I mean, even against Control deck Maxx C isn't that bad, almost every deck in YuGiOh special summon so it will always go plus or neutral in card avantage
Maxx C effectively gatekeeps the meta. if your deck is unable to play thru a maxx C resolving or cannot use the package to prevent it from resolving(which includes your own copies of maxx C) your deck is not " competitive" and for thatalone Maxx C has no place in the game.
I've never really bought the "stops combo" argument for maxx "c". Especially when you look at master duel. They get hit by stuff like SHS just as bad as the TCG does. The problem is the lack of balancing as you put it. Maxx can be used just as effectively by a combo player as it can by anyone else.
yeah many midrange decks need at least 4 summons to pass on anything decent so it is basically just upstart that also reads skip your turn against them
@@freaki0734no dude you don't understand, without maxx c i wouldnt be able to beat oppressive combo decks like dragonmaid. seals pass **needs** to be kept in check
Maxx C should never return. A candidate for the most powerful card in the game's history. Master Duel contains only a fraction of the power of the TCG.
Also best of one format in MD. So… yeah. Everyone and their mother is running this card because it’s best of one. There’s no side decking in regular MD ladder. It’s go big or go home. TCG? you have the side deck and best 2 out of 3.
I'd argue there's a fifth aspect for why Maxx "C" is banned in the TCG. You can play it going first, all you need do to build a turn one board, then drop the bug during your opponents draw phase.
-Maxx C doesn't really stop combo decks. Combo decks being the "hot new deck" will end up on top regardless and will also run Maxx C themselves if given the chance. Its resolution will tilt the scales in favor of the user most of the time it appears in, but when talking statistics, the overall win ratios of the best decks will remain the overall win ratios of the best decks in any format that uses Maxx C when everybody has the same chance of using Maxx C. -It's not weird that "tcg banned it if they created it". The OCG side of Konami calls all those shots like the banlist and the cards they want to have TCG release first. -Yes it was designed for its time when Droll and Maxx C were both considered "ok" to "bad" historically, but we know the game is not at all at the power/speed/complexity level it was at in 2011, so rather the question is not on why TCG banned it, but why it hasn't been banned in OCG and Konami also refuses to ban it in Master Duel.
@@Captyugioh Went to check on OCG meta videos and the same thing seems to be topping over there (Snake Eyes) as tier 0 or close to it. Maxx C is not tilting the balance in a meaningful manner. It just keeps some anecdotal single duel evidence scenarios in check because the card is unfair but it can't realistically keep things in check when the very decks some people claim to put in check are also using it to keep the pressure after establishing boards.
@@Sleepy0173 Well neither format is close to tier 0 but now and on average they have more variety in their decks due to maxx c. Drawing maxx c first is much worse than drawing it going second. Its taking the place of a card you could be using to extend your combo or stop a hand trap your op could have. For example this format their voiceless is stronger than ours because of maxx c. So much infact that is its performing better than pure snake eyes and has pushed the relavance of fire from about 60-70 percent between the 2 main decks to around 30 percent. That is 50 percent reduction in the power of the main combo deck. Case closed
In Red Reboot's defense; FUCK STUN DECKS! If the continuous flood gate trap cards were either heavily limited/banned Red Reboot would not be in the main deck and just relegated to a side deck only card. As for the limiting of popular cards in OCG; I call bullshit because Master Duel exists, and a lot of the popular cards are basically Maxx "C" and counters to it, with maybe Droll & Lock Bird/Nibiru, the Primal Being/ Dimension Shifter being played along side it Ash Blossom & Joyous Spring is no longer viable due to fire decks being popular.
The last 3 formats with maxx c showed the power it held was absurd as a purely going first card to insulate you more from your opponent. Being able to full zoo combo. Drop a maxx c thier turn was a point where maxc c was not future proofed at all.
Maxx C needs an eratta that makes it where you can only activate it if you control no cards, and maybe add a 1 card discard cost to prevent spamming it. That way it won't be used on your opponent after setting up your crazy board with 5 negates. I imagine this would severely cut how many decks play it
a max c like card would need a discard 3/4 minimum with out resricting the frequency or type of special summon needed. if it was extra deck summons and resricted to every other extradeck summon a discard 1 would get close to doing it.
@@randomprotag9329 I disagree. Max C is good as a going second tool to help draw enough cards to out your opponents board. The problem with Maxx C is it has no restrictions, so the going first player can go full combo, set up 4 to 5 disruptions, then Max C their opponent during the standby phase. This is just downright oppressive when it happens. I think the card can definitely be fixed with a few tweaks, but the goal of those tweaks should be to change the card from being broken to just good. That way it's not an auto include in every deck but it would still see play in certain strategies
@@JustSomeGuyLass the problem is its too good of one. if the issue is the choice of going first and second is unbalanced with first being too good making second too good is not the solving the issue. a turn skip should come with sigificent risk and cost.
The difference is the difference in the formats power levels (and the TCGs need to sell more in a shorter time). If you look at the OCG, they have overall a much higher power ceiling. Cards like Ariseheart for example were never banned in OCG. Instead they limit consistency tools such as the field spell. This allows for games to be very dynamic, as the presence of such blowout cards can cause major swings through the match, but it won't necessarily happen, so you have to hedge your bets and think ahead. This also reduces how many "dead" decks there are, as it doesn't outright kill cards core to most strategies. TCG on the other hand hits cards that affect the overall power ceiling. Going back to our Kash example Ariseheart is banned in TCG, which basically kills Kash as a main deck strategy. And then another factor is ease of access / selling cards. SHS was super cheap in the TCG, as most cards were commons. Yet, it performed super well. The deck got hit almost instantly in order to force players to go after new releases. OCG doesn't generally do this as players in Asian markets are generally more willing to spend on cards, whereas in the TCG players are generally chasing the next big thing. The need to "force" players to buy is greater in TCG than in OCG.
Almost every deck revolves around special summons maxxx c being a thing basically turns every duel into the pot of greed meme video. I use max c to draw 1 card, I use max to draw 1 card, max c card, max c card. Maybe it’s bc I’m not a huge yugioh player but it’s pretty cut and dry to me
I feel like we could errata max c to prevent you from activating cards in your hand for the rest of the turn it was actived. Because other than the draw power the biggest issue I have with maxx is when my opponent draws into additional hand traps. Could be wrong about this but when your opponent has to choose between maxing your opponent or choosing another handtrap if they drew into multiple.
@@crazyxxpanda2380 That would still be problematic. Doesn't matter how big of a board you build, you will simply just outweight them by simple card advantage be it breakers or starters
@@ayham613 I hear you but those cards can be cancelled out by Imperm, Droplet, Dark ruler no more, or you can just run over the appo+ and then try to combo off. Basically, that end board you put is more feasible than what we deal with now lol
Just 2 corrections: 1. TCG has all the pots unlimited while OCG has most of them limited. 2. OCG designs the cards. The TCG only adapts them with the exception of TCG exclusives. So cards like Evenly have the balance factor because of OCG designers. You need to give your videos a little more thought. But good job.
Seeing that maxx c is a must have in almost every deck in masterduel I shutter to think of the impact tcg would have if every deck required it to even have a chance to win a game
So with Dimension Shifter, I ran it for some time to counter Kashtira when I first hopped onto Master Duel but I realized they quickly gained advantage with banished monsters because Ariseheart or whatever isn’t banned in Master Duel. So I took it out. But with snake eyes, I tried putting it back into my deck. I drew it turn 1 and stopped my opponent’s play. Then I set up my traps and passed turn. Once the effect was over, I activated all my combos and locked my opponent out. He gave me the win for that round and I hadn’t even attacked. I run 3 Dimension Shifters now because I can and most decks can’t work around it. Some decks do but with my second engine of Branded, I can Fusion summon Albion and then Lubellion and then bounce back my banished cards to my deck and still have an advantage because my banished cards are no longer banished and I have good tempo of the game.
@@freaki0734 because Kashtira wasn’t running Shifter when I started Master Duel back in 2022. I never once saw a single deck run Shifter, only Dark Hero Mask Law or a Eater of Millions or other summoned monsters that banished cards that went to the GY. I didn’t run into Shifter till I dedicated my deck to beat Kashtira and Shifter did work for a while because anything detached was banished and they could only special summon one banished but my floodgate lock negated any activated effects on the field so whatever they summoned, it couldn’t activate so most the Kashtira players scooped and I finally had a chance to rank up. But nowadays..It’s a terrible idea to run Shifter against Kashtira. I’d side out all 3 Shifters and side in both my imperms and effect Velier instead.
The best comparision I had on this topic was like a few weeks back with the last Master Duel Event. One of them having close to none handtraps at all, the other being all in again. While the first event felt like a fresh wind and I saw a lot of different never seen decks, the second event was all the same again and you couldn't do one turn without handtrap spam. For Maxx C especially a erata would be needed. Because playing it going second, does help you - BUT - your opponent going full combo turn one and you are getting Maxx C'd on your first turn misses the point of this card in my opinion.
No mention of Max C being banned once hand traps started becoming a thing? Now Max C could draw you into interaction during your opponent’s turn, instead of just a bunch of traps and starters
It was on the banlist but not actually _banned_ in the synchro era and I feel that in that era it was fine at 1, just not with today's modern handtraps. If I was going to bring it back, it would need to not let that happen. But honestly I think all it needed was an added "you cannot activate effects from your hand for the rest of the turn, also if it is during your opponent's turn you cannot summon from the extra deck or activate effects from the graveyard during the battle phase and end phase of this turn. If you drew 7 or more cards by this effect, discard 3 random cards" Done. You can't use Maxx C to draw into an Ash and stop your opponent's combos. You might have a giant hand, but your opponent will have a board with negates probably. I was a defender of Maxx C since it was banned and became a critic of it once I touched Master Duel. I do not want to see it back in its current form ever again. In fact I think I use unofficial emulators more often than I play MD because of this mess.
