Note: I've seen a few comments about this taking up two talismans slots - just to clarify, you only need to use 1 of the 2 talismans to achieve these i-frames, and it's quite useless to equip both, as they won't stack their i-frames. So For those wondering, these factors do apply to PvP as well; backstep i-frames will be affected by the equipped weapon, and will also lose an additional 4 i-frames as a result of a PvP-exclusive nerf to the talismans following their release. This video was pretty interesting to make, as I initially set out to simply compile the frame data into one video, and then sort of stumbled upon wepmotionpositionIDs' involvement and it quickly rabbit holed from there. You'd probably expect lighter weapons to have more i-frames, if anything, so it may be possible that this is just another mistake - but as always we'll never have confirmation of this, and are just speculating off it's randomness.
Thank you! That’s really cool data. Love the video! But also, what the fuck is Fromsoft doing? Having the count change because of weapon choice without any visual indication of it happening is adaptability level of game design. Absolute spaghetti code.
@@Xandros999 I'm not familiar with animation cancelling, but there has been a general spread of misinfo that 12 i-frame backsteps are performed by holding a weapon over your shoulder. While it's technically true, it's not the actual cause, and I would think of it like this; all weapons that are held over the shoulder will have 12 i-frames, but you can also perform 12 i-frame backsteps using weapons NOT held over the shoulder. This is because all weapons held over the shoulder - greatswords, colossal weapons, great axes, etc - all have a OneHandID and BothHandID of above 0, so they get 12 i-frames instead of 11 - but at the same time, weapons held over the shoulder are not the only weapons to have a wepmotionpositionID of above 0, so other weapons can do the same. As a result it becomes easy to conflate the two, although there is more nuance to it
If it was something less significant like the Scorpion Charm penalty I would consider it but it's 35% more damage taken across the board so unless I ever start doing no-hit runs then it's useless to me. Edit: It's actually -15% damage negation so a bit more reasonable but I still wouldn't use it with how much damage bosses do since it only opens up some optimization that isn't necessary at all.
@@Kurai_69420 I got it confused with the Beloved Stardust talisman because I thought one was -15% and the other was -35% and it turns out I was also wrong on that and Beloved Stardust is -30%.
I’m so happy because this Backstep was something I applied on Bloodborne but in a way it was a bit harder to do, you had to press the dodge button and at the same time push the stick back and up and it worked and you could attack but the dodges didn’t work like here it was just a style because you took damage but.. Elden Ring really considered it as a dodge now and it’s easier to do it’s crazy thanks ooloh for this video ♡
I am not fully sure what you mean by that, since the raw backstep mechanic including reverse backsteps are basically the exact same in bloodborne. The timing for reverse backsteps is also way tighter in Eldenring, while they are hilariously easy to perform in Bloodborne. The only way to have actually useful backsteps with s is in Eldenring with these dlc talismans, which I mean I guess it’s fun for NG+ playthroughs? Wish Fromsoft would actually try to give us consistently interesting combat mechanics from the get go instead of patching that stuff in via paid DLC content.
For the me the number one reason that you mentioned is that it adds coherency to the fight. You are so much more aware of where your character is and what it is doing. Of course, for super experienced players this may not be a factor, but for someone not as good like me that still wants to play the game properly without cheesing it, it is fantastic. Also, some weapons have great follow-up attacks to the backstep, and it can be combined nicely with sorceries and incantations.
I've been using this talisman a ton since the dlc dropped for all the reasons you mentioned, plus two more: 1. It's really fun to learn and get used to a different type of dodging motion after 4 games of dodge roll 2. It looks stylish af 👌
@TheExeption by 4 games I meant dark souls 1-3 and ER. Bloodborne dodge was different, yes, but backstep dodging feels almost entirely new compared to the classic forward dodge. It's something that can definitely be built upon further (by giving I-frames to feint attacks, for example). It makes fights feel a lot more "duel" like, which is very fun
@ It was actually really cool. Was good to have a different button to press for once to avoid damage and that would have a unique follow-up attack. Frankly, they should never have got rid of backstep I-frames. Maybe it doesn't make actual sense, but then neither does dodge rolling.
