You call THAT a router?! 2 Tiny Raspberry Pi Routers
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 มิ.ย. 2024
- Take a look at the two smallest Raspberry Pi Routers in existence: The DFRobot IoT Router Board Mini and the Seeed Studio Routerboard!
Along the way, learn about networking, OpenWRT, and how these two routerboards stack up against each other.
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Sponsor me on GitHub: github.com/sponsors/geerlingguy
See my blog post with more links and data: www.jeffgeerling.com/blog/202...
DFRobot's IoT Router Carrier Board Mini: www.dfrobot.com/product-2242....
Seeed's Dual Gigabit Carrier Board: www.seeedstudio.com/Rapberry-...
GitHub issue for DFRobot Board: github.com/geerlingguy/raspbe...
GitHub issue for Seeed Board: github.com/geerlingguy/raspbe...
See all the PCI Express cards and CM4 boards I'm testing: pipci.jeffgeerling.com
#RaspberryPi #HomeNetwork #Router
Contents:
00:00 - Raspberry Pi Routers
00:55 - Tiny Routerboards
02:08 - Seeed Board overview
03:25 - DFRobot Board overview
04:24 - Getting OpenWRT working
06:24 - DFRobot test and benchmarks
08:54 - Seeed test and benchmarks
12:41 - WAP and WiFi Routing
13:28 - Verdict and 2.5 Gbps option?
14:17 - Outtakes - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
![ทททททททท #27 [หลุยส์ เค โตมายังไง ณ สระบุรี]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/CaKoYw_Xmtg/mqdefault.jpg)
Thank you for reporting energy consumption. This is really useful in RVs where running from battery power is a way of life.
Also off grid solar.
Living in an RV, you say? If your home is truly mobile, would you mind telling me about your WiFi reception setup? I know that RV parks are infamous for poor WiFi, but by and large, it's really not entirely their fault.
@@pinaz993 Wifi is mostly useless, but a MOFI with a pair of 10DB omni antennas works great -- so far. a MOFI is a little linux box with cellular modem that provides a hardware router and wifi onboard, highly configurable. So not idiot proof like most products for the RV industry, but easy to use without reading the manual for someone like me who never reads the manual (but knows a lot about technology.) YMMV
This device is PERFECT for a battery run home. Lol, buying mine in preparation for just that.
hahaha a 28 nm cuad a72 without crypto extension is the worst on energy efficiency fot a router...
I'm really liking where the pi ecosystem is headed with all these developments! Like, this kind of applications were always talked about but never truly feasible for every day use because of the interface limitations, now I finally really can consider using a pi as a router
If Raspberry Pi 5 includes pcie 3.0 or 4.0 or even 2.0, but with four lanes, that's going to be MUCH more interesting. I kind of imagine RPi 5 coming with single OCuLink sticking out of the board...
I usually only use raspberries for messing around and trying stuff. Even the old "standard" raspberries are pretty awesome for this. But imagining the possibilities, some of the new stuff opens up... Warms my heart, thinking of all the things I will probably fail at sometimes in the future :)
Take a look at Ivan's WIP for blade servers using the CM4 twitter.com/Merocle/status/1407684311344730117
@@Vatharian i hope that the Pi 5 CM will have the same connector like the CM 4 version, so you can keep your old "breakout boards"
@@friedrich1277 If it will have different connectivity, like pcie x4 2.0 port, it will be bad. It all depends on its CPU, since they are targeting price point, not feature set. Other than that, just couple of days ago R Pi foundation confirmed they are working on RPi 4 A, but there is no work being done on RPi 5, neither prototyping nor design wise.
Love the bloopers at the end. Just shows a small amount of the struggle that goes into video production. Anyone that thumbs down does not know the struggle, time,& effort that goes into making a single video.
I was thinking the same thing. Jeff (and everyone else really) that makes a fantastic product, rarely does it in one go; it (apparently!!) takes HOURS to make a good presentation, particularly one with all the details that Jeff puts in his.
Pretty amazing, Jeff - fantastic job.
Thank you for sharing.
Oh thank Goodness. Somebody's making a Pi router. Time to buy!
I hope you got your order in. Looks like they've sold out for now.
@@andrewyoung8703 Nope, I didn't make it in time.
