The Mas-222 (or any semi auto rifle in civilian caliber with a max 5 rounds magazine) was available on presentation of a valid identity card to anyone at least 18 years old. The french MAS-222 also has a longer barrel for legal reasons. Another thing about the markings : All MAS-223 were intended for the US market and have serial numbers starting with SA (Serie Amerique, American block) All MAS-222 were intended for the french market and have serial numbers starting with SF (Serie France, French block) All MAS-F1 not produced for the miltary have serial numbers starting with SP (Serie Particuliere, Special block)
Yes we in France once had almost the same Liberty as in the US… the government took us that liberty. Beware you Americans your gov will try hard to do the same.
@@Nooneimportant1299 still better than post commie polish laws maybe we dont have any restrictiosn considered barrel lengh or caliber but its so hard to get a permit only 0.7% of the population owns a firearm
@@ppmaks668 it dates back to the 1930s when it was feared that communists had stocks of military weapons and were planning a coup. Ammo was sold freely back then and it was thought that the ban would make such coup harder. The threat was even bigger in the early 50s and the ban remained jn place until a few years back
@@lst141 "the government took us that liberty." That's one way of putting it. Another way is you elected a government to take that liberty away because not enough people cared about those liberties and had other priorities. That is how they will try to do it in America as well.
@@kolosmenus yeah, we used to get yelled at if we called it a carrying handle on our M16s and heaven forbid you were dumb enough to actually carry the gun by it.
@@deejayimm All true. And? When have politics ever been about Ideas? New flash, that aren't and never were. Libertarians are like idealistic naive children, they vote on how they think things SHOULD be, not on how things are. You can keep dying on hills and tell everyone how virtuous and principled you are, but that is also why Libertarians will never have power to change anything. And that brings me to my next point. Power. Politics is about power, voting is about power, Do you trust this person with power? Yes or no. Thats really the only question a voter should ask. I could care less about "principles" in politics. They don't exist. And never have.
@@glandhound depends on the grenade. Some have a bullet trap and will safely be fired by a regular round but the ones we had had to be fired by a feuillette round that came in top of a tiny plastic magazine, packed with the grenade. We used to have some accuracy contest in my unit and we got pretty good at hitting a bucket at 80m
@@TexasSpectre there's a market for them. I would like to get one. The FAMAS is a good gun and it is not an AR so it's something different and some of us want something different. I am contrarian enough that I would like to see a rim fire 22 long version of the rifle. 22 long ammo is so easy to find and so cheap and good enough for varmints and target shooting which is my primary use anyway. Of course that's not going to happen because 22 long just doesn't have the power to work the action without heavy modification so I am fine with 223 or 222.
@@darrenskjoelsvold Not if it doesn’t take AR magazines, there isn’t. I’m aware that there are versions that do, but none of them are in today’s video and from what little I have read, they didn’t run well on STANAG magazines. Nobody wants to try to chase down weird BS French mags.
@@TexasSpectre you sound like someone who thinks that "if it doesn't take glock magazines it's crap" when it comes to pistols. Ubiquitous mags aren't always a good thing and presumably whoever brought the gun to market would also produce mags. Also if they were to produce a 22 long version they would have to completely redesign the mag anyway, but I digress.
Ian, a point you missed is: there are 2 different rifle grenade firing modes. The sight you show on the video is for high elevation (long range) shooting, with 2 different angles. This is used with the rifle on its side, with the butt resting on the ground. This is called "tir en cloche". You can also fire grenades from the shoulder, using the night sight as the rear sight, and the tip of the grenade as your front sight. This is used for low elevation, short range, typically against vehicles. This is called "tir tendu". The latter one, I must say, is quite an experience...
@@vincentkermorgant this was litterally a hazing habit for some instructors taking someone and not warining him for the risk of the recoil increase and the PGMP kicking in the face, leading to quite a lot of broken noses and eyebrow cuts. "and now you know why you have to handle it as tight as your girlfriends!" yaaay . But those grenades were VERY effectives in our deployments in Afghanistan. Not only this turned everyone into a light mortar operator, but also it was vastly more efficient to clean rooms than the underbarrel grenade launcher.
I was about to point that mistake on the rifle grenade sight. How glorious the time of "grenade à fusils tirs tendus hausse 100m base tourelle" on the Mourmellon, Suippe or Bitche shooting range 😅😅
Thought the MAS 223 looked pretty cool and that I'd check the price on them, a good AR-15 was a little over $1000 for me not that long ago so how much could they be, right? MAS 223s are currently in the $30,000+ range.
@@Broken_Yugo I'm not sure what transferrable M16s are going for right now, but I know there are many transferrable machine-guns for cheaper than that. $30,000 is what I would be expecting something like an MP 40 to be going for these days.
for the vertical "sight" you have 45 degrees setting and 74 degrees. you take the number on the barrel and multiple it by 20. (it goes to 16 when you push it down to the max) if 74 setting is use you just multiplie by 10. same with the direct sight you multiple by 10.
@@sashimanu its simple target at 80m on direct hit you chose 8 with the ring and then boom. if you wish to do a vertical launch you choose 45 degrees and 4.
@Catboomer you sir, I salute. You are the producer of a cultural icon. I cannot fathom a question to your methods, merely face in the general direction of your mother country and give thanks for your efforts.
@@crabmansteve6844 Stilton would like a word! Incidentally because of the controlled use of names, cheese made in Stilton cannot be called Stilton. Funny old World. And let's hear it for a really ripe Camembert that causes other dairy produce to flee from the fridge in terror. However, Cornish Cheddar is the best for toasting.
I'm lucky to have bought one of these in 1988. I wanted an AUG but couldn't find one. They had a barely used MAS223 for $900 and I bought it. I wonder if those night sights on the military version could be installed on civilian version.
You would probably be better off just finding a military one and installing it. Now, this might be horrendously expensive but you signed up for that when you bought a FAMAS.