I'm glad that backsteps are finally getting some love. I've been using them in PVP for years and have always preached that they are severely slept on. Even when they didn't have I-frames, unique backstep attacks catch people off guard, in DS3 a lot of the spears have backstep attacks that are entirely unique, which are much faster counter attacks than you'd get out of a roll, which is fantastic when you use the leo ring, i belive the pike and saints bident have a three hit charge attack that combos cleanly into the full charge weapon art which can be extended with an R2. People don't see it often so they aren't expecting counter attacks that fast. I've one shot overlevelled phantoms with that true combo. Sure, you didn't have I-frames but proper spacing makes that a non-issue.
Nooo this video is really excellent I like every little detail in terms of staging on your little fights it's example by always being precise and clean and the music very good choice 0:05 / 1:08 / 2:06 / 3:24 / Thanks thanks ❤
Interesting. Once I will have enough time to go back to the game and finally slay PC Radahn, I shall try that for the Alucard build that I have in mind.
@@VitharrOdinson I can find precisely zero information that supports that DS1 backsteps had I-frames. The only "evidence" I can find is people having displaced far enough that they don't NEED I-frames to avoid the attack.
@@destruction6124 It seems my previous reply may have been deleted for having a link to another video, but Domo3000 has a video titled, "We have all been wrong about i-frames," that goes over data across all 3 Dark Souls games. At the 30 second mark, it shows the animation data for backsteps, proving that all backsteps in Dark Souls 1 had 4 s right at the start of the animation. It was one of the first resources to show up in a search result.
Ah, I remember how backstep were the solution for the extremely questionable frametrap on Pre-nerf Crosslash, but I never knew they were *that* useful... Thanks for showing! Btw 2:15 NGL would had been quite cool fighting those fellows in plain Limgrave.(you fight one of them on an evergaol and Stormveil if im not wrong)
I love it because I feel it's much faster as an offensive option when combined with the backstep attacks. rolling attacks are definitely slower on many weapons especially taking rolling animation itself into account. Also they feel less cheesy for some reason even when spammed and last but not least, you look cool. All these are enough to bear the 15% damage penalty but honestly there shouldn't have been any penalty for a talisman slot's opportunity cost.
“It’s fine if you don’t get hit” Ah yes, let me just become a no-hit runner to get use out a single talisman instead of just pressing the roll button like a rational human being.
Thanks for revealing the extra i-frame certain weapons can get from these talismans! By the way, I recently heard people claiming that ER's backstep naturally has 2-4 i-frames without the talismans. Since you can look in the data and confirm that isn't true, what might have caused this rumor? Also, what are your thoughts on the natural backstep lacking any i-frames and covering a shorter distance than a roll?
It was the case in DS1, not even 5 frames I believe. DS2's were a bit longer, but I don't thing they kept it in subsequent games until SoTE's talismans. Honestly, they should have kept it from the beginning, it flow so well with the combat and generally faster enemies in elden ring. Besides certain weapons, it used to be generally useless without or with the bare minimum amount if s in these games
@@rickhapstley3866 I recall the backstep having zero i-frames, but infinite hyper armor, which could actually be a liability against multi-hit attacks.
backsteps are really good with spears, poleblades and lances because their backstep attack moves you forward with a thrust that is just as if not faster than the R1.
Looking through the spreadsheet, I found something a bit interesting: Shields do not provide the bonus i-frame unless two-handed, but certain weapon types frequently paired with Shields (greatswords, large thrusting swords, greatspears) *do* provide the bonus frame while one-handed. Which leads to the question, what does the game check for? If I were wielding a bastard sword and heater shield, for example, would the game observe that a higher value weapon is equipped in my main hand? Or would it default to the lower valued weapon, in this case the shield, in my off-hand? Moreover, would I even notice the difference? Fascinating video! I really want to try this out!
