What's even more fun with the spike pit in front of a chest scenario is having a shorter than usual kobold guarding it pointing a bow at them saying don't come any closer I'm warning you.. *player falls in trap*.. why don't they ever listen?
I'm generally the type of DM to embrace the chaos of my players with open arms (I improv a lot), but the concept of containing the RP and guiding the conversation around the table is so simple yet so powerful. It keeps pushier players in line, while allowing others less comfortable to speak up the opportunity. I'm stealing this. Thanks
Free form RP gets directionless, people wait on others to take the lead, and it makes the game last hours and hours that I would rather spend doing other things. I ran the game that way for a long time, and things like movement and the passage of time fell apart. After watching your videos, I doubled down on round robin turns, one turn-one roll, and tracking turn time in Dangerous Moments, Hours, and Days. Now the game moves at a steady pace, and it feels more like a story with each player being the main character in their turn. The most I will do after my turn as GM is give them a quick moment to confer (I turn over one of those cheap plastic hourglasses), and then they need to act and roll dice in their individual turns. I think it maintains the appropriate amount of tension and excitement. I have run great town adventures this way. Visiting one building and doing one thing = one Hour turn, and moving on to another building and doing one thing there is another Hour turn.
Hankerin, it never ceases to astound me your ability to turn things into processes. I don't always use processes when playing, but I keep some of yours at hand and use them.
Your DM advice is so easily applicable, and translates to fun so readily, that imho you are the best source of information on encounter design. I just (somewhat) haphazardly slapped a D4 timer on an encounter and threatened the arrival of a powerful NPC... and crazy stuff went down! After the session, my players said they were on the edge of their seats! They asked me if I read the DM guide/used CR to inform the encounters. 🤣 Thanks Hank!
Can confirm that Hank does a lot of RP in the game. The RP in turns works _great_ . It's definitely more high octane than traditional free form DnD, though, so I second the "play how you have fun" way. Just worth considering if the way you do really _is_ fun for you.
@@winstonpope2898 You may have put it a little too simply. ;o) I meant like, would you be satisfied with a whole session of just investigation and RP or do you do just enough RP to get you to the next battle. Appreciate you responding though. Thanks.
@@RemyBent oh yeah I see. The complicated answer for me is "both" as long as the session is moving forward. I dont personally like RP that flounders. For example, I had an amazing session in Curse of Strahd that had no combat at all. It was incredibly tense and full of RP and discovery. Conversely, I played a DnD session that had multiple combats and it floundered a ton with no clear hooks/direction from the GM. Hank definitely skews more towards action scenarios, but my first game with him only had two brief combats across 3 hours and it was jam packed with intensity, badass RP moments, and real story line consequences, none of which involved killing stuff.
I applied your speak in turn, AND IT WORKS! It avoided the very moments when that guy was trying to monopolize the situation. It really makes things flow.
I just found your videos and I've never thought about it as "turns" but I have noticed that I get really good RP and engagement out of my players by asking them directly. What do you say? What do you do? What is your response? I've found that asking directly also gets new players involved. Asking the group, "What do y'all do?" leads to 15 seconds of silence followed by broad unsure responses. "We should talk to the inn keeper? Right??" Also, I think the idea that your turn will be coming up could help keep players focused when on a virtual table top with the whole internet to distract them. I'm going to try using turns more in my sessions and see how it goes.
You are one of the few people I have hit the notification bell on. I can't count how many times while watching your videos I have had an idea or been inspired and then begin to write while you talk in the background. Love your content keep it up
There are always more extroverted players that seem to dominate rp while the shy quiet player is overshadowed. I think this style of rp is perfect for giving everyone an equal chance to voice their characters.
Great video! You are my number one role play content provider. You truly are awesome and put across ideas in such a wonderful erudite fashion. You are enchanting! Also good to see a tabaxi envoy joining you in your video. Keep up the good work. X
been binging all of your dnd videos, super helpful advice for game design overall. love how the art, personality, and sound design bring it all together.
Super dig the new style! Framerate issue aside, the editing is nice and tight, but yours always has been. That editing style lends itself to the 1on1 vlog style you're using here. Excited to see more from you this year!
yep.. I'm easing into this new setup, and it might include a complete computer core upgrade. For now, I think I just need to reboot and close other apps. I NEVER REBOOT lol
Hurray, missed this type of setup. Best part of this channel is just Hank being Hank, nice to see it up close in all its glory. Also this is a sick video... feel like my npc to pc roleplay needed this video.
My furnace may have just kinda given up in the face of Canadian Winter, but a new Runehammer vid warms my heart in a much-appreciated anti-hypothermia kind of way
Hank-Zula. Gotta tell you. Friend to friend, amigo to amigo, muchacho to muchacho, that I'm glad you're firing off videos again. I'ma go get a flatbed trailer on which we can hopefully fit all this D&D.
