A Mercenary Guide to BATTLETECH - Shadow Hawk
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ก.ค. 2024
- Learn the tactics and lore for the BattleTech Shadow Hawk!
TIME STAMPS
0:00 Introduction
0:28 Quick Stats
0:41 Summary
0:56 Availability
1:10 Logistics
1:26 Offense Analysis
1:47 Defense Analysis
2:06 Mobility Analysis
2:21 Lance Compositions
3:01 Variants
3:30 Mercenary Tier Rating
3:31 Pilot Guide: Mindset
4:12 Pilot Guide: Deployment
4:31 Pilot Guide: Objective Taker
4:50 Pilot Guide: Disruptor
5:05 Pilot Guide: Long Range (10-21 hexes)
5:14 Pilot Guide: Skirmish Range (1-9 hexes)
5:35 Pilot Guide: Scenarios
6:59 Proposed Customization
This video covers everything a MechWarrior mercenary would need to know about the Shadow Hawk. The video starts by going over the Battletech lore of the Shadow Hawk before doing an objective analysis on the mech’s strengths and weaknesses. The analysis also covers variants of the Shadow Hawk and how to use it in a campaign. The video then moves onto a tactics section which demonstrates how to use the mech in combat, giving helpful tips to keep in mind while playing the tabletop game. Lastly a custom build for the Shadow Hawk is proposed specifically designed for BattleTech mercenaries. The speaker in the video is roleplaying as someone from the Battletech Succession Wars period of the lore to give a viewer an immersive experience.
While the video educates the viewer on the tabletop gameplay in Classic BattleTech, it’s also useful for players who play BattleTech Alpha Strike game, Battletech 2018, MechWarrior Online, or Mechwarrior 5 video games because the skills and concepts are closely related. It’s relevant to both new and experienced Battletech players, providing information and insights that can be useful to everyone in the hobby.
#battletech #mechwarrior #nerdyoveranalyzed
The style of this video is similar to videos from Big Red-40TECH and the Tex Talks Battletech series by The Black Pants Legion. Content creators like Auspex Tactics and Baradul have had a large influence on this video. - บันเทิง
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Hey there Commander our mercenary company is awaiting orders on the Community tab! Vote to decide what happens next in our upcoming BattleTech campaign! 🙂
Not sure if you are but you should upload all your "slime" variants to mordel DOT n3t :)
The Shawk has two easy field modifications. First, replace the LRM5 and the SRM2 with a pair of SRM4s. Second, replace the SRM2 with an LRM5. In both cases it has an extraneous heat sink that you can pull out for armor. I kind of like the idea of a cavalry lance that has a pair of each.
Alternatively, pull that heat sink for those 2 extra jump jets it so desperately wants
Personally, i think dropping 1 tonne of armour, the srm 2 and its ammo, to place a second lrm 5 and medium laser is where i'd go without any of the renaissance equipment.
I like to make a sports car model of dropping the AC5 and LRM and going all in on SRMs and armor. AC5 and its ammo take up a lot of tonnage. I can't speak for tabletop, but in the Battletech PC version I like sprinting in close, and then jump jetting behind enemies until they die from backstabs while I maintain as much evasion points per turn as I can.
@@Knightlyfrog I find SRMs more effective in the PC game, as each missle has its own chance to hit. In TT the LRM and SRM launcher either hit, (and then how many clusters or individual missles hit) or they miss.
@@theyellowjesters Interesting. So the tabletop has more of a risk to reward kind of dynamic?
I read the books, Play a lot of the games yet have no desire to play table top. And yet, I find your videos so well done and so oddly cathartic that I watch them over and over. Thank you for these, really appreciate your efforts!
I like this channel because it's relevant to both tabletop and digital version.
i love the shadow hawk. people say it's undergunned but it's a solid Mech that works best in support and reserve lances. it's the ultimate jack of all trades and can be slotted in just about any lance composition
The SHD has been my favorite IS medium mech ever since I was introduced to the battletech universe in the early 90s. I've never been a big fan of ammunition dependent units so what I have done in the past is stripped out all of the ammo based weapons for large and medium lasers along with extra heat sinks and/or armor. Although I do like the Talon refit.
Thanks! And yeah I'm in the same boat of preferring lasers.
So interesting to see what happens when you use the AC weight for other weapon options.
I have a different variant that I use to great success. The SHD-2J: The jump jets are increased to 5. The heat sinks to 13. The armor is increased to 11.5 tons. The weapons loadout is a PPC and 4 medium lasers. This gives it good heat management when alternating between PPC and lasers, depending on range. The lasers gives it a strong close range punch and a punishing sting at longer ranges. The lack of ammo and increased armor gives it great staying power. This makes the mech excellent in its original role as a skirmisher but adds to its roles the ability to be an excellent guerilla fighter as well.
Interesting variation, I'll have to try it!
PPC + M Lasers is one of the best weapon combo's available with 3025 tech. Where did you place the Lasers? For medium lasers it's almost better to not place them in the arms so you can close and double Punch in addition to their firepower.