It prioritises whatever's equipped in the right hand, aka yes, the primary hand. So if you had a greatsword that gets the 12 i-frames equipped in your right hand, but a shield with 11 i-frames in the left hand, you would get the 12 i-frames. As far as noticing goes.. probably not It's fascinating, but at the end of the day two effective frames (at 60fps) is not really something you'd be capable of registering unless you were attempting a frame perfect dodge or similar.
This is just speculation, but could the extra based on wepmotionpositionID be because values other than zero extend forward slightly? Like, when you one-hand a light weapon, you just hold it at your side, but when you two-hand it, you kind of hold it out in front of you. Similarly, with heavy weapons, you hold it over your shoulder and your elbow sticks forward a bit. Maybe the extra is to compensate for the hitbox change, since maybe there’s an attack that you could backstep away from with a light weapon at your side, but just barely grazes your elbow when you’re using a heavy weapon? In my mind, that’s the only conceivable way this could be intentional.
Why does fromsoft always add these weird penalties to equipment, like this talisman makes ya take way more damage. It makes it less likely to wanna experiment with something if you’re not very confident. This shit already takes a talisman slot that you could use for say dragoncrest great shield which gives more physical Damage protection and I already feel like we could use more talisman slots so having something take a slot and still have a penalty feels like double jeopardy. I think they should’ve had talismans work like spell slots where you can have a really good one take 2 slots and then we have like 6 - 8 slots instead of just 4
Problem is this tali effect isn't even that good, you can just use quickstep which is even better in all things related to recovery and costs not that much fp. They should left it without any drawbacks and it still would be mediocre in terms of usability, but at least not punishing to trying for fun
eh? it only costs 1 talisman. there's just 2 options to pick between for that talisman. the more dangerous con to the situation, is that crucible talismans lower your defenses slightly.
I am beyond disappointed that that the talisman that gives it i frames didnt just change your rolle to a backstep no matter direcuon. Operating as a quicker but shorter range dodge option that consumes less stamina. Its also more stylish imo.
Hey, I just wanted to drop in and say you can jump over Messmer's grab (he has to be in the crouching part of the grab) and that when he turns into a snake you can jump into it to avoid the first attack and stay at its neck to avoid the 2nd attack and then jump to the side to avoid the 3 while for the slam version you do the same as the 1st, sprint away and then immediately into the snake when he starts charging at you and then jump a bit early to avoid the slam. I can post a video to show what I mean.
Does the Crucible Feather Talisman add 3 extra i-frames - and also possibly take away 3 recovery frames - to talisman-enhanced backsteps as well, or is it only regular rolls?
So basically I need to use half of my talisman slots to get fewer s than a roll with the slight benefits of having a marginally faster recovery time and 4 points less stamina consumption…. But I also take over 66% more damage for stacking the two talismans together. Backsteps are only better if I’m trying to look cool or show off in pvp.
If I have a great spear in one hand with 12 i-frame value and a greatshield in the other hand with 11 i-frame value, I'm assuming I would get the lower amount?
@@ooloh Got it thanks! Then Great Spear and Greatshield build gets even better lol. Especially since you can backstep with the shield up so you can guard and get i-frames. And still poke behind the shield. Might need to try this out
Please talk in videos, it would be a great addition to videos like these, I find it good cause I play videos in the background to listen to and I can't. Maybe even use AI or someone if you aren't comfortable?
While this is possible in remant 2 day 1. Also remant 2 includes weapons with back step special heavies. Not saying remant 2 is better than elden ring but it is dark souls with gun where somehow u can kind still play dark souls.
It's better to backstap for skilled player. Much easier to perform a counter attack. Very good to dodge some quick comobs like Rallana, Midra and Radhn who are well-known for their tricky combo (slow slow quick-quick slow) BUT it takes one talisman slot out of four. The practise is harder because BS is a step backward which leads the player stay in the hitzone more than rolling. As a result, more sharp timing needed. Trust me, it's hard 😢
Okay im a total noob and don't play pvp but I thought backsteping is like a known and used thing. What's next you gonna tell me nobody jumps above big swipes and AoE on the ground?
