Maestro Bernstein devours Carreras in West Side Story! (Reaction)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ธ.ค. 2023
- This famous documentary in which 'Maestro' Leonard Bernstein loses his patience with opera star José Carreras. It dates from nearly 40 years ago!
Anyway, whose idea was it to cast a Spanish opera singer in the lead role of West Side Story!!? Tony is an American, singing lyrics and music by Americans!! It’s a Broadway role…..…. full of linguistic idioms and rhythmic nuances. Poor Carreras is completely miscast and put through the wringer by Bernstein, even though it was he who approved the casting! Wonderful lyrics by Stephen Sondheim and great orchestral playing.
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I was a young violinist who played on those recording sessions back in the 80’s. It was clear to all of us from the beginning that Carreras had not come prepared for this. Not only were the rhythms sloppy but the text was not learned as well. The recording provides the drama of that but it lasted much longer. There was much editing (good editing), but the totality of that week long recording session was a wonderful experience for everyone (even the crusty older musicians) who had performed for Lenny many years before in the New York Philharmonic! It became one of the best experiences for me to this day. We knew Lenny’s proclivity for drama, but in these recordings you see the real sides of him reflecting on his writing from years before, the passion he injected to the music, and the guts of detail in the rehearsals. It all comes down to his commitment to a phrase he used “you gotta do your homework”.
I encourage all to watch the 1.5 hour you tube “The Making of West Side Story”
This is why TH-cam is awesome. There’s you, a violinist who actually played in these sessions, sending me a message all these decades later. I’m so thrilled to receive it. Of course, you are right about preparing. It is always the key to success. Bernstein indeed was a force of nature and could be as demanding from others as he was of himself. But - Carreras was miscast, as that wasn’t really his fault. He didn’t understand the style, the rhythmic swings, and he was never going to sound like an American. They booked him because he was famous at the time. Jerry Hadley should have been doing it.
Thanks again. Very best wishes,
Will
Let's not forget that we are only reacting to this at all because it was captured on film (and this particular footage has been gone over time after time). What makes anyone think this doesn't happen in recording studios the world over, in every music genre, and has done since the beginning of modern music? Has anyone heard Toscanini's rehearsal recordings? Maria Callas was not exactly mild-mannered. Carlos Kleiber stormed off half-way through the recording of "Tristan and Isolde", never to return. I hear Barbara Hendricks was an absolute delight to work with... not. And on and on... it's probably more unusual to find a top-flight musician in any genre who has *not* behaved like this. A healthy respect is due to Carreras, Bernstein and all concerned, who had the honesty and intregrity to allow this to be broadcast.
It’s a good point that with big talent comes big egos ….. I get the feeling Bernstein is behaving like this Beate’s it’s bring filmed - playing up for the cameras. Carreras undoubtably signed a contract with the BBC and was powerless to influence what footage was used or not used.
This is EXACTLY how it was back then, even in non-professional theater. Yes it was stressful and grueling, but you pushed that all aside to serve the piece. And the end-result made you an even better performer.
Exactly, this is pretty normal and part of the process of working with a genius.
Oh my! This is cringe worthy! I felt it every time Bernstein chastised him. Yikes! Such patience and is class shown by Carreras. Thank you William :)
What's the use of this video? It has been around on the internet for ages. Bernstein was absolutely correct and Carreras wasn't able to sing it correctly rhythmically. End of story.
Just my take on it and some observations. Up to you to have your own opinions.
I’m enjoying it- I hadn’t seen it before
I also very much enjoyed your take. I was around when this recording and documentary first came out. As a tremendous fan of West Side Story, I was always baffled by the choice since he couldn’t pronounce the words. But as you pointed out, heavenly voice regardless.
Narcissist?? Maybe….
However, it is exactly the case that everyone there is for the purpose of serving the music of the composer. Bernstein was a perfectionist, and he eventually got what he wanted out of the performer and the performance.
He commanded perfection, and that’s what he eventually got. And we are all the better for it.
Bernstein was an artist and cared about music. What's not to love? This video has been around for decades. Have you only just discovered it?
