Excellent explanation. In almost every situation the gravity fed system will perform better. They do take more effort and cash to install but, the end result is worth it.
My biggest regret of my current pond is not installing a bottom drain, currently running a retro bottom drain (with air)which does actually work fairly well but not as good as a proper one would. Love your videos, your knowledge and the way you explain things is top notch👌 I’m currently on my second pond and wish I knew what I know now when I built it. Next pond will be the one but it’s probably a few years off yet!
Hi Mike, it sounds like you are on the exact journey 99% of us go on mate, first pond is a bit rubbish but whets our appetite, second one we think is the one, only to find we are still short of a couple of things. Third one is usually when you get what you want. Your ambition and knowledge grows and so does your pond, to be honest its the best way to do it I reckon. I'm in the same boat in that I'm in a short term house at the moment so I've had to compromise a lot but when we move I'm planning something better. Like you though, it will likely be a few years off yet.
i agree with most of this apart from pump fed leaving silt on the bottom, ive always used pump fed but if you have enough circulation ,then this will keep the bottom clean. But i do think your right in saying bottom drains are best , and i am currently converting my pond to a bottom feed system....nice video mate
Great info, Any pump fed system should have a float switch fitted to prevent pond being pumped dry if a pipe comes off. You can also fit a retro bottom drain to a pumped system that works really well. Keep up the good content.
I agree with you 100% that gravity fed is better than pump. Unfortunately my small pond has to be pump fed. Ground level ponds are more difficult to install gravity fed systems. Not only do you have the cost of the bottom drain and fitting but you also have to sink your filters into the ground which adds another cost. I learnt the hard way about pump fed systems emptying the pond. That is why I have a small header tank turned upside down which my pumps sit on. It keeps it 10 inches or so from the bottom of the pond and so reduces the risk of losing your fish if something goes wrong. It isnt ideal and I would much prefer a bottom drain and gravity fed system. With a pump fed system you also need to vac the pond more often.
Hi Jim, in my defense I made this video at the same time as the last one so I didn't consider an in ground pond. I will try to include them in future videos as I know a lot of people have them. Despite the negatives, pump fed filters can work really well, I think from my past experience with one that you need to work at it a bit harder in terms of maintenance etc These days we are all lazy and want everything low maintenance. What about a retro fit bottom drain? Could that be an option for your pond? Gravity feed to a dry mounted pump and then pump in to your existing filter. Its a similar setup to what you have now but you are effectively installing a vac that runs 24/7.
Hey pal good reasoning provided and finding this very educational for all koi pond hobbyists to think about whether it is for an existing upgrade or new build!
I dont disagree about bottom drains being the best system , i built my pond 20 odd years ago with a pump fed system , with hindsight and the experience i have now of keeping koi id probably go bottom drain , but to be fair ive still been very successful , not had any issues and the bottom of my pond is very clean without silt , granted i clean regularly with pond vac , and keep on top of maintainance . The hose is flexipipe , they dont damage themselves on that , or mine never have Im going to be redoing my pond for next year so will be looking at retro fit bottom drain , but if i cant make it work im quiet happy pump fed , Just my views , another very good video , cheers
Hi mate, yes I agree, its definitely possible. The biggest problem is that because it needs more work to keep on top of it, a lot don't do it and that's when the problems come. If you are willing to pu the effort it consistently then I can definitely work well 👍👍👍
Always gravity fed if possible mate. You get the waste to the filter in one piece whereas if you are pump fed the pump chops it up and makes it a lot more difficult to take out.
i had pump fed retro drian on old pond and built new pond was going to build with proper botton drain but that meant replacing my current filter which cost 2k so had to stick with retro drian but i did leave my pump outside of pond in filter house. and tbh my pond floor is muck free compared to just a pump in pond without retro fit drian.
Only just built my pond, did not fancy the thought of having a drain under my pond, I have friends with both systems and neither seem to be any better than the other, pump fed systems have been running for 15 years with no issues on 2 ponds, one of the gravity systems had a leak from the bottom drain meaning the whole pond had to be re-done, i have no issues whatsoever, return on one side, pump on the other, flexi pipe which is no detriment to the fish and runs a nexus 220+, might take a little more maintenance but no bother to me. Had quotes of 15-20k to build the gravity system, built mine myself for 5k so more than happy 👍
Hi Lee, good to hear your setup is working for you. Other than £140 for a bottom drain the price should be no different. I've never heard of a drain leaking before but if one ever did I would advise just capping it off. That way you are in exactly the same position as if you didn't fit one in the first place.
@@DazzleKoi Yes the pond had a leak, just a slow but constant water loss, turned out to be the bottom drain and seeing the work needed to rectify put me off, I will see how the oase pump goes but so far doing a great job, simple system on a 2000 gallon pond, oase 10,000 premium pump, 55w uv, nexus 220 plus, only 4 koi so far and apart from the pipe work for the pump I’m happy. I wanted 75n blocks with viewing window, I’m no brickie and was quoted £600 a day for just laying the blocks, never mind everything else, no thanks so did it myself, 3ft below, 2ft above with 4x4 s only for the above secured into concrete, no easy task but happy with the result 👍
Sounds good mate. Its a good feeling when you do it yourself and it turns out well. Much more satisfying than paying someone else, plus you get to spend the money you save on some more koi 😁 A brickie with a mate costs around £300 - £350 a day in the north west but I bet they put koi tax on when you tell them its a koi pond. I ran a small building company until recently and I thought a lot about doing pond builds but my partner in the business didn't fancy it. Its hard work but i bet its really rewarding. Getting a bit old now.
Another great video. I have a bottom drain fitted too as all the forums I joined recommended it. The other disadvantage I found was the limited choice of filters.