Long stoy short. Fromsoft once again left out a very important and neccisary function from the base game and decided the players need to be punished for the developers mistake. Usual fromsoft.
Note: I've seen a few comments about this taking up two talismans slots - just to clarify, you only need to use 1 of the 2 talismans to achieve these i-frames, and it's quite useless to equip both, as they won't stack their i-frames. So
For those wondering, these factors do apply to PvP as well; backstep i-frames will be affected by the equipped weapon, and will also lose an additional 4 i-frames as a result of a PvP-exclusive nerf to the talismans following their release.
This video was pretty interesting to make, as I initially set out to simply compile the frame data into one video, and then sort of stumbled upon wepmotionpositionIDs' involvement and it quickly rabbit holed from there. You'd probably expect lighter weapons to have more i-frames, if anything, so it may be possible that this is just another mistake - but as always we'll never have confirmation of this, and are just speculating off it's randomness.
Thank you! That’s really cool data. Love the video! But also, what the fuck is Fromsoft doing? Having the count change because of weapon choice without any visual indication of it happening is adaptability level of game design. Absolute spaghetti code.
Can you use this technique on Malenia?
Does it matter if you "hold a weapon over the shoulder" or is that just people conflating fatstep animation cancel with two-handed s?
@@Xandros999 I'm not familiar with animation cancelling, but there has been a general spread of misinfo that 12 i-frame backsteps are performed by holding a weapon over your shoulder. While it's technically true, it's not the actual cause, and I would think of it like this; all weapons that are held over the shoulder will have 12 i-frames, but you can also perform 12 i-frame backsteps using weapons NOT held over the shoulder. This is because all weapons held over the shoulder - greatswords, colossal weapons, great axes, etc - all have a OneHandID and BothHandID of above 0, so they get 12 i-frames instead of 11 - but at the same time, weapons held over the shoulder are not the only weapons to have a wepmotionpositionID of above 0, so other weapons can do the same. As a result it becomes easy to conflate the two, although there is more nuance to it
Those I-frames wouldn't work for the Feints, right? Like when you do a charged attack with a curved sword but interrupt it by pressing the dodge.
in short both are useless, use lightning ram to dodge
Too op
I disagree. Best dodge is the butt slam.
Without a doubt, yes.
Nah, Blinkbolt is better, or wait no, why not dodge at all and instead use Vow of the Indomitable?
Nah, just become the *brick*
You can also keep your guard up while back stepping which means you don't get punished if you miss your timing unlike rolling.
Fromsoft: *Cool New Feature*
Me: "OOoooooh!"
Fromsoft: "But increases damage taken"
Me: *throws it in the trash where it belongs*
Pros: It's fine if you don't get hit
Me: oKaY
If it was something less significant like the Scorpion Charm penalty I would consider it but it's 35% more damage taken across the board so unless I ever start doing no-hit runs then it's useless to me.
Edit: It's actually -15% damage negation so a bit more reasonable but I still wouldn't use it with how much damage bosses do since it only opens up some optimization that isn't necessary at all.
@@lmtalpha6382 The fine crucible feather talisman is only 15% extra damage taken
@@Kurai_69420 I got it confused with the Beloved Stardust talisman because I thought one was -15% and the other was -35% and it turns out I was also wrong on that and Beloved Stardust is -30%.
