You need a carbon arc torch ,I’ve melted metal ,brazed ,bent flat bar ,it’s a bit like picking your nose with chopsticks to start with but 45 years ago that’s all there was for the apprentice Blacksmith working in is shed .Make you self a necking tool for your hammer it will let you do the shoulder very fast ,no need to be square ,you should be able to neck,and draw one end in one heat .Great to see the trade being carried on 👍
It’s funny that I happen across this comment on a random channel I just discovered, at the very moment I’m building a carbon arc torch for my stick welder.
Glad you left in the spot with your child in the background. Laughing. You're a good Dad and she sounded like a great Mom too. They make all the hard work and sweat worth it all. It is for them after all, that we strive to be the best we can be. And you certainly seem to be quite the craftsman. The King of Random is just fun is he not. Great Video Joshua! dh
I've built the exact same induction heater. It works fine with the recommended power supply. No over heating or smoking. My understanding is the size of the coil matters. The one they included is the right one. It heats metal inside a crucible.
yes it does matter a lot. the inductance should be matched to the Driver, atleast the cirquit looks like that needs to be the case, otherwise it will work poorly. source: i am an electrical engineering student.
I am grateful for seeing your chickens in the video about a mud pit, carbon filters and gas generation. I just as grateful to hear the real world sounds of your partner and child at the start of this one. Just magic, thank you.
I would still recommend getting a induction heater. A LH-15A will set you back about 700quid peak power is about 8kw. They speed up the work process and it is cheaper to run than coal or gas.
I bought the blank pcb and used quality mosfets, caps, other components to build it myself. Made a few mods, water cooling for the mosfets & caps, over temp protection, and use an old mig welder (rectified) as power supply. I'm very happy with the unit, the cooling mod allows continual use without over temp. One observation is your coil is too small for the unit causing your mosfets to linger in "linear" region hence over heating. When altering coils you also need to alter your tank (caps) accordingly. Great video, awsome smithing.
I for one enjoyed the beautiful blend of camera shots and music applied to this video. Your transparency when giving explanations is also refreshing. My biggest kick comes from seeing you back doing what you love. I dearly want one of your power hammers one day! Keep up the awesome work😎
10:47 wrong explanation, the coil causes the electrons in the metal to move, the metal has a certain Resistance to it though, that causes the metal to heat up. i know nothing about forging but i know electrical engineering. main inefficiency is actually the magnetic fields escaping. more efficient is a direct connection like an arc furnace. your main issue is that your coil doesnt match the actual driver very well.
Brother! You can get that induction heater going well! You're almost there. The power supply and water is great, you may need to "touch up" the pcb. Re-solder the wiggling parts, glue down some others, maybe replace a few components but you can have that thing going. Theres lots of resources on the web. Maybe a collab with an electronics dude help you out.
Thank you for a very good and educational video. For the Do it Yourself folks out there you saved us some money, work, and time. Again, I say thank you!
I must have missed this vid when it was released so just watched it. Joshua you are one top bloke! I was an electrician by trade, now 63 years old and retired. How you have the knowledge and passion to try all these things is beyond me - but it sure makes for interesting viewing from my armchair. 👍👏👏👏🤪
Always really enjoy your content and presentation style - you’re a natural at it! Glad to see you finding the time to capture a little bit of what you are doing too - it’s been a while! Hopefully there will be more great content to educate us all very soon.
Thank you Ian. I've got lots to share but little time to do it. Nearly didn't get this one shared as I was in such a rush to get it done and filming really does slow things down a lot. Thank you for supporting the journey. Hopefully I'll be able to do this TH-cam thing full-time soon if I upgrade my home shop. Cheers J
Glad for that advice Joshua, I have always wanted an induction heater and might have been tempted to buy a cheap one but it would have to be several kilowatts to be of any real use. I am a retired power engineer and would suspect that the components used in the unit are not rated for the job. As I have also experienced with similar products "buy cheap buy twice" or three times. I realise now that commercially available stuff is always expensive for a reason and building a DIY one is sometimes not practical except for experimenting. However, I really liked watching the video about your skill as a blacksmith - most enjoyable and relaxing.
The problem of the induction heaters is that the current in the coil is massive and a lot higher than 50 amps because of the resonance between the coil and the capacitors on the pub and if you use a smaller coil, the frequency that it resonates at is a lot higher causing much larger currents up to maybe even a thousand amps.
One last thing, a rectifier does not make DC. You have to smooth out the power with capacitors. All the rectifier does is fold the AC on to itself to be humps instead of a sine wave. You were still putting AC in from the BuzzBox.
The main reason that your induction heaters keep failing is that the coil you are using is too low in inductance.. This makes the frequency too high and the Mosfets can't turn on fast enough. They spend too much time in the "linear" mode which makes them heat excessively. I have been successfully running these things for a few years now and haven't had any failures since I went through a similar learning process. I don't want to hijack your thread by putting links to my videos and webpages on the subject, though.
I just recently bought a 15kw induction heater that runs directly of off the 240v and I love it so far. I have not used the little 48V DC units like you have there, but I agree with French Creek valley that your coil that you made is to small for the board you are using. It's is not about the power, it's the length of the tubing in the coil; yours is quite a bit shorter than the stock coil and is changing the resonant frequency out of the working range of the board. You can do the small diameter, but make it longer, using the same length of copper tubing.
I'm now ready for an induction heater and also tought to build it. Will you be so kind to give direction or comment on whether it is feasible and if so, how to go about it? I'm from South Africa.
I have to agree with my learned college on this. you changed the coil to suit your needs but left the capacitors the same. More turns or larger capacitance ;-)
Joshua, I really like your explanation of induction heating stuff. You are correct when you are talking about efficiency, it all depends on how you look at it. For example, an electric heater is said to be 100 percent efficient but compared to cost of running the unit, hold on to your wallet. Sorry for the bad example since we are talking about induction heating. The components the CHINAMAN use are as cheap as you can get. The duty cycle and reliability is ultra low just like quality of components. The true industrial heaters are just superb. The internal components are first class using water cooled capacitors that have copper construction which are way higher in efficiency with cost to boot. There's a downside as with everything, you need to have different coils for different size and shape . The upside is how quick this will heat up metal using very little electricity as compared to using oxy-acetylene gas or coal as everything today seems to cost so much up front. Nice video mate, look forward to seeing more great videos from you Joshua.
Thank you so much. I agree. Maybe if the technology can improve and still be cheap it may get better. I could invest more in finding out ways of building one from scratch with more internal cooling. But I'm not in any need for one anymore. Cheers J
Joshua, Really interesting video again. "The Tower of London",that's reasonably impressive from this end of the world! That hammer puts out pretty well ! Don't know what it is about your videos but they motivate my day for sure 😎 Looking forward to the next video. Chris 🇳🇿
The bridge rectifyer does a neat little trick, it swaps the negative side of the AC sine wave to positive. Problem is that the AC voltage is the effective voltage the sine wave produces, not the difference in potential between the 'peaks'. If you flip it up, you get a 100hz pulsed DC, with a peak of AC voltage times sqrt(2) - so about 40% more. So your board got a pulsing DC between 0 and 70V, which is guaranteed to fry a 48V appliance. Adding at least a (big) capacitor to smooth those peaks out would have brought it closer to nominal. Thats usually the biggest price tag in DC supplies - the capacitors and other do-dads to make sure the DC is exactly what it should be.
It never occurred to me to use a Tig welder as a forge which is silly as I have got things red hot several times while trying to get suitable conditions to weld & not vaporise thin sheet metal. I will give this a try next time I want to hot set rivets. It is surprisingly often how i learn something from the trials, pain & unhappy struggles of someone else & this unintended transfer is perhaps the potential blessing of helping another to remember & counter negativity when things go awry. Thanks for sharing!
I've looked into these for the same reasons, and have watched Black Bear's progress. My conclusion is that I would be money ahead to buy the same machine he uses; building one myself is beyond my skill set and I would probably fry components to the point where spending the money for a proper one would be more cost-effective.
