2021 Adam: "I just don't see a need for 3D printing in my process at this time" 2025 Adam: "I just got an SLS printer that's taking up an entire wall of my shop to add to my print farm!"
a 3D Printer is still a tool after all. Tools are like Pokemon, gotta catch em all, and they're always inventing newer, more legendary ones with every new generation.
I bet he wishes he had these when he was at ILM. So many of the Star Wars props could be produced this way without worrying about the process of replacing a damaged one.
@@TheBigburciesomebody should scan the original sprues from the truck and tank kits that were kitbashed into the Star Wars ships, so that the authentic look and relationship with real vehicles can be preserved in new designs.
@@dddddyynit’s just nonsense to be glad a whole class of technology was made available to a wider market and promptly axed. Tools are inherently dangerous and it’s always your responsibility to use the proper PPE.
@@dddddyyn I'm glad there are definitely no other ways "amateurs" have access to turning nylon, carbon fiber, silica and other materials into an inhalable dust!
This model is designed to not require any respirator, according to form labs, IF you follow the proper procedure. Hence the gloves chamber, the cartridge system, and the integrated vacuum. The instructions state to use a respirator if local exhaust particulates are above a defined threshold (ACGIH Threshold Limit Value) but it shouldn't reach that threshold with proper configuration of exhaust. I would assume the form labs field tech would explain that to Adam. Pretty sure he'll be fine with or without one depending on his personal work practices.
I think they were relying on the built-in ventilation to suck the dust to the back end of the cabinet. You can see it flowing that way in some moments. I think they were going with the 95% effective PPE as opposed to the full sealed enclosure.
As someone with the certs to do maintenance and training on these machines, I wanted to scream at the screen a couple of times here. The guy from Formlabs was way too lax about the safety IMHO. But I guess it looks better for the cameras if you're not wearing PPE and keeping the hood open. And for Norm. Hollowing out parts is not what you want to do here, unless you fill that void with other parts. You'll just end up with an excess of used powder. Shoot for 30% packing density if you can (which is hard to reach, I know, but hollowing parts is going to make it a whole lot harder :D ). It does feel wasteful to print solid but having a bunch of excess used powder that you don't know what to do with is also a pain. Also, make sure you follow the maintenance schedule on the machine. And for the optical cassette and filters I'd just do it before or after every print rather than waiting for the timer to run out. Makes it easier in the long run IMHO. Also keep things clean around the machine. Even a single strand of hair in the hopper can ruin a print if you're unlucky. And be mindful of the blasting media so that you don't bring it back into the Sift, too much of it will make the PrinterWatcher abort the print and you might end up having to discard a bunch of contaminated powder. I'd hope the rep from Formlabs went through all this but I kinda got the feeling he didn't.
@@Daniel-rd6st It does. But it has to be mixed, in the case of PA12, with 30% fresh powder before it can be used again. The problem if you keep printing at low densities is that you end up with a hopper that is full of used powder that doesn't get re-used fast enough. You can technically use straight used powder but then you run the risk of poor quality or just failed prints altogether.
@Daniel-rd6st yes but for quality you have to have a certain percentage of fresh to used powder because it gets heated and cooled on the MJF machines we run 70/30
We had one of these machines at my old job and it worked incredibly well, though I would just make sure you keep on top of the dust! The thing becomes messy in no time at all, and you really dont want to wait until there is a fine layer of powder coating everything within a 10m radius of the machine. Upkeep is also critical, making sure to vacuum the filters and do as much cleaning as you can as often as you can afford - makes the machine run much smoother and you will get more consistent prints. We found a 50/50 mix of used and fresh powder to be about the most used powder to cycle before getting defects. Also as others have mentioned, you will end up with way more used powder than you will know what to do with so dont worry about designing parts to be volume efficient to maximise how much powder you can recover. Cleaning time is also something to consider so if you can just have a piece be filled solid you may as well just leave it filled to save on cleaning time. PPE is also super important! Nylon 12 can definitely impact your lungs and if I was ever a bit relaxed about not wearing a respirator it would noticeably impact my health. Otherwise happy printing!
Yeah - personally I'd leave the lid closed just to avoid the powder getting everywhere. I have to deal with that enough when powder coating. I mean, I'm a PPE stickler but sometimes, the mess helps keep me that way.
Isn't this technically _still_ fused deposition? It's just a different method of delivering the material to its destination, and a different method of melting it for fusion, but still the same fundamental principle of stacking slices.
@@SebastianWeinberg not necessarily. FDM is specifically referring to a machine that deposits material that is directly fused to the layer below it, usually by extruding a solid filament through a heated nozzle, and only deposits said material in the exact pattern that forms each layer of print, with the rest of the build volume remaining a void/air. This means any overhangs or floating pieces need supports to keep them in place for the duration of printing. SLS requires an entire layer of material dust in the build volume, which then a laser sinters only select parts of to make the solid component, before placing a whole new layer of material down and repeating the process. This also means that, since the parts are suspended in powder that is roughly the same density, there is effectively no need for support structures. You could think of SLS as working similarly to resin printing, just flipping the laser and build chamber, but really each type of printing is its own separate thing.
@@SebastianWeinberg FDM and SLS are different subsets of AM (additive manufacturing). Using a laser to sinter powder instead of using a nozzle to extrude molten plastic is a distinctive enough characteristic to merit labeling it as its own separate form of AM. If you don't adhere to that logic, you could also call MSLA/DLP printing FDM because the action of the printer is depositing resin by allowing it to flow on to the build plate and then fusing it into a specific shape.
i have 14 printers, its took me almost a decade to get what i have but this is goals. this is how metal 3d printing becomes something we can do in our homes.
I feel like you could print these types of things already assembled to avoid that "won't fit" issue just because of not needing supports. I'd love to see you try that print!!
This was my thinking also ! I think they can print-in-place - would be neat to see them try again with that method... might have to adjust tolerances - the press fit looked a little too tight.
sintered powder will have different tolerances than plastic filament or resin. as is, with the current tolerances, the joints would fuse together and it would just be a solid figure. one way would be to adjust tolerances on the file as you said. a quicker way would be adjusting the printer setttings (if there aren't physical requirements needed, only thing would be aesthetics, only getting iffy if you push it too far). other way, that they're taking a whack at, is post processing (sanding/filing down would work eventually).
Try printing those same action figures with the same joints fully formed. so no assembly is required. that process looks like it would be able to do that. cleanup would be more challenging, but would be interesting to try.
Was actually thinking about the same, what would happen if you just tried to print in place? I am guessing the powder would be packed so tight into the joints it would be mechanically locked...but maybe not?
FFF printing actually has models that print assembled. all kinds of things not just action figures search print in place in your fav print repository 🤠
The buttons on the outside of the fume hood seem like a massive oversight. Constantly having to deglove to activate the vacuum or start the sifting leads to leaving the fume hood open, which will destroy your lungs, even with the fume hood activated.
The gloves are a recent addition to the system. For years it didn't have those at all so reaching the buttons was easy. But, normally you'd start the sifting right away and leave it running as you're working. The vacuum is only used at the end when you're all done and you're cleaning up. But yeah, being able to reach them while wearing the gloves wouldn't be a bad thing for sure.
when do you have to open it to press the buttons? Start the sift at the beginning, then start the blower, run them for the entire sift cycle, then deglove, start the vac, clean up, and you're done. most of the stuff you see them doing (taking the grate off the sifter) is just for filming.
Sounds like it needs a button or external switch pressed to activate the vacuum? That means de-gloving if you are by yourself. Maybe they need (or have) a foot pedal option?
It's called "ungloving", the act of removing gloves from ones hands. "Degloving" is an entirely different process, which is a medical term for a traumatic injury.
We need Tested for a long time please use PPE! Also when nylon absorbs water naturally it get more flexable! I'm sure the powder is bone dry. Try it again in a week! With FDM nylon you can also dye it with RIT dye. I'd love to see sls parts tested with dyes!
They can be dyed but since it's dark gray the options are of course quite limited. But Formlabs recently launched white nylon as well which can be dyed any colour you want.
SLS parts don't get flexible with water they do with heat so when dye or cerakote them we have to watch the temperature we've left PA12 in water for a couple weeks all it did was absorb water
Printing and handling powder media without ppe like a papr hood and a jumpsuit and gloves is a great way to get untreatable interstitial lung diseases and to bring aerosolizable powder home with you. The plastic sls companies like to pretend this is only a metal powder problem but it just is only presented as such because there hasnt been sufficient research to study in an additive specific context. The lung damage from similar powder media is well established in other industries. Wonderful tools, just need to be safe to use them. I cant believe you guys pulled an exposed chamber bin out with no ppe.