@ Believe it or not, the talisman of all crucibles is even worse than that at -45%
I’m so happy because this Backstep was something I applied on Bloodborne but in a way it was a bit harder to do, you had to press the dodge button and at the same time push the stick back and up and it worked and you could attack but the dodges didn’t work like here it was just a style because you took damage but.. Elden Ring really considered it as a dodge now and it’s easier to do it’s crazy thanks ooloh for this video ♡
I am not fully sure what you mean by that, since the raw backstep mechanic including reverse backsteps are basically the exact same in bloodborne. The timing for reverse backsteps is also way tighter in Eldenring, while they are hilariously easy to perform in Bloodborne. The only way to have actually useful backsteps with s is in Eldenring with these dlc talismans, which I mean I guess it’s fun for NG+ playthroughs? Wish Fromsoft would actually try to give us consistently interesting combat mechanics from the get go instead of patching that stuff in via paid DLC content.
3:25 on this episode of "attacks in Elden Ring that don't look jumpable but totally are"
spear wielding Soldier of Godrick taught me this early, bless him (a lot of thrust attacks can be easily jumped)
It's especially counterintuitive coming from Sekiro, where thrust attacks specifically track you in the air.
It looks totally jumpable if I'm being honest
@ Honestly, I would much more prefer thrust attacks having a better vertical tracking. Ofc I say that as someone using the thrust attacks haha
@@KodFrostwraththat soldier is helpful, he assisted in my parrying lesson
For the me the number one reason that you mentioned is that it adds coherency to the fight. You are so much more aware of where your character is and what it is doing. Of course, for super experienced players this may not be a factor, but for someone not as good like me that still wants to play the game properly without cheesing it, it is fantastic.
Also, some weapons have great follow-up attacks to the backstep, and it can be combined nicely with sorceries and incantations.
i did NOT know that backsteps could possibly have 12 s, cool stuff.
Gotta say, bro. I started implementing backsteps into my fights because of you lol.
Awesome video, this version of song of storms is such a banger. I listen to it all the time.
I've been using this talisman a ton since the dlc dropped for all the reasons you mentioned, plus two more:
1. It's really fun to learn and get used to a different type of dodging motion after 4 games of dodge roll
2. It looks stylish af 👌
4 games? No bloodborne? It had quick step as the main dodge and rolling was secondary
@TheExeption by 4 games I meant dark souls 1-3 and ER. Bloodborne dodge was different, yes, but backstep dodging feels almost entirely new compared to the classic forward dodge. It's something that can definitely be built upon further (by giving I-frames to feint attacks, for example). It makes fights feel a lot more "duel" like, which is very fun
DS2 also had I-frame backsteps.
@@maxburrill6192ADP-scaling backsteps 🤢
@ It was actually really cool. Was good to have a different button to press for once to avoid damage and that would have a unique follow-up attack.
Frankly, they should never have got rid of backstep I-frames. Maybe it doesn't make actual sense, but then neither does dodge rolling.
this video is so well done and high quality . you definetely deserve more subscribers
3:25 This is the best reason tbh. Loving these videos, learning a lot from these
I'm glad that backsteps are finally getting some love. I've been using them in PVP for years and have always preached that they are severely slept on.
Even when they didn't have I-frames, unique backstep attacks catch people off guard, in DS3 a lot of the spears have backstep attacks that are entirely unique, which are much faster counter attacks than you'd get out of a roll, which is fantastic when you use the leo ring, i belive the pike and saints bident have a three hit charge attack that combos cleanly into the full charge weapon art which can be extended with an R2. People don't see it often so they aren't expecting counter attacks that fast. I've one shot overlevelled phantoms with that true combo.
Sure, you didn't have I-frames but proper spacing makes that a non-issue.
Nooo this video is really excellent I like every little detail in terms of staging on your little fights it's example by always being precise and clean and the music very good choice 0:05 / 1:08 / 2:06 / 3:24 / Thanks thanks ❤
1:38 PARDON?
Right is this a mod? It’s gotta be
This video was super helpful! Thank you.
Usually i just tank and simply hit the enemy harder, but this seems cool too.
Believe in hyperarmour superiority
1:09 I always found the backsteep followed by a backshot extremely satisfying
So amazing, I had to replay it
2:10 I saw the vision that kill would have been clean asf
and worth mentioning that usefulness aside it is a fun new way to experience the game
that backstep style of fighting is so stylish oh boy
every gamer on this level is a scientist the world lost out on. but we have enough scientists...
