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To piggyback on mid generation updates undermining the value proposition of a console, i feel like longer dev cycles have an impact here too. A dev team back in the day could get 4 or 5 games out during a console generation and could really maximize what the machine could do over time. Now many dev teams are lucky if they get 2 games out per generation.
Jacob is right about Orange btw. I learned in my physics class that it doesn't actually exist. Our brain/eyes interpret it weird and it shows up "orange" to us.
Here's my thoughts on the PS5 Pro. From a specs perspective, it is an awesome mid-gen refresh with new features that will genuinely impact how games look and perform. PSSR is a great addition and will totally change the way a game like FF7 Rebirth looks compared to the current upscaling solution the base PS5 offers. This will truly make image quality look better, even to those more "laymen" gamers who struggle to see a difference between 1080p and 4K. Not only that, native resolution will also be higher in general, allowing for the input resolutions to already be of a higher quality. Currently, 3rd party games are reguarly running at sub 900p on PS5 and then upscaled. I think this has created image quality that suffers (to my eyes). The bigger GPU will also make an impact beyond resolution. Maybe we'll see games with graphic settings cranked closer to PC max settings while also maintaining great image quality and performance because of PSSR. So then why did Sony demonstrate literally none of this in the presentation? Last of Us is not a game anyone is complaining about image quality with. It's close to a flawless game visually, even on the PS5 performance mode. So who cares. Plus the ray tracing displays? Some blurry reflections in a UE4 game and gameplay raytracing we've already seen in a photo mode? Not exciting at all. Plus, the stream quality was terrible, and the games they chose to compare were so contrary to the point their trying to make. Ratchet and Clank having more background detail is going to entice about 10 people in the world. Night and day difference in image quality for a game like Wukong? Lots of people would care. But you can only show that through detailed capture and screenshots running at 4K 60 with very clear comparisons. If they did that and PSSR is what they claim it to be, most people should be able to spot a difference. That being said, the price is difficult. Why sell a "professional" model of your systems that is guranteed to only intrigue your hardcore audience (and wealthy people) and leave out desperately needed features? People who's whole library is mostly on disc; those are the people interested in this system. So for (probably) most people, the disc drive is a requirement. The disc drive is a complete rip-off price wise, and Sony is making a profit off it. Sony is also making a profit off the stand, and also making a profit off the console itself. That's all well in good besides it feeling like a blatant rip-off when consumers already feel jaded by a 700$ price tag. Which, by the way, isn't that bad in the US. You're not getting any comparable PC at 700$. Maybe at 1000-1100$, but not 700$. However, everyone else in the world is just disrespected. The prices are absurd for people out of America and illogicaly priced based on currency exchange. Which then raises the questions, what's the point of a console compared to a PC when physical media is gone? Why not use that 800$ you'd spend on a complete "Pro" model and invest in a PC? The price is getting to close to justify a box. The reason the PS5 is such a deal is, for 500$, you get a system that can run current games at (mostly) decent performance. That's the appeal. How expensive can it become before just being a worse PC with less options? But here's my last pet-peeve with the new console discussion, especially with the US market perspective. This system is a great option for people who this is important to. People who don't want a PC, want PS exclusives day one, and want better quality for their games. Sony is not forcing this on anyone, the announcement was completely lowkey, and specs wise the system is actually really cool. So who cares? Why is there outrage? If you can't see a difference, don't get it. The option is there for people who want it and are willing to spend the money.
What comparison has been made on FSR2/3 vs PSSR (and not even mentioning DLSS which isn't available on consoles)? I would suggest people just wait till the console is in people's hands for real analysis and comparison. I do think the question of "why complain about Sony making a console for people willing to spend the money" is missing the argument... the same could be asked, why not make a cheaper console (aka series S?) or why not make a mobile version (aka Steamdeck) .... or a super Pro version (aka PC). The PS4Pro was was a solution to a problem.... whereas PS5Pro is a More$ = MorePerformance = MoreSelfWorth (the tech-cultural war aspect from Mobile Phone industry that has been a cancer in tech IMO).
I’m with y’all.. it’s way too overpriced BUT you know it’s gonna run FF7 Part 3 so much better 😭… not to mention GTA6. I hate to do it but I will probably be getting one eventually. Gotta see Digital Foundry’s breakdown of the console first before making the decision..
