It's incredible you have a Mitsumi D500 drive that still works. I have 2 of them and the head on one went bad sitting on a shelf. The other one still miraculously works. (for now)
I begin to wonder if they found some kind of code injection vulnerability on the CPU in the floppy disk drive and used that to implement their copy protection.
Didn't have to, it was using a "spiral" disk layout which only specialized disk duplication hardware could write, therefore it was "un-copyable" till now with more powerful tools.
Hi Thomas so.... which PC based method was used to make a duplicate of the disk? watched it to the end, but there’s no hint which one got the job done. Or will you make a video later which reveals the secret? ;)
I was going to make another video about this, and may well still do so... but it was the SCP flux copier that I used to duplicate them. All of my disks could only be duplicated in this manner (with the exception of the 2.0 modified diskette, that had to be duplicated using c64 software). And I will further say that it's not a hit an miss process. Provided you use a good quality diskette, every copy the SCP produces makes a fully functional copy with the protection in tact! My plan is to release all of the images to the community, however, the SCP software appears to be incapable of creating a G64 from an SCP copy (in the case of these disks), and a G64 is what I wanted to release. I don't want to force anyone to buy an SCP just to make one of these disks. In the end, if I cannot get a G64 created, then I will just release the SCP images and let the community play with it that way, even though it will restrict the usability of the image.
@@8BitResurgence this is AMAZING! Super cool stuff to me, I have always found it fascinating. I will have to look into this device, I thought I had them all, but it seems I missed one!! Anyway, awesome video - new sub for sure!!
@@8BitResurgence SCP - Is that the Supercard Pro? If so I have one of those. Also a Kyroflux, an arduino based thing and I just shelled out on a GreaseWeazle.
@@RetroJay1974 Yes, SCP is the Supercard Pro made by Jim Drew. You and I both then just shelled out for a GreaseWeazle. I'm curious to see what the GreaseWeazle can do with these disks.
I am very interested in the 3D printed 5.25" drive case you have there! Did you create that and is the 3d print of it available? EDIT: Thank you for doing this! sorting out the backing up the disk which is great work :)
Hi. I designed that case and a similar one for 3.5" floppy drives. I don't offer the physically printed case for sale on my shop, however, I do offer the use of the STLs for a small fee, so people can print their own. Here are the links: corei64.com/shop/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=377 , corei64.com/shop/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=378
I had initially tried freezers on this software, and it will freeze the program in memory, however, when you go back to the program, or load the "frozen" copy, the program is locked solid. How it accomplished this to defeat freezers is a mystery to me at the moment.
@@TalkingWallsPhotography, that is exactly what appears to be the consensus so far, that there is in fact some software running on the drive along side the software running on the c64 rendering frozen copies of this software inoperable. As has been observed, as soon as you freeze the software, the connection appears to be broken. Even resuming the program finds it at a locked up state.
@@8BitResurgence- Well, since on the C64 pretty much everything is unecrypted,, the frozen copy could be disassembled and patched to stop the drive checking. That would be the job is the 8-Bit Show and Tell guy. hehe
@@8BitResurgence and of course the Dell 2007FP works just as well and has the power supply built into the back of the monitor, I own both of these monitors and they both use Samsung LCD panels. And both have DVI/VGA/S-VIDEO/COMPOSITE. and of course they both allow the Dell Soundbar to be clipped onto the bottom of the monitor and supplied power from the monitor to the soundbar for a compact and easy packaged monitor setup. I use these exclusively on my C64 setups. Also, make sure you adjust the sharpness adjustment in the monitors built in menu to about 50% or less to get rid of unwanted artifacts floating all over the screen. Otherwise GREAT monitor to use
@CBMSTUFF.COM I have no interest in arguing with you . I wouldn't know what you own, I didn't delete any post of yours and I guess we'll agree to disagree. If you think you're missing a comment, post it if you're inclined to do so, and it will be here. I don't delete comments unless they're culturally inappropriate, offensive to people or violate youtube rules.
