That's a good part when repairing things and engines, when you find bad parts, then you know you're fixing it! Great video, keep sharing those with us! Thanks a lot!
Well, this series started off with just our parts donor being taken apart. Then we added the other engine, which we are repairing. You'll notice in a few shots there are two engines standing on their noses... You gotta stop being so technical and analytic, and just enjoy the movie...
Someone else beat me to the remote control Roulette wheel hyperlink. Ok, we are all looking forward to see the Ai-25 wind up and scream to life on the test cell. Uh, zoom zoom?
Thanks AJZ! If you happen think of it when you're just about to tear down another one that has reams of lock-wire, could you make one on how you unravel and strip all that lock-wire? The real jet techs watching this channel might find it boring but I won't... I was even thrilled by your famous 'o-ring' vid. I know amongst your video making they actually expect some work too, so no pressure here and thanks again.
I wouldn't be surprised if that AL-25 is going to outperform your other engines of the same size. I don't know about the J-79 though, that's a monster of an engine.
Hi jay, what brand of bearings are OEM in Ivchenko engines? Such as the AI25. HOw do you apply the fairly large torque values to the bearing /seal retainer assemblies? Large T wrench or a calibrated air tool? Do you guys make your own special tools in house or use outside machine shop? I think Robin S said there is a really hot machine shop in JC now. Likely makes a lot of down hole well eqp,t Thx. Bob.
Just an idea...You have mentioned how delicate the carbon seals are. Why not smash up the damaged one just to show how delicate? Always great vids. Thanks for posting.
Been waiting for this one for awhile. Diggin' the AI-25 series because it's so different. Will this be run at the S&S Turbines test cell or at another location?
Love your videos! I'm a Rolls-Royce kind of guy but I've never seen other jets in such detail, your channel is fantastic for that! How does the build quality of the Russian engines compare to contemporary western jets? Sorry if you've answered this question before.
From Pt.4: "Jet engines are a product that does not suffer incompetence. This little Russian turbofan is built to a quality standard equal to anything I've seen. In terms of the details, it resembles a Rolls Royce more than any other turbine engine I've taken apart. As for quality of materials.. all of the manufacturers put out exactly the same stuff... the best possible at time of manufacture. The core parts of this engine are of the highest quality." ...If anything, this engine is more Rolls Royce-y, and not very GE-like in the way it's made. Translation: it's finicky and time consuming to work on, with many features that make you say " why the shizzle did they do it that way? "
AgentJayZ Very interesting! I know that the Russians are the only people outside of Rolls to use 3-shaft designs, so I'd very much like to see one of those in the flesh. Without wanting to sound like a cynic, do you think its possible that the russians may have copied Rolls somewhat after they were sold Derwent jets? They obviously copied the Derwent which went on to power the MiG-15 as the RD-500, but I don't know how far the "reverse engineering" extended. I had expected the quality to be good - but spending half of your time around Rolls engineers almost makes you think that anything not made by them is rubbish (something which I know to be totally false). Thanks a lot for the reply!!
wyzarme Ha! First of all, I am totally in agreement with your intimation that Rolls Royce engineers are "a little biased", and that spending time with them will poison your thoughts. Second... no, the Derwent is a centrifugal compressor engine. The AI25 is a two spool, all axial turbofan. In concept, it is a bit like a smaller Spey, but having worked on both, I will say it is much more sensibly designed. So, if you want to say that Russia copied Britain, that's fine, but I would add that they also optimized and rationalized what was an extremely complicated and finicky design. The Spey was the first engine line I worked on in my career, and remains my least favorite.
AgentJayZ I know the Derwent is a centrifugal compressor, and a bit of a swine, it is the one I have worked on the most along with the Gnome. I just wondered whether the Russians somewhat followed a more British design scheme as opposed to an American one - however if it is a two spool design that means it is more similar to an American jet. I don't doubt that the Russians have great engineers and I'm not trying to demean them, rather trying to ascertain where the similarities in their engine design and construction came from, it may just be that they evolved in a similar way. Rolls are VERY proud that they are the "only" company to make 3-shaft engines, however the Kuznetsov NK-32 does also. I have worked on the Spey and I would agree it is a bit of a swine, but my least favourite jet remains the Welland, because while Whittle was a genius, he had some very daft ideas.
