I just upgraded my system, i got like $12,00.00 into my system now, i really didn't need to upgrade, not really and i didn't upgrade just for msfs, it was for other games i play that has ray-trace graphics which takes a ton of muscle for FPS and also CPU.. But what i got here is ... MSI Z790 MEG GODLIKE MAX Intel LGA 1700 eATX Motherboard Intel Core i9-13900K Desktop Processor 24 cores (8 P-cores + 16 E-cores) 36M Cache, up to 5.8 GHz & ASUS ROG Maximus Z790 Hero (WiFi 6E) LGA 1700(Intel 13th&12th Gen) ATX ASUS TUF GeForce RTX 4090 OC Edition Gaming Graphics G.SKILL Trident Z5 Royal Series (Intel XMP 3.0) DDR5 RAM 256GB with all settings to ULTRA i'm getting around 160 FPS in most cases.. Some times it will drop down to 125 or so.. But it is perfect for MSFS but you have to be able to afford it, my setup ran me around $12,000.00 or so, but i also do video editing so i needed this..
I did something very similar about a month ago, went from a Ryzen 7 3700x to a 7800x3D. Bumped up from 32gb of Ram up to 64. Unfortunately I was on a 3070 and wanted to jump to the 4080 Super so that was a huge hit to the wallet. But the difference is night and day. Totally worth it.
I just did the same cpu/ram upgrades as you (+ new motherboard) and am still on a 3070...dreaming of an upgraded GPU but trying my best to sit tight to see what the next series brings...but I'm jealous of your 4080 super.
Smart move saying with AMD. Intel 13th and 14th gen CPUs are not recommended at this time due to massive overvolting issues that Intel has yet to properly address. I should've gone with a 7800x3D instead of a 13700K when I did my upgrade earlier this year.
The 13700 isnt impacted, lol. Your 13700 was the best choice you could make back then and you act like it was a bad choice because you cant read, lol. The problem isnt intel it is the Motherboard mfgs using out of spec settings in the bios. Asus has addressed this. Stop listening to idiots on the internet then repeating it like you know something, lol.
@@Despiser25 Not true. This is a microcode issue. All Intel CPUs down to the 13400/14400 are affected. My 13700K was doing 1.4+V stock until I undervolted it. It's recommended that the voltage not go over 1.3V or the CPU could be damaged. I've been building my own systems since 2011, so I understand what's going on. As for the motherboard venders, they do share part of the blame for not implementing Intel's power limits properly. That's been fixed, but the microcode in the chips is still a problem. I also would appreciate you not assuming I'm an idiot and don't know what I'm talking about.
Came here to say that a 7800X3D would have been a better choice for gaming, but saw that you replied to a comment that the extra cores of the 7900X3D are needed for production work 👍🏼 When it comes to the AM5 platform, throwing 2 more sticks of RAM it the MoBo "because why not" is likely not a good idea because the max throughput speed will go down (AM5 is very sensitive to 2 sticks vs 4 sticks of ram) as the memory controller can't keep pace. See a video Jayz-2-Cents did recently on why hes switching back to AMD and what he's doing for his build for more on this. Blue skys and tailwinds!
I have VR but never really use it because I have the full logitech cockpit setup with physical controls and I honestly did not like how MSFS implemented VR (vs how well Xplane 11 did it). That said I run a 5950x and 6900xt at 5120x1440 and generally only fall into the low 20s in extremely dense and complex airports like my payware LAX. One thing I notice in your performance monitor view is you will probably improve performance by loading up more on your GPU. As counter intuitive as that sounds by increasing the GPU intensive settings you are offloading some of the work from your CPU. You want to try to get mainthread and gpu to be in the 15ms or so on both when at a nominal complexity airport on the ground (like denver or houston). That will generally get you the best and most stable FPS where only your altitude, scenery density, and LOD radius will reduce performance. Also once you open MSFS, set the application to "High" priority or get a utility like thread lasso that will automate that setting every time you launch the program. For windows 11 users, task manager, right click on MSFS process, click details, then right click MSFS process again and set priority to High. Also at least in my case I get better performance from DX 11 but your mileage may vary, try DX 12 beta with same settings and see if there is any difference in performance, visuals, or most of all stability.
