The Locomotive is the 50 3616 from Schwarzenberg from the Saxon Railway Friends Association Or VSE 😅 as we call it ITs almost fresh Out of the RAW Meiningen where she got a full overhaul that Took around six and a half years 😅 Sorry for blabering and for the grammer i Speak better than i write The only thing i can Tell you about this is that it only was a 7 day Protest we from VSE wished that our Lok could do more but its still a museums Lok so 😅 We were Happy to Help them with there loads and that she could pull more than the normal five to six passanger Cars
@@tobiasbruckner373 You should get with the folks that run the repair shop for the steam trains in his trip video... Looks like the can make there own parts, so they might have what it takes to make the parts you need... Never know if they can help, but never hurts to ask.... I hope you get lucky and they can help :)
@@jonathanbair523the Problem in bringing 94 2105 Back to runing conditon is not that we dont want it she is the Last of her kind so it would be awsome but the Problem is funding 50 3616s overhaul was fundet with donations and the Museum revenue it was almost 3 milion Euro and the know how to do this Class of Locomotives but 94 2105 is a Saxonian XI HT from 1923 so we keep trying an If she cant come Back we try 75 501 a Saxonian XIV HT from 1915
Are you a German native speaker? I'm interested in the exact nuance of "Schienenweg." You used "rails," which gets the idea across, but "rails" would strictly speaking just be "Schienen" wouldn't it? Duden says Schienenweg is "Gleis (als Verbindung zwischen Orten)," so something similar to "Gleis" (track) or a track/line, but I want to understand this better.
@@rdreher7380 "Schienenweg" is rails as infrastructure, "Schiene" is Rails as an Item and "Gleis" I would best describe as an administrative term. And yes my native language is German but I'm Swiss so there are quite a few discrepancies.
@@burnerheinz Thank you, Danke schön. Schienenweg was a new word to me, and the dictionary translated it as "railway/railroad." However I knew that Eisenbahn is the usual word for a railway/railroad, so I was confused. I don't think we have a word in English that maps one-to-one with that word, but "rails/tracks/rail lines," all seem close.
As for how this happens? These freight services are operated by small private companies that own or lease their motive power and buy "Trassen", spot trackage use slots from the rail infrastructure companies, which, all else being equal, is usually DB. The network between those companies and the rail preservation scene is pretty tight knit. Foamers do be working on the railroad. So the person booking freight movements during the week might very well be a volunteer at a local museum on the weekends. Somebody knows someone, people sit around after hours and bitch about the mess DB is making of the railroad, someone makes a half-serious jab about "might as well run it with a Class 50 at that point", and then things fall into place. Beauty of an open access rail market: as long as the choochoo meets the saftey requirements to operate in that secrion of track, and you as the operating company pay the infrastructure company the appropriate fees for running the train, what sort of traction you actually put on the service is your decision. So long as it the mod cons like air brakes and PZB (intermittent train control), nothing in the rulebook says it can't be a steam engine.
Yep, it's amazing how often they do this in Germany. I feel like they have steam doing revenue earning freight almost every year there. Sadly I also learn about it after the fact haha.
Fun sidefact: There are even some steam locos that have been equipped with modern ETCS systems so that they can run on high-speed mainlines. Not in germany yet though as PZB is still accepted as a minimum.
@@web1bastler currently only 60163 Tornado in the UK right? I occasionally follow the project, the results of that trial will probably be a big basis for ETCS conversions for heritage trains across the world. Here in the Netherlands research has already been done for mobile ETCS installations that you could swap around various locomotives when needed, sadly without positive results.
Looks like they need one of them fire locomotives that can burn brush along side and inside the track area, then it has its own water mist/water tended car to put out the fires as the loco's go down the track...
Imagine the call, Company: hey could we borrow your steam locomotive? museum/preservation group: Sure, but why?' Company: We want to protest government
Museum: "Sure thing. Give us an hour or so to make a few phone calls in order to get the crew together to run it." Because who doesn't like sticking it to the government? And rightfully so. the rail-network across the country is in woeful shape (although I'd reckon it is even worse in the eastern part of the country as a holdover from GDR-times).
By the way, the diesel at the end is also a museum piece. That's the class 107, a imported Czechoslovak CSD T435.0 from the early 1962's. It most likely helped pushing the train after they had trouble pulling the train with class 50.35 alone. There is a video that shows the same section of track seen at 9:16 with the steamer having a very bad time and having a lot of wheel slip.
It can pull it no problem, the Class 50 could pull 2,500 tons on the flat, they're super powerful machines. The reason for the wheelspin is that with very heavy loads it's a little more tricky to get the right regulator setting in the beginning with a steam loco (esp. under wet or damp conditions!), as you don't have as fine a throttle control as modern locos and there's no traction control system to help you either. As for why the 107 is at the back, it's there primarily to help with braking and just incase something goes awry with the old engine, and IIRC its a rule that you have to have newer diesel or electric loco at the back for loads over a certain weight just incase with these old engines. BUT ithey're not helping actually move the train, atleast not usually and definitely not in the video above, so infact the Class 50 is starting that 2000+ ton train all on its own in the video. Later on it does sound like the Diesel is on though, wether or not its actually pushing I don't know though.
Running revenue steam is really the perfect way to protest any railroad related problem if you think about it; People go out of their way to see and film Steam locomotives in action, especially when they're working in revenue service, the point of every protest is to make as many people aware of the problem you're protesting as possible so that something will be done about it, so putting the two together is an excellent way of accomplishing the goal of your protest.
@@bahnspotterEU If I found the correct values (length with uncompressed buffers): 22,94 m (BR 50) + 32 * 29,52 m (Sggmrrs)+ 12,56 m (DR V 75) = 980.14 m (3215 ft)
@@dommsevanschnitzel2732 not quiet correct the Sggmrrs waggons are double wagons so the 32 wagons are actually 16 wagons also the maximum lenght in germany for a train is 700m in total but still thanks for the research
Hi Hyce. A very basic and nasty internet translation of the placard is "1950s Railway Locomotives Protest Against the State of the [Rail] Infrastructure in the Thuringia Forest." The story (from the OG video description, commentary and a spot of wiki searching) seems to be that the State-owned private company providing rail infrastructure maintenance services on behalf of the German Federal Government, is not able to fully maintain the line at Themar in the State of Thuringia to a suitable state for freight haulage, and to reduce its resource burdens, has abruptly downgraded the status of track around that section. The little passenger shuttle railcars that run to Themar are unaffected, but freight haulage is limited to light, lower-capacity stock and locomotives. However, while the freight services are allegedly sporadic, it is quite clear what is lifted out of there (logs aren't light) isn't the sort of stuff that tolerates something a small shuttle car will float over. As the protesting company has pointed out, it's not viable to run their log trains using the little branch line units the lower track class requires. On-the-spot corrections and clarifications from any German watchers are most welcome and desired. I only wish I had the means (and an on-call roster of steam engines) to run Plandampf ops in Australia. For pleasure or to make a point...
The first words are „Rail ways“ (differ word than the usual for railways to specifically mean the right of way side of railways) and „Locomotives“ with the red box „as in 1950“, the rest is absolutely correct
@@Zyo117 They are actually quite common for infrastructure service provision in open access networks. The UK's Network Rail is another example. As is the Australian Rail Track Corporation. The Australian air traffic control and air navigation network is administered and maintained by the government-owned corporation Airservices Australia.
I'm from this area and for years there was a Event called "Plandampf". In Plandampf there were 3 to 5 steamengines pulling regular trains. You sould look a bit into this as well. You may find the right Videos under "Plandampf im Werratal". In germany there are still many steamengines that can run and in the area where this Video was filmed is the biggest an I think only Workshop that can complitly rebuilt steamengines, it's called the RAW Meiningen. This is one of the reasons why there are often events with steam there, like passenger excursions and Things like in the Video. I hope my Englisch is good enough that you can understand what i mean. Yours Großbahner
5:37 We aren't obligated to blow crossing signals when the railroad crossing has barriers. You could bring up the "What if they dont lower because the circuit or some other component is broken?" and you'd be right to do so. I don't understand it either. 6:20 "Trackwork like in 1950. Locomotives like in 1950. Protest against the infrastructure's [bad] state/condition in the Thuringian Forest" The whistle on the locomotive is a hooter (shocker I know) but I love this one because it sounds similar to E&P 4's hooter and we love Eureka.
Crossings in Germany are usually combined with Block Signals, "control Signal" or supervised by the Signals system, if the Crossing malfunctions the Signal(s) drops to a Stop aspect or the Signalman get a notification and can stop the Train via Radio call.
There actually is a special procedure in the case for a not closing crossing. The train driver gets notified either by the dispatcher responsible for the crossing or through a warning signal. If I'm remembering this right, the train has to stop before the crossing, give an acoustic attention signal (blow the whistle/horn), then approach the crossing in walking speed and when you reach the middle of the crossing go back to normal speed.
If the crossing is activated solely by a track circuit, there is a dedicated signal at braking distance which tells the train crew whether the crossing has activated. If it does not, the train must be brought to a stand short of the crossing and the train crew must attempt to activate it. If they can't, they must whistle, then proceed at walking pace until the crossing is occupied. In most cases, there will be a block/interlocking signal in rear of the crossing, with the signal interlocked such that it will not clear until the crossing is activated; or the dispatcher monitors the crossing by other means (e.g. cameras). If a failure develops, the train would be brought to a stand at the signal and advised by the dispatcher; the crew would then be authorised to pass the signal at stop, proceed to the crossing, and follow the same procedure as above. The one shown in the video, however, is manually operated by the train crew (the full video shows a clip of the switchman closing it); in such a case, the local rules will contain instructions to the effect of "all movements must stop short of the crossing at X and not proceed until protection is established".
Locomotive: I've been waiting for this for YEARS! I still got it! She was hauling 32 cars, three of which were empty. I wonder what the total weight of it was. Interestingly enough, I tried to see if I could find any info about her, but the only thing I found was her number on two lists of preserved locomotives in Germany, and both of them listed her as non working. This is the kind of protest I can get behind. ;) It's also a perfect example of why I DON"T want the US government to take control of our railroads. The class 1s have their issues, but they generally take care of their stuff. Well, most of the time, anyway. Meanwhile our government squabbles like a bunch of three years old fighting over the last piece of chocolate.
Regarding your question about train weight: When you assume the 29 loaded cars each use the full permitted axle loading of 18 t and the three empty cars each weigh about 20 t it comes out to nearly 2150 t.
I wish our government would finally re-nationalize DB... back when they were state owned they were world famous for punctuality and reliability, after they were forced to try and make a profit everything went to shit. Not that the German (passenger) rail network is anywhere near as bad as North America mind you. but compared to the rest of Europe we're a laughing stock at this point.
Well, having experienced most of your class 1 railroads aboard Amtrak, the German Branch line in this video is likely still in a better state than most US main lines (especially with Bnsf). DB and its subsidiaries, including infrastructure, are organised as private companies, with the government holding all shares. The issue isn't the government ownership per se, but rather a combination of massive lack of investment, strict regulations and local politics more often than not being an actual hindrance whenever anything is supposed to get done. Meanwhile, on US railroads you get thrown out of your bed at 2am because Amtrak yeets over badly maintained switches that at a stretch you might see on a tram line at 70 mph.