Brilliant video thank you very much ,what air pump do you recommend for a wild life pond with about 30 fish in trying to get the water clear without using a filter . King regards .
Hi Frank, sorry for the delay in replying, its hard to say without knowing your pond type, size, etc but you will struggle to get clear water without a filter in most ponds unfortunately. Its likely that you will have debris sat on the bottom which will harbor bacteria and if you add an air source it is likely to agitate it and stir it up causing you issues. It may be better to look if you can incorporate a waterfall of some can to add aeration?
Great video, thanks. I've dug my pond out to a depth of 1.2m so still not clear on if or how gravity fed would work unless I'd also have to dig another 1.2m hole for the filter? Can bottom drains be pumped to a higher filter? Im planning on my 3mx2.5mx1.2m pond being a fish pond only, but ive used a larger than necessary liner so i can always add height using sleepers and retrofit a bottom drain in future.... Assuming it can be pumped to the filter.
@@DazzleKoi it is at the moment. I've my made sure there's plenty of excess liner so if I want to go higher in the future I can put another 40cm of depth in by building up with sleepers.
Its tricky this. In the past the answer was always just 'no'. But I know people do manage to do it nowadays. I've no experience of it myself so I would recommend facebook groups to get in touch with someone who does it successfully. I think you would need to bury a large settlement tank in the ground at the same depth as the pond and then pump out from that but waste settling in there would be a problem and I don't know how you would avoid it. It may be that a retro drain is the better way to go.
need help have pond one air pump fitting 18mm I need to adapt to 8mm air pipe any ideas? The pump came with a rubber tube that is about 18mm but can not seem to find a fitting for my large air stone that has a 8mm pipe.
One of disadvantages with pump fed system. Some fish are very sensitive to pump vibration. When i switch to gravity fed filter, where the pump is outside the tank. The fish looks more happier.
Hello mate, that's a very good point which I hadn't considered. I know koi are very sensitive to vibration so it makes sense that taking the pump out of the water will help to take away some of that stress 👍👍👍👍
Hi I am currently in the planning stages of my up coming pond build. So I am planning g on a raised sleeper pond with a liner and I am unsure as to what size of bottom drain I need. My pond is going to be approx 5700 litres in volume. I watched one of your videos on the cons of having a 4” bottom drain. Do you think I should fit either a 3” or even a 2” drain. Also what bottom drain kit would you recommend?
Hi Graham, I would steer clear of 2" at that size. Your drain should really be specced based on your filter choice so depending what you choose to filter it with it will either be a 3" or a 4". Its an awkward size range in that you will either be up at the top end of 3" or down at the bottom end of 4". If you fall on the 4" side you will need to incorporate a means of flushing the line to waste at the full 4" opening, before any reductions. This should be a weekly occurrence. I have always used Spindrifter drains. They are not the cheapest but they are the best in my opinion and its not really an area I would scrimp on.
Brilliant explanation. Can not understand that people even consider pump fed. My main issue with pump fed is the solids being chopped up into a puree like substance which is very difficult to filter out.
Hi mate, yes very true. Sometimes its just not possible for one reason or another but I always advise putting a drain in if at all possible. Its a game changer. 🍻👍🍻👍🍻
First off, with you're incredible knowledge base how can there be any thunbs down, I don't get it. I have to thank you. I'm on my third build now. Fish are so big now I can't keep up withe mess, lol. Iv'e been using a hybid system of what you were talkng about. Gravity fed settlement tanks, from there pump fed to up flo bio filter gravity fed to waterfall, hard to hide but do-able. Been binge watchin since I subscribed a few days ago. Thanks
Hi mate, thanks very much and welcome 🍻👍🍻 It sounds like you are doing everything right if your koi are growing to big 😁😁 I read somewhere that 3 ponds is the average number before people are happy so maybe this is the last one 👍
This video helped me loads with getting my head around installing my Eazypod onto an IBC to rear some fry up. Is the bottom drain preferably in the middle or could I use the tap on the side of the IBC ?
Hi Lewis, bottom centre is the ideal position as you want waste to sink under gravity and be pulled in to the drain. If you can only put it on the side though it should be ok. You want it to be as low as possible and try and create a circulating flow around the bottom so the waste finds its way to the drain 👍👍
I have seen tons of videos and i am not related to you anyway, i dont know you at all BUT this is one of the very best content and explanation out there for us few noobs scratching heads on filter design / level basics and understanding. Thank you so much for this. Also, a) Do you have a video that you have done about sump design and what really is enough filtration than doing too much. b) Any video about k1 filtration and that if it really works or rather the only best thing to work among all options. I am torn between getting canister pond filters over sump based.m for my tiny 10ft dia x 4.5ft deep pit-pond. Any guidance on filtration essential for this shall be great. Thanks for your time Stay safe
@@DazzleKoi indeed got a lot of clarity. When you have time, could you possibly address my three queries too. Shall help me close my doubts and do what i need to 🙏.
Hi Sid, sorry, I didn't see your questions before. When you say 'sump' are you referring to a bottom drain? With regards to K1, it is in my opinion the best stand alone biological media there is. Bio relies first and foremost on surface area but also it is beneficial to provide different types of surfaces in that some are just that, on the surface of the media, but others are internal so tiny gaps and holes that what can reach but provide a different level of oxygen and exposure. K1 is designed to cater for all types of bacteria as well as having a very high surface area in general. Also, because it is semi buoyant, it can be agitated with air to dislodge dirt and so it can be easily cleaned without disturbing the bacteria. Waste that settle in and under bio media is big cause of bacterial infections and health issues. If by cannister filters you mean pressurised filters , I would avoid them if at all possible in favour of a koi specific , all in one filter. Pressure filter don't really cope well with koi waste products and are prone to waste and subsequently bacteria building up inside where you cant see it and cant clean it.
