Thanks for the review guys! A lot of work has gone into the classes since the crowdfunder ended and each class definitely has cool things to do on their turns. About fragility in general or dying before your turn begins-heroes go first, so everyone will always get a turn, and even if you drop to 0hp you don't go unconscious. Hope that clarification helps, maybe we can jump into another oneshot some day!
Thanks for taking the time to do the call and play with us! Fair point about not dropping unconscious at 0. We'd be happy to hop in another call one day, maybe once the full release is out we can do that. I'd love to see the finished classes.
Loving the videos guys! I had already backed DC20 and Nimble 5e, but I’m excited to see your future videos to help me decide where to invest my time and money in the TTRPG space!
The idea that one roll for the attack and damage is actually quite interesting, this really looks like a very fun way to streamline dnd especially for beginners trying to learn the system
It's fantastic for beginners coming into TTRPGs. Things are very smooth and streamlined. The one roll for attack and damage is a really cool idea. It does really mess with compatibility with D&D though. It'll be a hard line to walk for the designer.
@@TabletopRPGTrends I think I can make it work, to introduce people to ttrpgs I used start with vampire the masquerade and werewolf the apocalypse, since they had a decent amount of character customization and complexity to make it fun but was much simpler compared to DND , but that lead to trip ups when changing system, this makes it much closer to 5e that I think I could make it work to bring others into the hobby
I like these ideas. As always, I would want to house rule some things. I think some kind of risk added to the reward system of attacking multiple times, so that it isn't always the best option. For example, a miss becomes more dangerous the more dice that are rolled. A 2 die miss is a critical failure. A 3 die miss is an epic critical failure. Or something like that. I think I would also house rule armor a bit, leaving the rules for the defense action as-is, but also allowing light, medium and heavy armor to reduce an opponent's damage die by 1, 2 and 3 levels respectively. The exception being any weapons with an armor piercing trait.
Multiple attack penalties have left a bad taste in the mouth since 3e, but here it is so minor that it isn't a big issue, but adding some more dynamism to it, like you suggest, could be a big help!
It is definitely a different attack system. I'm sure there would be something to make fighting a god impossible, but anything super high level will be just as easy to hit yea. It is a weird thought.
Even if you can get past that, I truly can't imagine how this system could possibly sit side by side with 5e and have things be balanced. It's too different. It takes away +to hit and ac for a completely different mechanic, which is bound to throw many monsters off balance, and to claim on top of that that a GM could run these two systems side by side and still make things *faster*?? How??
That's when you put the Master in Game Master. "Your warhammer connects squarely with the God of War's head. He reaches up, grabs your wrist, and squeezes. Your bones crumble like chalk. No, you do not get to use your reaction to defend, you're level four and he's a god. What did you think was going to happen?"
@@Skullivon If that's the kind of GM you want to play with or be, that's fine. That wouldn't fly with the groups I play with, or with me personally. If I'm going to turn the game into a narration, then I'm going to play a game built for narration rather than simulation. Edit: Before anyone says it, yes there is some narration that exists in any roleplaying game. I'm specifically talking about combat or other kinds of danger resolution situations. There is a reason mainstream rpgs focus on those types of mechanical resolutions, people tend to dislike narrative resolutions on that level.
I feel like the complaint that it feels like three attacks is all to really do just tells me you need to use more imagination?? There's a ton of character and class specific abilities, added as you level up, so the combination of reactions, special abilities or spells, movement, along with basic attack gives a ton of choice for each round. Also, for martial classes in dnd you tend to get extra attacks with levels, so the multi attack evens out if that's how you want to play.
As we said in the review, feeling like you wish there was more to do is going to be class dependant, but with the cheat it felt that way. If your aren't getting hit then you won't use your defend reaction, if you are ranged you won't use your Interpose reaction, help reaction isn't that useful, then cheats get a free move, so what what is there to do? You can select some underhanded abilities to do additional stuff sometimes, but that's the way we both felt. Evan has changed cheat abilities so they have to be in melee, so now there will be some dynamism at least Or do you mean imagination like role playing the three attacks more interestingly?
@TabletopRPGTrends sorry if my comment sounded sharp. I see your point about not using the reactions, and then the cheat feels limited. I did mean imagination as roleplay, whether that's investigating for more information about enemy weakness, or doing something to draw attention or change the focus of the fight, or even just describing your hits differently. There's some fun in letting the narrative shine when the gameplay is lower crunch and quick. I also always love it when my players ask me if something crazy is possible, we can work towards the cool moment with a skill check or something, but they've got to ask.