The class 1s take care of their ops so well that derailments don't get cleaned up for months, whole lines are left to degrade to a point where passenger services have to be halted due to too-low operating speeds and of course anything resembling more major infrastructure and rolling stock modernisation is impossible. Electrification? Track-straightening? Track multiplication? No way! The way I see it, the class 1s are holding rail transport hostage in the US. They are in the way of a modern, environmentally friendly and high-capacity rail network useful for both freight and passenger service.
The locomotive shown here is the 50 3616. She is a "Rekolok" built during DDR times in 1960. The class is the BR 50.35. She was in use during the DR times and was put out of service in the late 1980s. After the fall of the Iron Curtain, she was sold to the VSE Schwarzenberg,who is in her ownership until today. She mostly drives in Saxony,where she is still stationed in the Schwarzenberg Depot. She ran in museum service until ca. 2017,when her License to drive ceased and she needed to be overhauled. At that time,this was to much money for the VSE and she stayed out of service. Only recently,in 2023,she was finally overhauled in the RAW Meiningen workshop. She reentered service in late 2023. Since then,she is in working condition again. This video was half a year after her being put back into service. The VSE regulary uses her for driving museum trains mostly in Saxony.
For some fun context on when the last revenue steam run was done (at least in West Germany) was around 1976 or 1977 around the time my mom had joined the army and was stationed over there. When they got there they were told they had missed the last revenue steam run by 1 week so i may have to show this to my dad so he can see a revenue steam run in germany. Thank you for sharing this video with us and what a great way to celebrate Decapod month. Edit 32 cars on last part of clip. I asume same length for whole video
The last official revenue steam run in western germany was on the 26th of October, 1977. The east german railway had the last official revenue steam run on the 29th of October, 1988. But they used some of their steam locomotives for freight trains until 1989, in case that a diesel locomotive broke down and they didn´t have any other locomotives that could do the job etc. After that, there were no revenue steam runs in germany, except those that were organized by railroad clubs... until 2024, when shtf (again) and some railroad maintenance companies realized, that there is a shortage in working diesel locomotives, so they had to rent steam engines, train drivers and boilermen from railroad clubs. 🤣
@@deru-bahn6622 The one in April this year was a bit special because it wasn't planned at all (Plandampf is the planned freight trains for railfans). 58 311 (a sprightly 103 years old) came back from a steam meet and the diesel power on a 1600t concrete sleeper train was down. They were going the same route anyway and said f*** it why not. th-cam.com/video/VNDa-Gs97No/w-d-xo.html
@@deru-bahn6622 Interesting it was October 26th as thats my dads birthday. I couldn't remember exact date she was sent over to west Germany so that definitely helps there. I knew the East Germans kept steam running essentially till the fall of the Soviet Union but ya know at that time for luck seeing those if you're in the western block. I know Europe in general has quite the number of working steam locomotives so I would be curious who owns this particular one. Thanks for filling in the exact time gap there.
By the way: There was an experiment conducted in germany a few years ago about if steam locos could use wood pellets as fuel and how it influences the performance. The team made quite a good reportage about it so maybe you could give it a watch.
@@MrToradragon It worket very well, you just have to shovel quit a bit more but the scoops weren´t as heavy. Also the pellets had to be kept dry because if they got wet they started to expand and also the firebox and its door had to be modified.
Far as I understood, they basically went to a preservation club (there’s a bunch of clubs in Germany dedicated to keeping their steam locos mainline certified) and asked to borrow their loco (and crew)
I like how he is kinda headbanging to the sound. I mean, sure enough, the choochooo is some proper heavy metal, so it is kinda apt. Hmm... why am I now imagining some heavy metal band performing from a steam train? Ideally as part of the music somehow?
This was neat. I have to admit though, first thought on seeing the engine and then the cars was "Oh Lord, It's the ES&DT heading to the Sylva Paperboard"
So called “Plandampf” (Scheduled Steam) is always great. About 3 months ago there was some which just happened because it was convenient. A steam excursion was on its way back to Karlsruhe. It had to stop in Aschaffenburg. Due to some events, a freight haul had their scheduled locomotive and the backup unavailable. The freight haul was scheduled to go, you may guessed it from Aschaffenburg to Karlsruhe. When they found out that the Steam locomotive was doing the same route, they just boldly asked if they where willing to take the freight haul with them. The where going there anyway. It was a really heavy train. A really fun thing was, the tram which was filming this took later picked up the replacement fireman from a train station (with long distance passenger service) and shuttled him to the Steam locomotive roughly 60km south.
Student learning German's take on what the tender translates to: "railway locomotive protest against the infrastructure condition in the Thüringer forest." The red square translates to "like 1950." Anyone who speaks German fluently, please correct me, I want to learn.
I'm not that fluent, but I too studied German long ago. I can add two points: First is not a language thing but a graphic design thing. I think the words Schienenwege and Lokomotiven are to be read as separate from the phrase "Protest gegen..." Rather, they are meant to be read together with the "wie 1950" as part of both: "Schinenenwege wie 1950, Lokomotiven wie 1950," or "Schinenwege, Lokomotiven, [beide (both)] wie 1950." In other words, "Railway tracks like 1950, Locomotives like 1950." The second point is an interesting nuance of the the word Schienenweg. I too would love it if someone who knows German better than me could explain the nuance of this word, but this word seems to mean "tracks" (the physical thing that makes a railroad) rather than "railway/railroad" (the abstract concept of a particular rail transport network). The word Eisenbahn (f) is the closer translation to "railway/railroad." The part I don't get is that the word Gleis (n) also means "track." The Duden gives Schienenweg as "Gleis (als Verbindung zwischen Orten)" or "tracks, as a connection between points," so maybe similar to a "line." That's where my German knowledge falls short.
@@deru-bahn6622 Thank you, danke schön. Dictionaries often miss nuances like that, so it's very useful to get insight from native speakers. So the use of the word in the protest probably is meant to emphasize the out of date nature of the track conditions, sounds like.
Some fun facts about the rolling stock seen here: The Locomotive actually is a Museum locomotive. It got new cylinders a few years ago and I presume it is usually used for excursions. The diesel at the end is a historic locomotive too more or less, this is a soviet design from DDR times. Few of them are left in service. Contrasting to that are the waggons: They are pretty new Inno-freight waggons. Its a design that can be easily adapted to transport all sorts of things, logs, ore, shipping containers, etc. If you had made this Train on a moddle railway before this happend, people wo have yelled at you lol
The locomotive was designed and constructed in Czechoslovakia, not ussr. In fact, the prototype was heavily inspired by American switchers, but they used only the american type bogies on the stock engines. (well, even the bogies were changed with the later batches)
About the different types of tenders: The Class 50 obviously has a normal, conventional tender. One of the wartime simplifications was the "Wannentender" (tub tender) you saw on the Class 52s / Class 33s in Bosnia. Inspired by tank cars, these don't have a frame; the water tub is the main structural element. This saved material as well as weight - the T30 tub tender used on the Class 52 has a lower empty weight than the Class 50's T26 tender, while also being able to carry a little more water and coal. As such, they remained a valuable piece of equipment for a long time: Even when Class 52s left service post-war, their tenders stuck around, being given to some Class 50s, as well as upgrading around 700 of the smaller Class 38 (formerly Prussian P8) locomotives, which gave them a significantly larger range. Learned this from a lovely little TH-cam channel called Steel Bridge Models, I recommend checking it out! The locomotive, 50 3616, belongs to the "Verein Sächsischer Eisenbahnfreunde" or Club of Saxonian Railroad Enthusiasts. They operate a small museum, as well as the occasional excursion train. They bought 3616 from the former East German state railway in 1991 (the country was unified at that point, but it took a while longer for the railways to fully integrate) and have operated it ever since. As other commenters have mentioned, if you have the right permits and equipment, you can run on German main lines, and ties between the preservation community and "normal" railways are tight, so things like this happen every so often. And yes, East Germany kept using steam for a LONG time, in part because they had domestic coal deposits, but were short on money to import oil. The official last standard gauge steam service in the German Democratic Republic (incidentally also a Class 50) ran in *1988*, and steam locomotives were kept in reserve even after that.
Although DR did not fully quit steam until 1993 and Poland quit steam in 1994, which is why there are so many Ex Reichsbahn and PKP locos that are in good enough condition to be quickly restored to operation.
Context for english speakers: this protest was started because the railway line's maximum axle loading was downgraded due to poor track condition. This meant that less powerful locomotives had to be used, which weren't strong enough for what was needed. Because the track repair authorities have no plans to fix this, the protest was held. The name of it is "Railways and Locomotives like in 1950" alluding to poor track conditions in the immediate postwar era in the Soviet occupation zone, where a lot of infrastructure including locomotives and often rails themselves from single tracked double track main lines was taken to the Soviet Union.
This reminds me of an old documentary I saw on RFD TV as a kid, it was about this German railway in the 1980’s or 1990’s putting steam on the head of revenue commuter and freight trains for a festival. There were streamlined Pacifics and tank engines running double decker commuter trains and decapods running logging trains, it was so surreal to see.
In Germany we call Diesel Helpers Angstlok Fear Loco, the reason is that if Diesel Helpers are restricted, the club assumes that the locomotive will not make the route. It also often happens that clubs take over freight train services on the way back from special train trips. During the Riedbahn renovation, the BR 58 311 of the Ulm Railway Friends was rented to a track construction company due to a lack of locomotives.
Couple things: Wood cars: two cars are coupled together with fixed (but flexible) coupler, which can be decoupled only in cars repair shop. So the two cars are making a set, and they're counted as one car. Count the number of cars in the video and then divide it by two. That diesel helper on the end was made in Czechoslovakia, and under Comecon exported in Eastern Germany. These locomotives were meant as switchers in yards, short and light freight trains and light local passenger trains. Also the big factories with large internal railroad networks and sidings had them made from manufacturer.
Regarding the Blowing the whistle on railroad crossings: In Germany you have to blow your whistle/horn on crossings if they have no additional warnings for the road vehicles etc. with i.e. barriers. For the drivers, there is a sign at the Track with a "P" that signals that you have to blow the whistle/horn. You find it mostly on small/more remote tracks like in this video. Hope this helps and greetings from Germany :D
Apparently we’re not in Decapod Month, it’s our Decapod Era. (A Mike era would be nice as well.) my limited German got the gist of that tender painting, and it’s a poignant way of sending a message to the governing body. But still effective, as that big Class 50 HUSTLES. (Even if it has a big hoot.) The little diesel helper also has a pleasant International TD6 straightpipe exhaust note. Pulling a disc in 4th gear and wide open.
The adjacent signal boxes are a part of the problem, too. Built about 100-120 years ago, spares are scarce (most manufacturers don't even exist any more - since decades) and German railway safety authorities don't care if they discover a potentially harmful defect. They close down the whole signal box, which poses another threat to railway lines and rail operators alike.
If you think German Whistles sound like a Rio Grande Whistle then you might think the JNR (Japanese National Railways) Whistles sound like a Rio Grande 5-Chime.
Thera are a lot of questions here, i try to explain what happend: The owner of the track, the InfraGo, a part of DB (GErman Railroar Infrastructure), had a lot of problems to bring their tracks to useable conditions (i dont soeak of good...). In this case, on this rails route, they had a small part where they reduce the track class. A track class means, how much tons (per axle and per meter) a train can have maximal. Here we speak just about Axle Loading. Former it was 20tons+, what is the standard on 99% of german tracks. this track had an special permission, for the wood transports, that they can use a locomotive with 20tons axle load insteed of 18 tons. This permission was time limited and not extendend. So the standard loc for this was the BR 218 with 20tons per axle. And there are not a lot of powerful locomotives with less than 20t in Germany. For sure you can use a bunch of locomotives, but as a single one the BR50 is still the strongest one with 18 tons per axle. And yes, its not economically, but an great protest anyway.