Interesting. Once I will have enough time to go back to the game and finally slay PC Radahn, I shall try that for the Alucard build that I have in mind.
Another reason why Dark Souls II is Best Souls: it's the only game in the trilogy where the backstep has s by default.
Dark Souls 1 backsteps had s, though, right at the start, as well as infinite poise for when you did get hit .
I absolutely abused the backsteps in that game, felt amazing
backstepping an attack and following it up with a parry felt AMAZING
@@VitharrOdinson I can find precisely zero information that supports that DS1 backsteps had I-frames. The only "evidence" I can find is people having displaced far enough that they don't NEED I-frames to avoid the attack.
@@destruction6124 It seems my previous reply may have been deleted for having a link to another video, but Domo3000 has a video titled, "We have all been wrong about i-frames," that goes over data across all 3 Dark Souls games. At the 30 second mark, it shows the animation data for backsteps, proving that all backsteps in Dark Souls 1 had 4 s right at the start of the animation. It was one of the first resources to show up in a search result.
Bro has the Nightreign build from the future 💀
Fantastic video. Really well made
Commenting for the algorithm. Great vid.
What makes backsteps viable (as if) are the unique followups, like certain swordspears can only thrust with backstep attacks.
Ah, I remember how backstep were the solution for the extremely questionable frametrap on Pre-nerf Crosslash, but I never knew they were *that* useful... Thanks for showing!
Btw 2:15 NGL would had been quite cool fighting those fellows in plain Limgrave.(you fight one of them on an evergaol and Stormveil if im not wrong)
Second part is correct
This music is so nostalgic bro.
I learned backstep just because the prenerf consort radahn X slashes XDD
that windmill remix though is fire
I love it because I feel it's much faster as an offensive option when combined with the backstep attacks. rolling attacks are definitely slower on many weapons especially taking rolling animation itself into account. Also they feel less cheesy for some reason even when spammed and last but not least, you look cool. All these are enough to bear the 15% damage penalty but honestly there shouldn't have been any penalty for a talisman slot's opportunity cost.
Or in other words. Fromsoftware design bosses to roll catch players but not backstep catch them.
Great info! Well done.
“It’s fine if you don’t get hit”
Ah yes, let me just become a no-hit runner to get use out a single talisman instead of just pressing the roll button like a rational human being.
Me who legit thought there was no invincible frame on the backstep
Thanks for the info :D
Thanks for revealing the extra i-frame certain weapons can get from these talismans! By the way, I recently heard people claiming that ER's backstep naturally has 2-4 i-frames without the talismans. Since you can look in the data and confirm that isn't true, what might have caused this rumor? Also, what are your thoughts on the natural backstep lacking any i-frames and covering a shorter distance than a roll?
probably them hailing ER as DkS2, 2; Which had power-stancing and backstep s
No
I have seen 3 people made video on how to dodge and i-frames work.
Trust me, BS don't have i-frames without talisman
i'm pretty sure dark souls 1 had a singular frame of invincibility when backstepping
It was the case in DS1, not even 5 frames I believe. DS2's were a bit longer, but I don't thing they kept it in subsequent games until SoTE's talismans. Honestly, they should have kept it from the beginning, it flow so well with the combat and generally faster enemies in elden ring. Besides certain weapons, it used to be generally useless without or with the bare minimum amount if s in these games
@@rickhapstley3866 I recall the backstep having zero i-frames, but infinite hyper armor, which could actually be a liability against multi-hit attacks.
I generally don't use backstep because you have to be completely still, especially with an older controller that has stick drift
backsteps are really good with spears, poleblades and lances because their backstep attack moves you forward with a thrust that is just as if not faster than the R1.
I totally thought people were only using backsteps because it looks cooler lol. Interesting to learn that there are actual benefits!
