Hi All, I have noticed a lot of hate and also alot of unfounded attacks on me and my channel for my opinion of this video. It is clear that many who do so have not actually watch the ENTIRETY of the video. I stand by this video and my analysis and opinions are made based on sound information which I provide the links to them as well. The massive price correction figures of the Tudor watches are from Watchcharts and Chrono24. I am not creating a video out of spite and spreading misinformation on purpose to get views - the truth is that the brand has become one dimensional due to the success of the Black Bay line. To the haters, do watch the entire video and try to understand objectively that this video is meant to address the issue on Tudor prices massive crash on the secondary market. If you disagree, it's fine... just enjoy the video! Let's keep ourselves civil here. :)
I think the problem with your viewpoint is that it's founded on a very anomalous period where watch values spiked in a crazy manner for a very, very, very short period of time. Many watches and brands felt this bump and therefore they're most susceptible to a return to reality. And in reality, for decades and decades, you would always lose at least 50% of your value on any watch you purchased. There were only merely a handful of models from a couple of brands where you might not lose value in the medium/long term. So I think there is not a lot of value in super close analysis of the current market as it recovers from the most anomalous market dynamic since the quartz crisis and eventually settles into normal. Nor does it really mean Tudor has a problem per se. The whole industry is facing some issues now
Can't get hurt whenever your opinion is expressed and someone disagrees. Don't purchase a Porsche 911 and complain of poor off-roading capabilities. I sold a rolex and bought a Tudor. It's a personal taste. Markets adjust as needed, self induced at times. Can't fault a company for not messing with their moneymakers.....Ask Coke about "new coke"
@@lonewolfemcquade8133 I have a five digit that I bought in 05. Serviced twice since then and working perfectly. I also have a 6538 but that is one ai don’t wear. It was handed down to me. I wanted something in that style and the closest thing to it is the BB58 which I own. I even tried a 54 but that wears nothing like the 6538 and is much smaller in thickness and length. Tudor is an amazing brand!
@@saksakorn1 They don’t have to be metas as those movements are the same as the 4 liners. They are just as accurate and don’t let anyone fool you either. The 3130 is a work horse and the real deal whether in a 2 liner or 4 liner.
I have the bb54 with rubber strap also. I am very happy with it and like it as a more sporty yet classy addition to my datejusts. Have a good time with your 54. 👍
There are many people who are moved to buy Tudors because they actually wanted Rolex because they aren’t able to get one at retail. This is common practice by Authorised Dealers to push potential customers to Tudors. This has always been the Rolex/Tudor strategy in the market. There are many, many out there who have buyers regret after getting a tudor black bay. Of course there are people like yourself who buy Tudor for what you like about your watches. Since you’re in that camp, congratulations 🥳.
I have a few Rolexes and I have a Tudor. The Tudor has a terrific in house movement. The cases are solid. People sell all sorts of watches. The grey market has millions of watches.
@@twosecondswatchMy authorized dealer never pushed to buy anything. I own a ‘41 Wimbledon and 5 Tudors… I think influencers or ppl in general gotta have a reason or comment on others ppl choices. It’s ridiculous and pretentious, you gotta buy the best of the best or your poor. This video is crazy; so, let me state a fact: if it’s not the crown(Rolex) you going lose money or value period. The reason the black bay line is pushed because it’s a tool/sport watch that covers all parameters without the price. Most ppl aren’t walking around with a $3-5000 watch on, period facts.
You buy a Tudor because you love Tudor. Tudor is allowed to create new models, Rolex can't. Tudor's quality now is as good as Rolex. You buy a Rolex for social status. You buy a Tudor because you don't need to reassure yourself about your social status. Take a look at the Pelagos LHD. It is what a Submariner should have evolved if Rolex was not stuck with its reputation.
I currently have 2 Rolex and 3 Tudor, among others, in my collection of 18 watches. I bought the Tudors because i liked them. Its utter bollocks that they are poor mans Rolex or you buy them in place of a Rolex. All my watches fill a niche. I do not consider them an investment. I never plan to sell any.
I'm right behind you w/10 & counting. I did want a Daytona but got a Tudor Panda & it really changed me. Someday I want a Picachu Daytona ,until then I love my Panda.
I owned few tudor such as bronze, chrono, gmt and they are bought from preown dealers which gives great value for the built and quality. Watches are for collecting and hobby... Not really for investment or appreciating assets. Buy it because you like it and not for investing.
100% watches are not an investment. For personal reasons, I don't buy used. But I understand why people do. I also never sell, so the watches I pick up are carefully selected and not purchased on a whim. Best time to be in this hobby IMHO!
Had a 41mm BB Nero smiley face short production run for a while. Sold it without regret. Tudor is one of the most boring watch out there..at least to me
You asked for people that had sold their Black Bays to comment, just commenting to say I've kept mine. Own both a 54 and 58, tempted by a 41 at some point. I like the more simple lines of Tudor and Rolex, I like that the movements will likely be servicable for my lifetime. I like that they're under the radar, not too flashy, no painful product placement. I think they know their audience and they're getting it right. I don't aspire to a Rolex, even the stigma attached to the brand name, it's not me. Another way to look at the metrics. Over here a second hand Black Bay 58 still sells for 70% of retail on Chrono24, Seamasters or Longines Spirits make 60%. A Black Bay 54 still gets about 85%, but that's newer, it'll follow the same trend as the market saturates, it doesn't mean it's failed.
A little too much generalization here. Not EVERYBODY who purchased a Tudor did so as an alternative to a Rolex. Many collectors actually prefer the Tudor.
Well the reality is both are the same company, Tudor is wholly owned by Rolex, so I guess whether someone purchase a Rolex or Tudor it’s the same for them.
@@twosecondswatch Very different design language and ethos between the companies and there has been for 70 years. Do you assume people buying a Hydroconquest or Diver 65 really wanted a Seamaster, because the parent company is the same?
This really resonates with me i recently went into a Tudor Boutique to view a BB 41 Monochrome. The sales guy was very difficult, wanting my personal details to check my purchase history etc. Ive no time for being messed around when i was prepared to spend 4k on a watch. I walked out.
Reason why I own Tudor only now is no one says they are reps. Every time I wore my GMT master 2 I would get people asking if it’s rep or something stupid. But with my pelagos never had an issues. Also whenever I wore my Rolex people treated me differently. Tudor for the win
You are very wrong. I got 3 Rolex and 3 Tudor. The reason I bought Tudor is because I really love the watch. Not only me, many of my friends bought Tudor because they like it. In fact I am going for BB58 GMT for my next watch instead of adding another Rolex into my collection.
I didn’t say everyone. I said many people. It is actually true that Tudor watches are specifically designed to be homages to Rolex designs. They oyster case. The black bay 58. The 54. They all reference ROLEX history of the big crown and subs. Heck even Tudor used to call their watches the Tudor Submariner in the 90s!
@@twosecondswatchyou did, you said 'people dont buy because they love the black bay, people buy because they love the submariner' which is just wrong and prevents people like me from respecting your view or channel
@@twosecondswatch I agree with alvin above i sold a buisness for 27 million dollars. I also bought Tudor and rolex. So to me a collection is just that. Not just one brand.Both Tudor and Rolex great watches I LIKE. Your wrong and i didnt need to watch the whole video.
I have a classic 1926 Tudor which I love and wear it constantly. Everything you're saying is your opinion and everyone is entitled to it. But I totally disagree with your reasoning.
The price and marked you talk about is pretty accurate for Omega as well. Yes you can get almost every watch at any time, but the prices just keeps getting higher. A Seamaster is a «bad» deal today compared 2 years ago. I bought my Seamaster 300 for 6600 USD in 2022, now its 8500 (if my conversion rates are correct).
You are so spot on. Tudor Hype is over. The young buyers are making enough to move on to the real thing. The hype had me looking towards Tudor, but couldn’t help to see a HOMAGE. Nothing original nor any real history besides being a copy. Guess that is what it was always meant to be. That is not a secret.
Some of what you say is certainly true for Tudor and for some Tudor buyers. And equally important, strong opinions in your vids means that the comments section comes alive, which drives the YT algorithm to more viewers. Chapeau. Happy to subscribe.
Who cares about the resell market, especially with a brand like Tudor? They're supposed to be readily available with not much demand compared to their sister brand Rolex. And it's great that they're even going for below retail in the secondary market but we shouldn't value a brand because of their grey market value.
lol..Rolex,Tudor and the like are just pretty normal tool watches (albeit expensive!) . My G shock is my tool watch. I own Longines, Omega and Tudor. All ace. But my grail is a Patek. Maybe one day😊 . Don’t worry about the hate comments. It will always happenAt the end of the day, they are all just watches. But we all love them. Good vid 👍
I could be one in a million who loves the quirkiness of old Tudor catalog, i loved the Pelagos and bought it , then suddenly i found a brand that is all about one model and from there onwards i stopped being excited , coming back to the old Tudor catalog each model was its own now that isn't the case .
I have a 41mm Black Bay diver with the blue bezel and love it. It's my favorite watch and I have two Omegas (300m and P.O. 43.5mm). I wear my Black Bay on a 22mm Long Island Watch brand FKM rubber strap in black. The accuracy is almost perfect.
