Such wicked humor. 😅 Halfway through and really loving this. Also, don't see how you can argue against it. Another excellent guest and interview. Thank you.
Just Great. And understanding this isn't just about debunking Bible literalists like two Great Richards (Dawkins and Carrier try to do) but with Big implications for development of our Civilization! You know what I mean? th-cam.com/video/jXYH9xdrhGU/w-d-xo.html Great Book. I'm the subject aficionado but still wonderfully collected facts in one lecture.
Just got this watched, interesting as always. What I felt was unique was how Abby tackled the discussion of evolution from a political perspective. I don't want my next comments to be taken as a criticism but more a personal perspective and point of discussion. I haven't looked deeply into some of these issues to my logic may have flaws. There is a great deal of weight behind many of our immune issues stemming from medical interventions that are verboten from discussing on TH-cam. Also stemming from processed foods and poor nutrition. This is more behaviour than biology. We had personal experience with sheep, where there was a blast of snow just before lambing. We fed using concentrated foods because of the snow on the ground, overfeeding of certain, but not all necessary nutrients. This led to lambs that were larger than normal despite the weather conditions. Although I do understand the hip issue, has our abundance of food made babies bigger in only a few hundred years outpaced our evolutionary adaptions. Surgical medical interventions saves lives but they also allow weaker genes to be passed on instead of being removed. Finally, regarding the oesophagus / vocal cords issue. We were taught that the reason we can make complex sounds is also the issue with choking. I think the benefits outweigh the cost, this wasn't addressed. It's all about balance for me rather than an all positive or all negative presentation. Again not a criticism of the interview or guest. Love the show.
I'll be honest I haven't watched this yet but I will after work. No matter which era or subject you are dealing with, whether you are going in-depth or covering a topic more generally, you always have interesting interviews. Well structured discussions where the guest can put across their knowledge. What I like most is how comfortable these are to watch, guests who are generous and enthusiastic. Some presentations from other channels can sometimes err towards a more clinical approach but you have great chemistry with your guests. A real joy to watch.
As for corrective eyeware: I've been myopic most of my life, it started when I learned to read at the ripe age of 4 (my mother says 3, but that's just a mother bragging). I love books. But I've managed to get it better. I saved the perscriptions for my glasses since 2010. from -4.5 down to -1.5 in 2021 (my left eye -3.5 to -1.0)! And now I don't use glasses, to finish it all. It's not evolution, but it's something anyone can do (if you are myopic that is).
As I understand it, nearsighted people grow through a period that they may not need glasses anymore, and I think it's because the of the natural tendency to need longer arms to read as we grow older. I used to grind lenses in an Optical lab and learned a little about it. Many people can read small print when they are young, and they can read up close, and we start to need magnification in our later years, but nearsighted people usually need minus lenses when young, and grow out of it, and start to need plus lenses later than some others. I'm stubborn, and I really do need readers, in a +1.5 or so.
I love it. I've often thought of a few others. But of course it's a treasure to get a well researched book by an expert in the field. rather than a random guy's opinion
Just Great. And understanding this isn't just about debunking Bible literalists like two Great Richards (Dawkins and Carrier try to do) but with Big implications for development of our Civilization! You know what I mean? th-cam.com/video/jXYH9xdrhGU/w-d-xo.html Great Book. I'm the subject aficionado but still wonderfully collected facts in one lecture.
Great video. It would however be helpful if when discussing the various designs, she were more specific about taxonomy, i.e. It's not just Humans with "backwards wiring" in the eyes, it's all vertebrates, and I think it's even all deuterostomes, but I could be wrong about that.
an amusing side-car to studying at Balliol was having the input of philosophers about cosmology, animal behaviour and so on. i remember a philosopher who gave a talk arguing that animals couldn't think. i thought that was anthropocnetric without being (consciously) religious.
On that blind spot test - you can tell there's image processing going on, as when you move so you can't see the X or the O, what you don't see is a black spot - you see white like the surrounding area. Your brain must be interpolating the white into that area.
