The sole reason I enjoy UTube is education and there is not reason why people can't learn new skills to free themselves from their self-imposed non-learning situation.
Hi there! Great video, love the content Quick question just to be on the safe side: If we cut back the corner of the double top plate and the top plate, then the birds mouth comes closer so in this case there is no need for dropping the hip on the bird's mouth right? As I see it in that case the HAP will be the same as the jack's, since they are lined up at the same edge on the duoble top plate - is that correct? Thanks so much! I appreciate it!
For anyone stumbling on this comment, yes that is correct. The calculation for hip drop is setting back the framing square half the thickness of the hip which is 3/4" for the 2x here, then marking the higher seat cut. If you clip the wall corner, you are doing the same thing, setting the birdsmouth back 3/4" and just make sure to set the heel stand or HAP the same as the common rafters adjacent it.
There are other ways to find out the amount of the drop . I will leave some ways to calculate it .I did some study and came out with this: If you like trigonometry , I will give you a way to do it : Hip drop = Hip angle tangent times half of hip thickness.I need more time to explain it but if you like trigonometry you will get it .Another way and very easy is the way explained in this video very clearly and very understandable .I give you another way which is : ( roof pitch times hip thickness ) / 34 in other words you take the value of the roof pich the way is noted on the blue prints weather is 6,8, 10 etc , you take that value and multiply it by the total thicness of the hip and then divide that result into 34 .The result is in inches .That way you also get the amount of hip drop .There is another very easy way but It has to be shown having the wood on my hands or on a drawing .That would be the easiest .But I hope you can use any of theses including the one shown in this video
You don't need a table saw to back the hip; the way I do it, I set the bevel angle on the circular saw trace the outline of the cut then measure away from that mark where the fence would rest. I would screw a long 2x or even a plywood piece as a straight edge along the length of the hip then without even looking you can make the bevel cut even better than with using a table saw.
you should not of dropped your rafter at the wall plate it was ok at the bottom .when you went to the top why did you work from the center of the rafter and not the edge like the bottom.the height above plate must be the same across the roof.
When you make the height above plate (HAP) of the hip the same as the common rafters the centre line of the hip is in plane with the commons but since the hip runs at 45 degrees it's edges are too high, so you can either drop it or bevel it.
TradesTube That's wrong my friend. Your HAP is always the same for your hips and your commons. You do not need to drop the hip, only the valley gets dropped. You must be doing something wrong. To work out your backing bevel, you use True Length Hip and Rise on a roofing square. That gives you the angle. With regards to dropping the valley so the top line of the rafters strike the centre of the valley, i personally always cut a reverse backing bevel on my valleys and don't drop the valley so HAP is the same on all rafters, hips and valleys. Greetings from a master carpenter from the UK.
Martin, when you layout the line length of a hip rafter are you using the centre line of the hip or the side of the hip? The method in the video is centre line with the bird's mouth plumb cut over the corner of the wall plates and the HAP of the common rafter marked along that plumb cut.
TradesTube But you would never work a hip length out like that on site. It's easier to mark half the thickness of hip on your rafter, plumb the line down, measure the HAP and mark and take the direct measurement from that point to your corner of wall plate. You now have the hip length with the same HAP in in the correct position. Never a need to put a bevel on the hip unless it's glazed.
If you mark the "Stand" where the centre of the valley rafter is over the inside corner of the wall plates the centre of the valley will be the correct height and it doesn't need to be dropped.
correct me if im wrong... if you drop the hip rafter arent you pushing it out of plane in relation to all the common rafter tail bottoms? then left having to rip off the height of the rafter what would've gotten cut off the bevel on the top?
When you drop the seat cut the entire hip rafters drops, both at the ridge and the tail. The top corners of the hip rafter are in plane with the common rafters all along the hip rafter's length.
@@garittlajoie8841 Yes Garitt, the bottom plane of the hip is lower than the bottom of the common and jack rafters. You trim the bottom of the hip rafter for the overhang portion, sometimes called a soffit cut. Our building code (Ontario Canada) requires the hip and valley rafters to be 2" deeper than the other rafters so the bottom is always lower.
The sole reason I enjoy UTube is education and there is not reason why people can't learn new skills to free themselves from their self-imposed non-learning situation.
Thank you so so much for this very informational video :) I'm using this information for a competition tomorrow
Great video, makes me think that someone should make a Framing Simulator game. That would be sweet.
Great video very well explained. Leaving me with no questions about what you said.
dude this channel is awesome, just started cutting hips and i had so many questions, Bless you
Greg is my hero
Ha Ha! Thanks Kev
Very well explained and a good video!
