Photographing Concerts in Bad Light? | Ask David Bergman
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 มิ.ย. 2024
- Today's question from Evan M. is, “How do you deal with shooting concerts at a small venue when the lights are all heavily saturated colors? Are there certain colors that can not be fixed and the only choice is to embrace it or make it black and white in post?”
Go to www.AskDavidBergman.com to submit your own photo question, see David's gear list, and view the episode archive.
00:00 Intro
00:59 Photographing concerts in a small club
01:29 Using fast lenses
02:21 Converting photos from color to black and white
03:40 Using wireless flash to photograph club concerts
09:50 Separate yourself as a photographer
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You've eased my mind: "document it as it is." I work with a children's theater group as the music director. But I also love taking photos of the show. Our stage lighting is horrible; it is so inconsistent across the stage. Some kids are in the dark while others are well lit. Plus there are times that specific colors are used to set the scene. I've been trying to make adjustments in Light Room, but I'm unsuccessful. After watching this video I realize I just need to leave it; this is what it was on stage. For the next show I will boost my ISO and open up my lens. Hopefully that will help. Thanks for this topic and sharing your knowledge.
Great advice, David. I spent 47 years of my life as a drummer, and most "night club" lighting was indeed horrible... a random collection of a few lights with randomly-selected colors, often with a green gel on one player, a magenta gel on another, etc., with no real design. A little knowledge and experience can go a long way toward producing better images! :)
I have shot tons of these shows. I got to know the staff at the bars and was able to get them to set their LED lights to more usable colors. I tried your method last show and it worked pretty well.
Worst gig I shot was a stoner sludge band who got them turned of the stage lights and filled the stage with smoke and they put a small red lamp in front of the drum kit pointing straight up to the ceiling.
That sounds horrible. :P
@@richardwintle1020 It was. Only chance I got was moving to the side of the stage and wait for when the singer faced the drummer
Ouch!
I didn't see David mention this anywhere in the video. If anyone wanna take advice from me. It's free game. not like anyone read my comments.
I'm surprise that David didn't mention this in the video. This is for the case if you have the Canon EOS R mirrorless system. (most likely will work on the RP, R6, R5, or R3). I don't know if the Nikon Z cameras or the Sony camera have this feature as well.
Other than having fast glass. set your camera to FV mode. Pick your shutter speed, pick your aperture, and set ISO to AUTO. Make sure your subject is in the focusing point so the EOS R metering can get pretty darn close to what ISO you need for the shot. Because the subject might move in and out of the light, causing the light value to change. Make sure you use the exposure compensation bar according to what you need expose properly. I like the mirrorless system's "Expo Simulation" feature since it'll give me an idea of what kind of exposure I'm getting by the time I click on that shutter.
When you get into post, you don't have like a hand full of blow out photos or way under expose because of the wrong camera settings on those lights. Your photos will be consistent if you use this method for "bad concert lighting".
That's a brilliant idea on the speedlights! I'm totally going to try it when I'm allowed back in to shows, here in Canada.
It was fab to hear your wisdom on this one - I was recently at a shoot with muliple models and photographers for a photowalk and the organisers were using mainly coloured LED lighting so most shots had skin tones replaced with red, blue, green, orange etc. In post I found that in some cases I could somewhat neutralise certain colours by adding opposing colour and get a better skin tone - in other cases a black and white conversion was the way to go.
One thing I sometimes use in similar situations (bad colour) is the Color Grading (used to be Split Toning) feature in Lightroom. Unless the light is a complete single colour wash, you can ajust tones and shift colors to get more of a natural color back in the skin tones.
Superb! Thanks David.
That’s why I watch your videos..so many great tips for many different situations. Thanks, again.
I just did a event and the flash work for this. Thank you 😊
Awesome, thx for sharing 🙏🏼
Woot woot! I assumed this topic was asked and answered before my time as a subscriber, so this is great.
The scenario that pushed me to get myself better equipped and informed was seeing the pics of the artists posing with guests in the low ceiling lobby of a jazz club with all black walls. The once in a lifetime image of just me and Jim McCarty, founder of the original Yardbirds (a real gent) looks ghastly and I still look at it to provoke me to do better from now on.
Most of my live music shooting was duo singer/songwriters in small places like restaurants that make room by shoving some tables around; or put them right by the front entrance so patrons walk in front of them, kick the snow off their boots to get to a table, or I'm not kidding, servers ask the musicians to scooch over while they are playing, so they can reach the baked goods rack behind them. No investment in their entertainment at all. Lights or sound installed? LOL, please :)
Thank you for the share I often do fashion runways and this would work great there as well
I'm not an event or concert photographer but a few friends own a bar that throws a big Halloween party every year which I shoot, including the live band. The light isn't bad, but it isn't great either and the place has a dark nearly 30' ceiling that doesn't work well for bounce flash. Putting flashes on stands, with drunk people partying, isn't something I was willing to risk either.