Master Duel shows pretty effectively how degenerate Maxx C is in a TCG-related meta. If someone uses it, the opponent's situration pretty much devolves into a risk-risk type of deal: 1: You can stop and if the interrupted combo was vital to the gamestate, that may be an F. 2: You can keep playing and just hope nothing your opponent draws will beat you next turn, which is most likely an F.(And that is assuming they don't just draw something they can activate off-rip to mess you up) 3: Or you can try to force-deck out your opponent by combo-ing especially hard, but that turns into case 2 if you miscalculated(or they draw a handtrap that messes you up. Imagine you are like one card away from winning and then they force-end your turn. I'd imagine everyone would do the face Seto made when he saw Exodia). A singular card completely twisting the game into the 4th dimension like that does not seem like a good idea to allow for Konami. Someone's opinion on if the card should be allowed depends entirely on if they think this type of gameplay is fun to watch and/or play and if "countering C" is a reasonable parameter to expect from comboplayers when they build their deck.
If there is a single(!) Card so powerful that people argue for it by saying it fixes the game then it needs to stay banned. no card should hold this much power, make it a game mechanic if it fixes the game.
Maxx C should have a change to "Only actives if u dont controls no cards on the field " that way it can be used as intended to stop Combo decks from goin 1st and summon a whole board that negates the opponent field, if u go 2nd the opponent cannot use it since he already build his field giving u a opportunity to fight back a field full of monsters with negates effects and trap cards
Another reason why they wont ban maxx c in the OCG i feel is because its a best of 1 format. In the TCG usually combo decks arent the best decks so you often side cards like nibiru and dark ruler for going 2nd. In a best of 1 format if you dont draw anything to beat a say SHS board you just isntantly lose so opening maxx c is just an instant win button, same as how SHS going uninterrupted is an instsnt win button
The problem with Maxx “C” is that it amplifies all of the hand traps in your deck and your opponent’s deck, which steepens the meta game, and many decks simply won’t get their time to shine. Although it makes stun decks with shallow combos insanely competitive, it also makes it much harder for rogue archetypal decks to compete.
Consider the maxx c argument missing the point of some of the nasty combo decks getting to plus off it. Making it easier to rebuild after breakers are used against you. After getting past negates. Maxx is useless if they have a game that turn. Sure, you may draw a hand trap that could counter, but need to consider the statistics in drawing the out through Maxx.
You missed the main aspect, which is money. As introverted as people are (myself included) i believe the majority of players would prefer playing in person as opposed to master duel or other simulators. Since the TCG is where konami makes its money, they have to make certain bans to keep the money coming in. Too many players would quit if it were legal. Im definitely in the minority when I say MAXX C TO 3 TCG, but I enjoy the maxx c challenge, and wish we played under the OCG list
It was a good attempt to get into Tcg Konami's philosophy. You made some good point but there's space for plenty of counter arguments. -TCG hates free advantage generators: what about Branded Fusion, the adventure package, Robina, Martha, Mo Ye etc. being all part of archetypes which had their share of success without being ever featured on the banlist? Surely the examples you brought came from hits directed towards generally better archetypes, but if so it has less to do with sheer advantage generated by those. -TCG hates draw cards: you pointed out the upstart yourself, but as someone said in the comments, all the pots are unlimited while they do have limitations in the OCG. Exposing yourself to droll for some random cards is pretty bad. Even the less random of those (Prosperity) is not so popular at the moment. -TCG hates unbalanced going second cards: pointing out Red Reboot is a big stretch for how uninteractive the card is. Evenly Match is crazy unbalanced punishing you for not putting/keeping a trap negate on board or at least for not having a way to limit the damage. Super poly was also pointed out by yourself. But a similar argument can be made for other cards which doesn't see much play at the moment such as Kurikara/Golem, DRMN, Denko Sekka. In general we are daily complaining about how going second is ass even by having a lot of crazy tools at our disposal. Konami is not excessively getting rid those and I dont see a reason why they should. So it was a fun video, but Maxx C is a card from another league. Just play some time wizard in which it is legal. You can find it in most of the main decks even if spammy strategies are not that succesful. If you ask me it was banned in TCG cause it felt unfair while in OCG they didn't feel that urgency. Time passed, list shaped accordingly to the ban and there was no room for a u-turn.
Your arguments are also flawed. Evenly Match only punishes trap decks. Against combo decks you will never resolve it as they will always negate it or save one negate. Red Reboot also only punishes trap decks does nothing to combo decks as combo decks run zero traps except Inpern. OCG no one plays evenly matched for this very reason. OCG has Chichen Game Upstart and Averice legal for a long time, no one played it despite the FTKs every tcg player fear mongers existing in the OCG. Desires no one plays anymore because Ash exist. OCG it was hit cause Droll and Ash are saved for Maxx C and others not desires. TCG hates stun cards and floodgates way more then the OCG. TCG also gates trap decks. TCG can not play a trap deck without turning it into an unconventional combo deck. Only shows tcg is extremely biased to combo decks. TCG gas a long history of punishing trap decks
@@soukenmarufwt5224 evenly just good against trap decks? Dude, you should really pick up something different than Stun. People literally jump on their chair when you attempt to leave mp1, trying to figure out a way to save as many resources as they can. We are in a format in which if you get lucky you can put an omni on field. And if you can't force it prior to Evenly, you can bait said negation which is something. So please do not call other's argument flawed coming from a biased prospective.
Is the Maxx C experience different between the TCG and Master Duel formats? I haven’t played against it in TCG but on Master Duel, it’s fairly easy to play over and ignore even when I am going full combo with a HERO deck who relies heavily on SS.
If max c was unbanned it would be a must play. almost like the old school tool box staples. almost all of them were in every deck and being touched in some way at some time in future banlist/restricted. I think Konami wants more deck building choices not deck building must play cards. With that said It’s weird because almost every deck goes into the same extra deck monsters in some way shape or form. Almost every engine does the same thing just in a different way resulting in similar set ups.
Let's say there was a hand trap that says: "If you lose the die roll and your opponent made you go second, you can send this card from your hand to the GY on your opponent's first standby phase. Play as if you are the player going first and your opponent now is going second. " Will this card be banned even though all it does is make it seem as if you won the die roll where you lost
In my opinion, 70% of the problem with Maxx C is not when they activated on the 1st turn, but when the opponent going 1st, already made a board full of disruption and negates, then resolves Maxx C on your turn. While you try to end the game, the opponent already accumulates many handtraps on their hand to disturb you more. If the opponent survived, they will counter you with >10 cards on their hands. Meanwhile, if you just set & pass, then you definitely would loss (except if you played trap decks, which is a minority). All Konami need is to just at least errata it, makes it "can only be activated if you control no cards".
@@lanius1084 Don't really care for the argument against Maxx "C" since we can evidently see it not do much in the OCG to derail Combo Decks regardless of range. Ash, Droll, Called and Crossout exist and contrary to popular belief, all four aren't used exclusively on Maxx "C" as there are many interactions in this game that can negatively impact your opening hand even before your opponent gets to play.
@@D.AblosFamilia in master duel it is quite literally in every single competitive deck. we can evidently see that it has the potential to be the most powerful card of the entire game so lets not play with nuclear bombs like that
@@lanius1084 And so is Ash Blossom. In fact, Ash Blossom has been in every competitive deck in the TCG for the last 7 years with very little decline in it's use due to it's wide versatility in the interactions it has. Doesn't matter at the end of the day because TCG players do in fact have thin skin.
You know what? I think they should bake the Maxx C stuff into the core rules. The idea that there should be something that lowers the attractiveness of endless combo chains is sound, it being tied to a card effect is however the true problem because that just means it's a no brainer staple like Pot of Greed and other such stuff.
I just hate maxx c cause it does nothing but make the format more sacky and deck building becomes uninteresting. If you cant play and counter maxx c then your deck is usually bad.
10:09 I really don't like how every deck in Yu-Gi-Oh has to have these 3 cards in every deck even before you build a new deck you have to have these 3 cards before building your engine.
cards i have are as follows. thats ok we still have retaliating c and contact c. i checked the list. bottomless trap hole isn't on there,neither are book of moon and compulsory evacuation device. and neither is cyber dragon. ash blossom isn't there either. infinite impermanence isn't there either. i know soul charge is there. solemn judgement isn't there either. reasoning is. but is limited but i wish they had numbers next to them to say to how many. i know prank kids meow meow mu is i want it off of the list. neither is dimension shifter. and finally neither is dark ruler no more.
I think we should have another card with the same effect of maxx c with a limitation like can draw max 3 card and/or can play this card when oponnent have more monster in the board than you
I miss the days of “one card facedown defense and 2 cards in the back row, pass.” Waiting for people to spend 6 minutes building their unbreakable board with 10 negates on turn one with no interaction is just so frustrating. I am not a huge fan of maxx c but at least it made the game a bit more balanced because you had a better chance of drawing into turn 1 interruption.
The only reason it’s banned is cause they want to differentiate between the TCG and OCG. TCG has far less diverse formats because it doesn’t have Maxx C, which makes Konami more money.
What if they did a hand trap that capped the special summon to 5 until the end of your next turn. So your opponent is capped, and you are capped on your next turn too. Obviously that favors control or stun decks. But five special summons is still a decent amount
That would hardly do anything against a deck like branded or swordsoul but it would kill a deck like HERO's. Special summons don't mean anything the amount that a deck special summons doesn't show how powerful it is. They shouldn't be something you should get punished for.....well except maybe nib because you can play around it in some ways.