We actually removed them all from military guns a few years ago for strange new tritium regulation laws, I assume you’ll have big difficulties to find any of those devices now. Maybe you can replicate it from pictures in CAD and 3D print or CNC cut them, would probably be wayyy cheaper than any existing piece anyway
I was in the Marine Corps for 15 years and did a lot of cross-training with other branches of service and other countries and when I was on a Mediterranean Cruise we'd trained with the French Foreign Legion and fired the Famas I liked it I was surprised it was a pretty sweet farm
It's actually a bit of a shame there's not more exchange between the NATO countries where they try out eachother's equipment and such. I knew a ton of people from many armies who were super curious about that but sometimes it feels like it's easier for a civilian to try out the different types than for someone actually wearing the uniform :D
@@LeutnantJoker If the actual users of the weapons could compare and contrast weapons in actual use, what would Boards of Ordnance (or whatever their equivalents are called) do with their copious spare time?
A civilian really need a bayonet, good thinking on their part to not cut corners in that absolutely essential part and instead to rework it to fit there.
@@762x51mm How dare do you forget the saucisson! I mean we can joke about many things, religion, politic, sex…. but let’s be serious when we talk about fundamental stuff……
@@arno222444 FINALLY someone who gets it. coming from someone who actually cut saucisson with a famas bayonet. twice. i keep it as a backup cooking utensil
Ok, I want you to run straight into a guy with 30 caliber and hope that the 3rd guy behind you will be close enough to kill the opponent with the bayonet
@@iatsd Even civie me knows that. It's the "where 6 feet deep in the crapper and sinking fast" indicator. Also do they even still make and issue canister?
@@iatsd just the thought of someone saying "fix bayonets, and advance until contact" is enough to send shivers down the spine! let alone to do it for real
I am 100% sure they had cámaras and security guards watching the filming and Ian coming and going from the compound because there is a net 0 chance he was not gonna try to make it out with atleast one of those inside his shirt if given the chance.
You should do an episode listing all of the "significant" production models of guns that exist only because of national government gun laws (e.g., the MAS .222).
Would be a total nonsense considering FAMAS stands for Fusil Automatique de la Manufacture d’Armes de StEtienne. It was also in commercial naming line with the PAMAS G1, their licensed 92FS Beretta handguns.
The weirder part is the muzzle device being larger to prevent rifle grenade usage. How many US civilians are gonna just find a French rifle grenade lying around? And how many of those happen to own a FAMAS clone?
@@thatonehumanoid7756 well NATO, France, and a bunch of other countries (including the former Jugoslavia) use the same specs for their rifle grenades. So US civilians have fairly ready access to launchers, rifles able to launch grenades, and the grenades themselves in non-explosive/inert form. I think the issue addressed by removing the feature from semi-auto FAMAS rifles would be much more restrictive countries, in Europe for example.
@@thatonehumanoid7756 you’d be surprised how many bizarre Soviet and European explosives are floating around the hills and deserts of the US. Countries I only know existed BECAUSE I found a rifle grenade made by them for sale from shady Jim at the flea market.
@J Jones Nations rise and fall and change with the times. In the early 90’s I wasn’t exactly an expert on failed soviet states. I’m sure your many volumes of literary works on archaic geographical nations and their production history will be a benefit to us all.
I remember the the the old, worn down example I got, gave me some nice burn marks on my right forearm when firing auto off sight or "hip firing", lol. I had big arms and my sergeant teased me and said that "Arnold" don't belong in the military.
Full auto is a marketing concept invented for by ammunition manufacturers to increase sales. It mostly benefits people who only hit their targets by accident. :-)*
The real issue was Bush 1's ban on imports in 1989. Congress messed up in 1994 on the AWB, but presidents have done a ton of damage, and by-passed Congress, with the flick of a pen.
@@devikwolf the GCA of 1968 did have the effect of creating the Ring of Fire companies in California, as well as banning imports of expensive Walther PPKs, and Russian PSMs.
As a french former NCO and an enthusiast sporting shooter I would be pleased to get a refurbish F1 Famas even in semi-auto castrated set up. But it's not possible. They will be rather scraped than refurbished to law abiding citizens. This is France.
Something that can add to the info here: The Chap on the Bloke on the Range channel has a great video where he builds a model of the fire control group and shows how it works.
17:15 so in order to make your civilian FAMAS look like the military one, you need buy a military FAMAS and put its furniture on your civilian FAMAS? Good idea, this way you have a military looking civilian FAMAS and a naked military FAMAS. Best of both worlds!
One of the weirdest guns I've ever owned was a winchester lever gun chambered in .307 win. Same deal 308 performance without being a "military caliber"
@@justindunlap1235 that's cool. I know about it from a book I have. Interesting and odd In a good way . It was a rimmed .308 case with a slightly lowered pressure ceiling for the locking system of a 94 . They wanted the hot selling.308 win in their most famous lever gun so they made an attempt ...they got .300 savage ballistics which were just fine . It has more punch than the .30-30 . But the flat nosed bullets still were limited range . Then we got the lever evolution ammo and they had a virtually identical cartridge . The .308 marlin express. It was what the .307 couldn't be , because of bullet design and propellant challenges. They still have the same pressure ceiling , but have high efficiency powders that give real velocity boosts without the pressure. It's cool how that works.
@@lasersharksushi1975 The MAS 223 sold like shit at the time because it was so expensive and nobody wanted one. MAS might've kept production going a bit longer if the ban hadn't happened but it still would've been a limited run and they'd still be expensive and hard to find today.
@@darrenskjoelsvold Reagan did the Hughes amendment. The republican party they ran created the first assault weapons ban in CA in the 80s, and Bush 1 used the vague terms in the 68 GCA to create an import AWB that is still in effect today. Bush 1, Reagan, and the Republicans laid the groundwork for the assault weapons ban. We just blame Clinton for putting the tiling on it.
I've definitely heard arbitrary gun laws before, but "222 ok, 223 banned" is about the dumbest thing I've ever heard - outside of California's "feature" bans, of course...
Which is why in 1992 they introduced licencing for the .222s as well. The EFD requires llcencing for any semi-auto rifle "which has the appearance of being a military weapon" and any centrefire semi-auto rifle with a detachable magazine or a fixed magazine that holds more than 2 rounds. After that, you could still buy a Mini-14 with a fixed 2-round magazine without a licence. In .222 But "without a licence" means you have to have a hunting licence, which requires an exam, or an FFTir licence, which also requires an exam. Anyway it was all scrapped a few years ago, the licencing makes more sense now, it uses the categories from the EFD.
