresh concepts and perspective, especially from a classical musician. God bless and have a wonderful day - thanks for the content.
Your channel is practical but also visionary, thanks for your inspiration!
This is an extraordinarily helpful video. Thank you so much for your insight.
Nahre, this is such a wonderful video! Appreciate the idea of taking a more holistic approach to music education! Something I continue to be challenged by on a daily basis is what you explain about separating our "musician" self and our "manager" self!
I love your channel. Thank you for sharing your knowledge
♥️♥️♥️ Thank you. I didnt go to school, but I can relate 🙏🏼 this is suuuuper helpful. Thank you for being REALLLL
Great video, very thorough list! I’m glad that I got taught a wide variety of music in UCC (Ireland) including Javanese Gamelan, Jazz, Improvisation and lots of contemporary music there but a lot of your other comments really resonate with me. My daughter is now in college studying pop. Seems to be a great course too. Hopefully they’ll cover some of those other areas you mention too, to prepare the students for life after college.
Hi Nahre, very insightful video. Thank you. Could you please make another one on the choice of technology and gear? How do you make your choices, what worked and what did not?
Great and insightful video. This video is demonstrable of what you have managed to learn on your own. It was clear, concise and creative. As well as being an amazing musician you clearly have a gift for teaching. Keep up the great work.
OMW! These are such great insights. Hopefully some people in these musical institutions will take some of your points and bring about change.
Dear Nahre Sol👍I have watched you over a couple of years, playing in parks, shopping malls, etc. you have shared your journey and the highlight for me is this video. You have grown and learnt so much, I love all 7 parts of this it makes smile 😃 and makes me think of my own journeys (that we all end up on), there is hope for us all. Xxx Brilliant, so good thanks 🙏
Your ability to communicate is just as awesome as your playing! I enjoyed this!
If you wanna do what you love for a living; be yourself, yes the road will be tougher and the path won’t be as clear but you decide where you go.
If you want to make money faster, do what is needed and what is trending, be where the people are and give them what they want. You’ll make money faster but you will be led by others rather than your own thoughts.
I feel that the process of creating these videos contributes to developing your personality. You are appearing more and more selfconfident. Awesome.
Amazing! Thank you for these valuable insights!
It's so nice to listen to smart and empathetic people like you, thank you for your work on YT!
Thanks for your insight! Always inspiring. Can’t wait for your next video
Thank you!!
aways love to watch you :) so inspiring! from Thailand
Thank you so much for this video! I 100% agree and I have been thinking the same things! I was a piano performance major as well but have since pivoted to a commercial music degree because of the wider learning and career options. Performance degrees can sometimes feel limiting.
Nahre, you are a terrific teacher ! Thank you so much !
Thank you back!
I think your insights are incredible. Very real world and personal. Thank you for sharing in both of these videos. There is so much more to this field than most of us are even aware. Most of what we see are the very gifted who enjoy the pampering that comes with their discovery. As in most things in life, the strive for excellence reveals surprising facets to our expectations. I truly enjoy your proficiency and candor. Your warmth and honesty are welcoming. Again, thanks for sharing.
These are not just musical tips but more life lessons. I 100% agree with these, when applying them to music or to life. Combining your brain with real life productivity is the hardest part of life I still struggle with, and I am 30 years old - but managing. I think the biggest takeaway is to always learn something new while staying comfortably stressed - be it a new scale, video editing, how to record sounds and video and pay mindful attention to yourself. Thanks for always wanting to help and improve your viewers!
Thank you back!!!
This was a great video!!! 💛
Thank you. These are thing I wish my school had raised awareness about even way back in the 80's. Now my son is about to graduate high school and is planning a career in music. I value my music degree but I wish I had a business or marketing background in addition to all the music theory. I will be sharing this video with him. Keep up the great work and thanks for sharing your journey.
ah yes, the sequel i have been looking forward to! it feels good to know others (nahre, viewers) resonate on these points. for me as a pivoter who often wonders if it would’ve been easier to stay in music than starting completely anew (well, i do a flavor of music research, just not performance), i am always humbled watching friends in music hustle to put themselves out there just as much of this video is trying to help encourage. another observation from pivoting that i’ve had is how classical musicians are often so insulated from other musical studies like music tech, cognition, digital audio, recording technologies, etc… like i didn’t have many options in conservatory and no introduction. it kind of makes me feel like it hard for me to “prove” how invested i still am in music to some musician friends, despite being in music. wanting to have that performer membership while actively studying something else is part of my identity ive been grappling with post undergrad. anyhow, thankful for a thoughtful video as always! ^^
I went to the three of the best music schools in the country for a BM, MM, and PhD. I learned very little. Most of my growth and development came through work I did on my own. I had around 7-8 private piano teachers through the years and not one of them was able to teach technique to the degree that my playing was improved. I would have been much better off doing music on the side and studying a subject that was more practical. This was decades ago and I can only imagine that things have gotten worse. Sad. The one good thing out of all of this is that I use what I've learned on my own in my teaching and it provides, I believe, great value for my students.