@@DazzleKoi thanks sir Yes by sump i meant bottom drain with top level similar to a horizontal stack of 4 chambers with various media, next to pond, that am using as filter, having water level similar in both - the pond and this chamber stack. The pump shall be in the last chamber, which shall lift mass from the bottom drain.
Hi Sid, yes I've got a video about choosing the correct sized sump for your pond based on what flow you will pull through it. To big means the velocity of the water is slow and you get waste settling in the pipe and harboring bacteria. If your velocity is not enough you will need to fit a means of flushing the line out with full pressure i.e. a T off before any pipe diameter reductions. Have a watch of this one if you get chance, it might be what you need th-cam.com/video/Gs0179ok258/w-d-xo.html
I've seen them hidden behind screens and things in the past. Its a tough one because you want to try and hide it away but you need to be able to get access to it for cleaning etc.
Here's what I'm planning im new to ponds but I came up with an idea i would like feedback on please. Im going to build a large pond roughly 30x20x5 with a 25' stream that will serve as the return. I plan on using a bottom drain inderground into a separate empty pond in my greenhouse approximately 8'x2'x2' (dug into the ground) the purpose of this is so water can flow up allowing the sediment to sick or even be filtered out through some basic filter pads. The the water will travel the 8' to an overflow that feeds a 15'x3'x3' gravel bed. I will have lots of plants growing in the gravel effectively turning the green house into a bog filter once the water level reaches max hight it will over flow in to a pump vault where its returned to the pond. Your thoughts?? would this work to help me both raise fish and grow food lol.
Hi Roy. I'm not going to pretend I understand your plans fully but from what I think you are planning to do it does sound feasible. Its certainly on a very big scale. Basically the tanks in the greenhouse are your filter boxes and the last box (which you call a pump vault) is the last chamber that will have your pump in to return water to the pond. Obviously you will need to get the heights of all the chambers correct. When your pump is turned off they all need to fill up to the top so all have to be at the same height. What I dont really understand is how you are going to flush the waste that they catch away? A mechanical filter simply collects all the waste together, it is then up to you to flush it out. But whilst it is still in the filter it is still in the water with your fish so it must be done regularly. I flush my filter waste out every single day.
Yes you pretty much got it. Thank you im not sure I can explain how I plan on allowing the gravel tank to be flushed without totally confusing everyone lmao. But I have planned for this about the best way I can explain it is similar to the centipede of a wetlands filter and reversing the pump vault from suck to blow 😆 🤣 😂 😹. Thank you so much im sure il run into problems as I always do but as long as it sounds like it can work then ill proceed with my endeavor. Thanks for your time cheers.
Another great piece of information, thank you for going into detail regarding to the two different set ups. I am at this place at the moment and planning to build my new pond this winter and you have helped me in my decision to go for gravity fed system. I do have one query, I read on a few forum sites that the bottom drain can effect the water temperatures during the winter and making it colder for the fish by pulling the cold water down! Is this incorrect? I wasn’t planning on getting an elaborate pond heater but I’m aware that the fish like to settle at the bottom over the winter months. Thank you again for sharing your expertise & information on your site. Could you possibly do a future video on skimmers, the best types and set ups? I am totally confused with the plumbing and how the weir works particularly also whether I can get away with using just one pump (Varipump 10000? ) only in my future gravity system incorporating a skimmer. All best Darren
Hi Darren, no, no issue at all with pulling cold water down. A pump would do the same but I don't buy in to that either. You need to maintain your filter and air all year round so your water is constantly moving and mixing anyway. Stratification is what they are referring too but it doesn't apply in such a small, artificial volume. It may apply in huge lakes and reservoirs but not in our back gardens. Heating isn't really necessary but it must admit it does help if you can just do something to keep the water going below say 6 or 7 Degrees C. I may look at putting a little inline electric heater in myself, I'll see how it goes. It isn't necessary though, you just need to keep a good eye on them. Yes I'll add the skimmer vid to my list. You can set it up to run off one pump but I've never done it. Have a look at this video, I think if I remember right they have done it and you can see the pipework. around the 3 minute mark. th-cam.com/video/Ba8Mmqd6xt0/w-d-xo.html
Hi Robert, I'm afraid not. Whichever way you go the water needs to be lifted at some point. You can use an air lift system which basically uses an air pump rather than a water pump and is a lot more efficient but it still needs electricity unfortunately 👍👍👍
I have an easypod and Evolution Aqua (well, their US distributor) pushed me during design/install to do a pump fed based on their design. I've see where you can flip the standpipe to make it a gravity fed filter, essentially lowering the overflow height I believe. Do you know why they recommend the pump fed, and why you determined for your use gravity fed was the better route. Moot point for me now since I didn't design a filter pit that would allow my filter water level to be at the pond water level (my sytem is pond, bottom drain to settling/swirl chamber, external pump to easypod, overflow back into pond).
Hi Josh, the Eazypod over here in the UK is either pump fed or gravity fed. It comes set up as pump fed because there are some models that can only be pump fed, such as the Complete model, so that is the default from the factory. You get the parts and instructions to turn it to gravity fed, it takes about 10 minutes to do. I would always choose gravity fed over pump fed personally for all the reasons in the video but my priorities are a spotlessly clean pond bottom and no pump in the pond for koi to injure themselves on. I don't know why they would recommend pump fed, that's very strange.
Hi Aaron, similar size to mine with 6 or 7 koi I would recommend the Eazy Pod. Its the smallest of the proper koi filters and does a great job. Dead quick and easy to clean and work really well. Always try to use a bottom drain if you can and a variable pump so you can get the flow bang on 5500 litres an hour.
