For a show to be woke, it merely needs to have woke producers, writers, and/or directors. The woke lens of the creators WILL bleed into their creative choices in all kinds of potential ways. Some of the most overt woke creative choices are: - Representation-driven casting (This includes unnecessary race-swaps, gender-swaps, sexuality-swaps, historically inaccurate multiculturalism/diversity, tokenism, etc.) - Representation-driven writing (A need to represent the experience of a POC primarily as a POC... and the experience of women primarily as women surrounded by oafish or misogynist men. Leading to regressive stereotyping & clichés. Usually requiring the show to include at least one microaggression or confrontation of bigotry, even if it has nothing to do with the story.) - Elimination or downplaying of heterosexual romances. - Highlighting of arbitrary positive LGBT affection/relationships that are unimportant to the story. - Women are portrayed as hyper-competent and other characters are used to praise and validate them. They should never be in need of rescuing by a male character, and should rarely even need help from men. - Straight men are generally portrayed as obtuse or antagonistic. If a virtuous and competent male character exists, he MUST either "simp" a powerful female character, or be outshone by one. - Dialogue sounds a lot like things people say on social media. - Body positivity should be promoted by casting less attractive people, or by costuming attractive actors in an unflattering way. - De-emphasizing main characters. Woke people see the notion of a main character as a support of classism. - And many many more.
They agree that a woman is a person who chooses to identify as a woman. A person's gender identity is not necessarily the same gender that was assigned to them at birth.
Thank you for explaining your definition, a lot of channels are afraid of doing that. This goes into how I watched the 1988 film Willow to prepare for the 2022 series, it was so bad because the critics were too positive, episode 1 didn't have the main character it, I doubt that you would have openly LGBTQ characters around during that time, and characters had inconsistent accents.
It cheapens his character tbh now he’s used as political construct to promote heavily leftist ideas and agendas. And that goes for other characters who are written this way. I was even called “misogynistic” because I dared to want female characters to be written equally as their male counterparts with depth and character development
Blame Kevin Feige for stealing the MCU from Ike Perlmutter and turning it into an ESG Money Laundering Machine 🤷🏽♂️ From the last 5 years, you can heavily tell that his fingerprints are all over it and that he was never the one that actually “guided the MCU”…but merely the guy who got too big of a head from his ability to take orders from the real mastermind and implement them. Until they turned on said mastermind and hyped him up to ensure the guy guiding him would be deposed and Feige instead being the one in charge. Feige and Victoria Alonso…until Alonso was fired WITH CAUSE from Marvel Studios for her incompetence and the perception she brought of “making the MCU into a propaganda machine”. Fun Fact: Victoria Alonso was the “she-nius” that came up with the idea to replace existing characters with the newer and better-er female/it versions by referring to the beloved characters as “mantles”. She referred to this strategy as “The Mantle System”…and it was heavily supported by Kevin Feige himself.
In short? It’s just the latest buzzword that means “thing/things/person/people I don’t like that/whom I just want to dismiss summarily without having to think about it.”
For me it’s always been an abundance of liberal ideology…like. The example you gave in Falcon and Winter Soldier promoting open borders Radical feminism in She hulk..Barbie movie..and almost every piece of Marvel and Disney media out now where the woman is always stronger smarter more capable etc Or pushing LGBT propaganda such as in Eternals or strange world especially among our people
@@laymansjournal it’s a shame we don’t see strong black men in the household anymore on TV like Jame Evans..George Jefferson..Phillip Banks..Carl Winslow I doubt shows like that would ever get green lit again…but I bet if you pitch an idea of a single mother raising 3 kids with her girlfriend and one of the kids are apart of the rainbow community Hollywood would jump all over that lol
@@laymansjournalwhy are you showing up on my feed? Not Bingo please stop trying to be an educator. How are you even a Black Man and you are misconstruing information. Then you are referencing fantasy show where people can make up a roster of characters and their settings.
The Critical Drinker did a video on this subject a while back, and I think his take was probably the one I would most identify with; having shit like lgbt characters, female protagonists, or characters of differing race, colour or creed isn't woke, but when all of that shit gets politicised, and becomes the entire basis of a show, movie, or game above anything else (such as quality writing, competent storytelling and likable characters), thats when it becomes "woke". I mean, no one had a problem with the Terminator or Alien films because they took the time to make their respective protagonists likeable, made them people who you wanted to see succeed, but then compare them to shit like captain marvel, who's only defining characteristic seems to be that she does not possess a penis.
My favorite woke nonsense is that whatever a man can do, a woman can do better, not equal but better. Which is BS, because we are not the same, we do not want the same things, and societal expectations are different as well.
I think of woke as this: whatever is understood to be normal is flipped on it's head and becomes a "new normal". Almost like a absurd alternate dimension.
Unfortunately words do mean different things to different people. I don't get why people are so bothered about defining Woke. When a person uses it you can understand what they mean based on context.
Because different groups take a word or phrase which had a specific meaning and use and alter it without actually understanding the meaning or context. The term woke/ stay woke was used by African Americans b4 the 60’s to be aware of specifically racial prejudices in ur surrounding area especially when living/ traveling threw parts of the south. That was it. Be aware. And now the way ppl go back and forth with it they see it as ignorance or a way to push an agenda. BLM may have projected the term but they didn’t creat it. And they really didn’t project it either as the term was used heavily on black Twitter b4 everyone else got to it
4:30. Sam Wilson was an interesting character and an inventive Captain America. But it was distracting that it became so much about him being black. "A Black man carrying the stars and strips"? there have been many black men who have carried the stars and stripes. 07:59... great response!
The Duality Of Swapping & Legacy In Fiction… For me I have a mixed more nuanced view on the subject. I believe we should have version based adaptations of art that stay true to source material in many ways for fans and audiences that want accuracy in storytelling, writing with characterization especially when it comes to Casting actors and actresses in quality storytelling writing and good characterization for the sake of entertainment but at the same time I’m also open to version based adaptations of art that take some liberties from source material in storytelling, writing with characterization granted that even with some changes in detail the overall story still holds true to the source material and that in casting actors or actresses can be picked purely based on their skill in performance and not based on their race or gender. On top of that this can all only work in my mind if the quality of the storytelling, writing and characterization is done well. In order to even do this though they’re should be no racial or gender bias on what’s ok to be swapped and what isn’t. This is the maintain consistency which hasn’t been shown with the mainstream. If some of its ok. All of its ok. Complaints about white washing make no sense if your fine with any other kind of swapping when it comes to fiction or non fiction based art. This means cutting out the modern woke over emphasis of racial & gender inclusion or diversity pandering that is often used when doing these things in modern projects. If these things are fine to do because race and gender doesn’t matter compared to skill and performance like I truly do believe but some modern SJW’s claim to also believe then saying your doing this more for racial and gender inclusion or diversity more then anything else also doesn’t make sense. Your holding up the race and gender mattering argument while saying it doesn’t. The same goes for those who prefer characters that are accurate to the original stories , writing and characterization when it comes to any source material. If your fine with changes to characters when it comes to casting or anything else on certain levels then that does risk weakening your argument to some extent if not completely shattering it unless you open your point to a more nuanced conclusion. There’s honestly a nuanced duality to this argument that holds true on both ends that I think is not seen due to the accusations of being racist, and sexist for having issues with this by modern wokeness and it’s followers.
Unfortunately, TONS of men have had a similar experience... but only a few are willing to openly admit it. It's a shameful thing for a man to open his heart, walk a straight and narrow path with a woman, only to find out she was duping him the whole time. It's a deeply shameful thing for men to admit.
The left knows what it means but like CRT are playing dumb semantic games. Just short circuit them asking what "woke" means by saying "far left" since that is usually what people mean and you sidestep the game playing. People said "woke" as a placeholder because many people and content creators wanted to avoid "political" labels so their content was not labelled as "conservative" or political. But if the left wants to play games and force you to say it is far left so you have to call it the real political ideology that it is, just embrace it.