12:34 understandable since when you come out of a full bridge rectifier instead of it being a half sign wave its instead its positive to zero to make it true DC you need two sets of buzz bars with a array of capacitors plus a resister to make DC to jump the top of the sign wave to make true DC the resister is there just so when your not using it it doesn't kill the capacitors edit: 14:30 i'm surprised you don't have oxy acetylene since most welding suppliers do the rent a bottle scheme where you pay for a bottle of oxygen and acetylene and when they run out you pay for the refill and swap the bottles and you don't need big bottles you can get the half bottles which are half the price to refill i think i paid 500 pound for my acetylene setup and i can't from the top of my head remember how much it costs to refill them but it's cheap
I'm always impressed by your drive and ingenious ideas I made the air filter mask works a treat even works with chap that wears glasses keep up the amazing work
Joshua, four tries now thats commitment, nice to see the power hammer doing some big stuff and the railing looks great at the end of the video. Do agree the proper induction forges do look great but are a little bit of an luxury I think at he current price range. Thanks for the heads up.
Thank you Kenny. I think they certainly have their place in high out put production. I would like to see a proper model up close first to have a true opinion and know how long they last. Cheers J
Hi Joshua, From the little I know about my 15kw induction forge the water not only flows through the coil but also through the internal parts (not sure what they are called) so it is cooling those as well. Sounds to me like yours might be experiencing that issue. I also have found on larger stock I start the induction and then insert the metal slowly into the coil so it is not trying to heat up the entire mass within the coil at once. Maybe try preheating the piece for 15 seconds with a torch/gas forge and then see what happens. My 15kw will do up to 1 1/2 inch stock but once i get over 3/4 inch i use the method described above to help get it to temp. Great video's love the most recent one on making leaves!!
Hi, Joshua this video came into my recommended because I am actively building an induction heater I have a few tips. First off your 50 amp breaker is doing absolutely nothing you might as well take that out and rely on the house breaker, in short the power supply you are using lowers the voltage and increases the current so the current on the mains line will be much smaller and your actual house breaker will be the only one that will trip in a short circuit situation. Also this appears to be a ZVS driver which is a rather crude circuit to push past 2.5KVA (2500watts layman's) it likely does not have a resonance capacitor that is close to spec'd enough to push that kind of power. You likely need to buy a new resonance capacitor to get this thing working properly which may run you a decent chunk of change (not too much if you look around cheap capacitors on aliexpress such as dawn caps which have built themselves a reputation among the hobbyist electronics community). You may also want an oscilloscope for this kind of project to look at the resonance frequency between your coil and capacitor bank to make sure it is somewhere reasonable and not something completely out of the ballpark. something like 40khz shouldn't stress the Mosfets. I am re-watching the video and have new points to make but don't feel like rewriting the original comment. upon closer examination that zvs driver seems more then capable of driving a 2500 watt induction coil. That is a large portion of the circuit board dedicated to resonance capacitors and those mosfet heatsinks do not look like they are something to scoff at. your problem may come from what other people are saying in that the frequency that is resonating between the capacitor and coil is to high. In short the capacitor value or the inductor value may need to change so the frequency is much lower as they are oscillating the power between each other to induce the magnetic field in the coil. I imagine with this circuit changing the capacitor value may be a hassle unless you feel like soldering some new ones on so you will be limited to changing the coil size like others have said. the formula for calculating the resonant frequency between an inductor and a capacitor is f Res =1/2π√LC with LC both under the square root symbol which you are not really going to know the value of your inductor as you have the knowledge of a layman. So I recommend taking an oscilloscope to both sides of your capacitor bank applying a much lower then normal voltage and measuring the frequency's it is resonating at when at rest and under load and making a coil where the values are around **say** 40khz. (note that 1khz = 1000hz) I imagine if you go much higher then **say** 80khz you may run into problems.
There's no transfer of electrons from the coil to the work piece. The coil is just concentrating magnetic field lines through the work piece (centered through the middle of the coil). Electrons will orbit around magnetic field lines that are changing (alternating current). This is similar to the effect that creates the aurora borealis. Since metals have a lot of free electrons an induction coil literally just makes the electrons that are already in the work piece spin in little circles (or eddies) around the changing magnetic field lines (like billions of kids going down coiled slides). The electrons stay inside the work piece and don't go anywhere but in spirals. As they spin around the magnetic field lines they bump into other electrons. The collisional energy creates heat.
An old school heating method using an arc welder was a Carbon arc torch. Two copper coated carbon rods in a holder and you create an arc between to make high heat. Not common anymore, but they are still out there. Not sure if they work with invertor welders though. Bugger about the induction build path. Thanks for the video.
Thank you. I think a water cooled clamp may work as I can get 200amps without gougeing it as a carbon arc would. Worth a go to see the results though. Cheers J
Thank you so much that's very kind of you. Lots more coming soon. Come September I hope to be full time on TH-cam content. At least for a while. Cheers J
i have been puzzeled by this zvs driver for over 10years i also blew up loads of ics then when over to igbt 200amp transistors and 200amp rectifiers im still sourcing for monster caps
Every other American workshop has a LINCOLN 225 AC only welder. If you use 7018AC rods, you can get a certified weld from it easy. Mine is 45 years old and never a grunt. $200 and less used, maybe $400 new. I also have a 500 amp DC 2200 pound diesel welder on a trailer with all sorts of arc control. Guess what - the little 225 gets 5x more use.
yes they need pure dc, and power supply need to be on and running BEFORE connecting to the board, as iv learnt. if you want to make dc with a bridge rectifier, it still too rough, but one way to smooth it right out could be 4 car batteries in series. (with each other, of course) (parallel to P.S.)they would act like huge capacitors (well bolted on) and keep them charged with the welder whatever... do you know alf??
You need to make a copper tubing coils for every size shape part you need to heat red hot. The smallest diameter you can make gets hottest. You also need to make 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, turn coils same diameter in some cases 3 will work best and others 5 turns work best, etc. Coild do not need to be round sausage shape works to heat flat metal. .
I agree withe Jim RY and the carbon arc.. Amazing how well you can heat locally with a carbon arc. Get wo carbon rods from a welding shop and clamp them to the cables of an old welder. Much hotter than a cutting torch. Carbons arcs are very old school but do the job.
Joshua! Don’t give up the day job! It’s way more interesting and challenging dealing with that and translating those challenges into your projects and the interest for us is seeing how you deal with that! BTW your hammer is fantastic and I will be building one... soon! Keep up the excellent work!
Ha ha thank you. I don't mean I'll de doing review videos all the time but the engineering and blacksmithing work I do on a daily basis I'll be able to film because it's my own work and not a different companies. I've got lots of clients waiting for me to start their projects so it'll be an interesting transition. Cheers J
I am looking at your video a year late, but your coil is far too short in length, and causing the ZVS circuit to run at a frequency that is too high. Your smaller coil needs to use "approximately" the same length as the original. If you make your coil 4 to 5 times longer (and slightly larger diameter), the circuit frequency may drop to an acceptable level, and operate properly. That coil is a key electrical component that directly affects operation. The coil must be within the range of inductive values needed for that circuit, else it will cause other components to overheat.
Hi, ... I am looking at this video with 3y of delay... I very much like thee ZVS induction coil heating units and am experimenting with a 2000W model. Instead of running just one single big coil, I would need to operate/energize 4 smaller, thinner wire coils which each in tunr heat up a 6mm steel pipe. Any suggestions how I can "convert" the one big coil into 4 smaller thinner coils to obtain the same working efficiency while not burning out the ZVS unit? Or should I rather operate 4 small ZVS units, one for each steel pipe? Thank you, Jake
@@JakeKennes Dealing with a similar issue. I have 3kW ZVS heater and need to use smaller diameter, shorter coil. Very little info about hacking that Chinese devices. I guess that I have to play with capacitors to match the new coil design. But I have no idea how.
yeah the coil actually matters. if the coil doesnt match the Driver it wont work properly, this is a non trivial thing if you want to get this exactly right.