Yeah, that actually plays to the mech's one strength which is heat management. It's already has too many heat sinks so leaning into that surplus can actually get you somewhere.
Have to say I love these videos they showed me how I should actually build a lance beyond tonnage limits and movement values. Before I'd just almost randomly choose mechs for a lance based off if I thought they're cool now theres actually a bit of method to my madness. I've also learned how I should behave within a lance when playing with my rpg group where as before I was just kind of aimlessly trying with no real idea what I'm doing
Hey, glad that you're getting value out of the content! Hope your RPG is going well x3
The shadow hawk is an underrated mech, great all rounder to support any lance, be it commanding a light lance, part of a medium lance, or as a scout for heavy and assault lances
Maybe~ the damage is so low though! D: It really makes me miss the Wolverine 6M. How do you compensate for the low damage on the Shadow Hawk?
@@nerdyOveranalyzed I generally see it as a harasser that I can move around reasonably well to distract from my other units, similarly to your point about distracting from objectives as well
There are a couple of large laser varieties that do better, it also does better if you use it as something of a skirmisher, then physical attacks. The SRM is also fairly nasty as an inferno launcher.
The shadow hawk is my favorite medium to take in a lance as it's flexible enough to harass, reinforce, and support as I need. If I were to choose a variant to take its usually a 5d and I'll have it paired with a few fast lights and a heavy or assault as a nice sturdy anchor to work around
I'm only in 3025 tech, but that Shadow Hawk 5D's RAC sounds cool!
@@nerdyOveranalyzed if you ever use it, I just hope you have better luck than me, I've jammed it on a two shot before trying to play it safe after jamming it earlier that game on a 6 shot
When I played back in the 80's we would simply replace the AC/5 and ammo with a PPC, 2 additional jump jets, and an additional heatsink. Then you have something that is basically a Griffin only with a few more options at close ranges. Another good option was to swap out the excess heatsinks with more medium LASERs (you can never have enough Medium LASERs). There was no BV back then so pretty much everything was based on tonnage alone. The only niche that an unmodified shadow hawk filled was serving on a hot world since it has far more heatsinks than is generally necessary.
I like your custom modifications of the mechs and I've even used a few of them in the PC game to great effect. Sadly from what I recall the "Talon" refit wouldn't quite work thanks to the arrangement of the hardpoints but...maybe I'm remembering wrong. It would be fun to play with if it does :)
Ye, the hardpoint issue makes it tough as it's present in some games but not in table top. Even worse it's not consistent across games. I do try to make them somewhat reasonable though!
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Yeah some games track hardpoints by Energy-missile-ballistic, some do it by size others by both.
Personal suggestion:
Drop heatsinks, jumpjets and the SRM 2.
Upgrade the Autocannon 5 to an AC 10, maybe ditch some other stuff to get an AC20 in there.
(Yes I do have autcannon fever).
lol, I did consider an AC/20 "all in" build. It's possible but ehhhhh, it's a bit too cheesy/overpowered for my taste. xD You can jump behind someone and core them with a back armor AC/20 shot for sure.
With introtech the AC/10 and AC/20 aren´t suitable for cavalry style Mechs. On the Shdow Hawk you could switch the AC/5 for a PPC to give it some decent punch.
If you are looking for a fast platform for an AC/20 I would pick the Dragon. Get rid of the AC/5 and LRM-10, put in the AC/20 and spend the remaining tonnage on ammo and as much armor as possible.
That's a very nice set of refits. I'm usually stripping heatsinks from the K model to add a second LRM5 and and some medium lasers in the arms. I'd love to try your design out with flamers (or a flamer and a medium laser) in place of the MGs for crowd control. A thorough and honest look at a mech loaded with potential.
The SHD-2H Shadow Hawk, imho, is the perfect training mech for a new mechwarrior. You get a little bit of everything to play with firepower-wise, you'll never overheat, you get to learn about range brackets, and you get to practice jumping. It wouldn't be my first choice of a medium mech to take into battle myself, but I wouldn't complain if I had no better choices.
Agreed! It's not too bad!
Unfortunately nobody in the Inner Sphere wants to spend 55 tons of Mech just for training purposes.
@@hermes7587 Depends on the mech and the era. During the Succession Wars I would agree. If it's post-Helm Memory Core and you're in a Great House military that can afford to shuffle older stuff to second line units while more advanced stuff gets sent to the front, it's an option.
Eh, I'd say that it never overheats is arguably a *BAD* thing in a trainer Mech. Learning heat mamagement is a fundamental skill that new pilots very much need to learn. The whole a reason the Chameleon, THE archetypical trainer Mech of the setting, is actually quite overgunned/undersinked is to teach the newbies to respect the heat gauge.
@@magni5648 You can shut down individual heat sinks for training if that's what you need, while at the same time giving the newbies a mech that's going to get them through their first few battles alive without much difficulty.