@@Honest_Mids_Masher I mean, that’s kind of how some hand traps are already designed. Some decks can play shifter just fine and I think we can all agree that card sucks to play under. We still have droll that limits searches. I don’t understand why we don’t have a hand trap that limits special summons. Even a clause saying, “you cant have any cards on field to activate and resolve the effect” would be fine too.
@@joshy5lo All three of those cards shouldn't be a thing period. They're the unholy trinity of floodgate handtraps As for a handtrap that limits special summons like Maxx C that would just lead to non game where matches are absurdly one sided to where a player doesn't even get to do anything. That's the exact thing the game has been trying to move away from (top decks relying less on Omni negate boards).
Now, let me say this, If people are calling Ash toxic for just being an easy 3 of that gives you a consistent and repeatable negate from your hand, the "toxicity" maxx "c" compared to Ash Blossom would be like Comparing ash with a normal card.
They will not maxx c for the glariestest reason: You can't sell combo decks, or better put, its rarity bumbed n' warped ScR (just SR in OCG) if they lose to the beautiful cocroach. So to guarantee you must play combo and pay for it they took out of the equation the card that would make you think twice instead purchasing Gumblar, Deagon Link, Adamancipator, VW full, and so on. Konami created a taboo around Maxx since when they banned it here. Now the day they release Maxx C they will lose half the playerbase. Ilo, Maxx C is a card designed behind every line of text of every card since they are made in Japan and thus they have Maxx in mind. So what we play here is a shadow of true yugioh. I love Maxx.
@@Honest_Mids_Masherso maxc causes problems even though modern meta decks can get 15 monsters special summoned for free while playing solitaire? u think thats fair?
@@Nelex5000Tell me, what's the actual problem with special summons? Does a deck special summoning 15 times make it more powerful than a deck that special summons 5? Cause funnily enough that's not the case in this game and as for solitaire you really can't just wait 2 minutes? So yes I think it's fair special summons are irrelevant when it comes to how good a deck actually is.
@@Nelex5000 play the actual game. Every deck special summons an arbitrary amount to acheive whatever wincon they're going for. If you want T-set pass to be in the game, there's retro formats for that
I like Maxx "C" in OCG because it can be their inspiration to create a good midrange and control deck. Without it, I think YGO will be full of combo-based strategy, either broken or ending with nothing like some TCG Exclusive. And waiting in a card game isn't cool. . The modern format is more problematic than this card. Modern decks can also create advantages for free. I'm amazed by YGO players because they can find anything to blame, to justify the problematic modern format. For me, 2 consistent disruptions are more than enough for the game. But if every deck can put 4 more on the field, and random things in hand or backrow. Your opponent just starts with 6 or fewer cards, do you think this is fair too? Okay, they can draw a lot of handtraps, but maybe it makes their hand unplayable because no engine card. Okay, they can draw powerful board breakers, so, we depended on a 1-card win the game too? . Konami really needs to redesign the game to make it more fair. If we always justify the problematic approach to this game. This will lead to unfixable problems in the future. Or at least make the players play with 3 different cards or more, with cards completely different in each deck. I'm surprised we still only use 1 deck with (max.) 75 cards in the deck, while we have 13000+ cards in the game. This will fix some problematic aspects of the game.
@@PapajusLtu This mean, it is okay to release the C because the result is the same. Besides, I'm talking about how they create a deck, not deck that META or popular in the format. Your logic isn't really right. If we see Maxx "C" as broken cards, this means, OCG is more difficult. So, if a deck can survive in difficult environment OCG, of course this will be survive in easier TCG too. . The question, is the TCG META can also in OCG META? Like Unchained? Both TCG and OCG have different approach to build the deck, if you see the detail.
@@renaldyhaenThe meta stays the same sure however what about everything that's not meta. In the TCG a couple of months ago Abyss Actors topped a regional, 6 months ago Galaxy Eyes topped a regional. In a format without Maxx C 2 rogue tier anime underpowered decks are able to see competitive results. Does the OCG have something similar to this? Because this really just seems to me Maxx C gatekeeps rogue and casual decks from standing a chance against the meta due to them being forced to fill their deck with more non engine which does nothing against the meta itself.
This sentence makes no sense because Maxx C is an excuse to keep bullshit cards legal for longer than they should. Kashtira Ariseheart VFD Rhongonymiad Block Dragon The entirety of Tearalaments as a deck Superheavy Samurai Galaxy Tomahawk And so many other degenerate shit was allowed to live in the OCG because "Maxx C balances it out", when in reality you were just going to lose to those whenever you didn't draw your "win condition". Meanwhile the TCG saw the issue, banned the actual problems instead of trying to make it slightly less consistent
@@renaldyhaen Your first argument is that Maxx C saves OCG from being combo-based strategy fully, but then saying it's ok because they are still the same..? Maxx C doesn't help vs combo decks. It "helps" vs every deck and making every deck lose harder versus it. Hence why some call it "Maxx C minigame" Even if not talking about meta, it still keeps the same issues combo decks have and the same decks come up. The only difference between TCG and OCG is that decks that can pull off their combo are more preferred and doesn't lose to Maxx C that more and combo decks build in a way to have some plan B for Maxx C
Would be even more annoying, considering the # of cards... but at the same time might push away traps in favor of board breakers, since you have 3 slots to work with
I think Maxx C is usually fine in a casual format, but when serious competition in any way enters the conversation my opinion is different, it is very uncompetitive so should be banned in big tournaments.
If you are talking about the same modern YGO and not time wizard formats: Maxx C hurts below rogue decks even more. Even really bad decks prefer to special summon at least several times and that already gives insane advantage to the opponent even when your board would not be that impressive It's like, Maxx C does the exact same to top deck as it does to Tier F deck, so if it hurts and sometimes kills top decks, how would it not do the same to others?
@@PapajusLtu because I said casual formats and Yu-Gi-Oh currently has 0 official casual formats. And even then, I would personally still prefer to play without it. By casual formats I mean formats you'd likely agree on with just a group of friends.
Is Maxx C fine? Absolutely not. Why? Because it shuts down an entire game mechanic, that’s why it’s banned. Both Droll & Shifter shut down entire game mechanics. Neither of these are fine and should be banned. You don’t change your deck choice entirely because you ‘might’ have to play around Nib/Ash/Imperm, but you do for Maxx C/Droll/Shifter. That’s not healthy for players. Maxx C though rewards a player for using it, rather than strictly punishing the opponent like Droll/Shifter. However, only reason that mistake and macro are completely fine, is because they are both traps with a physical point to break the condition applied, not hand traps. (Edit, because I forgot to add: Shutting down core game mechanics isn’t a format dependent thing).
Maxx C can activated at any time , D shifter requires you absolutely not to use a gy based deck and most will not do that at all as the popular choice. Shifter is an absolute brick if you never draw into it and your too far into the game with alot of cards in gy Droll is a hit or miss depending upon the deck and format and alot of combo decks are using crossout designator the card out of the duel which is a at 3 fyi.
@@gravekeepersven82 Hardly. The majority if not all of what you replied with was just "but it isn't" without actually providing a legitamamte reason for why either card is healthy.
There was a YCS final that Zoodiac lost because the True draco player drew Maxx C twice in a row and skipped their turn. That was the final straw for the TCG, and honestly, why wouldn't it be? Average turn in a maxx C format goes 2 ways 1."I normal summon" "Activate Maxx C" "End phase" 2."I normal summon" "Activate Maxx C" "Called by/Ash/Crossout" "Opponent scoops" Its a god awful gameplay
Literally the deck that beat zoodiac was at the time a year or two old koonami didnt want older decks to beat the new decks its literally the main reason they ban anything non meta
I think this is a very good discussion! As an ocg player, I think max c is necessary, because max c is a card that undermines the first suppression by strong combo decks. Cards like Maxx c Nibiru will undermine combo decks. If these cards are not there, even just a strong combo deck will become stronger. And even if you get hit by or use maxx c, it doesn't mean you win or lose 100% of the time; you can stop within 3 draws and play 1 or 2 blocking cards, or you can play a strategy of pushing through without worrying about the draws. Besides, thanks to the fact that many cards in modern Yu-Gi-Oh have turn 1 restrictions on the use of their effects, it is less likely that all the cards drawn can be used. Also, the source is vague and uncertain, but I have seen an analysis that says that max c makes the win rate of the first player about 55% and the win rate of the second player 45%, and that without max c, the win rate of the second player would be even lower. For these reasons and my personal feeling as an opinion I see from playing in Japan, I think that more than about 60% of players need max c and can have fun dueling without banning it. However, there are some ocg players who do not like max c, and even those who accept it, I feel that there are very many who say that max c is the worst thing to use after the prior has combo'd. I believe that there are definitely improvements to be made to a powerful card.
@@MxZ40 I and most ocg players do not think it is fair at all. I often hear people say that there needs to be an errata that can be used only for Second players.
Maxx c does not stop or hinder combo decks at all. If maxx c really stop combo decks then why is Superheavy Samurai, Snake Eye and other combo decks dominates the meta? The worst thing about maxx c is when I go second and did not open any handtrap. I strategize on how to play around their board and break it while my opponent are doing their combo. Then my opponenet uses maxx c on my turn and I lose cuz I need my special summon. Maxx c needs to be ban. If maxx c is really needed to keep combo deck in check, they need to make a restriction for maxx c. If maxx c have a restriction just like psy-frame gamma then the card is more balanced.
Ofc the only way Maxx “C” gonna be used is first turn player build a board then pass turn and drop “C” on the second turn player. Never would the second turn player draw the card. According to TCG players.