To heat up the steel bars by induction is a brilliant idea! As far as I know you have to use AC for the coil. - I think as higher the frequency as more heat you get... Unfortunately I don't know what is the optimal frequence / voltage / amps for the best result. However: Thanks for posing this video, you gave me a huge inspiration (for another project)
Applications of frequency ranges Frequency (kHz) Workpiece type 5-30 Thick materials (e.g. steel at 815 °C with diameter 50 mm or greater). 100-400 Small workpieces or shallow penetration (e.g. steel at 815 °C with diameter of 5-10 mm or steel at 25 °C with a diameter around 0.1 mm). 480 Microscopic pieces Ref.( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_heating)
@@joshuadelisle yes. I've not built one, but it is just a high power switching supply. Probably a flyback or something is my guess. I think had we spoke before hand, you wouldn't have needed to buy so many. Stuff that is cheap like that is not very tolerant to mistakes. One of the reasons it is cheap. Certainly a purchased one is robust, but if you use it properly, I think a cheap diy unit is possible. Personally, I didn't get far enough to figure out the water like you did.
@@joshuadelisle the guys who build the super turbocharged gaming computers often would seal the case, fill them with mineral oil, and pump that through a radiator to cool. That should help here too. Dan, do you have any thoughts on this?
@@trollforge you don't want to do that without knowing how much waste heat there is. The specific heat of mineral oil can only absorb so much heat per unit of time. Computers are in the hundreds of watts, not thousands. I don't know the specific heat of mineral oil, but I wouldn't jump to that conclusion without knowing that and how much waste heat there is.
Not the neatest of work but as I burnt the larger tenons... But they got cut off mostly and rivetted fine. Overall it was ok but I think a bit more practice is needed to keep everything as clean and crisp as possible. Cheers J
I think it may work better with a different coil but that would mean I can't use a custom coil for different diameters. I've just reviewed a 15kw all singing version and is totally worth spending the extra money on it. Works a treat and heats up 1" solid within a minute. Cheers J
Hi. Try keeping the coil leads much much closer together. Make them come together like back-to-back "Ls" out of the Chinese toy, keep them close but not touching, and let them come apart only at the coil itself. As far as the under-built circuitry, well, it is just a toy after all.
Thank you. I think it will work better with more windings and longer length of pipe so it resonates at a better frequency it's matched to. Or at least that's the advice I've been given so far. Cheers J
Great video! Thanks man, if you could get that to work it would be amazing. Remote on a pair of leads like a welder would be even better but I'm sure somebody has tried that already. Thanks again, hope all is well over there.
I did get a foot pedal and an ampmeter. Might have a way of salvaging it. Not too sure yet. Might be something to do with the resistance of the coil meaning I need a longer one with more coils to match the one it was supplied with. Cheers J
If you've bought an arc welder, you might consider finding a defunct piece of equipment called a Carbon Arc Torch for it. It has the same utility as an oxy/propane torch, or indeed your inverter. You can heat up a single point with electrical current. They're a little fiddly to use, but cheap to operate.
I vote for increasing traces and upgrading mosfets, or just get a 3kw board to match your PS. Most serious blacksmiths use the 7.5kw models if using induction - grossly over-rated at 15kw. Your 2.5kw model is best for smaller projects. Here is a video series on how to use it.
A bummer that the induktion forge isn't working properly. Having one which is not too expensive would be outstanding, especially for the neighbours. No stinky fumes or noise from the fan😊
Your explanation on how an induction forge works was fantastic purely because I'm dumb but I understood your explanation 😁. Excellent work and videography as usual Joshua ...love it and keep up the fantastic work ...
Hello Josh. My first thought of induction forges was of something massive, heating up a very large piece. This was so dainty and localized! (I have seen some monsters used for heating large tungsten and molly ingots.) Seeing you holding the work with bare fingers was very cool (as your fingers apparently were). Amazing to see some of the work you are doing. Congrats on the Tower commission.! I liked the vignette with the cooling tenon as your little one came to see you. Fade to family......
I am amazed such a concept could work without burning the copper coils. Looks like a dead short to me. A DC magnet does not induce any current in nearby metal. It has to be AC.
Good video. But u cant change the coil just like that. Its a tank oscilator. Coil inductance and value of capacitor must be such that we get a proper resonent frequency sign wave
You need a relay between the power supply and the induction heater,if you connect the power supply directly to induction heater it will burn up the mosfets as soon as you turn it on. They need to see full voltage and current from the start a proper size relay will work. If you are worried about coil inductance buy a inductance meter check with any ham operator he will have one, then you can measure the factory one and whenever you use a different coil if its the same inductance your heater will never no the difference. Kb4saf
Very interesting project. Nice rail too. Been pretty interested in the induction forges. Truely hope you get that bit of kit sorted. 🙏 Well wishes, possitive energy and Blessed days now Sir Crawford out 🔥⚒️🧙🏼♂️
Could you give us some more detail on why you feel it doesn't work? Is it just that the board overheats? Also I've noticed that the commercially available induction forges aimed at blacksmiths start at 15kW - so maybe expecting a 2.5kW unit to be effective is a bit ambitious!
I should of filmed the board bit it's literally melting and smoking when using it. Apparently the official systems have water cooled capacitors with modular replacement parts as they wear out quickly. Not convinced of it long term cost effectiveness thanless the technology get better and cheaper.
Amps are 'chosen' by the drain device. You can have 100amps, but if the drain device only needs 10A, then 10A is what will flow. Not sure if you mean the welder will increase voltage, not current, but wanted to add my half a penny. I also feel that there is an issue with your coil. Seems awful small... 🤷🏽♂️
Could you of used a carbon arc torch on your ac welder? They aren't as popular now as they once were, but you can heat things up pretty well with them.......Just a thought 😉
I need to get up in the loft and dig out my training on induction heating. We used it to seal up TetraPak cartons. so I know I am a month late but here goes. so when not in use it should be switched off that might help those transistors will get hot in idle. the inductance on the coil is quite important for the correct oscillation of the circuit. the number of turns is proportional to the inductance. I am sure between us we can get something that works well like your power hammer.
Thank you Jo. Yes since the video I've learned I need a much larger coil with more turns for both inductance and resistance. It came with a coil but was too wide for the size of stock I wanted to use it for. I'm considering using the original coil again but this time making it into a 'micky mouse' shape so it has smaller coils wound to the side... Do you think that will work? Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle I think I have found one similar on Amazon for £20. I'll have a look at it and see if there are any improvements that are easy to do. I will only use it for arrow heads so much smaller stock to start with.
Great video! ..... and nice to see an honest opinion stated ;0) One thing you need to keep in mind when ordering this stuff from China ....... they Lie! If you buy from a UK company it makes no sense for them to sell a dud as they will shortly have to replace it .... foreign sellers, less so! If your unit puts out 2.5KW at 48V it would need to push 52.08A (P=VI gets you P/V=I) down the coil! If it takes any more than that it would be caused by inefficiencies in the kit .... which would be mainly heat! Hence the toasty board! You also need to have some serious reinforcement to the tracks that carry the load in the board too (usually a wire laid the length of the track and soldered along its full length)! Also you need to be aware of different ratings for breakers and use one designed for magnetic devices. I think the majority of the useful generated heat is from the eddy currents set up by the collapsing magnetic field in the steel! ..... but it is a while since I dabbled ;o) Resistive heating is the most efficient, but arcing at the contacts could be a killer .... maybe using copper braid as a contact material would work. Having really chunky clamps would also increase the thermal mass and again using copper would allow for the relative resistivity of copper and steel to work to your advantage and water cooling would too! I think microwave induction is a bit beyond amateur level and would be more trouble than it is worth ..... but if you could get hold of the right materials Friction might be a good one! Sorry for ranting on a bit ;o)
Problem with Using a buzz box as you call it is the welders duty cycle. Only one welding machine manufacturer with a 100% duty cycle is Lincoln. Even with a Lincoln the electric welders usually doesn't have the 100% duty cycle like the portable gas or diesel welder generators. You can burn up a welder doing what you're suggesting by clamping both +- together on what you want to heat. The welding leads will melt through what you're trying to heat up before that happens. If you don't destroy your welder first.