Another great video, I got to run my second game of battletech this weekend doing an inner sphere versus clan scenario where I got to use a shadow Hawk. I have to wholeheartedly agree with your assessment, in terms of damage output the stock Shadow Hawk drastically underperformed for its cost, easily getting outperformed by even the BJ-1 and Commando in my lance. Its truly unfortunate as the Shadow Hawk is among my favorite medium mechs aesthetically. I might see if I can give the refit you've suggested here a try next week to see if I can't get a better performance out of my Hawk. Thanks again for another amazing video, and I can't wait for the next
I like the 5S variant. It forgoes the ammunition-dependent weapons for a large laser, two medium lasers, a medium pulse laser, and a TAG. It also utilizes a Beagle Active Probe and a Guardian ECM suite to perform a heavy scouting role. My favorite part though, is the half ton of cargo space in the head designated for supplies during long-term scouting missions.
I just imagine the MechWarrior taking up part of that half ton cargo space with a holovid setup lol
Thank you for another great mech-dive Nerdy! I can't wait to see what 'Mech gets put under the microscope next.
Hey thanks! I'm glad you're enjoying. More coming up soon!
You forgot the three tons of plot armor the Shawk gets
lel
*300
Amazing upload! Keep up the great work!
Thanks! More coming soon!
Once again and very good breakdown of an okay if not generic mech and an impressive refit plan. Some of the crew were thinking of using flamers instead of the machine guns though…….we kinda sorta hate infantry out here. Tangent aside, I do like the replacement of the AC-5 with a large laser for range increase though I’m shocked you didn’t go for a PPC for max range but hey I’m not an engineer. I just make shit go boom so I’ll trust your judgement. All in all it sounds like a great design for raids and I’ll take four from our reserves and have them refitted. They were free anyway so we’re still above red and we can cover the expense with next months contracts. Lord Calderon needs some Feddy Scum crushed and this machine will be a perfect mech for the raids into the border regions. Well done.
It's kinda wild to see how the Shadow Hawk's prefered tactics are... well they're literally the tactics used in the Dougram anime it comes from.
Heh heh heh, I don't claim it's the very best way, but it's the best way I've found so far!
Falling behind on working on a slime lance formation for classic.
Like the refits. Depending on what other mechs you have in lance I might swap the machine guns for med lasers.
Normally I don’t like having that much ammo in a mech but the dual srms are worth the risk.
For a simple variant, taking inspiration from the Wolverine 6R. I would swap the LRM 5 and SRM 2 with 2 SRM 4 and 1 ton of ammo. This retains the range and low heat of the AC5 (even if not the most efficient weapon) but adds a lot more short range punch. (This also works in games with fixed hardpoints, if you care about that sort of thing)
Another would be to take inspiration from the Enforcer with 2 options.
A - Drop the LRM, SRM, Medium Laser and the JJs and add a PPC and 0.5t of armour. So a PPC and an AC5 with 12 HS and 10t armour for some mobile, durable, long range sniping.
B - Drop all weapons, the JJs, 1HS, and 0.5t of armour and then add and AC10 with 1 ton of ammo and a Large Laser with 11 HS and 9t of armour. This is basically an Enforcer with 5/8/0 instead of 4/6/4
Interesting ones :) A couple of variants I used to use were drop everything and fit an AC20 for a 5/8 Hunchback or replace all the weapons with 2 Large Lasers and up the JJ's to 5 for a very mobile Long Range 'cavalry' Mech.
You were a lot nicer about Auld Reliable than other reviews. I've had a liking for the Shadow Hawk from my 3025 RPG & TT days. From the post-Invasion periods I understand why it gets down voted a lot. But in the 3025 era where alpha strikes were very risky, the weapons limitation wasn't a factor. In fact, the tough, low heat 2H was a good midrange contender. It made for a good starter command mech, a good big brother mech for bugs and other short range lights, and a good support unit for mixed lances. It became famous for the first two roles in the Gray Death Legion, and served well in the third role in the Fox's Teeth and my own merc unit.
That being said, I really liked your Talon variant, which is well balanced, fast, and a real bruiser. It looks like it could complement a Phoenix Hawk or a brawler type Griffon, or a Wolverine. I'll put it on my list of variants to use in the future.
Glad you enjoyed the variant! I think it will serve you well.
My favorite variation is a custom rebuild of the Shadow Hawk SHD-GD “Grey Death” in MW5 that I call “Asphodel.” Others have referred to this loadout as “Shadow God” due to how effective it is in the hands of your AI lancemates.
Its loadout consists of 4 C-ER Medium Lasers, 1 C-UAC/10, 2 C-MRM 10s, a supercharger, and 5 jump jets.
That’s just the basics. As time progresses and you gain access to more efficient weight-saving technology (composite structure, patchwork, etc) you can upgrade it even further with ECM and modular armor.
Thanks for bringing back the outro.
:)
Shadowhawk has to my favorite of the holy trinity. It's basically the multi-tool in my glove conpartment. It's not the best mech around but it works on everymap and in every mission.
Interesting! You don't feel like it does too little damage?