"Tudor milks the Black Bay line". Completely true, just look at their offer, they should rebrand Pelagos and just call the company Black Bay. After they dumped the Heritage Advisor I lost interest in Tudor, in spite of their cool Black Bay GMT..
I stand with you 1000%!!! Your words and opinions are needed by our community. I can only speak for myself but I fell for the whole TudorPooter hype and bought a BB 2 tone. Kept it for a year and finally it became the first watch I ever sold/traded in. I used the money to buy my wife a diamond bracelet. Then I bought her a DJ mint dial. Established myself and created a trusting relationship with a wonderful AD( who doesn’t even sell Rolex in her location currently but can get them from the main location). I played the game… And I’m glad I did because now I’m waiting on the phone call for my two tone SeaDweller. I have a friend and AD. Is Tudor well-made…yes… is Tutor a great entry-level watch… Absolutely! I just moved on🤷. I respect your stance and I’m with you!👊👊👊👊👊
Thank you very much for the kind words and encouragement. After creating this video, I have been receiving quite some hate, and even personal insults (It’s kinda shocking 😮). This encourages us to make more critical videos that’s not just what brands want us to make… it’s good you got a great AD, and one that respects and treats you well. Do stay subscribe and I’ll be creating more videos like these in the future. Thanks again and hope you get your two tone sea dweller soon. It’s a great watch indeed, been loving two tones lately, I think it’s the up and coming trend perhaps? 🤔
I agree with alvin above i sold a buisness for 27 million dollars. I also bought Tudor and rolex. So to me a collection is just that. Not just one brand.Both Tudor and Rolex great watches I LIKE. Your wrong and i didnt need to watch the whole video. Reply
@alvinkwok5233 3 months ago You are very wrong. I got 3 Rolex and 3 Tudor. The reason I bought Tudor is because I really love the watch. Not only me, many of my friends bought Tudor because they like it. In fact I am going for BB58 GMT for my next watch instead of adding another Rolex into my collection. 7 Reply
You are on point. I have the Pelagos 500m, and the 43 gray Bronze currently in the collection, the Pelagos because it's really light and has a beautiful design, and the bronze is a beautiful casual watch to wear. Tudor is a beautiful brand but definitely not for investment, you just buy and enjoy it for what it is.
I think everyone will have their own opinion on the brand and you have yours which is fine. For me with a circa £4,000 budget i was looking at breitling, Longines and Tudor. Initially i was set on getting a Breitling Super ocean 44 ( latest model) but after walking around the watch shop the tudor black bay burgundy caught my eye, after trying it on i realised it wore much nicer than the breitling and was cheaper at £3,800. It also looked a lot less flashy like an every day watch. After watching reviews on the latest Metas certification alongside the improvements from the previous model I found myself wanting this tudor watch. For most people Rolexs are out of reach or too much of a financial commitment. We are in a recession so spending £10,000 plus on a watch wouldnt make sense for most people. Value for money the Tudor is an excellent watch. I would also add if the quality of build on the Tudor is that good do you really need a Rolex? For me Rolexs have always been a statement brand - I just want a watch thats high quality and looks great. Nothing more nothing less 👌
I agree with the core concepts of the video. I own a 2024 Rolex submariner and I am highly considering a used Tudor Pelagos, nothing in Rolex’s catalog similar to that watch.
I sold my black bay s&g chrono a year ago, because I just felt like gold wasn't for me after wearing it off and on. I just traded a speedmaster for a reverse panda and I'm back to Tudor again.
@luvwatchesusa8333 Great! You can get them at great discounts right now, and due to the drop in demand you can get almost all the models at a significant discount. We also have one for sale on our website, link in the description!
I bought a BB58 because I didn't really care for the Rolex Sub or Seamaster but I agree the BB is huge in their push I like their dress watches and the Ranger but they haven't putt the effort into them that they have in the BB
Tudor is doing everything right at the moment. I rarely wear my Datejust and the BlackBay 54 almost every day. Omega in particular is cranking out thousands of Speedmasters ad nauseam. They are far too expensive for the fact that they flood the market. On the other hand, Tudor has moderate prices and also offers METAS works.
Thanks for sharing. Agree they are doing well, just want them to be more creative with their designs. Come up with something new that’s NOT a Black Bay
I think Tudors by design are a more accessible brand with a lower price point to compete with the likes of Longines, but below Omega or Breitling. I own a Rolex Sub, an Explorer 36mm, and BB58. I think they can all happily coexist. I really do love my BB58.
I agree with you on all the points you mentioned. I like both Rolex and Tudor but both are entirely way overpriced compared to many other Swiss brands. Rolex and Tudor know this and have been milking the market for big easy profits for years. Now the hype has passed and big prices are turning collectors to other Swiss and German brands that are still high quality but more reasonably priced. I also believe that the microbrand market are producing models that have an excellence about them for a fraction of the price.
I do agree about how Tudor did accidentally attract the wrong buyers (meaning those that actually wanted, but couldn't get a Rolex), but if you walk into any grey market dealer's store, the sheer amount of Rolexes sitting there is off-putting. Yes, many have moved on from Tudor, but many have also moved on from Rolex. That's just the nature of things. I recently picked up my BB58 in blue, not because I can't afford others, but because I genuinely love the BB58 design. And in a way, I do understand that Tudor is kind of stuck with this hero product that they've created. Very much like AP and Patek. Even if Tudor markets those other watches, they just don't have the same demand or brand cache to get picked up by the masses like an Omega Constellation or a Longines Heritage would. As a watch, the Black Bay design template just works. However, as a brand, Tudor has a long way to go to make it as aspirational as Omega. Perhaps that's why they're coming out with gold Black Bays now 😆 Great video and analysis by the way! 👌
Hey @watcheswithabdullah thanks for your awesome input. As a fellow enthusiast I’m hoping they can also focus on some of their other lines - something unique and not just call everything a black bay. I have nothing against the black bay 58 and original 41s as well, they were great watches and still are. It’s just that the new variations are kinda tiring. Maybe a new prince date chronograph would be great, perhaps 2025? 🤔
@@twosecondswatch Totally agree! I'm tired of everything being called Black Bay. But from a marketing perspective, I feel like they know that both the watch media and enthusiasts will eat up anything that has 'BB' in its name.
to be honest i like tudor more then rolex, and personally i like how tudors look, i love the 58, 54, pelagos, pink chrono, gmt s&g and gmt 58 the only bad thing you could say is that they all have the same name as you say its all blackbay, tbh i never thought about it and ye maybe its a bad/weird thing, and i think of all the watch brands, theres only a few where the watch price is close or higher then retail, the most are under retail, most people know this and thats why buying grey is not bad
I dont think people who buy tudor BB are buying it as a Rolex Sub alternative, although it could be one. But if that's the case, then there's a lot of other brands and lines to mention. If you pay really close attention to details of these watches, you ll know what i mean. They're 2 different watches. Its either some people are just being more reasonable, or just have different taste. If i have Rolex, i'd still get a Tudor BB monochrome. The quality is on par with the sub for one third of the price. People who think that they cannot co- exist on theyre collections are not watch enthusiasts.
Completely disagree about people buying Black Bay to scratch a Submariner itch. I bought my Black Bay 54 after a long research into what I would spend a lot of money on. On the day of purchase I tried on numerous Rolexes (and a couple of others I may be interested in) but this Black Bay 54 was perfect for me. I’m very much into buying one watch and not collecting and very much enjoying my watch, and this 54 does absolutely everything I could ask for for a watch 🙂
@@Saints-Forever Definitely a 54, all day long. In fact I tried on the modern Sub and an Explorer and was completely unimpressed by them in person! I'm still wearing my 54 daily after about 9 months ownership and it's gotten many compliments and conversations started😁
Isn’t it estimated that Rolex produces around 1.2 million watches per year, while Tudor produces around 250,000 watches per year? About a million less per year than Rolex. With this fact alone, doesn’t it stand to reason that Rolex does the “fake waitlist” thing to a much larger extent than Tudor? Also kinda makes you feel like owning a Tudor is much more exclusive than owning a Rolex for the same reason. There are literally 5x as many Rolex watches floating around each year than Tudors. But yet people think Rolex is more exclusive? This almost sounds a bit “gaslighty” to me.
Ridiculous! I had several Rolexes before I owned a few Tudors. I bought the Tudors because I liked them! I liked the styling! I’m not planning on selling ANY of my watches. And very few will hold their value. Only the PP, VC, and an occasional Rolex will hold their value. None of the Omegas. None of the Tudors. None of the TAGS, Zeniths, APs, IWCs, or Breitlings…hold their value. Now, surprisingly enough, some Cartiers are in favor! Who gives a shit? Buy what you want. Wear what you want.
Ok just my opinion I would like to get discount on tudor but not lists. This is because omega you can a small discount than it's too cose between tudor or omega and I would buy omega
To test out this theory, we just need to ask a simple question. If the Rolex watches (all the models) are just $100 (edited from $10 to make it more interesting😂) higher than their Tudor counterparts and all are readily available in store, which brand will you go for? I will be very surprise not to see majority choose the crown period.