It's all good, no offense taken. You are right that fun in combat often comes down to the player making it a good time. But when reviewing game systems, you kind of have to take the player out of it and look at the rules themselves.
Cons: potential for lethal combat encounters, difficult to min/max, shorter books to read (this is a hidden pro!) Pros: very simply convertible for the DMs out there that have tons of D&D material. Skill DC's are the same, HP's are the same. Magic items are wondrous, no +1 longswords, written very folktale like. Long Rests are in the hands of the DM and are a reward unto themselves. Reactions create more focus as a group around the table. A tenth of the spells, all delightful and useful: will make those reluctant to play casters more willing. The stripped back simplicity of the writing is stunning, the books are about 25% of the page count of WoTC and a relief to read. Art is boss. Using Lazy DM philosophy in that a combat encounter should progress the plot, then the more lethal stakes should mean shorter adventures with more meaning and likewise quite reduced campaigns but still with plenty of downtime activities and world interaction. I've been following the design videos for Nimble since it's launch (at 2x speed!) and it's been a big help in understanding the design philosophy behind it. Sounding a tad evangelical , but my DM and I are getting D&D bloat fatigue, especially since the 2024 release is so underwhelming, poorly balanced and many of the expected clean-ups were ignored i.e. spell verbal, material, Component bonus action confusion, mounted combat, what skill and tool to use for picking locks and disarming traps: just write it on one page in one place! Nimble will be our next venture, the rest of the table is reluctant, I'm looking forward to shelving the 600+ spells in D&D and actually just playing a mage for the fun of it, not the decision paralysis.
Nice! Yea, I've listened to a lot of his design streams too and I think he has a good philosophy about DMing which I shared in the video and I totally agree with. The game is very very easy to run and I love that. Apparently they have revamped the classes so they aren't boring to play. I'll have to give them another shot, but that was a big concern and frustration while playing. Mage definitely looked fun though, even in the preview. I definitely don't mind a scaled back 5e. I do have concerns about compatibility though. The way things affect each other in 5e ends up with very different results in Nimble. for example, just pushing. In 5e, pushing doesn't affect much because you have a dedicated movement, but in Nimble, if you get shoved, you need to spend one of your precious actions to get back in melee. This is just a very basic example. I think I need to run more games and play more at high levels to really see, but I have big concerns it will not play nicely if you mix the rules/monsters.
I don't like that the half-orc with the two-handed battle axe is MORE likley to hit the nimble halfling swashbuckler than vice-versa. That really kills it for me. Thanks for the in-depth review. I'm sick of reviews that only talk about one or two very exciting things, and not in very much detail, that end up with me spending $60 on a book and then being disappointed with half of it, and the rest of it is a no-go. I don't have a lot of hobby dollars, and most of them that I've spent in the last several years have resulted in a book gathering dust until I can sell it.
Yes, the attack and damage system is quite different and has far reaching outcomes in the game design, like what you just mentioned. Glad the review helped. That's exactly what we were hoping for in this channel! We hope people get enough details (including the good and the rough parts) to understand if the game is for them. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for the love! I believe someone mentioned that in the discord. I am in the process of recording potential games. I'll add this to the list to check out
I have a for fun table with a bunch of friends with a really loose rule of cool logic when people drop in and out as they please. It started as an improv experiment just to goof around with that friend group (4 of them are regular players at one of my standar tables). For one of their bday we ended up playing and although we had fun we ended up being NINE players and combat dragged down inmensely. I wish that I knew about this system last week because this seems like it would be a game changer for that table
That sounds like it could be a great table for nimble, especially if some player are new! Also sounds like a pretty chaotic time. Kudos to you for running that lol
Wow, i've just started creating my own game where the attack rolls work the exact same way as in this game, though i have some different mechanics that create a different dynamic, but still.
2:20 If Nimble is compatible with 5e to the point that characters can play side by side, is the same true of Nimble and the variants (A5E, TotV, DC20)? At least, in the creator's opinion or yours?
We didn't ask about nimble and other game compatibility. Personally, I wouldn't allow a 5e and nimble PC side by side at my table because I think it'll end up with some issues. I definitely wouldn't combine nimble with any other game, like DC20. They are just too different. I'm sure you can do any or all of these, but you had better have a really loose DM with players who aren't min maxers. But for the average table I wouldn't recommend that.
@@TabletopRPGTrends I think Nimble curbing min/maxers at the table is a good thing. I've had m/m's throw the game way off with the way 5e is out of balance past 9th level.