Glad to see you are back, needful subject matter. I lean pretty heavily towards using a DM style similar to yours, so i find your content of more interest than some others that i watch. Game on.
Your trap theory video was the best content on your channel. That's how I discovered you hand I go back to it from time to time to re-think how I make my dungeons. This being said I have a few questions on your theory and it's application on RP. 1- Can you do a low vs high level trap theory video? I'd be very interested to have your take on how to control the flow of your game and the traps with focus on the differences of approach versus low level and high level. 2- Isn't unconfined challenge another form of challenge though? I mean if you confine the character you force the character to use means of actions within the bonds of the confined space or time. However you could also present the situation as a quasi-insurmountable obstacle with no confinement, whether time limit or physical and let the player creatively find a way to approach the situation. for instance: a- There are underground tunnels under a mountain and the party needs/wants to go there because gold (lure/bait). They find themselves in front of a locked gate (obstacle) which is trapped (harm causer) and they need to go through that door before next moon or the treasure won't be there it'll be looted by goblins (time confinement). This is the only known door (space confinement). So in this example we see, I think, all the elements of your trap theory. However I could present the situation as follows too: b- There are underground tunnels under a mountain and the party needs/wants to go there because gold (lure/bait). They find themselves in front of a locked gate, which apparently cannot be opened in any way, shape or form at their disposition (very hard obstacle) and which is trapped (harm causer). This is the only known door but they've clearly got told there might be other doors and they have time to explore the mountain. in situation b you give your player another kind of challenge because they have no time or spacial confinement preventing them from passing through the obstacle the problem is the obstacle itself and this could be the whole point. They could go find another possible entrance or level up and come back when they are powerful enough to go through the door or they might even surprise you with an idea you didn't consider. My question is I guess do you consider exemple b: i- Not to be a trap? ii- To be a bad trap that needs revisiting? If that is the case don't you think there is also something rewarding for players to find their own answers instead of finding the pre-scripted possible answer within the scenario (like the key hidden under the rock beside the door)? iii- to be confinement by means of action? If you do, I'd be interested in a video where you'd talked about an exhaustive list of the different possible confinements type and applicable examples. (Well this is your channel you do with it what you want but I'd be very interested in watching this) iv- Is there another way you interpret it I have not think about? 3- In the example of RP trap, isn't *the answer* to the question not the lure more than *the question* itself? I guess this is not a very big distinction in the case you are making but if we wanna move things around and try original stuff doesn't that pose some form of theoretical framework problem. I don't mean to be knit-picky but the question I have, the answer I don't. If the answer is the lure/bait would it not be more like in citizen cane : "Holding a snow globe, he utters a word, "Rosebud", and dies; the globe slips from his hand and smashes on the floor"; you know the answer is "Rosebud" but you do not know what the question is, in opposition to your example where I know the question is "who should I marry" I don't know the answer though, the question is more of a MacGuffin here. 4- Do you think there is another way to confine in RP traps outside turns? I mean, in combat oriented traps, you can confine with physical constraints as well as time constraints and maybe mean of action constraints (depending of your position on the previous point I was making on the nature of confinement) and maybe other sorts of confinements I haven't think of. 5- Regarding the stakes/spikes, I'm assuming D&D mechanics here (for simplicity sakes), if the is a harm causer (spikes, face that springs in your face, etc...) I assume the normally I'm covered mechanically speaking for this, eg: trap opens, DEX check, deadly smell, WIS check to notice, boulder falls on your head, STR check. In the specific case of RP encounters, instinctively I can only see CHARISMA check for any kind of stakes I have and I cannot see all those stakes being avoidable preemptively or on the spot, for instance the princess pitting kingdoms against one another, how is it mechanically avoidable or how can it be soften at least? Is there for instance a way to implement DEX check or CON check versus the stakes? Do you believe your game covers this better than D&D (or another game) on some aspect or that this is just a matter of applying rules in a specific manner? I really like the idea of expending on your trap theory with RP specific questions. I hope you'll find my questions interesting and want to answer them, directly or through another video.
please try to exercise brevity :) that said, here's my best: 1: I don't see meaningful differences in level. If players have world-ending power to solve things, rock on :) 2: Unconfined can be its own form of fun, just not my jam. Footnote: a gate that has NO WAY of opening isnt a gate at all. It's a wall :p 3: Disagree. The answer is the burden and purview of the players. Any answer you may have as a GM is not only out of their agency, it is only useful as 'revelation' 4: No. Turns are the best :) 5: If an RP scene needs rolls, it is usually a sign that scene has failed. A CHA roll talking the princess down makes me sad thanks for watching!!
