Fancy Car...has NO HEAT? (Audi Q7 TDI)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ต.ค. 2024
- Winter is late this year, but it's still heating season!
The owner of this 2015 Audi Q7 TDI tells me that his wife's complaint is: NO HEAT in her SUV...
That means we have to diagnose the problem ASAP!!
Can we get this Audi to blow hot air again without breaking the bank?
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Enjoy!
Ivan - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
My guess is that the heater subscription expired.
🤣
If I were Larry the cable guy, i’d say, now that there’s funny.
No joke. Have you watched any of Louis Rossmann's channel? It's coming.
That is truly funny, I guess the next subscription for total climate control will just limit the blower fan speed .😊
Good one👍🏻
Or
Your social credit score has dropped. Heat is denied. Please report to the Ministry of Justice for re-education
A trip back in time for us seasoned mechanics: Who can forget the vacuum and cable controlled water valves...
2011 CRV for me. This summer, no AC and it was blowing hot. "I'll give it a couple of days..." Well it "Fixed" itself. Come October, no heat or so I thought. Go to the Honda delar. Customer service guy says "You have heat, but it's realllllllllllllly slow." Forget what the price was, I don't pay attention when I need something and I have the means to pay for it. 2+ weeks on backorder. He wasn't sure if he'd get one in a month. Then another week or so for an appointment. The heat did work. From cold, the cabin would get warm in about 15-20 minutes. He also said "If you turn the heat off it will go off, but it will take forever again to heat up". Hot engine wasn't too bad, maybe 4-5 minutes. I told him my first wheels was a air cooled VW Beetle and cold wasn't going to stop me. He said "I have you beat. I had a VW Thing". He also said "In the good old days, we would forced it on hot until the part comes in. But 'electronics'.....".
My 98 Volvo had a vacuum controled valve. If I remember right, it's normal position was open and closed with vacuum when you started the car.
In the hot summer it decided it didn't want to close, so I got a piece of hose and clamps and bypassed the heater core and left it that way.
I'm 78, and I do not remember any cable controlled water valves. I do remember the clock spring type heat risers on the exhaust manifold and choke plate though.
Fast detection of the problem and even faster solution - that car has too many parts 🙂 Good job, Ivan!
You are hot stuff!
Was asked for opinion on an overheating 2009 Jetta with sideways 5. Was fine in winter, overheated when weather warmed. One hot radiator hose, one warmish, so guy replaced thermostat, said it was a tough job. Same thing. Next he was going to try water pump, but that would require lifting front of engine, he wanted my opinion before doing that. I told him since one hose was getting hot, didn't think pump was problem.
I did a lot of research, finally found a post by a mechanic who fixed similar problem, said it was clogged heater core (no valve on these). Said the way the thermostat housing was designed, if no flow through the hose leading to the heater core, thermostat would never open?!?
Checked heater core hoses, one hot, one cold! As a test, bypassed the heater core, both radiator hoses got hot when thermostat opened, mystery overheat fixed. He left it like that, planned on replacing heater core before the next winter. RnR youtube vid showed tiny passages in heater core, no wonder it clogged, especially with the "lifetime" coolant these use.
If you have a mystery overheat on a VW product, run the heat and check heater core hoses to make sure both are hot. If not, investigate why.
Wish you could have taken that valve apart to see what broke down.
I like the tear downs.
Really enjoy watching you think through these problems! Very entertaining to my brain
I bet $220 got stuck in that valve
Nice quick fix Ivan. Leave the valve out unless the A/C performance suffers in the summer.
I've noticed that was a fairly common issue with Mercedies and BMW. The heater control valve just dies and well, no heat. The metal body control valves were much better. But the plastic ones like what's on this Audi, burn out after a few years. Awesome job Ivan! Lots of people wind up just eliminating them as they are not really needed. Oh, about the low air flow from the vents. Do the customer a solid and replace the cabin filter. It's very commonly overlooked.
The heater subscription must have run out.
Deleting the valve might present a problem with cooling in the summer, but I believe it's main function is to isolate the aux cabin heater from the engine. This russian fix probably results in a much longer warm up time for the cabin.