Lol. I still have the Tudors I bought from day one. While I went on to buy Rolex and other brands, I never sold any of my Tudors. I believe in buying watches you like, not cos others told you to do so. And you're right, Tudor isn't a Rolex. Cos it's a Tudor. :)
I agree with everything you said, enough of the BB line, that being said, the pelagos is the line I want, I didn't buy it to feel I have a Rolex I bought it to have a good looking, nice beater watch. Good video sir.
You mentioned theres so many versions ob BB, and yet praising Omega. Its funny cause, nobody milk it the way more than the Omegas does. Look at their their speedmaster. Its over marketeting to the point where its being canivalized. There's hundreds of versions 😅. I think my favorite one is the moonswatch. 😅
This must be the most overrated brand. Very good watches in terms of quality, but no originality in the current lineup - just Rolex inspired watches. And priced too high. Not to mention the lack of innovation and remarkable historic milestones in their back-catalogue. It simply does not deserve the level of hype it gets.
I’m in the market for a luxury watch to commemorate a milestone birthday. I plan to wear it often. I don’t plan to sell it. This video held my interest for roughly 30 seconds.
^^this. I’m completely like you who see the market value as being pointless discussion instead of actually enjoying buying yourself a wonderful watch, and enjoying wearing it for decades thereafter
IF we are talking about a new collector . they may think a Tudor will scratch the itch of a rolex ..and it might for a period of time ..then you see and feel the same way way about the Tudor as you feel about the timex ..rolex isnt stupid ..ok lets give them something that makes them feel like they are part of the family ..when in reality its a homage of a sub from the same manufacturer ..so they get you to buy the homage and after you get sick of it and wanna step up to the plate and play with the big boys ..then you take the Tudor get nowhere near close to retail in trade and then put up another 7k to ultimately get the same watch you wanted and should have gotten in the first place.so rolex just got.you to spend 10k instead of 7k . the tudor line is just a cheaper alternative to a rolex ..from.rolex. Its. Genius. Now the old school collector ..that remembers what rolex was even 20 years ago let alone 40 ..so we may go with the Tudor because we understand value ..your not getting a better watch because it has a different logo. Same as any other retailers do .give you a less desired item.for a. Lesser price thats made in the same place by the same people with the same tools quality control. Etc. No way I'm paying $4-$5 k on a 80s day .. Or even a no date op.or explorer ..when I can buy a date day oyster prince at under 2k...but now.we are.talking vintage ..i hate how this watch shit has sucked me in ..i remember having a g shock a bullova and a timex indiglow ..and was happy ..now close to 20 ish pieces and a bunch of watches I dont wear or even like anymore ..i need a new 3 watch collection ..and climb out of the rabbit hole... Longiness Seiko alpinest and a vintage rolex 😊& a beater or 2 maybe 3 ..fuq here we go again.😂
I cringe whenever someone calls a $3k+ watch "cheap" or refers to the components as cheap. To me, the word refers to something of low quality, which is not a Tudor.
You’re so right. Even when people say that they’ve bought Tudor without thinking of Rolex; that’s BS. Tudor designs ARE Rolex ripoffs. And that’s fine, it’s baked into the brand. They’re informed by being the cheaper alternative to Rolex. No shame! It’s what Hans Wilsdorf intended. But don’t tell me that Tudor has nothing to do with Rolex for you. If you want a BB you really want a Submariner.
Exactly what I was trying to convey - Tudor is supposed to be Rolex for the masses and at a more affordable pricing. It’s in their DNA. Heck even the founder said so himself…
I disagree. The BB58 for example is its own thing and is different enough from a modern Submariner to offer something unique in a collection. Seriously look and wear a BB58 black is a completely different experience from a Rolex Submariner. If you really want to equate the two than either you’ve never owned both to compare or you have an axe to grind and are being insincere.
@@michaelriera6277 Please don’t straw man my opinion and put insincere words in my mouth. I’ve owned the BB58 hoping to scratch a vintage sub itch, and experience what modern Tudor is about. I sold it within a year. Just didn’t do it for me. Bought a 5513 instead. I Tudor’s very mission statement, from the founder himself, was to be a cheaper alternative to Rolex. In the early days they were identical save for the dial and movement! Tudor literally ARE a cheap Rolex. You can’t tell me that “they’re their own thing” when it’s what they were made to be! It shouldn’t stop you, or anyone else, from enjoying them though. They’re great watches.
So what is the argument? By design the Hans Wildforf foundation has Rolex as the aspirational brand and Tudor as the more accessible. When we say more accessible we are saying less expensive and hopefully better product access. My point is if you look at w watch like my BB58, it is unquestionably unique as there is nothing in the current Rolex catalog that either looks or wears like the 58 and so it is possible to have within a collection of Rolex and Tudor as well. I own an Explorer 36mm, a Sub date and I can tell you my BB58 is unique enough to complement a collection. Also the comments about Tudor being a “poor man’s” Rolex. Well I’m sure most poor people would not spend $4k on a luxury item. Yes Tudor by design serves a different market more in line with Longines, under Omega/Breitling and I still don’t see the issue with this.
@@michaelriera6277 Yeah but hang on; you've kinda gone all over the place with your arguments there champ. The BB58 is not "unquestionably unique" for one thing. You should never frame an argument in those terms, because you're demonstrating bad faith immediately. If I can't question it, then you're declaring yourself the arbiter of right and wrong. I reject that. It's not unique because it's homaging an older Tudor Submariner reference, based on a Rolex. Not one of Tudor's current line up (of sports watches at least) are their own thing. Each one is based on a historic Tudor
Thought provoking video. People seem to forget that Tudor is Rolex. I’d be interested to know how many people eventually move from Tudor to Rolex, I’m sure it’s a lot. Trust me Rolex knows that. In my opinion Rolex doesn’t want Tudor to be as high end a brand, on the same level as Rolex. I think it’s Raison D’etre is twofold. 1. For those who can’t afford a Rolex and will actually stay with their Tudor and 2. To be a stepping stone to Rolex. For the collector I think both reasons are valid. Personally I really like a couple of the Tudor lines, blue pelagos with date, is a favorite for sure and if I ever got one I could see myself keeping it even if I managed to get a Rolex at some point.
Thanks for sharing your experience, thoughts and analysis. Also a big thanks for watching the video and supporting the channel. You’re right and I agree that the Tudor brand is strategically positioned to always be the step down brand from Rolex, which is why a lot of their designs do mirror and are also many times homages of Rolex designs. You can’t separate both companies as they are so similar and Tudor is and always will be a stepping brand to lead people to eventually want Rolexes. I don’t think that will change anytime soon. I do wish that Tudor will explore a lot of their other heritage designs, and not just focus on the ‘Black Bay’. Here’s to hoping! 😀
@@twosecondswatch yes I’d like to see the brand expand its models for sure, but I feel any new models will still be vaguely related to existing Rolex models. It would need a direction change from the Rolex owners to decide if they want Tudor to have its own identity. Rolex owners move very slowly. Bottom line if they feel their income will increase they may consider it. At the moment i guess they feel Tudor feeds Rolex
As an owner of Tudor, Rolex, Omega, and IWC watches, I can only recommend that you buy what YOU like. No, Tudor "is not Rolex", just as Rolex is not Patek. Tudor IS a solid, well-built, tool-oriented swiss watch. As for resale- if your love of wrist watches is outweighed by your desire to recoup your money upon resale, I would not get into watches.
I remember when Mercedes dropped its model names and started using a letter + a number designation, like E300, to get people to use "Mercedes". I wonder if Tudor will do the same rather then have people always use "Black Bay"?
the reason i bought a tudor is because i want a tudor and it costs about 50% less than a rolex which i think has better value and you dont confuse a tudor with a rolex...if you want a rolex simply buy a rolex....very simple...by the way, rolex is also a mass produced brand...
The reasoning is from a distorted point of view. The submariner and the black bay are different. (polishing, dial, material, indexes, size, bezel, mvmt, texture, size, typo etc..). A submariner is a beautiful watch historically but not since circa 16 years. It is very show off, not elegant and discret. You know men are very pragmatic. Is a rolex pragmatic? not anymore, it is very problematic. It is socially problematic, you look arrogant. It is not safe to wear one in many, many places. In summary, Rolex watches WERE good, reliable and masculine watches. Nowadays Rolex watches are nice objects to be kept in a box as asset but they are not watches anymore. The tudor black bay is just what people want and appreciated with rolex but also other brands in the past. Simple, well-made, reliable and nice looking watches. And I don't talk about the prices that's irrelevant, both brands are expensive. I am swiss and nobody I know wears a modern Rolex. Most models are just gaudy.
Not true. Brands don't need to have tons of models to be successful or even desirable. Rolex have very simple catalogue for all these years and it's still the biggest watch brand in the world. In non watch world, you can see examples like Apple and Tesla, which keeps very simple product line up but focus more on quality and timeless design theme. Many other examples I don't want to list all but you get the point.
Thanks for sharing your point of view! Rolex still does have different lines, though most of them are based on the Oyster case design. They are trying though, with their launch of the 1908 line. Apple Watch on the other hand doesn’t need to have any lines - they just pull you into the ecosystem. In this case you’ll want to buy iPhones, iPads, MacBooks… etc. Tesla car models do have different lines withe Model X, S, 3, Y and they are expanding to their solar powerwall technologies. I do think for watch brands it’s a little different than tech companies.