I would just use the standard Pi, much cheaper and more modular.
when this guy actually makes a product ready product is the day pigs fly. He's gunna stick to yt click bate
@@nigratruo : That depends on what you need/want out of said router. Like Jeff highlighted in the video...
PuTTY is no longer needed for SSH on Windows. OpenSSH is built in as of April 2018.
Yeah. Just use Powershell.
@@MrNeocortex There's even an OpenSSH *server* on windows 10 nowadays; so it's possible to ssh (&sftp) into windows directly.
Windows is no longer needed. Everything can be done on Linux as of May 2021
old habits die hard lol
Not at my computer atm so I can't easily check for myself.. But I'm running LTSC, which ends up being behind on some things. Do you know if it's in there?
I feel like the price would be a big no-no for me when things like the Edgerouter X for unter 50 bucks exist if you just need a good router and don't utilize the hdmi port, the usb ports or the GPIO pins.
Thanks for this. I had forgotten about my Pi's for the last year and now impressed with how it's going. I'm back in the game. Kudos
Stil loving your bloopers at the end.. and your valueble insights on anything cm4 of course 👍
This reminds me of the 25 year old LPR - Linux Router Project. To build your own router then, you took an older computer, and added two or more 10/100 Ethernet cards. Gigabit ethernet was new and expensive, and only really viable for cheap projects like this after the year 2000. You would set one config file on a floppy and boot the entire computer with only one 1.4MB 3.5" floppy drive. That was both OS and config. Bigger than the Pi for sure, but at time it was revolutionarily cheap. Routers of the day were hundreds of dollars and specialty equipment.
Yeah, I remember thinking Gigabit was exotic when I was still installing 10baseT and fancy 10/100 cards in some servers back in the day. 1 Gbps is so common and cheap now... makes you forget how slow a congested old network was-floppy-disk-like speeds over the network were common!
Looking forward to your 2.5 Gb version. Loved this video and the production quality. Thanks!
5:53 "or if you're using PuTTy on Windows"
Whilst using PuTTy is perfectly valid, Windows now natively supports SSH in the command prompt. You might have to enable it in the system settings but it's there :)
I didn't realize that but will have to check it out soon!
Awesome review and thanks for sharing. Regards from someone who built (cross-compiled) tiny Gentoo systems for Soekris hardware back in the days for multi-wan routers.
Great info and test results, thanks for all the work.. and I love the out-takes, they made my day.. Keep up all the great work!
Thanks. Great review of exactly the 2 boards I've been looking into!
Can't wait to see the 2.5 gig show!
So COOL!! thank you for these in depth reviews. I've been hoping for things that would replace my glinet mini router.
Fantastic content. I happen to be in need of a mobile, small router for in field use. Your video just saved me a lot of time and headache.
You are amazing. What a lot of work and so well done! I love the bloopers at the end. God bless you.
Also of interest is the nano pi r2s dual-homed router. It works well at 1 Gbps on both ports. It's capable of 2.5 Gbps but under armbian the present driver is unstable. I've run an R2S for quite a while now and using the excellent heatsink case I've never had any issues. It just works well
very impressive video, well thought out and edited ,you answered "EVERY" possible question I had .. "WELL DONE"
Great you include FLENT for network testing. It gives a great details over performance!
Wow, what cool little router boards! Great video Jeff 👌
I've been using a p3b+ as a router for years. I don't have or need gigabyte speeds so it's worked perfectly for my needs.
Great work as usual Jeff. I get to learn a lot even though I'm not planning to use a pi as a router. Thanks!
As an 'old timer it dude, I thought I was done with this level of fun.. I like the way you help people understand the pros and cons of these boards.
Thanks! What's old is new, and all that jazz-I see a lot of people getting back into the 'build your own' game these days, probably as a knee-jerk reaction to how much modern computing platforms are getting locked down.
The big difference is unlike 20-40 years ago, you can get the equivalent of like 500 back-then cray supercomputers at your disposal. Makes things a lot more fun (IMO)!
Have been looking to made a OoemWrt router using Pi since too long, this video covers it all!
I'm gonna yoink the dfrobot one before it runs out of stock. Thanks for sharing!
I'm hoping they can keep these in stock a while!
@@JeffGeerling Out of stock as of at least a couple hours ago.