@@8BitResurgence Curious if you can get it working with Greaseweazl. Flux-level images are what need to be shared for others to analyze. e.g. with SCP-generated images, distributing the .scp files is what's needed.
@@NozomuYume I'm waiting for the Greasweasel to arrive that I ordered. Then I'll be able to try it out, see if I can get a functional image using that device.
I'm sure I could copy that disc if I had it.... can't be that hard... worst case i hook up a logic analyzer to 1541 disk read clock selector VIA and disc read data pins... it's allways easy to reverse engineer if you have all the hardware at home and it is easy to connect your stuff to any node in the circuit... God bless 8 bit hardware with DIP ICs....
It's incredible you have a Mitsumi D500 drive that still works. I have 2 of them and the head on one went bad sitting on a shelf. The other one still miraculously works. (for now)
I REALLY LOVE C64 👍🥂🎩
It's certainly a timeless machine!
I begin to wonder if they found some kind of code injection vulnerability on the CPU in the floppy disk drive and used that to implement their copy protection.
Didn't have to, it was using a "spiral" disk layout which only specialized disk duplication hardware could write, therefore it was "un-copyable" till now with more powerful tools.
Hi there, i don’t doubt the screen, but I suggest that if you could have a capture screen in order to see it clearly.
Keep it up, thank you for sharing :)
Hi Thomas
so.... which PC based method was used to make a duplicate of the disk? watched it to the end, but there’s no hint which one got the job done. Or will you make a video later which reveals the secret? ;)
I was going to make another video about this, and may well still do so... but it was the SCP flux copier that I used to duplicate them. All of my disks could only be duplicated in this manner (with the exception of the 2.0 modified diskette, that had to be duplicated using c64 software). And I will further say that it's not a hit an miss process. Provided you use a good quality diskette, every copy the SCP produces makes a fully functional copy with the protection in tact!
My plan is to release all of the images to the community, however, the SCP software appears to be incapable of creating a G64 from an SCP copy (in the case of these disks), and a G64 is what I wanted to release. I don't want to force anyone to buy an SCP just to make one of these disks. In the end, if I cannot get a G64 created, then I will just release the SCP images and let the community play with it that way, even though it will restrict the usability of the image.
@@8BitResurgence this is AMAZING! Super cool stuff to me, I have always found it fascinating. I will have to look into this device, I thought I had them all, but it seems I missed one!! Anyway, awesome video - new sub for sure!!
@@locksmith614 Thanks very much for the kind words. Thank-you for subscribing! I'll make sure to keep making interesting videos.
@@8BitResurgence SCP - Is that the Supercard Pro? If so I have one of those. Also a Kyroflux, an arduino based thing and I just shelled out on a GreaseWeazle.
@@RetroJay1974 Yes, SCP is the Supercard Pro made by Jim Drew. You and I both then just shelled out for a GreaseWeazle. I'm curious to see what the GreaseWeazle can do with these disks.
I am very interested in the 3D printed 5.25" drive case you have there! Did you create that and is the 3d print of it available? EDIT: Thank you for doing this! sorting out the backing up the disk which is great work :)
Hi. I designed that case and a similar one for 3.5" floppy drives. I don't offer the physically printed case for sale on my shop, however, I do offer the use of the STLs for a small fee, so people can print their own. Here are the links: corei64.com/shop/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=377 , corei64.com/shop/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=378
@@8BitResurgence Many thanks! I really like the design. I have quite a few parts floating around that would be great in that case design. :)
What was the protection sceme?
Nice job!
Thank you! Cheers!
the double standards, copy program for backing up disk to keep the data safe, but you could not backup the backup program to keep that safe also?
The irony was not lost on me as well. Was virtually always the case with copy programs.
How did this protection stop the standard Freezer copy being made?
I had initially tried freezers on this software, and it will freeze the program in memory, however, when you go back to the program, or load the "frozen" copy, the program is locked solid. How it accomplished this to defeat freezers is a mystery to me at the moment.