I was 16 when I had my appendicitis attack and operation. The Dr. told my mother it was so swollen it was about to burst. My mother got pretty mad because I came in in the evening and didn't get operated on till the next morning. They didn't seem too concerned about the life of a young girl. I guess doctors need their sleep...whatever.
MY first-line example of bad "design" is the female birth canal. Birth shouldn't risk yje lives of mother and child so regularly. And PAIN! what possible reason is for birth to be so excruciating?
The variety in sexual development is very far from "perfect" unless that's the way evolution intended. The variety is sometimes good and sometimes debilitating.
Funny, in my country I've never heard of anyone having a problem with their appendix. Maybe that is a hereditary thing our people just missed? There are tons of other ways to die, like coronary disease that are more prevalent here. But appendicitis seems to be quite rare.
In the US 7% of all people have had appendicitis, usually as children. That's 0.1℅ per year. Of that number, less than 1℅ die from it. It's not common anywhere.
I've personally known two people with a very close call, related to an experience with appendicitis, but of course I've known a heck of a lot of people, and I have heard other stories that were scary close calls. I guess the percentage of people suffering appendicitis isn't large, but it is important for doctors and parents or loved ones, to stay aware of the dangers of misdiagnosis.
This person unfortunately does not understand some of the basics of the life processes, the same as those that are saying that god is punishing them or otherwise feeling guilty, of course we have to do with what we have at best whatever we can and live on, but guys things are exactly as they should be, ''perfection near'' to acquire is essential for the evolution and connected survival, but as any manufactory especially selfevolving one, there is a certain amount of error and mistakes, and if you really pay attention to life, you will see that even for those, there's a reason or usage in terms of life burn. Information getting burn off, as there's a gathering, of all kind of memories, so is dissolution of it in life, and this makes a revolution. Which is more important than perfection. Perfection cannot ensure the continuation of life when it has yet to dissolve. Once there is no need anymore, then it simply sits for long time. And the stillness that appears in the contrary of life manifestation and connected to the evolution is actually more dynamic then everything it just appears still due to the existing frequency and sits perfectly still until there's another disturbance that cases crude trauma in a way and yet again, start to manifest from the crude form and trough the processes including evolution perfect to be what it always suppose to be. And the start point of the evolution is dark and crude, but then again it is mother of life as we know.
When talking about being made in Gods image, I believe most get it wrong. It's not our bodies but our souls or spirits that are like His. Evolution is/was Gods tool for preparing the Earth/Universe for the advent of the human soul. Just my 2 cents.
In my opinion, It's okay to wonder and be religious, but it is the Biblical literalism that is damaging to our critical thinking and dangerous in other ways. My late mother majored in Zoology at Mt Holyoke College, back in the late 40s, and they were still somewhat religious, and they taught about Evolution, but they would want students to add a bit of somewhat annoying religious statements in their papers. My mother wasn't religious, but she liked the program, and she was lowered a grade when she didn't end her paper with some sort of religious statement. I think she mentioned that there were Nuns there, but I could be wrong. People will always have beliefs, and wonder, but we shouldn't let it stop us from learning from evidence.
Everything complicated and functional shows God's master plan. Everything stupid and potentially fatal is our fault for eating a magic apple in the garden of Lala land.