Most welders have safety over heat switch so it's not a problem. My oil filled oxford is 100% duty at 220amps. Most welders have a 100% rated duty cycle at 60% of the amp capacity. So a typical 200amp welder is 100% duty under the 120amp setting. Cheers J
So it requires a specific size coil and number of winding to match the resonance otherwise it over heats. It comes with a specific coil but it's not ideal for forging. My new 15kw version is far more flexible when it comes to coil design and has safety features so you don't cook the machine by accident like I did with this one. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle aprox how many kw induction heater do i need to super heat a small pizza oven?( Meaning the coil wrapped around the oven from the outside)
@@jomfawad9255 my honest opinion would be to use a halogen heater or electronic furnace element if you want an electronic pizza oven. A 1kw system would be more than enough with good insulation. Personally I would use a wood fired one made from adobe straight from the ground. Cheers J
How can you do this without having oxy-acetylene on on hand that's like one of the most fundamental metal working tools to have or is it that a time to acquire in your neck of the woods
I've got the kit but because I'm only infrequently using my home shop I can't justify the rent on the bottles. To be honest using my Tig torch worked excellent and I would say was better than oxy-fuel for this purpose. Still If I find a more cost effective alternative to gas I will use it. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle why Wrentham I bought two bottles on let-go outright for 60 bucks. And the oxygen bottle was entirely full and I found a guy who will refill any bottle I bring him at a lower price than anyone else in the area so I'm sure you can manage something without spending an arm and a leg
Hi Joshua, thanks for this video. Like the way you explain things. I was also thinking of building one but if I grill 3, 4 units it maybe better if I buy one ;-) I have seen a portable one at 240€ for a 1000W, but did not try it out. I bought your horse head pattern to try to build one but for the moment I stick to 2D-models :-) One day I will get the courage to try that one out. Keep up the good work!
A welder to power this is not a great idea as their outputs will likely be way out of spec for something like this. I expect this induction heater module is probably not rated for continuous use at the rated power. Your coils also need electrically insulating, glass fibre is good for that. As the coil really needs a water cooling at such high power, the best thing would be to also cool the electronics with a water cooling system. Note also that switching the induction heater on and off without a separate switch for the fans is not good as the devices may get very hot heating some metal, but then you turn it off and the fans stop, so the heat isn't removed. Re welders: different types of welders have different output characteristics. The older cheap stick welders were all simply a big transformer, so AC. Modern inverters are DC, but stick and TIG normally uses constant current output, so the voltage will vary all over the place. MIG is constant voltage so may work as a PSU, but you won't want the wire feeder running every time you use the induction forge. So called HF start (really high voltage) will put thousands of volts on the welding tip.
It may work after talking to a few others. I need to use its original coil to keep the correct resonance and tighten up a few coils to make it useful. It's not as simple as putting any size coil on it.
I do a considerable amount of this type of work. I use a multi holed gas forge to heat the tenons. As i only need to heat the last 20mm. With out an oxy torch or LPG/ OXY. How are you going to assembly the railing. The top rail needs to be round recesseded to rivet the tenon. Then hand filed and leaded. Otherwise you will see every tenon. How by hot forging are you going to get everyone exactly the same. The bottoms will need to be dowelled and driven into a pre drilled hole. Good luck with it. By the way the crown has its own Blacksmiths and Blacksmith shops. Just saying.
Hi Brian. I already finished it and installed. I counter sunk the top and forged it flush with a little bit to file after. The bottom was riveted also like the top so no dowl or anything. Skill keeps it straight, some filing before final fit. I was sub contracted by the maintenance team there. Cheers J
I watched black bear forge, he boughta very expensive induction forge Very expensive. bye for now the tennon joints were brill blacksmith. at 74 i am needing a power hammer. bye for now.
Thank you Tom. I also have a better induction forge now, there should be a video on it on my channel. They're awesome but still doesn't replace the solid fuel forge in my opinion. All the very best and hope you get well soon. Cheers J
I have a 15kw, 220 volt unit from China, needs a water cooling unit like for a welding machine. It heats steel rather quickly. I never checked the costs for electricity, so I can not comment on the costs of running it.
@@joshuadelisle around 1500 euro’s including shipping, without the water cooling unit. I use it for knifemaking, but there is a guy on youtube with a similar unit who uses it for black smithing. He can probably advise you better. I will look him up.
If the mcb is on the dc side it won't be doing anything. You need a fuse or a really big fet for dc. As for it not working great, commercial ones are usually 15kw minimum, so your 3kw is way too small for anything but small bars. I'm by no means an expert BTW. Just what I've gleaned from reading many forums etc.
In fact there's a Facebook page/group just for induction forges. And I think you probably need way more flow on your cooling, they don't need pressure, just lots of flow I think.
Great video, but your explanation of electricity, electrons and magnetism is a bit confused and not quite right. You are correct saying that when a current flows in a coil it creates a magnetic field and the most concentrated part of the filed is in the middle of the coil. However, it is not electrons flowing there, it is simply a magnetic field. You are also correct in saying that an induction heater uses AC, so that the magnetic field inside the coil varies backwards and forwards. When there is another piece of metal in a varying magnetic field, the varying field will cause electrons to flow in that piece of metal, i.e. an electric current, called an eddy current. Except for superconductors, all metals have electrical resistance, so eddy currents will cause heating due to this resistance. An induction heater operates at high power and frequency, i.e. the magnetic field is strong and changes very fast, so eddy currents in other pieces of metal will also be big and vary very fast, causing lots of heating.
You need a carbon arc torch ,I’ve melted metal ,brazed ,bent flat bar ,it’s a bit like picking your nose with chopsticks to start with but 45 years ago that’s all there was for the apprentice Blacksmith working in is shed .Make you self a necking tool for your hammer it will let you do the shoulder very fast ,no need to be square ,you should be able to neck,and draw one end in one heat .Great to see the trade being carried on 👍
Thank you Jim I'll take note of that. Cheers J
It’s funny that I happen across this comment on a random channel I just discovered, at the very moment I’m building a carbon arc torch for my stick welder.
Glad you left in the spot with your child in the background. Laughing. You're a good Dad and she sounded like a great Mom too. They make all the hard work and sweat worth it all. It is for them after all, that we strive to be the best we can be. And you certainly seem to be quite the craftsman.
The King of Random is just fun is he not.
Great Video Joshua!
dh
Thank you David. Your totally right! Blessings to you and yours also. Cheers J
I've built the exact same induction heater. It works fine with the recommended power supply. No over heating or smoking. My understanding is the size of the coil matters. The one they included is the right one. It heats metal inside a crucible.
yes it does matter a lot. the inductance should be matched to the Driver, atleast the cirquit looks like that needs to be the case, otherwise it will work poorly. source: i am an electrical engineering student.
I am grateful for seeing your chickens in the video about a mud pit, carbon filters and gas generation. I just as grateful to hear the real world sounds of your partner and child at the start of this one. Just magic, thank you.
I would still recommend getting a induction heater.
A LH-15A will set you back about 700quid peak power is about 8kw.
They speed up the work process and it is cheaper to run than coal or gas.
I bought the blank pcb and used quality mosfets, caps, other components to build it myself. Made a few mods, water cooling for the mosfets & caps, over temp protection, and use an old mig welder (rectified) as power supply. I'm very happy with the unit, the cooling mod allows continual use without over temp.
One observation is your coil is too small for the unit causing your mosfets to linger in "linear" region hence over heating. When altering coils you also need to alter your tank (caps) accordingly. Great video, awsome smithing.
That's great advice thank you Robert. I've now got a 15kw machine and very pleased with it. Its only £500. All the very best. Cheers J
hi Im gonna be making something like this and dont know all that much about it, you think you could give me some advice?
I for one enjoyed the beautiful blend of camera shots and music applied to this video. Your transparency when giving explanations is also refreshing. My biggest kick comes from seeing you back doing what you love. I dearly want one of your power hammers one day! Keep up the awesome work😎
Thank you Dan. Anyone reading this comment should check out Dans channel, his belt sander is awesome! ;) Keep up the great work. Cheers J
10:47 wrong explanation, the coil causes the electrons in the metal to move, the metal has a certain Resistance to it though, that causes the metal to heat up. i know nothing about forging but i know electrical engineering. main inefficiency is actually the magnetic fields escaping. more efficient is a direct connection like an arc furnace. your main issue is that your coil doesnt match the actual driver very well.
Smokes PCB with welder: Buys new welder and repeats 3 more times.
Subscribed.
Brother! You can get that induction heater going well! You're almost there. The power supply and water is great, you may need to "touch up" the pcb.