Lol, nope. I ordered anyway, better get it within 2 months or I'll just cancel.
Really appreciate the outtakes. Keeping it real.
Love your videos, Jeff. They are succinct and informative and pleasant. Really need to get into the raspi ecosystem after I got burned on edison a few years ago
I believe you can get really good value switches or routers but, having a RPI like this to play with OpenWRT is heaven on earth
Low power consumption, ability to use part of the router in other projects (I'm talking about the CM4 board) and the software supports that will keep on growing over time is very nice!
Also, did you have a look at Banana PI R2?
Network/Admin flashbacks... Great videos. Keep them coming :)
Oh wow you're looking young in this video. I've seen almost all of your videos UpTo now, and saw this one which I haven't seen. You're the best.
Man this is all foreign language to me, but I love it, LOL! This things are getting better and better with the performance and technology out of the box!! I'm learning so much from your videos, thank you for your dedication and passion to the community!
Another amazing video Jeff. Thank you
Can't wait for the one with the 2.5g board. Love your stuff. You are the only TH-camr that I have all notifications on. keep up the great work.
Another great video and the bloopers always make me laugh. Sterling work as always Jeff
RTK 8111-H support MSI and MSI-X, meaning that it doesn't use IRQ that much.
NAPI infrastructure with MSI uses interrupt mitigation, disabling interrupts when there's high load, working in a somewhat synchronous mode.
What 8111 lacks (I think) is a multiple queues infrastructure that server NICs have, that could boost performances even more sharing interrupts between multiple cores instead of always hitting the same core.
Love the bloopers.
I mean, i love your content but the bloopers are too fun aswell. :)
Stay cool Jeff!!
I and my Pi 4 and a couple of USB-3 ethernet dongles under my desk were waiting for this video. Thank you for making it!
bruh until now i was just reading your books and appreciating how you explain everything so well and only now i found out you have a youtube channel???
hey man great video,
As a long-time networking nerd still gnawing at the idea of finishing my CCIE, one thought was to perform UDP based iperf to get TCP windowing and retransmissions out of the way.
I currently have the DFRobot router board coming in the mail so i cant wait to play around with WRT again!
Fantastic Hardwork. Very informative
Dope vid Jeff! Thanks!
I just found that video... I have bought the Seeed model in june, and I the speeds are a lot better than what you get here!
It saturates the gigabit connexion no problem... My speed tests are getting me around 940Mbps up and down with the firewall active.
I used a stock OpenWRT image as I did not want to use the one provided directly by Seeed... because reasons!
I might add that I had speed issues when using a PSU that was not powerfull enough. The one that works is a 4amp 5V PSU
HOLEY UNDERWEAR, this immediately brought to mind the old 486 4meg headless floppy equipped, keyboardless machine with 2 interfaces running one of my favourite solutions FLOPPYFW (1.6meg) at my chilean cyber cafe up to 2003. Not a router... but a good way to make use of 'obsolete' hardware. No harddisk, no pool, no pets. It aint got no cigarettes.
Haha, I ran a similar machine with a Linux Router Project floppy disk in it, with a 56k modem hanging off it
@@SimonQuigley Got you beat on that, ours was 64K dedicated with 16 addresses. OUCH! About 600 a month. GLORY DAYS!!
@@loginregional lol, I "upgraded" to a Windows 95 machine with a NetJet ISDN interface card for 56 or 112k digital connection, using Sygate(? actually, I think it was WinGate) for NAT.. Horrible memories.
@@SimonQuigley RUN AWAY! RUN AWAY! Worst. Software. Ever. I used it for a very short time for a smaller cybercafe in 97 that used dialup. There was a solution in SuSE at the time... but my bwain is ti...r...ed. Best command learned at the time: dd. Made doing images S.I.M.P.L.E
I'd check out the NanoPi R4S 4GB if you're looking for a robust OpenWRT router for gigabit connections with SQM.
Excellent video as usual
dang. don't want your Raspberry Pi 4 Model B to be off center. Good thing you caught that!
I use edgerouter most of the time, but the normal pi4 is awesome for router duty. I've been using mine as a backup router on my home network, when my DSL dies. Either through its wifi and my phone in hotspot duty, or through a 3g usb modem. Openwrt works like a charm with minimal fiddling
I just ordered a CM4 with Wireless, 4GB ram, and 32GB eMMC and the DFRobot bundle - cant wait to make this my primary router for the fibre coming into the house
Thanks for this - really useful!
