People should realize that Zero's the only Diddy to be this consistently dominant. No other Diddy comes close to his level. Nairo's beaten loads of other top Diddys. Yes, it's a hard matchup. But Nairo's switched characters before and they couldn't bring him the win either. It's not the matchup, Zero has shown himself to be consistently the better player. Doesn't mean Nairo isn't ridiculous himself.
@@DarthCinnabon coming back to this video I'm just so devastated and hurt. don't forget that the victims were hurting for years longer and 10 times worse. It disgusts me
Maan FeelsBadForNairo, i feel like he is catching up though, ZeRo's Diddy has been the only thing he's had trouble with, but that game 1 shows he can do it
It's crazy cuz you can see that Nairo gets better every time he fights ZeRo. Even though he lost to him twice this tournament, he played better than he did at Genesis (took ZeRo to game 5)
Hilarious to see Naifus johning for Nairo so hard keep blaming the characters and ignore the fact that Nairo has tried like six characters to beat Zero but he hasn't in over a year lol ZeRo is the better player
Alejandro Montero exactly I'm not saying the match up isn't tough but people are acting like this is MK vs Rosa or Rosa vs Ness levels of impossible if it were actually impossible he would've found a legit secondary for the match up by now
First off i don't think any match up is impossible, I like to follow the whole demon triangle which goes like this ZeRo>Nairo>Ally>ZeRo and repeat. Like people have said before, Nairo vs ZeRo is basically can Nairo get his grabs or not. I think the big thing is that with diddy being so small and making Nair so unusable at times it definitely makes it harder to get those set ups or even in general getting grabs from forcing your opponent to shield cuz nair. I think ZeRo adapted perfectly after that first game and imo I think secondaries aren't needed more as an answer to ZeRo's adaptation.
guys it aint ditty its just that Zero evolved to his playstyle while nairo didnt really change what he did. I think that Zero is the better player in general.
Nairo did change what he did a couple times but ZeRo changed his play style not even from game to game but sometimes during the middle of a stock. It was insane.
You can see it on Nairo's face, he knows that if he beats ZeRo, this tourney is free for him, Tsu isn't surviving past 60% against Nairo. But as he says himself, the gatekeeper keeps him out. I know PGR says Nairo is 3rd but i definitely still think he's 2nd best. ZeRo is the only reason Nairo hasn't won more majors
Nairo's 2 worst set counts in Smash 4 (as far as i know) are Esam (2-4) and ZeRo (1-6?) If he found a way to deal with shorties consistently, he'd be golden imo
off the top of my head idk how many sets Nairo and ZeRo have played (they've played way too many for me to remember off the top of my head) but ik all of Nairo v Esam's Nairo wins: Genesis 3 and MLG Loser's Finals Esam wins: Smash Con '15 Winner's Semi's and Loser's Finals, MLG Winner's Semi's, and UGC Smash Open (If u wanna count STR 16 then its 5-2 Esam favor) ZeRo v Nairo has way more sets to it's credit and i just guessed with the 1-6
TheNeoGamr :/ I've been looking for a website with updated set counts similar to the Tafostats head to head matchup for Melee,but I cant seem to find any
+Chad Lowtan What do you mean? Of course someones character comes into play. Its the reason nairo places high too, bc zss is a good character. After the nerfs zss became more difficult to win with, and I know this by experience. Do you not watch the gameplays and think to yourself what could nairo have done here? I do bc I main zss, and many times there's not much nairo could have done to bring the game back without reading perfectly.
+Chad Lowtan Most of the time nairo is taken out by zero in an already losing match up, so what im saying is not baseless. The same way zero loses to ally all the time, and nairo consistently beats ally's mario. The best is always changing so you can't really say zero will always be the best. I think you mean the greatest. The best is zero one day, and the next its someone like ally/leo, back and forth.
That boi Nairo got beat in the air and was getting punished for missed grabs and not using smash attacks. Those kicks up close would have thrown diddy off. Just my quick analysis cuz im a zss player.