Schienenwege = railway tracks Lokomotiven = locomotives Wie 1950 = [both] like 1950. Protest gegen den Infrustrukturzurstand im Thüringer Wald = Protest against the infrastructure conditions in the Thuringian Forest. It's been a while since I studied German, and it was fun for me to make sense of that protest sign. That first word in particular is interestingly confusing. Schienenweg (m) literally means "rail way/road," but that's not exactly the German word for "railroad," which would be Eisenbahn "iron trail." Eisenbahn (f) is more the abstract concept of a railroad as a system of transportation, while Schienenweg refers to the railroad as a physical entity, so like the "tracks." Except German has another word for railroad track, which is Gleis (n), which is confusing as heck. The Duden dictionary seems to suggest that Schienenweg is track "as a connection between points," so maybe more like a "line." I'd be very happy if someone who knows German better than me can explain this, hahaha.
"Schienenweg" is kind of analogous to "waterway" in English (except that it refers to railways, obviously): it's a more of an abstract term for railways/the railway system - you probably wouldn't use it to refer to a specific line and definitely not in the sense of "I work on the railway".
@@dkbmaestrorules I think "Eisenbahn" refers to the general concept of a railway, while "Schienenweg" refers to the actual thing - i.e. what the Britons call "permanent way", so the actual Schienen, the tracks. A (railway) line is referred to as a (Bahn)Strecke.
"Schienenweg" or the plural "Schienenwege" is more of a bureaucratic term that is used for the connection of two or several places via rails. "Der Schienenweg von Frankfurt nach Stuttgart" is not only one track between Frankfurt and Stuttgart but includes all technicalparts of the rail infrastructure between Frankfurt and Stuttgart. One Schienenweg can be made of several tracks and also includes all other technical parts needed like signals, overhead lines and so on. In this protest they don't just say "give us new tracks" but rather "do a complete work over of the network". If they'd say "Gleise wie 1950" it would be to much of a focus on the rails and ties.
OK, so there's already a lot in the comments about what was happening but I'll punt some more stuff in because why not? Firstly, the BR50 class 2-10-0s. These were a major German standard with 3,614 of these locomotives built between 1939 and 1948, with most built towards the end of World War II as simplified Class 50ÜK _Übergangskreigslokomotiven_ (provisional war locomotives). Producing 1,500hp/1118kW and with an axle loading of 15 tonnes, they're a real go-anywhere-do-anything type, so much so that the Germans tried saving as many as they could in 1945 - end result, the West German Bundesbahn had 2,159 on their books while the East German Reichsbahn _only_ got 350 (but instead got lots of Class 52 Kriegsloks which are really very oversimplified 50's). The locomotive in this clip, 50 3616, was built in 1940 and was one of the 208 Class 50's rebuilt as Class 50.35 by the Deutsche Reichsbahn between 1957 and 1962. To cut a long story short, the steel used in the original boilers wasn't particularly durable so the DR fitted new boilers, to a more modern design already being produced for the DR's Class 23.10 _Neubaulokomotiven_ (new design locomotives). A very easy giveaway that it's an East German locomotive is the shape of the feedwater heater cover - the East Germans preferred mixer-preheaters, which is what the trapezoidal cover between the stack and smokebox front is hiding. These days, it's owned by the Saxon Railway Friends Association/Verein Sächsischer Eisenbahnfreunde and (usually) runs occasional mainline passenger trips. Now for the protest part: from the VSE's own website, these log trains run between Schleusingen and Meiningen - the latter being home to a former railway workshops that are still capable of maintaining and even building new steam locomotives - but, because the line wasn't upgraded to carry the heavier axle loading of these trains, they had to be run under a regular exemption issued by the German national rail infrastructure provider, DB Netz. No upgrades ever got carried out though, and earlier this year DB InfraGo (successor to DB Netz) put axle load limits in place. So to protest this the company running the log trains, Railsystem AG, got together with the VSE and brought 50 3616 in to do the job for a week and make the problem very visible to the public! As for the diesel hanging off the back... it's 107 018, a former DR Class 107 diesel built in 1962 and owned by Railsystem. It's got an axle loading of 15.5 tonnes so was light enough to run to Schleusingen. What it isn't, however, is powerful enough to pull the train on its own - at 750hp/552kW, it's what Americans might call a 'road switcher' - great for moving short trains around a railyard or over medium distances, but doesn't have the huevos to get down on its knees and crawl with the big boys. My uninformed opinion based on the footage is that it was used to lead the train on the Meiningen-Scheusingen leg (faster than turning the 50 or running tender-first), and then served as a rear helper on the loaded return trips. Which tells you just how heavy these trains were! Links for the interested: *VSE's homepage (with links to the protest log train's timetable):* www.vse-eisenbahnmuseum-schwarzenberg.de/ *Railsystem fleet page (for 107 018):* www.railsystems-rp.de/lokomotiven/ I should also point out, as have others, that Germany is incredibly enlightened when it comes to running steam on the mainline compared to other Western nations. Not only do they allow steam on the national network, they even permit _Plandampf_ events - basically, planned steam operations where museum locomotives are allowed to haul regularly scheduled passenger *and even freight* trains. Not sure how common they are anymore, but they're a thing. I won't try to get into the details of that though, I'm not really conversant with the technicalities and whatnot. Anyways, apologies that's a bit of an epistle on steam, but in summary, the Germans really know how to make their point.
I bet the reason they don't blow the whistle for grade crossings is because they don't want to hear a loud screeching ear piercing whistle every three miles.
That's an Eastern German class 50 with a reconstruction boiler which you can recognize by the trapezoid shape above the front of the smokebox which is a mixing preheater. But you really must hand it to the guys at Meiningen Locomotive Works, where this BR 50 will certainly have passed through: They really know how to adjust a valve gear! Traditionally, this is done by indicating. There is some really nice footage from 2024 of a three cylinder class 58 hauling a train of concrete sleepers. WIthout a diesel for helping with the brakes. The title is "Awesome! Steam locomotive pulls heavy freight train in 2024!"
The “Ulmer Eisenbahnfreunde” possesses a DRG BR 58, formerly a Prussian G12, built in 1918. It’s a three cylinder 2-10-0 goods locomotive and was originally designed as a war locomotive for WW1 (kinda like the BR 52 for WW2). It often still runs spontaneous mainline goods trains and it’s really a sight to behold. Definitely worth checking out!
Class 50 was designed to have a powerful locomotive for lines of low permitted axle load. You can see it as a lightweight derivative of class 44 (the standard locomotive for heavy mainline freight trains in the era). Their boilers were also lightweight, made of St47K, a steel that in the long run didn't turn out to be very durable. So all locomotives received new boilers after 20 years of service. In the east German DR this rebuilding allowed to operate them to the end of regular steam operations 1988. (About the same time, late 1950s, a series of similar locomotives class 50.40 was built new.) DR also had a few series of lightweight 6-axle diesel locomotives, some of which might still be used by private operators, but of course using steam is a more spectacular way to point out the problem of deferred track maintenance.
The locomotive is Type 50 3616, built in 1940 as 50 453, reconstructed with a new boiler and renamed 50 3616 in 1960, had her last main inspection from October 2017 to August 2023, getting a complete inspection/overhaul etc. including brand new cylinders in the big steam workshop in Meiningen (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meiningen_Steam_Locomotive_Works). So she's only just out on the rails again for a year.
11:26 Dutchman living in Germany here - from what I've seen there's quite a few of the old steam locos in germany that are in possession of clubs/associations that restore them but don't have their own track. Instead they're rented out for special trains on the mainline, like this one. I've also seen trains that run from like Rotterdam to Cologne which is quite a distance to cover. This particular loc appears to be owned by the VSE, Verein Sächsischer Eisenbahnfreunde (the association of Saxon friends of railroads) which indeed advertises such a construction on their website (altho I'm not entirely clear if they have their own museum track next to it or not)
It is incredible to see steam in regular service. Fantastic to see not only the old locomotives hard at work, but also the railway employees who are knowledgeable and can make it happen!
So hypothetically if the UP refused to maintain their tracks do you think Ed would protest like this? And if the BNSF refused to do the same, would the museum help protest with the standard locomotive? (If it was in an operating condition).
@@wilfstor3078 true but the big boys were only supposed to run on a small section of the tracks not the entire network. However the tracks are supposed to be rate to hold the Challengers, it shouldn't be outside the realm of possibility for them to hold 4014. At the very least, the tracks can hold 844 and Ed can use her.
Hi Hyce Es gibt noch mehr Unternehmen die mit Dampfloks arbeiten und daß sind zum Beispiel die Harzer Schmalspurr HSB , der MBB Molli und die RBB auf der Insel Rügen . Diese fahren noch nach Plan ( täglich) . Der Molli fährt dabei auch mitten durch die Stadt. Und der HSB fährt auf den höchsten Berg in Norddeutschland. Und die Lokomotive ist sicherlich nicht aus einem Museum sondern von einem Verein. Wir haben sogar eine TV Show die einige davon zeigt. Der name ist Eisenbahn Romantik.
Hi Mark, a fabulous video of a beautiful choo choo! Lovely engine sound too. The red contrasting with the black made for a great look. I also liked the nice, haunting sound of the whistle. I agree, a fabulous and quite creative way to protest. As always Professor, I enjoy hearing your valuable commentary about all things choo choo. So many thanks for sharing this, Mark and cheers to you!
Little tidbit about German level crossings and signaling: Trains generally only whistle before unsecured level crossings and they do so upon the command of a "Pfeiftafel" signal. It's a black "P" on a square white sign. If the crossing is secured using a barrier then no whistling is required or even wanted due to the noise pollution. Also, basically the entire right-of-way in Germany is owned by DB InfraGo, which is wholly owned by the nation of Germany. Another fun tidbit: we still have lots of tilting trains on small village-to-village train services so they can make use of the old rails whist travelling at up to 160km/h. And we also still have the ICE-T for high-speed tilting train action over long distances!
One thing that I like about German steam locomotives is the stack talk, the design and the operational. Back in WWll these locomotives we're armoured and they look badass when they armoured, now a day these big guns are still in preservation.
On german tracks there should be a P sign on the track whereever you need to whistle as an engineer. On crossings that have bars lowered, you usually don't have to whistle, but on crossings that don't have any bars you have to. And yes, usually the 50s are used as museum locomotives only. Though there have been more occasions where steam locomotives are actually in revenue service. Here they're moving sleepers using a 58 th-cam.com/video/VNDa-Gs97No/w-d-xo.html (due to lack of personnel and avialable electric engines in that case). The 58 had to go that way anyways from a museum tour so they picked up a load on the way. ;)
All I'm saying: You know how every train crew has their onomatopoeia about what their engine sounds like? Peaches goes "Al-la-mo-sa" right? When that 50 was starting in my head I just heard, "Dres-den, Dres-den."
This Loco is at home in Schwarzenberg. In the Germans city of Dresden,the capital of Saxony, is a big museum with many other locos. (The Verkehrsmuseum Dresden)This spring,she visited the annual Dreseden steam festival.
In germany there are things called Planddampf (Plansteam) There Steamenignes take normal Trains in regular Timetsbles End.od September in the City of Nördlingen there are 3 Steamengines 2 Days in regular service.