Their were a lot of Black people in Europe during the early Renaissance era. They throw black people in these movies to mock the black rulership that existed back then. They know that most black people today have no idea that blacks ruled in Europe for centuries. If you ever visit certain places in Europe, they still have black paintings and statues of noble blacks that use to rule the lands.
The Duality Of Swapping & Legacy In Fiction… I only mind race and gender swapping when they say they’ll stay completely true to the source material because at that point I just expect the source material on screen but if they make an adaptation that is close to the source material but they admit they’ll take some liberties I won’t be mad that can be done well because it has been done before and worked for me, the only time I get mad is if they say they’ll stay completely true to the source material or say they’ll just take some liberties but they’ll stay close to it but they do neither and take major liberties and the core behind their changes is because of modern wokeness and nothing else that will piss me off. Modern wokesters have no interests in race blind casting. Because that means they can’t point out how they’re being diverse and inclusive or target certain groups based on their race or gender for casting. To actually do race or gender blind casting means the modern woke concept to casting wouldn’t work. That means any female characters or minority character can be race swapped to be white characters or male characters as much as it can be done for white characters & male characters. Honestly someone like me is willing to break the barriers that modern wokesters don’t want to. Race and gender swapping doesn’t matter as much to me as the skill and performance but in order to do that means that they’re are no double standards or hypocrisy that modern SJW’s love to commit. If we’re breaking all barriers let’s break all barriers. I know they don’t want to because they still want to complain about white washing yet they’re completely fine when it’s the other around. Either it doesn’t matter or it does matter. The funny thing is that race or gender swapping wouldn’t be so bad and could be good if they stayed true to the core of the original characters and made them unique in well written ways of quality so they just wouldn’t be the token version of an original character more Miles from Into The Spiderverse and less Miles from The current Woke Marvel comics where he has decent moments but overall fails as a character with the woke shitty writing attempts. Samuel L Jackson’s version of Nick Fury is a very good example. In The 1610 Ultimate Universe of Marvel Comics before The MCU started they wanted to make their doppelgänger of Nick Fury in that Parallel/Alternate Universe to have the likeness of Samuel L Jackson so they made that version look like SLJ while still having the personality and character of The Original Nick Fury from The Main Marvel Comics Universe Of 616. He wasn’t just made to be a black token version of Nick’s character they’re was actual intent and effort put into it that made it work beyond bland swapping with only the perverted version of “diversity” & “inclusion” in mind. They even played with this concept in The Main 616 Marvel Universe where The Original Nick Fury fell in love with a fellow agent and had a son becoming Nick Fury Sr. His son Marcus Johnson adopts his father’s role as head of shield and takes The name Nick Fury becoming Nick Fury Jr. Both of these work because the intent wasn’t just to make a token version of an original established character and as a result even a lot of old fans accept it or tolerate it. If Token based characters had good quality in them in terms of making them unique while staying true to the core of the original character they can work, like the great performance Vondie Curtis Hall did for Ben Urich, his version of the character is a black version of Ben Urich but he had great quality behind the writing of his character, his performance was a stellar god send and he was more then just a tokenized version of an older side character for Daredevil. The same can be said for Michael Clarke Duncan’s performance as Wilson Fisk/The Kingpin. His performance matches the ruthless, cold and strategic sadistic character that often is The Kingpin from the comics while he is technically a tokenized version of The Kingpin’s original character in the comics his portrayal was pretty good for what it was. Token characters can work based off the quality of the writing or interesting traits you give them while having them stay unique to the core of the character but if you just make a tokenized character just to be “diverse” & “inclusive” with no substance but woke nonsense, lazy writing you get Miles Morales’s Thor. The same could be said for characters like early She Hulk, & early Batgirl, early Supergirl & such. These examples show that with good writing & effort initial token based characters can grow to be more then what they are. They often fit The Legacy Characters category. Whether Token, or not Legacy characters are made to be an extension of the original characters story, they can written well like Batman Beyond or written horribly woke style like Jane Foster’s version of Thor. This issue has been around for a long time fans older or younger that prefer the original or Iconic characters have complained about them being replaced this often happens with mantle legacy storylines. Now you can do a good legacy storyline with a mantle but often it doesn’t last that long. This isn’t an issue of racism because when new characters would take up the mantle of big time heroes people complained. Many Fans didn’t like Dick Grayson becoming Nightwing and Jason Todd being The New Robin when that started. Fans were interested Dick Grayson becoming Batman but didn’t want that storyline to remain permanent eventually wanting Bruce Wayne to come back as Batman. Fans were excited to see John Stewart introduced as another Green Lantern fighting along side Hal Jordan but fans weren’t happy when John Stewart eventually replacing Hal Jordan as Green Lantern of earth. Fans didn’t want Superboy Conner Kent or Johnathan Kent taking Clark’s place as Superman at least not permanently. Miles Morales was popular at the start of his initial run but eventually fans just wanted to see Peter Parker again and many storylines of Peter & Miles teaming up were accepted while stories focusing on Miles on his own whether they were good or bad were heavily criticized. Fans generally don’t like change especially when the legacy character no matter how well written they are can’t match up to The Iconic or Original version in terms of quality. The main issue with legacy characters is while they can get very good stories with the effort put in eventually some level of the status Quo has to return to satisfy audiences. This is why most legacy stories that are final out comes to a long running franchise as usually if not always are what if multiverse stories when it comes to comics or anything else. You can write a great legacy story or you can completely screw it up but often regardless those legacy characters can’t replace the originals or Iconic versions for good because many fans will want the original back at some point this is the reality of any legacy character regardless of their race and gender. Kyle & Guy got flak for not being Hal Jordan. Hal Jordan was criticized at times for not being Alan. Accusing fans of racism for not liking changes like this will often lead to fans getting pissed off and no longer supporting the story as Customers this often the problem with current media and society. Another flaw is when legacy stories are attempted with bad quality in an attempt to grab the current generation and be Woke/PC often not just leading to the main audience no longer supporting the franchise and new audiences not being interested that’s when things fall apart. The lesson we can learn here is that legacy stories can be well made and legacy characters can be interesting with hard work and good writing put in but eventually they’ll have to be sidekicks, partners basically secondary characters to the original or iconic versions that came before because they can never truly replace them for people this is why Gohan could never take Goku’s place at the end of Dragon Ball like Akira wanted originally after The Cell Saga or why Anakin wasn’t Luke for some fans during the original trilogy despite being a prequel character. For a new character that you want to have their own status has to always be original because while legacy characters can be well made they’ll always just be legacy characters to people which is just another version. Batman Beyond despite how well made he is still Batman Beyond not Batman even if he’s called that in universe. No one ever truly replaces Bruce Wayne for people just like no one ever truly replaces Steve Rogers or Peter Parker. Further evidence of this is people getting pissed that T’Challa was replaced by his sister as Black Panther people didn’t like that either and The Black Panther comics were going downhill at that point anyway. Don’t call fans racist because they prefer what came before it’s just normal for humans.