Looking through the spreadsheet, I found something a bit interesting: Shields do not provide the bonus i-frame unless two-handed, but certain weapon types frequently paired with Shields (greatswords, large thrusting swords, greatspears) *do* provide the bonus frame while one-handed.
Which leads to the question, what does the game check for? If I were wielding a bastard sword and heater shield, for example, would the game observe that a higher value weapon is equipped in my main hand? Or would it default to the lower valued weapon, in this case the shield, in my off-hand?
Moreover, would I even notice the difference?
Fascinating video! I really want to try this out!
It prioritises whatever's equipped in the right hand, aka yes, the primary hand. So if you had a greatsword that gets the 12 i-frames equipped in your right hand, but a shield with 11 i-frames in the left hand, you would get the 12 i-frames.
As far as noticing goes.. probably not It's fascinating, but at the end of the day two effective frames (at 60fps) is not really something you'd be capable of registering unless you were attempting a frame perfect dodge or similar.
This is just speculation, but could the extra based on wepmotionpositionID be because values other than zero extend forward slightly?
Like, when you one-hand a light weapon, you just hold it at your side, but when you two-hand it, you kind of hold it out in front of you. Similarly, with heavy weapons, you hold it over your shoulder and your elbow sticks forward a bit.
Maybe the extra is to compensate for the hitbox change, since maybe there’s an attack that you could backstep away from with a light weapon at your side, but just barely grazes your elbow when you’re using a heavy weapon?
In my mind, that’s the only conceivable way this could be intentional.
3:29 That was filthy!
Poder hacer eso a rennala solo con backsteps se ve tan clean! 🔥🔥
List of good reasons to use backsteps
1. Raviolis
2. Raviolis
3. Unlimited raviolis
banger after banger 🔥
In PvP that talisman is considered so op that the biggest tryhards refuse to use it.
they refuse to play it because they dont know how it work and harder to play that her META BUILD with UGS lol
...Lance, fist, rapier and cracked ashe of war re lol
Why does fromsoft always add these weird penalties to equipment, like this talisman makes ya take way more damage. It makes it less likely to wanna experiment with something if you’re not very confident. This shit already takes a talisman slot that you could use for say dragoncrest great shield which gives more physical Damage protection and I already feel like we could use more talisman slots so having something take a slot and still have a penalty feels like double jeopardy.
I think they should’ve had talismans work like spell slots where you can have a really good one take 2 slots and then we have like 6 - 8 slots instead of just 4
Problem is this tali effect isn't even that good, you can just use quickstep which is even better in all things related to recovery and costs not that much fp. They should left it without any drawbacks and it still would be mediocre in terms of usability, but at least not punishing to trying for fun
@@williammclyr3330exactly 👌🏽
Im sure you know rhis already but you can pair leda armor and one of the tree talismans. I think its the retaliation and not the lacerating one
Amazing video
Pro: similar dodge frames with less endlag.
Con: takes 2 talismans
eh? it only costs 1 talisman.
there's just 2 options to pick between for that talisman.
the more dangerous con to the situation, is that crucible talismans lower your defenses slightly.
Just subbed!
Also what is he gear you're using in the video? It looks sick :)
Fia's Robe with the Circlet of Light, and Leda's Sword
Crucible tali my beloved 💜
Very stylish
I am beyond disappointed that that the talisman that gives it i frames didnt just change your rolle to a backstep no matter direcuon. Operating as a quicker but shorter range dodge option that consumes less stamina. Its also more stylish imo.
Hey, I just wanted to drop in and say you can jump over Messmer's grab (he has to be in the crouching part of the grab) and that when he turns into a snake you can jump into it to avoid the first attack and stay at its neck to avoid the 2nd attack and then jump to the side to avoid the 3 while for the slam version you do the same as the 1st, sprint away and then immediately into the snake when he starts charging at you and then jump a bit early to avoid the slam. I can post a video to show what I mean.