@@Runehammer1 >please try to exercise brevity Isn't brevity the enemy of precision though? Is a theoretical framework not a tool of precision? >1: I don't see meaningful differences in level. So you'd put an ancient red dragon in front of a level 1 party? Or a single goblin in front of a 20th level party, not as a joke but as a honest obstacle? You don't think that this doesn't make sense? >2: Unconfined can be its own form of fun, just not my jam. I wasn't talking about fun (see brevity might be simpler but you answered beside the point because you didn't read it properly), I was talking about your theoretical framework? The trap theory says that confinement is obligatory but my question was how do you fit unconfined obstacles in this theoretical framework? I gave you a few examples of how this could be understood inside the framework, do you understand it as the definition a, b, c or d? If d could you elaborate this is very unclear. >Footnote: a gate that has NO WAY of opening isnt a gate at all. It's a wall :p And I didn't say "no way of opening it" I said " *apparently* cannot be opened in any way, shape or form *at their disposition* ". I didn't went on full specific details regarding this for the sake of brevity but maybe you would prefer I elaborate on the different ways in which this hypothetical gate would be locked or maybe you would prefer to focus on my real question which was isn't that a challenge by itself? Do you have to know as GM how it is possible to pass through or can you not (still in your framework) give a challenge to which there is no time or spacial constraint but that can still be a trap in the sense you present it as? >3: Disagree. The answer is the burden and purview of the players. Any answer you may have as a GM is not only out of their agency, it is only useful as 'revelation' Okay. But so is gold. It's out of their agency (the metaphorical gold that is), it is only displayed in the end as revelation for successfully resolving the trap. Or I didn't understand clearly how you define the concept of bait/lure. >4: No. Turns are the best :) >5: If an RP scene needs rolls, it is usually a sign that scene has failed. Okay. Don't you that there lies the criticism of lack of RP people present? If you say that there is only one possible way of solving RP situations and that this situation is by convincing you through oratory skills don't you: a- Don't you admit that the system (or framework) lacks RP (sub)framework to handle this specific kind of situations. If I were to say there is spikes (theoretical obstacle) there is (let's say) at least 5 resolution sub-routines (STR, DEX, CON, INT, WIS) where there is not even a single sub-routine that allows resolution in the RP obstacle. b- Don't you make this very much subjective? I know this goes outside the limits of a specific system but since, from what I understand, your trap theory has a holistic will behind it, it's not outside it's scope. Shouldn't a trap be objective? I mean, I might not be very charismatic myself but my bard might be. As a PC, so as the merger of Player and Character, you have to take into account the capacities of my character not only the player. If you don't you allow yourself disparity of treatment between players. Surely, disparity of treatment between players is not what you advocate for so either you have mechanics to prevent that kind of problem either you have a sub-routine in your framework that allows the GM to handle this as objectively as possible? >A CHA roll talking the princess down makes me sad >a gate that has NO WAY of opening isnt a gate at all. It's a wall :p But the gate in this specific example is the obstacle, so you are saying that on one hand obstacles should have a way to be handled when physical but not when roleplay. That seems paradoxical, how do you conciliate that? To conclude, I'm trying to ask precise questions regarding your framework (the trap theory), it is not an attack on you or your idea if I say that something seems off or odd but I think you should give it more thought than just answering one liners. Being brief here only makes your theoretical framework seems less plausible were I think, personally that there is a lot of inherent value in it. Hence the will to understand the limitations of the framework. Answering with everyone can have their fun how they want is true but doesn't help understand your theory or its praxis. In the hope of reading more answers from your part,
@@jello195 it is simply impossible to read long form in a youtube comment. The deep discussions take place on discord. The best one I'd like to answer is #1: a resounding yes!
Hey Hank! I've been following your Patreon stuff and it's great! But what really gets me excited is when you put up these videos. It's always a mind expanding moment when it comes to D&D perspectives.
I'm using a lot of your videos for my next Dungeon World Campaign for notes and inspiration. Very helpfull! Thank you for this BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON!
> Trap Theory I came back to these videos because I'm working on a videogame. Strangely enough, it's side-scrolling. Trying to get the right head space.