The first year I was mostly photographing peoples costumes and got a few shots of the band. I used a Rogue Flashbender on a handheld speedlight for the portraits and ambient for shots of the band. The second year I hung a pair of Evolv 200's with reflectors from the exposed roof beams and bounced light off the wall opposite where the band plays. I was able to use very little flash power and freeze action thanks to the leaf shutter in my X100s.
The third year I remembered to turn off sleep mode before I hung the Evolv's(DOH!). The last two years... Well you can imagine how that went but hopefully I'll be back there in 2022.
Wow, you used an x100s for this? I've always struggled with boosting the ISO on mine; haven't been able to tame it for darker situations. Was your solution only to better-light the subject and scene, or did you do more? I'd love to see what you created. Are these images posted anywhere? Cheers!
Great article David, a lot of good ideas and I like the "making it your own" angle
Good job. Thanks for your comments. I learned a lot.
Thanks David!
That are awesome tipps! Thank you! 😁
So far one of the best videos on the subject. Though I would really be interested in a deeper dive into when you don’t have any access, or speed lights, and all you have is your camera. I enjoy shooting events, but one of the problems is that the lights change between colors so much that it can be difficult to get good shots.
Thanks for this video. Such great tips. Cant wait to see the next video.
Great examples!! Thx!
Great video!! Thank you 🙏🏾
Don't forget to get to know the lighting guy in a larger event. They can often create a scene and cue you when it will happen. When transitioning from saturated scene to saturated scene, often a dissolve will include a mid transition through white, or strobes if used can be triggered if your radio includes the ability to trip a 1/4 inch strobe trigger. In a scene with strobes, an extra shot in sync with the camera won't even be noticed. This can be coordinated with a riff with a performer jump and the strobe at the peak of a jump can appear to be just another element of the show, but the lighting guy let the photographer trip the strobe for the jump. This works best with the strobes in with the PARs on the truss. Get there early, It is possible the crew can rig your speedlights into the flown trusses.
I can see you now hitting the shutter with the beat to look like the lighting system 😎
The blue one of John looks nice as well
I had a go at this on the weekend at a local gig and the results were fantastic. The three bands that played were thrilled with the images. I may have got at least one photographer off-side…
Great advice... Thanks
Thanks David - Happy Holidays -------
I know the lightning director so I just tell him I am photographing and give some me good light! I found that lower ISO helps with red lights.
This is a great "starting point" when regular flash is not available. Nice job, David. 💪📸
This so what I needed
When the Rotolight NEO 3 hits the market you will have an LED flash that allows you to remotely fire and change the colors on making the use of gels obsolete.
Great video!I shoot a biker bar in RI and have actually used mag mod magmasks behind bands before they loved the images. I was at Luke Combs show last Thursday was hoping to see you in action but didn't spot you. Great show!
I was there!
"Your friend Pat McGee??" That's awesome, man. I used to love them but haven't listened to them in ages. Will have to give their catalog another look, thanks for the reminder! Also, great work with the video :)
Nice video, and great ideas David. Personally I only photograph musician friends at small venues... I will most definitly try and place some speedlights next time.
Thank you for your videos.
I shoot a lot of dance and the combination of very little (nice and moody if you're in the audience) and usually monochromatic light is the hardest. Especially if they combine 2 or 3 different colors. Can look pretty cool if it's not too dark though.
Hey David...How do you adjust to fog machines on stage.
Excellent 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻. I will try using my flash very soon👍👍👍👍
Just watched again to refresh my mind. I noticed you are as old as I am, why? You mentioned "flash bulbs"!!!
Did a burlesque show once but I went no flash as one guy (boyfriend of one of the girls) was blasting away walking around getting in front of the stage, generally being a distraction. I stayed in back and pumped up my iso. Didn't get all winners but some good ones. Plus I was asked back. Working the situation...
Always great information! Thanks David! #Adorama #CreateNoMatterWhat
Thanks David, great tips for shooting in small venues with poor lighting with a heavy emphasis on red and blue lights . For triggering lights remotely , is there a tendency for the remote flash/speedlight to go to sleep disabling any remote triggering ?