Legacy characters can be made and I’m behind them being made because I always loved legacy stories as a matter of fact I’m one of the few old comic book fans that believes you can make these new legacy characters in DC & Marvel good if you strip out all the modern wokeness and actually put great writing quality behind them but they can never fully replace the original or iconic characters and they have to be mainly side characters in that original or iconic Mythos they can still have solo stories but they have to tie back into that particular Mythos so while fans can enjoy these new characters and other new characters with better creative writing put in they can still enjoy the original and /or iconic characters that mean so much to them with better interesting creative writing. The only new characters that should fully have their own status like the originals and or Iconic ones should be the new original characters that have their own identity. If legacy characters transition from mantle sidekicks & secondary characters to their own full identities then the same applies and if they’re are characters that start off as new original characters and go to a mantle of an older original and or iconic character the same rule of side character/secondary/sidekicks applies. I believe that will solve the problem for older and newer audiences. No more replacing, and no more changing or downgrading characters to replace them either. “As the indefatigable 92-year-old superhero conjurer and Marvel Comics chairman emeritus sees it, fan backlash up until this point hasn't so much been spurred on by racism as much as unyielding fealty to the source material. "They're outraged not because of any personal prejudice, Lee says. "They're outraged because they hate to see any change made on a series and characters they had gotten familiar with. In Spider- Man, when they got a new actor, that bothered them, even though it was a white actor. I don't think it had to do with racial prejudice as much as they don't like things changed.” “I wouldn't mind. if Peter Parker had originally been black. a Latino, an lndian or anything else that he stay that way. But we originally made him white. I dont see any reason to change that. It has nothing to do with being anti-gay, or anti-black, or anti-Latino, or anything like that. Latino characters should stay Latino. The Black Panther should certainly not be Swiss. I just see no reason to change that which has already been established when it's so easy to add new characters.”-Stan Lee The hilarious hypocrisy of modern wokesters is they’re happy with any race or gender swap of an already established character and anyone who isn’t is an ist or phobic but when you take an already established non white or non male character and change to them to be white or male they get angry. Someone got attacked for showing fan art of a white black Panther and they attacked marvel’s what if series for showing a Peggy Carter version of Captain America because they thought she was replacing Sam Wilson’s version of Captain America let’s not forget the fact that they were mad and calling some fans racists for not liking T’Challa having Peter Quill’s role as Star Lord in a What If Episode but now they’re mad that Peggy Carter’s version of Captain America is racist because they think Marvel intended her to replace Sam Wilson’s role of Captain America. I’m not even one that’s mad at a T’Challa version of star lord or a Peggy Carter version of Steve Rogers, What If is a multiverse comic run and show. Those also could be interesting what if’s but the point is If your gonna make a token or non token legacy character you’ll have to make them unique but still stay true to the core of the character. They’re has to be more to them then just being another version of an original character and they have to be very well written. They can’t replace the original or iconic version so they must be secondary and if you want a character who fully stands on their own with quality writing and such not having to be overly reliant on an original or iconic character make them a new original character. If we can have a what if where T’Challa became Star Lord we can have a what if where Peter Quill became Black Panther, if we can have Sam Wilson take up the mantle of Captain America after Steve Rogers then we can have a what if where Peggy is another version of Captain America out there in The vast Multiverse but the primary versions of Peter, Sam & Peggy should be them as their original character selves while mantle legacy stories and alternate versions should remain secondary always. Avoiding Modern wokeness is the best step forward to better art. The funny thing is that race or gender swapping wouldn’t be so bad and could be good if they stayed true to the core of the original characters and made them unique in well written ways of quality so they just wouldn’t be the token version of an original character more Miles from Into The Spiderverse and less Miles from The current Woke Marvel comics where he has decent moments but overall fails as a character with the woke shitty writing attempts. Samuel L Jackson’s version of Nick Fury is a very good example. In The 1610 Ultimate Universe of Marvel Comics before The MCU started they wanted to make their doppelgänger of Nick Fury in that Parallel/Alternate Universe to have the likeness of Samuel L Jackson so they made that version look like SLJ while still having the personality and character of The Original Nick Fury from The Main Marvel Comics Universe Of 616. He wasn’t just made to be a black token version of Nick’s character they’re was actual intent and effort put into it that made it work beyond bland swapping with only the perverted version of “diversity” & “inclusion” in mind. They even played with this concept in The Main 616 Marvel Universe where The Original Nick Fury fell in love with a fellow agent and had a son becoming Nick Fury Sr. His son Marcus Johnson adopts his father’s role as head of shield and takes The name Nick Fury becoming Nick Fury Jr. Both of these work because the intent wasn’t just to make a token version of an original established character and as a result even a lot of old fans accept it or tolerate it.
If Token based characters had good quality in them in terms of making them unique while staying true to the core of the original character they can work, like the great performance Vondie Curtis Hall did for Ben Urich, his version of the character is a black version of Ben Urich but he had great quality behind the writing of his character, his performance was a stellar god send and he was more then just a tokenized version of an older side character for Daredevil. The same can be said for Michael Clarke Duncan’s performance as Wilson Fisk/The Kingpin. His performance matches the ruthless, cold and strategic sadistic character that often is The Kingpin from the comics while he is technically a tokenized version of The Kingpin’s original character in the comics his portrayal was pretty good for what it was. Token characters can work based off the quality of the writing or interesting traits you give them while having them stay unique to the core of the character but if you just make a tokenized character just to be “diverse” & “inclusive” with no substance but woke nonsense, lazy writing you get Miles Morales’s Thor. The same could be said for characters like early She Hulk, & early Batgirl, early Supergirl & such. These examples show that with good writing & effort initial token based characters can grow to be more then what they are. They often fit The Legacy Characters category. Whether Token, or not Legacy characters are made to be an extension of the original characters story, they can written well like Batman Beyond or written horribly woke style like Jane Foster’s version of Thor. This issue has been around for a long time fans older or younger that prefer the original or Iconic characters have complained about them being replaced this often happens with mantle legacy storylines. Now you can do a good legacy storyline with a mantle but often it doesn’t last that long. This isn’t an issue of racism because when new characters would take up the mantle of big time heroes people complained. Many Fans didn’t like Dick Grayson becoming Nightwing and Jason Todd being The New Robin when that started. Fans were interested Dick Grayson becoming Batman but didn’t want that storyline to remain permanent eventually wanting Bruce Wayne to come back as Batman. Fans were excited to see John Stewart introduced as another Green Lantern fighting along side Hal Jordan but fans weren’t happy when John Stewart eventually replacing Hal Jordan as Green Lantern of earth. Fans didn’t want Superboy Conner Kent or Johnathan Kent taking Clark’s place as Superman at least not permanently. Miles Morales was popular at the start of his initial run but eventually fans just wanted to see Peter Parker again and many storylines of Peter & Miles teaming up were accepted while stories focusing on Miles on his own whether they were good or bad were heavily criticized. Fans generally don’t like change especially when the legacy character no matter how well written they are can’t match up to The Iconic or Original version in terms of quality. The main issue with legacy characters is while they can get very good stories with the effort put in eventually some level of the status Quo has to return to satisfy audiences. This is why most legacy stories that are final out comes to a long running franchise as usually if not always are what if multiverse stories when it comes to comics or anything else. You can write a great legacy story or you can completely screw it up but often regardless those legacy characters can’t replace the originals or Iconic versions for good because many fans will want the original back at some point this is the reality of any legacy character regardless of their race and gender. Kyle & Guy got flak for not being Hal Jordan. Hal Jordan was criticized at times for not being Alan. Accusing fans of racism for not liking changes like this will often lead to fans getting pissed off and no longer supporting the story as Customers this often the problem with current media and society. Another flaw is when legacy stories are attempted with bad quality in an attempt to grab the current generation and be Woke/PC often not just leading to the main audience no longer supporting the franchise and new audiences not being interested that’s when things fall apart. The lesson we can learn here is that legacy stories can be well made and legacy characters can be interesting with hard work and good writing put in but eventually they’ll have to be sidekicks, partners basically secondary characters to the original or iconic versions that came before because they can never truly replace them for people this is why Gohan could never take Goku’s place at the end of Dragon Ball like Akira wanted originally after The Cell Saga or why Anakin wasn’t Luke for some fans during the original trilogy despite being a prequel character. For a new character that you want to have their own status has to always be original because while legacy characters can be well made they’ll always just be legacy characters to people which is just another version. Batman Beyond despite how well made he is still Batman Beyond not Batman even if he’s called that in universe. No one ever truly replaces Bruce Wayne for people just like no one ever truly replaces Steve Rogers or Peter Parker. Further evidence of this is people getting pissed that T’Challa was replaced by his sister as Black Panther people didn’t like that either and The Black Panther comics were going downhill at that point anyway. Don’t call fans racist because they prefer what came before it’s just normal for humans. Legacy characters can be made and I’m behind them being made because I always loved legacy stories as a matter of fact I’m one of the few old comic book fans that believes you can make these new legacy characters in DC & Marcel good if you strip out all the modern wokeness and actually put great writing quality behind them but they can never fully replace the original or iconic characters and they have to be mainly side characters in that original or iconic Mythos they can still have solo stories but they have to tie back into that particular Mythos so while fans can enjoy these new characters and other new characters with better creative writing put in they can still enjoy the original and /or iconic characters that mean so much to them with better interesting creative writing. The only new characters that should fully have their own status like the originals and or Iconic ones should be the new original characters that have their own identity. If legacy characters transition from mantle sidekicks & secondary characters to their own full identities then the same applies and if they’re are characters that start off as new original characters and go to a mantle of an older original and or iconic character the same rule of side character/secondary/sidekicks applies. I believe that will solve the problem for older and newer audiences. No more replacing, and no more changing or downgrading characters to replace them either. “As the indefatigable 92-year-old superhero conjurer and Marvel Comics chairman emeritus sees it, fan backlash up until this point hasn't so much been spurred on by racism as much as unyielding fealty to the source material. "They're outraged not because of any personal prejudice, Lee says. "They're outraged because they hate to see any change made on a series and characters they had gotten familiar with. In Spider- Man, when they got a new actor, that bothered them, even though it was a white actor. I don't think it had to do with racial prejudice as much as they don't like things changed.” “I wouldn't mind. if Peter Parker had originally been black. a Latino, an lndian or anything else that he stay that way. But we originally made him white. I dont see any reason to change that. It has nothing to do with being anti-gay, or anti-black, or anti-Latino, or anything like that. Latino characters should stay Latino. The Black Panther should certainly not be Swiss. I just see no reason to change that which has already been established when it's so easy to add new characters.”-Stan Lee
Im not a black man, but even I saw through the stupidity you spoke about happening in captain america. I was really dissapointed in what could have been a great arc in marvels story telling.