Great video, appreciate all the information! Just adding some info here for those still rocking older generation processors, such as the Ryzen 5000s but have an RTX 4000 series card such as the 4080 (like me... 🤣). I noticed you have NVIDIA DLSS Frame Generation greyed out on your PC settings which only works if you enable HGAS (Hardware Accelerated GPU Scehduled) on Windows. Enabling HGAS and Frame Gen gives a MASSIVE boost on "FPS". I say "FPS" in quotes because it's not really giving you more FPS but rather "cheating" by adding frames in between frames to give you a much smoother experience. The FPS counter you check under Development Mode still shows what your real FPS is but it is a massive change due to this "NVIDIA hack". Since my system is a Ryzen 5700X with 32Gb of RAM (waiting for the next round coming out soon to finally jump into the newer generation stuff), this Frame Generation is a game changer. In 4K without Frame Gen I would get rather low FPS, 20-30fps but when enabled, it is close to "60fps" visually due to this feature. I have changed over to a 5120x1440 display and even having my settings on Ultra all across, I get smooth gameplay. Hoping to not have to enable Frame Gen when I finally upgrade my system but for those out there with a 4000 series NVIDIA card, that is the best "free upgrade" you can have! Thanks again and keep up the great videos!
Yeah, I'm thinking of getting the 7800x3D also but am holding off to see when the 9000 series with X3D will be released. Currently I'm still running my dinosaur Intel i7 4970K from 200 years ago... lol Surprisingly with my nVidia 2070 Super I'm still able to fly most situations at 30+ FPS with minimal stutters at 2K resolution. Overcast weather seems to be one of the biggest killers for performance.
Great practical info and shared experience - always appreciated! I ended up favouring “the physical” rather than “the displayed”, as in controller hardware instead of VR. That way, I’ve taken it quite far with a pretty ancient Xeon workstation and a mid-tier AMD GPU. That said, both the behemoth workstation and Win-10 are at their EOL. The IT reality over the last years has already “decided” for me, a new system will be all AMD - but _my_ experience is certainly not a general recipe… 😅
Glad you’re happy with your new machine. Looking at benchmarks, it seems the 7800x3D is faster than the 7900x3D in games (bigger caches). Would have saved you some money. I have a 5800x3D and am pretty happy with performance (no VR).
Agreed but I also use my machine for my day job which requires the use of multiple VMs and for production the 7900 was the better balance. But you’re not wrong and I thought hard about it lol it was a tough call
Really comes down to 3 things Team Blues latest processors are not doing well physically. Overheating and other performance issues The 3D series cache from AMD is definitely superior for gaming/simulation The cost of Intel these days just isn’t justified. They don’t have the lead they used to and 95% of users will not notice a difference between the two
Same here, particularly if they improve the mult-threading performance. Got to say since I've discovered Lossless Scaling and AutoFPS I'm getting the best performance I've ever had in the sim.
5400 mhz is about the top out where I see the limited by main thread in the same category as the previous gen DDR 4 chips get above that range. Granted it's still there in a sense, but the micro stutter definitely disappears. It might be possible that the x series chips of amd's might work fine when you jump up, but I will not be spending the cash to jump down from a 7800x3d to test that out.
Never had a problem with a computer by not changing paste. Still have one going strong my son uses from 07. If this was true ppl would have to take purchased computers in for maintenance. Whether that is true or not I am disputing it!
@1AllenBlack Ive done the same thing. With heat cycles, the moisture eventually leaves the pase. Lessening effectiveness. Less so at CPU stock speeds compared to overclocking with marginal cooler
I run a 5950x which is a pretty hot chip and used a diamond carbon pad instead of paste with a 360AIO. While I dont have great temps (can hit up to 90c in MSFS) I am getting great boost clocks and will never worry about paste degradation and the best part is they are reusable and no mess to clean up if you need to remove cpu for any reason. That said I think those carbon pads are only about as good as a C grade thermal paste, which I consider stellar since its no mess, no voids, and pretty much no way to get it wrong. I am sure I would get better cooling with a high end paste but probably only 2-3C better.