Historically Tudor strong points have always been dive watches for the Military and Professional diver. I thanks divers will always be a strong genre for the brand.
I have a Rolex and now I'm waiting for the black and burgundy Black Bay 58 GMT to arrive to buy it, I don't know why so much controversy? Excellent model, excellent brand! 😎✌️
Buy what you like is always gonna be my go to answer. I buy tudor, oris, omega, gs, and if one day, any rolex catches my eye, I'll buy one too, probably ever rose day date brown dial.
Tudor have also been updating greatly their models with on the fly micro adjustment bracelets and now with master chronometre certificate movements a lot of people are trying to sell older models to get the new ones.
except for the stupid rol/ap/pp bubble...why the hell a watch should be sold avove its retail price? in the past decades it was quite common to obtain a discount of 5/15% on every brand for a brend new watch, except fpr ltd releases or special editions...
I just bought 2 watches last month. One was a rolex that i paid 41K yes 41 thousand dollars for the full gold sub 2024 blue dial. The other was a TUDOR reverse panda.Tudor is not a poor mans watch. Most people in the world cant even buy the tudor.Maybe rolex is an over priced tudor just saying.
I own 4 times the amount of Rolex than Tudor. Rolex are for collection Tudor to wear and enjoy. I love the brand, though criticise the inflatetd use of the name Black Bay as well. Why not calling the BB 58 just 58, the BB Professional just Professional, the BB GMT, just heritage GMT, or classic GMT or mid-century GMT or.... just not BB 58 GMT.... I also believe this naming greatly damaged the brand.
That’s a pretty good point. And maybe not have the hands and case style too similar to the black bay line. I mean they are oyster cases design anyway, and perhaps it’s ok for tudor to use that as it makes sense.
Let them tank. Used watches should be worth less than new ones. We've been made to believe that watches should be investments, that resell values have always been huge. I really hope the market crashes and everyone will be able to buy the watches they want.
I have two Omega watches (Aqua Terra, Speedy Sapphire) and one Rolex Oyster Perpetual 36 and wearing right now my BlackBay 54. Honestly, after acquiring my Oyster and 54 I’m saturated with watches from both of these brands. Love them both don’t get me wrong, but I don’t really feel the need to get anymore from them. Love my Aqua Terra and Speedy and Omega as a brand way more. I was thinking about putting my name down on the list for a GMT2, but it is just too much money and the waiting list turns me off. Even if you are happy to get one at retail you can’t really enjoy the watch, because you always have to think about where you travel with it and your safety so in the end you gonna wear something more discrete like the Oyster. For me it’s the quintessential Rolex anyway. It took me 2.5 years to get a simple Oyster. Insane!
Omg! You just kicked a lot of soared arses with this video 🤣🤣 Thanks for telling the truth no matter what. It is what it is, kids. And if you can’t stand the truth: Deal with it! 😅
Actually in many ADs the Black Bay 58 is available for sale. Some of them will tell you there is a list, but just leave your details and they will probably call you right after. 😉 I don’t see why they would give you a discount if there’s stock
Marketing is indeed a genuine field. However, it is important to note that Rolex and Omega may not be considered true tool watches in 2024. On the other hand, G-Shock stands out as a genuine tool watch in 2024
I bought m 17:40 y BB58 about 4 months ago and i already want to get the new BB58 Coke GMT. I think Tudor is awesome. Great " tough guys " tool watches for the outdoors... It's what Rolex used to be. I wear them for my outdoor adventures daily. Also i don't buy watches to sell them. When i get bored with watches i gave it to my other family members lol. Tudor is a brand that listens to their fan base. Ppl wanting rolex coke GMT and rolex released it on Tudor. They are fairly priced. You can get METAS for half of the price of Omega. Give it 10 years Tudor will surpass Omega. Because Tudor generally a young brand ( since the rebranding) I understand it's hard to get Rolex at the AD. But that's what the grey market for. Buy a piece of Rolex and done. No Rolex AD mind games .
Thanks for sharing and glad you’re enjoying your tudor black bay 58. It’s great that tudor is listening to its fan base and of course metas certification is something great they are embarking on. Thank you for watching the video and your support! 🙏
I buy Tudor because I think they are great. Period. I don’t buy them for ROLEX reasons. And if you want a comparison, I think they are better than ROLEX
How much is Longines paying you! The Black Bay line is the anchor of the Tudor line. We have choices in the watch world. Tudor has its own distinct style and look. I have no interest in a Rolex. Tudor aren’t playing games. Their popularity makes it difficult to buy a new launch. Nothing “fake” about it.
Thanks 🙏 for your wonderful support! Will keep creating content you like to see in the future. Do let me know if there are any other topics you’d like us you explore or touch on, we are all ears 👂!
Availability or the lack of it is annoying consumers. The ADs for Tudor are the same as the Rolex dealers and often the same guy at the AD controls both brands. That guy is connected to flippers so ordinary consumers are poorly treated. Word gets out and consumers go to other stores.
I share your views about Tudor. Thanks for getting it out from my system! 😄I am a fan of The Urban Gentry too. Imo, the following formula pretty captues Rolex's cunning Tudor strategy to prey on innocent lollipop suckers: Tudor watches infused by Rolex's design DNA + loads of social media hype + perceived scarcity at the AD.
I had 2 Tudors. Black Bay 41 and 41 heritage blue bezel. The quality was amazing. But to be honest I just realized the design was too plain for my taste and if I was to buy a boring watch there would have to be a reason. So if historically the Explorer is boring well, that’s the nature of the beast but getting a copy of a boring watch was too much. Got an iwc and a breitling since
You’re the only person that thinks Tudors watches and wonders were lack luster. Lmao. Btw, Nothing is tanking. The prices are normalizing on the secondary market.
Not really, there are some watch TH-camrs who agree with this opinion, just not your regular TH-cam channels who are sponsored and afraid of speaking the truth due to their collaborations with watch brands. 😀
@@twosecondswatch I haven’t seen one notable TH-camr say it yet. And what’s a “watch youtuber?” Is that an authority? Mostly clout chasers. Not real watch collectors. Lmao.
Hi All, I have noticed a lot of hate and also alot of unfounded attacks on me and my channel for my opinion of this video. It is clear that many who do so have not actually watch the ENTIRETY of the video. I stand by this video and my analysis and opinions are made based on sound information which I provide the links to them as well. The massive price correction figures of the Tudor watches are from Watchcharts and Chrono24. I am not creating a video out of spite and spreading misinformation on purpose to get views - the truth is that the brand has become one dimensional due to the success of the Black Bay line. To the haters, do watch the entire video and try to understand objectively that this video is meant to address the issue on Tudor prices massive crash on the secondary market. If you disagree, it's fine... just enjoy the video! Let's keep ourselves civil here. :)
I think the problem with your viewpoint is that it's founded on a very anomalous period where watch values spiked in a crazy manner for a very, very, very short period of time. Many watches and brands felt this bump and therefore they're most susceptible to a return to reality. And in reality, for decades and decades, you would always lose at least 50% of your value on any watch you purchased. There were only merely a handful of models from a couple of brands where you might not lose value in the medium/long term. So I think there is not a lot of value in super close analysis of the current market as it recovers from the most anomalous market dynamic since the quartz crisis and eventually settles into normal. Nor does it really mean Tudor has a problem per se. The whole industry is facing some issues now
Great way to tell if your opinion is wrong.
Can't get hurt whenever your opinion is expressed and someone disagrees. Don't purchase a Porsche 911 and complain of poor off-roading capabilities. I sold a rolex and bought a Tudor. It's a personal taste. Markets adjust as needed, self induced at times. Can't fault a company for not messing with their moneymakers.....Ask Coke about "new coke"
You don’t buy Tudor for resale. You buy a Tudor to get what Rolex used to be.
You buy resale Tudor to save money
There's the 5 digit Rolex if you want what Rolex used to be. That were made into the mid 2000s
movements of those models were not metas.
@@lonewolfemcquade8133
I have a five digit that I bought in 05. Serviced twice since then and working perfectly. I also have a 6538 but that is one ai don’t wear. It was handed down to me. I wanted something in that style and the closest thing to it is the BB58 which I own. I even tried a 54 but that wears nothing like the 6538 and is much smaller in thickness and length. Tudor is an amazing brand!
@@saksakorn1
They don’t have to be metas as those movements are the same as the 4 liners. They are just as accurate and don’t let anyone fool you either. The 3130 is a work horse and the real deal whether in a 2 liner or 4 liner.
I sold my black bay 58 to….buy another black bay 54 😂. Tudor is awesome! I wear it more than my rolexes
I have the bb54 with rubber strap also. I am very happy with it and like it as a more sporty yet classy addition to my datejusts. Have a good time with your 54. 👍
Another BB54 owner here. It is the only model in Tudor that has interested me. The proportions and design is just spot on. YMMV.
Thats is the most stupid thing I have heard, people buy Tudor but really want Rolex. 😆. I own 3 Tudor watches not even thinking about a Rolex.
