Hillsong 1999-2005… I was there. I was at youth with you both. It was some of the best years!!! I witnessed peoples salvations, healings, and receiving such peace. Praise God! I thrived on the 5 services a Sunday… loving the relationships I formed. I had no idea the relationships wouldn’t continue outside of those doors though. Hillsong financial documents released (implicated Ben in these) shocked me. Donations used on so much of nothing to do with ministry. This talk Ben and Carl- you mention nothing of this… it would all be so triggering for people who were there… and knew nothing about what was going on. Love to you both. So good to hear you’re both going well.
@@aprilLiz2023 I find it hilarious. People have no idea how much Ben received from the church for doing absolutely nothing. Yet here he is talking about getting back to a humble, simple church life.
@@bennwaters5851 I was blessed so much back in 2000 from the ministry at Hillsong. I never believe the media… however I’ am struggling with feelings in what was said in Canberra House sitting and the offical documents (they are a matter of public record now). Ben is a kind hearted person. Repentance is the only way for all of us… Bens parents (I still love them)… Ben did they really deny fraudulent use of tithe money (publicly), say they are being attacked for no reason and move to another country??This blows my mind… and I can only leave it in Gods hands. For my own wellbeing I can’t listen to anything from Ben’s family going forward cause I feel gaslighted… but I guess I shouldn’t feel that way… 🙏🏼 @onlyGodKnowsTruth.
I am a Pastor who had to leave a church after public shaming and charges that were dropped. All right before and during COVID. The people who I thought were my closest friends were nowhere to be found. I went through PTSD counseling and found the few true friends. I am a grateful man and still serving the Lord. My Dad who pastored a church in Australia for 16 years in Tamworth said the best thing to me. He said never make your identity in what you do. Make it in who you are in Christ and who He is in you. That kept me. Thank you for sharing your stories. This was encouraging and confirmation.
As a pastor's kid myself, I hate to see the church shoot its wounded. Just know that the body of Christ will keep you both in our prayers and hope God brings you both to a point of restoration. We don't just need restoration for sin, but also when we are going through being mistreated and hurt. I pray that God brings healing to both of you as you both have gone through a lot. We have to believe in a God that restores or we shouldn't be believers. God Bless. Had the opportunity to attend Hillsong in Sydney and in the UK and both times were amazing. God Bless.
I haven’t listened to the entire podcast yet, but I would like to thank you, Ben, for your leadership at Hillsong LA. I wandered into the Belasco theater in 2015 as a super depressed young adult and I sat at those red couches in the back alone. I felt God’s presence and it made me curious so I kept going back. Absolutely changed my life, and now I’m a Youth Pastor in Vancouver helping students know God. You blessed me, and I remember you praying for me once. So, thank you. And Carl, thank you for this podcast and the humility & honesty present. I respect the way you’re using your mistakes to continue to be salt and light in a world that desperately needs it.
So grateful for Carl & Ben’s humility in sharing their darkest moments! “The reason I’m standing before you today isn’t because in my darkest moments I clung onto God. The reason I’m alive today is because in my darkest moments GOD clung onto ME.” - Tullian Tchvidjian
Therefore, I'm tempted to think the same. I have a dear friend who confronted me the other day. The church used to use this thinking to be condescending to their sins and harshly condemn the sins of others. I'm not defending anyone, but God's judgment will be harder on his children.
Loved hearing Ben’s story, and I relate so much: recognizing at a young age that I didn’t react to things the same way as others, discovering what depression was and what it meant, and even going through severe depression with suicidal ideation while in ministry. Thank you, Ben, for encouraging others with your honesty!
I felt blessed to listen in on this - a really great conversation. I've never actually heard much from Ben before but he seems like such a humble and gentle guy with a real pastor's heart. God bless both of you 🙏
2 guys humbled and honest. We see it and appreciate the honesty. I’m a former pastor as well. I went through a divorce several years ago. It helps more people than you know having these conversations.
Attending & serving at Hillsong LA around 2015 were some of the best times of my life and I will never forget them, so thank you! It's also where I met my best friend & forever changed my life!
I make no judgements and sincerely want Lentz to be restored and fruitful as some type of influencer for the Kingdom. I believe much of modern Christianity isn't Biblical. This whole concept of big meetings with bright lights and entertaining music seems contrary to the walk of brokenness with Jesus to me. Very few people can become an on stage church speaker without becoming carnal and out of touch with God. Just my opinion, but after a season of being a church insider and seeing so much phony nonsense I've come to this conclusion. I just want Jesus. Our time on earth is but a vapor. Nothing matters but being close to Him.
I tend to agree with your perspective on the modern church. It doesn’t seem at all like what we read about in the Bible. As for these two. I wouldn’t give them the time of day. One lives a life of luxury in Orange County on the church tab and the other is a con artist.
Ben I don’t know if you will read this or not but I appreciate your humility. In you conversation its very evident you love the Lord and you have tremendous love for the body of Christ. Your desire to do the Lords will is something we should all strive for separate and above any role/title we may have in or outside the church. At the end of the day the only thing that is certain is the Lords love for us and His word and promises. Thanks for the indirect encouragement to stay the course despite what’s happening in and around us. 🙏🏾
Thank you to both of you for your humility. We all have feet of clay. And your courage to go public about being so vulnerable, huge respect. John from Cape Town
I JUST LOVE LOVE LOVE THIS CONVERSATION. So honest, true and both of you made yourself vulnerable. Learnings: Remember the good, forgive, love your neighbour, see the other side, not living in the bitterness, be thankful, renewing your mind, yes people and Church make mistakes, but Jesus not. Go and love your friend that made a mistake and stay a friend instead of judging.
Ben, I live in Montana. I love you and your parents. I’m 62. I’ve followed Hillsong for many years. Please give them my love. I’m also deeply appreciative of Carl. No judgment here. Love you and your testimony. We all have a testimony.
Honor both of you for being REAL and putting this out. May our Father continue multiplying his GRACE and PEACE (2 Peter 1:2) upon both of your lives! I grew up catholic for 20 years and did religion. I left the church and then God met me where I was at. The first christian church I EVER stepped foot in was Hillsong LA in 2019. It was the catalyst for my life with starting my RELATIONSHIP with God. I don't care what people say about Hillsong. The Father has used BOTH of you to eternally impact MILLIONS of lives and it has a RIPPLE EFFECT. And He's JUST GETTING STARTED with both of you!! 5 years have passed and I now lead the Men's Ministry at our church in LA, Youth Ministry, and am in full-time ministry. Fruit from Hillsong. Honor u both
I can’t tell how much it meant to listen to this podcast. Carl and Ben you both showed so much honesty after all the tragedy. Thank you Carl for your courage to stand up again and explaining what Grace really is, thank you!