I made a 800 upgrade with a 850 psi and Asus tuf 4070 super, even though I'm still in i7 10k but I'm having it smoking this time,, I bought it from MC so I have 30 days to decide weather I keep it or go for the 80 super
Currently running: 5800X3D/3080/DDR4 32gig@3600MHz. Will I notice a difference in vr if I upgrade to: 7800X3D/DDR5 32gig@6000MHz and keeping the same 3080?
It took me a year after my upgrade to make MSFS20 run ok, lol. What they dont tell anyone is that DLSS doesnt get updated correctly and without knowing I was on the release version, lol.
Good on you! Great advice…I hope you sold the old MOBO/CPU combo! BTW what is the max CPU RAM speed does your new 570 MOBO support? Sending protective and healing vibes to you and yer kids and loved ones! Namaste Chas
Good video, brother. I keep trying DLSS but I hate the way the ribbons and dials look. DLSS. Anything small and fast moving. Airport light mast trinkle at night along with the external plane lights. At least that is how it works on my machine. I am going to try to get used to it. I do not have a many graphic issues but I do know I push my GPU really hard with three 4k monitors runng. Thanks for the information.
i made an upgrade from my i9 9900k to the 7800x3d, very insane impact for vr
I just upgraded my system, i got like $12,00.00 into my system now, i really didn't need to upgrade, not really and i didn't upgrade just for msfs, it was for other games i play that has ray-trace graphics which takes a ton of muscle for FPS and also CPU..
But what i got here is ...
MSI Z790 MEG GODLIKE MAX Intel LGA 1700 eATX Motherboard
Intel Core i9-13900K Desktop Processor 24 cores (8 P-cores + 16 E-cores) 36M Cache, up to 5.8 GHz & ASUS ROG Maximus Z790 Hero (WiFi 6E) LGA 1700(Intel 13th&12th Gen) ATX
ASUS TUF GeForce RTX 4090 OC Edition Gaming Graphics
G.SKILL Trident Z5 Royal Series (Intel XMP 3.0) DDR5 RAM 256GB
with all settings to ULTRA i'm getting around 160 FPS in most cases..
Some times it will drop down to 125 or so..
But it is perfect for MSFS but you have to be able to afford it, my setup ran me around $12,000.00 or so, but i also do video editing so i needed this..
8:30 What in the _WORLD_ happened to the Golden Gate Bridge?!?!
My guess is that it could be a mod that recreates the aftermath of the earthquake that took out the bridge in the mid 20th century.
Godzilla?
Go Packers! I'm headed up to Lambeau for the Ravens preseason game. Brats, beer, and old-fashioneds, baby!
Have one for me brother!!
I'm JEALOUS! GO PACK!! GO!
I did something very similar about a month ago, went from a Ryzen 7 3700x to a 7800x3D. Bumped up from 32gb of Ram up to 64. Unfortunately I was on a 3070 and wanted to jump to the 4080 Super so that was a huge hit to the wallet. But the difference is night and day. Totally worth it.
I just did the same cpu/ram upgrades as you (+ new motherboard) and am still on a 3070...dreaming of an upgraded GPU but trying my best to sit tight to see what the next series brings...but I'm jealous of your 4080 super.
Micro center has bundle deals, hard to beat!
Smart move saying with AMD. Intel 13th and 14th gen CPUs are not recommended at this time due to massive overvolting issues that Intel has yet to properly address. I should've gone with a 7800x3D instead of a 13700K when I did my upgrade earlier this year.
The 13700 isnt impacted, lol. Your 13700 was the best choice you could make back then and you act like it was a bad choice because you cant read, lol. The problem isnt intel it is the Motherboard mfgs using out of spec settings in the bios. Asus has addressed this. Stop listening to idiots on the internet then repeating it like you know something, lol.
@@Despiser25 Not true. This is a microcode issue. All Intel CPUs down to the 13400/14400 are affected. My 13700K was doing 1.4+V stock until I undervolted it. It's recommended that the voltage not go over 1.3V or the CPU could be damaged. I've been building my own systems since 2011, so I understand what's going on. As for the motherboard venders, they do share part of the blame for not implementing Intel's power limits properly. That's been fixed, but the microcode in the chips is still a problem.
I also would appreciate you not assuming I'm an idiot and don't know what I'm talking about.