For the french laws. Before 2012, we had 7 categories and before 1995 : -Semi-auto rifles with a « military caliber » were classified in the 1st category, so you had to ask for an authorization. Sport-shooting was a good reason to ask for an authorization. -Semi-auto rifles in a « civilian caliber » were classified in the 5th category, the « hunting rifle » category, a simple ID was required to buy them. That’s why some rifle were sold in .222r to avoid the 1st category. So the MAS223 => 1st cat but the MAS222 => 5th cat.. This system is no longer in force. Now all semi-auto are classified in B category and you need an authorization for sport-shooting.
Your existence in that comment section is yet another reminder that your country's VHS was the coolest replacement for the Famas, which should trump any other consideration.
@@Poirecorp VHS 2 is a nice rifle i agree with you! Also the Famas is a legendary/great rifle to! France and Croatia are brother countries! Grettings from Croatia! 🔴⚪🔵 ♥️ 🔵⚪🔴 !!
@@Poirecorp Yeah but you need to consider price per unit, with so many men to arm it's better to have a good rifle that is cheaper rather than a great one that is expensive, the expensive one would be used by special forcers
They were available in Canada? I had no idea... Now I have to find one. Edit: looks like they put in on the prohibited list...stupid Canadian government!
The French show the British how to design a bullpup service rifle. _Les Français montrent aux Britanniques comment concevoir un fusil de service bullpup, entre deux visites au bordel_
@@CenlaSelfDefenseConceptsI think it was more arrogant than fascinating. Made worse by the fact that the L85 is little more than an AR18 stuffed into a bit of bent tin and not a far more technically risky lever delayed blowback as the FAMAS was.
I got my hands on the FAMAS when I became a Legionnaire 2nd class when I joined the French Foreign Legion and went for basic training with the Fourth Foreign Regiment in Castelnaudery France in the early 80’s. Anyone?
I'd like SO MUCH if Ian could to show the Brazilian bullpup rifle LAPA FA-03. It was built ahead of its time and because this, it was refused by the Brazilian Army. Heard some rumors that there are some remaining somewhere.
France troops fire rifle grenades gangsta style. Bloke on the Range: French FAMAS bullpup with / without military buffer: th-cam.com/video/eMP5KUoEXZ4/w-d-xo.html
If I was gonna get one bullpup, it would be that one. Too iconic and cool. Aug is a close second. And the vhs is a shoe in since its basically a modern famas.
@@thepny_chasseur_de_tricera5361 it's obviously wishful thinking but maybe one day someone will pull a tommy built and start producing them themselves.
I like how Ian is constantly explaining that he will get to more detailed disassembly later in his videos. Like he can’t help that he needs to cover all the aspects of a firearm before getting to it.
is it ordinary practice to have a bayonet for the civillian market? (i can understand collectors wanting original bayonets for their rifles, but there can't be much of a market for bayonets, outside of military use..right? ) anyways, cheers for making your videos, find them really interesting :)
Most of the people willing to pay the big premium of the MAS 223 over any other semi in 223 likely were collectors wanting as close to mill spec as possible.
The trigger group assembly being non interchangeable and diffrent reminds me of when a ExGF changes her phone number so I can't get it anymore...... why they gotta do that to us?😢
What a beauty of an assault rifle , it was the first 556 I’ve ever shot back in 92. Absolutely fantastic . In bursts and full auto it just dump ammo at an eye glimpse , outstanding. Both this and the AUG are my favorites . Cheers IAN . Great Vid
When you mentioned that the rifle grenade assembly is the same as on the MAS-49/56, I realized that even though I *have* a MAS-49/56, I'd never noticed the range adjustments on the grenade stop.
Yes, I think that may a small mistake on Ian's part. Everywhere agrees with "assault" and then wikipedia has a small section where they use "automatic" for the Saint-Étienne factory.
Seems like you can just cut away some of the plastic fire control group housing to make it fit into the semi auto version... 🤔 But you'd also have to modify the receiver to fit an auto sear mechanism
No, it will not work. Components inside the trigger group are spaced differently and the Mas223 trigger bar will not reach the sear of the select fire group. The mas designers were not idiots
I was in the Legion, 80-85. My last assigned FAMAS was SN 21207. FAMAS does not stand for fusil AUTOMATIQUE (NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) MAS. It stands for fusil d'Assaut MAS. Stop saying that stupid shit! And we NEVER called it "le clarion." If that ever existed, it must be some stupid french regular shit.
I'm from the UK and know very little about guns. Why are there so many guns that look identical but under other company names? Is this not a patent issue at all or are all gun copies licensed from the originals manufacturer?
It depends honestly. Sometimes you get designs that are produced under license (this is common with military designs, especially pistols), sometimes a patent expires (like the AR-15) or simply isn’t recognized somewhere else (like the CZ 75 and it’s copies) and clones are made, sometimes a foreign design gets imported by different companies over time who rename it for marketing reasons (such as the HS 2000 being sold in the US under both that name and as the Springfield XD), and sometimes a company will change the name on their own design for marketing reasons (like how the Jericho series has gone through four or five names now).
How do you tell if a guy worships french guns? The mags were made to be disposable and were flimsy.. If you get any ( remember the flimsy mag) look after them they will server you will. There is Nooo french made gun lovin bias there🤷♂️🤣🤣🤣🤣
They're just so damned weird. I want at least two. Counter-Strike was where I first saw this gun nearly 20 years ago, and I thought it was a made-up video game gun ('what the heck is a Clarion?'). That bipod placement blew my mind, same as the WA-2000. I saw a UTG bipod that mounts the legs on either side rail, allowing the weapon to hang in similar fashion rather than perching atop the support. I think I've seen one other brand offering a similar set-up, and am surprised that or similar configuration isn't more popular, at least in some niche capacity like precision shooting/competition.
And I'm sitting here wondering if the 223 is actually chambered for 5.56 or they actually redesigned it to have a 223 chamber. Just idle speculation, as I can't afford one, anyway. Edit: also wondering what twist that barrel is.
I wish they have brought back the MAS 223 to civilian market at least here in Europe. Now with the real treat of a new full scale war in Europe it would be reassuring to be able to use MAS 223 as a civilian defence weapon in case of a war. This is one of the best rifles ever made in my opinion and its a shame they are simply gone. So, France - I shout once again: BRING BACK MAS 223 to the civilian market at least here in Europe.
