Veliki pozdrav,gospodine Hurwitz,pišem komentar na mom Srpskom jeziku,jer ne znam tako dobro Engleski i nadam secda cete imati prevod!Nažalost,od pre dva dana Gugl prevodilac ne funkcioniše i iako vas ne razumem u potpunosti nastavljam da vas gledam...Od svih Šostakovičevih simfonija 8 je za mene posebna,slušala sam je bezbroj puta.Monumentalno delo posveceno E.Mravinskom.U jednom intervjuu koji sam gledala sa Ruske tv ,slavni dirigent je rekao da je za njega bio najsrecniji trenutak u životu kada mu je Šostakovič saopštio da je simfoniju posvetio njemu.Obožavam ih obojicu!!Ovo izvodjenje je vrhunsko...Ipak,moram da kažem da meni za nijansu bolje zvuči izvodjenje Kirila Kondrašina sa Moskovskim filharmonijskim Orkestrom...Adadjo,ta esencija kosmičkog bola ,ljudske patnje,je nešto najtužnije što sam čula.Moje mišljenje je da je Šostakovičev smisao za muzički izraz osecanja ljudske patnje jedinstven i neponovljiv...(Miecyslav Wainberg,kome je Šostakovič mnogo pomogao u karijeri je komponovao po ugledu na njega,tj.ima tu karakteristiku...Tužno je što taj izvanredni kompozitor nije dovoljno zastupljen u muzičkom svetu),vi to sigurno znate 1000puta bolje od mene!I na kraju želim da dodam da je i Rudolf Barshai 8.simfoniju izuzetno dobro interpretirao...
Thank you for your comment. Here is a translation for those who do not speak Serbian: "Greetings, Mr. Hurwitz, I'm writing the comment in my Serbian language, because I don't know English that well and I hope you will have a translation! Unfortunately, since two days ago, Google translator is not working and even though I don't fully understand you, I continue to watch you... Of all Shostakovich's symphonies, 8 is special to me, I have listened to it countless times. A monumental piece dedicated to E. Mravinsky. the most telling moment in my life when Shostakovich announced that he had dedicated the symphony to him. I adore them both!! This performance is superb... However, I have to say that the performance of Kirill Kondrashin with the Moscow Philharmonic Orchestra sounds a shade better to me... Adagio, that essence of cosmic pain, human suffering, is the saddest thing I've heard. My opinion is that Shostakovich's sense of musical expression of feeling human suffering is unique and unrepeatable... (Miecyslav Wainberg, whom Shostakovich helped a lot in his career, he composed after him, i.e. he has that characteristic... It's sad that this outstanding composer is not represented enough in the music world), you surely know that 1000 times better than me! And finally I want to add that Rudolf Barshai also interpreted the 8th symphony extremely well..."
I've always found the ending to be posing a question: trying to find solace amid the horrors the music paints before it, the horrors of war and dictatorship. Incredibly powerful and very humane.
I’m not surprised but, I’m still not too sure, what with the sonics of this recording. That last movement, really makes the back of my hair curl up, every time.
Lady Macbeth doesn't end quietly, there's a loud F minor chord for the full orchestra. I realize the scene peters out and most of it is quiet and hardly hopeful, but there's a big difference between a loud final chord and the ending of the 4th, 8th, 13th, and 15th symphonies, or indeed the other mentioned examples.
I'm going to have to give this version a try. The reason I've avoided it has more to do with the legacy of lousy sounding recordings of Mravinsky performances. My go to has always been Sanderling, who by the way knows "grim" more than most, and he's better recorded. But since you've advocated so convincingly for this recording, I need to once again throw caution and my wallet to the winds. Thanks for another extremely informative review.
Dave, really? A 1/2 step doesn't really make a difference? Imagine listening to Beethoven 9 or Brahms 2 in Eb instead of D major. No thank you. Otherwise, great recommendation.
No, actually, it doesn't; it's not a big deal at all. Your question is typical of those who try to make something out of very little. Imagine that! You say. OK, I did. Sounds much the same to me. Remember, the difference is not how the work was actually played, but rather how it was pitched on the recording--so there is no difference in the character of the playing as such. The instruments that sounded comfortable or somehow "right" in the original key still do, because they are playing in that original key. The rest is just a technical fumble. I would agree with you if the work were actually played in the wrong key, but that's not the issue here.
@@RobMathesTammyMathes Well, for one thing it mucks up the tempi if it's reproduced sharp or flat. I sure don't have perfect pitch but after a few minutes of listening I invariably get the feeling that something's wrong if it's a semitone off, never mind a whole tone. A quarter tone, meh, not so much but I believe the listener will feel uncomfortable if it's off. With vocal music, it's catastrophic. I chose a JVC cd player that can adjust pitch but fortunately an off pitch disc or file can be easily fixed in a PC nowadays.
It's the same performance, but with the pitch corrected. There is a note on the back of the CD that explains what they did. It's on Alto's website IIRC.
Thanks for the tip. The old Philips CD is a bit expensive but the pitch-corrected CDs on Regis and Alto Records are astonishingly cheap to get.
I think Regis/Alto also corrected the tempo. The Philips version is slightly faster and slightly sharper.
@@jameslee2943 Yes, that's right according to Discogs. The Regis and Alto share the same remaster, so you can buy the one you get the cheapest.
