Great video, as always, Peter. I really enjoyed my nearly 60 hours with ISSV, but I definitely agree with some of the issues you brought up. When I found myself having to revisit a planet due to energy issues when flying through space, I just assumed that I successfully landed, met the goal, and lifted back off. I wasn't going to let that get in the way of me actually enjoying the game. Was it cheating? Technically, yes. Do I care? Nope, because I was playing solo and I was playing this game for the experience, not the game mechanisms. I think the story and world puzzles are worth experiencing, and highly recommend people persevere to the end--even if that means sanding (or tearing off) a few of the rough edges.
Sounds like a reasonable cheat to me. And I'm not a fan of having to revisit places you've already been when it's a 2 hour redo - that's grind - and makes me feel like there are no real consequences to 'losing' on a planet, as you have to go back and do it successfully eventually. I might take your advice and skip such things and stick with it just for the story, I am curious about where it goes.
How come negative reviews are always labeled as honest. I never understand that. So if someone likes this game there lying about it. This is not even the first negative review I have seen. Just a weird comment.
I am very impressed with the way you were able to balance that review so expertly having not preferred the game yourself. The amount of respect you show the designers of the game is commendable. This is the way to handle a review (discussion). It sure helps that you are from NZ as well :) That accent brings back so many fond memories from when I lived in Methven for a year. Thank you and keep up the great work Peter!
Thankyou! However my accent is Australian - I've lived here ten years, but I really don't have that distinctive NZ accent. But then again, my Australian one isn't very strong either! The differences are very clear to us, but probably not so much to those overseas. 😃
Great review, I know it can feel weird to say anything negative about a game so many people worked so hard on. But I you are quite respecful when you do, so keep on!
Thankyou - I try to see the game from the perspective of different players. I certainly understand that many people love this game, as under different circumstances I would too!
Great review Peter! Pretty much sums up my feelings about it as well. I I ran a few missions but I had to put it away and haven’t played since. I will get back to it however and your summaries are so great!
I download every one of your references sheets for games in my collection .. I love it , great job !! Do you print it by your own? Im looking for good paper i see yours is shiny, what kind of paper weight you use ?
As Selby says, I laminate it. But I use a pretty good quality double-sided matt paper, heavier than normal paper. The Epson 178gsm when I can get it (which is difficult here in NZ), or if I can't, the HP 150 gsm. The double-sidedness is obviously important, though I have printed on normal glossy paper in the past, and stuck two sheets together with diary adhesive before laminating.
Good video and fair review 👏 Yourself and Three Minute Board Games are pretty much the only gamers/reviewers who's opinions I like to watch. As a thought, if you're not really planning on playing much, and aren't fussed by the gameplay, would you donate it to someone in NZ? Or long term lend it? If it didn't cost you anything it's a shame to have so much game in one box not get used. And I'm not in NZ so I'm not asking for it myself 😂
Thankyou for the compliment, it means a lot. I would love to be able to do such things Jonathon, but to be honest, I'm not making an income from my normal design work at the moment, so I need to generate every dollar I can from this channel, and that includes selling games occasionally. Even then I am nowhere near making enough o get by lately. As an example, I've spent about a week's work on this game time-wise, in return for nothing beyond the game itself. And even if I was keeping a game, I'm not a fan of lending out my games (or books), as in my experience they're never cared for in a way that meets my own picky standards - or even worse, they're not returned at all.
Yes I am, but you don't need BGG to find them! They're all in one place on my website, along with foamcore insert plans and ten years worth of videos - all easily searchable! Follow me on social media and you'll never miss an update or a new rules & reference.
I do like that AR keeps core box minis down to a sensible level, and mainly those that are in constant use. That still allows those that love the extra minis to pledge for them and enjoy them. Re: ship management, this made me feel like the increasing 'level' in dungeon crawlers and the like, but then amped up to include events, the crew, etc. etc. A case of AR pushing the envelope as they do. I must say I thought the trimming back of the ship management vs. the Gamefound campaign was sensible/pragmatic. ISS Vanguard (and indeed Etherfields) is now hitting retail shelves in the UK (through a retail distribution deal announced a year or so ago). That's not always been the case, though Nemesis did get a retail release, whilst This War of Mine rights were sold to Galakta, who then brought it (very professionally IMO) to retail.
Yes, it's good they're habitually going to retail now, I've got a lot of Awaken games like that in the past as backing crowdfunding campaigns just isn't affordable for me anymore, with shipping costs to NZ. And very often the extras really aren't necessary.