@@nerdyOveranalyzed it's on the lower end but makes up for having 2weapons that can fire at long range and short range. So the dmg is low but the dps is high and chances to hit.
Nice medium mech guide!
Thank you military analyst slime, I will convey these notes to the officers.
You're welcome Commander! o7
I'm using a similar build in my latest megamek game. Instead of a large laser, i have an lrm 5 and a couple extra medium lasers. Those mgs are great for extra damage at punchin' range!
I created a version of the Shadow Hawk that I called the Dark Hawk.
I stripped all of the ammo based weapons and replaced them with a large laser in each torso and added a medium laser to the left arm for a total of 3 mediums. The leftover tonnage is dedicated to armor and heat sinks.
I really love the Shadow Hawk as a part of the universe.
Looking at it as a I need to assign like one mech that can kinda cover all the bases as a command mech over a bunch of lights off on periphery world that might see a few frankenmech pirates or like dudes in technicals it fits in so well as a government pick.
lol, I suppose you're right!
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Kind of up there with the Assassin. It isn’t min maxed or even all that good but it is totally something that could get made in a shitty government contract when the paper pushers thought they knew what was needed on the battlefield.
I think the biggest advantage the shadow hawk has is in the refit potential, as a jack of all trades mech it is easy to refit into more specific roles as needed without needing a new mech.
Had the techies over for a round of cards and somewhere between hands they came up with a refit they nicknamed the -2P. Take a -2H, remove the AC5 and put a PPC in its place, swap out the SRM2 and LRM5 for a pair of SRM4s and one ton of ammo like you have in your S-X1, cram another jump jet into each side torso. Last ton goes to more armor; 6 on each leg and 2 on the side torsos.
They ran the numbers, and, it'll run hot if you're jumping around constantly. But, if you stay on the ground and remember to not shoot the ppc at the same time as the close-in stuff, you'll be fine. They're already working on ordering the stuff needed to make the refits.
I just started using it on mechwarrior 5. I changed out a few weapons and it seems to work well.
Ye, it needs a re-fit for sure!
Came back to this one via a comment. After doing a little experiment I found you can make a Super Panther out of the -2K. Exchange the LRM-5 for a SRM-4. You get an up-armored Panther that is faster, has more armor, and can run + jump + fire PPC while remaining heat neutral.
Heh nice! I didn't even think of that. It does seem like a good alternative
I usually just take out the SRM 2 and try to fit in an additional LRM5 and maybe ammo and call it a day. I also like the later era 5M because it seems to have the same idea of making it more of a fire support mech by narrowing its design on an ultra ac 5 and LRM rack over having its weapons so unfocused.
I generally use those 2 tons for a second Medium Laser and getting the jumpjets up to full 5/8/5. Suddenly it's a pretty nasty, tough and maneuverable skirmisher/brawler hybrid. Or go full brawler by replacing the LRM 5 with an SRM 4.
I like replacing the autocannon with a large laser and adding more jump jets and heat sinks. The SRM2 can be useful for delivering inferno missiles.
Agreed with the Large Laser. Not too sure about the SRM-2 on the infernos though, that's only a tiny amount of heat damage for an ammo explosion risk. We could upgrade the rack size and lay on the flames :3
@@nerdyOveranalyzed That's a good idea. I like infernos for lighting forest fires as well as cooking 'mechs, though.
@@nerdyOveranalyzed I just reworked it and you're right. The Shadow Hawk works perfectly with a Large Laser, LRM5, Medium Laser and SRM4. It still has enough weight left over to increase the heat sinks up to fourteen and the jump jets to five. Alternatively, only increasing the heat sinks to twelve would mean we can increase the armor by two tons. Do you think the SRM ammo should go in the center torso or in the right torso padded by heat sinks?
@@NonApplicable1983 Oh! If you go to the end of the video "Proposed Customization" there should be the recommended build there!
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Thank you!
Another modification I've been considering is just dropping the LRM5 and SRM2 for a single SRM6 turning it into a WVR-6R with a different layout.
I have a bit of a soft spot for the Shadow Hawk for seeing me through some shaky operations, I guess I gotta admit she aint the best mech around haha. Still! Given how tedious she is built, it was really worthwhile for you to invest further into how it should engage in various ranges. It was a good call to spend more time explaining it for anyone who will tale the risk and it definitely helped expand my knowledge! Well done advisor
Thank you Commander! Glad you enjoyed!
This is my favorite mech . This guy with 2 centurions and a wolf hound . My go to merc lance .
I like putting a Heavy Rifle, 1 clan srm-6, 1 clan srm-4, and one clan lrm-15 with 2 ER medium lasers.
Heavy rifles might have a slow reload time but they're light and does 9 damage so using it for hit and run is actually pretty nice.
I'm a fan of a crit seeking peregrine build that runs a pair of srm 6 and an srm 4 while leaving the arms empty and maxing jump. All the spread damage with punches backing it up will find holes quickly or sand armor into holes itself
I too enjoy the punch > SRM combo!