Veliki pozdrav,gospodine Hurwitz,pišem komentar na mom Srpskom jeziku,jer ne znam tako dobro Engleski i nadam secda cete imati prevod!Nažalost,od pre dva dana Gugl prevodilac ne funkcioniše i iako vas ne razumem u potpunosti nastavljam da vas gledam...Od svih Šostakovičevih simfonija 8 je za mene posebna,slušala sam je bezbroj puta.Monumentalno delo posveceno E.Mravinskom.U jednom intervjuu koji sam gledala sa Ruske tv ,slavni dirigent je rekao da je za njega bio najsrecniji trenutak u životu kada mu je Šostakovič saopštio da je simfoniju posvetio njemu.Obožavam ih obojicu!!Ovo izvodjenje je vrhunsko...Ipak,moram da kažem da meni za nijansu bolje zvuči izvodjenje Kirila Kondrašina sa Moskovskim filharmonijskim Orkestrom...Adadjo,ta esencija kosmičkog bola ,ljudske patnje,je nešto najtužnije što sam čula.Moje mišljenje je da je Šostakovičev smisao za muzički izraz osecanja ljudske patnje jedinstven i neponovljiv...(Miecyslav Wainberg,kome je Šostakovič mnogo pomogao u karijeri je komponovao po ugledu na njega,tj.ima tu karakteristiku...Tužno je što taj izvanredni kompozitor nije dovoljno zastupljen u muzičkom svetu),vi to sigurno znate 1000puta bolje od mene!I na kraju želim da dodam da je i Rudolf Barshai 8.simfoniju izuzetno dobro interpretirao...
Thank you for your comment. Here is a translation for those who do not speak Serbian:
"Greetings, Mr. Hurwitz, I'm writing the comment in my Serbian language, because I don't know English that well and I hope you will have a translation! Unfortunately, since two days ago, Google translator is not working and even though I don't fully understand you, I continue to watch you... Of all Shostakovich's symphonies, 8 is special to me, I have listened to it countless times. A monumental piece dedicated to E. Mravinsky. the most telling moment in my life when Shostakovich announced that he had dedicated the symphony to him. I adore them both!! This performance is superb... However, I have to say that the performance of Kirill Kondrashin with the Moscow Philharmonic Orchestra sounds a shade better to me... Adagio, that essence of cosmic pain, human suffering, is the saddest thing I've heard. My opinion is that Shostakovich's sense of musical expression of feeling human suffering is unique and unrepeatable... (Miecyslav Wainberg, whom Shostakovich helped a lot in his career, he composed after him, i.e. he has that characteristic... It's sad that this outstanding composer is not represented enough in the music world), you surely know that 1000 times better than me! And finally I want to add that Rudolf Barshai also interpreted the 8th symphony extremely well..."
@@DavesClassicalGuide Thanks a lot,you are so kind🎯
I find Kondrashin, with Moscow Phil, particularly smart in choosing a flexible approach to tempi and highly sensitive with dinamics.
I believe Alto released a pitch-corrected version that is still in print.
Yes, and it sounds very good.
Informative, I will check it out ❤️
I've always found the ending to be posing a question: trying to find solace amid the horrors the music paints before it, the horrors of war and dictatorship. Incredibly powerful and very humane.
David, I'm still recommending this performance to you on the Altus label, in SACD sound. It really does sound amazing.
It always sounded very good.
I've never been crazy about Mravinsky in Shostakovich, but I think this particular Shostakovich 8 is terrific.
The most absolute reference.
I’m not surprised but, I’m still not too sure, what with the sonics of this recording. That last movement, really makes the back of my hair curl up, every time.
Recently saw Lady Macbeth of Mtensk, which also ends quietly. Imagine that, an opera that ends quietly…
Lots of operas end quietly--the Ring, for example, or Parsifal, or Aida, or Otello, or Peter Grimes, or Dialogues of the Carmelites, or...
Lady Macbeth doesn't end quietly, there's a loud F minor chord for the full orchestra. I realize the scene peters out and most of it is quiet and hardly hopeful, but there's a big difference between a loud final chord and the ending of the 4th, 8th, 13th, and 15th symphonies, or indeed the other mentioned examples.
Which Shostakovich 4th symphony have you made a Dave'S Fave?
I'm going to have to give this version a try. The reason I've avoided it has more to do with the legacy of lousy sounding recordings of Mravinsky performances. My go to has always been Sanderling, who by the way knows "grim" more than most, and he's better recorded. But since you've advocated so convincingly for this recording, I need to once again throw caution and my wallet to the winds. Thanks for another extremely informative review.
Dave, really? A 1/2 step doesn't really make a difference? Imagine listening to Beethoven 9 or Brahms 2 in Eb instead of D major. No thank you. Otherwise, great recommendation.
No, actually, it doesn't; it's not a big deal at all. Your question is typical of those who try to make something out of very little. Imagine that! You say. OK, I did. Sounds much the same to me. Remember, the difference is not how the work was actually played, but rather how it was pitched on the recording--so there is no difference in the character of the playing as such. The instruments that sounded comfortable or somehow "right" in the original key still do, because they are playing in that original key. The rest is just a technical fumble. I would agree with you if the work were actually played in the wrong key, but that's not the issue here.
@@RobMathesTammyMathes Well, for one thing it mucks up the tempi if it's reproduced sharp or flat. I sure don't have perfect pitch but after a few minutes of listening I invariably get the feeling that something's wrong if it's a semitone off, never mind a whole tone. A quarter tone, meh, not so much but I believe the listener will feel uncomfortable if it's off. With vocal music, it's catastrophic. I chose a JVC cd player that can adjust pitch but fortunately an off pitch disc or file can be easily fixed in a PC nowadays.
@@RobMathesTammyMathes It's nonsense, of course it matters! Ridiculous to suggest otherwise.
How's the performance of Alto's issue compared with this one?
See below.
It's the same performance, but with the pitch corrected. There is a note on the back of the CD that explains what they did. It's on Alto's website IIRC.