I don't subscribe to being nice, it's got to be perfect. This is what genius and the process of excellence looks like, it's about long hours and hard hard work. You can't take it personally, Carreras undoubtably learned how to sing the uniquely American idiom at the end of day and was better off for the experience. People now days need to learn inner strength and resilience, because life isn't easy. The pursuit of perfection isn't easy. You have to look at the big picture.
Going to see Jose Carreras has always been such a joy.I havent seen this for a few years.Yes Jose was miscast but i makes good viewing.Ive watched Maestro.
I saw Carreras in Il Corsaro (early Verdi) at the Royal Opera House, Covent Garden and his voice was utterly gorgeous. And a big voice too.
Was it just me!? I thought Maestro made for difficult viewing. Who wants to spent two hours in close proximity to an unpleasant, selfish, egotistical man? Thank goodness for his long-suffering wife, Felicia Montealrgre who brought so much meaning to the film.
SUPERB analysis - i love the way you dive right in but then pan back to the context and the casting and then to the characters of the two men. Incredible how Carreras and Rene Kollo - in another clip of the exasperated maestro - both manage to sing like angels despite the huge stress he's putting them under - such professionalism.
Thank you Donal. 🙏
One of my favourite musicals of all time, that stands the test of time. Depressing this is nearly 40years old. I have the recording of this on cassette. Dame Kiri Te Kanawa a Kiwi playing a Hispanic. The music might be great but the word play of Stephen Sondheim is absolutely marvellous and witty. America and Gee Officer Krupke! a good example of that.
My sympathies lie with Jose Carreras, but maybe he should have turned the part down as being nonsensical.
It’s full of wonderful music, especially the up tempo set pieces. Officer Krupke is a true merging of music and lyrics. Bernstein always followed the natural rhythm of the words when setting them to music. They should have had Jerry Hadley for this.
But dear Bangkok Voice Coach, Bernstein 'snapped' at his producer because he was defending Carreras---he didn't want the producer to 'correct' his accent over the microphone in front of everyone. Bernstein rightly assumes that is arrogant/jingoistic. His criticism of the singer's rhythmical struggles is also spot on---the singer doesn't get the syncopation. Sometimes performers have to sweat to make art.
Got it. Bernstein is Bernstein therefore he can act like a martinet. This guy nailed it. A Spanish tenor as an Italian kid from the Bronx is bad casting.
As literatura teacher and art enthusiast I understand this legendary artist (as also were Michelangelo, Händl, Tolstoy, Rodin and sooo many more) through Nietzsche's word "dionisic" people. In their search for perfect art (what that is: combo of dionisic and apolinic) they are hard to comprehend, but what they leave behind, is immortal. Sure: people around them - they all have hard times ...
A small correction - Puerto Ricans are not immigrants to the US. Puerto Rico is part of the United States and Puerto Ricans are American citizens at birth.
Ah! I didn’t know that. Thank you.
Brief but sharp analysis. Speaking of Carreras and Domingo, I wonder if you are familiar with the legacy of Alfredo Kraus, a contemporary of these two and considered by many to be superior to both. It would be great if you dedicated a video to him as well. Thanks for your channel!
Oh yes indeed, I know Alfredo Kraus. There are some interesting videos of his master classes on TH-cam. He had a great top!
Pretty interesting. Raeminds me of my highschool choir director.
Maybe he saw this!
Yes. I agree with everything you said. I had a great cousin who was LB 's age. He was lead cellist for the BSO and he knew LB. Never said much about him. Talented but seemed to be a troubled man.
Are you going to watch the biographical movie about him? It’s in Netflix from tomorrow. I’m interested if it reveals much of his dark side!
Oh no! A talented but troubled man? Well that's him cut down to size.
Am I correct in saying Bernstein wanted Jerry Hadley but he was not available? He would have been great and saved we Carreras lovers a lot of angst.
I really feel JH would have been perfect! Not available!!? How could anyone not make themselves available for a once in a generation recording like this!? No. I feel the record company wanted a huge name.