It's just some guy with a few subs and no idea what he's talking about..
Not time first time I’ve heard this said about Tudor
There are many people who are moved to buy Tudors because they actually wanted Rolex because they aren’t able to get one at retail. This is common practice by Authorised Dealers to push potential customers to Tudors. This has always been the Rolex/Tudor strategy in the market. There are many, many out there who have buyers regret after getting a tudor black bay. Of course there are people like yourself who buy Tudor for what you like about your watches. Since you’re in that camp, congratulations 🥳.
I have a few Rolexes and I have a Tudor. The Tudor has a terrific in house movement. The cases are solid. People sell all sorts of watches. The grey market has millions of watches.
@@twosecondswatchMy authorized dealer never pushed to buy anything. I own a ‘41 Wimbledon and 5 Tudors… I think influencers or ppl in general gotta have a reason or comment on others ppl choices. It’s ridiculous and pretentious, you gotta buy the best of the best or your poor. This video is crazy; so, let me state a fact: if it’s not the crown(Rolex) you going lose money or value period. The reason the black bay line is pushed because it’s a tool/sport watch that covers all parameters without the price. Most ppl aren’t walking around with a $3-5000 watch on, period facts.
You buy a Tudor because you love Tudor. Tudor is allowed to create new models, Rolex can't. Tudor's quality now is as good as Rolex. You buy a Rolex for social status. You buy a Tudor because you don't need to reassure yourself about your social status. Take a look at the Pelagos LHD. It is what a Submariner should have evolved if Rolex was not stuck with its reputation.
I currently have 2 Rolex and 3 Tudor, among others, in my collection of 18 watches. I bought the Tudors because i liked them. Its utter bollocks that they are poor mans Rolex or you buy them in place of a Rolex. All my watches fill a niche. I do not consider them an investment. I never plan to sell any.
I'm right behind you w/10 & counting. I did want a Daytona but got a Tudor Panda & it really changed me. Someday I want a Picachu Daytona ,until then I love my Panda.
I owned few tudor such as bronze, chrono, gmt and they are bought from preown dealers which gives great value for the built and quality. Watches are for collecting and hobby... Not really for investment or appreciating assets. Buy it because you like it and not for investing.
Thanks for sharing! Totally agree. Do you still own those tudor watches or have you sold them and moved on?
100% watches are not an investment.
For personal reasons, I don't buy used. But I understand why people do. I also never sell, so the watches I pick up are carefully selected and not purchased on a whim.
Best time to be in this hobby IMHO!
Had a 41mm BB Nero smiley face short production run for a while. Sold it without regret. Tudor is one of the most boring watch out there..at least to me
100% :)
If you should ever fall on hard times if you need to sell you could.
You asked for people that had sold their Black Bays to comment, just commenting to say I've kept mine. Own both a 54 and 58, tempted by a 41 at some point. I like the more simple lines of Tudor and Rolex, I like that the movements will likely be servicable for my lifetime. I like that they're under the radar, not too flashy, no painful product placement. I think they know their audience and they're getting it right. I don't aspire to a Rolex, even the stigma attached to the brand name, it's not me.
Another way to look at the metrics. Over here a second hand Black Bay 58 still sells for 70% of retail on Chrono24, Seamasters or Longines Spirits make 60%. A Black Bay 54 still gets about 85%, but that's newer, it'll follow the same trend as the market saturates, it doesn't mean it's failed.
A little too much generalization here. Not EVERYBODY who purchased a Tudor did so as an alternative to a Rolex. Many collectors actually prefer the Tudor.
Well the reality is both are the same company, Tudor is wholly owned by Rolex, so I guess whether someone purchase a Rolex or Tudor it’s the same for them.
@@twosecondswatch Very different design language and ethos between the companies and there has been for 70 years. Do you assume people buying a Hydroconquest or Diver 65 really wanted a Seamaster, because the parent company is the same?
This really resonates with me i recently went into a Tudor Boutique to view a BB 41 Monochrome. The sales guy was very difficult, wanting my personal details to check my purchase history etc. Ive no time for being messed around when i was prepared to spend 4k on a watch. I walked out.
No bad comments from me, as people like myself, purchase a watch because we like it, and don't care if it's Brand stock is decreasing or increasing
Reason why I own Tudor only now is no one says they are reps. Every time I wore my GMT master 2 I would get people asking if it’s rep or something stupid. But with my pelagos never had an issues. Also whenever I wore my Rolex people treated me differently. Tudor for the win
You are very wrong. I got 3 Rolex and 3 Tudor. The reason I bought Tudor is because I really love the watch. Not only me, many of my friends bought Tudor because they like it. In fact I am going for BB58 GMT for my next watch instead of adding another Rolex into my collection.
I didn’t say everyone. I said many people. It is actually true that Tudor watches are specifically designed to be homages to Rolex designs. They oyster case. The black bay 58. The 54. They all reference ROLEX history of the big crown and subs. Heck even Tudor used to call their watches the Tudor Submariner in the 90s!
@@twosecondswatchyou did, you said 'people dont buy because they love the black bay, people buy because they love the submariner' which is just wrong and prevents people like me from respecting your view or channel
@@twosecondswatch I agree with alvin above i sold a buisness for 27 million dollars. I also bought Tudor and rolex. So to me a collection is just that. Not just one brand.Both Tudor and Rolex great watches I LIKE. Your wrong and i didnt need to watch the whole video.
I have a classic 1926 Tudor which I love and wear it constantly. Everything you're saying is your opinion and everyone is entitled to it. But I totally disagree with your reasoning.
The price and marked you talk about is pretty accurate for Omega as well. Yes you can get almost every watch at any time, but the prices just keeps getting higher. A Seamaster is a «bad» deal today compared 2 years ago. I bought my Seamaster 300 for 6600 USD in 2022, now its 8500 (if my conversion rates are correct).
Thanks for sharing. Yes it’s an industry issue of watch companies raising their prices. I’ll do an omega video soon in the future. 😀
You are so spot on. Tudor Hype is over. The young buyers are making enough to move on to the real thing. The hype had me looking towards Tudor, but couldn’t help to see a HOMAGE. Nothing original nor any real history besides being a copy. Guess that is what it was always meant to be. That is not a secret.
this is stupid. Tudor is absolutely 100% original.
I'd rather have two Tudors than one Daytona,actually if you could find one it'd be more like four or five Tudors.
If you can get a Rolex for real price? Why not. But can you?😅
Some of what you say is certainly true for Tudor and for some Tudor buyers. And equally important, strong opinions in your vids means that the comments section comes alive, which drives the YT algorithm to more viewers. Chapeau. Happy to subscribe.
🥰 Thanks for your support!
Please keep up this kind of content because I can pick up a great timepiece with a great history at a great value! Thanks!!!!
Who cares about the resell market, especially with a brand like Tudor? They're supposed to be readily available with not much demand compared to their sister brand Rolex. And it's great that they're even going for below retail in the secondary market but we shouldn't value a brand because of their grey market value.
Which is funny cause they are not that readily available
I have my BB58 blue and I am vert happy with it
lol..Rolex,Tudor and the like are just pretty normal tool watches (albeit expensive!) . My G shock is my tool watch. I own Longines, Omega and Tudor. All ace. But my grail is a Patek. Maybe one day😊 . Don’t worry about the hate comments. It will always happenAt the end of the day, they are all just watches. But we all love them. Good vid 👍
Thanks for the encouragement and the support!
I could be one in a million who loves the quirkiness of old Tudor catalog, i loved the Pelagos and bought it , then suddenly i found a brand that is all about one model and from there onwards i stopped being excited , coming back to the old Tudor catalog each model was its own now that isn't the case .
I have a 41mm Black Bay diver with the blue bezel and love it. It's my favorite watch and I have two Omegas (300m and P.O. 43.5mm). I wear my Black Bay on a 22mm Long Island Watch brand FKM rubber strap in black. The accuracy is almost perfect.
"Tudor milks the Black Bay line". Completely true, just look at their offer, they should rebrand Pelagos and just call the company Black Bay. After they dumped the Heritage Advisor I lost interest in Tudor, in spite of their cool Black Bay GMT..
I stand with you 1000%!!! Your words and opinions are needed by our community. I can only speak for myself but I fell for the whole TudorPooter hype and bought a BB 2 tone. Kept it for a year and finally it became the first watch I ever sold/traded in. I used the money to buy my wife a diamond bracelet. Then I bought her a DJ mint dial. Established myself and created a trusting relationship with a wonderful AD( who doesn’t even sell Rolex in her location currently but can get them from the main location). I played the game… And I’m glad I did because now I’m waiting on the phone call for my two tone SeaDweller. I have a friend and AD. Is Tudor well-made…yes… is Tutor a great entry-level watch… Absolutely! I just moved on🤷. I respect your stance and I’m with you!👊👊👊👊👊
Thank you very much for the kind words and encouragement. After creating this video, I have been receiving quite some hate, and even personal insults (It’s kinda shocking 😮). This encourages us to make more critical videos that’s not just what brands want us to make… it’s good you got a great AD, and one that respects and treats you well. Do stay subscribe and I’ll be creating more videos like these in the future. Thanks again and hope you get your two tone sea dweller soon. It’s a great watch indeed, been loving two tones lately, I think it’s the up and coming trend perhaps? 🤔
I agree with alvin above i sold a buisness for 27 million dollars. I also bought Tudor and rolex. So to me a collection is just that. Not just one brand.Both Tudor and Rolex great watches I LIKE. Your wrong and i didnt need to watch the whole video.