yay a new vid, The drought is over! if rp in round works for you cool, My group rp's great not doing that :) Good point about remembering to add stakes to interactions
Would be great to see a short (5/10 minutes) example play session demonstrating the turn-based social encounters, You could add a little commentary etc. Even if its a bit of a contrived/planned demo, might help to really sell the idea (which I'm all for but yet to really try)
Welcome back! Confinement and binary questions are a great place to start for new dm too i think from personal experience...definitely already here at the cooler channel too 😎👍
I think I need to rewatch this video because most of these concepts flew over my head. In the example it doesn't seem like the PCs actions really matter? I like the concept, though, because when my players RP with an NPC it always turns into an interrogation where they're milking them for exposition or clues. It ends up feeling like a video game where you're going down the list of dialogue options and hitting each one just to make sure you don't miss anything. Edit: Ok, on second viewing I realize you never concluded the example but switched to a different one (300). What would the Barbarian have said at that point? How would they have successfully got her hand in marriage (the "gold coins") or otherwise prevented her evil plans? Why would she even tell them her plan instead of continuing to play dumb and let them stumble into her, hehe, trap? There's definitely something to this but I might be too dense to really grasp it lol
I just caught this and I'm at one minute in and the first thing that came to mind was Grimtooth ... Ima keep watching and hope to hell you might sometime or another Talk To Murphy! You dudes should synthesize!! I Am Not Wrong! LOL! Happy Fun Times to All!!!!
The issue with turns in conversations with this style is how to do natural and back an forth conversations. If a player intimidates a goblin into talking on their turn, does the goblin cave and give up the info then or once it's the GM turn after a few other players have acted?
I mean don't be a tyrant with it, but YEAH the conversations are NOT natural.. they are turns. I know this view is polarizing, but it has worked wonders on my games.
@@Runehammer1 Oh yeah for sure, pros and cons- I definetly see the benefits of this system! Love your work, I've been running icrpg for like 10 people in the dorms right now and it's been awesome. Keep doing what you're doing!
Ok. Thank you for articulating this. I have a brand new party of newbie rpg'ers that I am trying to get more in character. Time to spring some social traps :)
14:37 is the moment when the GODS OF D&D manifest themselfes as a cat and rock the gamingtable, muhahahaha :o) @Hank the infernal: you are a true mastermind. absolutely brilliant what you present in this video!!!
Interesting... so this is kind of like a social variant of timer, threat, treat? Definitely trying this one out, all of my groups have gotten lost in the freeform RP morass now and again.
yes, the framerate is awful. I learn by doing. The new setup will let me get back into the swing of videos...just need to adjust this... BOOM SKREEE
Here for the info. we love you for your mind Hank. Maybe Victor D. loves you for your body.....yknow im just gonna speak for myself here. Mind.
He's Back, Once Again.....!
Your quality is in what you say, thats what im here for.
@@thanson77 Agreed. Here for the good word. I'm glad it got pointed out though, because it thought it was my connection.
Glad your back buddy.
What's even more fun with the spike pit in front of a chest scenario is having a shorter than usual kobold guarding it pointing a bow at them saying don't come any closer I'm warning you.. *player falls in trap*.. why don't they ever listen?
The giant metal face-to-the-face trap is definitely going into one of my dungeons.
I'm generally the type of DM to embrace the chaos of my players with open arms (I improv a lot), but the concept of containing the RP and guiding the conversation around the table is so simple yet so powerful. It keeps pushier players in line, while allowing others less comfortable to speak up the opportunity. I'm stealing this. Thanks
It’s a “problem” I didn’t even know I had!
Free form RP gets directionless, people wait on others to take the lead, and it makes the game last hours and hours that I would rather spend doing other things. I ran the game that way for a long time, and things like movement and the passage of time fell apart. After watching your videos, I doubled down on round robin turns, one turn-one roll, and tracking turn time in Dangerous Moments, Hours, and Days. Now the game moves at a steady pace, and it feels more like a story with each player being the main character in their turn. The most I will do after my turn as GM is give them a quick moment to confer (I turn over one of those cheap plastic hourglasses), and then they need to act and roll dice in their individual turns. I think it maintains the appropriate amount of tension and excitement. I have run great town adventures this way. Visiting one building and doing one thing = one Hour turn, and moving on to another building and doing one thing there is another Hour turn.
Hankerin, it never ceases to astound me your ability to turn things into processes. I don't always use processes when playing, but I keep some of yours at hand and use them.
Your DM advice is so easily applicable, and translates to fun so readily, that imho you are the best source of information on encounter design.
I just (somewhat) haphazardly slapped a D4 timer on an encounter and threatened the arrival of a powerful NPC... and crazy stuff went down! After the session, my players said they were on the edge of their seats! They asked me if I read the DM guide/used CR to inform the encounters. 🤣
Thanks Hank!
Can confirm that Hank does a lot of RP in the game. The RP in turns works _great_ . It's definitely more high octane than traditional free form DnD, though, so I second the "play how you have fun" way. Just worth considering if the way you do really _is_ fun for you.
Different people seem to have different ideas about what RP means for them. So what do you mean when you say RP?
@@RemyBent to put it simply, it's playing and acting as a character according to their personality and personal motives.