Unless I did something wrong in MML, you should have another ton free for the refit - which I personally sunk into armour. My usual refit is to weld half a -2K and half a -2D together (or rather, to rip a -2D's LRMs and AC for a PPC and plow the weight savings into armour and movement), and get a mech with 11.5 tons of armour, 5/8/5 movement, a PPC in the LT, two MLs one in each arm, and either an SRM4 in the RT or the two SRM2s in the -2D's locations (to save on refit time) fed by a ton of ammo. It's got a Long Range Hole-Poking Device that it can fire on the run and stay cool, and then a fair amount of close-in firepower that it can jump and fire for quite a while. If anything it may be a little oversinked...
And again I have to agree to you. The Shadow Hawk is not a good Mech, and i am always surprised by the love he gets. But I can imagine a in universe role that would fits so well for this machine. Not on the frontline, but in the rear as trainings mech. I mean he is quite quick, have Jumpjets, and 4 different weaponsystems, who all react differently. When you want to train a Mechjockey quick in all these aspects, the Shadow Hawk is perfect.
In both HBS's Battletech and in Classic, I've seen Shadowhawks put in some really solid performances. Less so in MechWarrior 5, though
To be fair, HBS Battletech actually made the AC/5 a good weapon instead of the ludicrously tonnage-inefficient liability it is in classic TT. It really says something that they almost *doubled* the damage of it compared to TT and it became "only" a good option instead of blatantly overpowered.
@@magni5648 I mostly agree with you, but my buddy and I have regularly gotten surprisingly solid performance out of the Shadowhawk in Classic.
Every time I use the shadow hawk I usually drop the SRM and upgrade the Lrm to either an lrm 10 or 15 and use it as long range support.
Yeah that seems like a decent idea. The SRMs are pretty inefficient. Personally I do like the punch the PPCs give :)
It's a good config and one I have not seen before, but I would agree with the others you focus to much on anti infantry and point blank weapons, stripping out the MG's and restarting the Medium laser along with another heat sink would give you a better damage curve.
My version is drop the extra sink, the srm, and the lrm, put in a large laser. Gives you a nice spread of decent weapons while still feeling like a shadowhawk. The slime variant is probbably the way to go for a merc company however.
Ye, I do like the swap to a LL too! Com-Star actually went a similar route when designing the Clan Buster variant. If I didn't need a utility mech I would likely go for something similar to what you designed. :)
The stock loadout is exactly what I'd imagine campaign designers would equip for NPCs to make their campaign easier.
I like the refit, though I'm always skeptical of machine guns. The instant vaporization from the ammo never seems with the risk for the weapon itself. I'd probably find a better use for the tonnage.
Check out the burst fire rules for MGs
It was between flamethrowers and MGs. I do tend to like flamethrowers for the safety, but in this case I felt the MGs were good because the shadow hawk will often be getting in close to enemy mechs. The 0 heat from the MGs will help with extra damage. Too bad we couldn't stack on more though. I would have liked 4-6!
@@Spartaner251 I've seen them, they don't help LOL. The unpredictable heat buildup and damage don't mitigate it for me
The main problem is it tried too hard to mimic what was depicted in the Dougram anime. Making it's weapon's load out too spread out and generalized to excel at anything. The most straight forward fix is to simply drop the SRM 2 and extra heat sinks and use those 4 tons on almost anything else.
I like it's design, but I often find myself yanking the LRMs our for more SRMs. I can also see swapping the Medium Laser for a Large and swap the SRMs, it's ammo out to make it a long range harasser.
Yep yep that doesn't sound too bad!
I mounted a UAC-20++ on mine in HBS Battletech. It became a flying hunchback.
Ohhh yeah, I 100% thought about that build lol. Unfortunately it felt just way to OP for me. But I might include it in a series.
@@nerdyOveranalyzed well, there is another refit I did based on the 2d. I basically replaced the two medium lasers, lrm, srm and heatsinks with two small lasers, a srm 4 at the torso and tons of armor.
It still plays like the og shadowhawk but closer and better. It is a great host for upgrades, from arm mods to the UAC 5.
You basically punch holes in heavies and let your lance finish your work, with some occasional fire support between punches.
Truly a mech where being wishy washy on what weapons you want make it suck at everything. The Dracs made the best variant.
It's funny how the main character of The Fang of The Sun, an incredibly high performance and sophisticated Combat Armor in its universe be interpreted as a below average all rounder in Battletech, the irony. But damn do I still love both of em, such a timeless design (visually at least)
Yeah! It has a great design. Unfortunately it just doesn't perform
Fielding the 2H in table top is like trying to win a sword fight with a swiss army knife. Great vid though!
lol, thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!
as much as I LOVE the shadowhawk, I am not blind to it's failings...
so I rebuilt it using 3050 Full Clan Tech.
Idea: keep true the the original, but make it better in every possible way, MAXED Armor on every mech.