Anyway, they don't fit a valve just for the hell of it.
The same valve is used on numerous other VAG cars and whilst the original Audi part is quite pricey (around £200 in the UK) there are some reasonable quality aftermarket parts (e.g. Pierburg, Gates) that are around £70. Since it seems quite an easy job to change and a part failing to work is not going to cause expensive damage, I would be less concerned about using aftermarket in this case.
He forgot to pay for the subscription 😂
My Land Rover had a similar issue. After I had the engine rebuilt. Rebuilder put a 192° thermostat in, the car specs for 198°. The heater bypasses until ~194° (fast heat up for emissions). So idle and some "spirited" driving would get some heat generated putting the proper thermostat in fixed it. Also max heat is now dubbed "gates of hell" as I had replaced the heater core thinking it was clogged as only the input side was getting hot. (This was when I learned that the core had a bypass thermostat)
I keep trying to figure out whether people actually want all these fancy doodads on their cars or if it's just the carmakers adding more complexity so the dealers can make more money on all the repairs that will be needed and the carmakers can make even more money selling replacement parts.
Not to mention replacement cars when the owners get too frustrated with their current one.
My AC doesn't blow very cold in the summer. They put the proper amount in and everything tests fine pressure-wise on a gauge set. When I first got it, it needed blend doors replaced (WJ Jeep). Stupid dual-zone control. Bought a whole HVAC box from a part-out and also the aluminum ones that someone makes. I replaced everything in boxes and had a shop do the swap. I suspect the blend doors aren't able to travel all the way. If it was me, even 5 degrees would be worth a $200 valve to get the most out of the AC.
Seems like automakers add these valves for maximum AC performance (air handler box leaks) and as a side benefit they keep crud out of the heater core when the heat isn't needed, but i'm sure that part isn't a priority...
Also less stress or cycles on the heater core in theory... Don't want to be replacing those, especially in an Audi!
a/cwill have to cool the heater core would replace the valve great diagnosis
When you said that the cabin heats up, initially, then gets cold, I suspected that it was due to a bad flow valve.
I ran into a similar problem, a few years back. The valve, that was causing my problem, was vacuum activated rather than solenoid activated.
Wanted to say thank you...looked all over for a diagram of the heater core hoses...came across your video...would've never guessed it routes through the fender! Saved a ton of time and headache. Liked and subed!
Thank you!
Gotta say I loved the auxilary heater in my old Audi A4 2.0T. It would be around 32F in PA sometimes and within 1 - 2 minutes I would get air hot enough to cook an egg! My current Audi A6 doesn't seem to have it and I couldn't find anything in the SSP provided to technicians regarding an auxiliary heater, but at least I have supercharger whine and one of Audi's most reliable gasoline engines so a small trade off.
My car (Skoda - also VAG family) has the auxiliary heat option. It's fantastic. It's a diesel engine work whip and all my prior diesel vehicles have taken an absolute age to start producing any heat from the vents on cold mornings, to the point I'd be sat there engine idling for up to 20 minutes just to blow the mist off the inside of the windscreen to be able to drive at all. This car, within a minute - hot air from the vents clearing the windows. I assume it's some simple resistive electric ni-chrome wire heater assembly in the air path - ancient tech with nothing to go wrong but so damn effective.
the temp should stay in the middle even with heaters on i think one of the thermostats is duff. the smoke could be a coolant leak, it fills the valley under the inlet manifold and when you brake it leaks down the front of the engine onto the belt. there is a small theremostat under there aswell. well there is on older models. the water pumps also have plastic impellers that like to fall off and they dont really overheat unless its warm weather going up a big hill. it mite also have the water pump that covers the impellers they can get stuck
If it works it works. If AC is a little less colder in summer then buy the valve or live with it. Great job 👊🏻
Auxiliary heat would be a wonderful feature.
Those Diesel fuel catalyst heaters are quite popular in northern Europe.
@@AraCarrano I know what you're talking about but that's not what I'm referring to here.