@@winstonpope2898 You may have put it a little too simply. ;o) I meant like, would you be satisfied with a whole session of just investigation and RP or do you do just enough RP to get you to the next battle. Appreciate you responding though. Thanks.
@@RemyBent oh yeah I see. The complicated answer for me is "both" as long as the session is moving forward. I dont personally like RP that flounders.
For example, I had an amazing session in Curse of Strahd that had no combat at all. It was incredibly tense and full of RP and discovery. Conversely, I played a DnD session that had multiple combats and it floundered a ton with no clear hooks/direction from the GM.
Hank definitely skews more towards action scenarios, but my first game with him only had two brief combats across 3 hours and it was jam packed with intensity, badass RP moments, and real story line consequences, none of which involved killing stuff.
@@winstonpope2898 Cool. Yes, a DM sometimes has to work as a shepherd herding players along the story. Thanks for replying.
I applied your speak in turn,
AND IT WORKS!
It avoided the very moments when that guy was trying to monopolize the situation. It really makes things flow.
This is the type of content your channel EXCELLS at. More of this please, you tactical beast of a DM
Lost me in the middle of the Stakes when the cat jumped on the table and attacked the tree.
High point of a great video, IMO.
I just found your videos and I've never thought about it as "turns" but I have noticed that I get really good RP and engagement out of my players by asking them directly. What do you say? What do you do? What is your response? I've found that asking directly also gets new players involved. Asking the group, "What do y'all do?" leads to 15 seconds of silence followed by broad unsure responses. "We should talk to the inn keeper? Right??" Also, I think the idea that your turn will be coming up could help keep players focused when on a virtual table top with the whole internet to distract them. I'm going to try using turns more in my sessions and see how it goes.
If anyone has read anything you have written then they would see you are a story guy WITH awesome combat ideas and a superbly well-rounded DM!
You are one of the few people I have hit the notification bell on. I can't count how many times while watching your videos I have had an idea or been inspired and then begin to write while you talk in the background. Love your content keep it up
Thanks TTF!
Hankerin is back with the goodies! Oh hell yeah! Can't get enough of your content man, beeing it educational or just the crazy stuff, I love you man!
He's back! You've completely changed my entire philosophy on RPG and made it fun for me and my friends again!
I can't thank you enough. #ICRPG
There are always more extroverted players that seem to dominate rp while the shy quiet player is overshadowed. I think this style of rp is perfect for giving everyone an equal chance to voice their characters.
Hank your videos are always absolute Gem's. Doesn't matter there are months inbetween them, they are the best!
Great video! You are my number one role play content provider. You truly are awesome and put across ideas in such a wonderful erudite fashion. You are enchanting! Also good to see a tabaxi envoy joining you in your video. Keep up the good work. X
Great to see you back Hank
been binging all of your dnd videos, super helpful advice for game design overall. love how the art, personality, and sound design bring it all together.
Agh. Runehammer has been missing in my life as of late. This is a revitalizing shot straight to the bloodstream
Super dig the new style! Framerate issue aside, the editing is nice and tight, but yours always has been. That editing style lends itself to the 1on1 vlog style you're using here. Excited to see more from you this year!
yep.. I'm easing into this new setup, and it might include a complete computer core upgrade. For now, I think I just need to reboot and close other apps. I NEVER REBOOT lol
So distracted by the cat! lol Awesome video! Thanks. Love your GM style and camera presence.
Yes! Hankerin back with the encounter design, you beautiful bastard.
I feel like you should have spelled your channel with ALL CAPS RUNEHAMMER!!!
Great to see you Hank. Glad you're doing well brother.
Oh my gosh the cat in the background was fantastic!
Hurray, missed this type of setup. Best part of this channel is just Hank being Hank, nice to see it up close in all its glory. Also this is a sick video... feel like my npc to pc roleplay needed this video.
My furnace may have just kinda given up in the face of Canadian Winter, but a new Runehammer vid warms my heart in a much-appreciated anti-hypothermia kind of way
THE GREAT MASTER IS BACK!!!!
Great content, thanks for the always-mind-expanding analogies :)
Great! I'm prepping tonight to run some weird masquerade party in a jazz club, so I'll keep this in mind.
Blessed be Odin's smile! The great Hankern returns!
Hank-Zula. Gotta tell you. Friend to friend, amigo to amigo, muchacho to muchacho, that I'm glad you're firing off videos again. I'ma go get a flatbed trailer on which we can hopefully fit all this D&D.
I'm so fucking glad you're making another video man keep it up! Stoked for the ICRPG magic book btw!
Yes! A new Runehammer video. It's Trap Theory 2. Sweet! 😎
Glad to see you are back, needful subject matter. I lean pretty heavily towards using a DM style similar to yours, so i find your content of more interest than some others that i watch. Game on.