The word woke had an original meaning of waking up literally then it started to be used metaphorically as the term had morphed into having your mind opened to whatever “true reality” you thought/believed society or the world didn’t want you realize. Far Left leaning political ideologies coined it eventually and it was somewhat used for topics like social Justice whether it was racial or gender based, for those historical reasons I’ve always come to use the word modern woke instead of woke because despite the connection between the two the various but similar definitions we give modern woke aren’t a complete 1 to 1 with what it originally meant. You can have racial or gender activist who are strong in their beliefs criticize what current wokeness is these days in society even though their beliefs at one point was apart of what woke used to mean. Similar to the generations of racial Social Justice Warrriors and gender Social Justice Warrriors ie feminists changing over time, current day Modern SJW’s are the extreme descendants of these ideologies (and I say ideologies because they are , that isn’t said positively or negatively, whatever opinions anyone has on them is fine but like any mindset for better or worse they are ideologies so the term isn’t being used as an insult right now just being objective.) and they have used them to take their beliefs and approaches to human society to the extreme, because of that I define modern wokeness we see today as progressive extremism. The issue isn’t there beliefs in themselves it’s often that they take these beliefs to a dangerous extreme that turns many people off because of that they view others who are indifferent to them or in disagreement with them as the enemy. When it comes to current day entertainment they take the extremism of their beliefs beyond the purpose of the entertainment. Great Storytelling: Great storytelling is what’s important. The Stories that aren’t political at all and are based on good writing, good characters , deeper lessons, morals and entertainment as well as the stories that do have political elements but are more focused on an engaging story,a well thought out lesson or idea behind it and interesting characters are the stories that make great entertainment. As my film teacher taught me Art before politics, always. The story & characters comes first whether the politics are subtle, secondary or completely non existent. There are two types of great stories when it comes to this method: stories that are apolitical with great characters, writing & moral lessons or none, and then there are stories that have political elements but put the quality of the writing and characters, & moral lessons first. Whether either type of story is apolitical or has political elements deep philosophy, morality, & mythology can often play a role in sharpening the story, once you form your morals for a story into ideas over just using them for government or social policy statements you can grab anyone within an audience no matter who they are or what they believe that is the gift of good storytelling Modern SJW’s unfortunately don’t have that gift because for them there is nothing deeper then the physical realm they see and often hate so instead of forming deep intelligent universal themes or ideas through the magic of storytelling they try to bend those themes or ideas to their will ,thoughts and beliefs. They can’t form their morals into ideas so often they come off as just government or policy statements without the feeling of anything deeper to an audience turning most people off whether they do or don’t agree with them or are indifferent to begin with.
You know, I don't think it's the fact that it's "woke" I think it's the fact that it is "preachy" it is cynically thrown in there to look good and nothing else, shallow tokenism. Now my issue with these arguments is that some people think that *ALL* forms of inclusion has the same intention of being preachy and cynically thrown in for token brownie points, and that makes me self conscious as an artist. Okay wait, about that black dude in Game of Thrones; that series is about as fictional as King Arthur, which by the way, had African knights named sir Moreon and Feirefiz. Also dragons didn't exist in medieval times, so it seems kinda sussy you would say that dragons are okay but not black people.
Samuel Wilson aka The Falcon has been an African American man since maybe the early 80's or earlier. I didn't give a dislike for that mistake, rather for claiming that the character's race was changed for the MCU. Mayhaps you are confusing him with Nick Fury played by Samuel L Jackson, who is Marvelously more fitting than David Hasslehoff. Sam Jackson and Anthony Mackie do not look alike. I watched up to 6:24, and I won't bother watching the rest. I could try to understand why the world's smallest violin was played during the scene of Sam Wilson asking them not to call the Flagsmashers "terrorists", but I believe I know the answer. This video almost started out positive, but got to be condescending in a subtle juvenility. I am not a soft skinned snowflake, but I expected a clear definition of woke from it's inception in as early as the 1920's when it was used by African American citizens who I believe this video wishes to demonize. That and the CashApp ( Get money over everything else, I'm not hatin ) information scroll has me thinking this video is clickbait. Not trying to be rude about it. If my opinion is informative and appreciated, cool, thank you and you are welcome. ✌🏿
This is the most succinct and articulate breakdown I've ever seen on this topic! It's like you were reading my mind. Thank you for making this.
You're welcome 🙏🏾
For a show to be woke, it merely needs to have woke producers, writers, and/or directors. The woke lens of the creators WILL bleed into their creative choices in all kinds of potential ways.
Some of the most overt woke creative choices are:
- Representation-driven casting (This includes unnecessary race-swaps, gender-swaps, sexuality-swaps, historically inaccurate multiculturalism/diversity, tokenism, etc.)
- Representation-driven writing (A need to represent the experience of a POC primarily as a POC... and the experience of women primarily as women surrounded by oafish or misogynist men. Leading to regressive stereotyping & clichés. Usually requiring the show to include at least one microaggression or confrontation of bigotry, even if it has nothing to do with the story.)
- Elimination or downplaying of heterosexual romances.
- Highlighting of arbitrary positive LGBT affection/relationships that are unimportant to the story.
- Women are portrayed as hyper-competent and other characters are used to praise and validate them. They should never be in need of rescuing by a male character, and should rarely even need help from men.
- Straight men are generally portrayed as obtuse or antagonistic. If a virtuous and competent male character exists, he MUST either "simp" a powerful female character, or be outshone by one.
- Dialogue sounds a lot like things people say on social media.
- Body positivity should be promoted by casting less attractive people, or by costuming attractive actors in an unflattering way.
- De-emphasizing main characters. Woke people see the notion of a main character as a support of classism.
- And many many more.
Bruh they can't even agree what a " woman" is anymore.. How are they going stick with something that's idea?? And you're right about language
They agree that a woman is a person who chooses to identify as a woman. A person's gender identity is not necessarily the same gender that was assigned to them at birth.