In case nobody mentioned it yet, that "deeper", "more pleasant", "almost Rio Grand Hooter" whistle is the quasi standard whistle that germany used for (almost) everything from narrow gauge to the big stuff. That usually also includes the Class 52. The one you saw had what i whould almost consider more of a british style "shrieker" than a hooter. I cant really tell you what exactly the type/model/whatever it is. Suprisingly difficult to find. Probably because in germany there never developed a sort of "whistle culture" like in the US. Again, it was mostly just the same (or atleast similar) style hooter.
A 52 could have any whistle available, even stuff that was on the shelf for ages - some got a Prussian whistle, and many railroads later replaced them with the national standards
In germany we have different Axel load limits for every route. The heaviest is 22ˋ5 metric tonnes on mainlines all the way down to 16 tonnes per axel. In this case DB Infrago/Netze downgraded the axel load limit because they didn’t maintain it right. Also the Loco didn’t blow its whistle because the crossing is secured by atleast barriers or blinking lights or both. Also also the diesel on the end is doing smthing we call nachschieben in Germany .I don’t really know how to translate it but it means that the schiebelock bushing loco is pushing the train up a steep slope it couldn’t handle on its own.
Hi Hyce, what I remember from high school German … tells me that the sign on the tender would read something like .. Rail tracks locomotives like the 1950’s protest against the state of infrastructure in the Thuringian Forest.
Do see videos every once in a while in Germany of construction trains being run by steam on rare occasions so it does still happen ever once in a while in Germany
The loco is a museum piece belonging to the "Association of the friends of the railways of Saxony" and has been recently fully rebuilt including new cylinders, as it's used for mainline excursions.
There are a couple of shortlines in the US that occasionally do steam freight. Strasburg, from time to time. And there's another line that has been doing some short moves recently.
Some Contemporary Union Pacific Diesel Locomotives struggled to pull freight wagons up a hill recently, and #4014, which was already pulling a tourist train, with a diesel locomotive coupled between itself and the carriages in case of emergency, buffered up to the freight train and ate that hill for breakfast.
Hello Hyce, first of all, it's really, really cool that you make an english video from this protest action. Most of Your information is correct, just a little correction about the tracks: The railway line belong to german state railways (Deutsche Bahn), but it is not very important for traffic, so the last modernization was in the 1950s. The tracks are mainained, but back in the 50s in GDR Steam (Class 50, 52, 41, 58) and Diesel Locos (Class V100, V180) were used to have only 15-18 tons of axle load so it wasn't an issue at all. Unfornately modern Diesel Locos are way heavier so the private railway company was permitted to use heavier locomotives (e.g. Class 218, 19to axle load) to be able to haul the heavy log trains. But this Year, the permission was taken away so there are only very few and old engines can be used to pull the trains. And thats why the protest started. Btw: the Diesel engine at the rear of the train is a Class V75, made in Czechoslovakia in the 1960s and imported by GDR which is also lightweight enough to be operated on this railway line. Speaking of german steam locomotives hauling "real" cargo trains: have You ever heard of the "Ruebendampf" near Noerdlingen (literally "sugar beet steam", an event where up to 4 steam engines pull heavy harvest trains up to 2500 tons the first miles on their way to the sugar factory. If You're interested, I made a video about this myself: th-cam.com/video/1s4iNBttAmk/w-d-xo.html
Some facts about the BR50 class. It was constructed as an multipurpose Engine for smaller Railway lines without a proper turntable. The tender is special made for this class. Its not the cheap war tender you might have seen on the 52s. For example as you can see it has plates mounted on the tender, so you can pull the train backwards at normal speed and you do not have to turn the engine around for example in passenger service.
Excellent video. As far as the train length is concerned, I counted 32 cars, most of them loaded. I took a look at a German language locomotive book. Power output was 1195 KW, or roughly 1620 HP. The original design requirement was to be able to haul 1000 Metric tons on level track at 70 kph, but this train appears to be much heavier, hence the diesel pusher in back. Still, the class 50 and war simplified class 52 was a very rugged and reliable design that could easily be run past its design limits. Impressive, considering it was a lightweight design intended to be usable on branch lines with a 15 ton axle load.
Coolest protest ever. Hope it drew enough attention to make a change, though i can't see how it couldn't lol. Also, I noticed you always bob your head to the beat of the exhaust. I always tap my foot in the downbeat too. It's a musician thing. Normies wouldn't get it!
Seeing the length of the train and lading i can see why we got some wheel slip on start up. Second favorite steam engine wheel slip with the Nickle Plate 765 photo arrival at Lasalle Street station in Chicago 7ish years ago as my top one. Look it up you get the stack talk,whistle and bell echoing off the man made canyons of Chicago and then hogger either opened the throttle a little too much or hit a area of slick rail but it's a feast for the ears and a throwback to what it must have sounded like when the Rock Island, NYC and NKP ran steam and passengers into Lasalle Street for real rather than excursions.
Hey there, geetings from ze Germany. Instances like this, where a railway operator is in a bind and hires a steam locomotive to pull their revenue train, happen every now and again here in Germany. This comes mainly to the fact, that most of the lines are electrified. So among all the railway companies there aren’t that may diesels to begin with. Other than the UK for example. Another case of that happend recently around Mannheim. A MoW-company needed some trains to be moved around and asked a railway club if the big diesel that they owned was available. The diesel was undergoing some maintenance work but mostly as a joke the club made the company an offer for their Steamer - class 58 311. To their surprise the company took the offer and so their over 100 year old Prussian goods engine pulled the 1500 ton train all by itself.
rail tracks like 1950 locomotives. protest against the state of infrastructure in the Thuringian Forest very rough google translate. but that is essentially what the tender says
Regarding the tenders of the 50s: several different models existed beside the one shown here. One bathtub-shaped one was built during WW2 and was also the default for the 53 war type. Their primary point was to save materials. They were used for standard 50s, too postwar. A not very common tender type which was unique to the 50s was a cab-tender, which replaced the caboose-alike Güterzugbegleitwagen.
If you want to hear another good sounding loc, i recommend the Baureihe 41. Somehow it tends to always sound great. The youtube channel Powered by steam has a "few" good clips I recommend the video "Steam locomotive 41 1144 is fighting alone on the mountain"
In your Europe trip, have you been to Germany to visit the Brockenbahn? It's revenue narrow gauge steam hauling passengers up a mountain. They run upto 25 steamloc's. People think its just a tourist attraction but its run by a regional public transport company. Beautiful mountain scenery there to
Over here in Germany we have a lot of Steam Locomotives kept in operating condition by museums and volunteers . We also have many museum railways using steam.
German here, the square say "like [in] 1950", so it would be read: Rails like [in] 1950 Locomotives like [in] 1950 *Protest* against the [bad] state of the [rail] infrastructure in the Thüringer forest
The diesel that is pushing has a low speed engine, so it sounds like idling over the whole power band. The tender on this locomotive is a 'neubautender' built according to improved design plans for the original version.
What's interesting is UP 4014 Big Boy it quite capable of doing revenue service. They'd probably have to keep it limited to certain sub-divisions though so it could be serviced with water and fuel.
Best sounding European whistle I have heard in a while. Definitely more enjoyable than other ones from across the pond. Fantastic to see a big Decapod working for the money like they use to. ❤
I think the diesel locomotives they would normally use, if the track could handle it, would be six-axle types such as the "Ludmilla". The BR50 has only five driving axles, as well as having a reduced axle load - it is similar in that respect to the British Standard 9F. So to reliably start the train and keep it moving on gradients, having the small diesel on the back would actually be very helpful, even though it wouldn't be able to haul the train on its own. There was a companion type to the 50/52, namely the 40/42. This had a heavier axle load and three-cylinder drive, in the same 2-10-0 format. I'm not sure whether any of them are still in running order.
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The Locomotive is the 50 3616 from Schwarzenberg from the Saxon Railway Friends Association
Or VSE 😅 as we call it
ITs almost fresh Out of the RAW Meiningen where she got a full overhaul that Took around six and a half years
😅 Sorry for blabering and for the grammer i Speak better than i write
The only thing i can Tell you about this is that it only was a 7 day Protest we from VSE wished that our Lok could do more but its still a museums Lok so 😅
We were Happy to Help them with there loads and that she could pull more than the normal five to six passanger Cars
That is so cool! So it was from a museum. You love to see it. Thank you for helping them out.
I bet the Union Pacific steam folk are _envious_ of the locomotive crew.
@@tobiasbruckner373 You should get with the folks that run the repair shop for the steam trains in his trip video... Looks like the can make there own parts, so they might have what it takes to make the parts you need... Never know if they can help, but never hurts to ask.... I hope you get lucky and they can help :)
@@jonathanbair523the Problem in bringing 94 2105 Back to runing conditon is not that we dont want it she is the Last of her kind so it would be awsome but the Problem is funding
50 3616s overhaul was fundet with donations and the Museum revenue it was almost 3 milion Euro and the know how to do this Class of Locomotives but 94 2105 is a Saxonian XI HT from 1923 so we keep trying an If she cant come Back we try 75 501 a Saxonian XIV HT from 1915
Sorry if I'm out of subject, but people were curious if I was able to work at the Canadian railway museum. Well....I didn't 🥲
it says:
"Rails like 1950, Locomotives like 1950.
Protest against the state of Infrastructure in Thüringen Forrest"
for those that are curious.
You might want to Pin this comment
Thanks mate
Are you a German native speaker? I'm interested in the exact nuance of "Schienenweg." You used "rails," which gets the idea across, but "rails" would strictly speaking just be "Schienen" wouldn't it? Duden says Schienenweg is "Gleis (als Verbindung zwischen Orten)," so something similar to "Gleis" (track) or a track/line, but I want to understand this better.
@@rdreher7380 "Schienenweg" is rails as infrastructure, "Schiene" is Rails as an Item and "Gleis" I would best describe as an administrative term.
And yes my native language is German but I'm Swiss so there are quite a few discrepancies.
@@burnerheinz Thank you, Danke schön. Schienenweg was a new word to me, and the dictionary translated it as "railway/railroad." However I knew that Eisenbahn is the usual word for a railway/railroad, so I was confused. I don't think we have a word in English that maps one-to-one with that word, but "rails/tracks/rail lines," all seem close.
As for how this happens? These freight services are operated by small private companies that own or lease their motive power and buy "Trassen", spot trackage use slots from the rail infrastructure companies, which, all else being equal, is usually DB.
The network between those companies and the rail preservation scene is pretty tight knit. Foamers do be working on the railroad. So the person booking freight movements during the week might very well be a volunteer at a local museum on the weekends. Somebody knows someone, people sit around after hours and bitch about the mess DB is making of the railroad, someone makes a half-serious jab about "might as well run it with a Class 50 at that point", and then things fall into place.
Beauty of an open access rail market: as long as the choochoo meets the saftey requirements to operate in that secrion of track, and you as the operating company pay the infrastructure company the appropriate fees for running the train, what sort of traction you actually put on the service is your decision. So long as it the mod cons like air brakes and PZB (intermittent train control), nothing in the rulebook says it can't be a steam engine.
Thank you so much for the background, that's really cool!
Yep, it's amazing how often they do this in Germany. I feel like they have steam doing revenue earning freight almost every year there. Sadly I also learn about it after the fact haha.
Fun sidefact: There are even some steam locos that have been equipped with modern ETCS systems so that they can run on high-speed mainlines. Not in germany yet though as PZB is still accepted as a minimum.