@@leatherguru8904 agreed that it is a good thing for the party to be on the same level. I'm just saying that mixing games will end up creating some potentially broken combos or cutting some things off at the knees.
Honestly I've played Nimble, and it's cool but by the end it didn't feel faster, the time of combat felt mostly the same and even tho there are some rules that are better in nimble, like dying, the way attack is dealt and crit, it's not that faster. I think it's a good system if your campaing is focused on combat and it's a short campaing or a one shot. Nimble is a good system and people should give it a try, but I trully believe if your combat is slow or boring, it is probably because it is not engaging enough, maybe it is narration, maybe it does not have any stakes on it, talk to the players, see what they like or don't like about it, adapt and be creative, set traps during combat, make your players run for their lives, incentivise creative problem solving, maybe a dragon is to hard for then, but collapsing that bridge on it's head will make the fight more manageble and there will give a common objective to the party instead of just punching the dragon to death.
The math behind attack rolls is really weird. I mean, player using d12 weapon can literally ignore the whole Adv/DisAdv system, because even at lowest it grants a pretty high 77% chance to hit, while the difference between base 91% and 99% with 2Advs is unnoticeable in practice.
I think this is intentional. Missing just isn’t that fun. This also makes monster hp math a bit easier too. There’s also a far more likely chance to crit with smaller dice so big weapons are more for reliable damage and smaller are more chaotic. I think a lot has changed since you played but also I think you probably only played level one in which you haven’t got up subclass or all the other abilities along the way. Which is pretty similar to 5e. That said, I do think I like dc20s curve a bit more but overall since it essentially forces you to do other things with your actions.
@@GagePeterson Missing could be fun if system provides options for player to do something about it. Missing should be an opportunity for desicion to be made. Also, crits make dice explode. Ironically, even with exploding dice mechanic, bigger dice is still better than smaller. Yes, d4 has higher chance to explode, but even so it has lower average result than d12 with lower chance to explode.
Just FYI, we played a variety of levels from 3-5. I know a lot has changed, so I'm sure some of these things are not exactly the same and hopefully have resolved some of these issues. Regarding dice damage, even with Crits, high dice weapons do more damage, but if you are a cheat, then Crits end up doing a lot more.
@@shnobz_kotik I'm pretty sure big damage dice are still supposed to be better, just less so than in 5e. Lower damage dice weapons have other advantages. You're not going to wield a greatsword in one hand, or hide a longsword in your boot like you could with a dagger.
Generally if you are distracted during combat, you don’t care enough about what is happening to be a good player. Much like in real life, if your friend was in a fight and you are googling what an uppercut looks like in real life, you might ignorant of life priorities. Paying attention in a game is key to your tactical advantage if one exist. Turning the tide, escape, saving people, overwhelming a foe/foes because you are paying attention makes you a better player. If all of this is too much for you, Xbox for you? Perhaps PS5 games might be more your level of game.
If the system isn't going to give me any meaningful decisions to make outside of my turn, I have no incentive to pay attention. Why pay if nothing is being sold?
Been following the design videos (at x2 speed!) closely since supporting the release. Really appreciate his clarity and simplicity. Compatibility is probably more for DM's. As stated in the video a DC13 perception check is the same, likewise players know that if they're 5th level and have 40HP they're doing ok: the nomenclature and mathematics is identical. This means the DM can use all the books and material without trying to convert to a totally different system. So, yes, it is the only game out there that is compatible 100% in a meaningful way. Draw Steel and DC20 use different systems; though DC20 is pretty close, this makes conversion with Nimble very simple.
I don't get the obsession with faster and more simplified combat. Just don't play a game with actual combat rules if you want it to be more narrative than dicey. Nimble doesn't actually sound easier than the current 5e system though, and in some ways it sounds a lot more like Pathfinder 2E.
I get the pursuit of it to some degree. If a simple skirmish takes forever in 5e and you can barely fit one in a session then it came be really annoying. At the same time, people often want epic combats and don't mind it being too long, so a system kind of needs to do both. If you want a game that is 20% combat and 80% social/exploration them this kind of system could make perfect sense. But even if you want 50% combat then having super quick combat can be unfulfilling.
Yes, I think that's an interesting point for sure. If the point is speed to get through it, why do that combat at all? D&D combat can definitely get boring and tedious, so a little spice would be nice
This feels like it’s made for tables that actively dislike combat, which is fine, but it’s definitely not for me. Also not changing DCs for skill checks from 5e is a big miss in my opinion, seeing as I find the skill system in 5e to be lacklustre. Also I feel like forcing a strong degree of 5e compatibility is a fool’s errand.