@@jarblewarble nope
@@allenoverall7361 Do they not agree that there is such a thing as gender identity, or that transgender people exist? 🤔
"Your woke is all about puttin on a dress my woke stay strapped with a Kevlar vest"
Bars
This was really well done.
Thank You!
Thank you for explaining your definition, a lot of channels are afraid of doing that. This goes into how I watched the 1988 film Willow to prepare for the 2022 series, it was so bad because the critics were too positive, episode 1 didn't have the main character it, I doubt that you would have openly LGBTQ characters around during that time, and characters had inconsistent accents.
🙏🏾
Just started watching your videos bru, love your channel ❤ Im here cause T Hassan shared your video 💪🏾
Thank You sir
I want to like the Black Captain America... but your right, he is just being used as a political tool. They didn't need to make his like that.
It cheapens his character tbh now he’s used as political construct to promote heavily leftist ideas and agendas. And that goes for other characters who are written this way.
I was even called “misogynistic” because I dared to want female characters to be written equally as their male counterparts with depth and character development
Blame Kevin Feige for stealing the MCU from Ike Perlmutter and turning it into an ESG Money Laundering Machine 🤷🏽♂️
From the last 5 years, you can heavily tell that his fingerprints are all over it and that he was never the one that actually “guided the MCU”…but merely the guy who got too big of a head from his ability to take orders from the real mastermind and implement them.
Until they turned on said mastermind and hyped him up to ensure the guy guiding him would be deposed and Feige instead being the one in charge. Feige and Victoria Alonso…until Alonso was fired WITH CAUSE from Marvel Studios for her incompetence and the perception she brought of “making the MCU into a propaganda machine”.
Fun Fact: Victoria Alonso was the “she-nius” that came up with the idea to replace existing characters with the newer and better-er female/it versions by referring to the beloved characters as “mantles”. She referred to this strategy as “The Mantle System”…and it was heavily supported by Kevin Feige himself.
Another great video! Thank you.
Thank You
In short? It’s just the latest buzzword that means “thing/things/person/people I don’t like that/whom I just want to dismiss summarily without having to think about it.”
For me it’s always been an abundance of liberal ideology…like. The example you gave in Falcon and Winter Soldier promoting open borders
Radical feminism in She hulk..Barbie movie..and almost every piece of Marvel and Disney media out now where the woman is always stronger smarter more capable etc
Or pushing LGBT propaganda such as in Eternals or strange world especially among our people
Bingo
@@laymansjournal it’s a shame we don’t see strong black men in the household anymore on TV like Jame Evans..George Jefferson..Phillip Banks..Carl Winslow I doubt shows like that would ever get green lit again…but I bet if you pitch an idea of a single mother raising 3 kids with her girlfriend and one of the kids are apart of the rainbow community Hollywood would jump all over that lol
@@laymansjournalwhy are you showing up on my feed? Not Bingo please stop trying to be an educator. How are you even a Black Man and you are misconstruing information. Then you are referencing fantasy show where people can make up a roster of characters and their settings.
The Critical Drinker did a video on this subject a while back, and I think his take was probably the one I would most identify with; having shit like lgbt characters, female protagonists, or characters of differing race, colour or creed isn't woke, but when all of that shit gets politicised, and becomes the entire basis of a show, movie, or game above anything else (such as quality writing, competent storytelling and likable characters), thats when it becomes "woke". I mean, no one had a problem with the Terminator or Alien films because they took the time to make their respective protagonists likeable, made them people who you wanted to see succeed, but then compare them to shit like captain marvel, who's only defining characteristic seems to be that she does not possess a penis.
Thank you for showing me that I am not alone. Thank you also for mentioning Dr. T. Hasan Johnson.
Well the whole point of Bruce's hulk was that his was uncontrollable. Every other hulk has control of there's.
I'm 51 seconds so far. And I can already tell you that "woke" basically means liberal/leftist ideology
Should watch the video.
@@gabrielmeth4844 i watched the whole video. My definition still stands.
@@liveone11probably should watch it again in that case, while paying better attention.
@@dirtyace1668 i dont need to. i dont see any right leaning person using the term "woke"
My favorite woke nonsense is that whatever a man can do, a woman can do better, not equal but better. Which is BS, because we are not the same, we do not want the same things, and societal expectations are different as well.
Exactly.
I think of woke as this: whatever is understood to be normal is flipped on it's head and becomes a "new normal". Almost like a absurd alternate dimension.
Unfortunately words do mean different things to different people. I don't get why people are so bothered about defining Woke. When a person uses it you can understand what they mean based on context.
Because different groups take a word or phrase which had a specific meaning and use and alter it without actually understanding the meaning or context. The term woke/ stay woke was used by African Americans b4 the 60’s to be aware of specifically racial prejudices in ur surrounding area especially when living/ traveling threw parts of the south. That was it. Be aware. And now the way ppl go back and forth with it they see it as ignorance or a way to push an agenda. BLM may have projected the term but they didn’t creat it. And they really didn’t project it either as the term was used heavily on black Twitter b4 everyone else got to it
One of the things I loved about Into and Across The Spider-Verse it's just Miles struggling with everyday teenage life while being a superhero.
I agree. which is why I do NOT consider the cinematic version of Miles Morales to be woke. He's just a regular person
4:30. Sam Wilson was an interesting character and an inventive Captain America. But it was distracting that it became so much about him being black. "A Black man carrying the stars and strips"? there have been many black men who have carried the stars and stripes. 07:59... great response!
The Duality Of Swapping & Legacy In Fiction…
For me I have a mixed more nuanced view on the subject. I believe we should have version based adaptations of art that stay true to source material in many ways for fans and audiences that want accuracy in storytelling, writing with characterization especially when it comes to Casting actors and actresses in quality storytelling writing and good characterization for the sake of entertainment but at the same time I’m also open to version based adaptations of art that take some liberties from source material in storytelling, writing with characterization granted that even with some changes in detail the overall story still holds true to the source material and that in casting actors or actresses can be picked purely based on their skill in performance and not based on their race or gender. On top of that this can all only work in my mind if the quality of the storytelling, writing and characterization is done well. In order to even do this though they’re should be no racial or gender bias on what’s ok to be swapped and what isn’t. This is the maintain consistency which hasn’t been shown with the mainstream. If some of its ok. All of its ok. Complaints about white washing make no sense if your fine with any other kind of swapping when it comes to fiction or non fiction based art. This means cutting out the modern woke over emphasis of racial & gender inclusion or diversity pandering that is often used when doing these things in modern projects. If these things are fine to do because race and gender doesn’t matter compared to skill and performance like I truly do believe but some modern SJW’s claim to also believe then saying your doing this more for racial and gender inclusion or diversity more then anything else also doesn’t make sense. Your holding up the race and gender mattering argument while saying it doesn’t. The same goes for those who prefer characters that are accurate to the original stories , writing and characterization when it comes to any source material. If your fine with changes to characters when it comes to casting or anything else on certain levels then that does risk weakening your argument to some extent if not completely shattering it unless you open your point to a more nuanced conclusion. There’s honestly a nuanced duality to this argument that holds true on both ends that I think is not seen due to the accusations of being racist, and sexist for having issues with this by modern wokeness and it’s followers.
I hate the term… racist ppl use it to include racism within it and the calling out of racism.
Damn that story about the girl you simped for was wild.😂
Unfortunately, TONS of men have had a similar experience... but only a few are willing to openly admit it. It's a shameful thing for a man to open his heart, walk a straight and narrow path with a woman, only to find out she was duping him the whole time. It's a deeply shameful thing for men to admit.
@@ChineduOpara true
Everyone has that ONE.