@@DazzleKoi cheers for getting back to me again, unfortuantely as I have a liner and the way I've build the pond, a bottom drain isnt really an option unfortuantely, i was considering a pressure filter but am also considering a bog filter that I can DIY. the submersible pumps from all pond solutions look pretty good I.e. the 4500Lph or the 6000Lph. The good this is that because the pond is in my insulated shed, and it is higher up than some of the rest of the garden, i reckon i could use a syphon pipe to remove solids that arent sucked up by the pump cheers aaron
Hi mate, can you not fit a 3" tank connector on one side, close to the bottom, to take the water out under gravity to a filter?. If you fit it at one end of the pond and return to the other you can create a flow toward the take off point.
Yes mate, something like this www.bosta.co.uk/all-products/fittings/fittings-for-pvc-pressure-pipes/abs-fittings/liner-tank-connector-with-seal-13050?number=0440637&gclid=Cj0KCQjwyZmEBhCpARIsALIzmnI7Kf80r9hNj9_08i2GkHpZTGX4rs1n34niPI89PdtqtNLFS6yzns8aAjoLEALw_wcB
Very good well explained video. Well Done mate 👍before watching this video I never herd so much bullshit about people plumbing a koi pond .I thought I would need a plumbing team
@@DazzleKoi hi mate just wanted to get some advice. Hope you can help . Can you connect your skimmer into you bottom drain 4 inch pipe or can you put a side feed pipework into the easypod top many thanks in advance 😊
Hello Darran, i am building a small pond . it should about 1000 to 1200 gals, i shall fit a bottom drain after watching your video, should it be a 4 in or will 3in be ok, it will be going into a easy pot.
Hi Philip, there will be some that say it should be 4" and some (myself included) that say it should be 3". A 4" drain would future proof somewhat incase you wanted to go bigger in the future but the chances of expanding the pond without disturbing the bottom and the bottom drain are slim so I don't worry about that. The benefit to having 3" is that the water moves through the underground pipework much much quicker than it would through 4" so it constantly flushes it and keeps it from building up debris due to settlement. With a 4" pipe the flow is so slow (due to the Pod only needing around 5000 litres per hour throughput) that you get a lot of settlement which can harbor bacteria. Another small bonus is the 3" pipework is significantly cheaper than the 4".
Hey I need a reply for advice I want to have a gravity filter for my future koi pond Questions are that can we cover it and disguise the filter as a pond etc pls reply as I am in need of answers
Hi mate, if you want to feed your filter by gravity it means the top of your filter will sit at the same height as the pond water level. Yes you can cover the filter and hide it away, no problem. A lot of people put decking over them or hide them away in a shed a distance away from the pond.
Hi Bro.. I don't know my think is right, if we keep the the filtration champers little bit below the tank that overflow (by gravity ) connect to main tank ???????
Hi mate, the water level in the filter is the same height as the water level in the pond. When your pump is running it will be slightly lower in the filter.
Hi mate, I've never heard of anyone having a leak in 25 years so I don't really know what you would do to be honest. You only use pressure pipe underground so its practically bomb proof. I guess you would just cap it off at the pond end and be in the same position as you would be if you didn't fit one in the first place. I cant see how it would leak but if it did somehow develop a leak it could only be a small seep so its never going to empty the pond but it honestly wont happen 🍻🍻
Hi Humphrey, I can only assume they are not set up properly as the bottom should be kept spotless with a bottom drain. water Flow, air flow, circulation, bottom finish all contribute to getting the waste in to the drain.
Wouldn’t a negative of having gravity fed system with bottom drain be that you couldn’t have an in ground pond, unless you wanted to dig a massive pit along side your pond to house your filter and pump?
Hi Matt, I guess you could class that as a negative but in reality there are less dedicated koi ponds built that way these days and any that are simply dig the hole bigger to house the filter house to. It also means you can cover them completely with decking or similar so you don't see the filter house at all. Probably a bit more expensive though.
Excellent explanation. In almost every situation the gravity fed system will perform better. They do take more effort and cash to install but, the end result is worth it.
Thanks Lee. Totally agree 👍👍
Always ran 2 pumps twice the size of my pond does a great job at keeping water clean and tidy for fish
Awesome work explaining both systems. Thanks so much for explaining all of this with your graphs. Awesome work.
Thanks Douglas 👍
Glad I found your videos mate . Very informative and well delivered. I’m fairly new to the hobby and appreciate information like this . Well done.
Thanks Gary, I appreciate you taking time to say that 👍👍
All the best to you and yours for Christmas 🎅🎅🍻🎅🎅
My biggest regret of my current pond is not installing a bottom drain, currently running a retro bottom drain (with air)which does actually work fairly well but not as good as a proper one would.
Love your videos, your knowledge and the way you explain things is top notch👌
I’m currently on my second pond and wish I knew what I know now when I built it. Next pond will be the one but it’s probably a few years off yet!
Hi Mike, it sounds like you are on the exact journey 99% of us go on mate, first pond is a bit rubbish but whets our appetite, second one we think is the one, only to find we are still short of a couple of things. Third one is usually when you get what you want. Your ambition and knowledge grows and so does your pond, to be honest its the best way to do it I reckon.
I'm in the same boat in that I'm in a short term house at the moment so I've had to compromise a lot but when we move I'm planning something better. Like you though, it will likely be a few years off yet.
Now i understand what the different. Thank you so much mate.
You're welcome mate, thanks for taking the time to post 🍻🍻🍺🍺🍻🍻
i agree with most of this apart from pump fed leaving silt on the bottom, ive always used pump fed but if you have enough circulation ,then this will keep the bottom clean. But i do think your right in saying bottom drains are best , and i am currently converting my pond to a bottom feed system....nice video mate
Thanks Paul. Appreciate the feedback. How are you going about it? Are you using a retro drain or digging it all up?