@@web1bastler currently only 60163 Tornado in the UK right? I occasionally follow the project, the results of that trial will probably be a big basis for ETCS conversions for heritage trains across the world. Here in the Netherlands research has already been done for mobile ETCS installations that you could swap around various locomotives when needed, sadly without positive results.
@@treinenliefde4014 Big Boy is also PTC equipped.
Malicious compliance, Railroader Edition.
Yes 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
Yep, just pounding those tracks with roughly sinusoidal force...well, pounding for track in such poor condition at least.
Looks like they need one of them fire locomotives that can burn brush along side and inside the track area, then it has its own water mist/water tended car to put out the fires as the loco's go down the track...
Imagine the call,
Company: hey could we borrow your steam locomotive?
museum/preservation group: Sure, but why?'
Company: We want to protest government
polite megadeth
Museum: "Sure thing. Give us an hour or so to make a few phone calls in order to get the crew together to run it."
Because who doesn't like sticking it to the government? And rightfully so. the rail-network across the country is in woeful shape (although I'd reckon it is even worse in the eastern part of the country as a holdover from GDR-times).
@@ranekeisenkralle8265 Right. Forty years of running it down has left its mark till the present day.
By the way, the diesel at the end is also a museum piece. That's the class 107, a imported Czechoslovak CSD T435.0 from the early 1962's. It most likely helped pushing the train after they had trouble pulling the train with class 50.35 alone. There is a video that shows the same section of track seen at 9:16 with the steamer having a very bad time and having a lot of wheel slip.
I remember seeing one of the T435.0 on the empty stock moves regularly.
It can pull it no problem, the Class 50 could pull 2,500 tons on the flat, they're super powerful machines. The reason for the wheelspin is that with very heavy loads it's a little more tricky to get the right regulator setting in the beginning with a steam loco (esp. under wet or damp conditions!), as you don't have as fine a throttle control as modern locos and there's no traction control system to help you either. As for why the 107 is at the back, it's there primarily to help with braking and just incase something goes awry with the old engine, and IIRC its a rule that you have to have newer diesel or electric loco at the back for loads over a certain weight just incase with these old engines. BUT ithey're not helping actually move the train, atleast not usually and definitely not in the video above, so infact the Class 50 is starting that 2000+ ton train all on its own in the video. Later on it does sound like the Diesel is on though, wether or not its actually pushing I don't know though.
Running revenue steam is really the perfect way to protest any railroad related problem if you think about it; People go out of their way to see and film Steam locomotives in action, especially when they're working in revenue service, the point of every protest is to make as many people aware of the problem you're protesting as possible so that something will be done about it, so putting the two together is an excellent way of accomplishing the goal of your protest.
28 full loads, 1 partial, 3 empties, for 32 cars total. Thats sizeable for Europe.
I sense this is IHW's comment.
Max length for freight trains in Germany is 740 Meters, so 32 log wagons is pretty average for a main line freighter.
Really? I counted at least 5 empties. Maybe I'm just crazy
@@bahnspotterEU If I found the correct values (length with uncompressed buffers):
22,94 m (BR 50) + 32 * 29,52 m (Sggmrrs)+ 12,56 m (DR V 75) = 980.14 m (3215 ft)
@@dommsevanschnitzel2732 not quiet correct
the Sggmrrs waggons are double wagons so the 32 wagons are actually 16 wagons
also the maximum lenght in germany for a train is 700m in total
but still thanks for the research
Hi Hyce. A very basic and nasty internet translation of the placard is "1950s Railway Locomotives Protest Against the State of the [Rail] Infrastructure in the Thuringia Forest."
The story (from the OG video description, commentary and a spot of wiki searching) seems to be that the State-owned private company providing rail infrastructure maintenance services on behalf of the German Federal Government, is not able to fully maintain the line at Themar in the State of Thuringia to a suitable state for freight haulage, and to reduce its resource burdens, has abruptly downgraded the status of track around that section. The little passenger shuttle railcars that run to Themar are unaffected, but freight haulage is limited to light, lower-capacity stock and locomotives.
However, while the freight services are allegedly sporadic, it is quite clear what is lifted out of there (logs aren't light) isn't the sort of stuff that tolerates something a small shuttle car will float over. As the protesting company has pointed out, it's not viable to run their log trains using the little branch line units the lower track class requires.
On-the-spot corrections and clarifications from any German watchers are most welcome and desired. I only wish I had the means (and an on-call roster of steam engines) to run Plandampf ops in Australia. For pleasure or to make a point...
The first words are „Rail ways“ (differ word than the usual for railways to specifically mean the right of way side of railways) and „Locomotives“ with the red box „as in 1950“, the rest is absolutely correct
I am sorry, WTH is a "State-owned private company"?
Pick one.
@Xoruam in Canada we call it a crown corporation. Its a for profit corporation that's wholly owned by the government.
@@Zyo117 They are actually quite common for infrastructure service provision in open access networks.
The UK's Network Rail is another example. As is the Australian Rail Track Corporation. The Australian air traffic control and air navigation network is administered and maintained by the government-owned corporation Airservices Australia.
@@RexAnger. Sounds like a conflict of interest to me that would hinder the free market. I mean I get the ATC, kinda, but the rest?
I'm from this area and for years there was a Event called "Plandampf". In Plandampf there were 3 to 5 steamengines pulling regular trains. You sould look a bit into this as well. You may find the right Videos under "Plandampf im Werratal".
In germany there are still many steamengines that can run and in the area where this Video was filmed is the biggest an I think only Workshop that can complitly rebuilt steamengines, it's called the RAW Meiningen. This is one of the reasons why there are often events with steam there, like passenger excursions and Things like in the Video.
I hope my Englisch is good enough that you can understand what i mean.
Yours Großbahner
5:37 We aren't obligated to blow crossing signals when the railroad crossing has barriers. You could bring up the "What if they dont lower because the circuit or some other component is broken?" and you'd be right to do so. I don't understand it either.
6:20 "Trackwork like in 1950. Locomotives like in 1950. Protest against the infrastructure's [bad] state/condition in the Thuringian Forest"
The whistle on the locomotive is a hooter (shocker I know) but I love this one because it sounds similar to E&P 4's hooter and we love Eureka.
Crossings in Germany are usually combined with Block Signals, "control Signal" or supervised by the Signals system, if the Crossing malfunctions the Signal(s) drops to a Stop aspect or the Signalman get a notification and can stop the Train via Radio call.
There actually is a special procedure in the case for a not closing crossing. The train driver gets notified either by the dispatcher responsible for the crossing or through a warning signal. If I'm remembering this right, the train has to stop before the crossing, give an acoustic attention signal (blow the whistle/horn), then approach the crossing in walking speed and when you reach the middle of the crossing go back to normal speed.
If the crossing is activated solely by a track circuit, there is a dedicated signal at braking distance which tells the train crew whether the crossing has activated. If it does not, the train must be brought to a stand short of the crossing and the train crew must attempt to activate it. If they can't, they must whistle, then proceed at walking pace until the crossing is occupied.
In most cases, there will be a block/interlocking signal in rear of the crossing, with the signal interlocked such that it will not clear until the crossing is activated; or the dispatcher monitors the crossing by other means (e.g. cameras). If a failure develops, the train would be brought to a stand at the signal and advised by the dispatcher; the crew would then be authorised to pass the signal at stop, proceed to the crossing, and follow the same procedure as above.
The one shown in the video, however, is manually operated by the train crew (the full video shows a clip of the switchman closing it); in such a case, the local rules will contain instructions to the effect of "all movements must stop short of the crossing at X and not proceed until protection is established".
Because it would be bullshit to blow the horn at every crossing. If not just for the noise pollution alone.
Locomotive: I've been waiting for this for YEARS! I still got it!
She was hauling 32 cars, three of which were empty. I wonder what the total weight of it was. Interestingly enough, I tried to see if I could find any info about her, but the only thing I found was her number on two lists of preserved locomotives in Germany, and both of them listed her as non working.
This is the kind of protest I can get behind. ;) It's also a perfect example of why I DON"T want the US government to take control of our railroads. The class 1s have their issues, but they generally take care of their stuff. Well, most of the time, anyway.
Meanwhile our government squabbles like a bunch of three years old fighting over the last piece of chocolate.
Regarding your question about train weight: When you assume the 29 loaded cars each use the full permitted axle loading of 18 t and the three empty cars each weigh about 20 t it comes out to nearly 2150 t.
I wish our government would finally re-nationalize DB... back when they were state owned they were world famous for punctuality and reliability, after they were forced to try and make a profit everything went to shit. Not that the German (passenger) rail network is anywhere near as bad as North America mind you. but compared to the rest of Europe we're a laughing stock at this point.
Well, having experienced most of your class 1 railroads aboard Amtrak, the German Branch line in this video is likely still in a better state than most US main lines (especially with Bnsf). DB and its subsidiaries, including infrastructure, are organised as private companies, with the government holding all shares. The issue isn't the government ownership per se, but rather a combination of massive lack of investment, strict regulations and local politics more often than not being an actual hindrance whenever anything is supposed to get done.
Meanwhile, on US railroads you get thrown out of your bed at 2am because Amtrak yeets over badly maintained switches that at a stretch you might see on a tram line at 70 mph.
The class 1s take care of their ops so well that derailments don't get cleaned up for months, whole lines are left to degrade to a point where passenger services have to be halted due to too-low operating speeds and of course anything resembling more major infrastructure and rolling stock modernisation is impossible. Electrification? Track-straightening? Track multiplication? No way!
The way I see it, the class 1s are holding rail transport hostage in the US. They are in the way of a modern, environmentally friendly and high-capacity rail network useful for both freight and passenger service.
The locomotive shown here is the 50 3616. She is a "Rekolok" built during DDR times in 1960. The class is the BR 50.35. She was in use during the DR times and was put out of service in the late 1980s. After the fall of the Iron Curtain, she was sold to the VSE Schwarzenberg,who is in her ownership until today. She mostly drives in Saxony,where she is still stationed in the Schwarzenberg Depot. She ran in museum service until ca. 2017,when her License to drive ceased and she needed to be overhauled. At that time,this was to much money for the VSE and she stayed out of service. Only recently,in 2023,she was finally overhauled in the RAW Meiningen workshop. She reentered service in late 2023. Since then,she is in working condition again. This video was half a year after her being put back into service. The VSE regulary uses her for driving museum trains mostly in Saxony.
For some fun context on when the last revenue steam run was done (at least in West Germany) was around 1976 or 1977 around the time my mom had joined the army and was stationed over there. When they got there they were told they had missed the last revenue steam run by 1 week so i may have to show this to my dad so he can see a revenue steam run in germany. Thank you for sharing this video with us and what a great way to celebrate Decapod month.
Edit 32 cars on last part of clip. I asume same length for whole video
The last official revenue steam run in western germany was on the 26th of October, 1977. The east german railway had the last official revenue steam run on the 29th of October, 1988. But they used some of their steam locomotives for freight trains until 1989, in case that a diesel locomotive broke down and they didn´t have any other locomotives that could do the job etc.