This is so cool. It's amazing not just how much this stuff has advanced, but how much more accessible this tech has become over the last decade or so. I have a ~7 year old CR-10S (heavily upgraded) and I think I'm going to get a small SLA printer pretty soon. And this is like a legit industrial rapid prototype machine! Not exactly the kind of thing the average maker is going to have in their home workshop right away (Holy sticker shock, Batman!) but the fact that this is a thing you can own and operate outside of an industrial setting makes me super excited to see what kind of stuff will be available to the masses in just a few more years.
We’ve all been there! In my experience nylon 12 does have some flex to it, but like any material it depends on the thickness of the structure. I created a set of ball and socket joints somewhat like those shown, but minimized the connection surfaces as shells approximately 1/4 thick to allow for enough give for insertion of the ball (without tolerance for a firm fit). Obviously good idea to prototype and print test fit fitted joints be sure they will function and snap together.
Yes, surprised me that there seemed to be no flex, despite some walls being 2mm thick. On further reading it appears the material may be 12CF, which is carbon fibre reinforced and may explain the metallic-type tapping sounds and rigidity.
man this is so amazing, were moving into another golden era of innovative vibey tech and its a crazy time to be alive. Cyberpunk world really isn't far out!
You could look at opening up the socket side of the joints then print a TPU bushing to allow for movement with the needed holding. This may also benefit from polishing the ball side of the joints to keep the movement smooth.
I wonder if wearing a mask when moving the container between the machines or fiddling with the power with your hands would be a good thing to do to prevent some inhalations of that powder.
Yes, the lack of PPE use was disturbing. Sure, one time won't kill you, but it's all about being in the habit because the continued exposure is a problem.
@@MTGeomancerI suspect their technician was a little bit too chill about the exposure risk, he apparently did mention stuff about PPE but said things like they could use the hood open without masks,* and was even there during one of the shots where Adam was just pouring loose nylon powder into the machine. *Yes I know there's extraction air flow but you could see the dust flying off in all directions before being captured by the air flow, that level of protection should really only be treated as a backup on top of a respirator, not a sole protective measure
Being a big fan of 3D printing, I am THRILLED beyond measure that you kept in the ultimate fail of this build! Learning is always a process, as you often show on this channel. And to see 2 skilled builders, with years of experience in different methods, with some of the best tools possible, STILL manage to fail at your 1st attempt. And the humor and classic (in Heinaman voice) "Well, THAT didn't work..." attitude... chef's kiss! LOLOLOLOLOL!
"I can still feel some warmth." Yeah, I noticed that on Norm's first print the cautionary note about checking the temperature before removing the canister went right out the Tested window.
It's really fun when we have to pull a part off the top of a build that's only been cooling for 10 minutes in the post processor of our HP MJF 4200 we have nice thermal gloves and the hold the heat for quite some time. In our machines it takes 48 hours to natural cool we do that for critical Parts that we want to avoid any warping parts printed in PA12GB for firearms. We normally run the fast cooling which takes 16 hrs depending on density and build height. So it's still really warm in the middle but safe enough.
Even after the printer/sift reports that it's safe to extract the cake you can still feel a bit of heat in the middle of it unless it has been cooling for quite some time.
I love how much joy you get from something as simple as the sound the pieces make. And how you took the inability to assemble the project in stride, finding that funny as well. So good to see these days.
I love the fact that Adam and Norm printed action figures in parts when the sls process could have printed them entirely assembled in one go. Its like scratching the surface of what's possible and I cant wait to see them play with it more .
I've got an SLS holster for my Leatherman and it's awesome! Super light, and I've banged it on plenty of door frames without a hitch. No snap to loosen up and clack, and no velcro to wear out
I would also suggest hand blasting the parts first before tumbling! Also a vibratory polisher gets amazing smooth parts - great for robots etc! (lost of detail ofc), also gives them a little wash. White powder is cool because you can dye it (not super easy to get consitant, but works with some additives and heat help). And when designing, you will find long flats warping potentially. So you may want to design fins/heat sinks in that get snapped/cut off if you get any issues (same with metal poweder printing) :) SLS moulds work well also! but Silicone sticks in all the pitted surfaces. So I spray seal with a matt lacquar or gloss depending on the cast finish I want + mould release. I usually find a 0.2 tollerance worked on the machine I worked with after a light vib polish.
My buddies and I were gonna pre-order a Fuse 1 to add to our print farm when they first enounced it. However after requesting some sample prints, we were not impressed. They were very brittle and broke with very little force, especially considering that it's nylon. Formlabs asked us if we wanted to place an order, but at that point we had more questions than answers. So after the parts weren't to our standards of durability, we started asking more questions about practical uses, but the Formlabs rep ceased communication with us after that. Apparently he didn't see a sale forthcoming...lol.
Having used a friend's fuse 1 I can agree with you. It feels more like a porous nylon network than cast and machined nylon. The refresh rates very quickly affect part strength even if the prints still come out looking nice. I would be very hesitant to use it for any thin-wall fragile parts, for thicker stuff it's probably more than adequate.
Could some kind of annealing step improve the cohesion and durability of the print? That's something that even FDM prints benefit from, so I wonder if it's not a useful thing to do with SLS too.
@@Saminvent05it *feels* like it’s porous, but it’s not- you can cross-section it with a waterjet (or other cutting method that doesn’t cause melting) and the sintered area is solid. PA12 can be brittle if the part isn’t designed with the material limits in mind- PA11 is more ductile (super tough stuff). Orientation matters too since the layers are ~110 microns (the powder is ~80 microns) in the Z axis, but you get finer resolution as the laser sweeps in the X/Y axis.
It's almost like you need some PETG joints on those. Very cool. That sound is amazing. Thank you for reassuring me that I never actually HAVE to grow up.
Unfortunately CF12 is brittle and that SLS texture is very hard to cover over. Nylon doesn't allow most putty to stick very well. Not good for high fidelity models, but good for functional parts. They have other powders which have more durability (can take impact and have some flex). Also, wear a mask. You don't want to breath that stuff in repeatedly.
I've played with SLS and you should print with it fully formed. Just keep a very small gap around the ball joints. Also, I developed a box for printing very small parts. When you print them, you print the box around them so they don't get lost or separated. I developed the box so that multiple customers could print at once and we wrote their name on the box. The lid was printed in place and just slid out after the cleaning. I created it in OpenSCAD and you simply enter the dimensions and the name and then render the box. Quite easy to do
@@dakotareid1566 Well the material price even matter for this printer? Does the setup cost like half a million bucks? Is this a setup anybody that is not a celeb and get it for free use?
@@Average-AL These things are reasonable to buy if you're running a (large) print farm. FDM is really a race to the bottom on pricing so it's not worth doing.
@@someusername121 I would love to see a calculation for a scenario where this makes a good ROI, what amount of products and to what price they need to be sold to make this a good investment. There is also injection moulding that produces better parts to consider.
Congratulations Adam! That truly enables you to make stuff with absolutely amazing precision. I'm excited to see how you will utilize this equipment. One tip though, don't use the rubber mallet again.
I did not think that printer wholde get to market bechos of the technical problems, and even if it did it wholde have been a safety disaster fore the operator whiteout somting tike a negative preacher working station.
That thing wouldn't come to the market. The ammount of money the got with Kickstarter wouldn't cover production, it required major redesign for final product, prints weren't that good and the process of extraction of parts would make you sick. Not to mention you need to hire people (sales, customer service, shippin, marketing and repairs), have warehouse and factory to produce them Wouldn't be surprised if they used Kickstarter to find a buyer, as far as i know there were only two dudes working on this
That seems to be the reality with every "first print" of any type of 3d printing. Adam says that its the hobby for people that like picking scabs, its more like a hobby for people that do not give up. Especially when you model your own projects in cad, I mean... its not difficult on a "standard" filament 3d printer to download an stl and follow all the instructions from previous folks that have already went through all struggles, but I endeavored to design landing gear and tires and wheels using petG and TPU filament and it took me several failed prints, and lessons learned before I was successful.
As with any 3-D process you have to modify your CAD assembly tolerances to allow the parts to fit together. The ball joint you showed has an internal "overhang" that you need to account for the assembly in your CAD design with possibly more parts cut out the whole part.