I am sure Lennny was pissed that his Tony had such a thick Spamish accent..Redicilous!!!
But they must have known that when he was hired for the part!
Yeah...Bernstein goofed with the casting, he knew it and I think his venom was because he knew he screwed up. Unfortunately, Jose Carreras became the target. Lyrics just flow differently with an accent. But, kudos to Carreras...he got pretty close to perfect, imo.
It doesn't follow that they have done 135 takes of this song or this section of this song, just because they say 'take 135'!
Carreres version of Amore Perdito on his album of love songs in the 90s , is remarkable.
I ❤️ Carreras.
Bernstein did take him aside in a private coaching session with a pianist it is on film.
take 135....poor Carreras, exhausting
It's an hour and a half documentary, and this is a relatively small, but poignant slice. Though it certainly does portray Bernstein at his most meticulous and demanding self. I recommend this documentary to anyone who saw Maestro and wanted to see more of the forceful genius of Bernstein in his element. Carreras is an amazing operatic tenor, who's certainly versatile, but his heavily accented Spanish and seeming discomfort with the musical theater genre made him less than optimal for this role. Though to Pepe's credit, he did improve his elocution throughout.
Why didn't they get an American to sing the role of Tony? I think that's how it goes in rehearsals sometimes.
Don't agree with your assessment at all that Bernstein didn't care. If he didn't care, he wouldn't get upset. If you watch the full video and every other Bernstein performance, even into old age, he's completely immersed in the music and the job at hand in every moment. Recording sessions are high pressure situations. You say he was a tyrant, I say he was leading the standard by which all the musicians, including Carreras, had to rise. People today are too coddled to see a maestro correcting a singer as something other than professionalism.
And I think "Take 135" might be for the whole recording, not just the one track.
He cared - about himself!
Yes he cared about himself. He was a troubled man. I do not know of a great artist who wasn’t troubled.
He was miscast, as much as I love him as a performer.
I’ve been shouted at a few times in my life. It gets the adrenaline going.
Thank you for your post.
This is great. Still makes me rethink my life's paradigm. Just kidding. Carreras is great whether as a soloist or with The Three Tenors. His average singing is most singers best. Of course, Bernstein and Westside Story are the greatest also. I'm sure you know that there is a movie called "Maestro" soon to be released. It's about Bernstein's Life. The movie is considered "Oscar worthy". On the other hand, Putri Ariani has a complete live version of "Bohemian Rhapsody" at HUT TRANSMEDIA 22 celebration. In my opinion, this is on par of any "rock opera" I have ever heard. Please react to this video. Thanks again for a great reaction. 🥰🥰❤❤
I will definitely look at Putri’s new release.
Thank you for the heart.
Rumour has it that Bernstein wasn't expecting Carreras. When casting he said something vague like "let's get the Spanish guy I saw in London" and the agents just assumed he meant Jose. So not a good start.
Oh dear. Perhaps ‘the Spanish guy’ was a reference to Domingo!
@@BangkokVoiceCoachdid you know that Dimash has met Domingo and they have performed together and it is supposed to be published in January 😃
@@kriknut1 Ok, can´t wait to see Dimash perform unamplified at an opera house for the first time.
@@johnojvind7641 for what I have seen, no one of them are unamplified
@@kriknut1 Carreras is a trained opera singer who easily can project unamplified at an opera house. Dimash is an ordinary pop singer, they are very different so not a good match.
Please reaction new perfirmance putri ariani x choirs " bohemian rhapsody
Thanks😊
This is a mess. I can tell by this scene that Carreras got the score on a very short notice and never had a chance to study and rehearse privately with Bernstein at the piano, as it is a standard practice.
Exactly. It seems there were no piano rehearsals. Everyone just thrown in front of the orchestra, and Carreras no idea of the idiom. Of course, studio time costs a fortune so it was an expensive mistake.
@@BangkokVoiceCoach Apparently, he had little regard for singers, which could explain why there are so few opera recordings under his baton. He has to be the "prima donna" himself.