Lol Nairo had and Easy Bracket and hes claiming he could get the tournament cmon, he never faced a real treat until winners finals, he just got this far by lucky, meaning to how easy his bracket was... No big names on it as i said until WF
I said that because I heavily enjoy fighting Lucario and have never lost to one, because aura isn't a big factor against ZSS since she kills so early. And yeah why dont you go check the bracket out? Those 'real threats' you're going on about like Ranai or Abadango who were on my side of the bracket were not good enough to make it to me on this day. Ranai lost to Wadi and Aba lost to Black Yoshi, who then lost to Mr. E. None of that is my fault so don't come here giving me shit for it lmao. Who cares whether it was winners or losers? Go complain to the seeder of the tourney and those players who lost early if you got such a problem with it. I was still strong enough on this day to take out great players. MVD, Wadi, Mr. E, Shuton, and Dabuz. Show some damn respect you jim
well im gonna contact the seeders cause i also think zero had and easy one haha, and now that yore here i have to agree with others and say that you need to try another char like, lucina or even dr. mario, dark pit, etc. regards...
I think nairo and zero are equal in skill straight up. Zero may be better in terms of results but for real the diddy vs zss MU is the worst. People who dont main zss wouldnt understand. Zss may have like the second best punish in the game but her neutral can be figured out at times like meta knight. But you can always mix up your few options. All you need is that opening and etc. Whats so bs is that diddy kong has brain dead options to cover all of zss options. Such as f-air. That beats out zss jump, nair, and etc. only safe move zss has is zair. But diddykong can shield and throw banana or just perfect shield and run up f-air. Back then when zss could kill guaranteed, that was the only thing she had that kept the MU close to tied. Even at the time diddy still had an advantage. Nairo is definitely losing diddy kong and not zero completely. Yes he used multiple characters but those are secondaries he hasnt used that much at all. Overall this my opinion so try not to go crazy
0_ 0 nobody has to be a diddy main to understand him. And yes i used to main diddy for some time but it was to figure out what i could do to learn the zss > diddy MU. One brain dead option is f-air. It covers all approach options besides zair. Its a braindead move against zss. It even beats out approach options from other characters too.
Funny. Cause recently Nairo has been doing the best against zero with ZSS. You Johners here have all been proven wrong. Not even going to mention Marss and Luhtie who also beat zero.
![Frostbite 2017 GRAND FINALS - tsu [W] (Lucario) vs TSM | ZeRo [L] (Diddy Kong)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/fv8uX_DR8BM/mqdefault.jpg)
![Frostbite 2017 GRAND FINALS - tsu [W] (Lucario) vs TSM | ZeRo [L] (Diddy Kong)](/img/tr.png)
4 for 4 here on the predators, damn
Probably more in the crowd.
yup
Pierce on the phone w/ZeRo, that's 5
Don’t slander D1 thou he did nothing wrong
@@christophergomez5131 LOL yes he did homie
(After the first round)
4:24 ZeRo: Hello? 911? I need an ambulance, cuz this boi is on fire!
People should realize that Zero's the only Diddy to be this consistently dominant. No other Diddy comes close to his level. Nairo's beaten loads of other top Diddys. Yes, it's a hard matchup. But Nairo's switched characters before and they couldn't bring him the win either. It's not the matchup, Zero has shown himself to be consistently the better player. Doesn't mean Nairo isn't ridiculous himself.
More like diddly kong amirite
@@DarthCinnabon coming back to this video I'm just so devastated and hurt. don't forget that the victims were hurting for years longer and 10 times worse. It disgusts me
4:25 nothing about this set aged well lol
Holy shit LMAO
LOOL
Seeing Nairo lose to ZeRo always break my heart. He has the absolute worst win-loss ratio to ZeRo out of every top player combination.
Yami ABA and Void have never beaten Zero. Nairo has
+Jaden Laxn but it hurts nairo more when he does :/
Yami at least Nairo was first player to double eliminate ZeRo and end his tournament streak
Officialalmate Past success does not guarantee future success. I'm sure Nairo doesn't care about that as much as he does wanting to be Zero again.
Extremely cursed match, why did things turn out this way :(
Maan FeelsBadForNairo, i feel like he is catching up though, ZeRo's Diddy has been the only thing he's had trouble with, but that game 1 shows he can do it
It's crazy cuz you can see that Nairo gets better every time he fights ZeRo. Even though he lost to him twice this tournament, he played better than he did at Genesis (took ZeRo to game 5)
I love how after the first stock in the third game, both zero and nairo fixed their glasses like anime characters at 12:59
lol
They both did it at the same time wow
Bruh
What are the monitors that are typically used? Also, the splitter that's used? Thanks!!