Your trap theory video was the best content on your channel. That's how I discovered you hand I go back to it from time to time to re-think how I make my dungeons. This being said I have a few questions on your theory and it's application on RP.
1- Can you do a low vs high level trap theory video? I'd be very interested to have your take on how to control the flow of your game and the traps with focus on the differences of approach versus low level and high level.
2- Isn't unconfined challenge another form of challenge though? I mean if you confine the character you force the character to use means of actions within the bonds of the confined space or time. However you could also present the situation as a quasi-insurmountable obstacle with no confinement, whether time limit or physical and let the player creatively find a way to approach the situation.
for instance:
a- There are underground tunnels under a mountain and the party needs/wants to go there because gold (lure/bait). They find themselves in front of a locked gate (obstacle) which is trapped (harm causer) and they need to go through that door before next moon or the treasure won't be there it'll be looted by goblins (time confinement). This is the only known door (space confinement).
So in this example we see, I think, all the elements of your trap theory. However I could present the situation as follows too:
b- There are underground tunnels under a mountain and the party needs/wants to go there because gold (lure/bait). They find themselves in front of a locked gate, which apparently cannot be opened in any way, shape or form at their disposition (very hard obstacle) and which is trapped (harm causer). This is the only known door but they've clearly got told there might be other doors and they have time to explore the mountain.
in situation b you give your player another kind of challenge because they have no time or spacial confinement preventing them from passing through the obstacle the problem is the obstacle itself and this could be the whole point. They could go find another possible entrance or level up and come back when they are powerful enough to go through the door or they might even surprise you with an idea you didn't consider.
My question is I guess do you consider exemple b:
i- Not to be a trap?
ii- To be a bad trap that needs revisiting? If that is the case don't you think there is also something rewarding for players to find their own answers instead of finding the pre-scripted possible answer within the scenario (like the key hidden under the rock beside the door)?
iii- to be confinement by means of action? If you do, I'd be interested in a video where you'd talked about an exhaustive list of the different possible confinements type and applicable examples. (Well this is your channel you do with it what you want but I'd be very interested in watching this)
iv- Is there another way you interpret it I have not think about?
3- In the example of RP trap, isn't *the answer* to the question not the lure more than *the question* itself? I guess this is not a very big distinction in the case you are making but if we wanna move things around and try original stuff doesn't that pose some form of theoretical framework problem. I don't mean to be knit-picky but the question I have, the answer I don't. If the answer is the lure/bait would it not be more like in citizen cane : "Holding a snow globe, he utters a word, "Rosebud", and dies; the globe slips from his hand and smashes on the floor"; you know the answer is "Rosebud" but you do not know what the question is, in opposition to your example where I know the question is "who should I marry" I don't know the answer though, the question is more of a MacGuffin here.
4- Do you think there is another way to confine in RP traps outside turns? I mean, in combat oriented traps, you can confine with physical constraints as well as time constraints and maybe mean of action constraints (depending of your position on the previous point I was making on the nature of confinement) and maybe other sorts of confinements I haven't think of.
5- Regarding the stakes/spikes, I'm assuming D&D mechanics here (for simplicity sakes), if the is a harm causer (spikes, face that springs in your face, etc...) I assume the normally I'm covered mechanically speaking for this, eg: trap opens, DEX check, deadly smell, WIS check to notice, boulder falls on your head, STR check. In the specific case of RP encounters, instinctively I can only see CHARISMA check for any kind of stakes I have and I cannot see all those stakes being avoidable preemptively or on the spot, for instance the princess pitting kingdoms against one another, how is it mechanically avoidable or how can it be soften at least? Is there for instance a way to implement DEX check or CON check versus the stakes? Do you believe your game covers this better than D&D (or another game) on some aspect or that this is just a matter of applying rules in a specific manner?
I really like the idea of expending on your trap theory with RP specific questions. I hope you'll find my questions interesting and want to answer them, directly or through another video.
please try to exercise brevity :) that said, here's my best:
1: I don't see meaningful differences in level. If players have world-ending power to solve things, rock on :)
2: Unconfined can be its own form of fun, just not my jam. Footnote: a gate that has NO WAY of opening isnt a gate at all. It's a wall :p
3: Disagree. The answer is the burden and purview of the players. Any answer you may have as a GM is not only out of their agency, it is only useful as 'revelation'
4: No. Turns are the best :)
5: If an RP scene needs rolls, it is usually a sign that scene has failed. A CHA roll talking the princess down makes me sad
thanks for watching!!
@@Runehammer1
>please try to exercise brevity
Isn't brevity the enemy of precision though? Is a theoretical framework not a tool of precision?
>1: I don't see meaningful differences in level.
So you'd put an ancient red dragon in front of a level 1 party? Or a single goblin in front of a 20th level party, not as a joke but as a honest obstacle? You don't think that this doesn't make sense?