The left knows what it means but like CRT are playing dumb semantic games. Just short circuit them asking what "woke" means by saying "far left" since that is usually what people mean and you sidestep the game playing. People said "woke" as a placeholder because many people and content creators wanted to avoid "political" labels so their content was not labelled as "conservative" or political. But if the left wants to play games and force you to say it is far left so you have to call it the real political ideology that it is, just embrace it.
Wokenes: an overcorrection to our great grandparents biggotry.
Their were a lot of Black people in Europe during the early Renaissance era. They throw black people in these movies to mock the black rulership that existed back then. They know that most black people today have no idea that blacks ruled in Europe for centuries. If you ever visit certain places in Europe, they still have black paintings and statues of noble blacks that use to rule the lands.
The Duality Of Swapping & Legacy In Fiction…
I only mind race and gender swapping when they say they’ll stay completely true to the source material because at that point I just expect the source material on screen but if they make an adaptation that is close to the source material but they admit they’ll take some liberties I won’t be mad that can be done well because it has been done before and worked for me, the only time I get mad is if they say they’ll stay completely true to the source material or say they’ll just take some liberties but they’ll stay close to it but they do neither and take major liberties and the core behind their changes is because of modern wokeness and nothing else that will piss me off. Modern wokesters have no interests in race blind casting. Because that means they can’t point out how they’re being diverse and inclusive or target certain groups based on their race or gender for casting. To actually do race or gender blind casting means the modern woke concept to casting wouldn’t work. That means any female characters or minority character can be race swapped to be white characters or male characters as much as it can be done for white characters & male characters. Honestly someone like me is willing to break the barriers that modern wokesters don’t want to. Race and gender swapping doesn’t matter as much to me as the skill and performance but in order to do that means that they’re are no double standards or hypocrisy that modern SJW’s love to commit. If we’re breaking all barriers let’s break all barriers. I know they don’t want to because they still want to complain about white washing yet they’re completely fine when it’s the other around. Either it doesn’t matter or it does matter. The funny thing is that race or gender swapping wouldn’t be so bad and could be good if they stayed true to the core of the original characters and made them unique in well written ways of quality so they just wouldn’t be the token version of an original character more Miles from Into The Spiderverse and less Miles from The current Woke Marvel comics where he has decent moments but overall fails as a character with the woke shitty writing attempts.
Samuel L Jackson’s version of Nick Fury is a very good example. In The 1610 Ultimate Universe of Marvel Comics before The MCU started they wanted to make their doppelgänger of Nick Fury in that Parallel/Alternate Universe to have the likeness of Samuel L Jackson so they made that version look like SLJ while still having the personality and character of The Original Nick Fury from The Main Marvel Comics Universe Of 616. He wasn’t just made to be a black token version of Nick’s character they’re was actual intent and effort put into it that made it work beyond bland swapping with only the perverted version of “diversity” & “inclusion” in mind.
They even played with this concept in The Main 616 Marvel Universe where The Original Nick Fury fell in love with a fellow agent and had a son becoming Nick Fury Sr. His son Marcus Johnson adopts his father’s role as head of shield and takes The name Nick Fury becoming Nick Fury Jr.
Both of these work because the intent wasn’t just to make a token version of an original established character and as a result even a lot of old fans accept it or tolerate it.
If Token based characters had good quality in them in terms of making them unique while staying true to the core of the original character they can work, like the great performance Vondie Curtis Hall did for Ben Urich, his version of the character is a black version of Ben Urich but he had great quality behind the writing of his character, his performance was a stellar god send and he was more then just a tokenized version of an older side character for Daredevil.
The same can be said for Michael Clarke Duncan’s performance as Wilson Fisk/The Kingpin.
His performance matches the ruthless, cold and strategic sadistic character that often is The Kingpin from the comics while he is technically a tokenized version of The Kingpin’s original character in the comics his portrayal was pretty good for what it was.
Token characters can work based off the quality of the writing or interesting traits you give them while having them stay unique to the core of the character but if you just make a tokenized character just to be “diverse” & “inclusive” with no substance but woke nonsense, lazy writing you get Miles Morales’s Thor.
The same could be said for characters like early She Hulk, & early Batgirl, early Supergirl & such.
These examples show that with good writing & effort initial token based characters can grow to be more then what they are.
They often fit The Legacy Characters category. Whether Token, or not Legacy characters are made to be an extension of the original characters story, they can written well like Batman Beyond or written horribly woke style like Jane Foster’s version of Thor.
This issue has been around for a long time fans older or younger that prefer the original or Iconic characters have complained about them being replaced this often happens with mantle legacy storylines. Now you can do a good legacy storyline with a mantle but often it doesn’t last that long.
This isn’t an issue of racism because when new characters would take up the mantle of big time heroes people complained. Many Fans didn’t like Dick Grayson becoming Nightwing and Jason Todd being The New Robin when that started.
Fans were interested Dick Grayson becoming Batman but didn’t want that storyline to remain permanent eventually wanting Bruce Wayne to come back as Batman. Fans were excited to see John Stewart introduced as another Green Lantern fighting along side Hal Jordan but fans weren’t happy when John Stewart eventually replacing Hal Jordan as Green Lantern of earth.
Fans didn’t want Superboy Conner Kent or Johnathan Kent taking Clark’s place as Superman at least not permanently. Miles Morales was popular at the start of his initial run but eventually fans just wanted to see Peter Parker again and many storylines of Peter & Miles teaming up were accepted while stories focusing on Miles on his own whether they were good or bad were heavily criticized.
Fans generally don’t like change especially when the legacy character no matter how well written they are can’t match up to The Iconic or Original version in terms of quality. The main issue with legacy characters is while they can get very good stories with the effort put in eventually some level of the status Quo has to return to satisfy audiences. This is why most legacy stories that are final out comes to a long running franchise as usually if not always are what if multiverse stories when it comes to comics or anything else. You can write a great legacy story or you can completely screw it up but often regardless those legacy characters can’t replace the originals or Iconic versions for good because many fans will want the original back at some point this is the reality of any legacy character regardless of their race and gender. Kyle & Guy got flak for not being Hal Jordan.
Hal Jordan was criticized at times for not being Alan. Accusing fans of racism for not liking changes like this will often lead to fans getting pissed off and no longer supporting the story as Customers this often the problem with current media and society.
Another flaw is when legacy stories are attempted with bad quality in an attempt to grab the current generation and be Woke/PC often not just leading to the main audience no longer supporting the franchise and new audiences not being interested that’s when things fall apart.
The lesson we can learn here is that legacy stories can be well made and legacy characters can be interesting with hard work and good writing put in but eventually they’ll have to be sidekicks, partners basically secondary characters to the original or iconic versions that came before because they can never truly replace them for people this is why Gohan could never take Goku’s place at the end of Dragon Ball like Akira wanted originally after The Cell Saga or why Anakin wasn’t Luke for some fans during the original trilogy despite being a prequel character. For a new character that you want to have their own status has to always be original because while legacy characters can be well made they’ll always just be legacy characters to people which is just another version.
Batman Beyond despite how well made he is still Batman Beyond not Batman even if he’s called that in universe. No one ever truly replaces Bruce Wayne for people just like no one ever truly replaces Steve Rogers or Peter Parker. Further evidence of this is people getting pissed that T’Challa was replaced by his sister as Black Panther people didn’t like that either and The Black Panther comics were going downhill at that point anyway. Don’t call fans racist because they prefer what came before it’s just normal for humans.
Legacy characters can be made and I’m behind them being made because I always loved legacy stories as a matter of fact I’m one of the few old comic book fans that believes you can make these new legacy characters in DC & Marvel good if you strip out all the modern wokeness and actually put great writing quality behind them but they can never fully replace the original or iconic characters and they have to be mainly side characters in that original or iconic Mythos they can still have solo stories but they have to tie back into that particular Mythos so while fans can enjoy these new characters and other new characters with better creative writing put in they can still enjoy the original and /or iconic characters that mean so much to them with better interesting creative writing.