Kudos to you for learning a lot on your own!
many so Called teachers are not virtuosos
Good you brought this up-I am a frustrated music school dropout and can't say enough negative things about music schools but especially academia in general. Of course, as I dropped out.
First off, the expectations about formal learning are so exorbitantly high paced. Can anyone who's gone through the standard 4 semester undergraduate theory and harmony classes, honestly say that you really learned, remembered all that was in those 4 semesters? Did you retain half of what was presented- which was most likely 1/2 of what was in the text book? But this is true everywhere in academia, look inside the book for two semesters of biology 101 and 102. 1200-page text book, a web site, labs and discussion groups. All inside of 28 weeks (leaving one week each semester for final exams. Oh, and time out for mid-terms and other tests? Completely unrealistic and overly ambitious which only engenders skepticism and cynicism.
There's too much pressure to merely dispose of the learning process, dissolve it down to a formulaic process where real learning is never given the chance or given the time or given the opportunity to take place. Get it over with as quick as you can because, oh, my gosh you have to get a job and be quick about it. Quick! Quick!
Learning should be a lifelong process not something relegated to four frantically flustered, floundering years in the life of a yearning-to-be-free adolescent, young adult.
Wow I thought our problem was not finding the right teacher. But turns out this is a common thing
omg Nahre thank you for this topic... I have either been through or had the exact same feelings and thoughts on what definitely lacked in my times of study at the music academy... I feel I have lost a lot of time really, engaging so much in piano practice but being absolutely clueless about what it meant to be out there after I finished school. I'm more than thirty now and trying to really pivot away from anything musical, burnt out and frustrated at the same time, or just willing to explore, but everything just feels really off. Anyways, thank you!
Absolutely on point. 20 years ago, I learned that teaching was a necessary skill set to playing music. Today, playing AND teaching AND creating content keeps me very busy and pays the mortgage. Keep up the fantastic content.
Very good points Nahre! One thing that I personally would add to your list would be dealing with performance anxiety. There’s so much great research now on performance psychology, and it was never mentioned when I was in music school.
Exactly! I’m a psychologist and cognitive neuroscientist in training and music schools and education circles often times ignore scientific advancement as far as I observe as well (with the exception of Berklee). One of my professors in psychology was specialized in this topic and I was surprised to see how much anxiety was prevalent especially among professional classical music performers. And I think this topic goes hand in hand with improvisation on and outside the stage. For all these reasons I personally think they should teach psychology as a preliminary material even before music, I stated it in my previous comment as well so I appreciate yours, too!
@@Bati_ Right on Batí!
Do you have any recommended books or other resources to deal with performance anxiety ? I’d love to Berkeley if I won the lottery!
@@elgrupocachedallas9685 I’d love to help you as much as I can, I’ll have some time next week to deep dive into this, would you want me to share it via email? If it’d be helpful for you, I’d like to share a list of resources and hopefully helpful material during my free time. P.S. I’m not an expert in this topic but I have some insights and background to navigate my way through it.
Great points. And I think these have to be covered in all kinds of elite art, sport, or any field that involves heavy training in a competitive atmosphere. Love this video so much, probably will come back to ruminate in near future
Good gosh you're amazing ! I've been learning classical guitar & piano, & aspire to setup a music school in the future, you brought up some crucial subjects that i'd like to incorporate for students beyond just repertoire ! Thank you !! ✨🙌😇
Hi Nahre, amazing video. I’m actually surprised that some of those things weren’t taught in music school… For people interested in venturing out towards this path, your points are massively valuable. Thanks for posting, your videos are great. The avocado 🥑 piano player character 👍🏻😁
Amazingly valuable video. Thanks so much 🙏 Would love if you can expand on the '4. Learn to record yourself'
Amazing video as usual. You are a genius.
Great video. Great reflections! How important it would be for music schools to take note of this.
Congrats and above all: thank you.
I think you could apply these same ideas to many situations. Certainly all true for my work as teacher and therapist.