Came here to say that a 7800X3D would have been a better choice for gaming, but saw that you replied to a comment that the extra cores of the 7900X3D are needed for production work 👍🏼
When it comes to the AM5 platform, throwing 2 more sticks of RAM it the MoBo "because why not" is likely not a good idea because the max throughput speed will go down (AM5 is very sensitive to 2 sticks vs 4 sticks of ram) as the memory controller can't keep pace. See a video Jayz-2-Cents did recently on why hes switching back to AMD and what he's doing for his build for more on this. Blue skys and tailwinds!
I have VR but never really use it because I have the full logitech cockpit setup with physical controls and I honestly did not like how MSFS implemented VR (vs how well Xplane 11 did it). That said I run a 5950x and 6900xt at 5120x1440 and generally only fall into the low 20s in extremely dense and complex airports like my payware LAX. One thing I notice in your performance monitor view is you will probably improve performance by loading up more on your GPU. As counter intuitive as that sounds by increasing the GPU intensive settings you are offloading some of the work from your CPU. You want to try to get mainthread and gpu to be in the 15ms or so on both when at a nominal complexity airport on the ground (like denver or houston). That will generally get you the best and most stable FPS where only your altitude, scenery density, and LOD radius will reduce performance. Also once you open MSFS, set the application to "High" priority or get a utility like thread lasso that will automate that setting every time you launch the program. For windows 11 users, task manager, right click on MSFS process, click details, then right click MSFS process again and set priority to High. Also at least in my case I get better performance from DX 11 but your mileage may vary, try DX 12 beta with same settings and see if there is any difference in performance, visuals, or most of all stability.
Great video, appreciate all the information!
Just adding some info here for those still rocking older generation processors, such as the Ryzen 5000s but have an RTX 4000 series card such as the 4080 (like me... 🤣).
I noticed you have NVIDIA DLSS Frame Generation greyed out on your PC settings which only works if you enable HGAS (Hardware Accelerated GPU Scehduled) on Windows.
Enabling HGAS and Frame Gen gives a MASSIVE boost on "FPS". I say "FPS" in quotes because it's not really giving you more FPS but rather "cheating" by adding frames in between frames to give you a much smoother experience. The FPS counter you check under Development Mode still shows what your real FPS is but it is a massive change due to this "NVIDIA hack".
Since my system is a Ryzen 5700X with 32Gb of RAM (waiting for the next round coming out soon to finally jump into the newer generation stuff), this Frame Generation is a game changer. In 4K without Frame Gen I would get rather low FPS, 20-30fps but when enabled, it is close to "60fps" visually due to this feature. I have changed over to a 5120x1440 display and even having my settings on Ultra all across, I get smooth gameplay.
Hoping to not have to enable Frame Gen when I finally upgrade my system but for those out there with a 4000 series NVIDIA card, that is the best "free upgrade" you can have!
Thanks again and keep up the great videos!
NICE CATCH ON HAGS!!! I didn’t even think to check it with the new install
@@OverkillSimulations Sure thing! Also worth nothing that option is only available if you run DX12 (Beta), not on DX11.
Yeah, I'm thinking of getting the 7800x3D also but am holding off to see when the 9000 series with X3D will be released. Currently I'm still running my dinosaur Intel i7 4970K from 200 years ago... lol
Surprisingly with my nVidia 2070 Super I'm still able to fly most situations at 30+ FPS with minimal stutters at 2K resolution. Overcast weather seems to be one of the biggest killers for performance.
I also have an i7 4790K with a 1660TI video card on a 1080 samsung screen and very happy with it.
Great practical info and shared experience - always appreciated!
I ended up favouring “the physical” rather than “the displayed”, as in controller hardware instead of VR. That way, I’ve taken it quite far with a pretty ancient Xeon workstation and a mid-tier AMD GPU.
That said, both the behemoth workstation and Win-10 are at their EOL. The IT reality over the last years has already “decided” for me, a new system will be all AMD - but _my_ experience is certainly not a general recipe… 😅
Great vid Mike
Okay you made me break down and upgraded my system with 7900x3D but after DDR5 mem, new MB and CPU water cooler I spent over $1300.
Glad you’re happy with your new machine. Looking at benchmarks, it seems the 7800x3D is faster than the 7900x3D in games (bigger caches). Would have saved you some money. I have a 5800x3D and am pretty happy with performance (no VR).