Some winter packages at least in Europe come with glow plugs on the coolant lines. Auxiliary diesel heaters have also been an option on premium models and even Skodas for a long time. You can of course always retrofit. Some people even fit them to their electric cars!
It's been a few years, but my dad owned an 08' A8 and the heat did come up pretty quick as I recall, but than again the car was garaged. There was a way to run the climate control while the ignition was off for a brief time to heat the cabin, but the fan speed was limited to low or option 3 and it would eventually turn off after a period of time. I assume this used the auxiliary heat to continue providing heat with the engine off. I wonder if there was a limit to how high the fan speed could be and the aux heat able to supply enough with the engine running but cold? Granted with the ignition off, eventually that would drain the battery which was why the fan speed was limited and it turned off automatically.
@@Techhead777 That is not an uncommon feature with cars that have an electric water pump. Called "residual heat function"
Great diagnosis, and fast. My old 2010 Lancer has a similar issue where I feel the heater isn't fully off in Summer and the AC isn't doing as well as it should. Maybe I should investigate where the heater core flow valve is on mine.
Nice video and easy diagnosis with the thermal imaging camera.
I had a 1974 Mercedes 450SL that had no heat. The system had a similar on off valve and you regulated the heat with adding more outside air to cool the full heat down. I ended up adding a switch to turn the valve on and off. The center console and heater controls were beat up pretty good when the radio was pried out of the console and stolen.
I have installed second heater core valve on the return side on two of my vehicles and guess what.. A/C is ice cold in the summer! this prevents the conduction of heat through the return hose. It works!
Shouldn't matter if valve is on inlet or outlet side... 🤔
2024, Ivan what a start to the New Year. Masterful diag again. Dave in Guernsey, Channel Islands
Great work! You didn't get bogged down in the fancy system, and kept a simple coolant flow diagnosis to the end.
Happy to you and your better half. We could do with all the sunshine here in the UK.
Use to have an old ford fiesta Wen I was younger and not a lot of money.
In the winter I use to just bypass the heater control valve and run hot air . And vice versa in the summer
Sweet! Love a quick painless fix!
Nice diagnosis Ivan. Simple bypass
Nice work Ivan! So the car doesn’t complain with an error code that the valve solenoid is disconnected?
You are becoming the go to Audi guy
in eastern europe we install a common water valve and the work is done 😂
That smoke is likely leaking injector seals. These is a vent hole for each injector hole that exits just above the exhaust manifolds.
I have found the temp gauge on VAG cars to sit at the one temp even though actual engine temp can be a lot hotter or colder.
Technology surely helps when coupled with some logic!
Good diagnosis and I would have bypassed the shutoff valve as well. Just curious if the open circuit would set a code in the HVAC and whether you could bidirectionally control it with a scan tool.
$200.00 Of course a $15 part is that much. How ignorant.You must Comply! Great job Ivan.
This will be a great fit for the summer months.....the AC won't get cold. Russian hack not that good this time. You fixed the result and not the problem. Ivan go read Audi's theory of operation.
Exactly spot on.
How will the AC not work?
This fix will work fine for a few more years until the blend door foam starts blowing out the vents. Then spend $200 on the valve or $3000 rebuilding the HVAC box.
The shut off valve stops coolant from circulating through the heater core from the aux water pump when the heater is not in use; I believe the auxiliary water pump is only turned on when the heater is in use though it may also be part of the Start/Stop system (if equipped). Further no air will be vented through the heater core unless the heater is turned on. While it introduces some heat into the HVAC system, it simply means the AC will have to work a little harder to cool the car. So it's a temporary fix unless it works. OTOH it is an Audi with 100,000 miles which means this is likely just the start of a laundry list of sub systems that will continue to fail.
Many cars don't have coolant shut off valves and the AC works just fine... That's what blend doors are for 😜
My 2014 Ram diesel has an aux heater when in defrost mode to assist with defrosting the windshield on cold startup. Appears to be a common thing in newer vehicles.