After that, there were no revenue steam runs in germany, except those that were organized by railroad clubs... until 2024, when shtf (again) and some railroad maintenance companies realized, that there is a shortage in working diesel locomotives, so they had to rent steam engines, train drivers and boilermen from railroad clubs. 🤣
Well Sometimes they do it th-cam.com/video/VNDa-Gs97No/w-d-xo.htmlsi=D6J2wFuHRQ0VeyIE
@@deru-bahn6622 The one in April this year was a bit special because it wasn't planned at all (Plandampf is the planned freight trains for railfans). 58 311 (a sprightly 103 years old) came back from a steam meet and the diesel power on a 1600t concrete sleeper train was down. They were going the same route anyway and said f*** it why not.
th-cam.com/video/VNDa-Gs97No/w-d-xo.html
@@deru-bahn6622 Interesting it was October 26th as thats my dads birthday. I couldn't remember exact date she was sent over to west Germany so that definitely helps there. I knew the East Germans kept steam running essentially till the fall of the Soviet Union but ya know at that time for luck seeing those if you're in the western block. I know Europe in general has quite the number of working steam locomotives so I would be curious who owns this particular one. Thanks for filling in the exact time gap there.
@@deru-bahn6622 Until 1991 (maybe 1992), Bw Zittau
By the way: There was an experiment conducted in germany a few years ago about if steam locos could use wood pellets as fuel and how it influences the performance. The team made quite a good reportage about it so maybe you could give it a watch.
How did those trials end? Is it feasible?
@@MrToradragon It worket very well, you just have to shovel quit a bit more but the scoops weren´t as heavy. Also the pellets had to be kept dry because if they got wet they started to expand and also the firebox and its door had to be modified.
Far as I understood, they basically went to a preservation club (there’s a bunch of clubs in Germany dedicated to keeping their steam locos mainline certified) and asked to borrow their loco (and crew)
It was the VSE Schwarzenberg in Saxony, where she is stationed and used for driving with museum trains.
@@heermannmorrer thanks for the clarification
"Stack Talk" sounds like a railroader podcast.
I like how he is kinda headbanging to the sound. I mean, sure enough, the choochooo is some proper heavy metal, so it is kinda apt. Hmm... why am I now imagining some heavy metal band performing from a steam train? Ideally as part of the music somehow?
This was neat. I have to admit though, first thought on seeing the engine and then the cars was "Oh Lord, It's the ES&DT heading to the Sylva Paperboard"
So called “Plandampf” (Scheduled Steam) is always great.
About 3 months ago there was some which just happened because it was convenient.
A steam excursion was on its way back to Karlsruhe. It had to stop in Aschaffenburg.
Due to some events, a freight haul had their scheduled locomotive and the backup unavailable. The freight haul was scheduled to go, you may guessed it from Aschaffenburg to Karlsruhe.
When they found out that the Steam locomotive was doing the same route, they just boldly asked if they where willing to take the freight haul with them. The where going there anyway.
It was a really heavy train.
A really fun thing was, the tram which was filming this took later picked up the replacement fireman from a train station (with long distance passenger service) and shuttled him to the Steam locomotive roughly 60km south.
Thank you very much to show my video 😎👍.
I hope u enjoyed it (:
Greetings from Germany
Student learning German's take on what the tender translates to: "railway locomotive protest against the infrastructure condition in the Thüringer forest." The red square translates to "like 1950." Anyone who speaks German fluently, please correct me, I want to learn.
I'm not that fluent, but I too studied German long ago. I can add two points: First is not a language thing but a graphic design thing. I think the words Schienenwege and Lokomotiven are to be read as separate from the phrase "Protest gegen..." Rather, they are meant to be read together with the "wie 1950" as part of both: "Schinenenwege wie 1950, Lokomotiven wie 1950," or "Schinenwege, Lokomotiven, [beide (both)] wie 1950." In other words, "Railway tracks like 1950, Locomotives like 1950."
The second point is an interesting nuance of the the word Schienenweg. I too would love it if someone who knows German better than me could explain the nuance of this word, but this word seems to mean "tracks" (the physical thing that makes a railroad) rather than "railway/railroad" (the abstract concept of a particular rail transport network). The word Eisenbahn (f) is the closer translation to "railway/railroad." The part I don't get is that the word Gleis (n) also means "track." The Duden gives Schienenweg as "Gleis (als Verbindung zwischen Orten)" or "tracks, as a connection between points," so maybe similar to a "line." That's where my German knowledge falls short.
It translates to "Railway tracks like 1950 Lokomotive Protests against the state of the infrastructur in the Thüringer Forest
"Railways like 1950, Locomotives like 1950 - protest against the infrastructure condition in the thuringia forest"
@@rdreher7380, your first paragraph is 100% correct.
And "Schienenweg" is just a very old word for "Gleis". Like... 19th century old.
@@deru-bahn6622 Thank you, danke schön. Dictionaries often miss nuances like that, so it's very useful to get insight from native speakers. So the use of the word in the protest probably is meant to emphasize the out of date nature of the track conditions, sounds like.
Some fun facts about the rolling stock seen here: The Locomotive actually is a Museum locomotive. It got new cylinders a few years ago and I presume it is usually used for excursions. The diesel at the end is a historic locomotive too more or less, this is a soviet design from DDR times. Few of them are left in service. Contrasting to that are the waggons: They are pretty new Inno-freight waggons. Its a design that can be easily adapted to transport all sorts of things, logs, ore, shipping containers, etc. If you had made this Train on a moddle railway before this happend, people wo have yelled at you lol
Kind of want to make in OO (or at least HO, as I know that's more popular over in mainland EU).
The locomotive was designed and constructed in Czechoslovakia, not ussr. In fact, the prototype was heavily inspired by American switchers, but they used only the american type bogies on the stock engines. (well, even the bogies were changed with the later batches)
@@vojta3657 Oh, I didn't know that. I assumed it was a soviet design since it was used in the DDR.
@@himaro101 Thats awesome! Make sure to post some pictures somewhere!
About the different types of tenders: The Class 50 obviously has a normal, conventional tender. One of the wartime simplifications was the "Wannentender" (tub tender) you saw on the Class 52s / Class 33s in Bosnia. Inspired by tank cars, these don't have a frame; the water tub is the main structural element. This saved material as well as weight - the T30 tub tender used on the Class 52 has a lower empty weight than the Class 50's T26 tender, while also being able to carry a little more water and coal.
As such, they remained a valuable piece of equipment for a long time: Even when Class 52s left service post-war, their tenders stuck around, being given to some Class 50s, as well as upgrading around 700 of the smaller Class 38 (formerly Prussian P8) locomotives, which gave them a significantly larger range. Learned this from a lovely little TH-cam channel called Steel Bridge Models, I recommend checking it out!
The locomotive, 50 3616, belongs to the "Verein Sächsischer Eisenbahnfreunde" or Club of Saxonian Railroad Enthusiasts. They operate a small museum, as well as the occasional excursion train. They bought 3616 from the former East German state railway in 1991 (the country was unified at that point, but it took a while longer for the railways to fully integrate) and have operated it ever since. As other commenters have mentioned, if you have the right permits and equipment, you can run on German main lines, and ties between the preservation community and "normal" railways are tight, so things like this happen every so often.
And yes, East Germany kept using steam for a LONG time, in part because they had domestic coal deposits, but were short on money to import oil. The official last standard gauge steam service in the German Democratic Republic (incidentally also a Class 50) ran in *1988*, and steam locomotives were kept in reserve even after that.
Although DR did not fully quit steam until 1993 and Poland quit steam in 1994, which is why there are so many Ex Reichsbahn and PKP locos that are in good enough condition to be quickly restored to operation.
Context for english speakers: this protest was started because the railway line's maximum axle loading was downgraded due to poor track condition. This meant that less powerful locomotives had to be used, which weren't strong enough for what was needed. Because the track repair authorities have no plans to fix this, the protest was held. The name of it is "Railways and Locomotives like in 1950" alluding to poor track conditions in the immediate postwar era in the Soviet occupation zone, where a lot of infrastructure including locomotives and often rails themselves from single tracked double track main lines was taken to the Soviet Union.
This has got to be one of the best protests I've ever seen.
This reminds me of an old documentary I saw on RFD TV as a kid, it was about this German railway in the 1980’s or 1990’s putting steam on the head of revenue commuter and freight trains for a festival. There were streamlined Pacifics and tank engines running double decker commuter trains and decapods running logging trains, it was so surreal to see.
Oh, I found out what it was, it was a documentary by Herron Rail called German Mainline Steam
@@GP30_FoamerI remember that! Used to tune in weekly for the train stuff. For me that was like 15 years ago...
Hyce needs to make his schedule more of a dumpster fire and go to Armstadt to the museum from that documentary.
Streamlined pacifics and double deckers? That would have been a 01.5 in East Germany
Nice way of protesting! I do hope they keep the pressure up! (pun intended)
In Germany we call Diesel Helpers Angstlok Fear Loco, the reason is that if Diesel Helpers are restricted, the club assumes that the locomotive will not make the route.
It also often happens that clubs take over freight train services on the way back from special train trips.
During the Riedbahn renovation, the BR 58 311 of the Ulm Railway Friends was rented to a track construction company due to a lack of locomotives.
Its the "and Strasburg, duh" for me lol
Couple things:
Wood cars: two cars are coupled together with fixed (but flexible) coupler, which can be decoupled only in cars repair shop. So the two cars are making a set, and they're counted as one car. Count the number of cars in the video and then divide it by two.
That diesel helper on the end was made in Czechoslovakia, and under Comecon exported in Eastern Germany. These locomotives were meant as switchers in yards, short and light freight trains and light local passenger trains. Also the big factories with large internal railroad networks and sidings had them made from manufacturer.
Regarding the Blowing the whistle on railroad crossings: In Germany you have to blow your whistle/horn on crossings if they have no additional warnings for the road vehicles etc. with i.e. barriers. For the drivers, there is a sign at the Track with a "P" that signals that you have to blow the whistle/horn. You find it mostly on small/more remote tracks like in this video. Hope this helps and greetings from Germany :D
Apparently we’re not in Decapod Month, it’s our Decapod Era. (A Mike era would be nice as well.) my limited German got the gist of that tender painting, and it’s a poignant way of sending a message to the governing body. But still effective, as that big Class 50 HUSTLES. (Even if it has a big hoot.)
The little diesel helper also has a pleasant International TD6 straightpipe exhaust note. Pulling a disc in 4th gear and wide open.
I see old Semaphore Signals at 11:36. That is epic.
The adjacent signal boxes are a part of the problem, too. Built about 100-120 years ago, spares are scarce (most manufacturers don't even exist any more - since decades) and German railway safety authorities don't care if they discover a potentially harmful defect. They close down the whole signal box, which poses another threat to railway lines and rail operators alike.
In Germany we have many lines that still have form signals and mechanical Signal box, some points that have to be set by hand
If you think German Whistles sound like a Rio Grande Whistle then you might think the JNR (Japanese National Railways) Whistles sound like a Rio Grande 5-Chime.
You've got to check out the German class 44, those sound divine, or the Czechoslovak class 556.0
3 cylinder power
Thera are a lot of questions here, i try to explain what happend: The owner of the track, the InfraGo, a part of DB (GErman Railroar Infrastructure), had a lot of problems to bring their tracks to useable conditions (i dont soeak of good...). In this case, on this rails route, they had a small part where they reduce the track class. A track class means, how much tons (per axle and per meter) a train can have maximal. Here we speak just about Axle Loading. Former it was 20tons+, what is the standard on 99% of german tracks. this track had an special permission, for the wood transports, that they can use a locomotive with 20tons axle load insteed of 18 tons. This permission was time limited and not extendend. So the standard loc for this was the BR 218 with 20tons per axle. And there are not a lot of powerful locomotives with less than 20t in Germany. For sure you can use a bunch of locomotives, but as a single one the BR50 is still the strongest one with 18 tons per axle. And yes, its not economically, but an great protest anyway.