I know it’s like the least of concerns when it comes to the PS5 Pro and it’s problems but I think the fact that they call it PSSR for “Playstaion Spectral Sampling Resolution” when it should honestly be PSSSR irks the crap outta me. Like PlayStation has always been abbreviated as “PS” but for whatever reason it’s just “P” in that. Hell the PS5 Pro isn’t even called the P5 Pro.
Not to be the “umm, actually” guy, but Super Sampling tech isn’t just anti-aliasing; it’s rendering at a much lower resolution, then up sampling to your display’s output. It’s what gives you 4K/60, as even a $700 USD console couldn’t typically do that at a native resolution.
Lets all give Sony $800 so we can play games we all have already platinumed. As long as we all rebuy our games OR give Sony another $80. Sony are effed in the head. Oh and Canada and the UK are getting boned.
I don’t get all the hate for the pro. It’s called the “pro” not the “mini” or the “amateur” I also agree with most people that it’s not going to be a worthwhile upgrade for people. Personally I own a base ps5 and a solid gaming pc - if I really want to run a game at high fps and high fidelity - I’ll run it on my pc. But some people just want to play on a console. You can always sell your ps5 for $350 and buy a pro if you want the upgrade. Most console players are not pixel peepers so it’s not a big deal. But Monster Hunter Wilds is my big, anticipated game of 2025 - I’m sure it will run vastly better on the pro. If I didn’t have a pc, something like the pro would be much more interesting to me.
$700 is too much, but in fairness, my base model PS5 cost me $630 after I bought a 2TB SSD. Had they said the Pro comes with a 2TB SSD, that would have helped, at least a little.
I was right there with Haley on the storage because I thought she was saying PS5 Pro should have 4TB of storage for that price. SSDs are not that expensive
@@Feanaro5503 Wow, I had no idea about this, but I just checked and you're correct. Games media should be talking about this in their discussions about the price, as this kind of explains the price of the PS5 Pro being more powerful, but still doesn't have a disc drive. It's a very valid discussion point, and not addressing it is kind of negligent. Thanks for sharing!
In this weeks question submission email, you said you were going to talk about Yars Rising on this episode. Did that get pushed back to next week for some reason? Because I like that game and would love to hear your thoughts on it.
The PS5 Pro reveal was a disaster. Sony is completely out of touch. The price point was bad enough but not having a disc drive was the nail in the coffin. Not sure who this was made for except the top 1% of PS diehards. Felt like a total misfire.
@jonathanbaird if it is considered the best version of the PS5, and the original version has a disc drive, this feels like a downgrade in that regard. It's not just for games, but also a blu ray player too. Just a strange decision.
The leaks for the switch 2 were saying it looks like the architecture is equivalent to the 3000 Series nVidia chips which would imply it would utilize DLSS which has been an option since the 2000 Series, not to mention a perfect solution for the switch.
Haley is the most gorgeous person - I just love her natural reactions. As for the PS5Pro; I think that the issue isn't whether it's technically costing that much money, but rather that if that's the cost, perhaps they shouldn't have developed a console that is targeting specifically those people with more money... it's that FOMO and culture war 2 tiered system that is everything wrong with modern consumer technology. More importantly, it's Sony trying to normalise ridiculous costs... whereas if the cost of marginal improvements in performance are getting so high, then maybe a technology leader should use it's market position to change the narrative into considering gaming doesn't need to be about the nth decimal point improvement... rather than doubling down on it (as mentioned - this additional "fidelity" is also coming along with stupidly long development times). It also seems to be saying to devs - don't optimise, we'll just use brute force to solve your PR problems - meanwhile 95% of non-Pro players will get poor performance.
i play most games on graphic mode and don't notice a difference in performance . Valhalla looked ass on performance and i switched to graphic and it played the same but looked way better
i have a ps4 currently, and it has basically just become my dvd machine… i just play everything on my steam deck. i keep thinking about upgrading to the ps5 and then reminding myself that i don’t like being locked on the couch to play a game on my tv. so the ps5 pro, with the lack of disc drive, and the price point, and the lack of exclusives just makes the decision not to upgrade even easier.
I think if it included a dualsense edge, a disc drive, A STAND and maybe even the new Astrobot thrown in preinstalled, then maaaaaybe it would be slightly closer to being kinda worth it for some people. But for this price to not only have no extras but less features than the base PS5 is ridiculous. Btw I also thought it was still only 1tb, you’re not alone Haley
I agree with Jacob on performance mode looking good enough except for Rebirth and Stellar Blade, both of which looked weirdly blurry. Not worth $810 to upgrade my base ps5 tho.