Thank you! U got my interest on dfrobot.
My best scenes whole thing in the TH-cam Mr Jeff is the end of this video,
Mr Jeff has repeated taking a scenes 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
All your video is good and it is inspired amflearning by doing
Thanks alot Mr Jeff 🙏🏼
Incredible video. good job!
+100000 for great documentation!
Great video as always! I was seriously considering getting the DFRobot to try / play around with till I saw they jacked up the price by 50%. I mean, $45 for the SEED seems reasonable since it also has the additional capabilities of potentially doing double duty as a NAS as pointed out in the video - so not sure how DFRobot can justify jacking up the price. I know Jeff pointed out the slower throughputs on SEED but that should not be an issue for folks with say 500Mbps or lower speeds. Anyway, keep up the great work, Jeff! 👍
Meanwhile the avg internet speed in my town is like 1.5Mbps..
Chip supply. The SEED may be cheaper, but it's a USB hub, which sucks.
It has crappy 1Gbe downlink to your switch. What NAS are you talking about? That's a nonsense. Imagine you ul/dl something to/from NAS and that will shut down your internet completely. Silly idea.
Ive got a Pi4 setup as a router (OpenWRT) using its single gigabit port - setup with VLAN through a managed switch for connection to WAN and LAN. Speeds hang out at 930s Up and 840s Down on ATT Fiber.
Thanks for this great video! I'm very interested to learn about WAP options.
Waiting eagerly for the duel 2.5Gig networking video! Hats up Jeff. :)
for a year now, I've been running a Pi4B as openwrt router with VLANS uplinked with a single Gbit cable to a Layer 2 managed switch. One port on the switch goes to a 500/500 Fibre optic media converter. It works absolutely fabulously, no hiccups, lightning fast DNS (unbound) and full 500/500 speed despite SPI. It has completely replaced the standard router(zyxel) supplied by the carrier.
The line between LAN and Internet has faded nearly completely.
things I didn't expect to see appearing the same shot: a hacksaw and a raspberry pi :)
Great content!
nice review!
Always interesting videos mate ;)
Great vid as usual! I would be curious comparing these offerings to the single board mikrotik solutions. Some mikrotik router boards are about $50 and are similar. More red shirt Jeff!
+1 to that. Mikrotik products are awesome.
Tip about 0 tolerance stls: You can use the Horizontal Expansion setting in Cura (or equivalent in anything else) to make it smaller in the axis that are usually the problem (X, Y).
Bonus tip: You can use Initial Layer Horizontal Expansion to get rid of elephants foot
Thanks! I'll take a look at that next time I do a build like this-I'm still pretty new to slicing and dicing in 3D printing :)
@@JeffGeerling How do you convert the step file the DFRobot supplies to files for the 3D printer?
@@dogsop I used Fusion 360 (Personal / non-commercial license) to select each of the case parts, and export them individually to STL files.
Hello Jeff, precise explanation/comparison on both the boards. Could you possibly test the outcomes for pfSense and pihole on these boards?
amazing..if you have the time, would you please also show or guide us on how best to use tailscale/taildrop on pi clusters or even virtual clusters locally and remotely. ur way of explaining is easy even on these geeky home lab configs.
I always love you making videos... I appreciate your and your brothers efforts on making the videos .. also tell your brother to not cut those pi's it hurts
Recommendations working fine again
I wish dual nics were more common ie on larger (workstation) laptops, on the pi etc. I'd love to see a firewall like Untangle /pfsense running well on a 12v tiny router. The masses need a decent plug and play solution.
If anyone's looking for a minimal linux based OpenWRT gigabit router, consider the NanoPi R4S using FriendlyWRT (based on OpenWRT). It uses an RK3399 so it's not quite the same as these PI based routers but it has great performance and you can get it with a passively cooled metal enclosure. It's great.
You are best of the best! And thanks for simple english!!
I've been looking to use a pi zero w as a wireless router out and about to connect multiple wireless clients to each other for LAN connections. This is a perfect project for inspiration and further research, thanks.