Before snake eyes combo decks were not a problem in the TCG however for many reasons. One they lose to soo many regular handtraps and not just nibiru. Infinite Impermanence on Junk speeder for example. Two being that if combo decks ever did get out of hand they were dealt with by the banlist. Superheavy Samurai lost Scarecrow in less than 2 weeks so we didn't need to suffer any FTK decks or anything like that (I'm pretty sure there was an instance of that getting results in the OCG). In the TCG before snake eyes out of the top 5 decks seeing representation only 1 was a combo deck which was unchained. As for stopping between 3 draws and putting up blocking cards there's soo many decks that simply can't do that because their deck is bad. Galaxy Eyes, Odd Eyes, Live Twins. They all require you to go above 5 to even get anything remotely resembling an endboard. As for giving the opponent draws that is an automatic loss if the opponent is playing a good/meta deck. As for the opponent not being able to use all of the cards due to OPT restriction. Do you think a Live twin player than end on a pop 1 and maybe an imperm and ash for example could stop a Snake Eyes deck with 11 cards in hand because they used Maxx C going second? Frankly I don't see that happening. Can't speak on the source due to it being unreliable however Maxx C factually helps meta decks get easy wins. It forces every player to run ,the same 9-10 cards in every deck 3 Maxx C, 3 Ash Blossom, Called by, 2-3 crossout. That's a 1/4 of the deck you could've used to counter the meta currently but because of Maxx C you don't have the deckspace to run the counters to it. Proof of banning Maxx C giving weaker decks a chance is that Galaxy Eyes, Abyss Actors, Marinecess, and Plunder Patrol have gotten tops at regionals or YCS's in the past year in the TCG a format without Maxx C.
i hate maxx "c". not a fan when every deck has to play certain cards, i feel the same way abought ash, droll and imperm. this meta you cant play anything. i miss older yugioh with 6 card starts. i know we cant do that because decks are too over powered now days.
Imagine banning cards because it grants going second too much advantage when going first clearly grants too much advantage in a format heavily revolved around combo decks
the player going first can set up AND drop a Maxx C. How often do you sit through your opponent's 5 minute combo, see the endboard and think "hey I can play through this", and then they just drop the Maxx C as a cherry on top?
@@haydenbennett3547 I can live with that. I can sincerely understand Maxx C as a purely going second tool. The fact that your opponent can just go Maxx C on top of an already established board is idiotic
The only cards that should be banned are those with no counters. This is a card game the whole point is to build strategies against both known and unknown threats and guess what no one will win 💯lol because there’s also a bit of luck. People are too sensitive about cards.
By that logic Ash blossom should have been banned years ago. In fact, in many decks these days, Ash blossom is inserted without even thinking, the same way Maxx C was. Mainly because it always resolves, there's always searching and there is always something happening with the graveyard. In fact, Master Duel shows that Maxx C isn't that monster people say it is. In fact, despite being the most picked card over there, there's a high chance yours will never resolve anyway, Ash, called by, Droll, all of witch are highly popular as non-engines. All because of Maxx C? No, but it's a factor. You can say whatever you want, Maxx C existing over there sometimes doesn't make sense, but without it? Nibiru would be more popular, Floodgates in general would be more popular. Much worse go second cards would be more prevalent due to the power vacum of a potential ban of the Insect would cause. A necessary evil.
To the contrary Master Duel proved just how bad Maxx C is many players who were indifferent to it began to hate it after playing Master Duel one of which being Farfa. Not to mention it helps meta decks by taking up 8-9 spaces in your deck which could've been used for anti-meta cards. Name one handtrap that does anything similar to that. Ash is seeing less use in the TCG btw because of how bad it is against Snake eyes and yet here in Master Duel we're still forced to run it anyways. Also droll is such a bad counter to Maxx C because you're putting yourself under it's effect as well since it affects both players. I'll gladly take nib in the format at least that doesn't help the meta like Maxx C does and benefits mainly going second. As for floodgates they're all hit in the TCG anyways and bad going second cards? Once again TCG players would've used them by now because they haven't had Maxx C for years however they use relatively the same cards as Master Duel player do. It's not a necessary evil, it's a card that holds this game back from being fun and has only caused problems.
Keep crying about Maxx “C” TCG Players. The card has lots of counters that are commonly played in the actual game. Please do not cry anymore with the same BS argumenta.
@@christianosantiagorivera3560Nobody cares that Maxx"C" has commonly played counters. That doesn't change the fact that Maxx"C" isn't fun to play against, especially going second.
Max c is a good card I got 2 pages of them. Ppl in the TCG just have no brains. It’s not that hard to band it. It causes balance to the game . Ppl mad cuz they can’t go full force . I
Say you summon 4 times, 1 of them being your normal (playing around nibiru). In that case, Maxx C draws 3 cards. Which means the going 2nd player will sometimes have 5 cards in hand and sometimes 7, which sounds like a nightmare to balance.
@@louistech112 So run the Maxx C package or play Floo/Trap Control/Stun. Also, what are hand limit cards ? Also there is another issue, cards in OCG are designed around Maxx C existing. If cards in 2005/2006 were designed around hard countering Mirror Force (or whatever staple of the time), would that be healthier than just banning Mirror Force ?
ygo players are just extremely delusional and they will always tell you how much they hate the game and that x card is problematic. no maxxc? damn, shifter must be the problem card that makes it unplayable. no shifter? must be droll or fkng branded fusion or whatever that makes it unenjoyable lol
People hate shifter because there's no Downside to decks that use it but the post duea design ethos put more focus on the graveyard which they still do meaning it functionally gimps most decks that aren't even combo.
Master duel can't even reign in super heavy samurai or how it's original format was tier 0. I'll accept it's a better banlist when they actually can make normal changes
Maxx’s problem isn’t that it can be used to beat combo decks but that combo decks can use it to beat everything else as well lol
I mean, even against Control deck Maxx C isn't that bad, almost every deck in YuGiOh special summon so it will always go plus or neutral in card avantage
@@TouchMe888 lmao bro, literally have a 45% win rate going second. just get good bozo
Maxx C effectively gatekeeps the meta.
if your deck is unable to play thru a maxx C resolving or cannot use the package to prevent it from resolving(which includes your own copies of maxx C) your deck is not " competitive"
and for thatalone Maxx C has no place in the game.
the same apply for every single card (ash, impermanence, veiler, crossout, all floodgates, etc) but being realistic, they hit harder the combo decks
"Maxx "c" has counterplay"
The counterplay: *End Phase*
then proceeds to get otk on the few seconds later
so effectively skipping your turn
that sounds even more broken.
I've never really bought the "stops combo" argument for maxx "c". Especially when you look at master duel. They get hit by stuff like SHS just as bad as the TCG does. The problem is the lack of balancing as you put it. Maxx can be used just as effectively by a combo player as it can by anyone else.
yeah many midrange decks need at least 4 summons to pass on anything decent so it is basically just upstart that also reads skip your turn against them
@@freaki0734no dude you don't understand, without maxx c i wouldnt be able to beat oppressive combo decks like dragonmaid. seals pass **needs** to be kept in check
I think it keeps combo deck out of top regionals at least. We mostly see mid-range in OCG Tops while we still have Mannadium, Unchain in TCG Tops.
Maxx C should never return. A candidate for the most powerful card in the game's history. Master Duel contains only a fraction of the power of the TCG.
Also best of one format in MD. So… yeah. Everyone and their mother is running this card because it’s best of one. There’s no side decking in regular MD ladder. It’s go big or go home.
TCG? you have the side deck and best 2 out of 3.
I'd argue there's a fifth aspect for why Maxx "C" is banned in the TCG. You can play it going first, all you need do to build a turn one board, then drop the bug during your opponents draw phase.
Would it be a more balance card if his effect can only be activated if you control no card in your side of the field:?
@@sinjoh53TBH I'd be okay with is coming back with that restriction.
@@sinjoh53It still becomes a turn skip card for the going first player which just creates non games.
@@sinjoh53If Maxx C were balanced, no one would use it.
@@Honest_Mids_Masher shifter does the same right now so
-Maxx C doesn't really stop combo decks. Combo decks being the "hot new deck" will end up on top regardless and will also run Maxx C themselves if given the chance. Its resolution will tilt the scales in favor of the user most of the time it appears in, but when talking statistics, the overall win ratios of the best decks will remain the overall win ratios of the best decks in any format that uses Maxx C when everybody has the same chance of using Maxx C.
-It's not weird that "tcg banned it if they created it". The OCG side of Konami calls all those shots like the banlist and the cards they want to have TCG release first.
-Yes it was designed for its time when Droll and Maxx C were both considered "ok" to "bad" historically, but we know the game is not at all at the power/speed/complexity level it was at in 2011, so rather the question is not on why TCG banned it, but why it hasn't been banned in OCG and Konami also refuses to ban it in Master Duel.
Oh yes Mannadium is my favorite top tier OCG deck.
@@spacepsycatWasn't doing anything in the TCG outside of exactly Trif playing it.
it really does though playing maxx along with other hand traps can put a damper on the unbreakable board decks
@@Captyugioh Went to check on OCG meta videos and the same thing seems to be topping over there (Snake Eyes) as tier 0 or close to it. Maxx C is not tilting the balance in a meaningful manner. It just keeps some anecdotal single duel evidence scenarios in check because the card is unfair but it can't realistically keep things in check when the very decks some people claim to put in check are also using it to keep the pressure after establishing boards.