I could add 'finding a team' to your list. Something I learned much too late was the importance of being proactive about finding a supportive team to work with: people with similar values and aspirations.
Having worked in academia for many years, I can say some of these things are common to many students. The ones who have lived off campus and held internships and relevant jobs get some of these skills, but everyone else seems like they're being prepared for more school. During the pandemic, I was missing live music at local places, so I wound up finding music communities on Twitch where the streamer actually can pull in a decent income. One of the streamers I follow gave up a pretty lucrative career in accounting to pursue music, I guess maybe it's more about the things you learn in life in general that can help you succeed. I have myself an opportunity while I'm transitioning to a second career to pursue music on a part time basis, and I'm going to make the most of it! Awesome video!
A lot of what you shared is important.
Thank you
TIMESTAMPS:
0:34 MUSIC'S WIDER CONTEXT:
History, other cultures/types of music, contemporary music of today.
2:02 HOW TO MAKE A LIVING IN MUSIC
3:40 CAREER SELF-MANAGEMENT
5:03 SOCIAL MEDIA TIPS:
1. Learn as you go
2. Don't be so self-conscious
3. Learn Video Editing
4. Learn how to record yourself (audio recording)
5. Try to be unique or useful conceptually
6. Choose a rhythm and format that is sustainable for you
7. Study what's working for others, and take notes.
5:27 HOW TO ACTUALLY TEACH MUSIC:
How to be a great/effective music teacher.
6:11 IMPROVISATION
6:52 HOW TO PRACTICE:
clarification/structure. Best/most efficient use of your time. Creativity.
7:29 PIVOTING:
Deciding/choosing the best music path/career for yourself;
or even whether a path/career in another field is a better choice for you.
Decision-making, transitioning.
Thank you for posting this very informative video! The part where you said about treating your "management" side and "creative" side really opened my mind a bit as lately the thought of organising and scheduling was taking a surprisingly large toll on more creative aspects of work where you're supposed to explore and have fun. I do often feel burnt out quite a lot after trying to rack my brain on what I need to do next and deadlines that are coming up which in tern continues a feed back loop resulting in the lack of sleep 😅😅. It would be nice to have a video exploring further into this to give more insight for people like me?
Keep up the good work!
Excellent video as always, Nahre. I only discovered you a few months ago, but your talent and great personality always shine through and your videos are always fun and interesting.
I thought of another topic that seemingly no one on social media, or in schools, ever talks about much: the nuts & bolts of how much money people actually make on CD sales, downloads, concerts, and other music professions (e.g., teachers, accompanists, etc.). Most of us have no idea. If we choose to study music at the university/conservatory level, it's pretty much all-consuming for four or five years and there simply isn't time to study/prepare for another career at the same time. I know a couple of people who've tried, and they failed because there aren't enough hours in the day to do both (and have a job to support yourself while in school). So if we choose music as something we want to be our profession, obviously we have to make a living at it after we graduate with our degree.
Prior to the advent of downloads in the early 2000s, and the resulting precipitous decline in album and CD sales, the standard music business model for performing musicians was to become good enough to get a record deal, then record albums, then tour to support those albums (not always, but usually), then make your living off of the money from record/CD sales that those tours generated (plus a little from T-shirts and other "merch"). Or you might become a studio musician or sideman and work with multiple artists and make a living that way. That's particularly true for the rock and jazz fields. But that business model has been dead for 20 years. I caught an interview with Michael Anthony, the original bass player for Van Halen, on TH-cam a few months ago. He commented that back in the day, successful artists with good contracts would get paid about a dollar per album sold. So if you were in Van Halen, for example, and your album went platinum, that's a million dollars divided four ways. Not a bad payday. But from what I've heard, nowadays most artists get a fraction of a cent per download, and unless you're Billie Eilish or one of the couple handfuls of other fortunate/lucky artists that happen to hit it big, how much can you actually earn and how can you make a living and pay the bills? While vinyl albums sales are on the upswing for the first time since the 90s, they still pale in comparison to downloads. And CD sales are only a fraction of what they were before the 2000s.
It's generally considered rude to ask people how much money they make, but as aspiring musicians (including me as a college piano performance major), we kind of need to have an idea of how much income we might be able to make so we can pay the bills once we graduate. And most of us want to make enough money to buy a home, maybe support a family, and start saving towards retirement and a rainy day. But all of those things seem like pipe dreams in the music industry these days. I think it would be interesting to hear from some music industry people, or artists willing to say how much they make, who would discuss just exactly how much income a musician can make off of downloads, CD/vinyl sales and concerts these days. And also, what the ballpark salary ranges are for the various vocations on your list of ways to make money as a musician. As it is, we're all focusing so much on learning and becoming good and we don't really have any idea what we're in for after we graduate. Unfortunately, passion and dreams don't pay the bills.