The only new characters that should fully have their own status like the originals and or Iconic ones should be the new original characters that have their own identity. If legacy characters transition from mantle sidekicks & secondary characters to their own full identities then the same applies and if they’re are characters that start off as new original characters and go to a mantle of an older original and or iconic character the same rule of side character/secondary/sidekicks applies.
I believe that will solve the problem for older and newer audiences. No more replacing, and no more changing or downgrading characters to replace them either.
“As the indefatigable 92-year-old
superhero conjurer and Marvel Comics
chairman emeritus sees it, fan backlash
up until this point hasn't so much been
spurred on by racism as much as
unyielding fealty to the source material.
"They're outraged not because of any
personal prejudice, Lee says. "They're
outraged because they hate to see any
change made on a series and characters
they had gotten familiar with. In Spider-
Man, when they got a new actor, that
bothered them, even though it was a
white actor. I don't think it had to do with
racial prejudice as much as they don't like
things changed.”
“I wouldn't mind. if Peter Parker had originally
been black. a Latino, an lndian or anything else that he stay that way. But we originally made him white. I dont see any reason to change that. It has nothing to do with being anti-gay, or anti-black, or anti-Latino, or anything like that. Latino characters should stay Latino. The Black Panther should certainly not be Swiss. I just see no reason to change that which has already been established when it's so easy to add new characters.”-Stan Lee
The hilarious hypocrisy of modern wokesters is they’re happy with any race or gender swap of an already established character and anyone who isn’t is an ist or phobic but when you take an already established non white or non male character and change to them to be white or male they get angry. Someone got attacked for showing fan art of a white black Panther and they attacked marvel’s what if series for showing a Peggy Carter version of Captain America because they thought she was replacing Sam Wilson’s version of Captain America let’s not forget the fact that they were mad and calling some fans racists for not liking T’Challa having Peter Quill’s role as Star Lord in a What If Episode but now they’re mad that Peggy Carter’s version of Captain America is racist because they think Marvel intended her to replace Sam Wilson’s role of Captain America.
I’m not even one that’s mad at a T’Challa version of star lord or a Peggy Carter version of Steve Rogers, What If is a multiverse comic run and show.
Those also could be interesting what if’s
but the point is If your gonna make a token or non token legacy character you’ll have to make them unique but still stay true to the core of the character. They’re has to be more to them then just being another version of an original character and they have to be very well written.
They can’t replace the original or iconic version so they must be secondary and if you want a character who fully stands on their own with quality writing and such not having to be overly reliant on an original or iconic character make them a new original character. If we can have a what if where T’Challa became Star Lord we can have a what if where Peter Quill became Black Panther, if we can have Sam Wilson take up the mantle of Captain America after Steve Rogers then we can have a what if where Peggy is another version of Captain America out there in The vast Multiverse but the primary versions of Peter, Sam & Peggy should be them as their original character selves while mantle legacy stories and alternate versions should remain secondary always. Avoiding Modern wokeness is the best step forward to better art. The funny thing is that race or gender swapping wouldn’t be so bad and could be good if they stayed true to the core of the original characters and made them unique in well written ways of quality so they just wouldn’t be the token version of an original character more Miles from Into The Spiderverse and less Miles from The current Woke Marvel comics where he has decent moments but overall fails as a character with the woke shitty writing attempts.
Samuel L Jackson’s version of Nick Fury is a very good example. In The 1610 Ultimate Universe of Marvel Comics before The MCU started they wanted to make their doppelgänger of Nick Fury in that Parallel/Alternate Universe to have the likeness of Samuel L Jackson so they made that version look like SLJ while still having the personality and character of The Original Nick Fury from The Main Marvel Comics Universe Of 616. He wasn’t just made to be a black token version of Nick’s character they’re was actual intent and effort put into it that made it work beyond bland swapping with only the perverted version of “diversity” & “inclusion” in mind.
They even played with this concept in The Main 616 Marvel Universe where The Original Nick Fury fell in love with a fellow agent and had a son becoming Nick Fury Sr.
His son Marcus Johnson adopts his father’s role as head of shield and takes The name Nick Fury becoming Nick Fury Jr.
Both of these work because the intent wasn’t just to make a token version of an original established character and as a result even a lot of old fans accept it or tolerate it.
If Token based characters had good quality in them in terms of making them unique while staying true to the core of the original character they can work, like the great performance Vondie Curtis Hall did for Ben Urich, his version of the character is a black version of Ben Urich but he had great quality behind the writing of his character, his performance was a stellar god send and he was more then just a tokenized version of an older side character for Daredevil. The same can be said for Michael Clarke Duncan’s performance as Wilson Fisk/The Kingpin.
His performance matches the ruthless, cold and strategic sadistic character that often is The Kingpin from the comics while he is technically a tokenized version of The Kingpin’s original character in the comics his portrayal was pretty good for what it was.
Token characters can work based off the quality of the writing or interesting traits you give them while having them stay unique to the core of the character but if you just make a tokenized character just to be “diverse” & “inclusive” with no substance but woke nonsense, lazy writing you get Miles Morales’s Thor.
The same could be said for characters like early She Hulk, & early Batgirl, early Supergirl & such.
These examples show that with good writing & effort initial token based characters can grow to be more then what they are.
They often fit The Legacy Characters category. Whether Token, or not Legacy characters are made to be an extension of the original characters story, they can written well like Batman Beyond or written horribly woke style like Jane Foster’s version of Thor.
This issue has been around for a long time fans older or younger that prefer the original or Iconic characters have complained about them being replaced this often happens with mantle legacy storylines. Now you can do a good legacy storyline with a mantle but often it doesn’t last that long. This isn’t an issue of racism because when new characters would take up the mantle of big time heroes people complained. Many Fans didn’t like Dick Grayson becoming Nightwing and Jason Todd being The New Robin when that started. Fans were interested Dick Grayson becoming Batman but didn’t want that storyline to remain permanent eventually wanting Bruce Wayne to come back as Batman. Fans were excited to see John Stewart introduced as another Green Lantern fighting along side Hal Jordan but fans weren’t happy when John Stewart eventually replacing Hal Jordan as Green Lantern of earth. Fans didn’t want Superboy Conner Kent or Johnathan Kent taking Clark’s place as Superman at least not permanently. Miles Morales was popular at the start of his initial run but eventually fans just wanted to see Peter Parker again and many storylines of Peter & Miles teaming up were accepted while stories focusing on Miles on his own whether they were good or bad were heavily criticized. Fans generally don’t like change especially when the legacy character no matter how well written they are can’t match up to The Iconic or Original version in terms of quality. The main issue with legacy characters is while they can get very good stories with the effort put in eventually some level of the status Quo has to return to satisfy audiences. This is why most legacy stories that are final out comes to a long running franchise as usually if not always are what if multiverse stories when it comes to comics or anything else. You can write a great legacy story or you can completely screw it up but often regardless those legacy characters can’t replace the originals or Iconic versions for good because many fans will want the original back at some point this is the reality of any legacy character regardless of their race and gender. Kyle & Guy got flak for not being Hal Jordan. Hal Jordan was criticized at times for not being Alan. Accusing fans of racism for not liking changes like this will often lead to fans getting pissed off and no longer supporting the story as Customers this often the problem with current media and society.
Another flaw is when legacy stories are attempted with bad quality in an attempt to grab the current generation and be Woke/PC often not just leading to the main audience no longer supporting the franchise and new audiences not being interested that’s when things fall apart.
The lesson we can learn here is that legacy stories can be well made and legacy characters can be interesting with hard work and good writing put in but eventually they’ll have to be sidekicks, partners basically secondary characters to the original or iconic versions that came before because they can never truly replace them for people this is why Gohan could never take Goku’s place at the end of Dragon Ball like Akira wanted originally after The Cell Saga or why Anakin wasn’t Luke for some fans during the original trilogy despite being a prequel character. For a new character that you want to have their own status has to always be original because while legacy characters can be well made they’ll always just be legacy characters to people which is just another version. Batman Beyond despite how well made he is still Batman Beyond not Batman even if he’s called that in universe. No one ever truly replaces Bruce Wayne for people just like no one ever truly replaces Steve Rogers or Peter Parker. Further evidence of this is people getting pissed that T’Challa was replaced by his sister as Black Panther people didn’t like that either and The Black Panther comics were going downhill at that point anyway. Don’t call fans racist because they prefer what came before it’s just normal for humans.