Feel like a lot of the negativity towards the PS5 Pro (both online and in the podcast) is due to the price being $700 and the fact they're charging you extra for the disc drive and vertical stand. That outrage is definitely warrented, but I don't think the argument should shift to "no one cares about fidelity as long as its 60fps" and just write off a PS5 Pro needing to exist Performance modes for most games on PS5 (the non-Sony first party ones) generally have really bad image quality, often times with 720p-1080p resolutions being upscaled and even then may have performance issues that VRR needs to fix. I understand a lot of this is due to improper use of upscaling/engines by developers on tough deadlines, but realistically the best short-term solution is to just have more powerful hardware with a (potentially) better upscaling method in PSSR. Is this solution worth $700+$80+$30? Hell no lol. But if someone plays their PS5 often and is bothered by the soft image quality of games like FF7 Rebirth, FF16, GOW Ragnarok, Jedi Survivor, HFW, Guardians of the Galaxy, etc, then yeah I dont blame them at all for getting a PS5 Pro if its reasonably in their budget (especially if that person doesn't have a 120Hz TV so they cant play GOW, HFW, etc on their great 40FPS modes)
Exactly. I play a lot of games and this is something that has bothered me for a while.. then I upgraded my tv to an OLED and it’s even more apparent. Playing Rebirth on 30fps because performance was so blurry really sucked.. and I’m noticing it more and more as games come out like Black Myth Wukong. I’m definitely contemplating getting a Pro, especially know FF7 Part 3 and GTA 6 are coming in the future.. If Rebirth struggled to run performance mode on PS5, I already know Part 3 is going to be even more demanding..
9:09 I'm sorry, but I don't take this statement seriously AT ALL after Jacob said previously that he could not see a difference between the LCD screen on the Steam Deck, and the OLED screen on the new Steam Deck. This dude needs prescription eyeglasses.
I hear you, but keep in mind how little the graphics change when you primarily play smaller or indie games. My Steam Deck is a cornucopia of little indie gems which I seriously doubt would look appreciably different on a spiffier screen.
@@wittynicknamehere I'm sorry, but an OLED would make the colors on even the most basic NES game pop out. Not seeing the difference on a OLED screen is legit mental.
This reveal and the sticker shock now makes buying a regular PS5 a sensible idea. Congratulations to Sony for a record breaking sales number this upcoming holiday season. ... seriously, this reeks of psychological manipulation. Like how costco puts their expensive items out front to make customers feel temoted, and when they aay no, anything else they inside the store would now feel like a good reward for being a good person. And wven if they sell some of these uvly butts, it'll still be a win.
If the developers want "more" and the PS5 Pro is giving them that, aren't first party titles going to be too heavy to handle for a base model PS5 in a year or two? Will it even be capable of running any of these games in 60fps at all or will we regular Joes have to deal with the fact that we'll need to buy a Pro to even have luxury again?
I mean, that same thing happened with the base PS4 - I had one and performance was atrocious for the last few games, but it felt like absolute insanity to have to buy another, so I just stopped using it for modern intensive games. At this point I'll never buy a base console again and just wait for the pro to lower the price - with the added bonus that there might actually be exclusive games by then
@@marcosm1223 Yep. This is the way, I'm finding. Let a library build up and the machine's price depreciate a bit, then swoop in on a Black Friday or Xmas bundle. I'm old enough now that I no longer care about being "part of the conversation" on the latest and greatest as soon as it's in the wild.
@@marcosm1223 Yeah, I hear ya. I didn't really have that issue back then, as I only gamed on my PS4, but now that I have a decent PC and framerate has become such n important factor for me, I can't imagine going back to anything lower than that.
I don't have a ps5 but designwise... they havent fixed something since the ps4 which is the buttons and the obscure ways you need to hard reset it etc... I still have to get close and squint and see what button is what on my ps4 because the symbols are so tiny
My only argument for the price point is that Xbox is putting out a 600 disc less series x with a 2tb ssd. For 100 dollars more we would be getting a better gpu and essentially PlayStation dlss and ray tracing. I still don’t agree with this price as I would have bit the bullet with an included hard drive but I’m not spending 800 for the full kit as I am a big physical gamer and that’s too much. I’ll wait for the ps6 I guess.
That price is bananas. 30 years ago I bought a PC for about $2400 and my console was about $200-$300. Nowadays you can buy a decent PC for around $1000 but a new console is $700+???