SHD-7A Shadowhawk 5/8/5 armor factor 182
endo-steel frame, clanner XL engine, clanner Fero-fiberous armor, jump jets, 6 tons for standard cockpit and gyro, leaving 26.5 tons of pod space.
Prime Config twin UAC-5's r/lt with a ton of ammo each. twin LRM-10 and a ton of ammo each. twin ER-medium lasers r/l arm, a ERSL in the head, and an extra DHS.
Alt Config A, 2 LPL r/lt, 2 MPL r/la, 2 Streak-6 r/lt with a ton of ammo each, 2 extra DHS, and an ERSL in the head
My Ideal ShadowHawk is by upgrading the AC/5 to a AC/10 get rid of the LRM 5 and upgraded the SRM 2 to a SRM 6 and if possible add extra Medium Laser
Ye, I do like a bigger punch gun! I think it's the best way to go
So the big question for warcrimes o`clock. Mchine guns or flamethrowers? Followed up by why Inferno SMGs may be best for your orphan cookout.
Finaly O look t the shadow hawk and for some reason I get a hankering for morters. Either that or a snubnosed PPC. Yes I know I have a problem.
The shadow hawk is a funny little machine- the 2H isn't great but it's somehow managed to consistently put up numbers for me simply by virtue of people underestimating it and it being able to always contribute at least a little to a fight
I like your mod. I've run something similar though if your just doing Mech to Mech, the MG's are kinda useless. Cool overall and would let it wade into infantry.
Yeah give it a shot! If you're going in hand to hand the MGs aren't terrible. They give a few rolls to crit something out.
I would rather drop the SRM and AC5 for a large laser, upgrade the LRM to a 10, add 2 heat sinks, then two small lasers and a medium laser.
Not a bad idea! We could try it!
Ah, the Shadow Hawk. When you want to be disappointed at any range.
True facts. xD There is a small hope if you slam your body into them and try to punch them in the face.... kind of. LOL
I think going with 2K and stipping 3 heatsinks for armor + 2jjs would result in best overall performance. Unlike griffin, that mech would be able to use ppc+lrm5 while running, or just ppc while jumping with just +0 & +1 heat increase. Not to mention now the mech has maximum armor and 5jjs.
yep! Pretty good plan. And you can melee while still shooting your PPC if it comes down to it
The shadowhawk really feels to me like it could have been an up-armored javelin, instead it's just... nothing.
Basic Shadowhawk does a bit of everything, but nothing well.
It is a quintessential "soldier mech" because of this. It is also fairly easy to use, because outside of damage debuffs and possible environmental factors, you basically can ignore heat mechanics entirely.
Shadowhawk on its own can't really do much, if I'm being honest - and it has too little firepower to plug any holes in your formation effectively. It provides minuscule indirect and long range capability with LRM and AC, and its short to medium range capability is also lacking.
A flanker Shadowhawk also does not present much of a threat, and when encountering enemy counter-flanker, its only quality lies in... just not dying immediately, because it is unlikely to outfight most other mechs.
But here comes the redundancy - as I mentioned, it is a soldier mech. The type that works best in uniform, consistent group. A 4x Shadowhawk lance suddenly no longer looks like such a joke. A group of mechs that can engage at any range, fire constantly, move constantly and never worry about heat. It makes it impossible to fully negate any range bracket - unless Shadowhawk's ammo runs dry.
In a lance with mixed, specialised mechs? Say, the enemy took down your Trebuchet? That is probably your entire LRM complement just gone. Your Black Knight got focused down? So did majority of your mid-range firepower. You suddenly have a hole you can't plug.
With a squad of Shadowhawks? You just lose 25% of general firepower if one goes down, but you still maintain utility.
Now, this is still probably going to lose to a well piloted balanced lance - but I see why this machine is popular.
Whenever I'm getting randomly assigned mechs, the Shadowhawk is in the "please lord no" category. It's standard configuration is just not enough of anything. That said, your suggested refit looks solid, and overall there are plenty of good ways to refit a Shadowhawk, because it comes with so much tonnage devoted to the worst possible choices that you can replace all of it's weapons and jump jets and have no chance of concocting an even worse design.
If I'm going to the work of refitting a mech instead of just buying something that's useful to begin with, I'd usually just remove the jump jets from the Shadowhawk. At 5/8/5 the Wolverine and Griffin are already great choices, so I'd rather just use one of them, but there actually aren't many good 5-8 mechs (I think only the Crab and Dragon at similar weight, and the Crab is rare), so I'd rather just rebuild the Shadowhawk without jump jets. The Shadowhawk needs a pretty complete rebuild to be worthwhile, so may as well go all the way.
The main thing is to focus on just 2 types of weapons
Yep yep! Seems pretty hard to make a Shadow Hawk build that's worse than the original. xD
@1:11 - That's a Hunchback (from the cover of the "Technical Readout: Prototypes") Still, nice vid, thank you for the info =)
How did I miss this?
Merry Christmas!!!!
Love the Shadowhawk, just not the vanilla version.
Heh heh, yeah we gotta add some extra toppings.