Should've went Lucina.
Hilarious to see Naifus johning for Nairo so hard keep blaming the characters and ignore the fact that Nairo has tried like six characters to beat Zero but he hasn't in over a year lol ZeRo is the better player
Finkle Meire Lol yeah, he has used ZSS, MK, Robin, Bowser, Lucina and Ryu from what I can remember.
Alejandro Montero exactly I'm not saying the match up isn't tough but people are acting like this is MK vs Rosa or Rosa vs Ness levels of impossible if it were actually impossible he would've found a legit secondary for the match up by now
Finkle Meire I remember nairo winning 1 game in zero saga with ryu vsing zero
Unfortunate He meant in a set.
First off i don't think any match up is impossible, I like to follow the whole demon triangle which goes like this ZeRo>Nairo>Ally>ZeRo and repeat. Like people have said before, Nairo vs ZeRo is basically can Nairo get his grabs or not. I think the big thing is that with diddy being so small and making Nair so unusable at times it definitely makes it harder to get those set ups or even in general getting grabs from forcing your opponent to shield cuz nair. I think ZeRo adapted perfectly after that first game and imo I think secondaries aren't needed more as an answer to ZeRo's adaptation.
is anyone else DONE with this match-up?
stupid question; is that Samus Zero player related to Ksizzle by any chance?
Yeah, he's his brother.
First time seeing Nairo with a tag. What's up with that??
E-nite that's his brawl tag
Ah, okay
E-nite. Did Nairo beat ZeRo in Brawl to?
ZSS is so hype to watch. Especially Nairo's
Great play from both players, Nairo was so close to beating ZeRo
The point of this battle is not letting ZeRo have control over banana.
Hope this isn't anyone's favorite set
I AM SO CURIOUS ABOUT THAT PHONE CALL
guys it aint ditty its just that Zero evolved to his playstyle while nairo didnt really change what he did. I think that Zero is the better player in general.
Nairo did change what he did a couple times but ZeRo changed his play style not even from game to game but sometimes during the middle of a stock. It was insane.
Hard to watch this set :(
Y que coño quiere decir tsm del nombre de zero?
Funny how it says Zero's secondary's are Cloud, Sheik. When Lucina should be in Sheiks spot.
You can see it on Nairo's face, he knows that if he beats ZeRo, this tourney is free for him, Tsu isn't surviving past 60% against Nairo. But as he says himself, the gatekeeper keeps him out. I know PGR says Nairo is 3rd but i definitely still think he's 2nd best. ZeRo is the only reason Nairo hasn't won more majors
Who did Zero lose to?
Tsu
Nairo's 2 worst set counts in Smash 4 (as far as i know) are Esam (2-4) and ZeRo (1-6?) If he found a way to deal with shorties consistently, he'd be golden imo
TheNeoGamr Where do you get these Set Counts?
off the top of my head idk how many sets Nairo and ZeRo have played (they've played way too many for me to remember off the top of my head) but ik all of Nairo v Esam's
Nairo wins: Genesis 3 and MLG Loser's Finals
Esam wins: Smash Con '15 Winner's Semi's and Loser's Finals, MLG Winner's Semi's, and UGC Smash Open
(If u wanna count STR 16 then its 5-2 Esam favor)
ZeRo v Nairo has way more sets to it's credit and i just guessed with the 1-6
TheNeoGamr :/ I've been looking for a website with updated set counts similar to the Tafostats head to head matchup for Melee,but I cant seem to find any
7: 28 someone said "god dammit"
Come on ZeRo, you got TSU and feel bad for nairo was playing so well
:(
all these grabs man
VANI O SHIIIIIIIIIIIT
最後の試合のZEROえぐすぎねぇか
Closed Captioning:
That's right there not gonna take a blood this is what will be TVs
he did his best against him with Ryu
Wtf man
The fuck you need a time out for a match you've played a billion times Zero!
Maybe Nairo should pick up Sheik?
Nairo's not losing to ZeRo anymore, he's losing to Diddy. That first game proves he can do it but God I hate this MU 😒
ZSM kbandz Just like how he was losing when ZeRo played Sheik
Sheik is just as bad for ZSS as Diddy is. Her two worst MUs.
+Chad Lowtan The point is, if they used the same character, nairo wouldn't be losing the way he does. They basically have the same skill level.