I think it's for players that enjoy combat that is more loose and narrative who don't necessarily want to output so much mental energy and time in combat. But yea, it probably isn't going to work for the type of game where combat is the main focus, like dungeon delves.
It's crazy to me that people are trying to *simplify* 5e. It's already so shallow that all characters are really just aesthetic variations on three core builds. And no, this is not compatible with 5e. Completely different action system, completely different dying mechanics, different level 1 hit points, different damage breakpoints, what looks like saving throw penalties, spells at different levels, ASIs at different levels. "Nimble 5e" is to "D&D 5e" as "D&D 5e" is to damn Vampire: The Masquerade 5e. Ie, there's a 5 in the name and that's about it. This is just another bargain bin D&D spin-off trying to capture an ever-shrinking slice of the post-5e market, and like all of them it misses the point: The players who like D&D simple are mostly set moving to D&D2024 anyway. The people interested in new systems are the ones who like it complex.
@@yurisei6732 There's not much to say. I think you speak on a place of bias. We all experience only a portion of the fandom we consume, the portion we're in or that we are aware of. There is much more to reality than what you said. It's not because 5e streamlined some facets of D&D that it is still an easy to use system, specially to new players. If D&D was an easy system it wouldn't need a special edition of the PHB exclusive to twitter, with Jeremy Crawford high on coke trying to fill in inevitable gaps that such rigid rules leaves behind. There is lots and lots of talks and feeligs of people who are busy and don't have much time to game anymore, so if 3 hours every week or 3 hours every 14 days is what you get, you really should look for game systems that leave space for storytelling, not game systems that a single combat takes the whole 3 hours. Or systems that fucks you over after you allocate time in your schedule to play just to make you spend 3 hours rolling death saves to see if you roll above or bellow 10. Nimble v1 made a spin on D&D. It is a set of rule that seeks to homebrew D&D to this audience. Nimble v2 however is trying to give its own spin on it. Yes, it is still a D&D based game, but it has distanced itself from its core inspiration that now it has its own personality. I've been playing Nimble since 1.3 now. We're in 1.9, and the game is really fun. I feel like D&D 5e should use even more streamlining, not because it's too complex for me to understand, but because it's unnecerssarily complex in places where it shouldn't and it doesn't care how boardgamey it feels sometimes. 2024 PHB addressed a lot of stuff, but not this. So even so it is easier to grasp, it answers no itches of those who already grasps 2014 ruleset but wishes it was just... less burocratic in execution. 2024 PHB doesn't do that. Nimble does that.
The compatibility is a little loose, but if you are comfortable winging things then it works well at low levels. I'm still skeptical of higher levels though. There are a lot of things where I just wouldn't quite know how to convert a 5e monster to Nimble, or how to apply this spell effect on them, etc etc.
Kickstarter (over): www.backerkit.com/c/projects/nimble-co/nimble-2-your-best-5e-combat-ever
Website: www.nimble5e.com/
Thanks for the review guys! A lot of work has gone into the classes since the crowdfunder ended and each class definitely has cool things to do on their turns. About fragility in general or dying before your turn begins-heroes go first, so everyone will always get a turn, and even if you drop to 0hp you don't go unconscious. Hope that clarification helps, maybe we can jump into another oneshot some day!
Thanks for taking the time to do the call and play with us! Fair point about not dropping unconscious at 0. We'd be happy to hop in another call one day, maybe once the full release is out we can do that. I'd love to see the finished classes.
Nice to see people taking a look at Nimble. Looking forward to future episodes.
Same. It's an interesting take on the classic formula, it should be fun to see how it continues to change!
Loving the videos guys! I had already backed DC20 and Nimble 5e, but I’m excited to see your future videos to help me decide where to invest my time and money in the TTRPG space!
Glad you are enjoying them! And that's the exact reason we want to do these, to help people see which systems they'd like best.
Your channel is off to an awesome start! Excited to see more from y'all!
Thanks a ton!
The idea that one roll for the attack and damage is actually quite interesting, this really looks like a very fun way to streamline dnd especially for beginners trying to learn the system
It's fantastic for beginners coming into TTRPGs. Things are very smooth and streamlined. The one roll for attack and damage is a really cool idea. It does really mess with compatibility with D&D though. It'll be a hard line to walk for the designer.