Carl, your interview on that documentary ... your transparency and vulnurability helped me so much. I'd never seen leadership take ownership of their behavior. It gave me hope that God does forgive and restore. Thank you.
Carl Lentz was my Pastor from Hillsong. I miss him dearly...You will always be my Pastor from Hillsong. May God bless you and families. Much love...Peace Be With You. 💯😇
This episode 😭 whewwww ! What a journey it took me on and it has reminded me just how much grace is needed for ALL of Gods people. What a beautiful reminder .
Thank you Carl,for remembering whose there in the fire. I pray we all have souls like Benny to love us, when we can't love ourselves Our life is truly in Jesus
Ben what a legend! The humility, wisdom, maturity, diplomacy, resilience and authenticity is tangible and real. The God in you is faithful and will always see you through and thankyou for being faithful throughout the journey. I believe that a crown awaits you❤
How amazingly real and refreshing and inspiring to “happen” upon this session today. Absolute thanks for your honesty in sharing the darkest times and allowing God to take your deep pain and use it to encourage others on their journey. Keep going and inspiring the body of Christ with your honesty, wisdom and personal experience.
@@SunnyDays70s No. Having all the comforts of life from growing up with money and opportunities absolutely Does NOT make one humble or love Jesus. The Bible says (Prov 22.6), 'Train up a child in the way that he should go, and when he is old, he will not depart from it.' Give honor to whom it's due; in this case, it's Brian and Bobbie Houston.
@@Cj-en4fj No, they got rich off of innocent people. And none has been given to the grandfather’s victims. These people aren’t following the Lord. It’s all about money. Use more discernment. Honour Brian Houston who when things started going wrong dealt with it by getting drunk? Wrote books on how to get rich? Read your Bible.
Thank you for the transparency. And for investing in so many many people over the years. I am so thankful for Hillsong Church. I was able to attend college in Sydney, church, conferences. It has always brought me closer to Jesus and I was able to grow and work on myself. I love to remember City care; we served people every week, cleaned homes, talked to Isolated people, and brought friendship , encouragment. I loved how the church Serverd the community in do many many ways and i still remember the smiling faces.
This is absolutely beautiful!! A true Loving Soul with a genuine faith and LOVE FOR JESUS! Thank you Ben and Carl for showing the world what a genuine relationship should reflect!🥰
Ben Houston is the real deal. I first met him 20 years ago when he came to NZ to speak at our youth camp. But it was the way he treated the least and took the moment to truly care.
God does not through anyone away either, but HE do expose those who do not repent, become lukewarm and live like the rest of the world !!! Megachurch became like a club where people have the shine of holiness, but their hearts are far from the TRUE CHRIST 😢 RELIGION IS EVIL !!!! THE devil TOOK OVER THE MEGACHURCHES !!! SAD !!!
Ben appears to be a very genuine, humble man who is determined to give God the glory. I pray that the Lord blesses him and his family in this challenging season 🙏❤️
Great and honest podcast from start to finish. I can relate to everything in so many ways as a pastor and missionary. Thank you both for sharing and opening up. I’m praying for you both
Thank you both of you Carl and Ben God will reward you this was the best pod i ever heard thanks for sharing, i love the Houston Family and Hillsong and Pray for you all ❤❤ thanks Carl for this. Please invite Brian Houston, i know it maybe too early, but when ready, invite him. We love you all and praying for you all.
It is hopeful to see Carl and Ben having such a beautiful love filled conversation. The faith and hope and ability to own their personal life journey and express that the church should support and continue to guide and love rather than discard people who fall is so right. The church represents God, represents forgiveness, represents chances for redemption and the people running a church should always have empathy and an open door policy and be underpinned by God's love. Thanks for having this real conversation 🙏
My life has been very blessed by Hillsong’s ministry over many years I’ve met wonderful Christians in Sydney, New York and LA. Thank you both and your families for your service to Christ. The body of Christ really needs to devote prayer to support our leaders. You all are on the front lines. It’s much easier to be a critic than be a leader! Much love and thanks ❤
Great to see Ben and Carl having a chat . I love Hillsong and still go the waterloo campus all the pastors are doing a great job . A prophet once told me a long time ago always be yoked to Jesus Christ and not to a Church so you can have the best of both Worlds . God is really merciful and just kind to us , we wrestle not against flesh and blood . Kermet the frog said it is not easy being green , it is not easy being a Pastor !! body of Christ please pray for the Pastors of your Church .
This was a beautiful conversation. Thank you so much for bringing these perspectives. It breaks my heart how we so easily discard our brothers and sisters. This really spoke to me. I love that followers of Christ are having these honest conversations. Thank you.
I used to go to Hillsong Sydney around 20yrs ago and loved it but then returned to NZ. I wasn't clear about what happened at Hillsong in the US but all I know is that we all are on a life journey with God and learning as we go; growing in gratefulness and understanding. Thank you both for sharing this conversation. The more we all can be real in our vulnerability and relationship with God, the more we encourage each other. Though the world changes I am so very glad God hasn't changed. God Bless you and your families in this next chapter.
Same, I was at Hills from 1999-2001 before moving to Brisbane. My Aunt is still a Pastor there and I have family which attend also. Some of my best memories are at youth and doing United nights etc.. Now In my 40’s and still weathering the storm of life.
Well you can hear some of what went on in Hillsong US in Dan Johnstone's podcast, such as Carl sexually assaulting their nanny "more than 20, but less than 100" times, and Carl's wife repeatedly punching the victim in the face when she walked in on one of the assaults. But doesn't the heart warm to see him now with a new reach 🤔
I attended Hillsong NYC once. It was a good experience with wonderful preaching by then Pastor Carl Lenz. Many lives have been affected in a positive way by all of the Hillsong ministries, despite the scandals and secrets.
this makes my heart happy seeing carl & ben - love this conversation, needed to hear this. had the absolute honor of working under ben's leadership at the city campus, and he was always the most loving and caring leader, pulling out the gold in every one of us fuel leaders.