+Chad Lowtan What do you mean? Of course someones character comes into play. Its the reason nairo places high too, bc zss is a good character. After the nerfs zss became more difficult to win with, and I know this by experience. Do you not watch the gameplays and think to yourself what could nairo have done here? I do bc I main zss, and many times there's not much nairo could have done to bring the game back without reading perfectly.
+Chad Lowtan Most of the time nairo is taken out by zero in an already losing match up, so what im saying is not baseless. The same way zero loses to ally all the time, and nairo consistently beats ally's mario. The best is always changing so you can't really say zero will always be the best. I think you mean the greatest. The best is zero one day, and the next its someone like ally/leo, back and forth.
That boi Nairo got beat in the air and was getting punished for missed grabs and not using smash attacks. Those kicks up close would have thrown diddy off. Just my quick analysis cuz im a zss player.
I can rest easy now that nairo got the W over zero at momocon :)
this set...
This is the most original comment in this comment section
I can safely say this matchup is absolute booty for ZSS
I think people should stop hating on Zero tbh.
Melee Hell | Bot still think so.
Lol Nairo had and Easy Bracket and hes claiming he could get the tournament cmon, he never faced a real treat until winners finals, he just got this far by lucky, meaning to how easy his bracket was... No big names on it as i said until WF
I said that because I heavily enjoy fighting Lucario and have never lost to one, because aura isn't a big factor against ZSS since she kills so early.
And yeah why dont you go check the bracket out? Those 'real threats' you're going on about like Ranai or Abadango who were on my side of the bracket were not good enough to make it to me on this day. Ranai lost to Wadi and Aba lost to Black Yoshi, who then lost to Mr. E. None of that is my fault so don't come here giving me shit for it lmao.
Who cares whether it was winners or losers? Go complain to the seeder of the tourney and those players who lost early if you got such a problem with it. I was still strong enough on this day to take out great players. MVD, Wadi, Mr. E, Shuton, and Dabuz. Show some damn respect you jim
well im gonna contact the seeders cause i also think zero had and easy one haha, and now that yore here i have to agree with others and say that you need to try another char like, lucina or even dr. mario, dark pit, etc. regards...
Get fucking rekt my dude.
The sodium levels, though.
Nairo fucking tell him wassup
Nairo isn't being outplayed, it's just a really bad matchup. Can't wait to see Nairo come back up :]
Baby Eater Geez he beat MVD its not just diddy man.
Maybe his Diddy just better than MVD making the matchup harder?
This hurts to watch.
VANI
Man
Cursed match
BRUH
They should ban coaching between sets. If not, at least ban phone calls.
I think nairo and zero are equal in skill straight up. Zero may be better in terms of results but for real the diddy vs zss MU is the worst. People who dont main zss wouldnt understand. Zss may have like the second best punish in the game but her neutral can be figured out at times like meta knight. But you can always mix up your few options. All you need is that opening and etc. Whats so bs is that diddy kong has brain dead options to cover all of zss options. Such as f-air. That beats out zss jump, nair, and etc. only safe move zss has is zair. But diddykong can shield and throw banana or just perfect shield and run up f-air. Back then when zss could kill guaranteed, that was the only thing she had that kept the MU close to tied. Even at the time diddy still had an advantage. Nairo is definitely losing diddy kong and not zero completely. Yes he used multiple characters but those are secondaries he hasnt used that much at all. Overall this my opinion so try not to go crazy
Evann Cochran Are you a diddy main? Why do you think he's braindead?
0_ 0 nobody has to be a diddy main to understand him. And yes i used to main diddy for some time but it was to figure out what i could do to learn the zss > diddy MU. One brain dead option is f-air. It covers all approach options besides zair. Its a braindead move against zss. It even beats out approach options from other characters too.
Evann Cochran equal skill? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH
Funny. Cause recently Nairo has been doing the best against zero with ZSS. You Johners here have all been proven wrong. Not even going to mention Marss and Luhtie who also beat zero.
This one is bad lmaoo.
Nairo lost against diddy, not against zero
He was better! But good balancing shit :/
Diddy needs a nerf again
Super Zombie Diddy does not need a nerf
Super Zombie dood he beat mvd its not diddy lol
mvd is bad -_-
Oh shut up stupid fanboy!
Nairo tried 6 characters against Zero and lost with all of them.
shut up kikoo it's my opinion !!