@@Astromechy I think you are right. I intend tolerance as the movement that is allowed once the ball is in the receiver. That needs to be tight to hold the legs into position, but still movable to play with. Clearance is how much the receiver "closes" around the ball, and needs to clear when the ball is pressed in
Although it was pointed out several times in the comments that you should have used more precautionary measures for PPE I found the video pretty fun. I've been working for a large investment casting business for the last 45 years. We purchased our first 3DSystems SLA machine back in 1988 which was their SLA 250 (ser #3) which had a printing volume of 10"x10"x10". It was pretty slow but put us ahead in the Investment casting industry in using SLA patterns for casting. I got involved with doing the CAD work and setup for builds about 1990 and it is still my primary job. We now have 10 large machines which we have built over the years large 60"+ diameter patterns for things like Intermediate cases for jet engines for Pratt, GE and Rolls. We build them in segments and resin the segments together to form one whole pattern. Years ago we did look into having some gating built with SLS in the hopes it would be cheaper and easier than SLA gates. But found out there was a bit of process in needing tin infiltrate them with wax which helps with the casting process and also some surface finish. The surface finish also kept us from using SLS for casting patterns. So it never really panned out and we never really investigated the process since. I do like the nylon material you used for these figures. I agree the sound of them is pretty cool. Look forward to more videos to see what you create, especially as you get more experience in dealing with things like joints and such. Thumbs up!
"We've just ended up with a kilogram's worth of hard plastic parts that we can do nothing with", that's 3d printing alright! The first print is seldom perfect :)
I know the action figures didn't work out but you could still use the pieces for paint and finish tests that way you can get a sort of swatch idea for what works on this new kind of print.
I love how often Adam goes from 'hey I could do that or at least a smaller scale version of it' To 'oh, there's no way in heck I'm ever gonna be able to do that' 😂 Also, you know you're getting a serious tool/toy when it takes a technician to come out and install and set it up.
This is my first time seeing this kind of process and I am absolutely blown away at the fidelity of these prints. In my head I was saying "what are those 3 impressive-looking machines?!" and at this point I am just blown away at the engineering and manufacturing that went into them; they look so elegant! I will say though, I cringed at the lid being opened when there was still nylon powder floating around in the air 🫣
Yeah...I would have masked up for that. I do want to see them redo that print and put those together ... not sure if they just make the ball joints smaller or if there is a different nylon material that does have some flex to it they need to use.
I worked on the electromechanical props for the Harry Potter stage shows (magic effects). We had an in-house resin printer at the time, but of course props get dropped quite a bit, and when the resin printed parts were dropped they basically disintegrated. Eventually we outsourced the printing, getting them made in SLS nylon - much more durable. Of course we then had a different problem, being that the nylon parts were actually quite difficult to finish. Nice printer - no way I can afford one, unfortunately!
Are you still having that issue I have some solutions that we use we finish our parts many different ways and it's not as difficult as you think feel free to send me a message and I can tell you about what we do at our shop where we 3D Print Everything from Disney to parts for firearms. My email is matt.r@forerunner3d.com
Resin parts should be used to make master molds for any application where the output is going to be handled regularly. Resin prints are at best display pieces.
Print the male/female joints with some slots in them to allow for flex when assembling. You can also selectively thin the wall at those points when creating your wall thickness.
Hey guys, love you. I love you show just awesome production and captivating video and watching Adam find so much joy and sound of those parts. You know the interesting thing to me if I hadn’t watched this program and somebody handed me one of those I would’ve swore they were some kind of ceramic really cool guys. Thanks 🙏
You should make some kind of wear test for that material.. maybe some gears with a motor and one offset weight.. or something like that.. just keep the motor spinning for a month or a year.. until something wears out
We have a gear at work we've been running for a year holds up quite well. Here is another wear test with pa12 and tpu th-cam.com/video/x9DDOUm_xyE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=3bDUi9txZonYCZSN
*jaw-on-floor* I have the Form 3 and a Phrozen Sonic Mega 8k V2. Not quite big enough, and pretty messy, but very wonderfully adequate, for now. I'd been looking at the Formlabs SLS for our manufacturing endeavor. You are leading me down a rabbit hole, Good Sir Adam!
So with these tight tolerances, can you do more print in place models with out any connections seems it might work with just print in position? Please follow up with this series on this printer, it is awesome.
That'd be pretty expensive chainmail I'm not sure the cost per build on this machine because I'm not sure on the ratio of used to new material per build. Ours is 30/70% and each build retails around a few grand.
A quick peek at the website reveals there’s about $55,000 sitting on that platform. (Plus tax, shipping, etc.) This is not for the individual maker or 3D printing enthusiast. This is for a serious production environment. (Pre-assembled action figures sold separately. 😂😂😂)
Custom change gears for your lathe to make any thread/pitch on earth sounds like a fun project. The "noise" shouldn't effect performance of a part that large. It would also test the power transmission capabilities of this nylon.
Sand down the joints, and give them a silicone, or some rubberized coating via dip or brush? The Ball joints need a millimeter or so removed, or, a small hacksaw, and a reprint of the balls in a flexible material. The elbows and knees would be a good way to test. But a misprint doesn't necessarily mean garbage. It might even make a whole episode of you and Norm figuring out how to salvage a project when something unexpected happens.
Since no supports are needed wouldn't you be able to print the action figures already assembled with the ball joints just printing in place already together?
@@demetriusmichaelYou have to fill the chamber anyway, and it doesn't really waste powder that much since you can run recovered powder through the machine again (there's a limit due to thermal degradation but it's not like all the dusted off powder goes in the bin). The bigger issue here is that to make it print in place you need clearance between each part so a print in place action figure in a single material process would be loose and floppy, whereas I think they're going for poseable
Ooooohhhhh! Fun! Looking forward to seeing what Adam and the rest of the team make with this. On this channel and the new connected channel. I would love to have access to a printer like this, but I wouldn't want to own one until I had a proper workshop and team to do all the clean up work.
I have seen assembled parts in SLS. If you have enough clearance for the powder in the joint this will work. Formlab has a print in place little case that use that process.
@@N94able I've printed jointed figures and millipedes and other multiple movable parts items with regular 3d printers... it's nothing new. I'm sure it could be arranged with this system.
HI Adam. nice machine, much more automated than the 3d Systems DTM Sinterstation I ran for 10+ years at work (2004-2014). Basically the same process. heat, sinter, cool, post process brush and then bead blast. My bead blaster was manual hand held, but you could easily direct it where you needed to get better cleaning in tight areas. the working volume of my machine was about 10 x12x 14, and I usually printed .004 layers back then. Be aware as good as this new system post process works, you will find the powder gets everywhere! much like wood working! good luck, Tom
We need another episode to see how the articulated joint problem can be resolved. Without any flexibility it would seem difficult to achieve a friction that could be maintained over a long period, if frequent movement is involved after assembly.
Remember Adam, safety first! Never clean SLS parts in the open like that with no respirator, lab coat, or eye protection. Always use the glove box closed with the fume hood running when extracting the parts, and conducting the initial scrub down on the part surfaces. Any time your transferring parts from the printer to the glove box or from the glove box to the media blaster wear PPE! I recommend having a PPE station with all 3 that stays in the printer room so the powder has a smaller chance of traveling through the shop on your personal clothing. Have a separate tub with seal to put your respirator into also so it stays clean. Also I'm very surprised the service engineer only covered temperature calibration when they installed it. Calibrating the printer for dimensional accuracy is crucial with any 3D printing. That way you can run your parts with nominal dimensions, and know they be within a specific tolerance the machine is rated for. That way you know your assemblies will fit together with the correct gap settings. I wish I could help you out. I'm heavy into AM technology. I feel there's so much that the service engineer did not cover that could have helped you're first print be successful the first run. I'm sure the assembly gaps on the models themselves are all wrong for the most part, but.... never let a service engineer install a 3D printer and leave without proving it's accurate within specification. It's also very weird the way that nylon 12 sounded, and way it fractured. You might need to set your temp settings cooler. Anyways I'm glad I found your channel. I've always been a huge fan!! Feel free to hit me up any time if you need help with CAD, and AM technology. I'd be glad to help. Cheers!✌🤓
As its sintered nylon its best to polish parts that make contact with each other, if you want joints. Polished sintered nylon parts are self lubicating which is also a bonus.
oh i can already tell this is going to be a beloved new toy for the shop's prop and cosplay work. working with a material that powdery looks like it could DEFINITELY use some masks though.