@@TabletopRPGTrends I think I can make it work, to introduce people to ttrpgs I used start with vampire the masquerade and werewolf the apocalypse, since they had a decent amount of character customization and complexity to make it fun but was much simpler compared to DND , but that lead to trip ups when changing system, this makes it much closer to 5e that I think I could make it work to bring others into the hobby
Loving the content!
Thanks!!!
I appreciate the breakdown
Outstanding coverage! I backed this, and I really want to get this set for all the VTT.
The speed of combat will make this into the next big thing!
I think it's definitely got some tables that will really enjoy it!
I like Nimble, backed it. However, it's starting to look like Savage Worlds. So, I might incorporate the two. Fast, fun and furious.
I like these ideas. As always, I would want to house rule some things. I think some kind of risk added to the reward system of attacking multiple times, so that it isn't always the best option. For example, a miss becomes more dangerous the more dice that are rolled. A 2 die miss is a critical failure. A 3 die miss is an epic critical failure. Or something like that.
I think I would also house rule armor a bit, leaving the rules for the defense action as-is, but also allowing light, medium and heavy armor to reduce an opponent's damage die by 1, 2 and 3 levels respectively. The exception being any weapons with an armor piercing trait.
Multiple attack penalties have left a bad taste in the mouth since 3e, but here it is so minor that it isn't a big issue, but adding some more dynamism to it, like you suggest, could be a big help!
A very NIMBLE release!
I see what you did there! :P
"You are just as likely to hit a GOD, as you are a slime." That really tells me everything I need to know, there's no way I could take that seriously.
It is definitely a different attack system. I'm sure there would be something to make fighting a god impossible, but anything super high level will be just as easy to hit yea. It is a weird thought.
Even if you can get past that, I truly can't imagine how this system could possibly sit side by side with 5e and have things be balanced. It's too different. It takes away +to hit and ac for a completely different mechanic, which is bound to throw many monsters off balance, and to claim on top of that that a GM could run these two systems side by side and still make things *faster*?? How??
That's when you put the Master in Game Master. "Your warhammer connects squarely with the God of War's head. He reaches up, grabs your wrist, and squeezes. Your bones crumble like chalk. No, you do not get to use your reaction to defend, you're level four and he's a god. What did you think was going to happen?"
@@Skullivon If that's the kind of GM you want to play with or be, that's fine. That wouldn't fly with the groups I play with, or with me personally. If I'm going to turn the game into a narration, then I'm going to play a game built for narration rather than simulation.
Edit: Before anyone says it, yes there is some narration that exists in any roleplaying game. I'm specifically talking about combat or other kinds of danger resolution situations. There is a reason mainstream rpgs focus on those types of mechanical resolutions, people tend to dislike narrative resolutions on that level.
I feel like the complaint that it feels like three attacks is all to really do just tells me you need to use more imagination?? There's a ton of character and class specific abilities, added as you level up, so the combination of reactions, special abilities or spells, movement, along with basic attack gives a ton of choice for each round. Also, for martial classes in dnd you tend to get extra attacks with levels, so the multi attack evens out if that's how you want to play.
As we said in the review, feeling like you wish there was more to do is going to be class dependant, but with the cheat it felt that way. If your aren't getting hit then you won't use your defend reaction, if you are ranged you won't use your Interpose reaction, help reaction isn't that useful, then cheats get a free move, so what what is there to do? You can select some underhanded abilities to do additional stuff sometimes, but that's the way we both felt.
Evan has changed cheat abilities so they have to be in melee, so now there will be some dynamism at least
Or do you mean imagination like role playing the three attacks more interestingly?
@TabletopRPGTrends sorry if my comment sounded sharp. I see your point about not using the reactions, and then the cheat feels limited. I did mean imagination as roleplay, whether that's investigating for more information about enemy weakness, or doing something to draw attention or change the focus of the fight, or even just describing your hits differently. There's some fun in letting the narrative shine when the gameplay is lower crunch and quick.
I also always love it when my players ask me if something crazy is possible, we can work towards the cool moment with a skill check or something, but they've got to ask.
It's all good, no offense taken. You are right that fun in combat often comes down to the player making it a good time. But when reviewing game systems, you kind of have to take the player out of it and look at the rules themselves.
Cons: potential for lethal combat encounters, difficult to min/max, shorter books to read (this is a hidden pro!)