Edit: I don't need high bandwidth or anything intense, it would mostly be used for Nintendo switch gaming TCP packets that don't care about data integrity and are not overly large.
Outtakes! Woohoo! Good times.
Still looking forward to the testing on the dual port 2.5gbps card you teased.
Jeff nice video, I was looking throughout your other videos do you have one on setting up a proxy on pi? If not could you do on setting up the proxy software with a management web interface.
Nice! I guess I’ll still look at X86 for my planned Vyos build since I need multiple wan and lan ports, but this could be a cool thing for some other project
Thanks for that. Partly over my head, very info dense.
Looking for a home router for Home Assistant, sounds like you're heading in the same direction?
Love to hear more.
great video!
It's humble of you to show bloopers at the end, without which we'd be convinced you were flawless!
This also shows the diligent work you put in to produce a flawless end production, as easy as you make it look.
Jeff, my long time dream was to use Pi's a router, back then, when I investigated the question, there were no 2x NIC cards available. Thank you so much for this video and looking forward very much for your new option with PCI-e card and CM4. Cheers from Russia. BTW VPN throughput is VERY important characteristic for the router... testing just NIC bandwidth is somewhat disconnected from reality a bit.
64 byte packets are almost pathologically small. They are legal, of course, and it is a good test to do, but I'd also always do a test with maybe 512 bytes. The reason is that there's always a packets-per-second limit (due to IRQ or similar I/O limitations). Also, because the internal data structures used to store packets in memory are likely to be larger than 64 bytes, the system may actually be transferring more data per packet already. So either way there's a good chance that you can get a higher average bitrate by using bigger packets, because it gets more data through "for free".
Video is great, as always)
Take a look at the Nano Pi R2s. Very interesting and cheap router sbc.
There is also the R4S which uses PCIe GbE, instead of USB3 Ethernet of R2S.
Best price I’ve seen is directly from the manufacturer in China. Shipping takes awhile though.
Use IRQBA... oh, good you did it already.
tested one device. This channel is annoying click bait for noobs.
Nice video! I'm currently using my rpi 4 as a router because my apartment building's wifi won't allow me to ssh between my own devices. In the future I'm probably going to be looking at repurposing an old computer of mine as a router + NAS. A bit hard to do since I'm a student on a budget.
Ooh! a hardware firewall / pi-hole! ^^ I need to get one of those, so I can reroute the traffic. ^^
cant wait to see what you come up with as a ap :D hope its a low budget decent option :D
Many thanks for this great video. Did-you manage to get the pci eth of DFrobot work with raspbian ? I tried many drivers without success … also printed case, but too small for CM4 with radiator …
thank you ! , i think that performance need to be check with different packet size mixed - like in imix protocol , and for router random or increment src ip is also good choice (to be same as in the real world ) .
I did do some different packet size tests-at least on the DFRobot-and the results are linked in the GitHub issue there.
If all you need are two Gigabyte ports, the NanoPi R4S is a powerful router that runs OpenWRT and can manage a 1 Gigabit WAN uplink with SQM. Search for tests done on reddit, it smokes the RPi.
First, thanks for the awesome videos! You always have such great content!
On your initial statement on what a router is... technically a router just routes between two networks. Whether it's internal or external doesn't matter.
A consumer grade "router" also does Network Address Translation between your internal IPs and an external IP. They also sometimes have firewalling features.
It's much easier to route than nat/firewall from a computational perspective. Does it matter in the real world on a pi? No idea!
Note that OpenWRT's default config does do NAT and has a simple firewall (with about 8 rules) configured by default.
Good video as ever Jeff :) I'm just taking a look at the DFRobot board right now with a view to using them in an LXD cluster with the second network interface connecting to a ceph storage cluster. What do you think, I guess it should probably work well? So all the containers run on the ceph storage and I should be able to make an HA LXD cluster.
I like, how you chase the installation status bar with your mouse... I do the same
How else does one survive the mundane tasks of everyday life?
Very nice explanation. Can I use any of those boards to implement Modbus/TCP and daisy chain them?
There's a board called "NanoPi R2S" by FriendlyARM, which has 1 PCIE GbE NIC and 1 USB GbE NIC
Don't know if you check that thing already tho
Nice video!
Interesting Topic this video i wanted for a long time