@@TalkingWallsPhotography, that is exactly what appears to be the consensus so far, that there is in fact some software running on the drive along side the software running on the c64 rendering frozen copies of this software inoperable. As has been observed, as soon as you freeze the software, the connection appears to be broken. Even resuming the program finds it at a locked up state.
@@8BitResurgence- Well, since on the C64 pretty much everything is unecrypted,, the frozen copy could be disassembled and patched to stop the drive checking. That would be the job is the 8-Bit Show and Tell guy. hehe
I have an SCP and a Greazeweazle too. Looking to try your scp file soon. I also expect to get a 21 second cable from you.
Any success?
@@8BitResurgence Can you help me to be sure I will use the right scp file? I found more than one on Internet.
@@8BitResurgence I didn't get it fully working with my SCP. Do I need to use a high density or low density floppy drive to write it to a floppy disk?
I think it must be a high density drive because it need half-track support.
Can you have the Disk in G64 format or has to be duplicated to a physical disk! I have my Originals...(Red Label) and need to repair the cable..
At the moment, they have to be duplicated to a physical disk. I'm going to try to get it down to a digitally reproduceable copy.
What hardware are you using to get your C64 display on the LCD?
That is a Dell 2001FP LCD monitor. It has composite and S-Video built in, so it's just a direct connection from the 64 to the monitor.
@@8BitResurgence and of course the Dell 2007FP works just as well and has the power supply built into the back of the monitor, I own both of these monitors and they both use Samsung LCD panels. And both have DVI/VGA/S-VIDEO/COMPOSITE. and of course they both allow the Dell Soundbar to be clipped onto the bottom of the monitor and supplied power from the monitor to the soundbar for a compact and easy packaged monitor setup. I use these exclusively on my C64 setups. Also, make sure you adjust the sharpness adjustment in the monitors built in menu to about 50% or less to get rid of unwanted artifacts floating all over the screen. Otherwise GREAT monitor to use
You're leaning the original disk against the monitor speaker! :(
Oops.... They were only there for the duration of the video! I'll have to be more cognoscente of that in the future. Thanks for pointing it out.
I came here to watch how you copied it, not to see you trying to "prove" that you had done it!
Agree - those could've been cracked version on generic disk.
wow
Nice job, how can I get one.
The files to make your own can be found here: archive.org/details/@cbm_preserve
@@8BitResurgence Which .scp files from above link did you make?
Also, it might be helpful to put the link in the video description.
wouldn't *nix dd have worked? no idea really since never tried. just curious
I don't know what a "*nix dd" is.
Can't a modern Kryoflux / Greaseweazle just copy them easily?
@CBMSTUFF.COM I think you might want to re-visit this comment if you ever get an original for yourself. You might be surprised at what you discover!
I wasn't aware of the Greasweazle device. Interesting looking device. I've just ordered one and will give it a try when it arrives.
@CBMSTUFF.COM I have no interest in arguing with you . I wouldn't know what you own, I didn't delete any post of yours and I guess we'll agree to disagree. If you think you're missing a comment, post it if you're inclined to do so, and it will be here. I don't delete comments unless they're culturally inappropriate, offensive to people or violate youtube rules.
@@8BitResurgence Curious if you can get it working with Greaseweazl. Flux-level images are what need to be shared for others to analyze. e.g. with SCP-generated images, distributing the .scp files is what's needed.
@@NozomuYume I'm waiting for the Greasweasel to arrive that I ordered. Then I'll be able to try it out, see if I can get a functional image using that device.
I'm sure I could copy that disc if I had it.... can't be that hard... worst case i hook up a logic analyzer to 1541 disk read clock selector VIA and disc read data pins... it's allways easy to reverse engineer if you have all the hardware at home and it is easy to connect your stuff to any node in the circuit... God bless 8 bit hardware with DIP ICs....
DOOD!