Pros: very simply convertible for the DMs out there that have tons of D&D material. Skill DC's are the same, HP's are the same. Magic items are wondrous, no +1 longswords, written very folktale like. Long Rests are in the hands of the DM and are a reward unto themselves. Reactions create more focus as a group around the table. A tenth of the spells, all delightful and useful: will make those reluctant to play casters more willing. The stripped back simplicity of the writing is stunning, the books are about 25% of the page count of WoTC and a relief to read. Art is boss.
Using Lazy DM philosophy in that a combat encounter should progress the plot, then the more lethal stakes should mean shorter adventures with more meaning and likewise quite reduced campaigns but still with plenty of downtime activities and world interaction.
I've been following the design videos for Nimble since it's launch (at 2x speed!) and it's been a big help in understanding the design philosophy behind it.
Sounding a tad evangelical , but my DM and I are getting D&D bloat fatigue, especially since the 2024 release is so underwhelming, poorly balanced and many of the expected clean-ups were ignored i.e. spell verbal, material, Component bonus action confusion, mounted combat, what skill and tool to use for picking locks and disarming traps: just write it on one page in one place!
Nimble will be our next venture, the rest of the table is reluctant, I'm looking forward to shelving the 600+ spells in D&D and actually just playing a mage for the fun of it, not the decision paralysis.
Nice! Yea, I've listened to a lot of his design streams too and I think he has a good philosophy about DMing which I shared in the video and I totally agree with. The game is very very easy to run and I love that.
Apparently they have revamped the classes so they aren't boring to play. I'll have to give them another shot, but that was a big concern and frustration while playing. Mage definitely looked fun though, even in the preview. I definitely don't mind a scaled back 5e.
I do have concerns about compatibility though. The way things affect each other in 5e ends up with very different results in Nimble. for example, just pushing. In 5e, pushing doesn't affect much because you have a dedicated movement, but in Nimble, if you get shoved, you need to spend one of your precious actions to get back in melee. This is just a very basic example. I think I need to run more games and play more at high levels to really see, but I have big concerns it will not play nicely if you mix the rules/monsters.
All three of those "cons" sound like pros to me, lol
I don't like that the half-orc with the two-handed battle axe is MORE likley to hit the nimble halfling swashbuckler than vice-versa. That really kills it for me.
Thanks for the in-depth review. I'm sick of reviews that only talk about one or two very exciting things, and not in very much detail, that end up with me spending $60 on a book and then being disappointed with half of it, and the rest of it is a no-go. I don't have a lot of hobby dollars, and most of them that I've spent in the last several years have resulted in a book gathering dust until I can sell it.
Yes, the attack and damage system is quite different and has far reaching outcomes in the game design, like what you just mentioned.
Glad the review helped. That's exactly what we were hoping for in this channel! We hope people get enough details (including the good and the rough parts) to understand if the game is for them.
Thanks for watching!
Hey, thinking of doing a vid on EZD6 and EZD6 Wastelands? Love your Unoptimised channel and approach.
Thanks for the love!
I believe someone mentioned that in the discord. I am in the process of recording potential games. I'll add this to the list to check out
I have a for fun table with a bunch of friends with a really loose rule of cool logic when people drop in and out as they please. It started as an improv experiment just to goof around with that friend group
(4 of them are regular players at one of my standar tables).
For one of their bday we ended up playing and although we had fun we ended up being NINE players and combat dragged down inmensely. I wish that I knew about this system last week because this seems like it would be a game changer for that table
That sounds like it could be a great table for nimble, especially if some player are new! Also sounds like a pretty chaotic time. Kudos to you for running that lol
Beware: Nimble and Nimble 5e are two different things from the same creators
Just a heads-up for anyone searching for it online
Vagabond would be a great TTRPG to check out!
That's on the list! I'll see if we can get it to work
@TabletopRPGTrends yay, looking forward to it!
Wow, i've just started creating my own game where the attack rolls work the exact same way as in this game, though i have some different mechanics that create a different dynamic, but still.
That's funny! It's the first time I've heard of this style, but it's very interesting and has much deeper implications than I expected at first.
Interpose is an option in Marvel Multiverse RPG too! I’d love to see y’all review that one too
Yea we'd love to do that one too!
It sounds close to Pathfinder but more fun
2:20 If Nimble is compatible with 5e to the point that characters can play side by side, is the same true of Nimble and the variants (A5E, TotV, DC20)? At least, in the creator's opinion or yours?
We didn't ask about nimble and other game compatibility. Personally, I wouldn't allow a 5e and nimble PC side by side at my table because I think it'll end up with some issues. I definitely wouldn't combine nimble with any other game, like DC20. They are just too different.