This might work really well as a print in place model though, it will require a ton of work cleaning out the joints and things, but if you do it right. That could turn out amazing, and you'll never be able to break them.
The build area of such a large imposing(and incredibly expensive) machine is shockingly small...heh. Although you can dump a ton of small to medium prints in it at once since they don't have to be at the bottom stuck to a plate. They can float anywhere in the build volume.
You basically have to surround the build area with an oven to get the whole thing up to near sintering temperature, the a layer of insulation, then surround that with the necessary motors, controllers, laser, and optics. It's harder than you think.
Funny, I was just using a rubber mallet to join some PLA hinge joints not long before watching this. Ended up using a heat gun. For my ball joints I add a cross split to it so the ball can deform to fit in the socket then expand out again. It seems to be working well so far. That probably won't work with what you've got though if it simply doesn't flex at all.
No kidding, god, I wish my life went 1% as well as he's been lucky to get. I mean god damn, dude (likely) gets a free SLS printer, and a huge one at that, not to mention just the sheer awesome levels of experience he's had with incredible luck being in the right place at the right time to work for ILM and so many other fucking awesome things I can only dream of. I don't even want to know how much it would cost, my eyes would water.
@@JunctionRunnerIn skilled labor world, luck only works if you do. CEO land is different. But acquiring skills is an active and expensive(time intensive) process. It can be an enjoyable process but it still means you spent time doing it instead of doing something else. And yes luck is real and it UNLOCKS doors But skills OPEN them!
@@JunctionRunner Fame also comes with popularity. Formlabs donated one to expose their products. Luck is indeed one of the factors. Adam is a celebrity/influencer in the maker world. The amount views and subs will also give Formlabs exposure.
I’ve been using a gen 1 Fuse 1 and Sift exclusively with nylon 12 since spring of 2023 (before the Fuse Blast was available and before the Sift had cabinet-style gloves). I’ve always used the recommended 30% refresh rate (70% recycled powder mixed with 30% fresh powder) and I always have a surplus of recycled powder. I have two build chambers and I’ve been forced to use one for recycled powder storage. The sifted powder hopper in the Sift is always full so the incoming jobs I have to print are a challenge to clean. I know, packing density makes a difference but I have timelines, quantities and quality standards to meet. The Formlabs tech should’ve warned Adam and Norm not to both work in the Sift at the same time with the hood up and without respirators. The negative pressure is only effective enough for really dusty operations when the hood is down. I always wear glasses, gloves and a half face respirator when working with this stuff. Adam needs a vapor smoother next!
You can but you still need to make sure adjust the tolerances because the parts will fuse if your build is too dense. But definitely possible we do flexy parts for fill sometimes and they come out great
From 2013 to 2015 I operated the Zcorp 450 color 3D printer. It used kind of the same system, but with plaster powder and a HP designjet inside. One of the printer cartridges contained a binder fluid instead of ink, the other cartridges contained the HP inks. Nice system...if it worked, very prone to errors and maintenance troubles...
I'm surprised/impressed with how much the surface pebbling is reminiscent of cast bronze. I wonder if you could work with that for a very sculptural effect.
Very cool! Watch for burn through on the SLS machines, but otherwise they can produce some great stuff! I swung for the fences and opened up an additive shop in Cincinnati, OH that does MJF printing with an HP unit. We print all kinds of things, including working intakes for sports cars. You're right about PA12 nylons being stout material. It can fulfill a lot of requirements that people don't think it can!
Great tech but a very poor representation of how one should handle it. Cleaning with an open hood and no respirator. Really? You’re treating it and the process as if it’s a toy to be played with, with zero consequences. Total lack of respect for the potential health concerns and misleading presentation of good practices. I know you all can do better.
he explained why in the video. There's a very strong fan pulling in any nylon that would go airborne and the negative pressure ensures it is still safe to work with even without a respirator or the hood, which is actually just an optional add on
most likely they can't. it's advised in SLS to not use the powder in enclosed geometries (such as in a cup). where the part itself is sintered nylon powder, melted by a laser, the parts are hot after sintering. the powder in the enclosed area would be surrounded by stronger ambient heat. the powder in the enclosed area wouldn't be solid, but solid clumps stick on to the part even after cooling. this powder, when cleaning, would be best disposed during the sandblasting stage, as waste powder. if left to be recycled, print quality suffers. all that to say - even the powder around some prints isn't recommended for reuse, so if a print is ground down to a powder, we most likely wouldn't be able to ensure same quality results.
Would love to see a differential printed and see how it holds up or how the gears can be lapped to mesh. Or even the 2-way nut/bolt that was made on the lathe.
One of the greatest benefits I see on top of the print density, is the clean up and lack of waste material. No supports means no wasted nylon or post printing clean up of the nubs left behind where the supports connected to the print. You pretty much go from print to prepping for paint or assembly. I cannot wait for this printing technology to become a home consumer level product, but right now the costs and size keep this at a commercial level, but FDM and Resin started at the same level and now anyone can buy a printer for resonable prices, I am sure this will go the same way. How is the fidelity of the prints, do you feel you can get the same level of fine detail as you can with a newer model resin printer?
2021 Adam: "I just don't see a need for 3D printing in my process at this time"
2025 Adam: "I just got an SLS printer that's taking up an entire wall of my shop to add to my print farm!"
a 3D Printer is still a tool after all.
Tools are like Pokemon, gotta catch em all, and they're always inventing newer, more legendary ones with every new generation.
I bet he wishes he had these when he was at ILM. So many of the Star Wars props could be produced this way without worrying about the process of replacing a damaged one.
The thing is the size of a mid-70s mainframe terminal. That thing is huge
@@TheBigburciesomebody should scan the original sprues from the truck and tank kits that were kitbashed into the Star Wars ships, so that the authentic look and relationship with real vehicles can be preserved in new designs.
It's amazing how free stuff can change your point of view
Nylon powder will shred your lungs. Always use protective gear. Please
SLS should only be used by actual professionals. Thank god micronics got bought out, amateurs should not have easy access to SLS printers.
@@dddddyynit’s just nonsense to be glad a whole class of technology was made available to a wider market and promptly axed. Tools are inherently dangerous and it’s always your responsibility to use the proper PPE.
@@dddddyyn I'm glad there are definitely no other ways "amateurs" have access to turning nylon, carbon fiber, silica and other materials into an inhalable dust!
He will be fine
Where are the stl files for the action figure???
Don't you want to wear a respirator when pouring nylon powder?
Yes the powder if inhaled will shred your lungs its very bad.
Ideally yeah. It's not pleasant for the lungs
This model is designed to not require any respirator, according to form labs, IF you follow the proper procedure. Hence the gloves chamber, the cartridge system, and the integrated vacuum. The instructions state to use a respirator if local exhaust particulates are above a defined threshold (ACGIH Threshold Limit Value) but it shouldn't reach that threshold with proper configuration of exhaust. I would assume the form labs field tech would explain that to Adam. Pretty sure he'll be fine with or without one depending on his personal work practices.
I think they were relying on the built-in ventilation to suck the dust to the back end of the cabinet. You can see it flowing that way in some moments. I think they were going with the 95% effective PPE as opposed to the full sealed enclosure.
I certainly would. I like redundancy when it comes to *not* discovering new and exciting forms of lung cancer.
As someone with the certs to do maintenance and training on these machines, I wanted to scream at the screen a couple of times here. The guy from Formlabs was way too lax about the safety IMHO. But I guess it looks better for the cameras if you're not wearing PPE and keeping the hood open.
And for Norm. Hollowing out parts is not what you want to do here, unless you fill that void with other parts. You'll just end up with an excess of used powder. Shoot for 30% packing density if you can (which is hard to reach, I know, but hollowing parts is going to make it a whole lot harder :D ). It does feel wasteful to print solid but having a bunch of excess used powder that you don't know what to do with is also a pain.
Also, make sure you follow the maintenance schedule on the machine. And for the optical cassette and filters I'd just do it before or after every print rather than waiting for the timer to run out. Makes it easier in the long run IMHO. Also keep things clean around the machine. Even a single strand of hair in the hopper can ruin a print if you're unlucky. And be mindful of the blasting media so that you don't bring it back into the Sift, too much of it will make the PrinterWatcher abort the print and you might end up having to discard a bunch of contaminated powder. I'd hope the rep from Formlabs went through all this but I kinda got the feeling he didn't.
We will hunny comb our builds when possible to avoid elephant skin from solid parts
As far as i have understood in this video, unused powder goes back into the system?