The best review I've seen and you managed to articulate what I was thinking amd feeling about this 'game' really well. I was so excited for this and went all-in but was just underwhelmed by the gaming experience and had to sell it on quite quickly. This is the second time it has happened to me after Tainted Grail so I have decided never to buy an Awaken Realms game again. I guess they just aren't for me.
ISS Vanguard, Tainted Grail, and Etherfields very much lean on the storytelling aspect, but then again there are excellent Awaken Realms games that are more traditional games - Nemesis and Lords of Hellas for example. I wouldn't discount the whole company by any means, it depends on the individual game! Thanks for the kind words BTW.
This was a great review. I love you making that separation of a gaming experience vs a CYOA experience. It is for that "Mass Effect" experience that I look forward to this game. And I love the ship management phase. You defined everything so well, it helped me pinpoint why I fell in love with this game when I saw Paul Grogan's playthrough and immediately late backed it. Thank you for your work, and for the reference sheets I will definitely print when I finally get the game (in like a year or so; I hope the files will still be available for download then?)!
I'm very glad that I walked the line between expressing my thoughts but still not alienating people who love the game. Job done! Thanks for writing, I appreciate it.
@@EsotericOrderGamers It is ok to not like a game, and to explain why. Tastes differ so it's unreasonable to expect people to like what we ourselves like. How it's done may be important and I'm reminded of the guidance given to us as basketball referees when ejecting a player from the game. The signal for this was two clenched fists with both arms raised to the vertical. We were instructed to avoid this appearing triumphant (as it could be construed), but raising both arms slowly and with a sad expression on the face. Some youtubers are wary of being negative, but framed as 'this didn't appeal to / work for me' really is fine, and that's how you've pitched it. There are few instances I can think of with a youtube presenter delighting in trashing a game, though sadly I can think of one UK based channel that does this in a 'this is why the game is bad' way. That's the kind of attitude that might rile fans of it, but not simply being clear on your experience, time constraints, and motivations for gaming... which is fine.
So played a bit now, and I am reviewing this video again, I would say there is very good "game" here and not just a choose your own adventure book. There are actually a lot of tactical decisions that need to made from a cooperative perspective that aren't readily apparent if you gloss over the dice check rules or just play the tutorial. Yes, you are ultimately at the mercy of the dice, but having your section leaders in the same zone contributing dice and section cards is very "puzzle-ly" aspect, there is a lot more collaboration here then even games like Arkham Horror LCG offer IMHO, so I cannot agree with your assessment that there is no "game" here.
I certainly went further in that that, but in any case it depends on your definition of game. I'm not a fan of puzzle-like elements in games because - well, they're puzzles, not games. But I still have my copy and maybe one day I'll want to trudge through the interminable checklists of repetitive tasks to see if there's more of a game in here for me than I discovered after the hours I spent with it. If you're enjoying it however, that's fantastic! We all have different tastes and I try to allow for them all in my reviews.
Well done review. While I disagree pretty much with every aspect of your review, I can certainly see why some people might not enjoy the game. Will say its not a perfect game and to be honest the ship book started out super enjoyable. Towards the back half of the campaign it certainly got less interesting but maybe not for the reasons people would expect. The story has been super engaging and I like the sense of exploration enough that I was really looking forward to each play. I am hopeful that the upcoming expansion can improve on a few of the issues I had with the game.
I'm really glad you enjoyed it that much! As I said, everyone has their own preferences when it comes to games and a review is always just one person's opinion. I'm always interested to hear other people's ones.
Oh, the old gatekeepy "What is a game?"-argument. Equally annoying in videogames, RPGs and boardgames. Will it ever die? Probably not, it just gets older. Good review otherwise!
What? I have no idea what you're on about. How ridiculous, the absolute last thing I would ever do is be gatekeepy. I repeatedly recognise that everyone has different tastes in games, and while I'm expressing mine because it's me making the video, I have absolutely no problem with what other people enjoy - in fact I completely understand and celebrate it in this and any other case. That would be the polar opposite of gatekeeping. "I think for the right person, this is fantastic - the problem is, I'm not that person." Yeah, real gatekeepy there. 🤣
You can find the Esoteric Order of Gamers ISS VANGUARD Rules & Reference here: www.orderofgamers.com/games/iss-vanguard/
Great video, as always, Peter.
I really enjoyed my nearly 60 hours with ISSV, but I definitely agree with some of the issues you brought up. When I found myself having to revisit a planet due to energy issues when flying through space, I just assumed that I successfully landed, met the goal, and lifted back off. I wasn't going to let that get in the way of me actually enjoying the game. Was it cheating? Technically, yes. Do I care? Nope, because I was playing solo and I was playing this game for the experience, not the game mechanisms.