Very practical and down to earth thinking.. Thanx for sharing your thoughts.
You are an incredible person!!! Thanks for your ideas. God bless.
Thanks Nahre, you have covered very relevant topics in this video.
Nahre you are my music guru
내용도 좋지만, 영상 편집 실력도 정말 뛰어나세요!!! 어쩜 이렇게 다 잘하시는지!
thank you for making this video- I am a bit worried about applying to music school but you helped me ground my thoughts :)
Very good, and really well presented.
This is all very valuable!!! Grad school for English Composition and literature is similar to your description of your area in that it tends to be abstract and doesn’t show you how to teach. That’s something I had to learn by doing. In fact, as they say, the teacher gets more out of teaching than the students.
YES to all of this!!! I’m about 3 semesters away from graduating with my piano performance degree, and as much as I love it, it’s frustrating to me that we’re not learning these things that are so important to know as musicians! Going into music school I was actually hoping and expecting to learn improv in particular, but unfortunately all I’ve learned is that improv used to be important to classical musicians of the past, but we don’t learn it now for some unknown reason - like it’s a crime for classical musicians to learn anything relating to jazz or something🙃 Anyway, thank you for making this video! I hope to be able to figure things out eventually and help my future music students to learn these important skills that I wish would have been more accessible to me!
thank you, Nahre I believe you are a great teacher, and yes not everyone is cut out to be, just like many college professor's and music school instructors But I think you are really being proactive about helping us , Thank you for your honest and sharing about your experience that helps me personally !
Love your thoughts and agree wholeheartedly. Your observations are actually very relevant for education in general and educationists should really think about adding courses about life and making a living and the general skills and mindset that is necessary to do well "out there". Thanks!
Nahre, i love all of your vidéos!
I have a MM in piano performance and was lucky to pivot into a different field and use my focus and analytical skills in my new work. Unfortunately, my perfectionism developed as a musician has driven me in everything I do!
I still love classical music and infrequently play for myself because I was a weak sight-reader! Strangely, I now read better than whole in music school. Something about age, wisdom and letting go, but that’s another topic!
I absolutely love seeing your videos and learning something new, even though I’m now 72! Thank you so much for your passion!❤
BANG-on. Perhaps your best video to date. The academic springboard into life needs to be more resolved/refreshed by the institutions offering dated programs. (As someone who appreciates classical music among so many other genres, I often wonder why schools and media marginalise contemporary composers). In architecture school, I recall those with musical backgrounds using that language to inform their designs, much like others would use painting, literature, dance etc to inform their concepts and designs. Arch school did little to help us market ourselves towards our first 'gig'. Transitioning into a career (2:58 - lol) is also left to the individual and their struggles against peers with better opportunities (read: contacts). Lastly, I suspect you have amazing spatial & graphic (& teaching, charisma) skills that compliment your gifts in music and video-making - always a breath of fresh air - thanks NS!
I just want to say how very enjoyable your videos and your piano playing are. I've just recently discovered your channel and I'm hooked. I am what I call a hibernating musician because I used to be active in music, had a band, was writing songs, singing and DJing. And then life happened I was pulled away due to various reasons. And then, about 5 years ago, I came across a conscious dance practices such as 5 Rhythms or Ecstatic dance and it catapulted music back into my life. Now I'm experimenting a lot, recording new stuff, playing percussion in a community group, dance a lot and want to come back to piano that I used to play 20 years ago. That's how I found you. Thank you very much for the content you're creating.
Nahre, you are a brilliant communicator. I share your videos with my son who hopes to earn his living playing the trumpet.
Thank you for bringing all of these topics up. I'm a music theory professor and I do my best to bring in all of what you mentioned within my courses, so you just validated my efforts. Thank you! That said, we professors are under tremendous pressure to make sure our curriculum is meeting the Student Learning Outcomes and we just can't do it all, but we can do some. It's also a very long and difficult process to do a curriculum elevation. I know, because I'm doing that now. In my discipline of music theory, it is changing and we ARE addressing the topics you mention, but everyone of course, is different. Not all programs can focus on all of these topics or offer classes in all of the topics. The influence of folk and non-Western music is covered more deeply in ethnomusicology or musicology classes, it often gets a superficial gloss over in theory classes because that is not our focus. Keep in mind that many of the core curriculum music courses are taught by adjunct, non-tenured, contingent faculty who are sometimes teaching at multiple music schools. I agree with you that all of the topics you mentioned are essential, but receiving that training is going to be dependent on individual instructors based on their lived music career experience and what they can realistically add to their already heavy teaching loads.