Yay FIRST!
“Railway locomotives (like 50) protest against the infrastructure conditions in Thuringian Forest”
You would know. :P
Schienenwege = railway tracks
Lokomotiven = locomotives
Wie 1950 = [both] like 1950.
Protest gegen den Infrustrukturzurstand im Thüringer Wald = Protest against the infrastructure conditions in the Thuringian Forest.
It's been a while since I studied German, and it was fun for me to make sense of that protest sign. That first word in particular is interestingly confusing. Schienenweg (m) literally means "rail way/road," but that's not exactly the German word for "railroad," which would be Eisenbahn "iron trail." Eisenbahn (f) is more the abstract concept of a railroad as a system of transportation, while Schienenweg refers to the railroad as a physical entity, so like the "tracks." Except German has another word for railroad track, which is Gleis (n), which is confusing as heck. The Duden dictionary seems to suggest that Schienenweg is track "as a connection between points," so maybe more like a "line." I'd be very happy if someone who knows German better than me can explain this, hahaha.
"Schienenweg" is kind of analogous to "waterway" in English (except that it refers to railways, obviously): it's a more of an abstract term for railways/the railway system - you probably wouldn't use it to refer to a specific line and definitely not in the sense of "I work on the railway".
@@dkbmaestrorules I think "Eisenbahn" refers to the general concept of a railway, while "Schienenweg" refers to the actual thing - i.e. what the Britons call "permanent way", so the actual Schienen, the tracks. A (railway) line is referred to as a (Bahn)Strecke.
"Schienenweg" or the plural "Schienenwege" is more of a bureaucratic term that is used for the connection of two or several places via rails. "Der Schienenweg von Frankfurt nach Stuttgart" is not only one track between Frankfurt and Stuttgart but includes all technicalparts of the rail infrastructure between Frankfurt and Stuttgart. One Schienenweg can be made of several tracks and also includes all other technical parts needed like signals, overhead lines and so on. In this protest they don't just say "give us new tracks" but rather "do a complete work over of the network". If they'd say "Gleise wie 1950" it would be to much of a focus on the rails and ties.
OK, so there's already a lot in the comments about what was happening but I'll punt some more stuff in because why not?
Firstly, the BR50 class 2-10-0s. These were a major German standard with 3,614 of these locomotives built between 1939 and 1948, with most built towards the end of World War II as simplified Class 50ÜK _Übergangskreigslokomotiven_ (provisional war locomotives). Producing 1,500hp/1118kW and with an axle loading of 15 tonnes, they're a real go-anywhere-do-anything type, so much so that the Germans tried saving as many as they could in 1945 - end result, the West German Bundesbahn had 2,159 on their books while the East German Reichsbahn _only_ got 350 (but instead got lots of Class 52 Kriegsloks which are really very oversimplified 50's).
The locomotive in this clip, 50 3616, was built in 1940 and was one of the 208 Class 50's rebuilt as Class 50.35 by the Deutsche Reichsbahn between 1957 and 1962. To cut a long story short, the steel used in the original boilers wasn't particularly durable so the DR fitted new boilers, to a more modern design already being produced for the DR's Class 23.10 _Neubaulokomotiven_ (new design locomotives). A very easy giveaway that it's an East German locomotive is the shape of the feedwater heater cover - the East Germans preferred mixer-preheaters, which is what the trapezoidal cover between the stack and smokebox front is hiding. These days, it's owned by the Saxon Railway Friends Association/Verein Sächsischer Eisenbahnfreunde and (usually) runs occasional mainline passenger trips.
Now for the protest part: from the VSE's own website, these log trains run between Schleusingen and Meiningen - the latter being home to a former railway workshops that are still capable of maintaining and even building new steam locomotives - but, because the line wasn't upgraded to carry the heavier axle loading of these trains, they had to be run under a regular exemption issued by the German national rail infrastructure provider, DB Netz. No upgrades ever got carried out though, and earlier this year DB InfraGo (successor to DB Netz) put axle load limits in place. So to protest this the company running the log trains, Railsystem AG, got together with the VSE and brought 50 3616 in to do the job for a week and make the problem very visible to the public!
As for the diesel hanging off the back... it's 107 018, a former DR Class 107 diesel built in 1962 and owned by Railsystem. It's got an axle loading of 15.5 tonnes so was light enough to run to Schleusingen. What it isn't, however, is powerful enough to pull the train on its own - at 750hp/552kW, it's what Americans might call a 'road switcher' - great for moving short trains around a railyard or over medium distances, but doesn't have the huevos to get down on its knees and crawl with the big boys. My uninformed opinion based on the footage is that it was used to lead the train on the Meiningen-Scheusingen leg (faster than turning the 50 or running tender-first), and then served as a rear helper on the loaded return trips. Which tells you just how heavy these trains were!
Links for the interested:
*VSE's homepage (with links to the protest log train's timetable):* www.vse-eisenbahnmuseum-schwarzenberg.de/
*Railsystem fleet page (for 107 018):* www.railsystems-rp.de/lokomotiven/
I should also point out, as have others, that Germany is incredibly enlightened when it comes to running steam on the mainline compared to other Western nations. Not only do they allow steam on the national network, they even permit _Plandampf_ events - basically, planned steam operations where museum locomotives are allowed to haul regularly scheduled passenger *and even freight* trains. Not sure how common they are anymore, but they're a thing. I won't try to get into the details of that though, I'm not really conversant with the technicalities and whatnot.
Anyways, apologies that's a bit of an epistle on steam, but in summary, the Germans really know how to make their point.
Thank you so much for the wonderful context!
I bet the reason they don't blow the whistle for grade crossings is because they don't want to hear a loud screeching ear piercing whistle every three miles.
They only blow the whistle for unprotected crossings the ones without bells and lights.
they dont because most grade crossings here are protected with barriers, on the ones without them they do.
The crossing they didn't blow the whistle at hadd boom gates
@@nashorn9745 Thank you, I didn't know that.
@@SimonBauer7 I didn't know that, Thanks for telling me.
That's an Eastern German class 50 with a reconstruction boiler which you can recognize by the trapezoid shape above the front of the smokebox which is a mixing preheater.
But you really must hand it to the guys at Meiningen Locomotive Works, where this BR 50 will certainly have passed through: They really know how to adjust a valve gear! Traditionally, this is done by indicating.
There is some really nice footage from 2024 of a three cylinder class 58 hauling a train of concrete sleepers. WIthout a diesel for helping with the brakes. The title is "Awesome! Steam locomotive pulls heavy freight train in 2024!"
The “Ulmer Eisenbahnfreunde” possesses a DRG BR 58, formerly a Prussian G12, built in 1918. It’s a three cylinder 2-10-0 goods locomotive and was originally designed as a war locomotive for WW1 (kinda like the BR 52 for WW2). It often still runs spontaneous mainline goods trains and it’s really a sight to behold. Definitely worth checking out!
Class 50 was designed to have a powerful locomotive for lines of low permitted axle load. You can see it as a lightweight derivative of class 44 (the standard locomotive for heavy mainline freight trains in the era). Their boilers were also lightweight, made of St47K, a steel that in the long run didn't turn out to be very durable. So all locomotives received new boilers after 20 years of service. In the east German DR this rebuilding allowed to operate them to the end of regular steam operations 1988. (About the same time, late 1950s, a series of similar locomotives class 50.40 was built new.)
DR also had a few series of lightweight 6-axle diesel locomotives, some of which might still be used by private operators, but of course using steam is a more spectacular way to point out the problem of deferred track maintenance.
The locomotive is Type 50 3616, built in 1940 as 50 453, reconstructed with a new boiler and renamed 50 3616 in 1960, had her last main inspection from October 2017 to August 2023, getting a complete inspection/overhaul etc. including brand new cylinders in the big steam workshop in Meiningen (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meiningen_Steam_Locomotive_Works).
So she's only just out on the rails again for a year.
that's the best protest ever! I would have love to see it in person! Thanks for bringing it to my attention!
11:26 Dutchman living in Germany here - from what I've seen there's quite a few of the old steam locos in germany that are in possession of clubs/associations that restore them but don't have their own track. Instead they're rented out for special trains on the mainline, like this one. I've also seen trains that run from like Rotterdam to Cologne which is quite a distance to cover. This particular loc appears to be owned by the VSE, Verein Sächsischer Eisenbahnfreunde (the association of Saxon friends of railroads) which indeed advertises such a construction on their website (altho I'm not entirely clear if they have their own museum track next to it or not)
I love your head bouncing to the chug chug like you're listening to music. Thanks for sharing.
So nice to see a German locomotive on your channel 😍 greetings from Germany
It is incredible to see steam in regular service. Fantastic to see not only the old locomotives hard at work, but also the railway employees who are knowledgeable and can make it happen!
So hypothetically if the UP refused to maintain their tracks do you think Ed would protest like this?
And if the BNSF refused to do the same, would the museum help protest with the standard locomotive? (If it was in an operating condition).
I'd hope so, on both cases! Lol
Big Boy is just like Peaches, he puts the track where he wants it
Only problem is, I think in this case, a Big Boy is a fair amount heavier than something like an SD-70...
@@wilfstor3078 true but the big boys were only supposed to run on a small section of the tracks not the entire network. However the tracks are supposed to be rate to hold the Challengers, it shouldn't be outside the realm of possibility for them to hold 4014.
At the very least, the tracks can hold 844 and Ed can use her.
Well that’s one way to protest!
Hi Hyce
Es gibt noch mehr Unternehmen die mit Dampfloks arbeiten und daß sind zum Beispiel die Harzer Schmalspurr HSB , der MBB Molli und die RBB auf der Insel Rügen . Diese fahren noch nach Plan ( täglich) . Der Molli fährt dabei auch mitten durch die Stadt. Und der HSB fährt auf den höchsten Berg in Norddeutschland. Und die Lokomotive ist sicherlich nicht aus einem Museum sondern von einem Verein. Wir haben sogar eine TV Show die einige davon zeigt. Der name ist Eisenbahn Romantik.
My goodness, the audio of the engine working hard that they captured in those clips were the BEST I have ever heard!
Hi Mark, a fabulous video of a beautiful choo choo! Lovely engine sound too. The red contrasting with the black made for a great look. I also liked the nice, haunting sound of the whistle. I agree, a fabulous and quite creative way to protest. As always Professor, I enjoy hearing your valuable commentary about all things choo choo. So many thanks for sharing this, Mark and cheers to you!
Little tidbit about German level crossings and signaling:
Trains generally only whistle before unsecured level crossings and they do so upon the command of a "Pfeiftafel" signal. It's a black "P" on a square white sign. If the crossing is secured using a barrier then no whistling is required or even wanted due to the noise pollution.
Also, basically the entire right-of-way in Germany is owned by DB InfraGo, which is wholly owned by the nation of Germany.
Another fun tidbit: we still have lots of tilting trains on small village-to-village train services so they can make use of the old rails whist travelling at up to 160km/h. And we also still have the ICE-T for high-speed tilting train action over long distances!
One thing that I like about German steam locomotives is the stack talk, the design and the operational.
Back in WWll these locomotives we're armoured and they look badass when they armoured, now a day these big guns are still in preservation.
Very very few were ever armoured
On german tracks there should be a P sign on the track whereever you need to whistle as an engineer. On crossings that have bars lowered, you usually don't have to whistle, but on crossings that don't have any bars you have to.