@@Sleepy0173 Well neither format is close to tier 0 but now and on average they have more variety in their decks due to maxx c. Drawing maxx c first is much worse than drawing it going second. Its taking the place of a card you could be using to extend your combo or stop a hand trap your op could have. For example this format their voiceless is stronger than ours because of maxx c. So much infact that is its performing better than pure snake eyes and has pushed the relavance of fire from about 60-70 percent between the 2 main decks to around 30 percent. That is 50 percent reduction in the power of the main combo deck. Case closed
They would rather have maxx c than fix a bigger problem.
9:35 - Just a fun fact, TCG does not create cards without Japan okaying it. Usually they test stuff on us.
In Red Reboot's defense; FUCK STUN DECKS! If the continuous flood gate trap cards were either heavily limited/banned Red Reboot would not be in the main deck and just relegated to a side deck only card.
As for the limiting of popular cards in OCG; I call bullshit because Master Duel exists, and a lot of the popular cards are basically Maxx "C" and counters to it, with maybe Droll & Lock Bird/Nibiru, the Primal Being/ Dimension Shifter being played along side it Ash Blossom & Joyous Spring is no longer viable due to fire decks being popular.
I saw someone suggest naming a card-type "floodgate" and having a ruling where you can only control 1 of them. And it honestly sounds pretty good.
@@juksleo62571 floodgate is more than enough. Skill drain would still screw over most decks. At best you just made people play more solemn cards.
The last 3 formats with maxx c showed the power it held was absurd as a purely going first card to insulate you more from your opponent.
Being able to full zoo combo. Drop a maxx c thier turn was a point where maxc c was not future proofed at all.
Maxx C needs an eratta that makes it where you can only activate it if you control no cards, and maybe add a 1 card discard cost to prevent spamming it. That way it won't be used on your opponent after setting up your crazy board with 5 negates. I imagine this would severely cut how many decks play it
a max c like card would need a discard 3/4 minimum with out resricting the frequency or type of special summon needed. if it was extra deck summons and resricted to every other extradeck summon a discard 1 would get close to doing it.
@@randomprotag9329 I disagree. Max C is good as a going second tool to help draw enough cards to out your opponents board. The problem with Maxx C is it has no restrictions, so the going first player can go full combo, set up 4 to 5 disruptions, then Max C their opponent during the standby phase. This is just downright oppressive when it happens.
I think the card can definitely be fixed with a few tweaks, but the goal of those tweaks should be to change the card from being broken to just good. That way it's not an auto include in every deck but it would still see play in certain strategies
@@JustSomeGuyLass the problem is its too good of one. if the issue is the choice of going first and second is unbalanced with first being too good making second too good is not the solving the issue. a turn skip should come with sigificent risk and cost.
The difference is the difference in the formats power levels (and the TCGs need to sell more in a shorter time).
If you look at the OCG, they have overall a much higher power ceiling. Cards like Ariseheart for example were never banned in OCG. Instead they limit consistency tools such as the field spell. This allows for games to be very dynamic, as the presence of such blowout cards can cause major swings through the match, but it won't necessarily happen, so you have to hedge your bets and think ahead. This also reduces how many "dead" decks there are, as it doesn't outright kill cards core to most strategies.
TCG on the other hand hits cards that affect the overall power ceiling. Going back to our Kash example Ariseheart is banned in TCG, which basically kills Kash as a main deck strategy.
And then another factor is ease of access / selling cards. SHS was super cheap in the TCG, as most cards were commons. Yet, it performed super well. The deck got hit almost instantly in order to force players to go after new releases. OCG doesn't generally do this as players in Asian markets are generally more willing to spend on cards, whereas in the TCG players are generally chasing the next big thing. The need to "force" players to buy is greater in TCG than in OCG.
Almost every deck revolves around special summons maxxx c being a thing basically turns every duel into the pot of greed meme video. I use max c to draw 1 card, I use max to draw 1 card, max c card, max c card. Maybe it’s bc I’m not a huge yugioh player but it’s pretty cut and dry to me
I feel like we could errata max c to prevent you from activating cards in your hand for the rest of the turn it was actived. Because other than the draw power the biggest issue I have with maxx is when my opponent draws into additional hand traps. Could be wrong about this but when your opponent has to choose between maxing your opponent or choosing another handtrap if they drew into multiple.
My errata was you can't have any cards in your graveyard so like dimension shifter
@@crazyxxpanda2380 that would definitely balance the card making it so only people going second could use it. I like that idea.
@@crazyxxpanda2380 That would still be problematic. Doesn't matter how big of a board you build, you will simply just outweight them by simple card advantage be it breakers or starters
@@crazyxxpanda2380Still makes it a turn skip card. Also some decks can play without any cards in the grave.
@@Honest_Mids_Masher but not top decks
ALL THEY HAD TO DO WAS put,
“You ONLY can activate this card if you control 2 or less cards on the field.”
it still would be broken cause you can make 2 generic ED monsters like appo + baronne and drop it on opponent turn
@@ayham613 I hear you but those cards can be cancelled out by Imperm, Droplet, Dark ruler no more, or you can just run over the appo+ and then try to combo off. Basically, that end board you put is more feasible than what we deal with now lol
Having a card that can randomly sack your opponent is extremely bad for the game, even if you can only activate it going second
I would say “you can’t activate this card if you control and cards on field.” That would fix it
Still makes it a turn skip card which is toxic
Just 2 corrections:
1. TCG has all the pots unlimited while OCG has most of them limited.
2. OCG designs the cards. The TCG only adapts them with the exception of TCG exclusives. So cards like Evenly have the balance factor because of OCG designers.
You need to give your videos a little more thought. But good job.
The video was fine
This is why ocg is better. Ocg card also print nicer and cheaper.
Seeing that maxx c is a must have in almost every deck in masterduel I shutter to think of the impact tcg would have if every deck required it to even have a chance to win a game
So with Dimension Shifter, I ran it for some time to counter Kashtira when I first hopped onto Master Duel but I realized they quickly gained advantage with banished monsters because Ariseheart or whatever isn’t banned in Master Duel. So I took it out. But with snake eyes, I tried putting it back into my deck. I drew it turn 1 and stopped my opponent’s play. Then I set up my traps and passed turn. Once the effect was over, I activated all my combos and locked my opponent out. He gave me the win for that round and I hadn’t even attacked. I run 3 Dimension Shifters now because I can and most decks can’t work around it. Some decks do but with my second engine of Branded, I can Fusion summon Albion and then Lubellion and then bounce back my banished cards to my deck and still have an advantage because my banished cards are no longer banished and I have good tempo of the game.
How on earth did you arrive at running shifter to counter the best shifter deck
@@freaki0734 because Kashtira wasn’t running Shifter when I started Master Duel back in 2022. I never once saw a single deck run Shifter, only Dark Hero Mask Law or a Eater of Millions or other summoned monsters that banished cards that went to the GY. I didn’t run into Shifter till I dedicated my deck to beat Kashtira and Shifter did work for a while because anything detached was banished and they could only special summon one banished but my floodgate lock negated any activated effects on the field so whatever they summoned, it couldn’t activate so most the Kashtira players scooped and I finally had a chance to rank up. But nowadays..It’s a terrible idea to run Shifter against Kashtira. I’d side out all 3 Shifters and side in both my imperms and effect Velier instead.
Rather they keep it banned or not it up to them no matter i still play Yu-Gi-Oh even if maxx c is legal again
The best comparision I had on this topic was like a few weeks back with the last Master Duel Event. One of them having close to none handtraps at all, the other being all in again.
While the first event felt like a fresh wind and I saw a lot of different never seen decks, the second event was all the same again and you couldn't do one turn without handtrap spam.
For Maxx C especially a erata would be needed. Because playing it going second, does help you - BUT - your opponent going full combo turn one and you are getting Maxx C'd on your first turn misses the point of this card in my opinion.
It undermines power creep, and they want to keep selling new OP cards. Konami's always focused on financial incentive ahead of a healthy format.
No mention of Max C being banned once hand traps started becoming a thing?
Now Max C could draw you into interaction during your opponent’s turn, instead of just a bunch of traps and starters
It was on the banlist but not actually _banned_ in the synchro era and I feel that in that era it was fine at 1, just not with today's modern handtraps. If I was going to bring it back, it would need to not let that happen. But honestly I think all it needed was an added "you cannot activate effects from your hand for the rest of the turn, also if it is during your opponent's turn you cannot summon from the extra deck or activate effects from the graveyard during the battle phase and end phase of this turn. If you drew 7 or more cards by this effect, discard 3 random cards" Done. You can't use Maxx C to draw into an Ash and stop your opponent's combos. You might have a giant hand, but your opponent will have a board with negates probably. I was a defender of Maxx C since it was banned and became a critic of it once I touched Master Duel. I do not want to see it back in its current form ever again. In fact I think I use unofficial emulators more often than I play MD because of this mess.
Master Duel shows pretty effectively how degenerate Maxx C is in a TCG-related meta. If someone uses it, the opponent's situration pretty much devolves into a risk-risk type of deal:
1: You can stop and if the interrupted combo was vital to the gamestate, that may be an F.
2: You can keep playing and just hope nothing your opponent draws will beat you next turn, which is most likely an F.(And that is assuming they don't just draw something they can activate off-rip to mess you up)
3: Or you can try to force-deck out your opponent by combo-ing especially hard, but that turns into case 2 if you miscalculated(or they draw a handtrap that messes you up. Imagine you are like one card away from winning and then they force-end your turn. I'd imagine everyone would do the face Seto made when he saw Exodia).
A singular card completely twisting the game into the 4th dimension like that does not seem like a good idea to allow for Konami. Someone's opinion on if the card should be allowed depends entirely on if they think this type of gameplay is fun to watch and/or play and if "countering C" is a reasonable parameter to expect from comboplayers when they build their deck.