To be fair the power you should be comparing it to is a pc equivalent and not a low grade pc, to where the ps5 pro is cheaper by more than just $700 vs $1000. Although even a low grade pc can do much, much more than the more powerful gpu that the pro would have including playing thousands of more games. That being said the price is still outrageous seeing as that they absolutely could have sold it at a lower cost since its already been reported that Sony allowed the higher cost since it has no competition in the "mid-console generation" upgrade. I hope people don't support the ps5 pro. It's scary to think of the cost of their consoles going forward if xbox leaves the market.
All this love for "astrobot" is mildly confusing. The first game I played on ps5 was "rift apart," which I feel is superior to astro in every way. Mainly story(it kinda has one), progression(upgrade guns and gadgets), and player freedom(choosing what to use and buy). Astro is good no doubt, but the only thing it does well for me is make me miss older PS games we will never see again.
Very dissapointed you guys missed the opportunity to pronounce PSSR as pisser. No but really the ps5 reveal felt like the ps3 reveal again. Above what most are willing to pay with Sony just assuming they'll keep their spot on top. The best thing about the ps5 pro is that the ps5's used cost immediately dropped.
Massive difference between an optional more expensive model of an existing console and a new console generation. Anyone who balks at the Pro’s price can get a PS5 Slim digital for $450, or less once the Black Friday deals start.
The level of ignorance about the benefits of AI upscaling in game graphics was amazing. Tech like DLSS has made a huge difference in PC games in the last few years.
So they should put out an outdated console and release full priced $60 ports and barely upgraded "remasters" like that other trash gaming company Nintendo?
@@smellywaffels1967 Get a life fan boy, your jealousy is showing. Nintendo is having no problem getting new games and ports/remasters every month. Why isn't Sony remastering games like Ape Escape/Tokyo Jungle/Fat Princess? Tokyo Jungle is trapped on the PS3, just like MGS4. Why aren't Sony/MS creating smaller games or more affordable games? How are Sony/MS going to make games if they keep closing studios and laying off staff? These are signs of trash companies.
I collect physical so PC gaming is not an option im willing to take until im forced to. The Pro coming out as digital only with an disc drive add on that requires the internet to even allow it to connect is an absolute no. Ill stick with the base ps5.
I live for experiences, not collecting plastic. There are countless amazing creative games on pc that will never get a physical release. I wish companies would prioritize media preservation and customer ownership, but that's still possible with digital distribution. PC gaming is the heart of the industry and the biggest source of innovation. With or without a drive, consoles only give you a taste of that, with a strictly controlled (and unmodded) experience.
@@arckinenso7615 "I live for experiences, not collecting plastic" yet you play games instead of touching grass and actually living an experience. PC sucks, $5,000 for crashing games, hacked multiplayer and no exclusives. Keep paying all that money for the same games the rest of us play for way cheaper.
@@smellywaffels1967 I travel, grow a large garden, and spend time with my friends and family every day. I also play video games that are filled with imagination and wonderful experiences you can't find in real life. Do you have any real arguments, or just strawmen and other fallacies? I suspect you waste a lot of your life trolling strangers with bad faith comments, so I'm not the one who needs to touch grass.
@@cbender128 Come again? It’s been long proven that PC is by far the most economical of the gaming ecosystems. A single PC can last 10+ years, games are exponentially more affordable and backwards compatible, and you can use any controllers and peripheral you’d like.
@@Feanaro5503 My 1080ti (2016) runs many new titles. For those that don’t, I just pay $16 for temp access to a 4080ti via GeForce Now. It’s much preferable to dropping $500-800 every five years, losing my library of games, and having to purchase new accessories.
I always get sold on platformers and immediately am reminded I do not understand the appeal. I played 35 minutes of Astro Bot and put it down. Still don’t get it. It’s well made, I see that but I do not understand the platformer collectathon. Why do I want this coin? It does literally nothing.
i wish i had the kind of money to quit playing games i purchase 35 minutes into them --- i still wouldn't quit on a game that soon, but the money would be nice...
The coins are to spend on the gacha mini-game to unlock outfits, ship paint jobs and diorama's for your bots. If you played more than 35 minutes and got to that part you will know the coins actually have a purpose and do not in fact "literally do nothing".
If you are outraged by the price of this thing clearly you don’t know much about the games industry or really capitalism as a whole. For most of us we grew up with consoles that were sold at a loss. We are well beyond those days on top of the highest prices we’ve seen in for all goods. We live in a world where apple put out 3000 dollar fucking vr goggles. These companies are scratching and clawing for every cent they can get and if you don’t like the price of something the loudest message you can send is not buying it and it’s the only message that matters.