If not using remote flash , what I have done with passable results 😀 adjust the raw image color temperature and hue to calm down some of the reds/blue and process it into black /white with yep DxO Silver Efex
Sleep / energy saver is usually a setting on the flash. So depending on how long they'll be up there before you start shooting, you might want to allow it to go to sleep and then wake when you first start shooting.
Damn. That is a really great idea!!
Sounds like we are all hear for problem solving and gaining some new weapons in our arsenals. Thanks Dave.
Nice and timely tips, especially for using flash(es). Often times the rule for press at big venues is '3 first songs only'. So, don't waste your time, guys!
Big venues often have much better lighting, though. So flash is not needed anyway.
I love this. It’s something I can use n other situations too. Thank you for whispering your secret
You're amazing.
I shoot small venues here in London out of choice, although I am also a house photographer for the one of the capital's nicer medium-size venues. Lighting can get really bad to surprisingly good, sometimes in the same venue, depending on the operator. The biggest frustration is when venues have decent lighting rigs, but the operating is usually left to the sound engineer, who often isn't that bothered with the visuals and just sticks on red lights (red lights are for prostitutes and photographic darkrooms). A lot of the time I will go and talk to them before the show and ask them not to use red or make it too dark, and usually they will do it because it's one less thing for them to think about. I've only had one person tell me to piss off on many years of doing it, but when he saw I was a photographer he apologised and did a great job. If the lights are stuck on a single colour (red, blue or green) I usually convert to B&W, as those three are particularly testing for the sensors. Monochrome lighting = monochrome photos. Or I shoot shoot some B&W film. If the lighting is good or fairly decent I will always colour correct in post to try and get a decent skin tone on the artists. If the lighting is really low I will occasionally throw on a small flash to add some fill light to the faces while trying to maintain as much of the atmosphere as possible, rather than blasting it with a big flash burst and annoying the band. In small venues it always pays to talk to people working there, including the bouncers, and let them know what you're doing, and , of course, the band. It's usually very chilled here and you can do what you like without passes or restrictions (short of climbing on the stage), and if you're a regular at venues or for bands then you'll be better accepted. Just have fun.
Couldn't agree more Chris. We have the same scenario here in Tasmania with soundies often doing the lighting. I too get to know the guys and ask them to put some white into the front of house lights (ie - those pointing at the band members faces). Then it is not too worrisome if the other lights are the dreaded red/blue/green.
......and thanking them often goes a long way in them continuing to do this for you at future gigs.
Monochrome lighting = monochrome photos LOL!!!!
@@andrewfuller62 Bring them a print of their great work!
Have this very situation coming up soon, timing of this video couldn't have been better!!!
Awesome
Great advice! Last concert I shot I ran into a problem with LED lighting. When I used electronic shutter I got really bad banding. When I switched to mechanical shutter I still ended up with some banding, although it wasn’t as bad and isn’t quite as noticeable unless you’re looking for it. What’s the best way to alleviate this? Finding that one perfect shutter speed that syncs with the lights? I was at 1/250th for this one.
Yea, that's all you can really do with today's technology. The new Canon R3 will actually look at the scene and find the exact shutter speed to match the pulsing lights.
oh my god this is factastic tips! I will use this. thanks!
Sometimes in photoshop 2024 you can set the image to black and white and use the “colourise” filter to re apply more natural colours, which you can then mask/filter over the og photo to make it more natural for the scene. Doesn’t always work ofc but it’s a useful method
that was awesome. What setting do you settings are you with your speed light?
No clue. LOL. But I just adjusted them (wirelessly from my camera) until they looked good! :)
@@DavidBergmanPhoto that is awesome hahaha
Ask David something simple and he will tell you about a life full of secrets and experiences!
I have been a concert photographer for years, also events, and more ... this video 10 years ago would have been an invaluable help!
I hope you appreciate those who are just starting out in this world.
Salo added something that you did not mention, if there is someone filming, also ask if the flashes disturb the filming!
Greetings from Uruguay.
Good point, and thanks for the kind words!
This is pretty much what I do - except for using flash - I shoot for a folk festival & small venue (max 250 seating) - it just wouldn't work. One of my most recent concerts - the single performer was lit with that magenta color, but then he's a 'colorful' character even if he's 73, so I left the color.
Try a black walled church at a wedding with no plug in for lighting and a really bright big screen and spotlights with purple colors at a wedding. Ahhhh
Ouch!
Just taking a survey: which white balance would you use in this senario? I was told to pick one and NOT use auto, because it would be all over the place. I was told to pick any one I like and fix it in post. What's your take??