One of the few singers who succesfully dared to clap back at LB was Christa Ludwig th-cam.com/video/f32bhICi-zI/w-d-xo.html
Christa knew her worth! She was prepared and had every square centimetre of the score memorised. Leonard was too fast and too loud - but he couldn’t admit it.
I don't think so.
I think you need to do some more research on the wws recording process.
I do. And shall.
I saw this cringe-worthy film some years ago and boy did I feel bad for Jose Carreras! Carreras is a true artist, his voice is beautiful, and he keeps getting stopped and criticized by the Emperor. It was a major mistake by Bernstein to cast a Spanish tenor as an American head of the Jets. Total miscasting, and Carreras is being criticized for issues that were endemic to being Spanish and not American. Were there no American tenors who could sing this piece?
Carreras has no business singing this-it’s not an opera role-but Bernstein is incredibly unprofessional here.
Unless this just happened to be a really bad day for Bernstein-a possibility we should leave open-I just lost a shitload of respect for him.
And like you said Carreras does sound great in the sections where he can just sing and not nail tough rhythms. Beautiful.
Omg, this recording session totally put me off enjoying the movie Maestro. He is so selfish, even to his wife.
Bernstein is impatient and irritated, however, José Carreras was not doing things right.
Yep! Rather a toxic combination. And studio time costs a fortune! Why did the Maestro not check Carreras with the piano before meeting the orchestra?
I have the CD at home and love it. Bernstein is musical, but you aren't, perhaps partly because Brits seem to be naturally unmusical. Often Brits think that Bernstein was nothing but an extravagant exhibitionist but only because he didn't conduct robotically like some prissy military bandmaster.
I’m not British
This video is about Bernstein and Carreras. It’s not about me. I love the score of West Side Story. And by the way I’m not British.
You jump to a whole lot of your own conclusions and make sweeping racist generalisations which reflect badly on you - whoever you are.
Carreras, a great tenor, totally unsuited and under prepared for this musical idiom. There we agree.
The instrumentalists nail it absolutely every time. While rhythmically, Carreras has no clue.
The number of takes are more than likely those taken for the whole recording, not just for ' Something's Coming".
I'm sorry but I don’t agree with your character assassination of Bernstein at all. I never worked with a conductor who cared more.
I feel sorry for Jose. He can’t seem to do anything right for Bernstein’.Hes a very hard taskmaster
It started bad and went downhill!!
Oh, how painful for Carreras, Bernstein actually doesn't look at all well, I thought he was a lot older when this was recorded. This truly is an interesting case study in behaving professionally.
Illness could explain the short temper and general inability to cope.
Carrera was having the worst time of his life
That’s for true!
Whiplash vibes
!!!! Ha. !!!!
Carreras should have resigned. He should have realized he had been miscast and quit. Also, whomever had cast him should have also resigned. And, of course, Bernstein was right, he was a musical giant and, at that stage in his life and career, he didn't have to deal with that kind of aggravation.
Also, Carreras may have been well liked as a person, but as a singer he was just average and overrated. Nowhere near his two counterparts, Pavarotti and Domingo who were truly giants in their own right.
Definitely the casting director at DG should have been fired!
@@BangkokVoiceCoach I guess they wanted someone well known internationally and probably there was no american tenor then that fitted the bill. The role -obviously- has to be sung by a native american singer, ideally trained in the Broadway Musical genre, just like the guys in the chorus were, some very good, but, alas, with not much name recognition. BTW I also didn't like Kiri Te Kanawa very much for the role of Maria, yes she was "all right" being an English speaker and all, but, for my taste "too operatic". Tatiana Troyanos, on the other hand, was excellent as Anita.
Live new putri ariani. Bohimian rhapsodi
You sound as though you would like to "cancel' him for caring too much for his own music. As we know, the British don't really care much for music and only tolerate it if it's suitably tepid and innocuous.
😆😆
This role should ALWAYS be sung by an American tenor, born and reared in the USA. A tenor who has a college degree in vocal performance and a tenor who can play the piano!!
Always!!