Military caliber bans are the stupidest thing. There are so many cartridges for that could be so called “military”. And if I’m not mistaken, .223 isn’t military, I thought that was 5.56. There are differences between the two
"So if you are one of the lucky people to own something that less than 300 were imported, and then you also somehow acquire the body parts to the full-auto version that most likely only 2 or 3 exists in the US, you can install them right on to make a clone." :D He says that "it doesn't get you the barrel", which I'm assuming means that you can't swap them out? But it isn't directly said.
The Mas-222 (or any semi auto rifle in civilian caliber with a max 5 rounds magazine) was available on presentation of a valid identity card to anyone at least 18 years old. The french MAS-222 also has a longer barrel for legal reasons.
Another thing about the markings :
All MAS-223 were intended for the US market and have serial numbers starting with SA (Serie Amerique, American block)
All MAS-222 were intended for the french market and have serial numbers starting with SF (Serie France, French block)
All MAS-F1 not produced for the miltary have serial numbers starting with SP (Serie Particuliere, Special block)
military cals ban is such bullshit
Yes we in France once had almost the same Liberty as in the US… the government took us that liberty.
Beware you Americans your gov will try hard to do the same.
@@Nooneimportant1299 still better than post commie polish laws maybe we dont have any restrictiosn considered barrel lengh or caliber but its so hard to get a permit only 0.7% of the population owns a firearm
@@ppmaks668 it dates back to the 1930s when it was feared that communists had stocks of military weapons and were planning a coup. Ammo was sold freely back then and it was thought that the ban would make such coup harder. The threat was even bigger in the early 50s and the ban remained jn place until a few years back
@@lst141 "the government took us that liberty."
That's one way of putting it. Another way is you elected a government to take that liberty away because not enough people cared about those liberties and had other priorities. That is how they will try to do it in America as well.
The french government really needs to gift Ian a full auto FAMAS for his work on Chassepot to FAMAS
[ATF] Registry's closed. The moose outside should have told you.
If only the US government was that cool
69th like
FAMAS designer: I really like that carry handle on the M16. Enhance!
France to America: ours is bigger.
I think it's just supposed to be a cover for the charging handle, just as in the original design of M16.
"And that charging handle on the AR-10... Let's make it reciprocating!"
@@kolosmenus yeah, we used to get yelled at if we called it a carrying handle on our M16s and heaven forbid you were dumb enough to actually carry the gun by it.
@@rfswitch4530 Don't you dare to put that hand in there you degenerate.
"Civilians won't be using muzzle grenades..." To be determined.
They underestimated the American civilian market.
@@johndaniels1197 I'd say the idiot market, but I guess you've covered most of it lol
@@Thy_Boss sounds like you're part of the cowardly market
Indeed....I live in Alabama so I will not comment on that statement at this time.
@@Thy_Boss haha USA bad heckin updoot my doods!
Points to FAMAS-F1: "Cannot get"
Points to MAS-223: "Basically cannot get"
**Leaves**
@@deejayimm What?
@@Immafraid 👽
Points to a FAMAS Airsoft gun: Can get but want?
The channel name is Forgotten Weapons, did you know?
@@deejayimm All true. And? When have politics ever been about Ideas? New flash, that aren't and never were. Libertarians are like idealistic naive children, they vote on how they think things SHOULD be, not on how things are. You can keep dying on hills and tell everyone how virtuous and principled you are, but that is also why Libertarians will never have power to change anything. And that brings me to my next point. Power. Politics is about power, voting is about power, Do you trust this person with power? Yes or no. Thats really the only question a voter should ask. I could care less about "principles" in politics. They don't exist. And never have.
And here we have another 19 glorious minutes of Ian passionately francogasming 🤣
Damn. He really loves that rifle.
The only thing it was missing was La Marseillaise belting out for the entire video :)
And rightly so!
@Google Ghey if america did defeat France in both world wars then it is the worst case of friendly fire in history
LOL...
“Civilians aren’t going to be using rifle grenades”
Speak for yourself buddy
Also Saint-Étienne: Hey! You guys want a bayonet?!
I live in Alabama, the home of many inventive Bubbas....we will see....
@@glandhound You mean, the way they are intended to be shot ?
@@aznmarty256 Oui! S'il vous plait
@@glandhound depends on the grenade. Some have a bullet trap and will safely be fired by a regular round but the ones we had had to be fired by a feuillette round that came in top of a tiny plastic magazine, packed with the grenade. We used to have some accuracy contest in my unit and we got pretty good at hitting a bucket at 80m
Calling Brownell's, here's the next rifle worth reverse engineering. I'm sure Ian will loan you his for study.
No, no, it isn’t. Figuratively nobody will buy it.
@@TexasSpectre wrong
@@TexasSpectre there's a market for them. I would like to get one. The FAMAS is a good gun and it is not an AR so it's something different and some of us want something different.
I am contrarian enough that I would like to see a rim fire 22 long version of the rifle. 22 long ammo is so easy to find and so cheap and good enough for varmints and target shooting which is my primary use anyway.
Of course that's not going to happen because 22 long just doesn't have the power to work the action without heavy modification so I am fine with 223 or 222.
@@darrenskjoelsvold Not if it doesn’t take AR magazines, there isn’t. I’m aware that there are versions that do, but none of them are in today’s video and from what little I have read, they didn’t run well on STANAG magazines. Nobody wants to try to chase down weird BS French mags.
@@TexasSpectre you sound like someone who thinks that "if it doesn't take glock magazines it's crap" when it comes to pistols. Ubiquitous mags aren't always a good thing and presumably whoever brought the gun to market would also produce mags. Also if they were to produce a 22 long version they would have to completely redesign the mag anyway, but I digress.
Ian, a point you missed is: there are 2 different rifle grenade firing modes.
The sight you show on the video is for high elevation (long range) shooting, with 2 different angles. This is used with the rifle on its side, with the butt resting on the ground. This is called "tir en cloche".
You can also fire grenades from the shoulder, using the night sight as the rear sight, and the tip of the grenade as your front sight. This is used for low elevation, short range, typically against vehicles. This is called "tir tendu".
The latter one, I must say, is quite an experience...
yep, most of us ended up with the "famas kiss mark" on the forehead ;)
@@vincentkermorgant that is some romantic words lmao..
@@vincentkermorgant this was litterally a hazing habit for some instructors taking someone and not warining him for the risk of the recoil increase and the PGMP kicking in the face, leading to quite a lot of broken noses and eyebrow cuts. "and now you know why you have to handle it as tight as your girlfriends!" yaaay .