Agreed but I also use my machine for my day job which requires the use of multiple VMs and for production the 7900 was the better balance. But you’re not wrong and I thought hard about it lol it was a tough call
With your background in building computers I would be interested in knowing your reasoning in going with AMD versus Intel.
Really comes down to 3 things
Team Blues latest processors are not doing well physically. Overheating and other performance issues
The 3D series cache from AMD is definitely superior for gaming/simulation
The cost of Intel these days just isn’t justified. They don’t have the lead they used to and 95% of users will not notice a difference between the two
There is no point in upgrading your computer while such awesome frame generators exist.
i have to upgrade definitely. but i wait for msfs 2024 recommendations and then actual experiences from users and then decide what i upgrade.
Same here, particularly if they improve the mult-threading performance. Got to say since I've discovered Lossless Scaling and AutoFPS I'm getting the best performance I've ever had in the sim.
5400 mhz is about the top out where I see the limited by main thread in the same category as the previous gen DDR 4 chips get above that range. Granted it's still there in a sense, but the micro stutter definitely disappears. It might be possible that the x series chips of amd's might work fine when you jump up, but I will not be spending the cash to jump down from a 7800x3d to test that out.
Bro, you should consider selling your old gear, because there is real money to be had. Especially when you are not having unlimited budget!
Sure, I’m usually that nerd buying such things, spending too much time (but less money) trying to max them out…😅
One is supposed to change out thermal paste at least every other year...because of dryout
Never had a problem with a computer by not changing paste. Still have one going strong my son uses from 07. If this was true ppl would have to take purchased computers in for maintenance. Whether that is true or not I am disputing it!
@1AllenBlack
Ive done the same thing.
With heat cycles, the moisture eventually leaves the pase. Lessening effectiveness. Less so at CPU stock speeds compared to overclocking with marginal cooler
@@Bryster51 Interesting, rarely do I overclock most of the computers I used over the years. Thx for the info.
I run a 5950x which is a pretty hot chip and used a diamond carbon pad instead of paste with a 360AIO. While I dont have great temps (can hit up to 90c in MSFS) I am getting great boost clocks and will never worry about paste degradation and the best part is they are reusable and no mess to clean up if you need to remove cpu for any reason. That said I think those carbon pads are only about as good as a C grade thermal paste, which I consider stellar since its no mess, no voids, and pretty much no way to get it wrong. I am sure I would get better cooling with a high end paste but probably only 2-3C better.
I made a 800 upgrade with a 850 psi and Asus tuf 4070 super, even though I'm still in i7 10k but I'm having it smoking this time,,
I bought it from MC so I have 30 days to decide weather I keep it or go for the 80 super
Currently running: 5800X3D/3080/DDR4 32gig@3600MHz.
Will I notice a difference in vr if I upgrade to: 7800X3D/DDR5 32gig@6000MHz and keeping the same 3080?
It took me a year after my upgrade to make MSFS20 run ok, lol. What they dont tell anyone is that DLSS doesnt get updated correctly and without knowing I was on the release version, lol.
I picked up teh 7900x3d on Prime Days for 327 which was 60 bucks cheaper then the 7800x3d
Good on you! Great advice…I hope you sold the old MOBO/CPU combo!
BTW what is the max CPU RAM speed does your new 570 MOBO support?
Sending protective and healing vibes to you and yer kids and loved ones!
Namaste
Chas
great video. What motherboard did you upgrade to?
Good video, brother. I keep trying DLSS but I hate the way the ribbons and dials look. DLSS. Anything small and fast moving. Airport light mast trinkle at night along with the external plane lights. At least that is how it works on my machine. I am going to try to get used to it. I do not have a many graphic issues but I do know I push my GPU really hard with three 4k monitors runng. Thanks for the information.
What is the software running in the top right corner showing the stats?
Have tried lossless scaling with Riva Tuner for smoothness?
My savings was for mobo and cpu with the 13 gen , but now? Btw I always been Intel so I have no idea how AMD does
@02:15 what has "ass" to do with the French ?
I have been building computers for 20 years, best and cheapest decision I ever made! 😂
You upgraded you CPU "NOW"???? in a week AMD will release their new CPUs Series 9000