Congratulations on this video! You are a pedagogic talent and the world desperately needs people like you to spread the right messages in a way that can be understood by everyone. However, there are some scientific mistakes you made: 1. "Englargement of the prostate as we age" is not normal. It is due to our wrong nutrition. This topic could be extended to the size of more books, but I am going to give here one single scientific reference just for you to understand that there are a lot of misconceptions in medicine, too (where even incipient prostate cancer shows complete reversibility after switching to correct diet): Ornish D et al. Intensive lifestyle changes may affect the progression of prostate cancer. J Urol. 2005 Sep;174(3):1065-9 And there are many other studies that show a strong association AND causal relationship between (animal) dairy intake and prostate cancer and enlargement By the way, if you are ready to dig further, you'll find out: - that our blood pressure doesn't physiologically increase with age (by 10 mmHG every decade) if you don't systematically and unnecessarily add sodium to foods that anyway contain the exact required amount of sodium (women with low blood pressure did not train at intensities over the anaerobic threshold during their youth and therefore they do not have enough cardiac output to support both systolic and diastolic pressure) - that nor atherosclerosis is physiological (in fact, none of the known 5.500 mammals CAN develop it, except for herbivores that are proposedly fed by humans with pure cholesterol powder), and it stops only at values of LDL under 70 mg/dl, not 100 as medicine "says", respectively total cholesterol under 150 mg/dl, not 200 - that the only natural and internal cause of death is heart arrest due to the connective tissue supporting the myocytes after having reached a certain number of heartbeats. (I have studies supporting all these, not have the time to put them all here) - chronic kidney disease is not due to normal aging, it is accelerated by a wrong diet with lots of animal protein (as it is known that you don't have that acceleration of emphysema without smoking or air pollution) - also many neurodegenerative diseases including Alzheimer are accelerated by a wrong diet with too much cholesterol, iron, animal and especially dairy protein - normal values of CRP are not under 0,5 as medicine stipulates, but somewhere lower than 0,05, as a lot of unnecessary inflammation is directly or indirectly (via microbiome) due to a wrong diet with too many animal calories And so on, the list can continue indefinitely. 2. I'm atheistic and 1000% pro-evolution (actually one of my hobbies), but we need to take into account that eagles and vultures have the same badly designed retinas and they still are known to possess the best visual capabilities (your argument about the retina layers is correct; I only think that we should mention that "nature" has the ability to compensate for such imperfect "designs" to amazing extents.
Prof Hafer is an accredited biologist/anatomist -- had she made such basic errors as you suggest, it would have been called out by her scientific peers long ago.
@@jamestodd2323 This is not a competition for professional competence. No genius can know everything. Moreover, she is specialized in her own topics, where she seems to be competent and a good teacher, while I am an accredited nutritionist-dietitian and an internal medicine doctor. Just as there are some misconceptions about evolution, there are many in human nutrition. Additionally, I offered a scientific reference to support the idea. Last but not least, your argumentation looks like the logical error universally called "Argumentum ad verecundiam" (appeal to authority, i.e. a statement is considered to be true due to the titles and reputation of the author, not to the scientific evidence). Had you been a good psychologist, you would have been able to tell from my comment that I generally expressed my sympathy towards her.
@@jamestodd2323 Moreover, her argument about the prostate still remains valid despite the fact that the prostate under correct nutrition exhibits a significantly lower tendency to grow with age since it makes anyway no sense that a tube that basically has to be constantly maintained open is exposed to the risk of being strangled by traveling through a relatively hard organ that has the inner property of easily being able to grow oversize.
Such wicked humor. 😅 Halfway through and really loving this. Also, don't see how you can argue against it. Another excellent guest and interview. Thank you.
Just Great. And understanding this isn't just about debunking Bible literalists like two Great Richards (Dawkins and Carrier try to do) but with Big implications for development of our Civilization!
You know what I mean?
th-cam.com/video/jXYH9xdrhGU/w-d-xo.html
Great Book. I'm the subject aficionado but still wonderfully collected facts in one lecture.
A very good argument. I think it's safe to say that men didn't come from dust and women didn't come from Adam's rib.
Absolutely love her for telling how it is. I feel you undersold this interwiev with a way to ambiguous title. This deserves much more views.
Came out of religion and theism for the past few years and just found this content. Such good stuff here, thanks.
Just got this watched, interesting as always. What I felt was unique was how Abby tackled the discussion of evolution from a political perspective. I don't want my next comments to be taken as a criticism but more a personal perspective and point of discussion. I haven't looked deeply into some of these issues to my logic may have flaws. There is a great deal of weight behind many of our immune issues stemming from medical interventions that are verboten from discussing on TH-cam. Also stemming from processed foods and poor nutrition. This is more behaviour than biology. We had personal experience with sheep, where there was a blast of snow just before lambing. We fed using concentrated foods because of the snow on the ground, overfeeding of certain, but not all necessary nutrients. This led to lambs that were larger than normal despite the weather conditions. Although I do understand the hip issue, has our abundance of food made babies bigger in only a few hundred years outpaced our evolutionary adaptions. Surgical medical interventions saves lives but they also allow weaker genes to be passed on instead of being removed. Finally, regarding the oesophagus / vocal cords issue. We were taught that the reason we can make complex sounds is also the issue with choking. I think the benefits outweigh the cost, this wasn't addressed. It's all about balance for me rather than an all positive or all negative presentation. Again not a criticism of the interview or guest. Love the show.