Re-solder the wiggling parts, glue down some others, maybe replace a few components but you can have that thing going.
Theres lots of resources on the web. Maybe a collab with an electronics dude help you out.
Thank you for a very good and educational video. For the Do it Yourself folks out there you saved us some money, work, and time.
Again, I say thank you!
Thank you for sharing this failure! You've paid for our education and I really appreciate it!
I must have missed this vid when it was released so just watched it. Joshua you are one top bloke! I was an electrician by trade, now 63 years old and retired. How you have the knowledge and passion to try all these things is beyond me - but it sure makes for interesting viewing from my armchair. 👍👏👏👏🤪
Thank you so much. I like to have a go. I like to think there's no such thing as failure just another opportunity to learn something new. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle yes indeed 👍👍👍👍
Always really enjoy your content and presentation style - you’re a natural at it!
Glad to see you finding the time to capture a little bit of what you are doing too - it’s been a while!
Hopefully there will be more great content to educate us all very soon.
Thank you Ian. I've got lots to share but little time to do it. Nearly didn't get this one shared as I was in such a rush to get it done and filming really does slow things down a lot. Thank you for supporting the journey. Hopefully I'll be able to do this TH-cam thing full-time soon if I upgrade my home shop. Cheers J
Glad for that advice Joshua, I have always wanted an induction heater and might have been tempted to buy a cheap one but it would have to be several kilowatts to be of any real use. I am a retired power engineer and would suspect that the components used in the unit are not rated for the job. As I have also experienced with similar products "buy cheap buy twice" or three times. I realise now that commercially available stuff is always expensive for a reason and building a DIY one is sometimes not practical except for experimenting.
However, I really liked watching the video about your skill as a blacksmith - most enjoyable and relaxing.
Thank you so much. I reviewed a 15kw induction heater after this which works very well. Cheers J
The problem of the induction heaters is that the current in the coil is massive and a lot higher than 50 amps because of the resonance between the coil and the capacitors on the pub and if you use a smaller coil, the frequency that it resonates at is a lot higher causing much larger currents up to maybe even a thousand amps.
One last thing, a rectifier does not make DC. You have to smooth out the power with capacitors. All the rectifier does is fold the AC on to itself to be humps instead of a sine wave. You were still putting AC in from the BuzzBox.
The main reason that your induction heaters keep failing is that the coil you are using is too low in inductance.. This makes the frequency too high and the Mosfets can't turn on fast enough. They spend too much time in the "linear" mode which makes them heat excessively.
I have been successfully running these things for a few years now and haven't had any failures since I went through a similar learning process. I don't want to hijack your thread by putting links to my videos and webpages on the subject, though.
I just recently bought a 15kw induction heater that runs directly of off the 240v and I love it so far. I have not used the little 48V DC units like you have there, but I agree with French Creek valley that your coil that you made is to small for the board you are using. It's is not about the power, it's the length of the tubing in the coil; yours is quite a bit shorter than the stock coil and is changing the resonant frequency out of the working range of the board. You can do the small diameter, but make it longer, using the same length of copper tubing.
@@matthewperlman3356 love this!!! Makes a lot of sense!!! Woohoo!! I still have hope now. Haha
I'm now ready for an induction heater and also tought to build it. Will you be so kind to give direction or comment on whether it is feasible and if so, how to go about it? I'm from South Africa.
I have to agree with my learned college on this. you changed the coil to suit your needs but left the capacitors the same. More turns or larger capacitance ;-)
I have one as well. I used two golf cart charger transformers and was melting copper with it.
Joshua, I really like your explanation of induction heating stuff. You are correct when you are talking about efficiency, it all depends on how you look at it. For example, an electric heater is said to be 100 percent efficient but compared to cost of running the unit, hold on to your wallet. Sorry for the bad example since we are talking about induction heating. The components the CHINAMAN use are as cheap as you can get. The duty cycle and reliability is ultra low just like quality of components. The true industrial heaters are just superb. The internal components are first class using water cooled capacitors that have copper construction which are way higher in efficiency with cost to boot. There's a downside as with everything, you need to have different coils for different size and shape . The upside is how quick this will heat up metal using very little electricity as compared to using oxy-acetylene gas or coal as everything today seems to cost so much up front. Nice video mate, look forward to seeing more great videos from you Joshua.
Thank you so much. I agree. Maybe if the technology can improve and still be cheap it may get better. I could invest more in finding out ways of building one from scratch with more internal cooling. But I'm not in any need for one anymore. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle When I find out something I will let you know. Peace V
this was good as i saw the vevor induction video and have been researching building one instead. very helpful, thank you
*encouragement* You are so skilled and talented, you need to produce more videos! 😁
I'll do my best. Thank you. Cheers J
I like your videos and British dialect, I made my own from parts I salvage from SMPS PCBs, Plasma TVs etc.
Joshua,
Really interesting video again.
"The Tower of London",that's reasonably impressive from this end of the world!
That hammer puts out pretty well !
Don't know what it is about your videos but they motivate my day for sure 😎
Looking forward to the next video.
Chris
🇳🇿
Thank you Chris. I'm really glad it helps. Cheers J
The bridge rectifyer does a neat little trick, it swaps the negative side of the AC sine wave to positive. Problem is that the AC voltage is the effective voltage the sine wave produces, not the difference in potential between the 'peaks'. If you flip it up, you get a 100hz pulsed DC, with a peak of AC voltage times sqrt(2) - so about 40% more. So your board got a pulsing DC between 0 and 70V, which is guaranteed to fry a 48V appliance. Adding at least a (big) capacitor to smooth those peaks out would have brought it closer to nominal. Thats usually the biggest price tag in DC supplies - the capacitors and other do-dads to make sure the DC is exactly what it should be.
Thank you. I did think getting some large capacitors would work but for the price I just went and got the official power supply unit. Cheers J
It never occurred to me to use a Tig welder as a forge which is silly as I have got things red hot several times while trying to get suitable conditions to weld & not vaporise thin sheet metal. I will give this a try next time I want to hot set rivets. It is surprisingly often how i learn something from the trials, pain & unhappy struggles of someone else & this unintended transfer is perhaps the potential blessing of helping another to remember & counter negativity when things go awry. Thanks for sharing!
Thank you so much. I think I might be able to fix it by making the coil longer. But to be honest the Tig works surprisingly well. Cheers J
I've looked into these for the same reasons, and have watched Black Bear's progress. My conclusion is that I would be money ahead to buy the same machine he uses; building one myself is beyond my skill set and I would probably fry components to the point where spending the money for a proper one would be more cost-effective.
Yes I think I'm in that boat.... Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle But I must thank you for doing the research! You've saved me time and money, and I appreciate it.
12:34 understandable since when you come out of a full bridge rectifier instead of it being a half sign wave its instead its positive to zero to make it true DC you need two sets of buzz bars with a array of capacitors plus a resister to make DC to jump the top of the sign wave to make true DC the resister is there just so when your not using it it doesn't kill the capacitors
edit: 14:30 i'm surprised you don't have oxy acetylene since most welding suppliers do the rent a bottle scheme where you pay for a bottle of oxygen and acetylene and when they run out you pay for the refill and swap the bottles and you don't need big bottles you can get the half bottles which are half the price to refill i think i paid 500 pound for my acetylene setup and i can't from the top of my head remember how much it costs to refill them but it's cheap
I'm always impressed by your drive and ingenious ideas I made the air filter mask works a treat even works with chap that wears glasses keep up the amazing work
Thank you Nick. All the very best. Cheers J
Matey your videos are awesome! Keep them coming! Ive just started the ram skull project so far so good thanks
Awesome. Thank you and all the very best. Cheers J
Joshua, four tries now thats commitment, nice to see the power hammer doing some big stuff and the railing looks great at the end of the video. Do agree the proper induction forges do look great but are a little bit of an luxury I think at he current price range. Thanks for the heads up.