Why are the numbers so small in the free worlds league where it is built?
In my experience the Shadow Hawk has a surprisingly good survivablity on the battlefield - not because of it´s thoughness but because the opponent never picks it as a primary target.
The ranged damage output is pathetic. It only becomes dangerous when it is able to close to melee range.
Every attempt to change the loadout somehow leads to Wolverine or a Griffin.
SHD-2H, SHD-2D are the problem. but not SHD-2Hb or later versions the Shadow Hawk is only really good if you install endo steel and ferro-fibrous especially if you put an XL engine on top
SHD-6S (not canon)
Role Mobile Artillery
Speed 5/8/0
Engine Light Engine
Core 250
Heat Sink Kit Double-strength models
Structure Endo-Steel Structure
Armor Ferro-Fibrous Armor
Left Torso Sniper Artillery
Right Torso CASE, 3t. Ammo Sniper
Left Arm M Laser
Right Arm M Laser
Sauce: bta3062
Right, alternatively for the shadowhawk, I propose the SHD-2F, PPC LT, SRM 4 head, 1 medium laser and machine gun in each side torso, 10 tons of armour, 12 standard heatsinks, and the same ammo config you offered. This makes it more of an all-rounder if you ask me, allowing it to fulfill any mission.
Ye, that could work! We could try for more machine guns though. Ideally I like to pack at least 4 or 2 flamethrowers. I do prefer the Large Laser over the PPC though since the Shadow Hawk does tend to get close up with its Battle Fists.
@@nerdyOveranalyzed 2 mgs in total while not ideal is decent enough for supplemental anti infantry support. As for the large laser, I favor the PPC for more range. As a merc commander my main experience comes with the trebuchet, as such I separate weapons for dedicated short range and long range ge usage on enemies.
At least in the mw5 universe, adding a rac5 usually makes the shadowhawk so much more usable. Never played battletech classic but I love the idea that everyone sees it as a joke mech. In full honesty, I'd probably want 4 of them
In the fluff it's actually regarded really well. :o
Harsh but far still with some modifications it's still a fav of mine
I like your variant, but I have one critique. Friends don't let friends use Machine Guns. MG Ammo is mostly a big risk with virtually no payoff, even if you do have to deal with infantry. Go with either SL or heck even a Flamer if you're worried about infantry. Since you have three MGs listed plus a ton of ammo, that means you can put in two flamers or SLs and still have some extra tonnage to put back into armor. After all, it's not like you're going to be firing your anti-infantry weapons in the same turn as your LL.
If you're really worried about refit times, just delete the MGs and ammo entirely, throw in another ton of SRM ammo, and put the rest of the tonnage into armor. No MGs is safer than MGs even with infantry to worry about in my experience, the MG ammo explosion risk isn't worth having the system installed.
We tended to go with a LL; LRM10; SRM4; ML, nothing else gets changed.Alternatively give it 2xLRM5; LL; SRM4 and 2xML.
Yeah, that doesn't sound too bad! Just getting rid of that AC/5 is pretty key imo
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Later years allow it to field a LAC5(LT) 1ton LAC5 ammo; 2xML(RA/H); Flamer(LA); MML9(RT); (1ton LRM/SRM ammo RT); CASE(RT)10.5 tons FF armour(max); 10(20) h/s; Endo-steel IS. BV 1397. You can swap out the LAC5 for a SNPPC if you wish. BV: 1559(but it runs very hot...29/20).
In the video games I always put the ammunition in the legs or arm, that way if it does ignite it spreads damage to the side torso not the center torso, is that a thing in table top has well?
Kinda~ there's a technology that's called CASE that comes later that explodes outwards rather than inwards. But in 3025 tech you're pretty much a goner if the ammo explodes. It usually does 100+ damage or so and cores you. xD
@@nerdyOveranalyzed But can you actually put your ammo into arms or legs?
Hey, Nerdy. What is the name of the song you play at the end of your videos? What band is that?
Shadowhawk is one of those mechs which you rely on briefly, but once you can reliably get higher tonnage be becomes outdated and uncompetitive.
The main reason, I think, is because it has the old recipe of one each of the different weapon types, but of course one laser is rubbish, one LRM5 is pointless, a single SRM2 hits like a thrown handful of gravel.
Maybe it is purely a tabletop mech, but in any video game that actually simulates mech combat, split load outs tend to be worthless. 4 medium lasers will always prove vastly more reliable and used yet than a mixture of small calibre ACs, an LRM, a single laser… etc
In reality you can close range using cover fast enough that a single LRM5 isn’t a threat.
A meaningful load-out has to be 2/3x SRM4/6s, or 2xAC10/LBX10, 4-6 med lasers… focus on one or two ranges of engagement , not all three.
The poor Shadow Hawk: it takes the "Jack of all trades, master of none" philosophy to its next level and just becomes a "Jack of none." I do really like your proposed refit, though!
Yeeeee, it really is bad imo. D: Thanks glad you enjoyed it!