But those grenades were VERY effectives in our deployments in Afghanistan. Not only this turned everyone into a light mortar operator, but also it was vastly more efficient to clean rooms than the underbarrel grenade launcher.
I was about to point that mistake on the rifle grenade sight.
How glorious the time of "grenade à fusils tirs tendus hausse 100m base tourelle" on the Mourmellon, Suippe or Bitche shooting range 😅😅
Thought the MAS 223 looked pretty cool and that I'd check the price on them, a good AR-15 was a little over $1000 for me not that long ago so how much could they be, right?
MAS 223s are currently in the $30,000+ range.
Thanks, I was waiting for Ian to shatter my dreams but it had to be you instead!
Isn't that getting into transferable M16 territory?
@@Broken_Yugo I'm not sure what transferrable M16s are going for right now, but I know there are many transferrable machine-guns for cheaper than that. $30,000 is what I would be expecting something like an MP 40 to be going for these days.
@@_ArsNova how much did it cost to make a mp40… it is like IKEA furniture becoming an antique 😂
Thats what makes this gun so fkin rare
for the vertical "sight" you have 45 degrees setting and 74 degrees. you take the number on the barrel and multiple it by 20. (it goes to 16 when you push it down to the max) if 74 setting is use you just multiplie by 10. same with the direct sight you multiple by 10.
When you thought US/imperial unit system was weird but then you discover French numerals
I believe one of those two angle is forbidden depending on the type of conflict the french army is engaged in.
@@azertyuiop1234567611 yes the 74 is forbidden i was told in the army i don't recall why (for safety i presume)
@@sashimanu its simple target at 80m on direct hit you chose 8 with the ring and then boom. if you wish to do a vertical launch you choose 45 degrees and 4.
@@glandhound guess thats what they can do best. multiply
Can I just say here, that Roquefort absolutely deserves it’s title as the King of cheese, that stuff is unbelievably good. These guns look ok.
@Catboomer you sir, I salute. You are the producer of a cultural icon. I cannot fathom a question to your methods, merely face in the general direction of your mother country and give thanks for your efforts.
we like our cheese here in the south..
@Catboomer Roquefort is the best cheese in the world!
@Catboomer How do you tell the good mold apart from any random green crap?
@@crabmansteve6844 Stilton would like a word!
Incidentally because of the controlled use of names, cheese made in Stilton cannot be called Stilton. Funny old World.
And let's hear it for a really ripe Camembert that causes other dairy produce to flee from the fridge in terror. However, Cornish Cheddar is the best for toasting.
I'm lucky to have bought one of these in 1988. I wanted an AUG but couldn't find one. They had a barely used MAS223 for $900 and I bought it. I wonder if those night sights on the military version could be installed on civilian version.
Looks like that thing is worth about $25,000 on today's market. Not a bad investment.
You would probably be better off just finding a military one and installing it. Now, this might be horrendously expensive but you signed up for that when you bought a FAMAS.
Bloody good find! It's like the time an SVT-40 followed me home.
Damn, color me *very* jealous!!!
We actually removed them all from military guns a few years ago for strange new tritium regulation laws, I assume you’ll have big difficulties to find any of those devices now.
Maybe you can replicate it from pictures in CAD and 3D print or CNC cut them, would probably be wayyy cheaper than any existing piece anyway
I was in the Marine Corps for 15 years and did a lot of cross-training with other branches of service and other countries and when I was on a Mediterranean Cruise we'd trained with the French Foreign Legion and fired the Famas I liked it I was surprised it was a pretty sweet farm
It's actually a bit of a shame there's not more exchange between the NATO countries where they try out eachother's equipment and such. I knew a ton of people from many armies who were super curious about that but sometimes it feels like it's easier for a civilian to try out the different types than for someone actually wearing the uniform :D
@@LeutnantJoker If the actual users of the weapons could compare and contrast weapons in actual use, what would Boards of Ordnance (or whatever their equivalents are called) do with their copious spare time?
"Civilians don't use rifle grenades "
(Bloke and his carrots of doom have joined the chat)
Oh, an American war criminal!
I went the France with the US Army during some ceremonies and shot the Famas, about the only 3 round burst gun I felt I would actually use.
I love the tech talk: "all sorts of extra junk sitting in the back". It just sounds funny coming from Ian :)
Ian forgot about the several dozen F1 rifles the US Army bought for it's security forces on Shadow Moses Island.
what a thrill
"Hmm, they're armed with five-five-sixers and pineapples"
You haven't even taken the safety off, rookie.
Snake! Snake!
I understood that reference.
A civilian really need a bayonet, good thinking on their part to not cut corners in that absolutely essential part and instead to rework it to fit there.
All French products do require a cutting apparatus in order to cut cheese and bread.
@@762x51mm
How dare do you forget the saucisson! I mean we can joke about many things, religion, politic, sex…. but let’s be serious when we talk about fundamental stuff……
A FREE man isn't required to prove a need.
I think they're just looking ahead to capture the Zombie Apocalypse market.
@@arno222444 FINALLY someone who gets it. coming from someone who actually cut saucisson with a famas bayonet. twice. i keep it as a backup cooking utensil
Imagine you’re told to fix bayonets and you have to deal with that
th-cam.com/video/PAPox1A3F6U/w-d-xo.html
Watch this vid and you will know the answer, infantery assault requires a bayonet….
And WHY would a civilian need a bayonet 😱.. 🤔 it's for the 'Merikan market you idiot 🤦
Ok, I want you to run straight into a guy with 30 caliber and hope that the 3rd guy behind you will be close enough to kill the opponent with the bayonet
@@iatsd Even civie me knows that. It's the "where 6 feet deep in the crapper and sinking fast" indicator. Also do they even still make and issue canister?
@@iatsd just the thought of someone saying "fix bayonets, and advance until contact" is enough to send shivers down the spine! let alone to do it for real
I could have bought the semi-auto back in the late 80s. Could kick myself.
I've been in a similar state of regret, its just better to move on.
I am 100% sure they had cámaras and security guards watching the filming and Ian coming and going from the compound because there is a net 0 chance he was not gonna try to make it out with atleast one of those inside his shirt if given the chance.
A pair of FAMAS tucked down either pants leg
Is that a FAMAS in your pants, or are you just happy to see me?