Abby Hafer is amazing! Thank you for this interview!
We can genuinely say, balls to intelligent design!!
And to Bible literalists!
th-cam.com/video/bQmMFQzrEsc/w-d-xo.html
I'll be honest I haven't watched this yet but I will after work. No matter which era or subject you are dealing with, whether you are going in-depth or covering a topic more generally, you always have interesting interviews. Well structured discussions where the guest can put across their knowledge. What I like most is how comfortable these are to watch, guests who are generous and enthusiastic. Some presentations from other channels can sometimes err towards a more clinical approach but you have great chemistry with your guests. A real joy to watch.
As for corrective eyeware: I've been myopic most of my life, it started when I learned to read at the ripe age of 4 (my mother says 3, but that's just a mother bragging). I love books. But I've managed to get it better. I saved the perscriptions for my glasses since 2010. from -4.5 down to -1.5 in 2021 (my left eye -3.5 to -1.0)! And now I don't use glasses, to finish it all. It's not evolution, but it's something anyone can do (if you are myopic that is).
As I understand it, nearsighted people grow through a period that they may not need glasses anymore, and I think it's because the of the natural tendency to need longer arms to read as we grow older.
I used to grind lenses in an Optical lab and learned a little about it.
Many people can read small print when they are young, and they can read up close, and we start to need magnification in our later years, but nearsighted people usually need minus lenses when young, and grow out of it, and start to need plus lenses later than some others.
I'm stubborn, and I really do need readers, in a +1.5 or so.
What an engaging speaker. I enjoyed her talk very much.
These videos are incredible and informative, and it's a shame these aren't more popular.
This is one of the best talks I have come across, a big thank-you.
Loved the talk second or third time I listened. Brilliant woman
I love it.
I've often thought of a few others. But of course it's a treasure to get a well researched book by an expert in the field.
rather than a random guy's opinion
Just Great. And understanding this isn't just about debunking Bible literalists like two Great Richards (Dawkins and Carrier try to do) but with Big implications for development of our Civilization!
You know what I mean?
th-cam.com/video/jXYH9xdrhGU/w-d-xo.html
Great Book. I'm the subject aficionado but still wonderfully collected facts in one lecture.
Very much appreciate this interview. Keep up the good work!
Great video. It would however be helpful if when discussing the various designs, she were more specific about taxonomy, i.e. It's not just Humans with "backwards wiring" in the eyes, it's all vertebrates, and I think it's even all deuterostomes, but I could be wrong about that.
an amusing side-car to studying at Balliol was having the input of philosophers about cosmology, animal behaviour and so on. i remember a philosopher who gave a talk arguing that animals couldn't think. i thought that was anthropocnetric without being (consciously) religious.
Nicely done
Another fascinating subject...❤
In UK we knew COVID was spreading but our government, sat on their hands and let it happen until it was too late.
COVID was just the seasonal flu rebranded to scare you
Everyone interested in science would enjoy it.
We are very smart is subjective.
On that blind spot test - you can tell there's image processing going on, as when you move so you can't see the X or the O, what you don't see is a black spot - you see white like the surrounding area. Your brain must be interpolating the white into that area.
sounds like higher fibre diet would help to avoid burst appendix? Or is that not what you mean by 'flow'?
Anyone who has hurt their eye would say that injury hurts more than a groin strike. So not the only organ .I see your point though
Look at the terrible design of our bodies. It's a shocking mark of ignorance when creationists say it's perfect.
I was 16 when I had my appendicitis attack and operation. The Dr. told my mother it was so swollen it was about to burst. My mother got pretty mad because I came in in the evening and didn't get operated on till the next morning. They didn't seem too concerned about the life of a young girl. I guess doctors need their sleep...whatever.