Guys Im so glad you both had this conversation. ❤Ben Im sorry that you have been going through this. Honestly former healing/deliverance intercessor here, and the onset of it all sounds like a spiritual attack. A garden variety kind that I keep hearing about. I also went through some myself.. Good for you for taking care of your body and mind. just remember there is a spiritual part too! if it comes back attack it on the side too.
So inspiring,growing up in the church myself, I identify with a lot of what Ben shared, so good, Carl great to see you ascending, recovering and being strengthened, bless you bro! Amen, Ben well done so encouraging and touching to hear your experiences man Love & blessings 👍
I do enjoy this podcast when I have the chance to listen to it. I’ve seen a couple of episodes with you and Laura. I really enjoy hearing from her. She has such a great spirit and heart. This episode was great to hear from Ben Houston. It made me empathize for Hillsong leaders. Praying for the everyone and the day the Church will have real compassion for others when they fall.
You can tell the heart Ben has for serving people. It is genuine, he has a Pastors heart. This attack he is talking about in 43:00 really sounds like a spiritual attack. Maybe some people will disagree with me. But I have seen this happen many times. This especially happens when someone is in sync with God's heart and the enemy sees it and wants to rob it. Especially since the LA area has so many witches and other dark forces. A lot of times we have to fight the spiritual battles, not to say that Ben did not. I hope is gets better for him. And that the change he has made with his life are really helping him with his health.
Great podcast Ben and Carl. I've had the opportunity to be in Church and listen to you share at different times in Brisbane. Despite the shortfalls and imperfections of Christians, we still need to Love God and Love People in all that we do going forward. God Bless Hillsongs Church and all that you both have invested into Gods Kingdom.
Beautiful. Just beautiful. THIS is what is going to bring us back to hope, love, joy, community and so much more. Real people just being open and honest and sharing their stories to give others hope again.
This video makes my heart happy. People want to trash Hillsong, and while I can say there are issues, I just can't, the Lord has used Hillsong to touch me for ove 30 yrs now. Watching this you can see the tender heart for Jesus that Ben has. (What happened to him was so wrong)I'm not sure I see that for Carl.
I think Carl was removed with reason. He was deceitful in his ministry and family. He was biblically disqualified from ministry because of what he was doing. With that being said, yes the church maybe could have handled his removal differently but I don't see it any other way than Carl being removed from ministry completely. I think Carl after being caught professed repentance and the church should have helped in the restoration process. By no means am I saying Carl should have been reinstated but what I am saying the church should have been there in the restoration process and supporting the family. But Hillsong Church is a global church with corporation business tendencies, so I am also not surprise them trying to save face after everything was revealed. They acted as a business and not a church. So that tells you what Hillsong is about. I feel for Ben, he was caught in the crossfire. Praying for his brother Joel as well!
Yes. Think Carl himself has siad that he should've been removed, but the manner which it was done was not appreciated (especially since his daughter was in a vulnerable state at the time). And yes the restoration part which is a sore point for many churches, not just Hillsong.
This is a great interview. I’ve never seen a family lift the name of Jesus like the Houston’s, and change the lives of so many for the better. Thank God for you guys.
Absolutely love this. Thanks for doing this podcast, speaking out. Respect the church you guys built and can only imagine what you’ve gone through. No judgement from me, my fave verses are around forgiveness “let him without sin cast the first stone”. Keep finding the love of Jesus and leaning and loving those close to you.
So blessed to heard that! Tks for sharing your lifes. It's not easy but God ir faithful and mercyful. So honest! We need heard and learn more about it because leaders are not superheros. They are not god. Are imperfect humans.
Prayers for the Lentz and Houston families. God loves and forgives and restores. I love that they are here and having honest communication. Thank you Jesus for this.
as a son of a pastor, and seeing what they go through, i feel for both Ben and Brian and Bobby. You always have a target on your back. Brian has been through hell with all that's happened. But, Ben, i hardly ever see my dad because of his commitment to serving God, and I'm 54 now with kids that the parents rarely see. to busy still with church to visit us 3 hours south of Sydney. Great to have heard you talk Ben.
I am SORRY but this woe is me attitude of Ben and Carl is so telling of the type of leaders they probably were. Thing is the leadership of Hillsong was toxic, and the route of the culture comes directly from the Houstons and even Carl and other senior pastors. etc. If you were of no use to the church, you were discarded. Unfortunately, they reaped what they sowed. If they desired support in their tough moments, then they should have established a culture of pastoring and feeding sheep instead of a "use and dispose" culture that Hillsong was plagued with. God removed these people from leadership for a reason. I just pray that they take this moment to humble themselves before the Lord. God will use them if they Love God and Love people without expecting anything in return. (I'm preaching to myself too don't get me wrong)
I was part of Hillsong LA. I couldn’t agree with you more. Ben was kind and available for his inner circle only. Why would he expect massive support from people he never cared to pour into.
@@crystalmorgan9118How about start with the need for repentance. Have they made amends with all of their victims. Doubt it. They seem as arrogant and self-absorbed as always. Hillsong formed a clique and had people pay money to strive to get in or be like them. Scam.
I visited Hillsong LA a few times in 2015 when I came to LA. it was such a great experience..my heart hurts though to hear even then Ben was suffering.. 😩 We briefly met Ben after service, he was so kind even when my friend was rambling on lol..
This is very palatable to me. What a privilege to visit the friendship of two Godly men. Guys it’s ok to love a friend. This is a refreshing podcast. Thanks guys.
I would love to hear Benjamin story a bit more, very eye opening and different side to pastoring that many don’t talk about. Being spiritually empty or fatigued but still showing up. God bless him
Carl and Ben, thank you so much for sharing your heart on the pod cast. Both of you and the Houstons have been in my prayers for the past few years. I am so glad God's grace is suffient for us all and to see your continued love for Jesus and the faith. Today has brightened up my day. I believe God will work through you both powerful to reach a broken and lost world with the light. The word I get for you is that the latter will be better than the former. God is the God of restoration and forgiveness. Never look back but straight ahead... bless ya... btw. I was so blessed to attend City Harvest Church a year ago and see Ps Kong Hee preach. It was the most touching message I have heard in a long time. Jesus is hope for us all......
May God bless you both & May He give you grace to continue strong in the love of our beautiful Jesus!! We are all imperfect humans serving a Perfect God!