@@Daniel-rd6st It does. But it has to be mixed, in the case of PA12, with 30% fresh powder before it can be used again. The problem if you keep printing at low densities is that you end up with a hopper that is full of used powder that doesn't get re-used fast enough. You can technically use straight used powder but then you run the risk of poor quality or just failed prints altogether.
@Daniel-rd6st yes but for quality you have to have a certain percentage of fresh to used powder because it gets heated and cooled on the MJF machines we run 70/30
@@treborrrrr Thanks for the explanation!
We had one of these machines at my old job and it worked incredibly well, though I would just make sure you keep on top of the dust! The thing becomes messy in no time at all, and you really dont want to wait until there is a fine layer of powder coating everything within a 10m radius of the machine. Upkeep is also critical, making sure to vacuum the filters and do as much cleaning as you can as often as you can afford - makes the machine run much smoother and you will get more consistent prints. We found a 50/50 mix of used and fresh powder to be about the most used powder to cycle before getting defects.
Also as others have mentioned, you will end up with way more used powder than you will know what to do with so dont worry about designing parts to be volume efficient to maximise how much powder you can recover. Cleaning time is also something to consider so if you can just have a piece be filled solid you may as well just leave it filled to save on cleaning time. PPE is also super important! Nylon 12 can definitely impact your lungs and if I was ever a bit relaxed about not wearing a respirator it would noticeably impact my health.
Otherwise happy printing!
Yeah - personally I'd leave the lid closed just to avoid the powder getting everywhere. I have to deal with that enough when powder coating. I mean, I'm a PPE stickler but sometimes, the mess helps keep me that way.
Absolutley agree!
And here’s me still trying to comprehend how amazing and alien my FDM printer technology is and now I see whatever the hell this is
I have a Plastic Filament 3-D Printer. This is ALIEN TECH in comparison… 😅
ya technology is on market for over 10 years issue is cost I think cheapest one right now around 30k
Isn't this technically _still_ fused deposition? It's just a different method of delivering the material to its destination, and a different method of melting it for fusion, but still the same fundamental principle of stacking slices.
@@SebastianWeinberg not necessarily. FDM is specifically referring to a machine that deposits material that is directly fused to the layer below it, usually by extruding a solid filament through a heated nozzle, and only deposits said material in the exact pattern that forms each layer of print, with the rest of the build volume remaining a void/air. This means any overhangs or floating pieces need supports to keep them in place for the duration of printing. SLS requires an entire layer of material dust in the build volume, which then a laser sinters only select parts of to make the solid component, before placing a whole new layer of material down and repeating the process. This also means that, since the parts are suspended in powder that is roughly the same density, there is effectively no need for support structures.
You could think of SLS as working similarly to resin printing, just flipping the laser and build chamber, but really each type of printing is its own separate thing.
@@SebastianWeinberg FDM and SLS are different subsets of AM (additive manufacturing). Using a laser to sinter powder instead of using a nozzle to extrude molten plastic is a distinctive enough characteristic to merit labeling it as its own separate form of AM. If you don't adhere to that logic, you could also call MSLA/DLP printing FDM because the action of the printer is depositing resin by allowing it to flow on to the build plate and then fusing it into a specific shape.
i have 14 printers, its took me almost a decade to get what i have but this is goals. this is how metal 3d printing becomes something we can do in our homes.
I feel like you could print these types of things already assembled to avoid that "won't fit" issue just because of not needing supports. I'd love to see you try that print!!
This was my thinking also ! I think they can print-in-place - would be neat to see them try again with that method... might have to adjust tolerances - the press fit looked a little too tight.
sintered powder will have different tolerances than plastic filament or resin. as is, with the current tolerances, the joints would fuse together and it would just be a solid figure. one way would be to adjust tolerances on the file as you said. a quicker way would be adjusting the printer setttings (if there aren't physical requirements needed, only thing would be aesthetics, only getting iffy if you push it too far). other way, that they're taking a whack at, is post processing (sanding/filing down would work eventually).
Try printing those same action figures with the same joints fully formed. so no assembly is required. that process looks like it would be able to do that.
cleanup would be more challenging, but would be interesting to try.
Just alittle extra blasting in the joints we would hand blast that build instead of tumbling
Was actually thinking about the same, what would happen if you just tried to print in place? I am guessing the powder would be packed so tight into the joints it would be mechanically locked...but maybe not?
@@MrAcuta73 you adjust the tolerance slightly should be able to break it loose
Was also wondering this
FFF printing actually has models that print assembled. all kinds of things not just action figures search print in place in your fav print repository 🤠
The buttons on the outside of the fume hood seem like a massive oversight. Constantly having to deglove to activate the vacuum or start the sifting leads to leaving the fume hood open, which will destroy your lungs, even with the fume hood activated.
I mentioned the need for foot pedals.
@@Bigrignohio yes! Foot pedals or buttons on the inside
The glove box for the sift is an optional extra. Normal workflow is disposable gloves and an N95.
The gloves are a recent addition to the system. For years it didn't have those at all so reaching the buttons was easy. But, normally you'd start the sifting right away and leave it running as you're working. The vacuum is only used at the end when you're all done and you're cleaning up. But yeah, being able to reach them while wearing the gloves wouldn't be a bad thing for sure.
when do you have to open it to press the buttons? Start the sift at the beginning, then start the blower, run them for the entire sift cycle, then deglove, start the vac, clean up, and you're done. most of the stuff you see them doing (taking the grate off the sifter) is just for filming.
Adam please wear the full respirator!!!! SLS is great but needs to be handled carefully.
Sounds like it needs a button or external switch pressed to activate the vacuum? That means de-gloving if you are by yourself. Maybe they need (or have) a foot pedal option?
Looking forward to seeing that one-day build!
@@wadecassels2778 He can use the same type he used before, the heavy-duty one with the flip up cover?
Or just a smart plug / Alexa
It's called "ungloving", the act of removing gloves from ones hands. "Degloving" is an entirely different process, which is a medical term for a traumatic injury.
We need Tested for a long time please use PPE! Also when nylon absorbs water naturally it get more flexable! I'm sure the powder is bone dry. Try it again in a week! With FDM nylon you can also dye it with RIT dye. I'd love to see sls parts tested with dyes!
They can be dyed but since it's dark gray the options are of course quite limited. But Formlabs recently launched white nylon as well which can be dyed any colour you want.
SLS parts don't get flexible with water they do with heat so when dye or cerakote them we have to watch the temperature we've left PA12 in water for a couple weeks all it did was absorb water
Printing and handling powder media without ppe like a papr hood and a jumpsuit and gloves is a great way to get untreatable interstitial lung diseases and to bring aerosolizable powder home with you. The plastic sls companies like to pretend this is only a metal powder problem but it just is only presented as such because there hasnt been sufficient research to study in an additive specific context. The lung damage from similar powder media is well established in other industries. Wonderful tools, just need to be safe to use them. I cant believe you guys pulled an exposed chamber bin out with no ppe.
Yeah watching that powder casually waft through the air with no PPE on made my lungs hurt.
Yes, any dust is dangerous: glass, carbon, plastic, metal
Adam’s joy for the sound of the prints hitting each other is giving running your hands through legos feels. So satisfying
This is so cool. It's amazing not just how much this stuff has advanced, but how much more accessible this tech has become over the last decade or so. I have a ~7 year old CR-10S (heavily upgraded) and I think I'm going to get a small SLA printer pretty soon. And this is like a legit industrial rapid prototype machine! Not exactly the kind of thing the average maker is going to have in their home workshop right away (Holy sticker shock, Batman!) but the fact that this is a thing you can own and operate outside of an industrial setting makes me super excited to see what kind of stuff will be available to the masses in just a few more years.
We’ve all been there! In my experience nylon 12 does have some flex to it, but like any material it depends on the thickness of the structure. I created a set of ball and socket joints somewhat like those shown, but minimized the connection surfaces as shells approximately 1/4 thick to allow for enough give for insertion of the ball (without tolerance for a firm fit). Obviously good idea to prototype and print test fit fitted joints be sure they will function and snap together.
Yes, surprised me that there seemed to be no flex, despite some walls being 2mm thick. On further reading it appears the material may be 12CF, which is carbon fibre reinforced and may explain the metallic-type tapping sounds and rigidity.
man this is so amazing, were moving into another golden era of innovative vibey tech and its a crazy time to be alive. Cyberpunk world really isn't far out!