Only problem with removing that valve could be difficulty warming up in very cool weather. Perhaps regularly below 15F and sub-zero weather as well. On my Ram Ecodiesel I run a front grille cover in weather regularly below 40F (OEM says 32F is cutoff) to aid in warmup and heat retention. Then again 15F is a typical wakeup temperature for me :)
Good fix though I'm guessing almost certainly there will be a code stored on a VAG vehicle for that valve now being an open circuit? No warning lights of course but will be a persistent code present on any scans, until the valve is replaced.
С наступившим Новым годом!
Вообще, я удивлен, как много у вас там европейских автомобилей.
Audis are notorious for clogged heater cores. CLR flush or similar is usually enough.
I found Thermocure to be really aggressive for corroded systems. My son has a 98 land cruiser and heater was weak, used the thermocure and 10 flushes later and all good. I bet CLR works well too though
Hi firstly the coolant has to be g12 , g13 dependent on its age as it protects all components and these engines take about 10 miles to warm up when it's cold. Obviously the valves are there so the engine heats up faster.
Diagnose Dan can help you out. A Dutch guy , good at german cars. He is on you tube, might heard of him .Or you should have . Greetz John.
Love thermal energy. Good job and diagnose
Good Job Ivan. Love PHAD. At first, I pictured the entire dash coming out for this fix. Always impressed with your ability to explain and make somewhat complex systems seem simple... a true sign of a great teacher. Even this decrepit 66-year old brain can follow your logic. lol.
Fantastic 2024 Audi video, one of many German car videos for the new year
Ah, love the sound of that diesel.
another brilliant diagnostic.
Ivan another great video. Diesels always tend to heat up slower until its driven for a short time. No big deal
formerly a heater was a dealer added option
I'm still here watching and learning thanks for the content
Auxiliary heater in this car you say? Its a Webasto Diesel Heater then right? Thats most likely the smoke out of the engine bay you mentioned thats where these heaters are ususally located and the exhaust isnt far away then.
Doesnt sound like it has an exhaust leak and a warmed up TDI doesnt smoke when idling.
I had to do a full overhaul on the Ardic 912D heater in my 2007 Diesel Volvo because it started smoking and flaming out only to restart the flame with a plume of smoke to the point of me just pulling the fuse and leaving it be until I was ready to do that job.
Its fuse No. 4 25amp in the engine bay fuse box for anybody interested BUT its Fuse 1 on earlier models. But Volvo labels their fuses really well actually so just look it up in the owners manual or in the fuxe box itself.
The unit was serverly sooted up inside and the burn chamber was so crusty even my favourite oven cleaner could not cut it and that oven cleaner is agressive parts left to soak in it for a few hours look better than new because it completely dissolves surface oxidization.
Had to to a few soak and wash cycles with the cleaner and sand the burned in crap off with sandpaper 😅
The heater was also all wet and sticky inside >unburnt fuel... running rich = stinky smoke so I replaced the fuel pressure regulator/nozzle assembly.
I got everything so clean that it literally started with zero smoke the first time and no exhaust smell at all.
Now it takes 60 sec to fire up, 2-3 Minutes until warm water reaches the heater core and from there on the coolant temp really picks up quick.
These older Ardic/Nordic branded heaters (in reality the company Ardic was bought by Eberspächer in the early 2000s) are really reliable and well made units, its unusual for them to need more than a basic cleanout and a new fuel nozzle even when they are now 15-20 years old. Parts are reeaaly expensive and not easy to get (basically the only way to get them is to buy original Volvo parts) like the fuel nozzle is 150$ alone. There are rare instances where the fan motor dies or parts of the wiring harness start to kinda smolder and short out where they enter the stainless steel housing of the heater. You need to make sure the wires are NOT pinched and free to move when reassembling these heaters.
That same heater was also the standard auxiliary heater for Audi back then, some! other VW models and it was used in some small yachts aswell.