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@alvinkwok5233
3 months ago
You are very wrong. I got 3 Rolex and 3 Tudor. The reason I bought Tudor is because I really love the watch. Not only me, many of my friends bought Tudor because they like it. In fact I am going for BB58 GMT for my next watch instead of adding another Rolex into my collection.
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It soundss like you can ONLY buy a few watches
@@greenrush4313 Your grammar and spelling are horrible…Guess you showed us what money can’t buy.
This is just an opinion. People who buy TUDOR appreciate wearing these watches. People who buy ROLEX wear these watches to be appreciated
That should be their logo but they're affiliated..
You are on point. I have the Pelagos 500m, and the 43 gray Bronze currently in the collection, the Pelagos because it's really light and has a beautiful design, and the bronze is a beautiful casual watch to wear. Tudor is a beautiful brand but definitely not for investment, you just buy and enjoy it for what it is.
Like they say, there are two kinds of people, investors OR collectors
I think everyone will have their own opinion on the brand and you have yours which is fine. For me with a circa £4,000 budget i was looking at breitling, Longines and Tudor. Initially i was set on getting a Breitling Super ocean 44 ( latest model) but after walking around the watch shop the tudor black bay burgundy caught my eye, after trying it on i realised it wore much nicer than the breitling and was cheaper at £3,800. It also looked a lot less flashy like an every day watch. After watching reviews on the latest Metas certification alongside the improvements from the previous model I found myself wanting this tudor watch. For most people Rolexs are out of reach or too much of a financial commitment. We are in a recession so spending £10,000 plus on a watch wouldnt make sense for most people. Value for money the Tudor is an excellent watch. I would also add if the quality of build on the Tudor is that good do you really need a Rolex? For me Rolexs have always been a statement brand - I just want a watch thats high quality and looks great. Nothing more nothing less 👌
I agree with the core concepts of the video. I own a 2024 Rolex submariner and I am highly considering a used Tudor Pelagos, nothing in Rolex’s catalog similar to that watch.
I sold my black bay s&g chrono a year ago, because I just felt like gold wasn't for me after wearing it off and on. I just traded a speedmaster for a reverse panda and I'm back to Tudor again.
Thanks for sharing. Enjoy the watch journey! Do check out our website for all your watch needs. 😀
I am a tool watch guy and like Tudor. All your video did, for me, was to convince me to buy a Tudor on the secondary market.
@luvwatchesusa8333 Great! You can get them at great discounts right now, and due to the drop in demand you can get almost all the models at a significant discount. We also have one for sale on our website, link in the description!
I adore my BB Bronze on a Tudor leather strap. 3 weeks ago, I bought a BB 41 Monochrome. For me, perfect. I won't own a Rolex too much flash.
I bought a BB58 because I didn't really care for the Rolex Sub or Seamaster but I agree the BB is huge in their push I like their dress watches and the Ranger but they haven't putt the effort into them that they have in the BB
Tudor is doing everything right at the moment. I rarely wear my Datejust and the BlackBay 54 almost every day. Omega in particular is cranking out thousands of Speedmasters ad nauseam. They are far too expensive for the fact that they flood the market. On the other hand, Tudor has moderate prices and also offers METAS works.
Thanks for sharing. Agree they are doing well, just want them to be more creative with their designs. Come up with something new that’s NOT a Black Bay
I think Tudors by design are a more accessible brand with a lower price point to compete with the likes of Longines, but below Omega or Breitling. I own a Rolex Sub, an Explorer 36mm, and BB58. I think they can all happily coexist. I really do love my BB58.
I agree with you on all the points you mentioned. I like both Rolex and Tudor but both are entirely way overpriced compared to many other Swiss brands. Rolex and Tudor know this and have been milking the market for big easy profits for years. Now the hype has passed and big prices are turning collectors to other Swiss and German brands that are still high quality but more reasonably priced. I also believe that the microbrand market are producing models that have an excellence about them for a fraction of the price.
Now that the hype is over, I wonder how they will adapt?
I have huge rolex and tudor collection but i love tudor more than rolex and started to sell my rolexes. Tudor is so tasteful watch to wear
I do agree about how Tudor did accidentally attract the wrong buyers (meaning those that actually wanted, but couldn't get a Rolex), but if you walk into any grey market dealer's store, the sheer amount of Rolexes sitting there is off-putting. Yes, many have moved on from Tudor, but many have also moved on from Rolex. That's just the nature of things. I recently picked up my BB58 in blue, not because I can't afford others, but because I genuinely love the BB58 design.
And in a way, I do understand that Tudor is kind of stuck with this hero product that they've created. Very much like AP and Patek. Even if Tudor markets those other watches, they just don't have the same demand or brand cache to get picked up by the masses like an Omega Constellation or a Longines Heritage would.
As a watch, the Black Bay design template just works. However, as a brand, Tudor has a long way to go to make it as aspirational as Omega. Perhaps that's why they're coming out with gold Black Bays now 😆
Great video and analysis by the way! 👌
Hey @watcheswithabdullah thanks for your awesome input. As a fellow enthusiast I’m hoping they can also focus on some of their other lines - something unique and not just call everything a black bay. I have nothing against the black bay 58 and original 41s as well, they were great watches and still are. It’s just that the new variations are kinda tiring. Maybe a new prince date chronograph would be great, perhaps 2025? 🤔
@@twosecondswatch Totally agree! I'm tired of everything being called Black Bay. But from a marketing perspective, I feel like they know that both the watch media and enthusiasts will eat up anything that has 'BB' in its name.
And there is the problem exactly… 😇
to be honest i like tudor more then rolex, and personally i like how tudors look, i love the 58, 54, pelagos, pink chrono, gmt s&g and gmt 58
the only bad thing you could say is that they all have the same name as you say its all blackbay, tbh i never thought about it and ye maybe its a bad/weird thing,
and i think of all the watch brands, theres only a few where the watch price is close or higher then retail, the most are under retail, most people know this and thats why buying grey is not bad
also, i buy watch to collect and to wear it...not to sell it...
Who upset this guy?
Tudor
Why?
You can watch the whole video on my opinions…
Not settling with my Black Bay. It's an upgrade to my Seiko SBDC101.
Tudor makes great, robust watches which can work accurately for decades. Buy pre owned and never worry about depreciation.
Great advice
I dont think people who buy tudor BB are buying it as a Rolex Sub alternative, although it could be one. But if that's the case, then there's a lot of other brands and lines to mention. If you pay really close attention to details of these watches, you ll know what i mean. They're 2 different watches.
Its either some people are just being more reasonable, or just have different taste. If i have Rolex, i'd still get a Tudor BB monochrome. The quality is on par with the sub for one third of the price. People who think that they cannot co- exist on theyre collections are not watch enthusiasts.
Completely disagree about people buying Black Bay to scratch a Submariner itch. I bought my Black Bay 54 after a long research into what I would spend a lot of money on. On the day of purchase I tried on numerous Rolexes (and a couple of others I may be interested in) but this Black Bay 54 was perfect for me. I’m very much into buying one watch and not collecting and very much enjoying my watch, and this 54 does absolutely everything I could ask for for a watch 🙂
Thanks for sharing!
Absolutely. They are two very different watches.
I wonder if have a choice between and Sub and 54 for the same price which one will you end up buying?
@@Saints-Forever Definitely a 54, all day long. In fact I tried on the modern Sub and an Explorer and was completely unimpressed by them in person!
I'm still wearing my 54 daily after about 9 months ownership and it's gotten many compliments and conversations started😁
Isn’t it estimated that Rolex produces around 1.2 million watches per year, while Tudor produces around 250,000 watches per year? About a million less per year than Rolex. With this fact alone, doesn’t it stand to reason that Rolex does the “fake waitlist” thing to a much larger extent than Tudor?
Also kinda makes you feel like owning a Tudor is much more exclusive than owning a Rolex for the same reason. There are literally 5x as many Rolex watches floating around each year than Tudors. But yet people think Rolex is more exclusive? This almost sounds a bit “gaslighty” to me.
😂
@@twosecondswatch 🤷🏻♂️
Ridiculous! I had several Rolexes before I owned a few Tudors. I bought the Tudors because I liked them! I liked the styling! I’m not planning on selling ANY of my watches. And very few will hold their value. Only the PP, VC, and an occasional Rolex will hold their value. None of the Omegas. None of the Tudors. None of the TAGS, Zeniths, APs, IWCs, or Breitlings…hold their value. Now, surprisingly enough, some Cartiers are in favor! Who gives a shit? Buy what you want. Wear what you want.