I love how this was the "Test Print" to see how the fitment works for this material. 😆
Good job guys! Thanks for sharing the fun! 🙏👏
You could look at opening up the socket side of the joints then print a TPU bushing to allow for movement with the needed holding. This may also benefit from polishing the ball side of the joints to keep the movement smooth.
I wonder if wearing a mask when moving the container between the machines or fiddling with the power with your hands would be a good thing to do to prevent some inhalations of that powder.
A mask should be worn at all times when working with this system.
Yes, the lack of PPE use was disturbing. Sure, one time won't kill you, but it's all about being in the habit because the continued exposure is a problem.
@@MTGeomancerI suspect their technician was a little bit too chill about the exposure risk, he apparently did mention stuff about PPE but said things like they could use the hood open without masks,* and was even there during one of the shots where Adam was just pouring loose nylon powder into the machine.
*Yes I know there's extraction air flow but you could see the dust flying off in all directions before being captured by the air flow, that level of protection should really only be treated as a backup on top of a respirator, not a sole protective measure
@@bosstowndynamics5488from what I’ve seen Adam is far too chill about inhaling lots of stuff.
Being a big fan of 3D printing, I am THRILLED beyond measure that you kept in the ultimate fail of this build! Learning is always a process, as you often show on this channel. And to see 2 skilled builders, with years of experience in different methods, with some of the best tools possible, STILL manage to fail at your 1st attempt. And the humor and classic (in Heinaman voice) "Well, THAT didn't work..." attitude... chef's kiss!
LOLOLOLOLOL!
"I can still feel some warmth." Yeah, I noticed that on Norm's first print the cautionary note about checking the temperature before removing the canister went right out the Tested window.
It's really fun when we have to pull a part off the top of a build that's only been cooling for 10 minutes in the post processor of our HP MJF 4200 we have nice thermal gloves and the hold the heat for quite some time. In our machines it takes 48 hours to natural cool we do that for critical Parts that we want to avoid any warping parts printed in PA12GB for firearms. We normally run the fast cooling which takes 16 hrs depending on density and build height. So it's still really warm in the middle but safe enough.
Even after the printer/sift reports that it's safe to extract the cake you can still feel a bit of heat in the middle of it unless it has been cooling for quite some time.
It feels like a design flaw to have to check the temperature manually 😅
I love how much joy you get from something as simple as the sound the pieces make. And how you took the inability to assemble the project in stride, finding that funny as well. So good to see these days.
I love the fact that Adam and Norm printed action figures in parts when the sls process could have printed them entirely assembled in one go. Its like scratching the surface of what's possible and I cant wait to see them play with it more .
Reduce the size of the ball in the ball joints and print in place was what I was thinking also.
@@marksmanazOr heat up the accepting end?
I've got an SLS holster for my Leatherman and it's awesome! Super light, and I've banged it on plenty of door frames without a hitch. No snap to loosen up and clack, and no velcro to wear out
I see you load that machine and the first thing that comes to mind "Light turns green, the trap is clean" from ghostbusters
I would also suggest hand blasting the parts first before tumbling! Also a vibratory polisher gets amazing smooth parts - great for robots etc! (lost of detail ofc), also gives them a little wash. White powder is cool because you can dye it (not super easy to get consitant, but works with some additives and heat help). And when designing, you will find long flats warping potentially. So you may want to design fins/heat sinks in that get snapped/cut off if you get any issues (same with metal poweder printing) :)
SLS moulds work well also! but Silicone sticks in all the pitted surfaces. So I spray seal with a matt lacquar or gloss depending on the cast finish I want + mould release. I usually find a 0.2 tollerance worked on the machine I worked with after a light vib polish.
My buddies and I were gonna pre-order a Fuse 1 to add to our print farm when they first enounced it. However after requesting some sample prints, we were not impressed. They were very brittle and broke with very little force, especially considering that it's nylon. Formlabs asked us if we wanted to place an order, but at that point we had more questions than answers. So after the parts weren't to our standards of durability, we started asking more questions about practical uses, but the Formlabs rep ceased communication with us after that. Apparently he didn't see a sale forthcoming...lol.
Having used a friend's fuse 1 I can agree with you. It feels more like a porous nylon network than cast and machined nylon. The refresh rates very quickly affect part strength even if the prints still come out looking nice. I would be very hesitant to use it for any thin-wall fragile parts, for thicker stuff it's probably more than adequate.
Could some kind of annealing step improve the cohesion and durability of the print? That's something that even FDM prints benefit from, so I wonder if it's not a useful thing to do with SLS too.
@@Saminvent05it *feels* like it’s porous, but it’s not- you can cross-section it with a waterjet (or other cutting method that doesn’t cause melting) and the sintered area is solid. PA12 can be brittle if the part isn’t designed with the material limits in mind- PA11 is more ductile (super tough stuff). Orientation matters too since the layers are ~110 microns (the powder is ~80 microns) in the Z axis, but you get finer resolution as the laser sweeps in the X/Y axis.
It depends on the powder used, they have less brittle nylons.
It's almost like you need some PETG joints on those. Very cool. That sound is amazing. Thank you for reassuring me that I never actually HAVE to grow up.
Hopefully future models will have all operational buttons inside, and will only operate when hood is closed and locked
Or perhaps, use a few foot switches?
So I love that you kept in the mistake, it honestly makes the video better and will show the evolution of the process in the future.
Unfortunately CF12 is brittle and that SLS texture is very hard to cover over. Nylon doesn't allow most putty to stick very well. Not good for high fidelity models, but good for functional parts. They have other powders which have more durability (can take impact and have some flex). Also, wear a mask. You don't want to breath that stuff in repeatedly.
I've played with SLS and you should print with it fully formed. Just keep a very small gap around the ball joints. Also, I developed a box for printing very small parts. When you print them, you print the box around them so they don't get lost or separated. I developed the box so that multiple customers could print at once and we wrote their name on the box. The lid was printed in place and just slid out after the cleaning. I created it in OpenSCAD and you simply enter the dimensions and the name and then render the box. Quite easy to do
This is why FDM printers with PLA are going to be main tech for home printing for the next 20 years.
Especially considering that 10kg of the powder he used is 1000$
@@dakotareid1566 Well the material price even matter for this printer? Does the setup cost like half a million bucks? Is this a setup anybody that is not a celeb and get it for free use?
@@Average-AL These things are reasonable to buy if you're running a (large) print farm. FDM is really a race to the bottom on pricing so it's not worth doing.
@@someusername121 I would love to see a calculation for a scenario where this makes a good ROI, what amount of products and to what price they need to be sold to make this a good investment. There is also injection moulding that produces better parts to consider.
Congratulations Adam! That truly enables you to make stuff with absolutely amazing precision. I'm excited to see how you will utilize this equipment. One tip though, don't use the rubber mallet again.
Remember when there was a glimmer of hope for consumer SLS a couple months ago?
Pepperidge farms remembers.
I did not think that printer wholde get to market bechos of the technical problems, and even if it did it wholde have been a safety disaster fore the operator whiteout somting tike a negative preacher working station.
@@CasGRos are you alright?
That thing wouldn't come to the market. The ammount of money the got with Kickstarter wouldn't cover production, it required major redesign for final product, prints weren't that good and the process of extraction of parts would make you sick. Not to mention you need to hire people (sales, customer service, shippin, marketing and repairs), have warehouse and factory to produce them
Wouldn't be surprised if they used Kickstarter to find a buyer, as far as i know there were only two dudes working on this
@@8bithack
No
@@seljd
Look, someone that actually can spell
That seems to be the reality with every "first print" of any type of 3d printing. Adam says that its the hobby for people that like picking scabs, its more like a hobby for people that do not give up. Especially when you model your own projects in cad, I mean... its not difficult on a "standard" filament 3d printer to download an stl and follow all the instructions from previous folks that have already went through all struggles, but I endeavored to design landing gear and tires and wheels using petG and TPU filament and it took me several failed prints, and lessons learned before I was successful.
As with any 3-D process you have to modify your CAD assembly tolerances to allow the parts to fit together. The ball joint you showed has an internal "overhang" that you need to account for the assembly in your CAD design with possibly more parts cut out the whole part.
I don't think it is a matter of tolerance, but of clearance.
@@Astromechy Semantics. It's the same thing.