Political message about evolution: Adapt or die…
MY first-line example of bad "design" is the female birth canal. Birth shouldn't risk yje lives of mother and child so regularly. And PAIN! what possible reason is for birth to be so excruciating?
Why not evolve more heat -resistant sperm? Is it just too energy -intensive?
there is no choice or intention on the process
The variety in sexual development is very far from "perfect" unless that's the way evolution intended. The variety is sometimes good and sometimes debilitating.
there’s vitamin C in meat, liver, kidneys and heart that you can eat … you don’t need to eat fruit and veg to get vitamin C
By default, God himself was badly designed & needs to evolve!
By Gods' God?
Funny, in my country I've never heard of anyone having a problem with their appendix. Maybe that is a hereditary thing our people just missed? There are tons of other ways to die, like coronary disease that are more prevalent here. But appendicitis seems to be quite rare.
In the US 7% of all people have had appendicitis, usually as children. That's 0.1℅ per year. Of that number, less than 1℅ die from it. It's not common anywhere.
@@Anuchan yet strangely I know two people who have had apendixicitis
@@jeffbybee5207 If you know 2000 people, then 2 would be average. It would only be unusual if both of those died.
I've personally known two people with a very close call, related to an experience with appendicitis, but of course I've known a heck of a lot of people, and I have heard other stories that were scary close calls.
I guess the percentage of people suffering appendicitis isn't large, but it is important for doctors and parents or loved ones, to stay aware of the dangers of misdiagnosis.
Most mammals have testes outside but they don't always hang.
A cult can not tolerate questions. Religious cults and science cults are quite similar.
This person unfortunately does not understand some of the basics of the life processes, the same as those that are saying that god is punishing them or otherwise feeling guilty, of course we have to do with what we have at best whatever we can and live on, but guys things are exactly as they should be, ''perfection near'' to acquire is essential for the evolution and connected survival, but as any manufactory especially selfevolving one, there is a certain amount of error and mistakes, and if you really pay attention to life, you will see that even for those, there's a reason or usage in terms of life burn. Information getting burn off, as there's a gathering, of all kind of memories, so is dissolution of it in life, and this makes a revolution. Which is more important than perfection. Perfection cannot ensure the continuation of life when it has yet to dissolve. Once there is no need anymore, then it simply sits for long time. And the stillness that appears in the contrary of life manifestation and connected to the evolution is actually more dynamic then everything it just appears still due to the existing frequency and sits perfectly still until there's another disturbance that cases crude trauma in a way and yet again, start to manifest from the crude form and trough the processes including evolution perfect to be what it always suppose to be. And the start point of the evolution is dark and crude, but then again it is mother of life as we know.
Do you sell these word salads?
Humans are actually at the bottom, the end, of evolution. Most others are better. A few, like giraffes, got "accidents" in physiology.
Enjoyed the science, not the politics
When did she mention politics?
Walking and running traded for wide hips and mean legs. Not fair.
When talking about being made in Gods image, I believe most get it wrong. It's not our bodies but our souls or spirits that are like His. Evolution is/was Gods tool for preparing the Earth/Universe for the advent of the human soul. Just my 2 cents.
Until we can put God under a microscope, we'll have to leave it to speculation.
@@Anuchan Or faith. The world only exists because we all think it does, collective thinking of the spirit.
@@theoldscout3478 Right. That's another area that doesn't stand up to scientific examination.
In my opinion, It's okay to wonder and be religious, but it is the Biblical literalism that is damaging to our critical thinking and dangerous in other ways.
My late mother majored in Zoology at Mt Holyoke College, back in the late 40s, and they were still somewhat religious, and they taught about Evolution, but they would want students to add a bit of somewhat annoying religious statements in their papers.
My mother wasn't religious, but she liked the program, and she was lowered a grade when she didn't end her paper with some sort of religious statement.
I think she mentioned that there were Nuns there, but I could be wrong.
People will always have beliefs, and wonder, but we shouldn't let it stop us from learning from evidence.
Faith is fine, but it shouldn't be a substitute for knowledge.
Genetically enhanced people, think of the accomplishments, think of the achievements.
Think of the warriors holding dominion over others for their masters. Mankind isn't ready.
Say developed, not designed.