If you are a drug addict, you stay away from drugs and those who peddle them. If you are a fame and celebrity addict, you stay away from audiences and attention and from those who peddle it. Have this conversation privately, without the attention. Go serve those who wont give you anything in return.
Y’all are doing everything so right 😭🤍 we’re all human and it’s amazing to see yall pivot and God still use whatever yall do to bless and help so many others! I was on TH-cam when I was a teen and I saw “With Everything” live in Miami. It caught my attention so much because I had never seen worship like that growing up in the Pentecostal church. It was a pivotal moment for me because after that I sought God on my own and started my own personal relationship with Him all because I saw that video and that song. Hillsong was a blessing to my life in Los Angeles before it came here in 2014. I don’t know what’s going on with it now! But I will forever love the OG’s!!! ❤ (Carl, Ben, Lucille, Joel, Esther, JD, etc)
At 33:07, I saw the pain. God, I am so thankful for this podcast. We are able to see two human beings affected by a situation that almost destroyed them but God did HIS thing and now we can enjoy seeing restoration. Amen.
Hang in right there guys.... God is known well for His redemption and restoration.... It will look soooo different yet will be wow... Its never over until any of us breathe our last and remember it is His church He is building.... right from the day He resurrected, He is globally still moving and using it all.... mistakes and all, failures and all, wrongs and all, denominations and all, extremes and all, imbalances and all...List can go on and on.... Because this is sooooo much bigger and when we all get to Heaven what a day of rejoicing that will be!!!!! I am sooooo proud of you both.... and as a 46yr old woman between India, UK and USA - with missions foundations in my life yet such different adventure, I am melted as a momma's heart and I know and I know and I know, greater are going to be your days ahead... To trail blaze what mantle it takes for a man to be so strong in being such beautifully vulnerable... Both of you!!!! Salute and cheering you on....... It will be worth it when you for real have your last moments transitioning into eternity.... !! AND WHEN HE SAYS 'well done, good and faithful servant' !!! The day of rewards from Jesus is going to be shocking moment for all of us.... that is for sure :)
Pastor Brian Houston came to preach in my church in Aust late last year as he is a friend of my Pastor. I knew during that media generated nothing scandal that Pastor Brian would be completely cleared. He is a great preacher.
The mega church machine breeds burnout from top to bottom. This conversation is such a sad example of it… would be so interesting to hear your insights about how the culture can be changed to be more sustainable? You talk about being there for people in the good and bad, but how about changing the culture for more emotional safeness for people to take breaks when they need, to be honest and accountable with sin and challenges earlier, so we can prevent our brothers and sisters in Christ from getting to such places of crisis, pain and darkness?
I believe this is how it should have been from the beginning: leaders speaking from their vulnerability, showing their true selves. Over the last decade, Hillsong promoted an idealized leadership style, using Hollywood as a reference and straying from biblical truths. This has resulted in many megachurches being filled with people seeking fame, setting aside the cross as the central message of personal repentance and inner transformation, and forgetting the mission of bringing that message to the lost
I love and honour Pastors Brian & Bobby and Hillsong Church. We were fed, encouraged and inspired in God and His kingdom by how they lead & loved God & His church.
Keep it real Carl and Ben 💯 love to see this. I remember hearing you multiple times here in Houston Tx. You were a big inspo throughout high school and when this went down the first thing that crossed my mind was. “He is human… and that’s okay Jesus was the only perfect one.. lets show him love and help him because i know first hand how it feels to be in a dark place without hope or help…” but nope that didn’t happen and this is what’s sad about churches across the globe… we forget to reflect Jesus and to do that we have to be human. We pick people up and help them we don’t dispose of them because they are being themselves… no one walks this world perfect you walk by being YOU and being YOU is being human and everyday you work to become a better human. Much love man I’m glad to see the unfiltered Carl speaking. “Real recognize real” 💯
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Hillsong 1999-2005… I was there. I was at youth with you both. It was some of the best years!!! I witnessed peoples salvations, healings, and receiving such peace. Praise God! I thrived on the 5 services a Sunday… loving the relationships I formed. I had no idea the relationships wouldn’t continue outside of those doors though. Hillsong financial documents released (implicated Ben in these) shocked me. Donations used on so much of nothing to do with ministry. This talk Ben and Carl- you mention nothing of this… it would all be so triggering for people who were there… and knew nothing about what was going on. Love to you both. So good to hear you’re both going well.
@@aprilLiz2023 I find it hilarious. People have no idea how much Ben received from the church for doing absolutely nothing. Yet here he is talking about getting back to a humble, simple church life.
@@bennwaters5851 I was blessed so much back in 2000 from the ministry at Hillsong.
I never believe the media… however I’ am struggling with feelings in what was said in Canberra House sitting and the offical documents (they are a matter of public record now).
Ben is a kind hearted person. Repentance is the only way for all of us… Bens parents (I still love them)… Ben did they really deny fraudulent use of tithe money (publicly), say they are being attacked for no reason and move to another country??This blows my mind… and I can only leave it in Gods hands. For my own wellbeing I can’t listen to anything from Ben’s family going forward cause I feel gaslighted… but I guess I shouldn’t feel that way… 🙏🏼 @onlyGodKnowsTruth.
I am a Pastor who had to leave a church after public shaming and charges that were dropped. All right before and during COVID. The people who I thought were my closest friends were nowhere to be found. I went through PTSD counseling and found the few true friends. I am a grateful man and still serving the Lord. My Dad who pastored a church in Australia for 16 years in Tamworth said the best thing to me. He said never make your identity in what you do. Make it in who you are in Christ and who He is in you. That kept me. Thank you for sharing your stories. This was encouraging and confirmation.
I can’t imagine what that would have been like, us Christians can be a nasty bunch! ❤
As a pastor's kid myself, I hate to see the church shoot its wounded. Just know that the body of Christ will keep you both in our prayers and hope God brings you both to a point of restoration. We don't just need restoration for sin, but also when we are going through being mistreated and hurt. I pray that God brings healing to both of you as you both have gone through a lot. We have to believe in a God that restores or we shouldn't be believers. God Bless. Had the opportunity to attend Hillsong in Sydney and in the UK and both times were amazing. God Bless.