You're so real and it's a such a gift to that gives insights and is thought provoking. I so relate that it would be nice to study more contemporary music, but I was luckly that my college required us to take an entrepreneurship course so we learned how to do business side for music and then I my private instructor was so practical as well as down to earth I was lucky to also learn how to manage oneself. So, it's be wondeful if all music schools made these experiences standard.
This video is AMAZING! The way you humanly and empatheticly approach the different subjects in music instead of just going "practice more" or take those "productivity only" gateways is admirable and appreciated. Being someone who struggles with the way music is thought and supposed to be understood, this really threw some light on the matter. I love how every video of yours is patiently thought out and you treat subjects in a comprehensive and also sort of "full circle" kind of way. I'm not usually touched by the musical TH-cam content, but the engagement and emotion you bring to them makes them very touching.
Just wanted to send a huge THANK YOU from Argentina, you are a true icon.
Thank you back!! I appreciate it…
Hey there Nahre !... You Are Fantastic thank you for the deep look into the other side Studying Music I appreciate you!!...
Totally agree with you! Thanks for being honest about these issues :) Greatings from Weimar!
Oh how i love the truth, very well done Nahre.
These are all great insights. Completely agree with you on your point that not all great pianists are great teachers. I’ve shuffled through a couple piano teachers in my childhood and it took a while before I found a teacher who really engaged me and introduced me to the music rather than just going straight into finding where middle C is.
Thank you!
I really like your directness in describing these things, although I have't attended any professional music schools I'm drawn to music as a huge interest and eventually hope to generate some $ from all the skills I've slowly been accumulating over many years and both of these videos you published resonate with me in many ways and so I found these 2 videos very insightful and helpful even to a non professional level musician but just someone who wants to know more about how its done.
Hi Nahre! Greetings from Indonesia! As a musician myself who has degree from music school, I agree with all your points!
It is a relieve that some of the points you mentioned are also what I am still figuring out. Hopefully, this video can be seen by as many musicians as it can be, so that we can support each other through.
I strongly agree with the point you said about how to teach music. Yes we learn about pedagogy and all of those stuff but sometimes I feel that it is too much focused on your instrument (piano, in my case) instead of, like you mentioned, the idea of music etc.
I think with your TH-cam channel you've amazingly maintained some of the things that you wish you'd learned. Exploration of different styles and interpretation as well as improvisation towards writing your own pieces.
A lot of the work based stuff and careers I think music schools should show you the basic concepts of. Especially with things like how to get grants and fill in forms to applications. This would help so much. Same with art schools teaching how to get funding etc.
Good video 👍☺️
Thank you!!
Will never forget the first presentation of a music education course in undergrad in which we had to present a trial lesson for an age group. We had no direction, just to do what we think would be appropriate for the level we chose. There were so many PowerPoints for classes that were supposed to be under elementary grade 3. There was one about note values for first grade that included all of these things about fractions. They were text heavy slides with no color that the kids would never have understood because in first grade, they wouldn’t have even gotten to multiplication and division, let alone fractions-if they’d even be able to have the attention span to focus on the slides in the first place. It really stood out to me as how little musicians understand how to teach (something that I at the time thought, considering we’ve been training for the majority of our lives, it should be something we’re used to, no?). There are natural pedagogues, for sure, but there needs to be a lot of training involved.
Which is where the program fell short. Honestly, I feel like music Ed courses should not be a major in itself, but supplementary to some kind of double major program in music and education so that music educators actually have the classroom experience and management/child development and psychology classes required of full fledged education majors. At least in the schools I went to, the actual education and being in the classroom part was not held to such a high importance as the ability to teach various instrument types or music specific things in music Ed programs which was… wild. And part of the reason why I didn’t end up pursuing music Ed in the end. My classroom experience in camps and music schools provided so much more experience and insight about teaching than any music Ed class about how to play saxophone or brass.
Very valid points IMO Nahre. And not only applicable to music school. I feel any educational institution that caters to students that when graduating end up in a more-or-less self-employed job should take notes from your video!