And yet they do not follow all the tribal principles in the bible tales. They lie that they follow all of it, or even read it.
Did we really need the controversial covid take at the end around 46 minutes?
God (evolution) liked water creatures better. Proof life was meant to stay in water, esp the sea.
Everything complicated and functional shows God's master plan. Everything stupid and potentially fatal is our fault for eating a magic apple in the garden of Lala land.
Maybe God is cephalopod.
artificial selection is evolution by intelligent design..
natural selection is devolution by no design
OVERT MENSTRATION, WTF?
Congratulations on this video! You are a pedagogic talent and the world desperately needs people like you to spread the right messages in a way that can be understood by everyone.
However, there are some scientific mistakes you made:
1. "Englargement of the prostate as we age" is not normal. It is due to our wrong nutrition. This topic could be extended to the size of more books, but I am going to give here one single scientific reference just for you to understand that there are a lot of misconceptions in medicine, too (where even incipient prostate cancer shows complete reversibility after switching to correct diet):
Ornish D et al. Intensive lifestyle changes may affect the progression of prostate cancer. J Urol. 2005 Sep;174(3):1065-9
And there are many other studies that show a strong association AND causal relationship between (animal) dairy intake and prostate cancer and enlargement
By the way, if you are ready to dig further, you'll find out:
- that our blood pressure doesn't physiologically increase with age (by 10 mmHG every decade) if you don't systematically and unnecessarily add sodium to foods that anyway contain the exact required amount of sodium (women with low blood pressure did not train at intensities over the anaerobic threshold during their youth and therefore they do not have enough cardiac output to support both systolic and diastolic pressure)
- that nor atherosclerosis is physiological (in fact, none of the known 5.500 mammals CAN develop it, except for herbivores that are proposedly fed by humans with pure cholesterol powder), and it stops only at values of LDL under 70 mg/dl, not 100 as medicine "says", respectively total cholesterol under 150 mg/dl, not 200
- that the only natural and internal cause of death is heart arrest due to the connective tissue supporting the myocytes after having reached a certain number of heartbeats. (I have studies supporting all these, not have the time to put them all here)
- chronic kidney disease is not due to normal aging, it is accelerated by a wrong diet with lots of animal protein (as it is known that you don't have that acceleration of emphysema without smoking or air pollution)
- also many neurodegenerative diseases including Alzheimer are accelerated by a wrong diet with too much cholesterol, iron, animal and especially dairy protein
- normal values of CRP are not under 0,5 as medicine stipulates, but somewhere lower than 0,05, as a lot of unnecessary inflammation is directly or indirectly (via microbiome) due to a wrong diet with too many animal calories
And so on, the list can continue indefinitely.
2. I'm atheistic and 1000% pro-evolution (actually one of my hobbies), but we need to take into account that eagles and vultures have the same badly designed retinas and they still are known to possess the best visual capabilities (your argument about the retina layers is correct; I only think that we should mention that "nature" has the ability to compensate for such imperfect "designs" to amazing extents.
Prof Hafer is an accredited biologist/anatomist -- had she made such basic errors as you suggest, it would have been called out by her scientific peers long ago.
@@jamestodd2323
This is not a competition for professional competence. No genius can know everything. Moreover, she is specialized in her own topics, where she seems to be competent and a good teacher, while I am an accredited nutritionist-dietitian and an internal medicine doctor. Just as there are some misconceptions about evolution, there are many in human nutrition. Additionally, I offered a scientific reference to support the idea. Last but not least, your argumentation looks like the logical error universally called "Argumentum ad verecundiam" (appeal to authority, i.e. a statement is considered to be true due to the titles and reputation of the author, not to the scientific evidence).
Had you been a good psychologist, you would have been able to tell from my comment that I generally expressed my sympathy towards her.
@@jamestodd2323
Moreover, her argument about the prostate still remains valid despite the fact that the prostate under correct nutrition exhibits a significantly lower tendency to grow with age since it makes anyway no sense that a tube that basically has to be constantly maintained open is exposed to the risk of being strangled by traveling through a relatively hard organ that has the inner property of easily being able to grow oversize.
Yea