Maxx c is needed in Master duel to even play the game going second.
@@denglong7180 This card game is really a mess, isn't it?
If there is a single(!) Card so powerful that people argue for it by saying it fixes the game then it needs to stay banned. no card should hold this much power, make it a game mechanic if it fixes the game.
Maxx C should have a change to
"Only actives if u dont controls no cards on the field "
that way it can be used as intended to stop Combo decks from goin 1st and summon a whole board that negates the opponent field, if u go 2nd the opponent cannot use it since he already build his field giving u a opportunity to fight back a field full of monsters with negates effects and trap cards
Another reason why they wont ban maxx c in the OCG i feel is because its a best of 1 format. In the TCG usually combo decks arent the best decks so you often side cards like nibiru and dark ruler for going 2nd.
In a best of 1 format if you dont draw anything to beat a say SHS board you just isntantly lose so opening maxx c is just an instant win button, same as how SHS going uninterrupted is an instsnt win button
The problem with Maxx “C” is that it amplifies all of the hand traps in your deck and your opponent’s deck, which steepens the meta game, and many decks simply won’t get their time to shine. Although it makes stun decks with shallow combos insanely competitive, it also makes it much harder for rogue archetypal decks to compete.
Consider the maxx c argument missing the point of some of the nasty combo decks getting to plus off it. Making it easier to rebuild after breakers are used against you. After getting past negates. Maxx is useless if they have a game that turn. Sure, you may draw a hand trap that could counter, but need to consider the statistics in drawing the out through Maxx.
You missed the main aspect, which is money. As introverted as people are (myself included) i believe the majority of players would prefer playing in person as opposed to master duel or other simulators. Since the TCG is where konami makes its money, they have to make certain bans to keep the money coming in. Too many players would quit if it were legal. Im definitely in the minority when I say MAXX C TO 3 TCG, but I enjoy the maxx c challenge, and wish we played under the OCG list
People who want maxx c back forget that their opponent can also use it
If the brought back Max C, I would simply quit the game. I don’t say this lightly, I fucking love the card game. But I will not tolerate this bs card
Weak bro lol it’s a good card
@@louistech112that's the problem. It's way too good of a card and it needs to be banned.
@@louistech112 I guess you one of those that will scoop the moment Max C dont resolve 🤡
Please leave. Exit is that way.
@@denglong7180 keep coping on master duel scrub.
It was a good attempt to get into Tcg Konami's philosophy.
You made some good point but there's space for plenty of counter arguments.
-TCG hates free advantage generators: what about Branded Fusion, the adventure package, Robina, Martha, Mo Ye etc. being all part of archetypes which had their share of success without being ever featured on the banlist?
Surely the examples you brought came from hits directed towards generally better archetypes, but if so it has less to do with sheer advantage generated by those.
-TCG hates draw cards: you pointed out the upstart yourself, but as someone said in the comments, all the pots are unlimited while they do have limitations in the OCG.
Exposing yourself to droll for some random cards is pretty bad. Even the less random of those (Prosperity) is not so popular at the moment.
-TCG hates unbalanced going second cards: pointing out Red Reboot is a big stretch for how uninteractive the card is.
Evenly Match is crazy unbalanced punishing you for not putting/keeping a trap negate on board or at least for not having a way to limit the damage. Super poly was also pointed out by yourself.
But a similar argument can be made for other cards which doesn't see much play at the moment such as Kurikara/Golem, DRMN, Denko Sekka.
In general we are daily complaining about how going second is ass even by having a lot of crazy tools at our disposal.
Konami is not excessively getting rid those and I dont see a reason why they should.
So it was a fun video, but Maxx C is a card from another league.
Just play some time wizard in which it is legal. You can find it in most of the main decks even if spammy strategies are not that succesful.
If you ask me it was banned in TCG cause it felt unfair while in OCG they didn't feel that urgency. Time passed, list shaped accordingly to the ban and there was no room for a u-turn.
Your arguments are also flawed.
Evenly Match only punishes trap decks. Against combo decks you will never resolve it as they will always negate it or save one negate. Red Reboot also only punishes trap decks does nothing to combo decks as combo decks run zero traps except Inpern. OCG no one plays evenly matched for this very reason.
OCG has Chichen Game Upstart and Averice legal for a long time, no one played it despite the FTKs every tcg player fear mongers existing in the OCG. Desires no one plays anymore because Ash exist. OCG it was hit cause Droll and Ash are saved for Maxx C and others not desires.
TCG hates stun cards and floodgates way more then the OCG. TCG also gates trap decks. TCG can not play a trap deck without turning it into an unconventional combo deck. Only shows tcg is extremely biased to combo decks.
TCG gas a long history of punishing trap decks
@@soukenmarufwt5224 evenly just good against trap decks? Dude, you should really pick up something different than Stun.
People literally jump on their chair when you attempt to leave mp1, trying to figure out a way to save as many resources as they can.
We are in a format in which if you get lucky you can put an omni on field.
And if you can't force it prior to Evenly, you can bait said negation which is something.
So please do not call other's argument flawed coming from a biased prospective.
Is the Maxx C experience different between the TCG and Master Duel formats? I haven’t played against it in TCG but on Master Duel, it’s fairly easy to play over and ignore even when I am going full combo with a HERO deck who relies heavily on SS.
If max c was unbanned it would be a must play. almost like the old school tool box staples. almost all of them were in every deck and being touched in some way at some time in future banlist/restricted.
I think Konami wants more deck building choices not deck building must play cards.
With that said
It’s weird because almost every deck goes into the same extra deck monsters in some way shape or form.
Almost every engine does the same thing just in a different way resulting in similar set ups.
What’s the background music?
Let's say there was a hand trap that says: "If you lose the die roll and your opponent made you go second, you can send this card from your hand to the GY on your opponent's first standby phase. Play as if you are the player going first and your opponent now is going second. " Will this card be banned even though all it does is make it seem as if you won the die roll where you lost
In my opinion, 70% of the problem with Maxx C is not when they activated on the 1st turn, but when the opponent going 1st, already made a board full of disruption and negates, then resolves Maxx C on your turn.
While you try to end the game, the opponent already accumulates many handtraps on their hand to disturb you more. If the opponent survived, they will counter you with >10 cards on their hands. Meanwhile, if you just set & pass, then you definitely would loss (except if you played trap decks, which is a minority).
All Konami need is to just at least errata it, makes it "can only be activated if you control no cards".
Its banned cause it warps the format around it forcing everyone to play the same 6 cards to counter it.
Irrelevant. There's Ash, Nibiru, Droll, Impermanence etc.
The real reason is because Combo Players have Thin Skin in the TCG.
the only decks maxx c doesnt affect are floo and stun. its a + 3 or 5 even on the most middest of midrange decks
@@lanius1084
Don't really care for the argument against Maxx "C" since we can evidently see it not do much in the OCG to derail Combo Decks regardless of range.
Ash, Droll, Called and Crossout exist and contrary to popular belief, all four aren't used exclusively on Maxx "C" as there are many interactions in this game that can negatively impact your opening hand even before your opponent gets to play.
@@D.AblosFamilia in master duel it is quite literally in every single competitive deck. we can evidently see that it has the potential to be the most powerful card of the entire game so lets not play with nuclear bombs like that
@@lanius1084 And so is Ash Blossom. In fact, Ash Blossom has been in every competitive deck in the TCG for the last 7 years with very little decline in it's use due to it's wide versatility in the interactions it has.
Doesn't matter at the end of the day because TCG players do in fact have thin skin.
@@D.AblosFamilia If you need Max C to resolve to win you bad 🤡
Pretty sure that Maxx C could be unbanned with the "if you control no cards" as an activation condition.
You know what? I think they should bake the Maxx C stuff into the core rules. The idea that there should be something that lowers the attractiveness of endless combo chains is sound, it being tied to a card effect is however the true problem because that just means it's a no brainer staple like Pot of Greed and other such stuff.
I just hate maxx c cause it does nothing but make the format more sacky and deck building becomes uninteresting. If you cant play and counter maxx c then your deck is usually bad.
macc gatekeeps the meta, which should not be happening
10:09 I really don't like how every deck in Yu-Gi-Oh has to have these 3 cards in every deck even before you build a new deck you have to have these 3 cards before building your engine.
cards i have are as follows. thats ok we still have retaliating c and contact c. i checked the list. bottomless trap hole isn't on there,neither are book of moon and compulsory evacuation device. and neither is cyber dragon. ash blossom isn't there either. infinite impermanence isn't there either. i know soul charge is there. solemn judgement isn't there either.
reasoning is. but is limited but i wish they had numbers next to them to say to how many.
i know prank kids meow meow mu is i want it off of the list. neither is dimension shifter. and finally neither is
dark ruler no more.
I think we should have another card with the same effect of maxx c with a limitation like can draw max 3 card and/or can play this card when oponnent have more monster in the board than you
I miss the days of “one card facedown defense and 2 cards in the back row, pass.” Waiting for people to spend 6 minutes building their unbreakable board with 10 negates on turn one with no interaction is just so frustrating. I am not a huge fan of maxx c but at least it made the game a bit more balanced because you had a better chance of drawing into turn 1 interruption.
Sure but then the guy who built their 10 negate board drops it on you and you go burn your cards in an actual bonfire.
@@astrobonkDoesn't matter because either way you lose the game lol
The only reason it’s banned is cause they want to differentiate between the TCG and OCG. TCG has far less diverse formats because it doesn’t have Maxx C, which makes Konami more money.