Ok just my opinion I would like to get discount on tudor but not lists. This is because omega you can a small discount than it's too cose between tudor or omega and I would buy omega
Agree 100% step up to omega for just a little more far superior watch imo...traded my monochrome for SMP sooooo much happier
To test out this theory, we just need to ask a simple question. If the Rolex watches (all the models) are just $100 (edited from $10 to make it more interesting😂) higher than their Tudor counterparts and all are readily available in store, which brand will you go for? I will be very surprise not to see majority choose the crown period.
🥸
Lol. I still have the Tudors I bought from day one. While I went on to buy Rolex and other brands, I never sold any of my Tudors. I believe in buying watches you like, not cos others told you to do so. And you're right, Tudor isn't a Rolex. Cos it's a Tudor. :)
I agree with everything you said, enough of the BB line, that being said, the pelagos is the line I want, I didn't buy it to feel I have a Rolex I bought it to have a good looking, nice beater watch.
Good video sir.
Just owned pelagos 39 last month, loving it 😉😂
The entire market will continue to tank. To include Rolex. It's crazy that people think that the last 4 years was the norm. 🤣
Great time to pick up Tudor watches in the pre-owned market!
You mentioned theres so many versions ob BB, and yet praising Omega. Its funny cause, nobody milk it the way more than the Omegas does. Look at their their speedmaster. Its over marketeting to the point where its being canivalized. There's hundreds of versions 😅. I think my favorite one is the moonswatch. 😅
This must be the most overrated brand. Very good watches in terms of quality, but no originality in the current lineup - just Rolex inspired watches. And priced too high.
Not to mention the lack of innovation and remarkable historic milestones in their back-catalogue. It simply does not deserve the level of hype it gets.
I’m in the market for a luxury watch to commemorate a milestone birthday. I plan to wear it often. I don’t plan to sell it. This video held my interest for roughly 30 seconds.
^^this. I’m completely like you who see the market value as being pointless discussion instead of actually enjoying buying yourself a wonderful watch, and enjoying wearing it for decades thereafter
Omega or Grand Seiko
IF we are talking about a new collector . they may think a Tudor will scratch the itch of a rolex ..and it might for a period of time ..then you see and feel the same way way about the Tudor as you feel about the timex ..rolex isnt stupid ..ok lets give them something that makes them feel like they are part of the family ..when in reality its a homage of a sub from the same manufacturer ..so they get you to buy the homage and after you get sick of it and wanna step up to the plate and play with the big boys ..then you take the Tudor get nowhere near close to retail in trade and then put up another 7k to ultimately get the same watch you wanted and should have gotten in the first place.so rolex just got.you to spend 10k instead of 7k . the tudor line is just a cheaper alternative to a rolex ..from.rolex. Its. Genius. Now the old school collector ..that remembers what rolex was even 20 years ago let alone 40 ..so we may go with the Tudor because we understand value ..your not getting a better watch because it has a different logo. Same as any other retailers do .give you a less desired item.for a. Lesser price thats made in the same place by the same people with the same tools quality control. Etc.
No way I'm paying $4-$5 k on a 80s day .. Or even a no date op.or explorer ..when I can buy a date day oyster prince at under 2k...but now.we are.talking vintage ..i hate how this watch shit has sucked me in ..i remember having a g shock a bullova and a timex indiglow ..and was happy ..now close to 20 ish pieces and a bunch of watches I dont wear or even like anymore ..i need a new 3 watch collection ..and climb out of the rabbit hole... Longiness Seiko alpinest and a vintage rolex 😊& a beater or 2 maybe 3 ..fuq here we go again.😂
We are all sucked in… 😜
I cringe whenever someone calls a $3k+ watch "cheap" or refers to the components as cheap. To me, the word refers to something of low quality, which is not a Tudor.
You’re so right. Even when people say that they’ve bought Tudor without thinking of Rolex; that’s BS. Tudor designs ARE Rolex ripoffs. And that’s fine, it’s baked into the brand. They’re informed by being the cheaper alternative to Rolex. No shame! It’s what Hans Wilsdorf intended.
But don’t tell me that Tudor has nothing to do with Rolex for you. If you want a BB you really want a Submariner.
Exactly what I was trying to convey - Tudor is supposed to be Rolex for the masses and at a more affordable pricing. It’s in their DNA. Heck even the founder said so himself…
I disagree. The BB58 for example is its own thing and is different enough from a modern Submariner to offer something unique in a collection. Seriously look and wear a BB58 black is a completely different experience from a Rolex Submariner. If you really want to equate the two than either you’ve never owned both to compare or you have an axe to grind and are being insincere.
@@michaelriera6277 Please don’t straw man my opinion and put insincere words in my mouth.
I’ve owned the BB58 hoping to scratch a vintage sub itch, and experience what modern Tudor is about. I sold it within a year. Just didn’t do it for me. Bought a 5513 instead. I
Tudor’s very mission statement, from the founder himself, was to be a cheaper alternative to Rolex. In the early days they were identical save for the dial and movement!
Tudor literally ARE a cheap Rolex. You can’t tell me that “they’re their own thing” when it’s what they were made to be! It shouldn’t stop you, or anyone else, from enjoying them though. They’re great watches.
So what is the argument? By design the Hans Wildforf foundation has Rolex as the aspirational brand and Tudor as the more accessible. When we say more accessible we are saying less expensive and hopefully better product access. My point is if you look at w watch like my BB58, it is unquestionably unique as there is nothing in the current Rolex catalog that either looks or wears like the 58 and so it is possible to have within a collection of Rolex and Tudor as well. I own an Explorer 36mm, a Sub date and I can tell you my BB58 is unique enough to complement a collection. Also the comments about Tudor being a “poor man’s” Rolex. Well I’m sure most poor people would not spend $4k on a luxury item. Yes Tudor by design serves a different market more in line with Longines, under Omega/Breitling and I still don’t see the issue with this.
@@michaelriera6277 Yeah but hang on; you've kinda gone all over the place with your arguments there champ.
The BB58 is not "unquestionably unique" for one thing. You should never frame an argument in those terms, because you're demonstrating bad faith immediately. If I can't question it, then you're declaring yourself the arbiter of right and wrong. I reject that.
It's not unique because it's homaging an older Tudor Submariner reference, based on a Rolex. Not one of Tudor's current line up (of sports watches at least) are their own thing. Each one is based on a historic Tudor
Everyone has a right to their opinion but damn, you really dropped the ball on this one.
Thought provoking video. People seem to forget that Tudor is Rolex. I’d be interested to know how many people eventually move from Tudor to Rolex, I’m sure it’s a lot. Trust me Rolex knows that.
In my opinion Rolex doesn’t want Tudor to be as high end a brand, on the same level as Rolex. I think it’s Raison D’etre is twofold. 1. For those who can’t afford a Rolex and will actually stay with their Tudor and 2. To be a stepping stone to Rolex.
For the collector I think both reasons are valid. Personally I really like a couple of the Tudor lines, blue pelagos with date, is a favorite for sure and if I ever got one I could see myself keeping it even if I managed to get a Rolex at some point.
Thanks for sharing your experience, thoughts and analysis. Also a big thanks for watching the video and supporting the channel.
You’re right and I agree that the Tudor brand is strategically positioned to always be the step down brand from Rolex, which is why a lot of their designs do mirror and are also many times homages of Rolex designs. You can’t separate both companies as they are so similar and Tudor is and always will be a stepping brand to lead people to eventually want Rolexes. I don’t think that will change anytime soon.
I do wish that Tudor will explore a lot of their other heritage designs, and not just focus on the ‘Black Bay’. Here’s to hoping! 😀
@@twosecondswatch yes I’d like to see the brand expand its models for sure, but I feel any new models will still be vaguely related to existing Rolex models. It would need a direction change from the Rolex owners to decide if they want Tudor to have its own identity.
Rolex owners move very slowly. Bottom line if they feel their income will increase they may consider it. At the moment i guess they feel Tudor feeds Rolex
The prices are falling because you can literally walk into any AD and walk out with virtually any Tudor model the exact same day.
That is quite true now, the hype and demand on the black Bay series is now gone… time to get a discount!
As an owner of Tudor, Rolex, Omega, and IWC watches, I can only recommend that you buy what YOU like. No, Tudor "is not Rolex", just as Rolex is not Patek. Tudor IS a solid, well-built, tool-oriented swiss watch. As for resale- if your love of wrist watches is outweighed by your desire to recoup your money upon resale, I would not get into watches.
Thanks for sharing. Great advice indeed. 😀
Dont know if you've noticed but the watch market as a whole has tanked.
I remember when Mercedes dropped its model names and started using a letter + a number designation, like E300, to get people to use "Mercedes". I wonder if Tudor will do the same rather then have people always use "Black Bay"?
That’s an interesting point… has there been any other watch brands doing that?
Lost me at TGV doesn’t criticize watch brands.
the reason i bought a tudor is because i want a tudor and it costs about 50% less than a rolex which i think has better value and you dont confuse a tudor with a rolex...if you want a rolex simply buy a rolex....very simple...by the way, rolex is also a mass produced brand...
I bought my Black Bay 39 S&G and sold it. It wasn’t a Date just. It was a bloody Tudor got sick of explaining to people so bought a Rolex
I have 4 rolex, but wear my Tudor more. Chunky, heavy, good quality. Like a real man's rolex.