I haven’t listened to the entire podcast yet, but I would like to thank you, Ben, for your leadership at Hillsong LA. I wandered into the Belasco theater in 2015 as a super depressed young adult and I sat at those red couches in the back alone. I felt God’s presence and it made me curious so I kept going back. Absolutely changed my life, and now I’m a Youth Pastor in Vancouver helping students know God. You blessed me, and I remember you praying for me once. So, thank you. And Carl, thank you for this podcast and the humility & honesty present. I respect the way you’re using your mistakes to continue to be salt and light in a world that desperately needs it.
@@dianewong_ PRAISING GOD!!!
🫶🏽
Praise God
Nice
This is it.
So grateful for Carl & Ben’s humility in sharing their darkest moments!
“The reason I’m standing before you today isn’t because in my darkest moments I clung onto God. The reason I’m alive today is because in my darkest moments GOD clung onto ME.”
- Tullian Tchvidjian
I wish there was a part 2! Ben is so wonderfully humble and his love of Jesus and the Church is evident! Loved this episode!
How much did his house cost?
my take away from this is that every one ...EVERYONE is human, imperfect and we ALL fall short... Praise God for HIS mercy!!
The way some fall affects more people.
Exactly. Bless you.
Therefore, I'm tempted to think the same. I have a dear friend who confronted me the other day. The church used to use this thinking to be condescending to their sins and harshly condemn the sins of others. I'm not defending anyone, but God's judgment will be harder on his children.
My late wife got saved at Hillsong Sydney in 1986 Brian was an extraordinary pastor And the church was on fire.
Loved hearing Ben’s story, and I relate so much: recognizing at a young age that I didn’t react to things the same way as others, discovering what depression was and what it meant, and even going through severe depression with suicidal ideation while in ministry. Thank you, Ben, for encouraging others with your honesty!
I felt blessed to listen in on this - a really great conversation. I've never actually heard much from Ben before but he seems like such a humble and gentle guy with a real pastor's heart. God bless both of you 🙏
2 guys humbled and honest. We see it and appreciate the honesty. I’m a former pastor as well. I went through a divorce several years ago. It helps more people than you know having these conversations.
Attending & serving at Hillsong LA around 2015 were some of the best times of my life and I will never forget them, so thank you! It's also where I met my best friend & forever changed my life!
I make no judgements and sincerely want Lentz to be restored and fruitful as some type of influencer for the Kingdom. I believe much of modern Christianity isn't Biblical. This whole concept of big meetings with bright lights and entertaining music seems contrary to the walk of brokenness with Jesus to me. Very few people can become an on stage church speaker without becoming carnal and out of touch with God. Just my opinion, but after a season of being a church insider and seeing so much phony nonsense I've come to this conclusion. I just want Jesus. Our time on earth is but a vapor. Nothing matters but being close to Him.
That’s good
Avoid churches that avoid taking communion.
The orthodox are smart to never worship without it.
You are so right. Its now fame and bright lights and big personalities
#1 purpose is to worship and love the Lord
#2 love one another
I tend to agree with your perspective on the modern church. It doesn’t seem at all like what we read about in the Bible.
As for these two. I wouldn’t give them the time of day. One lives a life of luxury in Orange County on the church tab and the other is a con artist.
Benny. One of the all time greats! Thanks for loving and serving bro! and great to see Carl back! 🙏🏼❤️
Champions aren't defined by their successes & triumphs, but by number of times, they pick themselves up after they fall ❤
'For a righteous man falls seven times, and rises again, But the wicked stumble in time of calamity. '
Proverbs 24:16
Ben I don’t know if you will read this or not but I appreciate your humility. In you conversation its very evident you love the Lord and you have tremendous love for the body of Christ. Your desire to do the Lords will is something we should all strive for separate and above any role/title we may have in or outside the church. At the end of the day the only thing that is certain is the Lords love for us and His word and promises. Thanks for the indirect encouragement to stay the course despite what’s happening in and around us. 🙏🏾
Thank you to both of you for your humility. We all have feet of clay. And your courage to go public about being so vulnerable, huge respect. John from Cape Town
I JUST LOVE LOVE LOVE THIS CONVERSATION. So honest, true and both of you made yourself vulnerable.
Learnings:
Remember the good, forgive, love your neighbour, see the other side, not living in the bitterness, be thankful, renewing your mind, yes people and Church make mistakes, but Jesus not. Go and love your friend that made a mistake and stay a friend instead of judging.
Ben, I live in Montana. I love you and your parents. I’m 62. I’ve followed Hillsong for many years. Please give them my love. I’m also deeply appreciative of Carl. No judgment here. Love you and your testimony. We all have a testimony.
Honor both of you for being REAL and putting this out. May our Father continue multiplying his GRACE and PEACE (2 Peter 1:2) upon both of your lives! I grew up catholic for 20 years and did religion. I left the church and then God met me where I was at. The first christian church I EVER stepped foot in was Hillsong LA in 2019. It was the catalyst for my life with starting my RELATIONSHIP with God. I don't care what people say about Hillsong. The Father has used BOTH of you to eternally impact MILLIONS of lives and it has a RIPPLE EFFECT. And He's JUST GETTING STARTED with both of you!! 5 years have passed and I now lead the Men's Ministry at our church in LA, Youth Ministry, and am in full-time ministry. Fruit from Hillsong. Honor u both
I can’t tell how much it meant to listen to this podcast. Carl and Ben you both showed so much honesty after all the tragedy. Thank you Carl for your courage to stand up again and explaining what Grace really is, thank you!
Carl, your interview on that documentary ... your transparency and vulnurability helped me so much. I'd never seen leadership take ownership of their behavior. It gave me hope that God does forgive and restore. Thank you.
Wow so so cool that Ben and Carl are sitting together like this. So healing.
Carl Lentz was my Pastor from Hillsong. I miss him dearly...You will always be my Pastor from Hillsong. May God bless you and families. Much love...Peace Be With You. 💯😇
@@JohnnySmith-nyc-85 wow that’s amazing 🤩
Same! ...I was apart of the start of NYC and LA ...... definitely contributed greatly to my Faith. Bless them and their families.
Really last time I heard him preach at waterloo his theology was so off.
@ As long as you're not off
he's hesitating a lot to go deeper..but it can be fathomable..love you man
This episode 😭 whewwww ! What a journey it took me on and it has reminded me just how much grace is needed for ALL of Gods people. What a beautiful reminder .
