The LEGO Ideas copycat conundrum
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ส.ค. 2024
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The designer behind the rejected LEGO Ideas Snow White project says he feels ‘let down’ by the LEGO Group as 43242 Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs’ Cottage arrives on shelves.
Harry Finkel’s LEGO Ideas Snow White project originally reached the second 2019 review, but was rejected at the first time of asking. He then redesigned and resubmitted his pitch for a large-scale cottage inspired by the 1937 Disney animated movie, which racked up 10,000 votes in time to progress to the first 2021 review.
Alongside the results of that review, the LEGO Group announced in October 2021 that it was still considering whether or not to greenlight Harry’s Snow White project. “We’re still looking into the possibility of releasing a set based on the Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs project,” the Ideas team wrote on the project page. “Once we have a decision, we’ll share it with you here and on the LEGO Ideas blog.”
Five months later, the LEGO Group revealed that it had made a decision - and it was bad news for Harry. “Our team has thoroughly considered the possibility of releasing this project as a LEGO set according to the criteria of the LEGO Review,” the Ideas team said. “Unfortunately, the LEGO Review Board has decided that we will not produce this project as a set.”
Fast forward to February 2024, or almost exactly two years to the day since the LEGO Group rejected Harry’s submission, and the company pulled back the curtain on 43242 Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs’ Cottage. Released under the LEGO Disney banner - independently of LEGO Ideas - the final build bears a pretty strong resemblance to Harry’s original pitch (perhaps inevitably, given they share the same source material).
“I feel let down by the LEGO Group,” Harry tells Brick Fanatics. “I’ve been a lifelong fan and having an Ideas set make it all the way has been a dream for me, as it is for many fans out there. There was clearly interest from TLG to make the set as it ‘required further review’, and we were told there were ‘a few boxes left to tick’.
“They then rejected it saying they would not produce the project as a set, and now their own version of the set is released within the timeframe that could’ve been expected for the Ideas project. I assume this wasn’t a case of the LEGO Group already working on the set as it would’ve been rejected in the review stage. I understand there are many factors involved, but this has been disheartening.”
Brick Fanatics reached out to the LEGO Group for further comment more than two weeks ago, but the company has yet to respond.
If LEGO did this with a non-IP Idea submission that would be issue.
They have
The Lego Creator Astronaut is very similar to one made by Legotruman on Lego Ideas that reached 10,000
@@BrickHQThere's also the new garbage truck mechanism that's very similar to an ideas design
@@piotr78 That one's a little more understandable, because LEGO themselves made many Technic sets with that exact same mechanism as far back as the 80s. It's nothing new, in fact it's a very common way of making a simple grabber arm, which if you are making a garbage truck set, would make sense to include. LEGO's garbage truck set is also licensed, from a manufacturer they've made a licensed truck set (with a garbage truck alternate model, no less) before. It could very well be another case of them developing something similar at the same time the Ideas project was submitted.
When you submit an IDEAS project to Lego don't they have a disclaimer that you loose the rights to the design, or that if your set is not selected now that they may use it in the future?
Yes they do!
Indeed they do, one of many disclaimers.
Why wouldn’t lego do it? You are fully aware when you submit an ideas project it’s no longer your design. Lego is simply outsourcing new projects for 0 cost to them.
Just for the record, the final build and the Ideas build are both exact copies of how the cottage looks in the cartoon and other pictures. Just Google it. So they might have stolen the idea but not the looks of the build
If anything the person who submitted the idea stole the idea. They know that lego already owned the license to the IP.
Well honestly, recreating an existing IP should hardly be called a Lego Idea in the first place... Even perfectly created, the idea was someone elses, in the case of Snow White even decades ago.
I agree. I think people can't really accuse Lego of stealing an idea that's just a recreation of something that already exists. It would suck to put all that effort into an idea and have this happen, but that's always a possibility. And when you look at the ideas program, you even see different idea submissions of the same idea that look almost identical. And some that are obvious copies with just a few changes.
Agreed as well. Snow White is one of Disney's all time classics and most venerable and respected movies that was hand crafted using intricate animation techniques. Making a mere Lego set doesn't even come close to having some kind of ownership or right to be part of it. Kids have likely tried to make Snow White cottage out of Lego for decades, it's hardly even that original of an idea, most MOC designers could come up with a good design based on the movie designers' hard work and expertise. Disney and Lego are smart to keep it to themselves, I'd do the same. No need to involve or reward random outsiders who barely created anything anyway.