I wear my bb58 every day. I love it.
Saying Tudor milking Black Bay and praising Omega is absurd. Omega is the milking king.
I believe all companies want to do so. But the issue is Tudor only has black bay. And… not much else.
The reasoning is from a distorted point of view. The submariner and the black bay are different. (polishing, dial, material, indexes, size, bezel, mvmt, texture, size, typo etc..). A submariner is a beautiful watch historically but not since circa 16 years. It is very show off, not elegant and discret. You know men are very pragmatic. Is a rolex pragmatic? not anymore, it is very problematic. It is socially problematic, you look arrogant. It is not safe to wear one in many, many places.
In summary, Rolex watches WERE good, reliable and masculine watches. Nowadays Rolex watches are nice objects to be kept in a box as asset but they are not watches anymore. The tudor black bay is just what people want and appreciated with rolex but also other brands in the past. Simple, well-made, reliable and nice looking watches.
And I don't talk about the prices that's irrelevant, both brands are expensive. I am swiss and nobody I know wears a modern Rolex. Most models are just gaudy.
I think you are upset that Tudor dont sponsor you. Leave Tudoor alone!
Not true. Brands don't need to have tons of models to be successful or even desirable. Rolex have very simple catalogue for all these years and it's still the biggest watch brand in the world. In non watch world, you can see examples like Apple and Tesla, which keeps very simple product line up but focus more on quality and timeless design theme. Many other examples I don't want to list all but you get the point.
Thanks for sharing your point of view! Rolex still does have different lines, though most of them are based on the Oyster case design. They are trying though, with their launch of the 1908 line. Apple Watch on the other hand doesn’t need to have any lines - they just pull you into the ecosystem. In this case you’ll want to buy iPhones, iPads, MacBooks… etc. Tesla car models do have different lines withe Model X, S, 3, Y and they are expanding to their solar powerwall technologies. I do think for watch brands it’s a little different than tech companies.
Historically Tudor strong points have always been dive watches for the Military and Professional diver. I thanks divers will always be a strong genre for the brand.
I have a Rolex and now I'm waiting for the black and burgundy Black Bay 58 GMT to arrive to buy it, I don't know why so much controversy? Excellent model, excellent brand! 😎✌️
I'm ok with the prices going down. It's better for us that want to have watches at best prices.
Buy what you like is always gonna be my go to answer. I buy tudor, oris, omega, gs, and if one day, any rolex catches my eye, I'll buy one too, probably ever rose day date brown dial.
Tudor have also been updating greatly their models with on the fly micro adjustment bracelets and now with master chronometre certificate movements a lot of people are trying to sell older models to get the new ones.
Everybody has that now. Nothing special about it.
@@bigmacdaddy1234 Everybody has what now? Metas certification??
except for the stupid rol/ap/pp bubble...why the hell a watch should be sold avove its retail price? in the past decades it was quite common to obtain a discount of 5/15% on every brand for a brend new watch, except fpr ltd releases or special editions...
The state of the watch hobby being infiltrated by social media celebrities and who’s who and the cool group 😎
Rolex at almost 30% discount from AD.
I just bought 2 watches last month. One was a rolex that i paid 41K yes 41 thousand dollars for the full gold sub 2024 blue dial. The other was a TUDOR reverse panda.Tudor is not a poor mans watch. Most people in the world cant even buy the tudor.Maybe rolex is an over priced tudor just saying.
I own 4 times the amount of Rolex than Tudor. Rolex are for collection Tudor to wear and enjoy. I love the brand, though criticise the inflatetd use of the name Black Bay as well. Why not calling the BB 58 just 58, the BB Professional just Professional, the BB GMT, just heritage GMT, or classic GMT or mid-century GMT or.... just not BB 58 GMT.... I also believe this naming greatly damaged the brand.
That’s a pretty good point. And maybe not have the hands and case style too similar to the black bay line. I mean they are oyster cases design anyway, and perhaps it’s ok for tudor to use that as it makes sense.
Thank you for your insight.
My pleasure!
Let them tank. Used watches should be worth less than new ones. We've been made to believe that watches should be investments, that resell values have always been huge. I really hope the market crashes and everyone will be able to buy the watches they want.
I have two Omega watches (Aqua Terra, Speedy Sapphire) and one Rolex Oyster Perpetual 36 and wearing right now my BlackBay 54. Honestly, after acquiring my Oyster and 54 I’m saturated with watches from both of these brands. Love them both don’t get me wrong, but I don’t really feel the need to get anymore from them. Love my Aqua Terra and Speedy and Omega as a brand way more. I was thinking about putting my name down on the list for a GMT2, but it is just too much money and the waiting list turns me off. Even if you are happy to get one at retail you can’t really enjoy the watch, because you always have to think about where you travel with it and your safety so in the end you gonna wear something more discrete like the Oyster. For me it’s the quintessential Rolex anyway. It took me 2.5 years to get a simple Oyster. Insane!
Enjoy your watch collection, that’s a pretty awesome one indeed. Perhaps a dress watch next? 😉
Quick, dump your BB ASAP ;)
Omg! You just kicked a lot of soared arses with this video 🤣🤣
Thanks for telling the truth no matter what. It is what it is, kids. And if you can’t stand the truth: Deal with it! 😅
Is it possible to get a discount on BB58 Black today from an AD?
Actually in many ADs the Black Bay 58 is available for sale. Some of them will tell you there is a list, but just leave your details and they will probably call you right after. 😉 I don’t see why they would give you a discount if there’s stock
Marketing is indeed a genuine field. However, it is important to note that Rolex and Omega may not be considered true tool watches in 2024. On the other hand, G-Shock stands out as a genuine tool watch in 2024
G-shock cannot be challenged as the true tool watch in 2024. Stay tuned and subscribed for my upcoming Gshock video review
I'm saving for the white dial GMT!!
They are available in the used market now for a discounted price!
They are a one trick pony, but they are not alone.
How many AP models other than the Royal Oak can you name?
I bought m 17:40 y BB58 about 4 months ago and i already want to get the new BB58 Coke GMT. I think Tudor is awesome. Great " tough guys " tool watches for the outdoors... It's what Rolex used to be.
I wear them for my outdoor adventures daily. Also i don't buy watches to sell them. When i get bored with watches i gave it to my other family members lol.
Tudor is a brand that listens to their fan base. Ppl wanting rolex coke GMT and rolex released it on Tudor.
They are fairly priced. You can get METAS for half of the price of Omega.
Give it 10 years Tudor will surpass Omega. Because Tudor generally a young brand ( since the rebranding)
I understand it's hard to get Rolex at the AD. But that's what the grey market for. Buy a piece of Rolex and done. No Rolex AD mind games .
Thanks for sharing and glad you’re enjoying your tudor black bay 58. It’s great that tudor is listening to its fan base and of course metas certification is something great they are embarking on. Thank you for watching the video and your support! 🙏
Tudor taking a note out of APs market approach.
I buy Tudor because I think they are great. Period. I don’t buy them for ROLEX reasons. And if you want a comparison, I think they are better than ROLEX
Thanks for sharing
How much is Longines paying you! The Black Bay line is the anchor of the Tudor line. We have choices in the watch world. Tudor has its own distinct style and look. I have no interest in a Rolex. Tudor aren’t playing games. Their popularity makes it difficult to buy a new launch. Nothing “fake” about it.
Dude…thank you for this
🙌🙏👊
Thanks 🙏 for your wonderful support! Will keep creating content you like to see in the future. Do let me know if there are any other topics you’d like us you explore or touch on, we are all ears 👂!
Bought a dozen Tudors new or near new for up to 55% off RRP from profile builders.😊
Availability or the lack of it is annoying consumers. The ADs for Tudor are the same as the Rolex dealers and often the same guy at the AD controls both brands. That guy is connected to flippers so ordinary consumers are poorly treated. Word gets out and consumers go to other stores.
Exactly
I share your views about Tudor. Thanks for getting it out from my system! 😄I am a fan of The Urban Gentry too. Imo, the following formula pretty captues Rolex's cunning Tudor strategy to prey on innocent lollipop suckers: Tudor watches infused by Rolex's design DNA + loads of social media hype + perceived scarcity at the AD.
Theres not a rolex I would wear, I have a tudor and there are several I'm interested in buying
I had 2 Tudors. Black Bay 41 and 41 heritage blue bezel. The quality was amazing. But to be honest I just realized the design was too plain for my taste and if I was to buy a boring watch there would have to be a reason. So if historically the Explorer is boring well, that’s the nature of the beast but getting a copy of a boring watch was too much. Got an iwc and a breitling since
Thanks for sharing! IWC and Breitling make awesome watches, and are now great value in the pre owned market
You’re the only person that thinks Tudors watches and wonders were lack luster. Lmao. Btw, Nothing is tanking. The prices are normalizing on the secondary market.
Not really, there are some watch TH-camrs who agree with this opinion, just not your regular TH-cam channels who are sponsored and afraid of speaking the truth due to their collaborations with watch brands. 😀
@@twosecondswatch I haven’t seen one notable TH-camr say it yet. And what’s a “watch youtuber?” Is that an authority? Mostly clout chasers. Not real watch collectors. Lmao.