>2: Unconfined can be its own form of fun, just not my jam.
I wasn't talking about fun (see brevity might be simpler but you answered beside the point because you didn't read it properly), I was talking about your theoretical framework? The trap theory says that confinement is obligatory but my question was how do you fit unconfined obstacles in this theoretical framework? I gave you a few examples of how this could be understood inside the framework, do you understand it as the definition a, b, c or d? If d could you elaborate this is very unclear.
>Footnote: a gate that has NO WAY of opening isnt a gate at all. It's a wall :p
And I didn't say "no way of opening it" I said " *apparently* cannot be opened in any way, shape or form *at their disposition* ". I didn't went on full specific details regarding this for the sake of brevity but maybe you would prefer I elaborate on the different ways in which this hypothetical gate would be locked or maybe you would prefer to focus on my real question which was isn't that a challenge by itself? Do you have to know as GM how it is possible to pass through or can you not (still in your framework) give a challenge to which there is no time or spacial constraint but that can still be a trap in the sense you present it as?
>3: Disagree. The answer is the burden and purview of the players. Any answer you may have as a GM is not only out of their agency, it is only useful as 'revelation'
Okay. But so is gold. It's out of their agency (the metaphorical gold that is), it is only displayed in the end as revelation for successfully resolving the trap. Or I didn't understand clearly how you define the concept of bait/lure.
>4: No. Turns are the best :)
>5: If an RP scene needs rolls, it is usually a sign that scene has failed.
Okay. Don't you that there lies the criticism of lack of RP people present? If you say that there is only one possible way of solving RP situations and that this situation is by convincing you through oratory skills don't you:
a- Don't you admit that the system (or framework) lacks RP (sub)framework to handle this specific kind of situations. If I were to say there is spikes (theoretical obstacle) there is (let's say) at least 5 resolution sub-routines (STR, DEX, CON, INT, WIS) where there is not even a single sub-routine that allows resolution in the RP obstacle.
b- Don't you make this very much subjective? I know this goes outside the limits of a specific system but since, from what I understand, your trap theory has a holistic will behind it, it's not outside it's scope. Shouldn't a trap be objective? I mean, I might not be very charismatic myself but my bard might be. As a PC, so as the merger of Player and Character, you have to take into account the capacities of my character not only the player. If you don't you allow yourself disparity of treatment between players. Surely, disparity of treatment between players is not what you advocate for so either you have mechanics to prevent that kind of problem either you have a sub-routine in your framework that allows the GM to handle this as objectively as possible?
>A CHA roll talking the princess down makes me sad
>a gate that has NO WAY of opening isnt a gate at all. It's a wall :p
But the gate in this specific example is the obstacle, so you are saying that on one hand obstacles should have a way to be handled when physical but not when roleplay. That seems paradoxical, how do you conciliate that?
To conclude, I'm trying to ask precise questions regarding your framework (the trap theory), it is not an attack on you or your idea if I say that something seems off or odd but I think you should give it more thought than just answering one liners. Being brief here only makes your theoretical framework seems less plausible were I think, personally that there is a lot of inherent value in it. Hence the will to understand the limitations of the framework. Answering with everyone can have their fun how they want is true but doesn't help understand your theory or its praxis.
In the hope of reading more answers from your part,
@@jello195 it is simply impossible to read long form in a youtube comment. The deep discussions take place on discord. The best one I'd like to answer is #1: a resounding yes!
Well this video was a pleasant surprise today. Always a pleasure seeing a new video. Thanks hankerin!
The hammer strikes again!
Hey Hank! I've been following your Patreon stuff and it's great! But what really gets me excited is when you put up these videos. It's always a mind expanding moment when it comes to D&D perspectives.
My heart was breaking at your absence.
Runehammer is the best youtube has to offer
I'm using a lot of your videos for my next Dungeon World Campaign for notes and inspiration. Very helpfull! Thank you for this BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON!
Man, this was very helpful. I dig your approach. Now, I'm off to watch the first one!
> Trap Theory
I came back to these videos because I'm working on a videogame. Strangely enough, it's side-scrolling. Trying to get the right head space.
Giddy up. Back in the saddle brother. just what I needed to get over my own writing hump. BOOOON!!!
Thank you hankrin! Another great video!
Your vids above all others have given me the most DMing gains! Keep it up!
Thank the gods you're back! Honor, strength, and more videos!
Good to see you making more game theory videos
yay a new vid, The drought is over! if rp in round works for you cool, My group rp's great not doing that :) Good point about remembering to add stakes to interactions
Always glad to see a new theory video.
I love these kind of videos :D
So glad to see more content from you! Missed you here!