I hope Pastor Ben and Pastor Carl got supernatural healing from this conversation. 🫂
Absolutely loved this! Ben is such a truly incredible human being. Also loving the podcast Carl. Keep up the great work!
Thank you Carl,for remembering whose there in the fire. I pray we all have souls like Benny to love us, when we can't love ourselves
Our life is truly in Jesus
One of the best Eps yet! More of this. More Ben houston. More ministry people.
These are the ones i really enjoy.
Ben what a legend! The humility, wisdom, maturity, diplomacy, resilience and authenticity is tangible and real. The God in you is faithful and will always see you through and thankyou for being faithful throughout the journey. I believe that a crown awaits you❤
How amazingly real and refreshing and inspiring to “happen” upon this session today. Absolute thanks for your honesty in sharing the darkest times and allowing God to take your deep pain and use it to encourage others on their journey. Keep going and inspiring the body of Christ with your honesty, wisdom and personal experience.
Ben's humbleness and love for Jesus are a testament to being raised right.
Or having all of the comforts of life from other peoples money. He hasn’t known hardship like most.
@@SunnyDays70s No. Having all the comforts of life from growing up with money and opportunities absolutely Does NOT make one humble or love Jesus. The Bible says (Prov 22.6), 'Train up a child in the way that he should go, and when he is old, he will not depart from it.' Give honor to whom it's due; in this case, it's Brian and Bobbie Houston.
@@Cj-en4fj No, they got rich off of innocent people. And none has been given to the grandfather’s victims. These people aren’t following the Lord. It’s all about money. Use more discernment.
Honour Brian Houston who when things started going wrong dealt with it by getting drunk? Wrote books on how to get rich? Read your Bible.
@@SunnyDays70s Your logic isn't sound. Bless your heart♥
@ Your passive aggressive response ‘bless your heart’ after insulting shows everything. Happy Holidays.
Thank you for the transparency.
And for investing in so many many people over the years.
I am so thankful for Hillsong Church. I was able to attend college in Sydney, church, conferences. It has always brought me closer to Jesus and I was able to grow and work on myself. I love to remember City care; we served people every week, cleaned homes, talked to Isolated people, and brought friendship , encouragment. I loved how the church Serverd the community in do many many ways and i still remember the smiling faces.
Transparency?Really?
so beautiful...continue bringing genuine content - the church needs it - I need it. God bless.
This is absolutely beautiful!! A true Loving Soul with a genuine faith and LOVE FOR JESUS! Thank you Ben and Carl for showing the world what a genuine relationship should reflect!🥰
Ben Houston is the real deal. I first met him 20 years ago when he came to NZ to speak at our youth camp. But it was the way he treated the least and took the moment to truly care.
@@markmcdowell1095 bawhaha he a false teacher to
I am going to pray for you all. People make mistakes and we don't throw them away.
@@elizabethbillingsley5534 AMEN, I for one and so grateful God didn't throw me away!!
God does not through anyone away either, but HE do expose those who do not repent, become lukewarm and live like the rest of the world !!!
Megachurch became like a club where people have the shine of holiness, but their hearts are far from the TRUE CHRIST 😢
RELIGION IS EVIL !!!!
THE devil TOOK OVER THE MEGACHURCHES !!!
SAD !!!
Ben appears to be a very genuine, humble man who is determined to give God the glory. I pray that the Lord blesses him and his family in this challenging season 🙏❤️
Great and honest podcast from start to finish. I can relate to everything in so many ways as a pastor and missionary. Thank you both for sharing and opening up. I’m praying for you both
Honest???
Redemptive conversation. Beautiful.
Great convo. So grateful to see how healthy Ben is ❤
Thank you for sharing, gentlemen. Loved the emphasis on 'pace'. Right there with you..
Glad you enjoyed it
Thank you both of you Carl and Ben God will reward you this was the best pod i ever heard thanks for sharing, i love the Houston Family and Hillsong and Pray for you all ❤❤ thanks Carl for this.
Please invite Brian Houston, i know it maybe too early, but when ready, invite him. We love you all and praying for you all.
Glad you enjoyed it
It is hopeful to see Carl and Ben having such a beautiful love filled conversation.
The faith and hope and ability to own their personal life journey and express that the church should support and continue to guide and love rather than discard people who fall is so right.
The church represents God, represents forgiveness, represents chances for redemption and the people running a church should always have empathy and an open door policy and be underpinned by God's love.
Thanks for having this real conversation 🙏
My life has been very blessed by Hillsong’s ministry over many years I’ve met wonderful Christians in Sydney, New York and LA. Thank you both and your families for your service to Christ. The body of Christ really needs to devote prayer to support our leaders. You all are on the front lines. It’s much easier to be a critic than be a leader! Much love and thanks ❤
Love Ya Carl! This series has been really helpful. Would love to see more from the coaching side
More to come!
Great to see Ben and Carl having a chat . I love Hillsong and still go the waterloo campus all the pastors are doing a great job . A prophet once told me a long time ago always be yoked to Jesus Christ and not to a Church so you can have the best of both Worlds . God is really merciful and just kind to us , we wrestle not against flesh and blood . Kermet the frog said it is not easy being green , it is not easy being a Pastor !! body of Christ please pray for the Pastors of your Church .
Sooo glad to see you two!!! I miss the Hillsong Channel! I've been wondering about all of you!
Love that you're not tearing the church to shreds. So refreshing to hear men speak without bitterness.
This was a beautiful conversation. Thank you so much for bringing these perspectives. It breaks my heart how we so easily discard our brothers and sisters. This really spoke to me. I love that followers of Christ are having these honest conversations. Thank you.
I used to go to Hillsong Sydney around 20yrs ago and loved it but then returned to NZ. I wasn't clear about what happened at Hillsong in the US but all I know is that we all are on a life journey with God and learning as we go; growing in gratefulness and understanding. Thank you both for sharing this conversation. The more we all can be real in our vulnerability and relationship with God, the more we encourage each other. Though the world changes I am so very glad God hasn't changed. God Bless you and your families in this next chapter.
Same, I was at Hills from 1999-2001 before moving to Brisbane. My Aunt is still a Pastor there and I have family which attend also. Some of my best memories are at youth and doing United nights etc.. Now In my 40’s and still weathering the storm of life.