Thank you Kenny. I think they certainly have their place in high out put production. I would like to see a proper model up close first to have a true opinion and know how long they last. Cheers J
Hi Joshua, From the little I know about my 15kw induction forge the water not only flows through the coil but also through the internal parts (not sure what they are called) so it is cooling those as well. Sounds to me like yours might be experiencing that issue. I also have found on larger stock I start the induction and then insert the metal slowly into the coil so it is not trying to heat up the entire mass within the coil at once. Maybe try preheating the piece for 15 seconds with a torch/gas forge and then see what happens. My 15kw will do up to 1 1/2 inch stock but once i get over 3/4 inch i use the method described above to help get it to temp. Great video's love the most recent one on making leaves!!
Hi, Joshua this video came into my recommended because I am actively building an induction heater I have a few tips. First off your 50 amp breaker is doing absolutely nothing you might as well take that out and rely on the house breaker, in short the power supply you are using lowers the voltage and increases the current so the current on the mains line will be much smaller and your actual house breaker will be the only one that will trip in a short circuit situation. Also this appears to be a ZVS driver which is a rather crude circuit to push past 2.5KVA (2500watts layman's) it likely does not have a resonance capacitor that is close to spec'd enough to push that kind of power. You likely need to buy a new resonance capacitor to get this thing working properly which may run you a decent chunk of change (not too much if you look around cheap capacitors on aliexpress such as dawn caps which have built themselves a reputation among the hobbyist electronics community). You may also want an oscilloscope for this kind of project to look at the resonance frequency between your coil and capacitor bank to make sure it is somewhere reasonable and not something completely out of the ballpark. something like 40khz shouldn't stress the Mosfets.
I am re-watching the video and have new points to make but don't feel like rewriting the original comment. upon closer examination that zvs driver seems more then capable of driving a 2500 watt induction coil. That is a large portion of the circuit board dedicated to resonance capacitors and those mosfet heatsinks do not look like they are something to scoff at. your problem may come from what other people are saying in that the frequency that is resonating between the capacitor and coil is to high. In short the capacitor value or the inductor value may need to change so the frequency is much lower as they are oscillating the power between each other to induce the magnetic field in the coil. I imagine with this circuit changing the capacitor value may be a hassle unless you feel like soldering some new ones on so you will be limited to changing the coil size like others have said. the formula for calculating the resonant frequency between an inductor and a capacitor is f Res =1/2π√LC with LC both under the square root symbol which you are not really going to know the value of your inductor as you have the knowledge of a layman. So I recommend taking an oscilloscope to both sides of your capacitor bank applying a much lower then normal voltage and measuring the frequency's it is resonating at when at rest and under load and making a coil where the values are around **say** 40khz. (note that 1khz = 1000hz) I imagine if you go much higher then **say** 80khz you may run into problems.
Love the content, both the work and your continuing progress with the business.
"... but its a turd" this had me laugh out loud. great video as ever Joshua
Thank you. Glad you liked it. May have found a way to make it work without dieing. We'll see. Cheers J
There's no transfer of electrons from the coil to the work piece. The coil is just concentrating magnetic field lines through the work piece (centered through the middle of the coil). Electrons will orbit around magnetic field lines that are changing (alternating current). This is similar to the effect that creates the aurora borealis. Since metals have a lot of free electrons an induction coil literally just makes the electrons that are already in the work piece spin in little circles (or eddies) around the changing magnetic field lines (like billions of kids going down coiled slides). The electrons stay inside the work piece and don't go anywhere but in spirals. As they spin around the magnetic field lines they bump into other electrons. The collisional energy creates heat.
An old school heating method using an arc welder was a Carbon arc torch. Two copper coated carbon rods in a holder and you create an arc between to make high heat. Not common anymore, but they are still out there. Not sure if they work with invertor welders though.
Bugger about the induction build path.
Thanks for the video.
Thank you. I think a water cooled clamp may work as I can get 200amps without gougeing it as a carbon arc would. Worth a go to see the results though. Cheers J
Thanks for insight into different welders as a power source and of course your video. Vevor induction heater must have been after this.
Thank you. Yes it was, unfortunately I don't think VEVOR stocks the induction forge anyone. Cheers J
Valiant Rescue effort Sir Gallihad, there are only 120 Virgins. I can handle them.
Man, your videos are so informative and spectacularly produced. Love your content, please keep it up! Liked and subscribed :)
Thank you so much that's very kind of you. Lots more coming soon. Come September I hope to be full time on TH-cam content. At least for a while. Cheers J
i have been puzzeled by this zvs driver for over 10years i also blew up loads of ics then when over to igbt 200amp transistors and 200amp rectifiers im still sourcing for monster caps
Thanks me, myself had alot of questions, answered! Sorry it was at your expense. Great video
Thanks for the honest review. It is really helpful. 👍
Thank you. I think with the correct coil it can work but has no adaptability otherwise. Cheers J
Every other American workshop has a LINCOLN 225 AC only welder. If you use 7018AC rods, you can get a certified weld from it easy. Mine is 45 years old and never a grunt. $200 and less used, maybe $400 new. I also have a 500 amp DC 2200 pound diesel welder on a trailer with all sorts of arc control. Guess what - the little 225 gets 5x more use.
yes they need pure dc, and power supply need to be on and running BEFORE connecting to the board, as iv learnt. if you want to make dc with a bridge rectifier, it still too rough, but one way to smooth it right out could be 4 car batteries in series. (with each other, of course) (parallel to P.S.)they would act like huge capacitors (well bolted on) and keep them charged with the welder whatever... do you know alf??
You need to make a copper tubing coils for every size shape part you need to heat red hot. The smallest diameter you can make gets hottest. You also need to make 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, turn coils same diameter in some cases 3 will work best and others 5 turns work best, etc. Coild do not need to be round sausage shape works to heat flat metal. .
I agree withe Jim RY and the carbon arc.. Amazing how well you can heat locally with a carbon arc. Get wo carbon rods from a welding shop and clamp them to the cables of an old welder. Much hotter than a cutting torch. Carbons arcs are very old school but do the job.
I'll definitely give it a go one day. Cheers J
But dangerous fumes
Dude your videos are awesome. Be well brother!
Thank you Chas. Cheers J
Thanks for sharing the learning experience.
Joshua! Don’t give up the day job! It’s way more interesting and challenging dealing with that and translating those challenges into your projects and the interest for us is seeing how you deal with that! BTW your hammer is fantastic and I will be building one... soon! Keep up the excellent work!
Ha ha thank you. I don't mean I'll de doing review videos all the time but the engineering and blacksmithing work I do on a daily basis I'll be able to film because it's my own work and not a different companies. I've got lots of clients waiting for me to start their projects so it'll be an interesting transition. Cheers J
I am looking at your video a year late, but your coil is far too short in length, and causing the ZVS circuit to run at a frequency that is too high. Your smaller coil needs to use "approximately" the same length as the original. If you make your coil 4 to 5 times longer (and slightly larger diameter), the circuit frequency may drop to an acceptable level, and operate properly. That coil is a key electrical component that directly affects operation. The coil must be within the range of inductive values needed for that circuit, else it will cause other components to overheat.
I always think of the coils as being like an antenna and the frequency of the "antenna" has to match the circuit to resonate properly.
Hi,
... I am looking at this video with 3y of delay...
I very much like thee ZVS induction coil heating units and am experimenting with a 2000W model.
Instead of running just one single big coil, I would need to operate/energize 4 smaller, thinner wire coils which each in tunr heat up a 6mm steel pipe.
Any suggestions how I can "convert" the one big coil into 4 smaller thinner coils to obtain the same working efficiency while not burning out the ZVS unit?
Or should I rather operate 4 small ZVS units, one for each steel pipe?
Thank you,
Jake
@@JakeKennes Dealing with a similar issue. I have 3kW ZVS heater and need to use smaller diameter, shorter coil. Very little info about hacking that Chinese devices. I guess that I have to play with capacitors to match the new coil design. But I have no idea how.
yeah the coil actually matters. if the coil doesnt match the Driver it wont work properly, this is a non trivial thing if you want to get this exactly right.
To heat up the steel bars by induction is a brilliant idea! As far as I know you have to use AC for the coil. - I think as higher the frequency as more heat you get... Unfortunately I don't know what is the optimal frequence / voltage / amps for the best result.
However: Thanks for posing this video, you gave me a huge inspiration (for another project)
Thank you. All the very best. Cheers J
Applications of frequency ranges
Frequency (kHz) Workpiece type
5-30 Thick materials (e.g. steel at 815 °C with diameter 50 mm or greater).