@@DazzleKoi whilst im in the process of rebuilding my pond, thought i might as well try to fit a proper one...
Nice one, I imagine its a lot of work but I think it will be worth it in the end 👍👍
Great info, Any pump fed system should have a float switch fitted to prevent pond being pumped dry if a pipe comes off. You can also fit a retro bottom drain to a pumped system that works really well. Keep up the good content.
Thanks Martyn. Yes totally agree. I should have included those points with hindsight 👍
I agree with you 100% that gravity fed is better than pump. Unfortunately my small pond has to be pump fed. Ground level ponds are more difficult to install gravity fed systems. Not only do you have the cost of the bottom drain and fitting but you also have to sink your filters into the ground which adds another cost. I learnt the hard way about pump fed systems emptying the pond. That is why I have a small header tank turned upside down which my pumps sit on. It keeps it 10 inches or so from the bottom of the pond and so reduces the risk of losing your fish if something goes wrong. It isnt ideal and I would much prefer a bottom drain and gravity fed system. With a pump fed system you also need to vac the pond more often.
Hi Jim, in my defense I made this video at the same time as the last one so I didn't consider an in ground pond. I will try to include them in future videos as I know a lot of people have them.
Despite the negatives, pump fed filters can work really well, I think from my past experience with one that you need to work at it a bit harder in terms of maintenance etc These days we are all lazy and want everything low maintenance.
What about a retro fit bottom drain? Could that be an option for your pond? Gravity feed to a dry mounted pump and then pump in to your existing filter. Its a similar setup to what you have now but you are effectively installing a vac that runs 24/7.
Thanks for this explanation on the two systems and how they work! I've got some work to do now😁
Thanks Richard, much appreciated Sir 👍🍻👍🍻👍
Hey pal good reasoning provided and finding this very educational for all koi pond hobbyists to think about whether it is for an existing upgrade or new build!
Thank you very much, that's good to hear mate 👍👍
I dont disagree about bottom drains being the best system , i built my pond 20 odd years ago with a pump fed system , with hindsight and the experience i have now of keeping koi id probably go bottom drain , but to be fair ive still been very successful , not had any issues and the bottom of my pond is very clean without silt , granted i clean regularly with pond vac , and keep on top of maintainance . The hose is flexipipe , they dont damage themselves on that , or mine never have
Im going to be redoing my pond for next year so will be looking at retro fit bottom drain , but if i cant make it work im quiet happy pump fed ,
Just my views , another very good video , cheers
Hi mate, yes I agree, its definitely possible. The biggest problem is that because it needs more work to keep on top of it, a lot don't do it and that's when the problems come. If you are willing to pu the effort it consistently then I can definitely work well 👍👍👍
I have a bottom drain in my pond, I'd never build one without one now, the difference is amazing...Bottom drain all the way.
Hi John, yes same here. It really is a game changer 👍
@@DazzleKoi advice please, i'm fitting retro bottom drain. Would you advice to use pump fed or gravity fed system? Please
Always gravity fed if possible mate. You get the waste to the filter in one piece whereas if you are pump fed the pump chops it up and makes it a lot more difficult to take out.
i had pump fed retro drian on old pond and built new pond was going to build with proper botton drain but that meant replacing my current filter which cost 2k so had to stick with retro drian but i did leave my pump outside of pond in filter house. and tbh my pond floor is muck free compared to just a pump in pond without retro fit drian.
Only just built my pond, did not fancy the thought of having a drain under my pond, I have friends with both systems and neither seem to be any better than the other, pump fed systems have been running for 15 years with no issues on 2 ponds, one of the gravity systems had a leak from the bottom drain meaning the whole pond had to be re-done, i have no issues whatsoever, return on one side, pump on the other, flexi pipe which is no detriment to the fish and runs a nexus 220+, might take a little more maintenance but no bother to me. Had quotes of 15-20k to build the gravity system, built mine myself for 5k so more than happy 👍
Hi Lee, good to hear your setup is working for you. Other than £140 for a bottom drain the price should be no different. I've never heard of a drain leaking before but if one ever did I would advise just capping it off. That way you are in exactly the same position as if you didn't fit one in the first place.
@@DazzleKoi Yes the pond had a leak, just a slow but constant water loss, turned out to be the bottom drain and seeing the work needed to rectify put me off, I will see how the oase pump goes but so far doing a great job, simple system on a 2000 gallon pond, oase 10,000 premium pump, 55w uv, nexus 220 plus, only 4 koi so far and apart from the pipe work for the pump I’m happy. I wanted 75n blocks with viewing window, I’m no brickie and was quoted £600 a day for just laying the blocks, never mind everything else, no thanks so did it myself, 3ft below, 2ft above with 4x4 s only for the above secured into concrete, no easy task but happy with the result 👍
Sounds good mate. Its a good feeling when you do it yourself and it turns out well. Much more satisfying than paying someone else, plus you get to spend the money you save on some more koi 😁
A brickie with a mate costs around £300 - £350 a day in the north west but I bet they put koi tax on when you tell them its a koi pond. I ran a small building company until recently and I thought a lot about doing pond builds but my partner in the business didn't fancy it. Its hard work but i bet its really rewarding.
Getting a bit old now.
Good video, for koi a bottom drain is a must.
Thanks mate, yes I tend to agree with you 👍👍
Another great video. I have a bottom drain fitted too as all the forums I joined recommended it. The other disadvantage I found was the limited choice of filters.
Thanks Charmaine. Yes that's a good point, the choice of filter is indeed another big advantage, I didn't think of that 👍
Brilliant video thank you very much ,what air pump do you recommend for a wild life pond with about 30 fish in trying to get the water clear without using a filter .
King regards .