What if they did a hand trap that capped the special summon to 5 until the end of your next turn. So your opponent is capped, and you are capped on your next turn too. Obviously that favors control or stun decks. But five special summons is still a decent amount
That would hardly do anything against a deck like branded or swordsoul but it would kill a deck like HERO's. Special summons don't mean anything the amount that a deck special summons doesn't show how powerful it is. They shouldn't be something you should get punished for.....well except maybe nib because you can play around it in some ways.
Let's make nib either absolutely terrible in one match up or absolutely broken if paired with it
I don't think it's good card design. Lingering floodgates of any kind must go. Period.
@@Honest_Mids_Masher I mean, that’s kind of how some hand traps are already designed. Some decks can play shifter just fine and I think we can all agree that card sucks to play under. We still have droll that limits searches. I don’t understand why we don’t have a hand trap that limits special summons. Even a clause saying, “you cant have any cards on field to activate and resolve the effect” would be fine too.
@@joshy5lo All three of those cards shouldn't be a thing period. They're the unholy trinity of floodgate handtraps
As for a handtrap that limits special summons like Maxx C that would just lead to non game where matches are absurdly one sided to where a player doesn't even get to do anything. That's the exact thing the game has been trying to move away from (top decks relying less on Omni negate boards).
Max c is fair.
MD needs to axe it. It’s gotten into 90 percent of decks.
One of the most individually easy to use while rewarding cards ever made.
It's close to 94% last one I saw which is absolutely absurd rep
designator fixes maxx, first to draw wins.
Now, let me say this,
If people are calling Ash toxic for just being an easy 3 of that gives you a consistent and repeatable negate from your hand, the "toxicity" maxx "c" compared to Ash Blossom would be like Comparing ash with a normal card.
Great video 👍
Bro great video. Let me know if you wanna collab.
They will not maxx c for the glariestest reason: You can't sell combo decks, or better put, its rarity bumbed n' warped ScR (just SR in OCG) if they lose to the beautiful cocroach. So to guarantee you must play combo and pay for it they took out of the equation the card that would make you think twice instead purchasing Gumblar, Deagon Link, Adamancipator, VW full, and so on.
Konami created a taboo around Maxx since when they banned it here. Now the day they release Maxx C they will lose half the playerbase.
Ilo, Maxx C is a card designed behind every line of text of every card since they are made in Japan and thus they have Maxx in mind. So what we play here is a shadow of true yugioh.
I love Maxx.
I disagree about Shifter. Shifter is used in decks that don’t give a damn about the purported downside.
People would complain even if this card was at 1
Probably because it still caused problems even when it was limited.
@@Honest_Mids_Masherso maxc causes problems even though modern meta decks can get 15 monsters special summoned for free while playing solitaire? u think thats fair?
@@Nelex5000Tell me, what's the actual problem with special summons? Does a deck special summoning 15 times make it more powerful than a deck that special summons 5? Cause funnily enough that's not the case in this game and as for solitaire you really can't just wait 2 minutes? So yes I think it's fair special summons are irrelevant when it comes to how good a deck actually is.
@@Nelex5000 play the actual game. Every deck special summons an arbitrary amount to acheive whatever wincon they're going for. If you want T-set pass to be in the game, there's retro formats for that
@@Honest_Mids_Masher oh naaaaaahhhh💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀😭😭😭😭😭😭
just unban top of greed its not even as strong as maxx c
maxx c should be 3 at all formats. ppl who cant play around maxx is unskilled
Agreed. TCG players smoking copium. They get a panic attack just from hear the name "Maxx"
I just use Maxx c as a hand trap bait tbh it exists to get negated
I like Maxx "C" in OCG because it can be their inspiration to create a good midrange and control deck. Without it, I think YGO will be full of combo-based strategy, either broken or ending with nothing like some TCG Exclusive. And waiting in a card game isn't cool.
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The modern format is more problematic than this card. Modern decks can also create advantages for free. I'm amazed by YGO players because they can find anything to blame, to justify the problematic modern format. For me, 2 consistent disruptions are more than enough for the game. But if every deck can put 4 more on the field, and random things in hand or backrow. Your opponent just starts with 6 or fewer cards, do you think this is fair too? Okay, they can draw a lot of handtraps, but maybe it makes their hand unplayable because no engine card. Okay, they can draw powerful board breakers, so, we depended on a 1-card win the game too?
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Konami really needs to redesign the game to make it more fair. If we always justify the problematic approach to this game. This will lead to unfixable problems in the future. Or at least make the players play with 3 different cards or more, with cards completely different in each deck. I'm surprised we still only use 1 deck with (max.) 75 cards in the deck, while we have 13000+ cards in the game. This will fix some problematic aspects of the game.
TCG doesn't have maxx C yet both TCG and OCG meta is almost the same. Your first argument doesn't hold
@@PapajusLtu This mean, it is okay to release the C because the result is the same. Besides, I'm talking about how they create a deck, not deck that META or popular in the format. Your logic isn't really right. If we see Maxx "C" as broken cards, this means, OCG is more difficult. So, if a deck can survive in difficult environment OCG, of course this will be survive in easier TCG too.
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The question, is the TCG META can also in OCG META? Like Unchained? Both TCG and OCG have different approach to build the deck, if you see the detail.
@@renaldyhaenThe meta stays the same sure however what about everything that's not meta. In the TCG a couple of months ago Abyss Actors topped a regional, 6 months ago Galaxy Eyes topped a regional. In a format without Maxx C 2 rogue tier anime underpowered decks are able to see competitive results. Does the OCG have something similar to this? Because this really just seems to me Maxx C gatekeeps rogue and casual decks from standing a chance against the meta due to them being forced to fill their deck with more non engine which does nothing against the meta itself.
This sentence makes no sense because Maxx C is an excuse to keep bullshit cards legal for longer than they should.
Kashtira Ariseheart
VFD
Rhongonymiad
Block Dragon
The entirety of Tearalaments as a deck
Superheavy Samurai
Galaxy Tomahawk
And so many other degenerate shit was allowed to live in the OCG because "Maxx C balances it out", when in reality you were just going to lose to those whenever you didn't draw your "win condition".
Meanwhile the TCG saw the issue, banned the actual problems instead of trying to make it slightly less consistent
@@renaldyhaen Your first argument is that Maxx C saves OCG from being combo-based strategy fully, but then saying it's ok because they are still the same..?
Maxx C doesn't help vs combo decks. It "helps" vs every deck and making every deck lose harder versus it. Hence why some call it "Maxx C minigame"
Even if not talking about meta, it still keeps the same issues combo decks have and the same decks come up. The only difference between TCG and OCG is that decks that can pull off their combo are more preferred and doesn't lose to Maxx C that more and combo decks build in a way to have some plan B for Maxx C
I hope kevin tewert gets fired
Here me out, maxx C in duel links
🤔
Would be even more annoying, considering the # of cards... but at the same time might push away traps in favor of board breakers, since you have 3 slots to work with
Maxx C challenge is probably more doable
Drawing cards is always broken, no matter the context.
Glad this abomination is never coming back.
Tcg will whine about anything. OCG is where it’s at.
I think Maxx C is usually fine in a casual format, but when serious competition in any way enters the conversation my opinion is different, it is very uncompetitive so should be banned in big tournaments.
If you are talking about the same modern YGO and not time wizard formats: Maxx C hurts below rogue decks even more. Even really bad decks prefer to special summon at least several times and that already gives insane advantage to the opponent even when your board would not be that impressive
It's like, Maxx C does the exact same to top deck as it does to Tier F deck, so if it hurts and sometimes kills top decks, how would it not do the same to others?
@@PapajusLtu because I said casual formats and Yu-Gi-Oh currently has 0 official casual formats. And even then, I would personally still prefer to play without it.
By casual formats I mean formats you'd likely agree on with just a group of friends.
Is Maxx C fine? Absolutely not.
Why? Because it shuts down an entire game mechanic, that’s why it’s banned.
Both Droll & Shifter shut down entire game mechanics. Neither of these are fine and should be banned.
You don’t change your deck choice entirely because you ‘might’ have to play around Nib/Ash/Imperm, but you do for Maxx C/Droll/Shifter. That’s not healthy for players.
Maxx C though rewards a player for using it, rather than strictly punishing the opponent like Droll/Shifter.
However, only reason that mistake and macro are completely fine, is because they are both traps with a physical point to break the condition applied, not hand traps.
(Edit, because I forgot to add: Shutting down core game mechanics isn’t a format dependent thing).
Maxx C can activated at any time , D shifter requires you absolutely not to use a gy based deck and most will not do that at all as the popular choice.
Shifter is an absolute brick if you never draw into it and your too far into the game with alot of cards in gy
Droll is a hit or miss depending upon the deck and format and alot of combo decks are using crossout designator the card out of the duel which is a at 3 fyi.
@@gravekeepersven82
I wish you were as right about what you said as you are passionate about it.
@@Deadly-Shunpo How condescending of you lol
@@gravekeepersven82 Hardly. The majority if not all of what you replied with was just "but it isn't" without actually providing a legitamamte reason for why either card is healthy.
@@Deadly-Shunpo you're welcome 😊
Max C is card advantage. Every other C has ways to stop your opponent is some way . Like the annoying bugs they are lol.
Would be real funny if they unban it next list.
#lettheClive
They should just eratta maxx c and bring it back to 3 but more balanced
They literally banned it to sell combo products look at the time it was banned noticed zodiac were bitching about it
There was a YCS final that Zoodiac lost because the True draco player drew Maxx C twice in a row and skipped their turn. That was the final straw for the TCG, and honestly, why wouldn't it be?
Average turn in a maxx C format goes 2 ways
1."I normal summon"
"Activate Maxx C"
"End phase"
2."I normal summon"
"Activate Maxx C"
"Called by/Ash/Crossout"
"Opponent scoops"
Its a god awful gameplay
Or because look at the infamous event where the zoo player lost to true draco (at the time a meta deck) because they used 2 maxx c back to back.