100-400 Small workpieces or shallow penetration (e.g. steel at 815 °C with diameter of 5-10 mm or steel at 25 °C with a diameter around 0.1 mm).
480 Microscopic pieces
Ref.( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_heating)
If that is really DC coming out of that power supply, the AC breaker will not work. You need a DC rated breaker.
Glad I subscribed after the nail making videos.
Thank you. Glad you came to support the journey. Cheers J
If no one else pipes up, I can help you set that up to work properly. I've a few years in designing electronics and what not. Just a few ;-)
Thank you Dan. Do you think a DIY build is cost effective compared to buying one? Let me know your thoughts. Thank you for your support. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle yes. I've not built one, but it is just a high power switching supply. Probably a flyback or something is my guess. I think had we spoke before hand, you wouldn't have needed to buy so many. Stuff that is cheap like that is not very tolerant to mistakes. One of the reasons it is cheap. Certainly a purchased one is robust, but if you use it properly, I think a cheap diy unit is possible. Personally, I didn't get far enough to figure out the water like you did.
@@joshuadelisle the guys who build the super turbocharged gaming computers often would seal the case, fill them with mineral oil, and pump that through a radiator to cool. That should help here too. Dan, do you have any thoughts on this?
Dan, see my other comment in this thread. I'd like your input.
@@trollforge you don't want to do that without knowing how much waste heat there is. The specific heat of mineral oil can only absorb so much heat per unit of time. Computers are in the hundreds of watts, not thousands. I don't know the specific heat of mineral oil, but I wouldn't jump to that conclusion without knowing that and how much waste heat there is.
In industrial use they bend heavy wall piping using induction systems
Wow! Awesome work - and for the Tower of London! Impressive.
Not the neatest of work but as I burnt the larger tenons... But they got cut off mostly and rivetted fine. Overall it was ok but I think a bit more practice is needed to keep everything as clean and crisp as possible. Cheers J
Thanks for posting this. It's good to know what' doesn't work as easily as advertised too!
I think it may work better with a different coil but that would mean I can't use a custom coil for different diameters. I've just reviewed a 15kw all singing version and is totally worth spending the extra money on it. Works a treat and heats up 1" solid within a minute. Cheers J
Enjoyed as always!!!!
Thank you. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle you’re absolutely welcome
Hi. Try keeping the coil leads much much closer together. Make them come together like back-to-back "Ls" out of the Chinese toy, keep them close but not touching, and let them come apart only at the coil itself. As far as the under-built circuitry, well, it is just a toy after all.
Thank you. I think it will work better with more windings and longer length of pipe so it resonates at a better frequency it's matched to. Or at least that's the advice I've been given so far. Cheers J
Great video! Thanks man, if you could get that to work it would be amazing. Remote on a pair of leads like a welder would be even better but I'm sure somebody has tried that already. Thanks again, hope all is well over there.
I did get a foot pedal and an ampmeter. Might have a way of salvaging it. Not too sure yet. Might be something to do with the resistance of the coil meaning I need a longer one with more coils to match the one it was supplied with. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle hope to see it.
If you've bought an arc welder, you might consider finding a defunct piece of equipment called a Carbon Arc Torch for it. It has the same utility as an oxy/propane torch, or indeed your inverter. You can heat up a single point with electrical current. They're a little fiddly to use, but cheap to operate.
You're not the first to mention carbon arc. Will definitely give it go when I get hold of some. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle they’re awesome, although you can get a pretty bad sunburn from the arc.
I vote for increasing traces and upgrading mosfets, or just get a 3kw board to match your PS. Most serious blacksmiths use the 7.5kw models if using induction - grossly over-rated at 15kw. Your 2.5kw model is best for smaller projects. Here is a video series on how to use it.
A bummer that the induktion forge isn't working properly. Having one which is not too expensive would be outstanding, especially for the neighbours. No stinky fumes or noise from the fan😊
Too good to be true in this case. Maybe with more tinkering but not as it is. Cheers J
Your explanation on how an induction forge works was fantastic purely because I'm dumb but I understood your explanation 😁. Excellent work and videography as usual Joshua ...love it and keep up the fantastic work ...
Thank you so much. Cheers J
Hello Josh. My first thought of induction forges was of something massive, heating up a very large piece. This was so dainty and localized! (I have seen some monsters used for heating large tungsten and molly ingots.) Seeing you holding the work with bare fingers was very cool (as your fingers apparently were). Amazing to see some of the work you are doing. Congrats on the Tower commission.! I liked the vignette with the cooling tenon as your little one came to see you. Fade to family......
Thank you Tim. There are monsters of induction out there and it looks like they work well, massive money though. All the very best. Cheers J
Great video as usual!!!!
Thank you Matthew. Cheers J
I am amazed such a concept could work without burning the copper coils. Looks like a dead short to me. A DC magnet does not induce any current in nearby metal. It has to be AC.
Good video. But u cant change the coil just like that. Its a tank oscilator. Coil inductance and value of capacitor must be such that we get a proper resonent frequency sign wave
You need a relay between the power supply and the induction heater,if you connect the power supply directly to induction heater it will burn up the mosfets as soon as you turn it on. They need to see full voltage and current from the start a proper size relay will work. If you are worried about coil inductance buy a inductance meter check with any ham operator he will have one, then you can measure the factory one and whenever you use a different coil if its the same inductance your heater will never no the difference. Kb4saf
Great info as always
Thank you. Cheers J
Very interesting project. Nice rail too.
Been pretty interested in the induction forges. Truely hope you get that bit of kit sorted.
🙏 Well wishes, possitive energy and Blessed days now Sir
Crawford out 🔥⚒️🧙🏼♂️
Thank you so much. Cheers J
Hi Josh - That’s a real shame I was getting really excited about making one. Hopefully someone will contribute with some answers to make this work.
It maybe the resistance of the coil I'm using isn't enough. I will explore further. Cheers J
Could you give us some more detail on why you feel it doesn't work? Is it just that the board overheats?
Also I've noticed that the commercially available induction forges aimed at blacksmiths start at 15kW - so maybe expecting a 2.5kW unit to be effective is a bit ambitious!
I should of filmed the board bit it's literally melting and smoking when using it. Apparently the official systems have water cooled capacitors with modular replacement parts as they wear out quickly. Not convinced of it long term cost effectiveness thanless the technology get better and cheaper.
Amps are 'chosen' by the drain device. You can have 100amps, but if the drain device only needs 10A, then 10A is what will flow. Not sure if you mean the welder will increase voltage, not current, but wanted to add my half a penny.
I also feel that there is an issue with your coil. Seems awful small... 🤷🏽♂️
Could you of used a carbon arc torch on your ac welder? They aren't as popular now as they once were, but you can heat things up pretty well with them.......Just a thought 😉
You could but it would gouge it on high current. If I clamp it with copper water cooled clamps I can get 200amps through it. Cheers J
Good information, thanks
I need to get up in the loft and dig out my training on induction heating.
We used it to seal up TetraPak cartons.
so I know I am a month late but here goes.
so when not in use it should be switched off that might help those transistors will get hot in idle.
the inductance on the coil is quite important for the correct oscillation of the circuit. the number of turns is proportional to the inductance.
I am sure between us we can get something that works well like your power hammer.
Thank you Jo. Yes since the video I've learned I need a much larger coil with more turns for both inductance and resistance. It came with a coil but was too wide for the size of stock I wanted to use it for. I'm considering using the original coil again but this time making it into a 'micky mouse' shape so it has smaller coils wound to the side... Do you think that will work? Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle
I think I have found one similar on Amazon for £20. I'll have a look at it and see if there are any improvements that are easy to do. I will only use it for arrow heads so much smaller stock to start with.
Great video! ..... and nice to see an honest opinion stated ;0)
One thing you need to keep in mind when ordering this stuff from China ....... they Lie!
If you buy from a UK company it makes no sense for them to sell a dud as they will shortly have to replace it .... foreign sellers, less so!