That miniature of a gigantic cat on the scenery table behind you is very realistic
Cat stole the show. Welcome back. :)
I'd love to see a social encounter like this in action!
Hey, Hank! Hope all is well with you and yours. Glad to see a new video, man.
This is awesome, thanks for the awesome breakdown!!!!
Awesome, I needed something like this for my upcoming sessions.
this is just amazing. thank you so much!
Cool vid, I'd add a 0 step: foreshadowing, so it doesn't feel unfair when they are confined.
"A giant metal face slams into your face."
I call this trap, "The Platinum Headbutt".
Well worth the wait!
Brilliant content. As always.
"She's already decided she's going to LAY LOW THE ENTIRE KINGDOM."
*cat leaps up on the table and attacks tree*
already liked this sight unseen! TRAP THEORY IS THE BOMB!
RP heavy gaming usually bores me but this does fascinate me. This is how to keep RP exciting. 😎
A new video! And Trap Theory nonetheless!
I rung the bell this time, I guess it was plugged up last time XD
Clicked. Liked. Time to watch now.
Hankerin look out! There's a spear tooth tiger behind you. 🐯😹
Never leave us again!
I missed you Hankerin’!
LETS GO HANKERN HERES TO ANOTHER UPLOAD
Hi Reggie! When are we gonna get Smash 6 for the Nintendo gameboy color? It's about time.
@@cheers9430 The day smash 6 and mother 3 arrives is the day I die
@@BlueFireDudester Don't come to school tomorrow Reggie.
Would be great to see a short (5/10 minutes) example play session demonstrating the turn-based social encounters, You could add a little commentary etc. Even if its a bit of a contrived/planned demo, might help to really sell the idea (which I'm all for but yet to really try)
watch any of our RFE videos. We do the turn based RP in every game there 'Roll For Effort' on youtube!
Great advice
Welcome back! Confinement and binary questions are a great place to start for new dm too i think from personal experience...definitely already here at the cooler channel too 😎👍
I think I need to rewatch this video because most of these concepts flew over my head. In the example it doesn't seem like the PCs actions really matter? I like the concept, though, because when my players RP with an NPC it always turns into an interrogation where they're milking them for exposition or clues. It ends up feeling like a video game where you're going down the list of dialogue options and hitting each one just to make sure you don't miss anything.
Edit: Ok, on second viewing I realize you never concluded the example but switched to a different one (300). What would the Barbarian have said at that point? How would they have successfully got her hand in marriage (the "gold coins") or otherwise prevented her evil plans? Why would she even tell them her plan instead of continuing to play dumb and let them stumble into her, hehe, trap?
There's definitely something to this but I might be too dense to really grasp it lol
Yeyyah! Back on the videos baby
missed you hank!
I just caught this and I'm at one minute in and the first thing that came to mind was Grimtooth ... Ima keep watching and hope to hell you might sometime or another Talk To Murphy! You dudes should synthesize!! I Am Not Wrong! LOL! Happy Fun Times to All!!!!
I love the kaiju kitty! 😂
YEEEESSSS!!! I can't wait to watch this over and over again lol
really good.. so happy to see you back at the vids
OMG a RPG video!?! Really?!?! Yaaay
Hammer time!
The issue with turns in conversations with this style is how to do natural and back an forth conversations. If a player intimidates a goblin into talking on their turn, does the goblin cave and give up the info then or once it's the GM turn after a few other players have acted?
I mean don't be a tyrant with it, but YEAH the conversations are NOT natural.. they are turns. I know this view is polarizing, but it has worked wonders on my games.
@@Runehammer1 Oh yeah for sure, pros and cons- I definetly see the benefits of this system!
Love your work, I've been running icrpg for like 10 people in the dorms right now and it's been awesome. Keep doing what you're doing!
Hank you beautiful beast, nice vid!
Hey man nice to see ya!!
Ok.
Thank you for articulating this. I have a brand new party of newbie rpg'ers that I am trying to get more in character. Time to spring some social traps :)
Wooooo, new runehammer!
A new video!
"Dey go rlight into de hol"
14:37 is the moment when the GODS OF D&D manifest themselfes as a cat and rock the gamingtable, muhahahaha :o)
@Hank the infernal: you are a true mastermind. absolutely brilliant what you present in this video!!!
Ha it's nice to see your face again on TH-cam! What GBA games did you end up playing?
Pokeyman Pinball
Why is it that everyone on the ttrpg scenario says something on the lines of "looking at me may be unpleasant"
You're back!
Interesting... so this is kind of like a social variant of timer, threat, treat? Definitely trying this one out, all of my groups have gotten lost in the freeform RP morass now and again.
Exactly. treat RP moments liek any other encounter, rather than just saying 'discuss'
Hes back!
He's Back! :)