Proves my point literally the combo deck that costed alot and was the main selling point of the sets was getting held in check by max c
Literally the deck that beat zoodiac was at the time a year or two old koonami didnt want older decks to beat the new decks its literally the main reason they ban anything non meta
Maxi “C” to 1
I think this is a very good discussion!
As an ocg player, I think max c is necessary, because max c is a card that undermines the first suppression by strong combo decks.
Cards like Maxx c Nibiru will undermine combo decks. If these cards are not there, even just a strong combo deck will become stronger.
And even if you get hit by or use maxx c, it doesn't mean you win or lose 100% of the time; you can stop within 3 draws and play 1 or 2 blocking cards, or you can play a strategy of pushing through without worrying about the draws.
Besides, thanks to the fact that many cards in modern Yu-Gi-Oh have turn 1 restrictions on the use of their effects, it is less likely that all the cards drawn can be used.
Also, the source is vague and uncertain, but I have seen an analysis that says that max c makes the win rate of the first player about 55% and the win rate of the second player 45%, and that without max c, the win rate of the second player would be even lower.
For these reasons and my personal feeling as an opinion I see from playing in Japan, I think that more than about 60% of players need max c and can have fun dueling without banning it.
However, there are some ocg players who do not like max c, and even those who accept it, I feel that there are very many who say that max c is the worst thing to use after the prior has combo'd. I believe that there are definitely improvements to be made to a powerful card.
What about if the player who goes first and builds an insane board, Maxx C you? Still fair??
@@MxZ40 I and most ocg players do not think it is fair at all.
I often hear people say that there needs to be an errata that can be used only for Second players.
Maxx c does not stop or hinder combo decks at all. If maxx c really stop combo decks then why is Superheavy Samurai, Snake Eye and other combo decks dominates the meta?
The worst thing about maxx c is when I go second and did not open any handtrap. I strategize on how to play around their board and break it while my opponent are doing their combo. Then my opponenet uses maxx c on my turn and I lose cuz I need my special summon.
Maxx c needs to be ban. If maxx c is really needed to keep combo deck in check, they need to make a restriction for maxx c. If maxx c have a restriction just like psy-frame gamma then the card is more balanced.
Ofc the only way Maxx “C” gonna be used is first turn player build a board then pass turn and drop “C” on the second turn player. Never would the second turn player draw the card. According to TCG players.
Before snake eyes combo decks were not a problem in the TCG however for many reasons. One they lose to soo many regular handtraps and not just nibiru. Infinite Impermanence on Junk speeder for example. Two being that if combo decks ever did get out of hand they were dealt with by the banlist. Superheavy Samurai lost Scarecrow in less than 2 weeks so we didn't need to suffer any FTK decks or anything like that (I'm pretty sure there was an instance of that getting results in the OCG). In the TCG before snake eyes out of the top 5 decks seeing representation only 1 was a combo deck which was unchained.
As for stopping between 3 draws and putting up blocking cards there's soo many decks that simply can't do that because their deck is bad. Galaxy Eyes, Odd Eyes, Live Twins. They all require you to go above 5 to even get anything remotely resembling an endboard. As for giving the opponent draws that is an automatic loss if the opponent is playing a good/meta deck.
As for the opponent not being able to use all of the cards due to OPT restriction. Do you think a Live twin player than end on a pop 1 and maybe an imperm and ash for example could stop a Snake Eyes deck with 11 cards in hand because they used Maxx C going second? Frankly I don't see that happening.
Can't speak on the source due to it being unreliable however Maxx C factually helps meta decks get easy wins. It forces every player to run ,the same 9-10 cards in every deck 3 Maxx C, 3 Ash Blossom, Called by, 2-3 crossout. That's a 1/4 of the deck you could've used to counter the meta currently but because of Maxx C you don't have the deckspace to run the counters to it.
Proof of banning Maxx C giving weaker decks a chance is that Galaxy Eyes, Abyss Actors, Marinecess, and Plunder Patrol have gotten tops at regionals or YCS's in the past year in the TCG a format without Maxx C.
i hate maxx "c". not a fan when every deck has to play certain cards, i feel the same way abought ash, droll and imperm. this meta you cant play anything. i miss older yugioh with 6 card starts. i know we cant do that because decks are too over powered now days.
Games dog shit now anyways, I'm moving to the Digimon tcg
Imagine banning cards because it grants going second too much advantage when going first clearly grants too much advantage in a format heavily revolved around combo decks
the player going first can set up AND drop a Maxx C.
How often do you sit through your opponent's 5 minute combo, see the endboard and think "hey I can play through this", and then they just drop the Maxx C as a cherry on top?
@juksleo6257 then errata it so that it can only be activated while you control fewer cards than your opponent. Problem solved.
@@haydenbennett3547 I can live with that. I can sincerely understand Maxx C as a purely going second tool. The fact that your opponent can just go Maxx C on top of an already established board is idiotic
@@haydenbennett3547 randomly sacking your opponent is unfun even if you can only do it going second
@@gamakujira64e23 neither is being unable to play going second. So what do you propose?
The only cards that should be banned are those with no counters. This is a card game the whole point is to build strategies against both known and unknown threats and guess what no one will win 💯lol because there’s also a bit of luck.
People are too sensitive about cards.
it is coming. You heard it here first.
By that logic Ash blossom should have been banned years ago. In fact, in many decks these days, Ash blossom is inserted without even thinking, the same way Maxx C was. Mainly because it always resolves, there's always searching and there is always something happening with the graveyard. In fact, Master Duel shows that Maxx C isn't that monster people say it is. In fact, despite being the most picked card over there, there's a high chance yours will never resolve anyway, Ash, called by, Droll, all of witch are highly popular as non-engines. All because of Maxx C? No, but it's a factor.
You can say whatever you want, Maxx C existing over there sometimes doesn't make sense, but without it? Nibiru would be more popular, Floodgates in general would be more popular. Much worse go second cards would be more prevalent due to the power vacum of a potential ban of the Insect would cause. A necessary evil.
To the contrary Master Duel proved just how bad Maxx C is many players who were indifferent to it began to hate it after playing Master Duel one of which being Farfa.
Not to mention it helps meta decks by taking up 8-9 spaces in your deck which could've been used for anti-meta cards. Name one handtrap that does anything similar to that. Ash is seeing less use in the TCG btw because of how bad it is against Snake eyes and yet here in Master Duel we're still forced to run it anyways.
Also droll is such a bad counter to Maxx C because you're putting yourself under it's effect as well since it affects both players. I'll gladly take nib in the format at least that doesn't help the meta like Maxx C does and benefits mainly going second. As for floodgates they're all hit in the TCG anyways and bad going second cards? Once again TCG players would've used them by now because they haven't had Maxx C for years however they use relatively the same cards as Master Duel player do. It's not a necessary evil, it's a card that holds this game back from being fun and has only caused problems.
An observance of ideology is the mark of an enslaved mind.
Maxx C is never a problem because everytime I ever use it in masterduel my opponent has an Ash or Called by to render it useless.
BAN MAXX C
Because it's maxx "C"
Free the C
No
Not without an errata so you can't use it going first. Having someone go full combo only to drop Maxx "C" on your draw phase is BS.
Never
Keep crying about Maxx “C” TCG Players. The card has lots of counters that are commonly played in the actual game. Please do not cry anymore with the same BS argumenta.
@@christianosantiagorivera3560Nobody cares that Maxx"C" has commonly played counters. That doesn't change the fact that Maxx"C" isn't fun to play against, especially going second.
To avoid re introducing a stupidly overcentralizing card into the game
Unban to 2 soon 🦅😹
Max c is a good card I got 2 pages of them. Ppl in the TCG just have no brains. It’s not that hard to band it. It causes balance to the game . Ppl mad cuz they can’t go full force . I
This comment sounds like the main reason is that you wanna make bank with those pages of the card xD
Say you summon 4 times, 1 of them being your normal (playing around nibiru). In that case, Maxx C draws 3 cards. Which means the going 2nd player will sometimes have 5 cards in hand and sometimes 7, which sounds like a nightmare to balance.
Nib does maxx c but balanced.
1 normal summon and 3 special summons to dodge nib in a plan B board is you starting your turn with 8 cards in hand.
You can ash or call by the grave . You can play around Ts. Use hand limit cards etc etc. if ppl in the ocg can do it we can too
@@louistech112 So run the Maxx C package or play Floo/Trap Control/Stun. Also, what are hand limit cards ?
Also there is another issue, cards in OCG are designed around Maxx C existing. If cards in 2005/2006 were designed around hard countering Mirror Force (or whatever staple of the time), would that be healthier than just banning Mirror Force ?
ygo players are just extremely delusional and they will always tell you how much they hate the game and that x card is problematic.
no maxxc? damn, shifter must be the problem card that makes it unplayable. no shifter? must be droll or fkng branded fusion or whatever that makes it unenjoyable lol
So you should be critical of Konami, not each other. Konami made the card so....
People hate shifter because there's no Downside to decks that use it but the post duea design ethos put more focus on the graveyard which they still do meaning it functionally gimps most decks that aren't even combo.
Much prefer Maxx over the stupid foot woman.
This is why TCG will always be the inferior format.
Awww cmon, stop with maxx c content…….
Max c should be unbanned masterduel Ban list is good
Tcg banlist is better
Master duel can't even reign in super heavy samurai or how it's original format was tier 0. I'll accept it's a better banlist when they actually can make normal changes
@@Fencer_Nowa I play shs it's good but not broken