Hi there! Great video, love the content Quick question just to be on the safe side:
If we cut back the corner of the double top plate and the top plate, then the birds mouth comes closer so in this case there is no need for dropping the hip on the bird's mouth right? As I see it in that case the HAP will be the same as the jack's, since they are lined up at the same edge on the duoble top plate - is that correct?
Thanks so much! I appreciate it!
For anyone stumbling on this comment, yes that is correct. The calculation for hip drop is setting back the framing square half the thickness of the hip which is 3/4" for the 2x here, then marking the higher seat cut. If you clip the wall corner, you are doing the same thing, setting the birdsmouth back 3/4" and just make sure to set the heel stand or HAP the same as the common rafters adjacent it.
There are other ways to find out the amount of the drop .
I will leave some ways to calculate it .I did some study and came out with this:
If you like trigonometry , I will give you a way to do it :
Hip drop = Hip angle tangent times half of hip thickness.I need more time to explain it but if you like trigonometry you will get it .Another way and very easy is the way explained in this video very clearly and very understandable .I give you another way which is :
( roof pitch times hip thickness ) / 34
in other words you take the value of the roof pich the way is noted on the blue prints weather is 6,8, 10 etc , you take that value and multiply it by the total thicness of the hip and then divide that result into 34 .The result is in inches .That way you also get the amount of hip drop .There is another very easy way but It has to be shown having the wood on my hands or on a drawing .That would be the easiest .But I hope you can use any of theses including the one shown in this video
You don't need a table saw to back the hip; the way I do it, I set the bevel angle on the circular saw trace the outline of the cut then measure away from that mark where the fence would rest. I would screw a long 2x or even a plywood piece as a straight edge along the length of the hip then without even looking you can make the bevel cut even better than with using a table saw.
you should not of dropped your rafter at the wall plate it was ok at the bottom .when you went to the top why did you work from the center of the rafter and not the edge like the bottom.the height above plate must be the same across the roof.
When you make the height above plate (HAP) of the hip the same as the common rafters the centre line of the hip is in plane with the commons but since the hip runs at 45 degrees it's edges are too high, so you can either drop it or bevel it.
TradesTube That's wrong my friend. Your HAP is always the same for your hips and your commons. You do not need to drop the hip, only the valley gets dropped. You must be doing something wrong. To work out your backing bevel, you use True Length Hip and Rise on a roofing square. That gives you the angle. With regards to dropping the valley so the top line of the rafters strike the centre of the valley, i personally always cut a reverse backing bevel on my valleys and don't drop the valley so HAP is the same on all rafters, hips and valleys. Greetings from a master carpenter from the UK.
Martin, when you layout the line length of a hip rafter are you using the centre line of the hip or the side of the hip? The method in the video is centre line with the bird's mouth plumb cut over the corner of the wall plates and the HAP of the common rafter marked along that plumb cut.
TradesTube But you would never work a hip length out like that on site. It's easier to mark half the thickness of hip on your rafter, plumb the line down, measure the HAP and mark and take the direct measurement from that point to your corner of wall plate. You now have the hip length with the same HAP in in the correct position. Never a need to put a bevel on the hip unless it's glazed.
Hey There Trade Tuber, are you ok if I show this video to some young apprentices. I like the way you can see the dropping of the hip.
Merle
Yes, go ahead, this video is intended for apprentices.
would you use the same method to determine how far you drop a valley rafter?
If you mark the "Stand" where the centre of the valley rafter is over the inside corner of the wall plates the centre of the valley will be the correct height and it doesn't need to be dropped.
correct me if im wrong... if you drop the hip rafter arent you pushing it out of plane in relation to all the common rafter tail bottoms? then left having to rip off the height of the rafter what would've gotten cut off the bevel on the top?
When you drop the seat cut the entire hip rafters drops, both at the ridge and the tail. The top corners of the hip rafter are in plane with the common rafters all along the hip rafter's length.
@@gregkenny680 but isn't the bottom plane of the hip rafter lower than the rest because you dropped it?
@@garittlajoie8841 Yes Garitt, the bottom plane of the hip is lower than the bottom of the common and jack rafters. You trim the bottom of the hip rafter for the overhang portion, sometimes called a soffit cut. Our building code (Ontario Canada) requires the hip and valley rafters to be 2" deeper than the other rafters so the bottom is always lower.
Take the dihedral angle off or commonly known as backing the hip rafter off
Bevelling the hip is not too much work when you know how to do it. 2 cuts 4 minutes.
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