You should do an episode listing all of the "significant" production models of guns that exist only because of national government gun laws (e.g., the MAS .222).
The semi only version should have been called the SAMAS.
Would be a total nonsense considering FAMAS stands for Fusil Automatique de la Manufacture d’Armes de StEtienne.
It was also in commercial naming line with the PAMAS G1, their licensed 92FS Beretta handguns.
Avaliable in canada *cries in prohibited* crazy to think that the semi is regulated the same way the full auto version is
"Civilians are not going to be using rifle grenades, right?"
Ummm, why the hell not?! I would love me some rifle grenades! :-P
The weirder part is the muzzle device being larger to prevent rifle grenade usage. How many US civilians are gonna just find a French rifle grenade lying around? And how many of those happen to own a FAMAS clone?
@@thatonehumanoid7756 well NATO, France, and a bunch of other countries (including the former Jugoslavia) use the same specs for their rifle grenades. So US civilians have fairly ready access to launchers, rifles able to launch grenades, and the grenades themselves in non-explosive/inert form. I think the issue addressed by removing the feature from semi-auto FAMAS rifles would be much more restrictive countries, in Europe for example.
We should have rifle grenades
@@thatonehumanoid7756 you’d be surprised how many bizarre Soviet and European explosives are floating around the hills and deserts of the US. Countries I only know existed BECAUSE I found a rifle grenade made by them for sale from shady Jim at the flea market.
@J Jones Nations rise and fall and change with the times. In the early 90’s I wasn’t exactly an expert on failed soviet states. I’m sure your many volumes of literary works on archaic geographical nations and their production history will be a benefit to us all.
We literally never fired our clarions on full auto except in basic at Castel.
Update...Blank ammo full auto at the farm. Checked my diary.
I smell burnt kepi
@@TheOdst219 Ancient kepi more like...A lifetime ago 😂🤣
I never fired the m4 in full auto or the m16 in 3 round burst.
I remember the the the old, worn down example I got, gave me some nice burn marks on my right forearm when firing auto off sight or "hip firing", lol. I had big arms and my sergeant teased me and said that "Arnold" don't belong in the military.
Full auto is a marketing concept invented for by ammunition manufacturers to increase sales. It mostly benefits people who only hit their targets by accident. :-)*
“about 300 went to America and Canada……and I want them all”
But civilians want rifle grenades stares longingly a Yugoslav SKS
The AWB really screwed us out of cool stuff
The real issue was Bush 1's ban on imports in 1989. Congress messed up in 1994 on the AWB, but presidents have done a ton of damage, and by-passed Congress, with the flick of a pen.
Reagan's ban and Bush 1's ban remain the biggest do-nothing restriction on US firearms imports.
@@devikwolf the GCA of 1968 did have the effect of creating the Ring of Fire companies in California, as well as banning imports of expensive Walther PPKs, and Russian PSMs.
because "cool stuff" is an idiot policy goal
As a french former NCO and an enthusiast sporting shooter I would be pleased to get a refurbish F1 Famas even in semi-auto castrated set up. But it's not possible. They will be rather scraped than refurbished to law abiding citizens. This is France.
don't forget: sold to terrorist groups in africa. hell, our ministers still have the invoices!
@@eddyguizonde401 not sold, given. They don't even know how to do business.
@@eddyguizonde401 only 1 or 2 country bought the Famas in Africa that will be impossible to find a famas in a terrorist group in Africa
Today I've learned the new term - "civilian bayonet"
Something that can add to the info here: The Chap on the Bloke on the Range channel has a great video where he builds a model of the fire control group and shows how it works.
17:15 so in order to make your civilian FAMAS look like the military one, you need buy a military FAMAS and put its furniture on your civilian FAMAS? Good idea, this way you have a military looking civilian FAMAS and a naked military FAMAS. Best of both worlds!
Sort of like the colt .222 rem. European export rifle.
One of the weirdest guns I've ever owned was a winchester lever gun chambered in .307 win. Same deal 308 performance without being a "military caliber"
@@justindunlap1235 that's cool. I know about it from a book I have. Interesting and odd In a good way . It was a rimmed .308 case with a slightly lowered pressure ceiling for the locking system of a 94 . They wanted the hot selling.308 win in their most famous lever gun so they made an attempt ...they got .300 savage ballistics which were just fine . It has more punch than the .30-30 . But the flat nosed bullets still were limited range . Then we got the lever evolution ammo and they had a virtually identical cartridge . The .308 marlin express. It was what the .307 couldn't be , because of bullet design and propellant challenges. They still have the same pressure ceiling , but have high efficiency powders that give real velocity boosts without the pressure. It's cool how that works.
Ruger also made a ton of .222 Remington Mini-14s.
Ian, you are doing nothing to convince me that I don't actually want a FAMAS.
Perhaps the French consider rifle grenades to be “military cartridges”?
We've done away with that "military caliber" nonsense (mostly), but grenades are still a big no-no.
Yes, in France: Grenade are in "catégorie A" ! This categorie reserved for military and police!
The FAMAS is a great gun. Too bad it's so expensive.
Blame Reagan and Bush
@@lasersharksushi1975 yeah Reagan did the assault weapons ban but what did Bush do? Or was it George 1 not George 2?
@@lasersharksushi1975 The MAS 223 sold like shit at the time because it was so expensive and nobody wanted one. MAS might've kept production going a bit longer if the ban hadn't happened but it still would've been a limited run and they'd still be expensive and hard to find today.
@@darrenskjoelsvold Reagan did the Hughes amendment. The republican party they ran created the first assault weapons ban in CA in the 80s, and Bush 1 used the vague terms in the 68 GCA to create an import AWB that is still in effect today. Bush 1, Reagan, and the Republicans laid the groundwork for the assault weapons ban. We just blame Clinton for putting the tiling on it.
@@katherinespezia4609 true. But there would likely be occasional civvie imports if it weren't for Bush 1 specifically.
I've definitely heard arbitrary gun laws before, but "222 ok, 223 banned" is about the dumbest thing I've ever heard - outside of California's "feature" bans, of course...