@@Astromechy I think you are right. I intend tolerance as the movement that is allowed once the ball is in the receiver. That needs to be tight to hold the legs into position, but still movable to play with. Clearance is how much the receiver "closes" around the ball, and needs to clear when the ball is pressed in
Although it was pointed out several times in the comments that you should have used more precautionary measures for PPE I found the video pretty fun. I've been working for a large investment casting business for the last 45 years. We purchased our first 3DSystems SLA machine back in 1988 which was their SLA 250 (ser #3) which had a printing volume of 10"x10"x10". It was pretty slow but put us ahead in the Investment casting industry in using SLA patterns for casting.
I got involved with doing the CAD work and setup for builds about 1990 and it is still my primary job. We now have 10 large machines which we have built over the years large 60"+ diameter patterns for things like Intermediate cases for jet engines for Pratt, GE and Rolls. We build them in segments and resin the segments together to form one whole pattern.
Years ago we did look into having some gating built with SLS in the hopes it would be cheaper and easier than SLA gates. But found out there was a bit of process in needing tin infiltrate them with wax which helps with the casting process and also some surface finish. The surface finish also kept us from using SLS for casting patterns. So it never really panned out and we never really investigated the process since.
I do like the nylon material you used for these figures. I agree the sound of them is pretty cool. Look forward to more videos to see what you create, especially as you get more experience in dealing with things like joints and such. Thumbs up!
"We've just ended up with a kilogram's worth of hard plastic parts that we can do nothing with", that's 3d printing alright! The first print is seldom perfect :)
Nothing wrong with the print. The issue was the operator.
I know the action figures didn't work out but you could still use the pieces for paint and finish tests that way you can get a sort of swatch idea for what works on this new kind of print.
that is one fancy bread maker.
I love how often Adam goes from 'hey I could do that or at least a smaller scale version of it'
To
'oh, there's no way in heck I'm ever gonna be able to do that'
😂
Also, you know you're getting a serious tool/toy when it takes a technician to come out and install and set it up.
This is my first time seeing this kind of process and I am absolutely blown away at the fidelity of these prints. In my head I was saying "what are those 3 impressive-looking machines?!" and at this point I am just blown away at the engineering and manufacturing that went into them; they look so elegant! I will say though, I cringed at the lid being opened when there was still nylon powder floating around in the air 🫣
With 12 hours to print, and 12 hours to cool and two hours of cleanup they better look good. This is a ridiculously time intensive process.
Yeah...I would have masked up for that. I do want to see them redo that print and put those together ... not sure if they just make the ball joints smaller or if there is a different nylon material that does have some flex to it they need to use.
Pulling in and out the chamber kinda reminds me of emptying the ghostbuster trap in the containment unit.
Did you do that full-time or part-time:)
Hi, I absolutely loved this one and wow what an improvement the new fan blades made. 👍.
I worked on the electromechanical props for the Harry Potter stage shows (magic effects). We had an in-house resin printer at the time, but of course props get dropped quite a bit, and when the resin printed parts were dropped they basically disintegrated. Eventually we outsourced the printing, getting them made in SLS nylon - much more durable. Of course we then had a different problem, being that the nylon parts were actually quite difficult to finish. Nice printer - no way I can afford one, unfortunately!
Are you still having that issue I have some solutions that we use we finish our parts many different ways and it's not as difficult as you think feel free to send me a message and I can tell you about what we do at our shop where we 3D Print Everything from Disney to parts for firearms. My email is matt.r@forerunner3d.com
Resin parts should be used to make master molds for any application where the output is going to be handled regularly. Resin prints are at best display pieces.
Print the male/female joints with some slots in them to allow for flex when assembling. You can also selectively thin the wall at those points when creating your wall thickness.
The Liquification of the powder reminds me of the sandworm effects from Dune.
Hey guys, love you. I love you show just awesome production and captivating video and watching Adam find so much joy and sound of those parts. You know the interesting thing to me if I hadn’t watched this program and somebody handed me one of those I would’ve swore they were some kind of ceramic really cool guys.
Thanks 🙏
You should make some kind of wear test for that material.. maybe some gears with a motor and one offset weight.. or something like that.. just keep the motor spinning for a month or a year.. until something wears out
We have a gear at work we've been running for a year holds up quite well. Here is another wear test with pa12 and tpu th-cam.com/video/x9DDOUm_xyE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=3bDUi9txZonYCZSN
*jaw-on-floor* I have the Form 3 and a Phrozen Sonic Mega 8k V2. Not quite big enough, and pretty messy, but very wonderfully adequate, for now. I'd been looking at the Formlabs SLS for our manufacturing endeavor. You are leading me down a rabbit hole, Good Sir Adam!
Please be careful around the nylon powder 🫣
The lack of PPE use was astounding and unnerving.
This was amazing!!Love this type of sheer Nerdery
26:01 I love the reveal that Adam is, in no uncertain terms, building an army of Adam clones.
So with these tight tolerances, can you do more print in place models with out any connections seems it might work with just print in position? Please follow up with this series on this printer, it is awesome.
this seems perfect for printed chainmail. No supports means you can print it fully separated, and it's actually pretty strong
That'd be pretty expensive chainmail I'm not sure the cost per build on this machine because I'm not sure on the ratio of used to new material per build. Ours is 30/70% and each build retails around a few grand.
@@mattrussell8813 for 10kg of powder is 1000$ unless bulk ordering
A quick peek at the website reveals there’s about $55,000 sitting on that platform. (Plus tax, shipping, etc.) This is not for the individual maker or 3D printing enthusiast. This is for a serious production environment. (Pre-assembled action figures sold separately. 😂😂😂)
It´s all fun and games without respirator until your lungs gets FUBAR. 😂
Custom change gears for your lathe to make any thread/pitch on earth sounds like a fun project. The "noise" shouldn't effect performance of a part that large.
It would also test the power transmission capabilities of this nylon.
32:40 -ish Uh, the parts can be used as an example of choosing the right prototyping / designing tools / methods for the target material's properties?
The "in a few min we'll have ice cream" reminded me of my nana when I was a wee lad. Very much enjoyed this video!
Sand down the joints, and give them a silicone, or some rubberized coating via dip or brush?
The Ball joints need a millimeter or so removed, or, a small hacksaw, and a reprint of the balls in a flexible material. The elbows and knees would be a good way to test. But a misprint doesn't necessarily mean garbage.
It might even make a whole episode of you and Norm figuring out how to salvage a project when something unexpected happens.
Loooovvvveeee getting reps in. I'm learning increase detail and practicing in FDM, I can't wait to see what you do with your reps ::)
Since no supports are needed wouldn't you be able to print the action figures already assembled with the ball joints just printing in place already together?
Probably! It probably matters more on the tolerances than anything else.
Looks like it’ll waste powder, so they want to limit their z height as much as possible
@@demetriusmichaelYou have to fill the chamber anyway, and it doesn't really waste powder that much since you can run recovered powder through the machine again (there's a limit due to thermal degradation but it's not like all the dusted off powder goes in the bin). The bigger issue here is that to make it print in place you need clearance between each part so a print in place action figure in a single material process would be loose and floppy, whereas I think they're going for poseable
Ooooohhhhh! Fun! Looking forward to seeing what Adam and the rest of the team make with this. On this channel and the new connected channel.
I would love to have access to a printer like this, but I wouldn't want to own one until I had a proper workshop and team to do all the clean up work.
Couldn't you print the action figure parts already assembled?
No because you'd have one solid statue.
Even if you were doing a statue you'd still probably do it in parts, just in case some thing went wrong.
I have seen assembled parts in SLS. If you have enough clearance for the powder in the joint this will work. Formlab has a print in place little case that use that process.
The technology hasn't been developed yet
@@N94able it's layer by layer, so you could print it with some tolerance, just like print-in-place joints for normal 3d printers.
@@N94able I've printed jointed figures and millipedes and other multiple movable parts items with regular 3d printers... it's nothing new. I'm sure it could be arranged with this system.
HI Adam. nice machine, much more automated than the 3d Systems DTM Sinterstation I ran for 10+ years at work (2004-2014). Basically the same process. heat, sinter, cool, post process brush and then bead blast. My bead blaster was manual hand held, but you could easily direct it where you needed to get better cleaning in tight areas. the working volume of my machine was about 10 x12x 14, and I usually printed .004 layers back then. Be aware as good as this new system post process works, you will find the powder gets everywhere! much like wood working! good luck, Tom
Really hope you take care of yourself around that stuff. Seems inevitable that the powder will go everywhere.
It does everywhere and anywhere
We need another episode to see how the articulated joint problem can be resolved. Without any flexibility it would seem difficult to achieve a friction that could be maintained over a long period, if frequent movement is involved after assembly.
😮 22:10 FINALLY put the lid down to clean off the parts!