Yes, Carreras obviously is the wrong choice with this type of music, but why did Carerras himself accept this session ?!. Though Carerras is not a better singer with the three tenors, miracles do not happen, but he got away with that mainly because then he had a truly great co-singer(Pavarotti) at his side and the trio sparkled and were fun together, as an act. Besides, there are a few videos with Laura Bretan(another well known got talent soprano) and Carerras(he still performs) singing duets.
Imo, if you can't sing quite simple popular music well you cannot sing anything well. This typical trained opera tenor just has a trained voice but he clearly shows he is almost totally unmusical, as in fact, most trained opera singers(including sopranos) are. But in serious opera it's easy to hide your musical mediocrity, because the majority of the opera audience shares their unmusicality(or perhaps the audience are very forgiving).
Natural talented singers in the opera business you can count on your fingers, a big sturdy secure voice is what matters, not music talent. And that is the reason why more natural talented singers, who are not trained opera singers, like Jonathan Antoine, Katherine Jenkins, Mirusia Louwerse, Amira Willighagen, Laura Bretan, Il Volo, Il Divo among many others are the ones that brings some opera music to the ordinary audience, because their interpretations at least have musicality and brings something different to the table !.
None of those crossover singers you mention could be heard in an opera house setting without a microphone. I don’t agree that Carreras is not a good musician. He just doesn’t get the syncopated jazz rhythms.
To be an opera singer, you need to be an excellent musician, especially if you want to sing late Romantic music like Wagner & R. Strauss. It’s not just about making a loud noise.
@@BangkokVoiceCoach You are hitting the problem with opera house singers. Just because they must be so loud on the stage so the cheap back row tickets will not complain they have to train a rock solid voice and that is only for those who have the DNA born stamina. Your so called excellent musicians has little to do with innate music talent. Opera house singer is more of a physical event, training products, vocal workers and few are interested in millions of trained classical musicians just because they deliver almost nothing of interest, just repeating the same old hits over and over again, nothing new of interest is produced in the genre, it's a dead art form.
Where I live in Europe the art form is completely dependent on extreme state subsidies. No one is interested to pay full price for their mediocrity. Not one of these abundant state paid vocal workers will not even pass first round in a popular talent competition, but sure, they have big sturdy voices and passed a few examine and managed learn a couple of roles, but can they sing well? When the truth is, one state opera singer is worse then the other, it's a very expensive club for internal admirations😀.
And Jazz is not difficult to sing, come on, all those I've mentioned sings Jazz and popular, at least decent(except Paul Potts perhaps, lol). When it comes to popular, jazz, whatever music Carreras is off and all over the place, almost always. To cover his mediocrity he must train endlessly to make a decent performance, he is hard working Karaoke level.
One of their biggest problems is with their vocal shouting technique and over bloaty pompopous singing style with over the top, never ending annoying vibrato, they lose almost all dexterity and therefore male singers in general sings stiff like military commanders extending shouting. Add extreme poor diction especially among sopranos that would not e tolerated in others genres but in opera you can get away with almost anything. After all, in theatre understanding the story is everything but opera fails totally, so badly they even have to use subtitles, even when sung in native language.
Honestly, to anyone passing by and reading this post, have a good laugh, check out some opera broilers, sopranos, why not start with opera star at the met Angela Meade, hilarious 😂, she definitely can´t sing and she is the BIG star, only in opera, comedy at the highest level 😂.
You don't this trained opera singers of Carreras' calibre can't handle the cricism? In Italy, where if you hit one bum note the audience BOOS YOU during Curtain Call? Carreras couldn't enunciate, couldn't sing with any genuine emotion, and couldn't follow the conductor's tempo. My sympathies were with Bernstein.
I thought Carreras handled Bernstein’s egotistical rudeness with good grace.
@@BangkokVoiceCoach Carreras certainly tried his best. But whatever the reason, the poor guy was unprepared and clearly over his head. Interpreting a piece of music requires more than a beautiful voice. Had it been an American attempting an Italian classic with an Italian conductor, I doubt the result would've been any different. .