Hi Frank, sorry for the delay in replying, its hard to say without knowing your pond type, size, etc but you will struggle to get clear water without a filter in most ponds unfortunately. Its likely that you will have debris sat on the bottom which will harbor bacteria and if you add an air source it is likely to agitate it and stir it up causing you issues.
It may be better to look if you can incorporate a waterfall of some can to add aeration?
Great video, thanks. I've dug my pond out to a depth of 1.2m so still not clear on if or how gravity fed would work unless I'd also have to dig another 1.2m hole for the filter?
Can bottom drains be pumped to a higher filter?
Im planning on my 3mx2.5mx1.2m pond being a fish pond only, but ive used a larger than necessary liner so i can always add height using sleepers and retrofit a bottom drain in future.... Assuming it can be pumped to the filter.
Hi mate, is your pond fully below ground at the moment then?
@@DazzleKoi it is at the moment. I've my made sure there's plenty of excess liner so if I want to go higher in the future I can put another 40cm of depth in by building up with sleepers.
Its tricky this. In the past the answer was always just 'no'. But I know people do manage to do it nowadays. I've no experience of it myself so I would recommend facebook groups to get in touch with someone who does it successfully. I think you would need to bury a large settlement tank in the ground at the same depth as the pond and then pump out from that but waste settling in there would be a problem and I don't know how you would avoid it.
It may be that a retro drain is the better way to go.
need help have pond one air pump fitting 18mm I need to adapt to 8mm air pipe any ideas? The pump came with a rubber tube that is about 18mm but can not seem to find a fitting for my large air stone that has a 8mm pipe.
One of disadvantages with pump fed system. Some fish are very sensitive to pump vibration. When i switch to gravity fed filter, where the pump is outside the tank. The fish looks more happier.
Hello mate, that's a very good point which I hadn't considered. I know koi are very sensitive to vibration so it makes sense that taking the pump out of the water will help to take away some of that stress 👍👍👍👍
Hi I am currently in the planning stages of my up coming pond build. So I am planning g on a raised sleeper pond with a liner and I am unsure as to what size of bottom drain I need. My pond is going to be approx 5700 litres in volume. I watched one of your videos on the cons of having a 4” bottom drain. Do you think I should fit either a 3” or even a 2” drain. Also what bottom drain kit would you recommend?
Hi Graham, I would steer clear of 2" at that size.
Your drain should really be specced based on your filter choice so depending what you choose to filter it with it will either be a 3" or a 4". Its an awkward size range in that you will either be up at the top end of 3" or down at the bottom end of 4". If you fall on the 4" side you will need to incorporate a means of flushing the line to waste at the full 4" opening, before any reductions. This should be a weekly occurrence.
I have always used Spindrifter drains. They are not the cheapest but they are the best in my opinion and its not really an area I would scrimp on.
Brilliant explanation. Can not understand that people even consider pump fed. My main issue with pump fed is the solids being chopped up into a puree like substance which is very difficult to filter out.
Hi mate, yes very true. Sometimes its just not possible for one reason or another but I always advise putting a drain in if at all possible. Its a game changer. 🍻👍🍻👍🍻
Hi Darren,well explained mate.
Excellent details 👍👍👍👍👍⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
Thanks very much 🍻🍻👍👍🍻🍻
Very informative day many thanks 😊
Cheers John 🍺🍺🍻🍻🍺🍺
Brilliant - cheers.
Great video as usual,
Great video 👍
Thanks Adam, I appreciate that 👍🍻👍🍻👍
First off, with you're incredible knowledge base how can there be any thunbs down, I don't get it. I have to thank you. I'm on my third build now. Fish are so big now I can't keep up withe mess, lol. Iv'e been using a hybid system of what you were talkng about. Gravity fed settlement tanks, from there pump fed to up flo bio filter gravity fed to waterfall, hard to hide but do-able. Been binge watchin since I subscribed a few days ago. Thanks
Hi mate, thanks very much and welcome 🍻👍🍻
It sounds like you are doing everything right if your koi are growing to big 😁😁
I read somewhere that 3 ponds is the average number before people are happy so maybe this is the last one 👍
This video helped me loads with getting my head around installing my Eazypod onto an IBC to rear some fry up.
Is the bottom drain preferably in the middle or could I use the tap on the side of the IBC ?
Hi Lewis, bottom centre is the ideal position as you want waste to sink under gravity and be pulled in to the drain. If you can only put it on the side though it should be ok. You want it to be as low as possible and try and create a circulating flow around the bottom so the waste finds its way to the drain 👍👍
Great video
Cheers mate, I appreciate that 🍻🍺🍻
I have seen tons of videos and i am not related to you anyway, i dont know you at all BUT this is one of the very best content and explanation out there for us few noobs scratching heads on filter design / level basics and understanding. Thank you so much for this.
Also,
a) Do you have a video that you have done about sump design and what really is enough filtration than doing too much.
b) Any video about k1 filtration and that if it really works or rather the only best thing to work among all options.
I am torn between getting canister pond filters over sump based.m for my tiny 10ft dia x 4.5ft deep pit-pond. Any guidance on filtration essential for this shall be great.
Thanks for your time
Stay safe
Hi Sid and thank you very much for your kind words. I really appreciate that and its good to hear you benefitted in some way from it 🍻👍🍻👍🍻
@@DazzleKoi indeed got a lot of clarity.
When you have time, could you possibly address my three queries too. Shall help me close my doubts and do what i need to 🙏.
Hi Sid, sorry, I didn't see your questions before.
When you say 'sump' are you referring to a bottom drain?