Legacy characters can be made and I’m behind them being made because I always loved legacy stories as a matter of fact I’m one of the few old comic book fans that believes you can make these new legacy characters in DC & Marcel good if you strip out all the modern wokeness and actually put great writing quality behind them but they can never fully replace the original or iconic characters and they have to be mainly side characters in that original or iconic Mythos they can still have solo stories but they have to tie back into that particular Mythos so while fans can enjoy these new characters and other new characters with better creative writing put in they can still enjoy the original and /or iconic characters that mean so much to them with better interesting creative writing. The only new characters that should fully have their own status like the originals and or Iconic ones should be the new original characters that have their own identity. If legacy characters transition from mantle sidekicks & secondary characters to their own full identities then the same applies and if they’re are characters that start off as new original characters and go to a mantle of an older original and or iconic character the same rule of side character/secondary/sidekicks applies. I believe that will solve the problem for older and newer audiences. No more replacing, and no more changing or downgrading characters to replace them either.
“As the indefatigable 92-year-old
superhero conjurer and Marvel Comics
chairman emeritus sees it, fan backlash
up until this point hasn't so much been
spurred on by racism as much as
unyielding fealty to the source material.
"They're outraged not because of any
personal prejudice, Lee says. "They're
outraged because they hate to see any
change made on a series and characters
they had gotten familiar with. In Spider-
Man, when they got a new actor, that
bothered them, even though it was a
white actor. I don't think it had to do with
racial prejudice as much as they don't like
things changed.”
“I wouldn't mind. if Peter Parker had originally
been black. a Latino, an lndian or anything else that he stay that way. But we originally made him white. I dont see any reason to change that. It has nothing to do with being anti-gay, or anti-black, or anti-Latino, or anything like that. Latino characters should stay Latino. The Black Panther should certainly not be Swiss. I just see no reason to change that which has already been established when it's so easy to add new characters.”-Stan Lee
Jeez! That Black Cap dialog is 'Cringe' with a capital 'C'. (You followed that up with She Hulk's diatribe? lol)
Im not a black man, but even I saw through the stupidity you spoke about happening in captain america. I was really dissapointed in what could have been a great arc in marvels story telling.
The word woke had an original meaning of waking up literally then it started to be used metaphorically as the term had morphed into having your mind opened to whatever “true reality” you thought/believed society or the world didn’t want you realize. Far Left leaning political ideologies coined it eventually and it was somewhat used for topics like social Justice whether it was racial or gender based, for those historical reasons I’ve always come to use the word modern woke instead of woke because despite the connection between the two the various but similar definitions we give modern woke aren’t a complete 1 to 1 with what it originally meant. You can have racial or gender activist who are strong in their beliefs criticize what current wokeness is these days in society even though their beliefs at one point was apart of what woke used to mean. Similar to the generations of racial Social Justice Warrriors and gender Social Justice Warrriors ie feminists changing over time, current day Modern SJW’s are the extreme descendants of these ideologies (and I say ideologies because they are , that isn’t said positively or negatively, whatever opinions anyone has on them is fine but like any mindset for better or worse they are ideologies so the term isn’t being used as an insult right now just being objective.) and they have used them to take their beliefs and approaches to human society to the extreme, because of that I define modern wokeness we see today as progressive extremism. The issue isn’t there beliefs in themselves it’s often that they take these beliefs to a dangerous extreme that turns many people off because of that they view others who are indifferent to them or in disagreement with them as the enemy. When it comes to current day entertainment they take the extremism of their beliefs beyond the purpose of the entertainment.
Great Storytelling:
Great storytelling is what’s important.
The Stories that aren’t political at all and are based on good writing, good characters , deeper lessons, morals and entertainment
as well as the stories that do have political elements but are more focused on an engaging story,a well thought out lesson or idea behind it and interesting characters are the stories that make great entertainment. As my film teacher taught me Art before politics, always. The story & characters comes first whether the politics are subtle, secondary or completely non existent.
There are two types of great stories when it comes to this method: stories that are apolitical with great characters, writing & moral lessons or none, and then there are stories that have political elements but put the quality of the writing and characters, & moral lessons first. Whether either type of story is apolitical or has political elements deep philosophy, morality, & mythology can often play a role in sharpening the story, once you form your morals for a story into ideas over just using them for government or social policy statements you can grab anyone within an audience no matter who they are or what they believe that is the gift of good storytelling
Modern SJW’s unfortunately don’t have that gift because for them there is nothing deeper then the physical realm they see and often hate so instead of forming deep intelligent universal themes or ideas through the magic of storytelling they try to bend those themes or ideas to their will ,thoughts and beliefs.
They can’t form their morals into ideas so often they come off as just government or policy statements without the feeling of anything deeper to an audience turning most people off whether they do or don’t agree with them or are indifferent to begin with.
Most evil thing ever
God I'm so happy they canceled She Hulk... Now let's please bring back Luke Cage!
3 days ago 😮
More on Sarah please
9:15
You mean Jewish person right?
Why not just say it?
You know, I don't think it's the fact that it's "woke" I think it's the fact that it is "preachy" it is cynically thrown in there to look good and nothing else, shallow tokenism. Now my issue with these arguments is that some people think that *ALL* forms of inclusion has the same intention of being preachy and cynically thrown in for token brownie points, and that makes me self conscious as an artist.
Okay wait, about that black dude in Game of Thrones; that series is about as fictional as King Arthur, which by the way, had African knights named sir Moreon and Feirefiz. Also dragons didn't exist in medieval times, so it seems kinda sussy you would say that dragons are okay but not black people.
Disney destroyed my GOAT, Sam Wilson. 😢
8:44
I'd say including that in your video is pretty "woke".
For me the propaganda make it woke. ,Got ain't woke while rings of Power definitly is.
Like i often say im woke but 1970's
You ask what is woke the defined it without giving ur sources or ample ideas on what it meant.... eh
Samuel Wilson aka The Falcon has been an African American man since maybe the early 80's or earlier. I didn't give a dislike for that mistake, rather for claiming that the character's race was changed for the MCU. Mayhaps you are confusing him with Nick Fury played by Samuel L Jackson, who is Marvelously more fitting than David Hasslehoff. Sam Jackson and Anthony Mackie do not look alike.
I watched up to 6:24, and I won't bother watching the rest. I could try to understand why the world's smallest violin was played during the scene of Sam Wilson asking them not to call the Flagsmashers "terrorists", but I believe I know the answer.
This video almost started out positive, but got to be condescending in a subtle juvenility. I am not a soft skinned snowflake, but I expected a clear definition of woke from it's inception in as early as the 1920's when it was used by African American citizens who I believe this video wishes to demonize.
That and the CashApp ( Get money over everything else, I'm not hatin ) information scroll has me thinking this video is clickbait.
Not trying to be rude about it. If my opinion is informative and appreciated, cool, thank you and you are welcome. ✌🏿
It gets so much easier to define woke once you realize it’s actually an acronym: Weaponized Oppression Kink and Empathy.
Where the hell did you get this dumb shit from?
🤣
We can have giants, dragons, talking animals, but we draw the line because black people into even tho they real
Sam wilson AKA new cap, he is from the comic books.
But the one you see in that show bears very little resemblance to the one in the comic. His early moments in the MCU are closer to the source material
@@jameydunne3920 agreed, Sam in M CU was a friend of Rodgers. a good man much like Steve which is why he chose him. he lost me after that. im done.