I'm sure you can do any or all of these, but you had better have a really loose DM with players who aren't min maxers. But for the average table I wouldn't recommend that.
@@TabletopRPGTrends I think Nimble curbing min/maxers at the table is a good thing. I've had m/m's throw the game way off with the way 5e is out of balance past 9th level.
@@leatherguru8904 agreed that it is a good thing for the party to be on the same level. I'm just saying that mixing games will end up creating some potentially broken combos or cutting some things off at the knees.
@@TabletopRPGTrends I'd agree. 5e is already broke enough, lol.
Honestly I've played Nimble, and it's cool but by the end it didn't feel faster, the time of combat felt mostly the same and even tho there are some rules that are better in nimble, like dying, the way attack is dealt and crit, it's not that faster. I think it's a good system if your campaing is focused on combat and it's a short campaing or a one shot.
Nimble is a good system and people should give it a try, but I trully believe if your combat is slow or boring, it is probably because it is not engaging enough, maybe it is narration, maybe it does not have any stakes on it, talk to the players, see what they like or don't like about it, adapt and be creative, set traps during combat, make your players run for their lives, incentivise creative problem solving, maybe a dragon is to hard for then, but collapsing that bridge on it's head will make the fight more manageble and there will give a common objective to the party instead of just punching the dragon to death.
All fair points. It does feel like it would be a great beer and pretzels game or for a spontaneous one shot.
The math behind attack rolls is really weird. I mean, player using d12 weapon can literally ignore the whole Adv/DisAdv system, because even at lowest it grants a pretty high 77% chance to hit, while the difference between base 91% and 99% with 2Advs is unnoticeable in practice.
Yes indeed it is very different! Feels like you can safely ignore disadvantage with a d12 and advantage gives almost no benefit
I think this is intentional. Missing just isn’t that fun. This also makes monster hp math a bit easier too. There’s also a far more likely chance to crit with smaller dice so big weapons are more for reliable damage and smaller are more chaotic. I think a lot has changed since you played but also I think you probably only played level one in which you haven’t got up subclass or all the other abilities along the way. Which is pretty similar to 5e.
That said, I do think I like dc20s curve a bit more but overall since it essentially forces you to do other things with your actions.
@@GagePeterson Missing could be fun if system provides options for player to do something about it. Missing should be an opportunity for desicion to be made.
Also, crits make dice explode. Ironically, even with exploding dice mechanic, bigger dice is still better than smaller. Yes, d4 has higher chance to explode, but even so it has lower average result than d12 with lower chance to explode.
Just FYI, we played a variety of levels from 3-5. I know a lot has changed, so I'm sure some of these things are not exactly the same and hopefully have resolved some of these issues.
Regarding dice damage, even with Crits, high dice weapons do more damage, but if you are a cheat, then Crits end up doing a lot more.
@@shnobz_kotik I'm pretty sure big damage dice are still supposed to be better, just less so than in 5e. Lower damage dice weapons have other advantages. You're not going to wield a greatsword in one hand, or hide a longsword in your boot like you could with a dagger.
Generally if you are distracted during combat, you don’t care enough about what is happening to be a good player.
Much like in real life, if your friend was in a fight and you are googling what an uppercut looks like in real life, you might ignorant of life priorities.
Paying attention in a game is key to your tactical advantage if one exist. Turning the tide, escape, saving people, overwhelming a foe/foes because you are paying attention makes you a better player.
If all of this is too much for you, Xbox for you? Perhaps PS5 games might be more your level of game.
While this is true, a portion of that responsibility fails on the game system to support that. Some games will inherently be faster or slower.
If the system isn't going to give me any meaningful decisions to make outside of my turn, I have no incentive to pay attention. Why pay if nothing is being sold?
Yeah im not convinced this is 5e compatible...
It was definitely a big concern of ours. It seems very possible but probably harder than it might seem.
Been following the design videos (at x2 speed!) closely since supporting the release. Really appreciate his clarity and simplicity. Compatibility is probably more for DM's. As stated in the video a DC13 perception check is the same, likewise players know that if they're 5th level and have 40HP they're doing ok: the nomenclature and mathematics is identical. This means the DM can use all the books and material without trying to convert to a totally different system. So, yes, it is the only game out there that is compatible 100% in a meaningful way. Draw Steel and DC20 use different systems; though DC20 is pretty close, this makes conversion with Nimble very simple.
THE CHEAT
I don't get the obsession with faster and more simplified combat. Just don't play a game with actual combat rules if you want it to be more narrative than dicey.