Of course, you have to Formally test the engine for your client. It would be polite if you strapped it to a boat. Just to make sure its working good n stuff. u know.
in a previous video you talked about how the oil system is kept at a lower pressure than the gasses surrounding them to make sure oil is not sprayed out of the system. So then in this engine why did the oil get past the seals, was that idea not really implemented in this engine?
In some engines, the carbon seals creating the chamber of the sump are themselves inside air seals that maintains a pressurized area outside the carbon seals. This engine only has the carbon seals, and they were seriously damaged. It looks like the scavenge pump could not prevent some of the leakage.
On your comment about it being good that something is found broken or worn, so you can be reasonably sure you fixed it...have you ever ran into a situation when you rebuild an engine in this manner, get it all assembled and running just to find out that something else is wrong?
This can happen, although two problems at the same time are unlikely. These engines are designed to be completely overhauled after an interval of service, and aren't really designed to be "fixed". When a problem is found, it is important to be careful in determining whether it's the root cause or just a symptom. The test cell is where we can see if we solved the problem, or just cleared up a symptom.
What it be, JayZ? Just wondering how the Ruskies run the accessories (fuel,oil,generator, starter ect.) off of the main rotor? IE is it a shaft located inside a standoff w/beveled pinion type gear boxes at each end, a chain and 2 sprockets (ha :-) , cogged belt (ha ha :-) or a large ring gear attached to the outer perimeter of a blade assembly (ha ha ha :-) ?
That's what the "he :-)" 's were for. But I was hoping you'd be able to shed some light as to the various ways power coupling (mainly for accessories) has refined down to through the progression of years and engine designs. Specifically have you seen a single design collate (settle down to) from the many various engine mfg's?.
There is only one way. Maybe two. They have not changed since the very beginning. Either a spur gear driven off the main shaft and driving accessories in a gearbox, Or a gearbox driven by a radial driveshaft which is driven by the main shaft via a bevel gear. Almost always the second one. Almost.
Did the wren 27 use a hollow shaft w/skewed slits as a means of fuel &oil pump? If so has anyone ever given that or a generator/starter stator built into the shaft assy. I'm assuming that maintenance of such a system would be too much.
Hello JayZ! Could you tell us/show us what kind of marking pencil you use to mark engine parts. There is common warning which state " Use of nonaproved marking materials such as common lead pencils on engine components In or near the hot end will cause cracking of those components when subjected to high temperatures. This can lead to engine failure". For those who ask why you record of your maintenance activities I said you are smart guy because if something unwanted happen you can always get back and see what you have done and fix whats went wrong. Smart guys record/write important things, fool guys memorize important things. In another words everything which is written is saved instead of something memorized which is lost forever. Sir, I wish you the best and thank you in advance.......
Where'd you get Andrei? Did you have to import him from Soviet Russia to have someone with a little first hand knowledge of this specimen or was he a local?
PS: This will a great pickup truck bed engine for you! About 3000 lbs thrust? Shit-n-git! CAUTION: Use of this product in such a way may result in injury or death. Well, fun to think about.....
Jay, as you work with this Soviet era engine, are you finding their design to be unique, or are you sensing this Russian engine was "modeled" after a western design? I ask as many Soviet era designs (all sorts of technologies) were copied from western counterparts....
If anything ,, this engine appears to be a downsized, much improved upon RR Spey. I would not say anything was copied, and some major features are totally different. Some are much better.
Hi, i was wondering how easy it is to get parts for those Ukrainian engines? i mean i doubt that these things are off the shelf stocked parts here in North America (or are they)... so how does that work?
Obtaining parts for all the engines we work on is a challenge. That's a large part of what we do. I am in the process of having several large, classified parts manufactured right now. Sometimes they are for sale, other times you need to engineer them yourself.
AgentJayZ Hi, Thanks for the reply... i was reading Ivchenko-Progress has had one of their large projects (Antonov 70) with Russia cancelled/delayed due to the ongoing tensions between Ukraine/Russia... so i wouldn't doubt they would be severely in need of funds/hungry for parts sales at least. i wonder how easy it is to procure parts from them. When manufacturing parts, how does one ensure that they are up to the same design spec/durability testing as the originals? Especially with something that is of foreign design?