Which is why in 1992 they introduced licencing for the .222s as well. The EFD requires llcencing for any semi-auto rifle "which has the appearance of being a military weapon" and any centrefire semi-auto rifle with a detachable magazine or a fixed magazine that holds more than 2 rounds. After that, you could still buy a Mini-14 with a fixed 2-round magazine without a licence. In .222 But "without a licence" means you have to have a hunting licence, which requires an exam, or an FFTir licence, which also requires an exam. Anyway it was all scrapped a few years ago, the licencing makes more sense now, it uses the categories from the EFD.
@@steven-k. yeah, that sounds even more ridiculous but now at least I know where Bloomberg gets his "if you can't hit it in 3 rounds" rhetoric.
I knew their rifles were MAS but I never put two and two together to realize the FAMAS
“Fusil Automatique de la Manufacture d’Armes de Saint-Étienne” was a bit too long of a name :/
It has a bayonet?! Gotta love the French!
All infantry rifles have a bayonet. It is not an infantry rifle unless it has a bayonet.
The Famas needs a tommybuilt treatment.
After his recent experience with the Bunch of Assholes That Foul up Everything I don't think he's going to try building anything cool again
@@CenlaSelfDefenseConcepts Oh wow, I missed that whole story. That sucks.
The night sights were all pulled off the military versions in service, because someone decided it was too radioactive to use...
For the french laws.
Before 2012, we had 7 categories and before 1995 :
-Semi-auto rifles with a « military caliber » were classified in the 1st category, so you had to ask for an authorization. Sport-shooting was a good reason to ask for an authorization.
-Semi-auto rifles in a « civilian caliber » were classified in the 5th category, the « hunting rifle » category, a simple ID was required to buy them. That’s why some rifle were sold in .222r to avoid the 1st category.
So the MAS223 => 1st cat but the MAS222 => 5th cat..
This system is no longer in force. Now all semi-auto are classified in B category and you need an authorization for sport-shooting.
"Civilians not gonna use grenade launcher"
But we WOULD USE it :]
Civilian bayonet.....for reasons.
Respect to France from Croatia! 🇭🇷♥️🇫🇷
Your existence in that comment section is yet another reminder that your country's VHS was the coolest replacement for the Famas, which should trump any other consideration.
@@Poirecorp VHS 2 is a nice rifle i agree with you! Also the Famas is a legendary/great rifle to! France and Croatia are brother countries! Grettings from Croatia! 🔴⚪🔵 ♥️ 🔵⚪🔴 !!
@@Poirecorp Yeah but you need to consider price per unit, with so many men to arm it's better to have a good rifle that is cheaper rather than a great one that is expensive, the expensive one would be used by special forcers
@@motmot8879 Our military definitely has money for fake jobs and rigged deals, but not for the funny stuff.
They seek him here, they seek him there - but the french seek him everywhere.
Bloke on the Range also did a nerdy deep dive into the three round burst mechanism if you like that sort of thing.
C'mon Ian, do a mud test with it
The stated policy is they'll gladly mud test one, just not his personal gun.
The famas is just a timeless beauty.
I'm starting to think Ian likes French military firearms...
Good luck passing an IPSC safety course with one of those. “Your finger is in the trigger guard!” Lol
They were available in Canada? I had no idea... Now I have to find one.
Edit: looks like they put in on the prohibited list...stupid Canadian government!
I just looked at this ban list. Wtf CAN you have? Slingshots?
@@donovanchilton5817 Hopefully it won't come to that. We can a a few rifles like X95, Ar180 and other stuff.
Noooooooooooooooooo
An actual “civilian bayonet”. Who would have guessed.
"Civilian bayonet" is not a phrase I was expecting to hear today... or ever. But here we are.
8:34 I think it’s mainly because they don’t want civilians launching grenades into their neighbors house 🙃
seems to have worked very well... >_>
The gopher & woodchuck local 666 complained enough as well
Civilians should be equally armed as the military. That's why the second amendment exists
@@tristanhodgden4286 😂
@@jacobums4538 do you disagree
The French show the British how to design a bullpup service rifle.
_Les Français montrent aux Britanniques comment concevoir un fusil de service bullpup, entre deux visites au bordel_
Its fascinating that the L85 came after the FAMAS yet was such a boondoggle by comparison.
@@CenlaSelfDefenseConceptsI think it was more arrogant than fascinating. Made worse by the fact that the L85 is little more than an AR18 stuffed into a bit of bent tin and not a far more technically risky lever delayed blowback as the FAMAS was.
I had no idea the FAMAS had soooooo many features. Very low-tech solutions in a "simple-looking" package. Great video, thanks.
I got my hands on the FAMAS when I became a Legionnaire 2nd class when I joined the French Foreign Legion and went for basic training with the Fourth Foreign Regiment in Castelnaudery France in the early 80’s.
Anyone?
I hope you got respect and appreciation from the French people. From the USA thank you for your service.
I'd like SO MUCH if Ian could to show the Brazilian bullpup rifle LAPA FA-03.
It was built ahead of its time and because this, it was refused by the Brazilian Army. Heard some rumors that there are some remaining somewhere.
They really are the ugliest guns (Sorry Ian, but it's just my opinion) I've seen them in real life, in France, and they just look stoopid imo.
France troops fire rifle grenades gangsta style.
Bloke on the Range: French FAMAS bullpup with / without military buffer: th-cam.com/video/eMP5KUoEXZ4/w-d-xo.html
"Civilians won't be using rifle grenades, right........right?"
You should mention the chap has a great video on how that three round burst clockwork actually works.
the bipods on these things look like someone recycled a craftsman 1/2" ratchet
Finally, a knife with a grip safety
If I was gonna get one bullpup, it would be that one. Too iconic and cool. Aug is a close second. And the vhs is a shoe in since its basically a modern famas.
Well good luck that cost 25 000$ ~ 30 000$ today but if you have some relation with the president in France you can get one
@@thepny_chasseur_de_tricera5361 it's obviously wishful thinking but maybe one day someone will pull a tommy built and start producing them themselves.
Je ne connaissais pas la version civile MAS, vidéo extrêmement intéressante!
I like how Ian is constantly explaining that he will get to more detailed disassembly later in his videos. Like he can’t help that he needs to cover all the aspects of a firearm before getting to it.
is it ordinary practice to have a bayonet for the civillian market? (i can understand collectors wanting original bayonets for their rifles, but there can't be much of a market for bayonets, outside of military use..right? ) anyways, cheers for making your videos, find them really interesting :)
You never done à bayonet charge on paper target ?