I do love the russian repairs. Some of these vehicles are expensive to repair. Im sure that will be just fine until the summer when the heater core is hot and ya are trying to run the AC. I had a Tbird a lady wanted her AC fixed. Freon was empty. 2 orings right on top ford had them next day. Replaced and charged the system it blew cold as ice till the engine warmed up and heater core overpowered the AC. So I do some testing it has some fancy pants 6 port valve to control 2 zones in the heater core. Valve was stuck open and the solenoid was shorted. Replaced with Motorcraft part and boom AC worked great. Sent car back to customer and then she called couple months later when it got cooler. No heat. The controller of the valve is the ETAC heater control. Either controller had shorted the original valve or vice versa either way we had to get the heater controller repaired too.
yup visteon datc. tbird ls and s-type
the heater valves on those short out and can blow the 10 amp fuse, or they burn up the traces on the module first.
never seen one get stuck to ground (cold) that’s a first
That's about the fastest repair yet!!! Thanks Ivan!!!
I'm fast at removing broken extra parts 😂
Ivan Vw/Audi suffer from the Silica bag in the coolant bottle splitting and blocking the heater matrix.
Done lots of them. Not done a Q7 yet very interesting.
Now why would they put a silica bag in a coolant bottle? Sounds SILLY to me 😂
Well done Ivan , i bet she is so happy to be warm :-D
The cost of a new electric valve is silly, and they hid it :-(
I suspect it actually needs that valve for the air conditioner to work. Many vehicles have the heating and cooling coils stacked so the air flows through both. They use the cooling coil in the winter to remove moisture to defog/defrost the windows. They use the heater valve to shut off coolant in the summer and cycle the AC compressor. It takes up less room than splitting the air flow.
Hmm so where would the blend doors go then? Usually all of the air goes through the AC evaporator, and then the blend door directs a portion of it through the heater core based on the desired temperature 🤔
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics The blend doors will direct the air flow to the window, dash or floor depending on the settings and mix outside and cabin air into the system while using the cycling of the AC compressor and modulating the flow through the heater core to control temperature.
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics if it’s like my BMW, that valve you removed is modulated on-off to achieve the desired heater core temperature.
@@tiredoldmechanic1791 ok... But how can you set driver and passenger temperature independently? There HAS to be a dedicated temperature blend door for each occupant 😉
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics the pics on the net show that every side has its own flap to mix the fresh and heated air
Good diag well done i hate cold.
I googled that part number and the price is all over the place.... amazing.... Amazon has it for $25.00, even has the part number on the part....
With a 1 day guarantee 😆
Ouch. !
Solenoid and
Plastic pipe..
$ 195. What a great deal😂
With that filter cup being right on the front of the engine.. I bet the "smoke" was just some spilled oil there, burning off; from the last oil change or something.
You should check: Is the unpowered position fully open? My Acura Vigor is like that. It gets regularly exercised that way and hasn't failed yet in 31 years. Drawback is a bit of warm air after every hot shutdown/restart.
He flow checked the valve, powered and unpowered. Both ways was closed.
Watch out for failed water pump impeller gets loose on shaft at warmup. Look in radiator to see if there is flow.
Vag diesels in my experience behave in a strange way 5 degrees celsius and below and take forever to warm up, even with good new thermostats etc.
My current Skoda is a nightmare close to 0 degrees in the Uk.
Try VCDS software for Volkswagen Group vehicles.
Almost all european cars.
INPA soft for BMW.
No TAP TAP TAP attempts? yeah i know half an amp but still coil isn't shot or it would be 0 amp. did you test if u can actually stop all heat with that removed?
Thank you very much it was so helpful. Could you please tell me the name of the piece. Thank youjave a wonderful day.
you are awesome on diagnosing ivan .....such a cheap fix and can i ask why do audi put a valve there if really its not needed?
Great job my friend. I'd leave that valve off. BTW Santa came today. New tool charged updated registered. Can't wait to try it out.
Good job excellent diag and repair
Great start for the new year, especially the bonus footage! 👍👍🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
"Global" coolant flow problem. Funny. We had a new Cut-Rate mattress store open by us. It was the "World Headquarters".How lucky were we? World Headquarters m a.
Brings back mixed memories! I'm of an Age now so can look back to when Southern England had winters - every year. My first recollections of motor mechanicing was my dad returning in high dudgeon, stomping snow from his boots on the back door mat while waving the distributor cap from his works vehicle ( all petrol back then) - this was then cooked in the oven for fifteen minutes before any sparks went anywhere. The only other possibility was a tow by a friendly soul but our milkman had learnt to change his route and our other immediate neighbours worked shifts. Even motors that fired up would all sport various pieces of cardboard over their radiator grills - mainly to prevent their carburettas freezing - heaters in vehicles were dreams for the future!