Nimble doesn't actually sound easier than the current 5e system though, and in some ways it sounds a lot more like Pathfinder 2E.
I get the pursuit of it to some degree. If a simple skirmish takes forever in 5e and you can barely fit one in a session then it came be really annoying. At the same time, people often want epic combats and don't mind it being too long, so a system kind of needs to do both.
If you want a game that is 20% combat and 80% social/exploration them this kind of system could make perfect sense. But even if you want 50% combat then having super quick combat can be unfulfilling.
i prefer to make combat tactical and exciting, not a thing to skip as fast as possible. But i admit, D&D Combat is boring AND tedious
Yes, I think that's an interesting point for sure. If the point is speed to get through it, why do that combat at all? D&D combat can definitely get boring and tedious, so a little spice would be nice
OR... you could play a better system. There's plenty out there.
Haha, there's a lot of good systems out there, that's for sure. This one is definitely not for everyone!
This feels like it’s made for tables that actively dislike combat, which is fine, but it’s definitely not for me.
Also not changing DCs for skill checks from 5e is a big miss in my opinion, seeing as I find the skill system in 5e to be lacklustre. Also I feel like forcing a strong degree of 5e compatibility is a fool’s errand.
I think it's for players that enjoy combat that is more loose and narrative who don't necessarily want to output so much mental energy and time in combat. But yea, it probably isn't going to work for the type of game where combat is the main focus, like dungeon delves.
Seems like pathfinder 2e.
but worse!
Action economy is basically PF2e yea
Isnt this just the p2e system?
Action economy is basically PF2e yea.
It's crazy to me that people are trying to *simplify* 5e. It's already so shallow that all characters are really just aesthetic variations on three core builds.
And no, this is not compatible with 5e. Completely different action system, completely different dying mechanics, different level 1 hit points, different damage breakpoints, what looks like saving throw penalties, spells at different levels, ASIs at different levels. "Nimble 5e" is to "D&D 5e" as "D&D 5e" is to damn Vampire: The Masquerade 5e. Ie, there's a 5 in the name and that's about it. This is just another bargain bin D&D spin-off trying to capture an ever-shrinking slice of the post-5e market, and like all of them it misses the point: The players who like D&D simple are mostly set moving to D&D2024 anyway. The people interested in new systems are the ones who like it complex.
That's simply not true at all.
@@brunobotelho4502 Care to elaborate, or did you just feel the need to register your objection?
@@yurisei6732 There's not much to say. I think you speak on a place of bias. We all experience only a portion of the fandom we consume, the portion we're in or that we are aware of. There is much more to reality than what you said.
It's not because 5e streamlined some facets of D&D that it is still an easy to use system, specially to new players. If D&D was an easy system it wouldn't need a special edition of the PHB exclusive to twitter, with Jeremy Crawford high on coke trying to fill in inevitable gaps that such rigid rules leaves behind.
There is lots and lots of talks and feeligs of people who are busy and don't have much time to game anymore, so if 3 hours every week or 3 hours every 14 days is what you get, you really should look for game systems that leave space for storytelling, not game systems that a single combat takes the whole 3 hours. Or systems that fucks you over after you allocate time in your schedule to play just to make you spend 3 hours rolling death saves to see if you roll above or bellow 10.
Nimble v1 made a spin on D&D. It is a set of rule that seeks to homebrew D&D to this audience. Nimble v2 however is trying to give its own spin on it. Yes, it is still a D&D based game, but it has distanced itself from its core inspiration that now it has its own personality. I've been playing Nimble since 1.3 now. We're in 1.9, and the game is really fun.
I feel like D&D 5e should use even more streamlining, not because it's too complex for me to understand, but because it's unnecerssarily complex in places where it shouldn't and it doesn't care how boardgamey it feels sometimes. 2024 PHB addressed a lot of stuff, but not this. So even so it is easier to grasp, it answers no itches of those who already grasps 2014 ruleset but wishes it was just... less burocratic in execution.
2024 PHB doesn't do that. Nimble does that.
@me "there's not much to say", then proceed saying a lot lmao
The compatibility is a little loose, but if you are comfortable winging things then it works well at low levels. I'm still skeptical of higher levels though. There are a lot of things where I just wouldn't quite know how to convert a 5e monster to Nimble, or how to apply this spell effect on them, etc etc.
Only a 1/4th in but so far its a copy/paste of pathfinder 2e
It's definitely got pf2 action economy, but everything else seems pretty different