+AgentJayZ Do not listen to this fool ukrainians this is the same as Russian urals, povolzhtsy, kuban, but there have western ukrainians of Polish origin nationalists , they hate the Russian and the WW2 were the Germans
![เปิดบ้านสุดหรู "เเจ็ค the ghost" ลั่นถ้าป๋องกพลลำบากผมเลี้ยงเอง!! l [Nickynachat]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1xbW4vULqGc/mqdefault.jpg)
I'd like to formally request a video or two on Remote Control Roulette Wheels! Thank AJZ!!
завидую Андрюхе, с такими ништяками работает...
I'm pretty sure Jay just got banned from every roulette wheel in a casino in all of North America. lol
Great to see the progress you're making. Can't wait to see that engine run.
good stuff, thanks again.. will be watchin for the test run
Well done, Jay. Been watching this from the beginning (part one). Itching to see the engine on the thrust frame!
This is a freaking saga i love it.
That's a good part when repairing things and engines, when you find bad parts, then you know you're fixing it! Great video, keep sharing those with us! Thanks a lot!
Another cracking video Jay!
Yet another great video. Thanks for your time and energy..... Keep it up : )
Always good to hear from a real aircraft maintainer. Thanks !
I hope we will all hear this mini russian monster roar soon ! As always,excellent videos Agent JayZ !
Can't wait for part 6!
Can't wait to see this puppy run!
It will be great to see this run. I didn't know there was only a relatively minor problem with it. Thanks.
Well, this series started off with just our parts donor being taken apart. Then we added the other engine, which we are repairing.
You'll notice in a few shots there are two engines standing on their noses...
You gotta stop being so technical and analytic, and just enjoy the movie...
AgentJayZ Oh, I did. Enjoy the movie. I'm very grateful that you keep making them. But I can't stop being analytical.
Im ready for another engine test run!
Part 6 and I am still watching
A roulette table made from the HP-compressor would be soooooo cool! :-)
Someone else beat me to the remote control Roulette wheel hyperlink. Ok, we are all looking forward to see the Ai-25 wind up and scream to life on the test cell. Uh, zoom zoom?
Yes.. I'd be happy to see AI-25 runs.. See u again soon, Jay Z..
Thanks AJZ! If you happen think of it when you're just about to tear down another one that has reams of lock-wire, could you make one on how you unravel and strip all that lock-wire? The real jet techs watching this channel might find it boring but I won't... I was even thrilled by your famous 'o-ring' vid. I know amongst your video making they actually expect some work too, so no pressure here and thanks again.
So when you buy a parts engine.... Do they all come with a Russian manual and translator?
Great You have russian guy now on the team, Jay ;)
remote control roulette wheels?!? I KNOW IT!!!! ha. great vids man.
Андрей, ничего им не говори!)) Пусть сами думают.
I see that roulette wheel control is a pretty popular topic.
Very nice. Looking forward to seeing this run :)
Had any nice Rollers in the shop lately?
I wouldn't be surprised if that AL-25 is going to outperform your other engines of the same size. I don't know about the J-79 though, that's a monster of an engine.
nice
Hi jay, what brand of bearings are OEM in Ivchenko engines? Such as the AI25.
HOw do you apply the fairly large torque values to the bearing /seal retainer assemblies? Large T wrench or a calibrated air tool?
Do you guys make your own special tools in house or use outside machine shop? I think Robin S said there is a really hot machine shop in JC now. Likely makes a lot of down hole well eqp,t Thx. Bob.
Just an idea...You have mentioned how delicate the carbon seals are. Why not smash up the damaged one just to show how delicate?
Always great vids. Thanks for posting.
Been waiting for this one for awhile. Diggin' the AI-25 series because it's so different. Will this be run at the S&S Turbines test cell or at another location?
The plan is to run this in the hallowed citadel of power !
5:13 - have a nice day
может быть, немного поздно ... но приветствую в любом случае
Thumb up for russian guy in the end.
Andrei, the Siberian cyclone....
Hi Jay! Just wondering:
Ehat is the (i think) air exhaust mounted between the GB and the generator? Sort of bleed air connection? How does it work?
The fwd pointing duct is for air to cool the generator. Is that what you are pointing to?
Jay ever run across any Pratt & Whitney J-57 out there ??
Love your videos! I'm a Rolls-Royce kind of guy but I've never seen other jets in such detail, your channel is fantastic for that! How does the build quality of the Russian engines compare to contemporary western jets? Sorry if you've answered this question before.