And yes, usually the 50s are used as museum locomotives only. Though there have been more occasions where steam locomotives are actually in revenue service. Here they're moving sleepers using a 58 th-cam.com/video/VNDa-Gs97No/w-d-xo.html (due to lack of personnel and avialable electric engines in that case). The 58 had to go that way anyways from a museum tour so they picked up a load on the way. ;)
The "P" stands for "Pfeifen", which basically means "whistle".
All I'm saying:
You know how every train crew has their onomatopoeia about what their engine sounds like? Peaches goes "Al-la-mo-sa" right?
When that 50 was starting in my head I just heard, "Dres-den, Dres-den."
Dresden dance?
This Loco is at home in Schwarzenberg. In the Germans city of Dresden,the capital of Saxony, is a big museum with many other locos. (The Verkehrsmuseum Dresden)This spring,she visited the annual Dreseden steam festival.
The locomotive was beautiful.
100% gorgeous Choo choo
In germany there are things called Planddampf
(Plansteam) There Steamenignes take normal Trains in regular Timetsbles
End.od September in the City of Nördlingen there are 3 Steamengines 2 Days in regular service.
in germany they usually only wistle/use the horn for crossings without gates or barriers or what they are called, and only once as well
There are actually a couple lines in germany that run steam in main service (99 class narrow gauge) Rasender Roland is one of them.
Another one th-cam.com/video/Jmmm0RqGqWk/w-d-xo.htmlsi=FJMNEaHi9zdXbnc1
In case nobody mentioned it yet,
that "deeper", "more pleasant", "almost Rio Grand Hooter" whistle is the quasi standard whistle that germany used for (almost) everything from narrow gauge to the big stuff. That usually also includes the Class 52. The one you saw had what i whould almost consider more of a british style "shrieker" than a hooter.
I cant really tell you what exactly the type/model/whatever it is. Suprisingly difficult to find. Probably because in germany there never developed a sort of "whistle culture" like in the US. Again, it was mostly just the same (or atleast similar) style hooter.
A 52 could have any whistle available, even stuff that was on the shelf for ages - some got a Prussian whistle, and many railroads later replaced them with the national standards
@@ivovanzon164 emphasis on *usually*
Explains at least why US and British engies sound so weird to me... when I am used to the Rasender Roland or the Brockenbahn.
In germany we have different Axel load limits for every route. The heaviest is 22ˋ5 metric tonnes on mainlines all the way down to 16 tonnes per axel. In this case DB Infrago/Netze downgraded the axel load limit because they didn’t maintain it right. Also the Loco didn’t blow its whistle because the crossing is secured by atleast barriers or blinking lights or both. Also also the diesel on the end is doing smthing we call nachschieben in Germany .I don’t really know how to translate it but it means that the schiebelock bushing loco is pushing the train up a steep slope it couldn’t handle on its own.
It's a "helper" in the US. I think in Britain it might be said to be "banking".
9:02 this is the most beautiful sound of hard working engines best head with headphones and volume turned up
That is a very well maintained. Looking up a motive though. That sounds really cool.
Hi Hyce, what I remember from high school German … tells me that the sign on the tender would read something like ..
Rail tracks locomotives like the 1950’s protest against the state of infrastructure in the Thuringian Forest.
I love BR50’s! Great looking steam in action! Thanks, BB
Do see videos every once in a while in Germany of construction trains being run by steam on rare occasions so it does still happen ever once in a while in Germany
I counted 32 cars behind that thing in the last clip, with most being full. That's pretty impressive
The loco is a museum piece belonging to the "Association of the friends of the railways of Saxony" and has been recently fully rebuilt including new cylinders, as it's used for mainline excursions.
I counted 32 cars.. what a cool story!
Wherever the locomotive came from it’s cool they had that much faith in it to run that hard
What a gorgeous locomotive. I know it wouldn't be preferable for them, but I hope they keep running steam after the tracks get fixed!
There are also a few fireless switchers in germany that see quite a lot of service.
Mannheim coal power station has some running lots, but where else?
@@the_retag Ineos Solvents GmbH in Herne
There are a couple of shortlines in the US that occasionally do steam freight. Strasburg, from time to time. And there's another line that has been doing some short moves recently.
Some Contemporary Union Pacific Diesel Locomotives struggled to pull freight wagons up a hill recently, and #4014, which was already pulling a tourist train, with a diesel locomotive coupled between itself and the carriages in case of emergency, buffered up to the freight train and ate that hill for breakfast.
Sorry I commented that before I heard the whistle, it actually doesn't sound half bad.
Hello Hyce,
first of all, it's really, really cool that you make an english video from this protest action. Most of Your information is correct, just a little correction about the tracks: The railway line belong to german state railways (Deutsche Bahn), but it is not very important for traffic, so the last modernization was in the 1950s. The tracks are mainained, but back in the 50s in GDR Steam (Class 50, 52, 41, 58) and Diesel Locos (Class V100, V180) were used to have only 15-18 tons of axle load so it wasn't an issue at all.
Unfornately modern Diesel Locos are way heavier so the private railway company was permitted to use heavier locomotives (e.g. Class 218, 19to axle load) to be able to haul the heavy log trains.
But this Year, the permission was taken away so there are only very few and old engines can be used to pull the trains. And thats why the protest started.
Btw: the Diesel engine at the rear of the train is a Class V75, made in Czechoslovakia in the 1960s and imported by GDR which is also lightweight enough to be operated on this railway line.
Speaking of german steam locomotives hauling "real" cargo trains: have You ever heard of the "Ruebendampf" near Noerdlingen (literally "sugar beet steam", an event where up to 4 steam engines pull heavy harvest trains up to 2500 tons the first miles on their way to the sugar factory.
If You're interested, I made a video about this myself: th-cam.com/video/1s4iNBttAmk/w-d-xo.html
Some facts about the BR50 class. It was constructed as an multipurpose Engine for smaller Railway lines without a proper turntable. The tender is special made for this class. Its not the cheap war tender you might have seen on the 52s. For example as you can see it has plates mounted on the tender, so you can pull the train backwards at normal speed and you do not have to turn the engine around for example in passenger service.
In australia on some lines we have 12.5 ton axle limits and then we have 10 kilometre speed limits on sections of those lines
Excellent video. As far as the train length is concerned, I counted 32 cars, most of them loaded. I took a look at a German language locomotive book. Power output was 1195 KW, or roughly 1620 HP. The original design requirement was to be able to haul 1000 Metric tons on level track at 70 kph, but this train appears to be much heavier, hence the diesel pusher in back. Still, the class 50 and war simplified class 52 was a very rugged and reliable design that could easily be run past its design limits. Impressive, considering it was a lightweight design intended to be usable on branch lines with a 15 ton axle load.
Coolest protest ever.
Hope it drew enough attention to make a change, though i can't see how it couldn't lol.
Also, I noticed you always bob your head to the beat of the exhaust. I always tap my foot in the downbeat too. It's a musician thing. Normies wouldn't get it!
Seeing the length of the train and lading i can see why we got some wheel slip on start up. Second favorite steam engine wheel slip with the Nickle Plate 765 photo arrival at Lasalle Street station in Chicago 7ish years ago as my top one. Look it up you get the stack talk,whistle and bell echoing off the man made canyons of Chicago and then hogger either opened the throttle a little too much or hit a area of slick rail but it's a feast for the ears and a throwback to what it must have sounded like when the Rock Island, NYC and NKP ran steam and passengers into Lasalle Street for real rather than excursions.
The DBR Class 52s also had the same whistle as the 50s but only the later ones. The earlier ones had high-pitched whistles like the ones in Bosnia.
Nice to hear from the Kregslokfurer. Wonderful video.
Hi Hyce. This one is off topic, but would love to see you react to the 1949 cartoon made for Timken roller bearings.
There's a cartoon for that? Lol! I'll have to look for it.
@@Hyce777 th-cam.com/video/j5EAVKiWAqY/w-d-xo.htmlfeature=shared
Here's the one from Timken themselves as opposed to a re-upload.
Hey there,
geetings from ze Germany. Instances like this, where a railway operator is in a bind and hires a steam locomotive to pull their revenue train, happen every now and again here in Germany. This comes mainly to the fact, that most of the lines are electrified. So among all the railway companies there aren’t that may diesels to begin with. Other than the UK for example.
Another case of that happend recently around Mannheim. A MoW-company needed some trains to be moved around and asked a railway club if the big diesel that they owned was available. The diesel was undergoing some maintenance work but mostly as a joke the club made the company an offer for their Steamer - class 58 311. To their surprise the company took the offer and so their over 100 year old Prussian goods engine pulled the 1500 ton train all by itself.
rail tracks like 1950 locomotives. protest against the state of infrastructure in the Thuringian Forest
very rough google translate. but that is essentially what the tender says
Regarding the tenders of the 50s: several different models existed beside the one shown here. One bathtub-shaped one was built during WW2 and was also the default for the 53 war type. Their primary point was to save materials. They were used for standard 50s, too postwar.
A not very common tender type which was unique to the 50s was a cab-tender, which replaced the caboose-alike Güterzugbegleitwagen.
If you want to hear another good sounding loc, i recommend the Baureihe 41. Somehow it tends to always sound great.
The youtube channel Powered by steam has a "few" good clips
I recommend the video "Steam locomotive 41 1144 is fighting alone on the mountain"
Another nice once is 41 241, a Dutch owned 41. Recently had a refurb. There is also a nice video on the same youtube page.
This shuld be the new normal; if you wanna protest, run a choo choo
10:34 He´s got the bar right at center
In your Europe trip, have you been to Germany to visit the Brockenbahn? It's revenue narrow gauge steam hauling passengers up a mountain. They run upto 25 steamloc's. People think its just a tourist attraction but its run by a regional public transport company. Beautiful mountain scenery there to
Over here in Germany we have a lot of Steam Locomotives kept in operating condition by museums and volunteers . We also have many museum railways using steam.
"Railways like locomotives protest against the state of infrastructure in the Thuringian Forest" translation according to google
German here, the square say "like [in] 1950", so it would be read:
Rails like [in] 1950
Locomotives like [in] 1950
*Protest* against the [bad] state of the [rail] infrastructure in the Thüringer forest
Blowing the wissle at crossings, only when there’s is a wayside marker to tell you. Usually at unprotected crossings.
The diesel that is pushing has a low speed engine, so it sounds like idling over the whole power band.
The tender on this locomotive is a 'neubautender' built according to improved design plans for the original version.
What's interesting is UP 4014 Big Boy it quite capable of doing revenue service. They'd probably have to keep it limited to certain sub-divisions though so it could be serviced with water and fuel.
Best sounding European whistle I have heard in a while. Definitely more enjoyable than other ones from across the pond. Fantastic to see a big Decapod working for the money like they use to. ❤
This is what’s on the tender “Rail tracks locomotives protest against the state of infrastructure in the Thuringian Forest”
I think the diesel locomotives they would normally use, if the track could handle it, would be six-axle types such as the "Ludmilla". The BR50 has only five driving axles, as well as having a reduced axle load - it is similar in that respect to the British Standard 9F. So to reliably start the train and keep it moving on gradients, having the small diesel on the back would actually be very helpful, even though it wouldn't be able to haul the train on its own.
There was a companion type to the 50/52, namely the 40/42. This had a heavier axle load and three-cylinder drive, in the same 2-10-0 format. I'm not sure whether any of them are still in running order.