I think the story and world puzzles are worth experiencing, and highly recommend people persevere to the end--even if that means sanding (or tearing off) a few of the rough edges.
Sounds like a reasonable cheat to me. And I'm not a fan of having to revisit places you've already been when it's a 2 hour redo - that's grind - and makes me feel like there are no real consequences to 'losing' on a planet, as you have to go back and do it successfully eventually. I might take your advice and skip such things and stick with it just for the story, I am curious about where it goes.
Finally a brutally honest review! Thanks for this. Love your channel
How come negative reviews are always labeled as honest. I never understand that. So if someone likes this game there lying about it. This is not even the first negative review I have seen. Just a weird comment.
I am very impressed with the way you were able to balance that review so expertly having not preferred the game yourself. The amount of respect you show the designers of the game is commendable. This is the way to handle a review (discussion). It sure helps that you are from NZ as well :) That accent brings back so many fond memories from when I lived in Methven for a year. Thank you and keep up the great work Peter!
Thankyou! However my accent is Australian - I've lived here ten years, but I really don't have that distinctive NZ accent. But then again, my Australian one isn't very strong either! The differences are very clear to us, but probably not so much to those overseas. 😃
@@EsotericOrderGamers :D I blame my origin as a Swede!
@@Swedeskanfly I have some Swedish blood from a few generations back! 😆
@@EsotericOrderGamers What a beautiful thing! I could feel it. 😅
Great review, I know it can feel weird to say anything negative about a game so many people worked so hard on. But I you are quite respecful when you do, so keep on!
Thankyou - I try to see the game from the perspective of different players. I certainly understand that many people love this game, as under different circumstances I would too!
Great review Peter! Pretty much sums up my feelings about it as well. I
I ran a few missions but I had to put it away and haven’t played since. I will get back to it however and your summaries are so great!
Thanks Etienne! I'll get back to it one day ... or maybe I'll sell it ... haven't decided yet!
I download every one of your references sheets for games in my collection .. I love it , great job !! Do you print it by your own? Im looking for good paper i see yours is shiny, what kind of paper weight you use ?
I believe he just laminates it. That’s what makes it shiny.
As Selby says, I laminate it. But I use a pretty good quality double-sided matt paper, heavier than normal paper. The Epson 178gsm when I can get it (which is difficult here in NZ), or if I can't, the HP 150 gsm. The double-sidedness is obviously important, though I have printed on normal glossy paper in the past, and stuck two sheets together with diary adhesive before laminating.
Good video and fair review 👏
Yourself and Three Minute Board Games are pretty much the only gamers/reviewers who's opinions I like to watch.
As a thought, if you're not really planning on playing much, and aren't fussed by the gameplay, would you donate it to someone in NZ? Or long term lend it? If it didn't cost you anything it's a shame to have so much game in one box not get used.
And I'm not in NZ so I'm not asking for it myself 😂
Thankyou for the compliment, it means a lot. I would love to be able to do such things Jonathon, but to be honest, I'm not making an income from my normal design work at the moment, so I need to generate every dollar I can from this channel, and that includes selling games occasionally. Even then I am nowhere near making enough o get by lately. As an example, I've spent about a week's work on this game time-wise, in return for nothing beyond the game itself. And even if I was keeping a game, I'm not a fan of lending out my games (or books), as in my experience they're never cared for in a way that meets my own picky standards - or even worse, they're not returned at all.
Would love to see your thoughts on 'La Famiglia: The Great Mafia War' and for you to give it your player aid treatment!
There are a gazillion games out there and everyone has their favourites - I'm afraid I can't cover them all! 😆
you are the dude that makes those guides on BGG
Yes I am, but you don't need BGG to find them! They're all in one place on my website, along with foamcore insert plans and ten years worth of videos - all easily searchable! Follow me on social media and you'll never miss an update or a new rules & reference.
I do like that AR keeps core box minis down to a sensible level, and mainly those that are in constant use. That still allows those that love the extra minis to pledge for them and enjoy them.
Re: ship management, this made me feel like the increasing 'level' in dungeon crawlers and the like, but then amped up to include events, the crew, etc. etc. A case of AR pushing the envelope as they do. I must say I thought the trimming back of the ship management vs. the Gamefound campaign was sensible/pragmatic.
ISS Vanguard (and indeed Etherfields) is now hitting retail shelves in the UK (through a retail distribution deal announced a year or so ago). That's not always been the case, though Nemesis did get a retail release, whilst This War of Mine rights were sold to Galakta, who then brought it (very professionally IMO) to retail.