With regards to K1, it is in my opinion the best stand alone biological media there is. Bio relies first and foremost on surface area but also it is beneficial to provide different types of surfaces in that some are just that, on the surface of the media, but others are internal so tiny gaps and holes that what can reach but provide a different level of oxygen and exposure. K1 is designed to cater for all types of bacteria as well as having a very high surface area in general. Also, because it is semi buoyant, it can be agitated with air to dislodge dirt and so it can be easily cleaned without disturbing the bacteria. Waste that settle in and under bio media is big cause of bacterial infections and health issues.
If by cannister filters you mean pressurised filters , I would avoid them if at all possible in favour of a koi specific , all in one filter. Pressure filter don't really cope well with koi waste products and are prone to waste and subsequently bacteria building up inside where you cant see it and cant clean it.
@@DazzleKoi thanks sir
Yes by sump i meant bottom drain with top level similar to a horizontal stack of 4 chambers with various media, next to pond, that am using as filter, having water level similar in both - the pond and this chamber stack.
The pump shall be in the last chamber, which shall lift mass from the bottom drain.
Hi Sid, yes I've got a video about choosing the correct sized sump for your pond based on what flow you will pull through it. To big means the velocity of the water is slow and you get waste settling in the pipe and harboring bacteria. If your velocity is not enough you will need to fit a means of flushing the line out with full pressure i.e. a T off before any pipe diameter reductions. Have a watch of this one if you get chance, it might be what you need th-cam.com/video/Gs0179ok258/w-d-xo.html
As long as the return pipe is higher in the filter it will return via gravity to the pond I have my nexus hidden pump fed
I've seen them hidden behind screens and things in the past. Its a tough one because you want to try and hide it away but you need to be able to get access to it for cleaning etc.
Here's what I'm planning im new to ponds but I came up with an idea i would like feedback on please. Im going to build a large pond roughly 30x20x5 with a 25' stream that will serve as the return. I plan on using a bottom drain inderground into a separate empty pond in my greenhouse approximately 8'x2'x2' (dug into the ground) the purpose of this is so water can flow up allowing the sediment to sick or even be filtered out through some basic filter pads. The the water will travel the 8' to an overflow that feeds a 15'x3'x3' gravel bed. I will have lots of plants growing in the gravel effectively turning the green house into a bog filter once the water level reaches max hight it will over flow in to a pump vault where its returned to the pond. Your thoughts?? would this work to help me both raise fish and grow food lol.
Hi Roy. I'm not going to pretend I understand your plans fully but from what I think you are planning to do it does sound feasible. Its certainly on a very big scale. Basically the tanks in the greenhouse are your filter boxes and the last box (which you call a pump vault) is the last chamber that will have your pump in to return water to the pond. Obviously you will need to get the heights of all the chambers correct. When your pump is turned off they all need to fill up to the top so all have to be at the same height.
What I dont really understand is how you are going to flush the waste that they catch away? A mechanical filter simply collects all the waste together, it is then up to you to flush it out. But whilst it is still in the filter it is still in the water with your fish so it must be done regularly. I flush my filter waste out every single day.
Yes you pretty much got it. Thank you im not sure I can explain how I plan on allowing the gravel tank to be flushed without totally confusing everyone lmao. But I have planned for this about the best way I can explain it is similar to the centipede of a wetlands filter and reversing the pump vault from suck to blow 😆 🤣 😂 😹. Thank you so much im sure il run into problems as I always do but as long as it sounds like it can work then ill proceed with my endeavor. Thanks for your time cheers.
No problem Sir, good luck with it. It sounds really interesting. I wish I had the space for something of that scale. Maybe one day 🍻
Another great piece of information, thank you for going into detail regarding to the two different set ups. I am at this place at the moment and planning to build my new pond this winter and you have helped me in my decision to go for gravity fed system. I do have one query, I read on a few forum sites that the bottom drain can effect the water temperatures during the winter and making it colder for the fish by pulling the cold water down! Is this incorrect? I wasn’t planning on getting an elaborate pond heater but I’m aware that the fish like to settle at the bottom over the winter months.
Thank you again for sharing your expertise & information on your site. Could you possibly do a future video on skimmers, the best types and set ups? I am totally confused with the plumbing and how the weir works particularly also whether I can get away with using just one pump (Varipump 10000? ) only in my future gravity system incorporating a skimmer.
All best Darren
Hi Darren, no, no issue at all with pulling cold water down. A pump would do the same but I don't buy in to that either. You need to maintain your filter and air all year round so your water is constantly moving and mixing anyway. Stratification is what they are referring too but it doesn't apply in such a small, artificial volume. It may apply in huge lakes and reservoirs but not in our back gardens.
Heating isn't really necessary but it must admit it does help if you can just do something to keep the water going below say 6 or 7 Degrees C. I may look at putting a little inline electric heater in myself, I'll see how it goes. It isn't necessary though, you just need to keep a good eye on them.
Yes I'll add the skimmer vid to my list. You can set it up to run off one pump but I've never done it. Have a look at this video, I think if I remember right they have done it and you can see the pipework. around the 3 minute mark.
th-cam.com/video/Ba8Mmqd6xt0/w-d-xo.html
Great explanation, is there any way to have gravity feed and gravity return to remove the need for electric / solar powered pump?
Hi Robert, I'm afraid not. Whichever way you go the water needs to be lifted at some point. You can use an air lift system which basically uses an air pump rather than a water pump and is a lot more efficient but it still needs electricity unfortunately 👍👍👍
I have an easypod and Evolution Aqua (well, their US distributor) pushed me during design/install to do a pump fed based on their design. I've see where you can flip the standpipe to make it a gravity fed filter, essentially lowering the overflow height I believe. Do you know why they recommend the pump fed, and why you determined for your use gravity fed was the better route. Moot point for me now since I didn't design a filter pit that would allow my filter water level to be at the pond water level (my sytem is pond, bottom drain to settling/swirl chamber, external pump to easypod, overflow back into pond).