Well you can hear some of what went on in Hillsong US in Dan Johnstone's podcast, such as Carl sexually assaulting their nanny "more than 20, but less than 100" times, and Carl's wife repeatedly punching the victim in the face when she walked in on one of the assaults. But doesn't the heart warm to see him now with a new reach 🤔
I attended Hillsong NYC once. It was a good experience with wonderful preaching by then Pastor Carl Lenz. Many lives have been affected in a positive way by all of the Hillsong ministries, despite the scandals and secrets.
Wonderful testimony on burn out and depression. Thank you for sharing a taboo subject, Mr Houston
Ben, Your parents are the best people and I am still trying to get over the way they were treated. I can't even imagine how you must feel.
This is a beautiful and frank conversational. Lessons to be learned for sure! ❤
Thank you for sharing your mistakes and what you learned from them and also the misconceptions out there. God’s blessings on both of you!
this makes my heart happy seeing carl & ben - love this conversation, needed to hear this. had the absolute honor of working under ben's leadership at the city campus, and he was always the most loving and caring leader, pulling out the gold in every one of us fuel leaders.
Guys Im so glad you both had this conversation.
❤Ben Im sorry that you have been going through this. Honestly former healing/deliverance intercessor here, and the onset of it all sounds like a spiritual attack. A garden variety kind that I keep hearing about.
I also went through some myself.. Good for you for taking care of your body and mind. just remember there is a spiritual part too! if it comes back attack it
on the side too.
So inspiring,growing up in the church myself, I identify with a lot of what Ben shared, so good, Carl great to see you ascending, recovering and being strengthened, bless you bro!
Amen, Ben well done so encouraging and touching to hear your experiences man
Love & blessings 👍
Extremely encouraging + restorative episode. Thank you both for your vulnerability (and courage).
Excellent, thanks Ben & Carl for your honesty. So refreshing! God bless you richly ❤
Glad you enjoyed it!
I do enjoy this podcast when I have the chance to listen to it. I’ve seen a couple of episodes with you and Laura. I really enjoy hearing from her. She has such a great spirit and heart.
This episode was great to hear from Ben Houston. It made me empathize for Hillsong leaders. Praying for the everyone and the day the Church will have real compassion for others when they fall.
This was my first time hearing Ben speak. Very powerful!
You can tell the heart Ben has for serving people. It is genuine, he has a Pastors heart.
This attack he is talking about in 43:00 really sounds like a spiritual attack. Maybe some people will disagree with me. But I have seen this happen many times. This especially happens when someone is in sync with God's heart and the enemy sees it and wants to rob it.
Especially since the LA area has so many witches and other dark forces. A lot of times we have to fight the spiritual battles, not to say that Ben did not.
I hope is gets better for him. And that the change he has made with his life are really helping him with his health.
Great podcast Ben and Carl. I've had the opportunity to be in Church and listen to you share at different times in Brisbane. Despite the shortfalls and imperfections of Christians, we still need to Love God and Love People in all that we do going forward. God Bless Hillsongs Church and all that you both have invested into Gods Kingdom.
Beautiful. Just beautiful.
THIS is what is going to bring us back to hope, love, joy, community and so much more. Real people just being open and honest and sharing their stories to give others hope again.
This video makes my heart happy. People want to trash Hillsong, and while I can say there are issues, I just can't, the Lord has used Hillsong to touch me for ove 30 yrs now. Watching this you can see the tender heart for Jesus that Ben has. (What happened to him was so wrong)I'm not sure I see that for Carl.
I think Carl was removed with reason. He was deceitful in his ministry and family. He was biblically disqualified from ministry because of what he was doing. With that being said, yes the church maybe could have handled his removal differently but I don't see it any other way than Carl being removed from ministry completely. I think Carl after being caught professed repentance and the church should have helped in the restoration process. By no means am I saying Carl should have been reinstated but what I am saying the church should have been there in the restoration process and supporting the family.
But Hillsong Church is a global church with corporation business tendencies, so I am also not surprise them trying to save face after everything was revealed.
They acted as a business and not a church. So that tells you what Hillsong is about.
I feel for Ben, he was caught in the crossfire. Praying for his brother Joel as well!
How was Ben caught in the crossfire? He was on the gravy train and practically doing nothing for the last several years.
Yes. Think Carl himself has siad that he should've been removed, but the manner which it was done was not appreciated (especially since his daughter was in a vulnerable state at the time). And yes the restoration part which is a sore point for many churches, not just Hillsong.
This is a great interview. I’ve never seen a family lift the name of Jesus like the Houston’s, and change the lives of so many for the better.
Thank God for you guys.
And live lavishly while doing it.
There’s gotta be another episode with these two!!
Absolutely love this. Thanks for doing this podcast, speaking out. Respect the church you guys built and can only imagine what you’ve gone through. No judgement from me, my fave verses are around forgiveness “let him without sin cast the first stone”.
Keep finding the love of Jesus and leaning and loving those close to you.
So blessed to heard that! Tks for sharing your lifes. It's not easy but God ir faithful and mercyful. So honest! We need heard and learn more about it because leaders are not superheros. They are not god. Are imperfect humans.
Thank you guys for keepin’ it Real! We all need this. God is our Wonderful Redeemer!
Prayers for the Lentz and Houston families. God loves and forgives and restores. I love that they are here and having honest communication. Thank you Jesus for this.
Thank you Ben and Carl. This is very helpful to me answered some of my questions.
Thank you Ben and am so sorry for what you have been through. May the Lord strengthrn and sustain you all. x
Thank you Ben. Loved it. So so good. Grateful and thankful for you.
as a son of a pastor, and seeing what they go through, i feel for both Ben and Brian and Bobby. You always have a target on your back. Brian has been through hell with all that's happened. But, Ben, i hardly ever see my dad because of his commitment to serving God, and I'm 54 now with kids that the parents rarely see. to busy still with church to visit us 3 hours south of Sydney. Great to have heard you talk Ben.
I am SORRY but this woe is me attitude of Ben and Carl is so telling of the type of leaders they probably were. Thing is the leadership of Hillsong was toxic, and the route of the culture comes directly from the Houstons and even Carl and other senior pastors. etc. If you were of no use to the church, you were discarded. Unfortunately, they reaped what they sowed. If they desired support in their tough moments, then they should have established a culture of pastoring and feeding sheep instead of a "use and dispose" culture that Hillsong was plagued with. God removed these people from leadership for a reason. I just pray that they take this moment to humble themselves before the Lord. God will use them if they Love God and Love people without expecting anything in return. (I'm preaching to myself too don't get me wrong)
100% agree.