@@azure1259 exactly. The main reason the set got 10k votes is down to what it is based on/from as opposed to the actual set design. If anything I guess it told lego that there is demand for a set based on Snow White.
Honestly, Lego should stop accepting existing IPs in the Ideas program. Solves any issues in the future.
What does IP mean? Sorry for the stupid question but with all the abbreviations sometimes I really get lost... And googling does not help when the abbreviation is so clearly used in another famous way... 😅
Intellectual property, it means things like Lego Hocus Pocus, Polaroid, the first Minecraft sets, Lego ideas Winnie the Pooh and obviously more wouldn't exist, which doesn't make any sense at all, and Lego has done things like these even with not known IP sets
I suspect Disney license has something to do with this. The Snow white movie is coming out soon and Disney and LEGO have an agreement so that LEGO produces sets using their IP. However, I am not sure that had this been an IDEA set, Disney would have been happy since they may not get a cent from its sales. Instead, by asking LEGO to not accept it so that they could produce a similar set but not pay a creator, they would cash in part of the money. A single individual has almost no power against a corporation. Also, LEGO or Disney will never admit doing this, for obvious image reason. My two cents.
Agreed. Disney would not want to give any cut of the profits for any Disney Lego Ideas sets to some rando fan designer. Disney wants 100% control over their own IP so I'm not surprised Lego and Disney would do this. Any corporation that has a profitable IP wanting to collaborate with Lego can't really be faulted for doing this since it is their IP.
Perhaps, but the Hocus Pocus Cottage is based on a Disney live-action film.
@@GregOrCreg I think that Disney views their Disney Princess movies and even Pixar movies differently than other movies that they own. I feel like they want to make sure they have full control over those because they are basically the foundation of Disney.
@@amyjones25 I think you're right, although I do sometimes question their judgement. I'm not one of those 'anti-woke' people, but the standards of the live-action remakes and the thought behind them have not always been steller.
This doesn't make any sense since we have had a Lego Ideas sets of Winnie the Pooh, Hocus Pocus and we are going to get one of The Nightmare before Christmas
Finished products from IPs are always going to look similar and it’s always a risk. Now, if the building techniques are similar, that’s another issue.
So if I break it down, they drop the creator and then say it was secretly in development? This malpractice must be widespread in huge businesses in general not just with Lego.
To be fair the Lego Ideas small print does pretty much say that as soon as you submit an idea, it's no longer yours and they can do what they like with it regardless of whether it gets voted in or not. Eh. It is what it is.
LEGO ideas/ bricklink should stay away from IP content. Which will promote more creative content. There looks to be some rip offs to me, but because its 2 designers modeling the same buildings from a source material makes a case they are not... I think something like this can happen to castle remakes as well since I see an awesome remake of the wolfpack hideout but that is a set LEGO should remake.... and people designing castle sets should be making unique things.
It must suck to get declined and have a similar thing come later. But the builders didn’t invent Snow White or Jurassic park, they took existing popular media and made them out of Lego. A bigger problem would be Lego denying an idea like the insect collection or space age tales then making it themselves as those are much more unique ideas compared to a setting from existing popular media
Yea the main reason the idea submissions got so far in the first place was because they are based on popular IPs.
I'm just happy that we got a Snow White Lego set. 😃
But, I understand that the ideas set creator is frustrated.
Lego needs to do a better job at picking Ideas submissions that people actually want!
Please! No more red telephone booths!
What’s wrong with the Red London Telephone Box?
Okay, it would helpful to explain why the red telephone box isn't a viable idea.
You realize that the red telephone box making it to the review phase means at least 10,000 people said "I want this," right?
You cannot argue nobody wants it, there is documented proof at least 10,000 people want it.
There's technically one other one that you forgot to mention, 42167 Mack LR Electric Garbage Truck. I believe a year or two ago somebody submitted a set to Lego Ideas that reached 10k supporters that was a garbage truck that could simultaneously grab and lift a trash can, and then dump it's contents in the back of the truck. That Idea got rejected, but then earlier this year we received this new set that does the exact same thing. The only difference though is that this Lego one is licensed and is built from technic, while the idea's one wasn't licensed and was built using mostly system bricks.