If your unit puts out 2.5KW at 48V it would need to push 52.08A (P=VI gets you P/V=I) down the coil! If it takes any more than that it would be caused by inefficiencies in the kit .... which would be mainly heat! Hence the toasty board! You also need to have some serious reinforcement to the tracks that carry the load in the board too (usually a wire laid the length of the track and soldered along its full length)! Also you need to be aware of different ratings for breakers and use one designed for magnetic devices.
I think the majority of the useful generated heat is from the eddy currents set up by the collapsing magnetic field in the steel! ..... but it is a while since I dabbled ;o)
Resistive heating is the most efficient, but arcing at the contacts could be a killer .... maybe using copper braid as a contact material would work. Having really chunky clamps would also increase the thermal mass and again using copper would allow for the relative resistivity of copper and steel to work to your advantage and water cooling would too! I think microwave induction is a bit beyond amateur level and would be more trouble than it is worth ..... but if you could get hold of the right materials Friction might be a good one!
Sorry for ranting on a bit ;o)
You need a much higher frequency to get any heat😁
It worked but I needed the right sized coil. My new 15kw induction forge is much better if you want to see that video. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle you have two options, change your capacitors , your coil looks great, maybe one or two turns more 😁😇
THANKS GREAT INFORMATION!!!!
Thank you for watching. Cheers J
Problem with Using a buzz box as you call it is the welders duty cycle. Only one welding machine manufacturer with a 100% duty cycle is Lincoln. Even with a Lincoln the electric welders usually doesn't have the 100% duty cycle like the portable gas or diesel welder generators. You can burn up a welder doing what you're suggesting by clamping both +- together on what you want to heat. The welding leads will melt through what you're trying to heat up before that happens. If you don't destroy your welder first.
Most welders have safety over heat switch so it's not a problem. My oil filled oxford is 100% duty at 220amps. Most welders have a 100% rated duty cycle at 60% of the amp capacity. So a typical 200amp welder is 100% duty under the 120amp setting. Cheers J
Pro tip: they sell complete induction heaters built by people who build induction heaters. Might cost more than 75 quid but you get what you pay for.
Does the length of the copper coil affect the wattage? Can i use a longer coil while withdrawing the same wattage?
So it requires a specific size coil and number of winding to match the resonance otherwise it over heats. It comes with a specific coil but it's not ideal for forging. My new 15kw version is far more flexible when it comes to coil design and has safety features so you don't cook the machine by accident like I did with this one. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle aprox how many kw induction heater do i need to super heat a small pizza oven?( Meaning the coil wrapped around the oven from the outside)
@@jomfawad9255 my honest opinion would be to use a halogen heater or electronic furnace element if you want an electronic pizza oven. A 1kw system would be more than enough with good insulation. Personally I would use a wood fired one made from adobe straight from the ground. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle thank you
How can you do this without having oxy-acetylene on on hand that's like one of the most fundamental metal working tools to have or is it that a time to acquire in your neck of the woods
I've got the kit but because I'm only infrequently using my home shop I can't justify the rent on the bottles. To be honest using my Tig torch worked excellent and I would say was better than oxy-fuel for this purpose. Still If I find a more cost effective alternative to gas I will use it. Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle why Wrentham I bought two bottles on let-go outright for 60 bucks. And the oxygen bottle was entirely full and I found a guy who will refill any bottle I bring him at a lower price than anyone else in the area so I'm sure you can manage something without spending an arm and a leg
i use an oxygen machine and propane for torch.. not too bad
Hi Joshua, thanks for this video. Like the way you explain things.
I was also thinking of building one but if I grill 3, 4 units it maybe better if I buy one ;-)
I have seen a portable one at 240€ for a 1000W, but did not try it out.
I bought your horse head pattern to try to build one but for the moment I stick to 2D-models :-) One day I will get the courage to try that one out. Keep up the good work!
A welder to power this is not a great idea as their outputs will likely be way out of spec for something like this.
I expect this induction heater module is probably not rated for continuous use at the rated power. Your coils also need electrically insulating, glass fibre is good for that. As the coil really needs a water cooling at such high power, the best thing would be to also cool the electronics with a water cooling system.
Note also that switching the induction heater on and off without a separate switch for the fans is not good as the devices may get very hot heating some metal, but then you turn it off and the fans stop, so the heat isn't removed.
Re welders: different types of welders have different output characteristics. The older cheap stick welders were all simply a big transformer, so AC. Modern inverters are DC, but stick and TIG normally uses constant current output, so the voltage will vary all over the place. MIG is constant voltage so may work as a PSU, but you won't want the wire feeder running every time you use the induction forge. So called HF start (really high voltage) will put thousands of volts on the welding tip.
U.S. Solid 15 KW High Frequency Induction Heater 30-80 KHz, 220V or 110V this unit. Can be used 24 h with no problems
My latest video is on the VEVOR 15kw. Pretty much the same as the US solid but 220v only. Only £500.
I would have bought one tomorrow if it worked.
It may work after talking to a few others. I need to use its original coil to keep the correct resonance and tighten up a few coils to make it useful. It's not as simple as putting any size coil on it.
I do a considerable amount of this type of work. I use a multi holed gas forge to heat the tenons. As i only need to heat the last 20mm. With out an oxy torch or LPG/ OXY. How are you going to assembly the railing. The top rail needs to be round recesseded to rivet the tenon. Then hand filed and leaded. Otherwise you will see every tenon. How by hot forging are you going to get everyone exactly the same. The bottoms will need to be dowelled and driven into a pre drilled hole. Good luck with it. By the way the crown has its own Blacksmiths and Blacksmith shops. Just saying.
Hi Brian. I already finished it and installed. I counter sunk the top and forged it flush with a little bit to file after. The bottom was riveted also like the top so no dowl or anything. Skill keeps it straight, some filing before final fit. I was sub contracted by the maintenance team there. Cheers J
very smart!
Thank you. Cheers J
Hi sir I want the circuit diagram of this induction forge
Hi sorry. I don't have one. cheers J
Your new coil is too small. So the frequency the transistors switch does not match the coil causing them to heat up.
كم تبلغ اقصا درجة حرارة لهاذه الالة
Hi !Nice work man !Great job !Greeting #Bulatsschmiede 😊🤙
I watched black bear forge, he boughta very expensive induction forge Very expensive. bye for now the tennon joints were brill blacksmith. at 74 i am needing a power hammer. bye for now.
Thank you Tom. I also have a better induction forge now, there should be a video on it on my channel. They're awesome but still doesn't replace the solid fuel forge in my opinion. All the very best and hope you get well soon. Cheers J
I have a 15kw, 220 volt unit from China, needs a water cooling unit like for a welding machine. It heats steel rather quickly. I never checked the costs for electricity, so I can not comment on the costs of running it.
Nice! Do you recommend it? How much did it cost? Cheers J
@@joshuadelisle around 1500 euro’s including shipping, without the water cooling unit. I use it for knifemaking, but there is a guy on youtube with a similar unit who uses it for black smithing. He can probably advise you better. I will look him up.
@@joshuadelisle EJ of the Anvil
@@Tonioostendorp thank you Tony
eddie currents in material being heated
If the mcb is on the dc side it won't be doing anything. You need a fuse or a really big fet for dc. As for it not working great, commercial ones are usually 15kw minimum, so your 3kw is way too small for anything but small bars. I'm by no means an expert BTW. Just what I've gleaned from reading many forums etc.
In fact there's a Facebook page/group just for induction forges. And I think you probably need way more flow on your cooling, they don't need pressure, just lots of flow I think.
Great video, but your explanation of electricity, electrons and magnetism is a bit confused and not quite right. You are correct saying that when a current flows in a coil it creates a magnetic field and the most concentrated part of the filed is in the middle of the coil. However, it is not electrons flowing there, it is simply a magnetic field. You are also correct in saying that an induction heater uses AC, so that the magnetic field inside the coil varies backwards and forwards. When there is another piece of metal in a varying magnetic field, the varying field will cause electrons to flow in that piece of metal, i.e. an electric current, called an eddy current. Except for superconductors, all metals have electrical resistance, so eddy currents will cause heating due to this resistance.
An induction heater operates at high power and frequency, i.e. the magnetic field is strong and changes very fast, so eddy currents in other pieces of metal will also be big and vary very fast, causing lots of heating.