Remember Adam, safety first! Never clean SLS parts in the open like that with no respirator, lab coat, or eye protection. Always use the glove box closed with the fume hood running when extracting the parts, and conducting the initial scrub down on the part surfaces. Any time your transferring parts from the printer to the glove box or from the glove box to the media blaster wear PPE! I recommend having a PPE station with all 3 that stays in the printer room so the powder has a smaller chance of traveling through the shop on your personal clothing. Have a separate tub with seal to put your respirator into also so it stays clean. Also I'm very surprised the service engineer only covered temperature calibration when they installed it. Calibrating the printer for dimensional accuracy is crucial with any 3D printing. That way you can run your parts with nominal dimensions, and know they be within a specific tolerance the machine is rated for. That way you know your assemblies will fit together with the correct gap settings. I wish I could help you out. I'm heavy into AM technology. I feel there's so much that the service engineer did not cover that could have helped you're first print be successful the first run. I'm sure the assembly gaps on the models themselves are all wrong for the most part, but.... never let a service engineer install a 3D printer and leave without proving it's accurate within specification. It's also very weird the way that nylon 12 sounded, and way it fractured. You might need to set your temp settings cooler. Anyways I'm glad I found your channel. I've always been a huge fan!! Feel free to hit me up any time if you need help with CAD, and AM technology. I'd be glad to help. Cheers!✌🤓
You can cut the ball in the middle.
oh that would be an idea, or even just print a thin line/gap in the ball so it can flex inwards and then pop back out once in the socket
As its sintered nylon its best to polish parts that make contact with each other, if you want joints. Polished sintered nylon parts are self lubicating which is also a bonus.
oh i can already tell this is going to be a beloved new toy for the shop's prop and cosplay work. working with a material that powdery looks like it could DEFINITELY use some masks though.
This might work really well as a print in place model though, it will require a ton of work cleaning out the joints and things, but if you do it right. That could turn out amazing, and you'll never be able to break them.
The build area of such a large imposing(and incredibly expensive) machine is shockingly small...heh. Although you can dump a ton of small to medium prints in it at once since they don't have to be at the bottom stuck to a plate. They can float anywhere in the build volume.
It's not your (build) size, it's how you use it.
You basically have to surround the build area with an oven to get the whole thing up to near sintering temperature, the a layer of insulation, then surround that with the necessary motors, controllers, laser, and optics. It's harder than you think.
Funny, I was just using a rubber mallet to join some PLA hinge joints not long before watching this. Ended up using a heat gun. For my ball joints I add a cross split to it so the ball can deform to fit in the socket then expand out again. It seems to be working well so far. That probably won't work with what you've got though if it simply doesn't flex at all.
Adam will be living his dream till his 90s.
No kidding, god, I wish my life went 1% as well as he's been lucky to get. I mean god damn, dude (likely) gets a free SLS printer, and a huge one at that, not to mention just the sheer awesome levels of experience he's had with incredible luck being in the right place at the right time to work for ILM and so many other fucking awesome things I can only dream of.
I don't even want to know how much it would cost, my eyes would water.
@@JunctionRunner lucks got nothing to do with it pal
@@JunctionRunnerIn skilled labor world, luck only works if you do. CEO land is different. But acquiring skills is an active and expensive(time intensive) process. It can be an enjoyable process but it still means you spent time doing it instead of doing something else. And yes luck is real and it UNLOCKS doors But skills OPEN them!
@@JunctionRunner Fame also comes with popularity. Formlabs donated one to expose their products. Luck is indeed one of the factors. Adam is a celebrity/influencer in the maker world. The amount views and subs will also give Formlabs exposure.
The nylon powder will shred his lungs before he is 80 lol.
your sponsors are on another level couldn't think of a better content creator to get this level of access
I think we need to add another demerit badge for "Printing in material that isn't flexible enough for the project" based on this video.
I’ve been using a gen 1 Fuse 1 and Sift exclusively with nylon 12 since spring of 2023 (before the Fuse Blast was available and before the Sift had cabinet-style gloves).
I’ve always used the recommended 30% refresh rate (70% recycled powder mixed with 30% fresh powder) and I always have a surplus of recycled powder. I have two build chambers and I’ve been forced to use one for recycled powder storage. The sifted powder hopper in the Sift is always full so the incoming jobs I have to print are a challenge to clean. I know, packing density makes a difference but I have timelines, quantities and quality standards to meet.
The Formlabs tech should’ve warned Adam and Norm not to both work in the Sift at the same time with the hood up and without respirators. The negative pressure is only effective enough for really dusty operations when the hood is down. I always wear glasses, gloves and a half face respirator when working with this stuff.
Adam needs a vapor smoother next!
Looks like you'll have to print those action figures in place.
You can but you still need to make sure adjust the tolerances because the parts will fuse if your build is too dense. But definitely possible we do flexy parts for fill sometimes and they come out great
From 2013 to 2015 I operated the Zcorp 450 color 3D printer. It used kind of the same system, but with plaster powder and a HP designjet inside. One of the printer cartridges contained a binder fluid instead of ink, the other cartridges contained the HP inks.
Nice system...if it worked, very prone to errors and maintenance troubles...
Perfect timing. Im laying in bed with a hangover headache.
I'm surprised/impressed with how much the surface pebbling is reminiscent of cast bronze. I wonder if you could work with that for a very sculptural effect.
10:00 Adam I think there’s a sand worm in your new printer, be careful
My exact thoughts, DUNE!!! Instead of dude haha 😂
Watching you two try to get those parts to join had me rolling. Thanks for sharing with us, Adam.
As much as I'd like to play with something like this, I don't have the scratch. I'll live vicariously through Adam & Norm.
I prefer to outsource sls prints ,the hassle of fine particle & cleanup & material prep is too much for me
Very cool! Watch for burn through on the SLS machines, but otherwise they can produce some great stuff! I swung for the fences and opened up an additive shop in Cincinnati, OH that does MJF printing with an HP unit. We print all kinds of things, including working intakes for sports cars. You're right about PA12 nylons being stout material. It can fulfill a lot of requirements that people don't think it can!
Great tech but a very poor representation of how one should handle it. Cleaning with an open hood and no respirator. Really? You’re treating it and the process as if it’s a toy to be played with, with zero consequences. Total lack of respect for the potential health concerns and misleading presentation of good practices. I know you all can do better.
They was just blinded for a new toy. That is very serious concern…
I was Suprised they didn't even put any disclaimers up in the videos saying always wear ppe @@フランク-e7f
he explained why in the video. There's a very strong fan pulling in any nylon that would go airborne and the negative pressure ensures it is still safe to work with even without a respirator or the hood, which is actually just an optional add on
@highasheaven9239 you can literally see dust on his jeans 😂
Watching Adam being so excited over 3D printing makes me happy.
They keep saying no supports but the powder itself is the support. It's using 100% support. That's what you're cleaning off, supports.
Can the parts be ground back down to a powder and reused?
most likely they can't. it's advised in SLS to not use the powder in enclosed geometries (such as in a cup). where the part itself is sintered nylon powder, melted by a laser, the parts are hot after sintering. the powder in the enclosed area would be surrounded by stronger ambient heat. the powder in the enclosed area wouldn't be solid, but solid clumps stick on to the part even after cooling. this powder, when cleaning, would be best disposed during the sandblasting stage, as waste powder. if left to be recycled, print quality suffers. all that to say - even the powder around some prints isn't recommended for reuse, so if a print is ground down to a powder, we most likely wouldn't be able to ensure same quality results.
The picture of the Razor crest in the backround is amazing!
I'm pretty sure that's Serenity....
That's a Firefly 10th Anniversary Poster!
Lol it isn't in anyway the razorcrest - that is from the series Firefly (which is better....) Lol
Would love to see a differential printed and see how it holds up or how the gears can be lapped to mesh. Or even the 2-way nut/bolt that was made on the lathe.
"jesus wept" 🤣🤣🤣
cool, cool cool reference
One of the greatest benefits I see on top of the print density, is the clean up and lack of waste material. No supports means no wasted nylon or post printing clean up of the nubs left behind where the supports connected to the print. You pretty much go from print to prepping for paint or assembly. I cannot wait for this printing technology to become a home consumer level product, but right now the costs and size keep this at a commercial level, but FDM and Resin started at the same level and now anyone can buy a printer for resonable prices, I am sure this will go the same way. How is the fidelity of the prints, do you feel you can get the same level of fine detail as you can with a newer model resin printer?