If I'm using gels, I'll put it on 'daylight' or 'flash' WB just so it doesn't change frame to frame. It doesn't really matter, however, because (assuming you're shooting RAW), you can change it to look however you want when you process in post.
I have to practice flash and gel color with a band in studio , because I can control iso, speed, light , focus etc In a concert, small or big It's difficult metering ambient light and then fill with flash, it's a high risk to burn your photos. with a lot of light. Sorry for my English I'm from Chile South America. Practicing.
I’ve been using strobes on stages for a couple years now. Except I don’t do gels. I use grids. Can’t see the strobe light leak and I can direct it exactly where I want. Like you said tho, read the room and see if you can get away with it and if you can don’t shoot a million frames lol
Smart!
David, I've done this a few times, mixed results, but Now I'm goin in with all 5 of my speedlites and a pack of Gells, Brilliant lighting the crowd. Please tell me though, are you in ETTL?
No - all manual. Lights are pre-set so you can set them to look exactly how you want.
Last night I shot Killswitch Engage at House of Blues....the shutter was cutting into my photo as well bandwidth lines driving me crazy but only certain photos. trying to study why. my settings were 1/160, 2.8 and ISO 2000 more or less depending on the lighting.
im late i know but you should use a faster shutter speed to prevent banding
I have a related but slightly different problem shooting events in a church. They have multiple technologies for their “white” lights, and seem to enjoy changing the blend throughout the event. Biggest problem is when part of the scene is lit with one temperature and another with a very different temperature. White balance is always off somewhere. For the more critical shots I’ve dealt with this by masking and using multiple white balances in post, but this is horribly time consuming. Is there a better way?
Other than using flash? You have to just deal with the light that's there. Sounds like you're making the best of a tough situation.
@@DavidBergmanPhoto, thanks for the reply! I’ll check with the media director to see if there would be a way to include some flash.
I have shot 100s of gigs and using a flash like you suggest removed all atmosphere from an event, a gig is what it is make the best out of the event lighting, as for the red and blue lights, have you never heard of colour correction? Pretty simple assuming you shoot in raw
And that is why all your cellphone looking photos are so plain looking and boring
I use the Sony A7RII with a 35mm & a slow shutter speed it’s the best low light camera I’ve ever used beside the canon 6D
☺️
👍🏾
If shooting ambient-only and you can't use flash, and your camera offers the feature, then you can use bracketing for some shots. I'll do 9 shots at ±0.5Ev. Not all night long but every now and then when the mood strikes. If you're on high-speed continuous and hold down the shutter the camera will bang out all the shots as fast as it possibly can. That gives me up to 2 stops under and 2 stops over to work with. There's usually too much movement to stack the shots but doing this lets me pick and choose the perfect *exposure* , and sometimes the perfect pose as well.
I wouldn't use bracketing shots on this. Just too much wasted shots. and too many photos to look through. If you had the Canon EOS R mirror system. FV mode and auto ISO will save you all the BS..
: Outstanding. Roger That : 🐢 📸 😀
What are gels?
Freak’n Einstein level solution!!!
David,
I appreciate your creativity. However, you can use Flash because you have a personal relationship with the band, and they trust you. When photographing a concert at a large venue where you don't have this relationship, using flash is the kiss of death. One photographer briefly used his flash at a rock concert at the Cynthia Mitchell Pavillion in the Woodlands, Texas. He is no longer allowed to shoot there. All photographers are told that flash is forbidden. Getting permission to shoot at this venue is very difficult to accomplish, and it makes me angry that he would destroy his credibility in such a manner.
Larry from Texas
You focus on lighting in clubs etc. with no professional light engineers. You ever watched video's of for instance Military tattoos? They have usually the best light engineers but horrible lighting desingers flooding the parade ground with just red or blue light. I can imagine the camera operators swearing and cursing ;-)
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No One Allow To Place Flash.
well, obviously the bands he shot did
Concert photography is done with film. It is black and white when in poor lighting and one either uses Ilford 3200 or Kodak HP3200. The Ilford has a nominal rating of around 1000. The HP3200 is actually just shy of 800. You don't just go for the widest aperture. You don't want the fastest shutter speed. You want to be at 1/60th. Spot meter it. In very low light you must use the Ilford. The HP3200 is best if you can get away with 1600. The HP3200 has too much contrast pushing it to 3200. The Ilford gives better detail in shadow. You shoot at 1/60th to get motion. If you're shooting with digital your photos are ugly, flat and frozen. You can push HP5 to 1600 with good results. Digital is just plain ugly. Any monkey can shoot digital. It takes talent to do it right.