Please post it! And leave a reply here once you have
@@jimmyjohnjoejr I posted a video on my channel.
@@jimmyjohnjoejr Reply. I can't type anything else because YT will auto-delete it, amazing system they put in place.
Are you saying bloodborne > Dark souls? lol
I will try to learn how to consistently backstep
Oh c'mon... You're going to make me unlearn and relearn everything I know about avoiding damage just to make my fights look that damn clean...
The real winner of the video is that awesome chill remix for Song of Storms. Any chance i can get a download link lol ?
if you search on soundcloud the music from the description it should come up :)
Most important reason to use backsteps instead of rolling; it feels like Bloodborne.
Does the Crucible Feather Talisman add 3 extra i-frames - and also possibly take away 3 recovery frames - to talisman-enhanced backsteps as well, or is it only regular rolls?
3:15
whilst
because hes john bloodborne, next
great pfp man
Great. Tks
Same thing with pvp? Despite the very latent duels
So basically I need to use half of my talisman slots to get fewer s than a roll with the slight benefits of having a marginally faster recovery time and 4 points less stamina consumption….
But I also take over 66% more damage for stacking the two talismans together.
Backsteps are only better if I’m trying to look cool or show off in pvp.
If you're doing the dlc with scadu frags the talismans become way more viable.
Also, you don't need to stack them to get s
@ the point is that even with both talismans, you still get fewer s than a roll has by default.
@@benthede2531Stacking both talismans does literally nothing. Use 1 of them not both
How much i-frames does a backstep has without any talisman?
If I have a great spear in one hand with 12 i-frame value and a greatshield in the other hand with 11 i-frame value, I'm assuming I would get the lower amount?
You would get whatever’s in your right hand
@@ooloh Got it thanks! Then Great Spear and Greatshield build gets even better lol. Especially since you can backstep with the shield up so you can guard and get i-frames. And still poke behind the shield. Might need to try this out
It's a great talisman, but has a very high skill ceiling.
I didnt know backstepping had I frames...
i can never backstep because i just move the joystick backwards
I tried backstopping and got hit everytime
Oh wait, is Recycle well known in the community?
DID YOU JUST REVERSE BACKSTEP😯 1:09
i like backstep very much, one step closer to castlevania build 😂
Why don’t they let backsteps have very little s
I really hope they will put backstep with 11-13 as a default option for the future games!
Great informative video as always 💪
BUT you have to get to the DLC to get the talisman first, so backsteps are kinda useless in NG+0
gottent it nerfed?
Please talk in videos, it would be a great addition to videos like these, I find it good cause I play videos in the background to listen to and I can't. Maybe even use AI or someone if you aren't comfortable?
While this is possible in remant 2 day 1. Also remant 2 includes weapons with back step special heavies. Not saying remant 2 is better than elden ring but it is dark souls with gun where somehow u can kind still play dark souls.
Interesting
It's better to backstap for skilled player.
Much easier to perform a counter attack.
Very good to dodge some quick comobs like Rallana, Midra and Radhn who are well-known for their tricky combo
(slow slow quick-quick slow)
BUT it takes one talisman slot out of four.
The practise is harder because BS is a step backward which leads the player stay in the hitzone more than rolling.
As a result, more sharp timing needed.
Trust me, it's hard 😢
I thought they nerfed these to have 7 s (or 8 with some weapons)
Only in pvp
@ooloh ohhh ok thank you
Okay im a total noob and don't play pvp but I thought backsteping is like a known and used thing.
What's next you gonna tell me nobody jumps above big swipes and AoE on the ground?
w0w
ledo swap ptsd
fun feature that looks cool. hm yeah what if we lock it behind a talisman in the Dlc
Long stoy short. Fromsoft once again left out a very important and neccisary function from the base game and decided the players need to be punished for the developers mistake.
Usual fromsoft.
It just looks weird imo
Why lock every interesting thing behind “makes you take more damage” like why does this game insist on being lame and making your character a loser