I feel like the idea is generic enough with this one that it could have been a coincidence.
Lego could have been already working on it hence why they rejected the ideas one.
The development process of new LEGO sets generally takes about 5 years, and that's after the conceptual phase or any discussions of what new sets to create. The Mack electric garbage truck set could EASILY have been in development or approved for development long before the Ideas project was submitted.
If it's from an existing IP then there's no issue at all. If it was an original design however then it's messed up.
It seems sus but LEGO likely does have tens of thousands of semi finished designs floating around and they choose to strike when they see it gain traction. Sketchy for sure, but understandable givens the terms agreement. Perhaps they should just stop doing licensed ideas sets.
The trouble for ideas sets is when they are based around IPs that Lego already own the rights too like in the case of the Snow White Cottage. Of course the submission was going to be very popular.
It’s a tricky one and to be honest, I’ve accepted LEGO’s reasoning for all the others, but the Snow White cottage feels way off.
And even if it truly was a coincidence, a LEGO Ideas winner only gets 1% of the profits (not the retail price, the profits)... surely they could easily afford to appear generous, both from a financial and a PR POV.
I mean it's based off the same movie location.
@@logansmith2703true, but it was in the Ideas review stage for a very long time (twice as long as normal). They then turned it down and created a very similar looking model... what's 1% of the profits for the richest most successful toy maker in the world?
Nothing like stealing to make a profit ! 😂
I figured the set being rejected was because it was during the time about the controversy over dwarves in the movie. It could also be that at the end Disney decided that they didn't want a set being made since they already have a partnership with Lego and didn't want to split the profits especially since it involves one of the Disney Princesses and their really protective over the profits of that line. With other Disney owned movies that have been turned into Lego Idea sets, it's only more niche or cult favorite movies. At this point I think people who submit ideas based on Disney movies have to be prepared for this to happen.
The most toxic version of this problem exists, predictably and unsurprisingly, in Hollywood. Hollywood constantly adapts pre-existing bodies of work (like The Lord of The Rings, or Narnia), but refuses to accept advice, consultation, criticism, or help from those who best understand and appreciate the original IP. Amazon could have easily hired a Tolkien scholar and a LOTR superfan, have them sign NDAs, and get their feedback on the scripts. But noooo; the people who hate these IPs are clearly the best qualified to adapt them! 😢
if something is already in development that the Idea applicant can't be aware of and it reaches 10 000 support, TLG just should give a temporary honorary Lego Designer position for the person who submitted the idea. The designers could compare ideas how to bring the idea to life, that way there would be proof that both the official team and the Idea submitter have already somewhat worked out models. And even if its not released as an ideas set the designer could still be mentioned on the instructions.
No because the applicant knew that they submitted an idea based around a popular IP that Lego already had the rights for. This isn’t the first time and won’t be the last time that basing a set on a popular IP will be similar to what Lego is already making.
Don't forget the UP House. As much as I'm happy to see it and the Snow White cottage as official sets, my heart aches for the fan designers who were very clearly ripped off.
The designers weren’t ripped off though. When your submission is based on a popular IP such as the Snow Whites cottage chances are if Lego were working on their own version you are going to get very similar ideas because it’s based on the exact same source material.
I remember the Lego group making the statement in one of the ideas review stage videos that they were unable to get a response from the person who submitted the snow white cottage. Since they couldn't get a response, the Lego group decided to make their own cottage.
LEGO have a habit of copying other people’s designs. Their very first plastic brick was an absolute rip-off of the patented design by Hilary Page. The Duplo brick too was based on Page’s Large Brick… Déjà vu! You think?
And just for the record... Disney stole the idea from German storytellers... As they did with all their fairytales
Both sets are based on Disney snow white. So I do see the issue regards this set.
There are many cases of this happening
The Lego Creator Astronaut is very similar to one made by Legotruman on Lego Ideas that reached 10,000
So is that why LEGO says even if they don’t make your Ideas model that they own the exclusive rights to your design for what is it 5 years? Hmmmmmmmm! Sounds like LEGO being LEGO!
It’s not the first time TLG have done this- steal an Ideas set design idea. And won’t be the last! Worst one I can think of is the Ghostbusters Firehouse!
I wouldn’t exactly call it stealing an idea when 2 different people are making sets based on very popular IPs and happen to come up with a very similar design.