I was part of Hillsong LA. I couldn’t agree with you more. Ben was kind and available for his inner circle only. Why would he expect massive support from people he never cared to pour into.
This is beautiful to watch armour of forgiveness and grace and mercy
@@crystalmorgan9118How about start with the need for repentance. Have they made amends with all of their victims. Doubt it. They seem as arrogant and self-absorbed as always. Hillsong formed a clique and had people pay money to strive to get in or be like them. Scam.
Agree, I’ve seen what Hillsong has done since the beginning here in Australia !
I visited Hillsong LA a few times in 2015 when I came to LA. it was such a great experience..my heart hurts though to hear even then Ben was suffering.. 😩 We briefly met Ben after service, he was so kind even when my friend was rambling on lol..
This is very palatable to me. What a privilege to visit the friendship of two Godly men. Guys it’s ok to love a friend. This is a refreshing podcast. Thanks guys.
I would love to hear Benjamin story a bit more, very eye opening and different side to pastoring that many don’t talk about. Being spiritually empty or fatigued but still showing up. God bless him
I agree! Burnout etc..
There are more people who respect Ben and Carl than perhaps they realise
This was a great conversation.
So thankful for this real and raw healthy conversation! 🙏🏾
Carl and Ben, thank you so much for sharing your heart on the pod cast. Both of you and the Houstons have been in my prayers for the past few years. I am so glad God's grace is suffient for us all and to see your continued love for Jesus and the faith. Today has brightened up my day. I believe God will work through you both powerful to reach a broken and lost world with the light. The word I get for you is that the latter will be better than the former. God is the God of restoration and forgiveness. Never look back but straight ahead... bless ya... btw. I was so blessed to attend City Harvest Church a year ago and see Ps Kong Hee preach. It was the most touching message I have heard in a long time. Jesus is hope for us all......
May God bless you both & May He give you grace to continue strong in the love of our beautiful Jesus!! We are all imperfect humans serving a Perfect God!
Love Ben! Enjoyed this conversation
If you are a drug addict, you stay away from drugs and those who peddle them. If you are a fame and celebrity addict, you stay away from audiences and attention and from those who peddle it. Have this conversation privately, without the attention. Go serve those who wont give you anything in return.
Y’all are doing everything so right 😭🤍 we’re all human and it’s amazing to see yall pivot and God still use whatever yall do to bless and help so many others! I was on TH-cam when I was a teen and I saw “With Everything” live in Miami. It caught my attention so much because I had never seen worship like that growing up in the Pentecostal church. It was a pivotal moment for me because after that I sought God on my own and started my own personal relationship with Him all because I saw that video and that song. Hillsong was a blessing to my life in Los Angeles before it came here in 2014. I don’t know what’s going on with it now! But I will forever love the OG’s!!! ❤ (Carl, Ben, Lucille, Joel, Esther, JD, etc)
At 33:07, I saw the pain. God, I am so thankful for this podcast. We are able to see two human beings affected by a situation that almost destroyed them but God did HIS thing and now we can enjoy seeing restoration. Amen.
Hang in right there guys.... God is known well for His redemption and restoration.... It will look soooo different yet will be wow... Its never over until any of us breathe our last and remember it is His church He is building.... right from the day He resurrected, He is globally still moving and using it all.... mistakes and all, failures and all, wrongs and all, denominations and all, extremes and all, imbalances and all...List can go on and on.... Because this is sooooo much bigger and when we all get to Heaven what a day of rejoicing that will be!!!!! I am sooooo proud of you both.... and as a 46yr old woman between India, UK and USA - with missions foundations in my life yet such different adventure, I am melted as a momma's heart and I know and I know and I know, greater are going to be your days ahead... To trail blaze what mantle it takes for a man to be so strong in being such beautifully vulnerable... Both of you!!!! Salute and cheering you on....... It will be worth it when you for real have your last moments transitioning into eternity.... !! AND WHEN HE SAYS 'well done, good and faithful servant' !!! The day of rewards from Jesus is going to be shocking moment for all of us.... that is for sure :)
wow love this thank you. as a pastor who has been hurt and hurt others this is so helpfull
Pastor Brian Houston came to preach in my church in Aust late last year as he is a friend of my Pastor. I knew during that media generated nothing scandal that Pastor Brian would be completely cleared. He is a great preacher.
The mega church machine breeds burnout from top to bottom. This conversation is such a sad example of it… would be so interesting to hear your insights about how the culture can be changed to be more sustainable? You talk about being there for people in the good and bad, but how about changing the culture for more emotional safeness for people to take breaks when they need, to be honest and accountable with sin and challenges earlier, so we can prevent our brothers and sisters in Christ from getting to such places of crisis, pain and darkness?
How about people stop becoming "pastors" to enrich themselves and enjoy tax-free living?
@@RCGWho 100%
I believe this is how it should have been from the beginning: leaders speaking from their vulnerability, showing their true selves. Over the last decade, Hillsong promoted an idealized leadership style, using Hollywood as a reference and straying from biblical truths.
This has resulted in many megachurches being filled with people seeking fame, setting aside the cross as the central message of personal repentance and inner transformation, and forgetting the mission of bringing that message to the lost
Amazing and transparent conversation!!!
I love and honour Pastors Brian & Bobby and Hillsong Church. We were fed, encouraged and inspired in God and His kingdom by how they lead & loved God & His church.
Me and my family were, too! So grateful!!
Hindsight or retrospective wisdom cannot change the past but it can influence the future.
Keep it real Carl and Ben 💯 love to see this. I remember hearing you multiple times here in Houston Tx. You were a big inspo throughout high school and when this went down the first thing that crossed my mind was. “He is human… and that’s okay Jesus was the only perfect one.. lets show him love and help him because i know first hand how it feels to be in a dark place without hope or help…” but nope that didn’t happen and this is what’s sad about churches across the globe… we forget to reflect Jesus and to do that we have to be human. We pick people up and help them we don’t dispose of them because they are being themselves… no one walks this world perfect you walk by being YOU and being YOU is being human and everyday you work to become a better human. Much love man I’m glad to see the unfiltered Carl speaking. “Real recognize real” 💯
We need part 2!!! Please Carl❤