Most of the people willing to pay the big premium of the MAS 223 over any other semi in 223 likely were collectors wanting as close to mill spec as possible.
If I recall correctly, the bayonet was only for the USA, the french MAS-222 could not mount one - it was illegal at the time
"civilians are not going to fire rifle grenades" -- tell that to Dale on the bloke on the range channel...
*patiently waiting for somebody, anybody, to start offering FAMAS parts kits*
The trigger group assembly being non interchangeable and diffrent reminds me of when a ExGF changes her phone number so I can't get it anymore...... why they gotta do that to us?😢
Yikes
Will Ian ever get his hands on a STG-940...
What a beauty of an assault rifle , it was the first 556 I’ve ever shot back in 92. Absolutely fantastic . In bursts and full auto it just dump ammo at an eye glimpse , outstanding. Both this and the AUG are my favorites . Cheers IAN . Great Vid
Any chance you could upload in 4K?
When you mentioned that the rifle grenade assembly is the same as on the MAS-49/56, I realized that even though I *have* a MAS-49/56, I'd never noticed the range adjustments on the grenade stop.
Was he trying to make them mate at the start in the hope of getting another one ?
This calls for a mud test.
😈
Thomas Edison was a jerk as well
I heard that the famas f1 takes a different cartridge than the regular 5.56 nato and has a fluted chamber
They are essentially steel cased, 55 grain 5.56
Top tail is very distracting. Makes it look bigger than it is.
4:40 Wouldn't the FA in FA-MAS stand for Fusil d'assaut, Assault rifle instead ? Maybe a little confusion inherited from the FAL :P
Nope. Fusil Automatique
Yes, I think that may a small mistake on Ian's part. Everywhere agrees with "assault" and then wikipedia has a small section where they use "automatic" for the Saint-Étienne
factory.
Which I think may be a mistake in Wikipedia. Still, I wouldn't bet any money on it. Ian is the expert on this sort of thing, relatively.
There are records, of both versions in various french documentation and literature.
Ian made a mistake. FA stand for Fusil d'Assaut, not Fusil Automatique.
www.defense.gouv.fr/terre/equipements/armement/famas
Seems like you can just cut away some of the plastic fire control group housing to make it fit into the semi auto version... 🤔
But you'd also have to modify the receiver to fit an auto sear mechanism
No, it will not work. Components inside the trigger group are spaced differently and the Mas223 trigger bar will not reach the sear of the select fire group. The mas designers were not idiots
@@vincentkermorgant okay thanks for the update 👌
Feel like Ian should be playing a snoopy happy dance video - TWO French Famas rifles to review at the same time!
I was in the Legion, 80-85. My last assigned FAMAS was SN 21207. FAMAS does not stand for fusil AUTOMATIQUE (NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) MAS. It stands for fusil d'Assaut MAS. Stop saying that stupid shit! And we NEVER called it "le clarion." If that ever existed, it must be some stupid french regular shit.
It's always great to see an F-1, even it's just the civilian version.
A hawe one Famas...from 1995 years.From Bosnia...Nice guns.Hello from Serbia
I'm from the UK and know very little about guns. Why are there so many guns that look identical but under other company names? Is this not a patent issue at all or are all gun copies licensed from the originals manufacturer?
It depends honestly. Sometimes you get designs that are produced under license (this is common with military designs, especially pistols), sometimes a patent expires (like the AR-15) or simply isn’t recognized somewhere else (like the CZ 75 and it’s copies) and clones are made, sometimes a foreign design gets imported by different companies over time who rename it for marketing reasons (such as the HS 2000 being sold in the US under both that name and as the Springfield XD), and sometimes a company will change the name on their own design for marketing reasons (like how the Jericho series has gone through four or five names now).
@@AscrodGreytagg Thank you for such a detailed response I could never understand why now it makes sense! Thank you!
1 person is salty cause they don't have one.
1:26 well except for the FOXHOUND Special Forces Unit stationed on Shadow Moses Island near Alaska of course...
How has nobody made clones of this in the US
This. I would totally buy the Famas over, say, the Tavor.
How do you tell if a guy worships french guns?
The mags were made to be disposable and were flimsy..
If you get any ( remember the flimsy mag) look after them they will server you will.
There is Nooo french made gun lovin bias there🤷♂️🤣🤣🤣🤣
They're just so damned weird. I want at least two.
Counter-Strike was where I first saw this gun nearly 20 years ago, and I thought it was a made-up video game gun ('what the heck is a Clarion?'). That bipod placement blew my mind, same as the WA-2000. I saw a UTG bipod that mounts the legs on either side rail, allowing the weapon to hang in similar fashion rather than perching atop the support. I think I've seen one other brand offering a similar set-up, and am surprised that or similar configuration isn't more popular, at least in some niche capacity like precision shooting/competition.
And I'm sitting here wondering if the 223 is actually chambered for 5.56 or they actually redesigned it to have a 223 chamber. Just idle speculation, as I can't afford one, anyway.
Edit: also wondering what twist that barrel is.
I wish they have brought back the MAS 223 to civilian market at least here in Europe. Now with the real treat of a new full scale war in Europe it would be reassuring to be able to use MAS 223 as a civilian defence weapon in case of a war. This is one of the best rifles ever made in my opinion and its a shame they are simply gone. So, France - I shout once again: BRING BACK MAS 223 to the civilian market at least here in Europe.
Military caliber bans are the stupidest thing. There are so many cartridges for that could be so called “military”. And if I’m not mistaken, .223 isn’t military, I thought that was 5.56. There are differences between the two
isnt the "FA" in FAMAS "Fusil d"Assaut" rather than "Fusil Automatique"? which would actually mean assault rifle rather than automatic rifle
"So if you are one of the lucky people to own something that less than 300 were imported, and then you also somehow acquire the body parts to the full-auto version that most likely only 2 or 3 exists in the US, you can install them right on to make a clone." :D
He says that "it doesn't get you the barrel", which I'm assuming means that you can't swap them out? But it isn't directly said.
I have a 223 FAMAS in serial 3XX, so more than that were manufactured!
I have a militay style FAMAS F1, but it has no rear sight elevation mechanism. Anyone has a clue why that would be?
Isn't FA in FAMAS an indication of its full auto capability? So full auto FAMAS, as in video title, would be full auto full auto MAS (223)?