I can see some value in groups of LRM 5’s due to the weight savings, but a single LRM 5 never made sense to me. Maybe groups of SRM 2’s have some value with increased crit chances (more rolls = more chances to roll a 12), but single SRM 2 packs just seem like a complete waste to me.
Yeah, it really seems they put 1 each of the smallest weapon on there.
I would just swap out the SRM-2 and its ammo for two medium lasers. 20 to 25 damage in the optimal range is not to bad.
Not a bad choice!
I have been enjoying the videos but how do you get the info on what factions have access to it by %? Is it in the MUL somewhere?
Hey Matt! I use the Xtol Rats tables!
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Thanks for the insight that will help me out.
I feel like the AC5 was always a bit too underpowered for it's weight. Personally, I feel like it should be more like a 6 or even 7 point damage weapon with a little more heat to make up for the extra damage. That way a commander might actually think twice about replacing them with a large laser or ppc.
Ye, I think the AC/5 is pretty bad honestly except for maybe some very specialized builds.
I just happened to start painting my Shadowhawk just before happening upon your video! Is there a place I could find a mech availability graph like the one at the 1:00 mark for all mechs, or, if it is something you made for this vid, where did you get the numbers?
www.sarna.net/wiki/Faction_Assignment_%26_Rarity_Tables :)
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Thanks!
@@angelshade00 yw!
Do you think you'd ever make a video on the pros and cons of 3D printing battletech models?
Hmm, it's a touchy subject. My preference would be to support the company that makes the game and buy from Catalyst as much as is reasonable.
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Yeah that makes sense 😁
The Shadow hawk, like the wolverine, has optimal tonnage for its movement profile and tech level and as such is a prime candidate for refit.
Where can I find the refit rules?
Campaign Ops
@@nerdyOveranalyzed Thank you very much.
One variant you did not talk about fixes, imo, nearly everything wrong with the shadowhawk. 2Hb. Drops the worthless AC5 for an LBX10 and adds in double heat sinks. Sure you still have the worthless SRM 2 but at least its a streak srm2 now. Still got the weird 5/8/3 movement though.
9D is also good with the better Light AC5 and the twin MML 5's give it a nice short/long range punches.
If your a dirty wobbie then running the 11CS in a improved C3 Level II with the amazing snub nose ppc is also a good choice.
I would actually say the 5M/7CS are the worst because of its XL engine, UAC 5 (Mechwarrior games UACs are great, tabletop they suck) and an LRM 20/15 really leaves much to be desired on the mech.
I'd also say the Shadow Hawk is the best of the 55 ton trio (Wolverine, Shadow Hawk, Griffin) since the other two seem to have odd design flaws. At least all 3 are better then the scorpion.
TH-cam just showed me this video (and your channel) and I feel I have to mention, sticking to only 3025 is a massive disappointment for nearly every mech. There are soo many other good variants of even bad mechs that fix a lot of issues.
I mean, a default Shadowhawk isn't useless... The excess heatsinks are great for keeping the drinks cold!
XD
What's your thoughts in the 2ht?
I really like it! I cheated a bit and looked at a few future builds before I started. The 2HT is where I got the inspiration for the SLIME variant!
Even though this is supposed to be for the tabletop game, I tried the recommended loadout on MechWarrior 5 with minor tweaks & absolutely demolish with it lol
I just play the 5M variant. It fixes basically all the problems of the OG variant.
For Succession Wars era, the 2H is fine. Almost every Mech from that era is walking ammunition explosion, with poopy damage output. Having 4 weapon systems on a Medium at that time, with 3 of them doing 5 is big game for creating and boring into armor breaches. It's not impressive in a single round, but tends to be tactically impressive when rolling for crits, even if it's armed like an Orion with 20 tons removed.
Not sure I'm sold on that Commander, but there are a few people that really like the Shadow Hawk. Maybe I'm missing something!
@@nerdyOveranalyzed It's an inexpensive succession wars era medium robed like a Heavy- and making 4 attacks at 5-6 Hexes, with a couple accuracy perks if the minimum is maintained on the slow half of the weapons. It's good at spray n' pray and fisticuffs in that environment. It's the Centurion's weird uncle with an extra free movement point and mean hands. Or the Griffin that has to hang out at medium ranges. It's fair to call it niche, but I consider the original serviceable for an era of awful Mechs- and the thousand upgrade packages timestamps in the game.
o7 It's a pleasure. Thanks for the content.
Love it, the 2K actually looks usable if you just dump 2 heatsinks for 2 more jump jets.
Even when new to the game I looked at the Shadow Hawk and just went "wat?", its loadout is so... wishy washy.
Agreed. The weapons loadout is pitiful and adding jump jets to the 2K sounds like a good idea!
It's a medium Atlas, sadly the weapons package doesn't translate well when downshifted
Lol, yep. One of each inefficient weapon. XD
Is there any app that shows class of refit, time and cost?
Mechlab dont have those information or I dont know how to turn it :(
you need the books!
@@nerdyOveranalyzed T_T