Hi Josh, the Eazypod over here in the UK is either pump fed or gravity fed. It comes set up as pump fed because there are some models that can only be pump fed, such as the Complete model, so that is the default from the factory. You get the parts and instructions to turn it to gravity fed, it takes about 10 minutes to do.
I would always choose gravity fed over pump fed personally for all the reasons in the video but my priorities are a spotlessly clean pond bottom and no pump in the pond for koi to injure themselves on.
I don't know why they would recommend pump fed, that's very strange.
Hi daz
what sort of filtration system would you reccomend for a wooden above ground pond with a liner, similar size to yours?
thanks
aaron
Hi Aaron, similar size to mine with 6 or 7 koi I would recommend the Eazy Pod. Its the smallest of the proper koi filters and does a great job. Dead quick and easy to clean and work really well. Always try to use a bottom drain if you can and a variable pump so you can get the flow bang on 5500 litres an hour.
@@DazzleKoi cheers for getting back to me again,
unfortuantely as I have a liner and the way I've build the pond, a bottom drain isnt really an option unfortuantely, i was considering a pressure filter but am also considering a bog filter that I can DIY.
the submersible pumps from all pond solutions look pretty good I.e. the 4500Lph or the 6000Lph. The good this is that because the pond is in my insulated shed, and it is higher up than some of the rest of the garden, i reckon i could use a syphon pipe to remove solids that arent sucked up by the pump
cheers
aaron
Hi mate, can you not fit a 3" tank connector on one side, close to the bottom, to take the water out under gravity to a filter?. If you fit it at one end of the pond and return to the other you can create a flow toward the take off point.
@@DazzleKoi good point that, would that be a bulkhead type fitting to seal to the liner?
Yes mate, something like this www.bosta.co.uk/all-products/fittings/fittings-for-pvc-pressure-pipes/abs-fittings/liner-tank-connector-with-seal-13050?number=0440637&gclid=Cj0KCQjwyZmEBhCpARIsALIzmnI7Kf80r9hNj9_08i2GkHpZTGX4rs1n34niPI89PdtqtNLFS6yzns8aAjoLEALw_wcB
Very good well explained video. Well
Done mate 👍before watching this video I never herd so much bullshit about people plumbing a koi pond .I thought I would need a plumbing team
Thanks Stew. To much over complication in this hobby mate, keep it simple, its better all round.
@@DazzleKoi hi mate just wanted to get some advice. Hope you can help .
Can you connect your skimmer into you bottom drain 4 inch pipe or can you put a side feed pipework into the easypod top many thanks in advance 😊
Hello Darran, i am building a small pond . it should about 1000 to 1200 gals, i shall fit a bottom drain after watching your video, should it be a 4 in or will 3in be ok, it will be going into a easy pot.
Hi Philip, there will be some that say it should be 4" and some (myself included) that say it should be 3".
A 4" drain would future proof somewhat incase you wanted to go bigger in the future but the chances of expanding the pond without disturbing the bottom and the bottom drain are slim so I don't worry about that.
The benefit to having 3" is that the water moves through the underground pipework much much quicker than it would through 4" so it constantly flushes it and keeps it from building up debris due to settlement. With a 4" pipe the flow is so slow (due to the Pod only needing around 5000 litres per hour throughput) that you get a lot of settlement which can harbor bacteria.
Another small bonus is the 3" pipework is significantly cheaper than the 4".
just subscribed
Thanks Brian, welcome aboard 👍
Hey I need a reply for advice
I want to have a gravity filter for my future koi pond
Questions are that can we cover it and disguise the filter as a pond etc pls reply as I am in need of answers
Hi mate, if you want to feed your filter by gravity it means the top of your filter will sit at the same height as the pond water level. Yes you can cover the filter and hide it away, no problem. A lot of people put decking over them or hide them away in a shed a distance away from the pond.
Hi Bro..
I don't know my think is right, if we keep the the filtration champers little bit below the tank that overflow (by gravity ) connect to main tank ???????
Hi mate, the water level in the filter is the same height as the water level in the pond. When your pump is running it will be slightly lower in the filter.
@@DazzleKoi Appreciate your quick response
We can use the over flow water directly to main tank Without a pump in gravity fed system? ??????
Yes mate, if I understand correctly what you asking , that is right 👍
@@DazzleKoi
Thanks dude thanks a lot ......
No problem pal, good luck 🍻👍🍻👍🍻
Do a complete making video
Hi mate, I do intend making a video on the construction of my pond soon 👍👍👍
What if you have a leak on a gravity fed system with the pipework underground?
Hi mate, I've never heard of anyone having a leak in 25 years so I don't really know what you would do to be honest. You only use pressure pipe underground so its practically bomb proof.
I guess you would just cap it off at the pond end and be in the same position as you would be if you didn't fit one in the first place.
I cant see how it would leak but if it did somehow develop a leak it could only be a small seep so its never going to empty the pond but it honestly wont happen 🍻🍻
i know people who have bottom drains they vacumn the bottom of their ponds all the time and the pull loads of rubbish out
Hi Humphrey, I can only assume they are not set up properly as the bottom should be kept spotless with a bottom drain. water Flow, air flow, circulation, bottom finish all contribute to getting the waste in to the drain.
Wouldn’t a negative of having gravity fed system with bottom drain be that you couldn’t have an in ground pond, unless you wanted to dig a massive pit along side your pond to house your filter and pump?
Hi Matt, I guess you could class that as a negative but in reality there are less dedicated koi ponds built that way these days and any that are simply dig the hole bigger to house the filter house to. It also means you can cover them completely with decking or similar so you don't see the filter house at all. Probably a bit more expensive though.