Yes, it's good they're habitually going to retail now, I've got a lot of Awaken games like that in the past as backing crowdfunding campaigns just isn't affordable for me anymore, with shipping costs to NZ. And very often the extras really aren't necessary.
This game is basically reverse XCOM, where you travel to locations and upgrade your base(ship), manage an away crew, and research tech.
This is giving me some aeon trespass vibes. Will be looking forward to your review on that, once you have time to go through it more :-)
You're right, I need more time to play it, but stay tuned for the review.
The best review I've seen and you managed to articulate what I was thinking amd feeling about this 'game' really well. I was so excited for this and went all-in but was just underwhelmed by the gaming experience and had to sell it on quite quickly. This is the second time it has happened to me after Tainted Grail so I have decided never to buy an Awaken Realms game again. I guess they just aren't for me.
ISS Vanguard, Tainted Grail, and Etherfields very much lean on the storytelling aspect, but then again there are excellent Awaken Realms games that are more traditional games - Nemesis and Lords of Hellas for example. I wouldn't discount the whole company by any means, it depends on the individual game! Thanks for the kind words BTW.
This was a great review. I love you making that separation of a gaming experience vs a CYOA experience. It is for that "Mass Effect" experience that I look forward to this game. And I love the ship management phase. You defined everything so well, it helped me pinpoint why I fell in love with this game when I saw Paul Grogan's playthrough and immediately late backed it. Thank you for your work, and for the reference sheets I will definitely print when I finally get the game (in like a year or so; I hope the files will still be available for download then?)!
I'm very glad that I walked the line between expressing my thoughts but still not alienating people who love the game. Job done! Thanks for writing, I appreciate it.
@@EsotericOrderGamers It is ok to not like a game, and to explain why. Tastes differ so it's unreasonable to expect people to like what we ourselves like.
How it's done may be important and I'm reminded of the guidance given to us as basketball referees when ejecting a player from the game. The signal for this was two clenched fists with both arms raised to the vertical. We were instructed to avoid this appearing triumphant (as it could be construed), but raising both arms slowly and with a sad expression on the face.
Some youtubers are wary of being negative, but framed as 'this didn't appeal to / work for me' really is fine, and that's how you've pitched it. There are few instances I can think of with a youtube presenter delighting in trashing a game, though sadly I can think of one UK based channel that does this in a 'this is why the game is bad' way. That's the kind of attitude that might rile fans of it, but not simply being clear on your experience, time constraints, and motivations for gaming... which is fine.
So played a bit now, and I am reviewing this video again, I would say there is very good "game" here and not just a choose your own adventure book. There are actually a lot of tactical decisions that need to made from a cooperative perspective that aren't readily apparent if you gloss over the dice check rules or just play the tutorial. Yes, you are ultimately at the mercy of the dice, but having your section leaders in the same zone contributing dice and section cards is very "puzzle-ly" aspect, there is a lot more collaboration here then even games like Arkham Horror LCG offer IMHO, so I cannot agree with your assessment that there is no "game" here.
I certainly went further in that that, but in any case it depends on your definition of game. I'm not a fan of puzzle-like elements in games because - well, they're puzzles, not games. But I still have my copy and maybe one day I'll want to trudge through the interminable checklists of repetitive tasks to see if there's more of a game in here for me than I discovered after the hours I spent with it. If you're enjoying it however, that's fantastic! We all have different tastes and I try to allow for them all in my reviews.
1:32 ship managment. Not shit managment
Sounds pretty clearly like 'ship' to me ...
Well done review. While I disagree pretty much with every aspect of your review, I can certainly see why some people might not enjoy the game.
Will say its not a perfect game and to be honest the ship book started out super enjoyable. Towards the back half of the campaign it certainly got less interesting but maybe not for the reasons people would expect.
The story has been super engaging and I like the sense of exploration enough that I was really looking forward to each play. I am hopeful that the upcoming expansion can improve on a few of the issues I had with the game.
I'm really glad you enjoyed it that much! As I said, everyone has their own preferences when it comes to games and a review is always just one person's opinion. I'm always interested to hear other people's ones.
Oh, the old gatekeepy "What is a game?"-argument. Equally annoying in videogames, RPGs and boardgames. Will it ever die? Probably not, it just gets older. Good review otherwise!
What? I have no idea what you're on about. How ridiculous, the absolute last thing I would ever do is be gatekeepy. I repeatedly recognise that everyone has different tastes in games, and while I'm expressing mine because it's me making the video, I have absolutely no problem with what other people enjoy - in fact I completely understand and celebrate it in this and any other case. That would be the polar opposite of gatekeeping. "I think for the right person, this is fantastic - the problem is, I'm not that person." Yeah, real gatekeepy there. 🤣