However; I spent hours wading through wads of tin ware dismantling heaters for various reasons - in builder's trucks - it's nearly always pencils & pens down the vents jamming the fan or Radweld in the hoses and fittings! Come across stuff like that in the States? Poor man's leak cure that usually ends up borlixxing the rad and thermo? Some folk even poured rice in the coolant! At least you were saved all that.
How much would it cost to simply put a simple shut off valve back there to cut off the flow during summer. I had a Chrysler with a vaccuum actuated valve on the heater hose and if it didn't shut off it really hurt the air conditioner performance.
Or make the valve default open.
Default open will allow hot water to flow through heater core and compromise Air conditioner efficiency. A simple shut off valve would be better.@@petrnemecek4379
It could have been a few other things ! But im sure the owner would like it back to OEM !
Ivan, Time to get out the snow shovel or snow thrower. Winter Storm Ember is headed your way on Sat Jan 6 into Sun Jan 7... expect at least 6 inches of snow in your area.
Got my snow tires and 4x4 ready to rock 😎👍
I owned a TDI (diesel VW)... it NEVER made very much heat. Infact, in subzero ambient temps., the engine would COOL OFF when sitting at stoplight. (Efficient engine = not much waste heat) I ended up covering the radiator with cardboard the 12 winters I owned it.
Hello Ivan, VW have SSP-Self Study Program source and read.
See SSP Audi 361 page 54
Thank you!!
I have the exact same problem lem on my 2014 q7 TDI. I found a new replacement valve on Amazon for $27.00. Is this a simple job to replace this valve, or do I need to take my car to a mechanic. What would be an estimated time to replace thus?
Thank you!!
Jon
Valve will be needed come summer, if it anything like a Benz or BMW. Flow needs to stop for cooling inside.
Another Audi….what a surprise!
Nice Russian repair, Ivan. You've been killing it with those Audi cars! Good heavens, the rat's nest of hoses. GREAT VIDEO!
Interesting Ivan.
Happy New Years Ivan !!
Great Stuff.ivan keep em' coming
That packaging though....
I seem to remember a Volkswagen with a wax battery that stored heat to speed engine warm up on cold mornings . Think it was on diesels only .
Auxiliary heater picked up the heating when the engine was cold. Engine started showing heat, aux heater shut down.
Is it worth installing a heater core diverter valve in a normal car (to boost summer AC performance)?
Yes, I installed one in my 2006 Dodge Ram 2500… the AC could not overcome the heat being pumped through the heater core without it.
Can't believe the Engine light didn't come on with an unplugged valve.
Right? It’ll have codes for open circuit in hvac module. Better than ford and GM with their shudders.
Or limp mode.
nice and fast. I am assuming that valve is to help warm up the engine faster when it is cold and people put it on max heat. that's where the auxillery heater helps heat up the cabin.?
Same assumption here. Extended warmup time leads to increased engine wear and above that poor mpg. Shutoff valve there to speed up engine warmup while simultaneously the aux heater ensures a heated cabin.
Would be surprised if the milage in winter went down after the valve broke down
I did the same thing on my 2011 touareg tdi and now I reverse it for the summer. When I bench test mine it seemed to function in both directions. 12v
Just make a dummy plug with a resistor in it or smt to avoid the fault code ;)
Another NP'sR,
Thx Ivan 😊
Diesels are naturally cold, drove a Cummins for years in the oil patch. Takes them forever to warm up, then when you start driving they cool right down again. If you let the water level drop to much, they’ll develop a hydro lock that needs to be bled out.
Why would they cool down when you start driving?? Sounds like you had a bad or missing thermostat LOL
Thanks Ivan!
I not sure but is all that stuff really necessary just a thought
To many modules!! Or even the valve thing. Audi I'd run away lol. Nice fix Ivan!! What did customer decide to do with bad pump?