From Pt.4:
"Jet engines are a product that does not suffer incompetence.
This little Russian turbofan is built to a quality standard equal to anything I've seen.
In terms of the details, it resembles a Rolls Royce more than any other turbine engine I've taken apart.
As for quality of materials.. all of the manufacturers put out exactly the same stuff... the best possible at time of manufacture.
The core parts of this engine are of the highest quality."
...If anything, this engine is more Rolls Royce-y, and not very GE-like in the way it's made.
Translation: it's finicky and time consuming to work on, with many features that make you say " why the shizzle did they do it that way? "
AgentJayZ Very interesting! I know that the Russians are the only people outside of Rolls to use 3-shaft designs, so I'd very much like to see one of those in the flesh. Without wanting to sound like a cynic, do you think its possible that the russians may have copied Rolls somewhat after they were sold Derwent jets? They obviously copied the Derwent which went on to power the MiG-15 as the RD-500, but I don't know how far the "reverse engineering" extended.
I had expected the quality to be good - but spending half of your time around Rolls engineers almost makes you think that anything not made by them is rubbish (something which I know to be totally false).
Thanks a lot for the reply!!
wyzarme Ha! First of all, I am totally in agreement with your intimation that Rolls Royce engineers are "a little biased", and that spending time with them will poison your thoughts.
Second... no, the Derwent is a centrifugal compressor engine.
The AI25 is a two spool, all axial turbofan.
In concept, it is a bit like a smaller Spey, but having worked on both, I will say it is much more sensibly designed.
So, if you want to say that Russia copied Britain, that's fine, but I would add that they also optimized and rationalized what was an extremely complicated and finicky design.
The Spey was the first engine line I worked on in my career, and remains my least favorite.
AgentJayZ I know the Derwent is a centrifugal compressor, and a bit of a swine, it is the one I have worked on the most along with the Gnome. I just wondered whether the Russians somewhat followed a more British design scheme as opposed to an American one - however if it is a two spool design that means it is more similar to an American jet. I don't doubt that the Russians have great engineers and I'm not trying to demean them, rather trying to ascertain where the similarities in their engine design and construction came from, it may just be that they evolved in a similar way.
Rolls are VERY proud that they are the "only" company to make 3-shaft engines, however the Kuznetsov NK-32 does also. I have worked on the Spey and I would agree it is a bit of a swine, but my least favourite jet remains the Welland, because while Whittle was a genius, he had some very daft ideas.
Of course, you have to Formally test the engine for your client. It would be polite if you strapped it to a boat. Just to make sure its working good n stuff. u know.
добро пожаловать на канал Андрей
DOBRY DEN' !!
in a previous video you talked about how the oil system is kept at a lower pressure than the gasses surrounding them to make sure oil is not sprayed out of the system. So then in this engine why did the oil get past the seals, was that idea not really implemented in this engine?
In some engines, the carbon seals creating the chamber of the sump are themselves inside air seals that maintains a pressurized area outside the carbon seals. This engine only has the carbon seals, and they were seriously damaged.
It looks like the scavenge pump could not prevent some of the leakage.
AgentJayZ so the damage to the seals was just that bad? and just out of curiosity, how much oil do you think leaked from that seal per hour?
I was told massive white smoke on running, and we found a lot of oil residue.
How much? More than acceptable limits.
AgentJayZ I like that answer. Thanks for the responses too.
Can Andrey translate the Rusian documentation for you ?
Wyr
God bless
On your comment about it being good that something is found broken or worn, so you can be reasonably sure you fixed it...have you ever ran into a situation when you rebuild an engine in this manner, get it all assembled and running just to find out that something else is wrong?
This can happen, although two problems at the same time are unlikely.
These engines are designed to be completely overhauled after an interval of service, and aren't really designed to be "fixed".
When a problem is found, it is important to be careful in determining whether it's the root cause or just a symptom.
The test cell is where we can see if we solved the problem, or just cleared up a symptom.
What it be, JayZ? Just wondering how the Ruskies run the accessories (fuel,oil,generator, starter ect.) off of the main rotor? IE is it a shaft located inside a standoff w/beveled pinion type gear boxes at each end, a chain and 2 sprockets (ha :-) , cogged belt (ha ha :-) or a large ring gear attached to the outer perimeter of a blade assembly (ha ha ha :-) ?
dude...its obviously a v belt running with a tension pulley from the main shaft ;)
Geoff Brown ... oh... you're joking...
Almost had me there !
That's what the "he :-)" 's were for. But I was hoping you'd be able to shed some light as to the various ways power coupling (mainly for accessories) has refined down to through the progression of years and engine designs. Specifically have you seen a single design collate (settle down to) from the many various engine mfg's?.
There is only one way. Maybe two. They have not changed since the very beginning.
Either a spur gear driven off the main shaft and driving accessories in a gearbox, Or a gearbox driven by a radial driveshaft which is driven by the main shaft via a bevel gear.
Almost always the second one. Almost.
Did the wren 27 use a hollow shaft w/skewed slits as a means of fuel &oil pump? If so has anyone ever given that or a generator/starter stator built into the shaft assy. I'm assuming that maintenance of such a system would be too much.
Hello JayZ!
Could you tell us/show us what kind of marking pencil you use to mark engine parts. There is common warning which state " Use of nonaproved marking materials such as common lead pencils on engine components In or near the hot end will cause cracking of those components when subjected to high temperatures. This can lead to engine failure". For those who ask why you record of your maintenance activities I said you are smart guy because if something unwanted happen you can always get back and see what you have done and fix whats went wrong. Smart guys record/write important things, fool guys memorize important things. In another words everything which is written is saved instead of something memorized which is lost forever. Sir, I wish you the best and thank you in advance.......
Where'd you get Andrei? Did you have to import him from Soviet Russia to have someone with a little first hand knowledge of this specimen or was he a local?
Dario Impini Andrei escaped Siberia in 2001 to become a Canadian. He says our weather is "about the same".
Remote Control Roulette Wheel is here: www.pokerdeceit.com/RemoteControlRoulette.asp
That fuel control looks like a mess with all of those pipes! Hope it is good! Appreciate the update; keep 'em comin'!
DD
PS: This will a great pickup truck bed engine for you! About 3000 lbs thrust? Shit-n-git! CAUTION: Use of this product in such a way may result in injury or death. Well, fun to think about.....
4:27 lol :D
Jay, as you work with this Soviet era engine, are you finding their design to be unique, or are you sensing this Russian engine was "modeled" after a western design? I ask as many Soviet era designs (all sorts of technologies) were copied from western counterparts....
If anything ,, this engine appears to be a downsized, much improved upon RR Spey.
I would not say anything was copied, and some major features are totally different. Some are much better.
Hi, i was wondering how easy it is to get parts for those Ukrainian engines? i mean i doubt that these things are off the shelf stocked parts here in North America (or are they)... so how does that work?
Obtaining parts for all the engines we work on is a challenge. That's a large part of what we do.
I am in the process of having several large, classified parts manufactured right now.
Sometimes they are for sale, other times you need to engineer them yourself.
AgentJayZ are they shipped in large classified boxes labelled with large classified labels?
Geoff Brown They come in plain brown wrappers...
AgentJayZ Hi, Thanks for the reply... i was reading Ivchenko-Progress has had one of their large projects (Antonov 70) with Russia cancelled/delayed due to the ongoing tensions between Ukraine/Russia... so i wouldn't doubt they would be severely in need of funds/hungry for parts sales at least. i wonder how easy it is to procure parts from them.
When manufacturing parts, how does one ensure that they are up to the same design spec/durability testing as the originals? Especially with something that is of foreign design?
Rigged Roulette Wheel:
th-cam.com/video/iOOc4sVA_vc/w-d-xo.html
its not russian engine! Its soviet engine and for now its Ukrainian engine!
+Володимир Зеленецький The manuals are printed in Russian, as are the log books. But the manufacturing center is in Ukraine. Sorry for the mistake.
so for what you need this engine?
AgentJayZ AI-25 created in Ivchenko-Progress and manufacturing in Motor Sich in Ukraine not in russia.
AgentJayZ ivchenko-progress.com/
www.motorsich.com/rus/
+AgentJayZ Do not listen to this fool ukrainians this is the same as Russian urals, povolzhtsy, kuban, but there have western ukrainians of Polish origin nationalists , they hate the Russian and the WW2 were the Germans