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Here’s the real question. Can it run Crysis?
I want to watch Jacob’s descent into Warhammer 40k lore
To piggyback on mid generation updates undermining the value proposition of a console, i feel like longer dev cycles have an impact here too. A dev team back in the day could get 4 or 5 games out during a console generation and could really maximize what the machine could do over time. Now many dev teams are lucky if they get 2 games out per generation.
Haley turning into Anton Chigurh while playing CoD is hilarious and terrifying
sad janet isn't here just so she'd say "fuck the big 3, it's just big me"
😂 I see why you said that. Every time they say big 3, that's all I hear now.
And it fits so much 😂.
Jacob is right about Orange btw. I learned in my physics class that it doesn't actually exist. Our brain/eyes interpret it weird and it shows up "orange" to us.
Interrupting Ben with a I PLAYED THAT needs to be a regular thing for the intro.
Thank you Kyle for giving World War Z some love. That game is so much fun and gets overlooked all the time.
45:25 Wild Bastards IS available on Switch
Good catch.
Here's my thoughts on the PS5 Pro.
From a specs perspective, it is an awesome mid-gen refresh with new features that will genuinely impact how games look and perform. PSSR is a great addition and will totally change the way a game like FF7 Rebirth looks compared to the current upscaling solution the base PS5 offers. This will truly make image quality look better, even to those more "laymen" gamers who struggle to see a difference between 1080p and 4K. Not only that, native resolution will also be higher in general, allowing for the input resolutions to already be of a higher quality. Currently, 3rd party games are reguarly running at sub 900p on PS5 and then upscaled. I think this has created image quality that suffers (to my eyes).
The bigger GPU will also make an impact beyond resolution. Maybe we'll see games with graphic settings cranked closer to PC max settings while also maintaining great image quality and performance because of PSSR.
So then why did Sony demonstrate literally none of this in the presentation? Last of Us is not a game anyone is complaining about image quality with. It's close to a flawless game visually, even on the PS5 performance mode. So who cares. Plus the ray tracing displays? Some blurry reflections in a UE4 game and gameplay raytracing we've already seen in a photo mode? Not exciting at all. Plus, the stream quality was terrible, and the games they chose to compare were so contrary to the point their trying to make. Ratchet and Clank having more background detail is going to entice about 10 people in the world. Night and day difference in image quality for a game like Wukong? Lots of people would care. But you can only show that through detailed capture and screenshots running at 4K 60 with very clear comparisons. If they did that and PSSR is what they claim it to be, most people should be able to spot a difference.
That being said, the price is difficult. Why sell a "professional" model of your systems that is guranteed to only intrigue your hardcore audience (and wealthy people) and leave out desperately needed features? People who's whole library is mostly on disc; those are the people interested in this system. So for (probably) most people, the disc drive is a requirement.
The disc drive is a complete rip-off price wise, and Sony is making a profit off it. Sony is also making a profit off the stand, and also making a profit off the console itself. That's all well in good besides it feeling like a blatant rip-off when consumers already feel jaded by a 700$ price tag.
Which, by the way, isn't that bad in the US. You're not getting any comparable PC at 700$. Maybe at 1000-1100$, but not 700$. However, everyone else in the world is just disrespected. The prices are absurd for people out of America and illogicaly priced based on currency exchange.
Which then raises the questions, what's the point of a console compared to a PC when physical media is gone? Why not use that 800$ you'd spend on a complete "Pro" model and invest in a PC? The price is getting to close to justify a box. The reason the PS5 is such a deal is, for 500$, you get a system that can run current games at (mostly) decent performance. That's the appeal. How expensive can it become before just being a worse PC with less options?
But here's my last pet-peeve with the new console discussion, especially with the US market perspective. This system is a great option for people who this is important to. People who don't want a PC, want PS exclusives day one, and want better quality for their games. Sony is not forcing this on anyone, the announcement was completely lowkey, and specs wise the system is actually really cool. So who cares? Why is there outrage? If you can't see a difference, don't get it. The option is there for people who want it and are willing to spend the money.
What comparison has been made on FSR2/3 vs PSSR (and not even mentioning DLSS which isn't available on consoles)? I would suggest people just wait till the console is in people's hands for real analysis and comparison. I do think the question of "why complain about Sony making a console for people willing to spend the money" is missing the argument... the same could be asked, why not make a cheaper console (aka series S?) or why not make a mobile version (aka Steamdeck) .... or a super Pro version (aka PC). The PS4Pro was was a solution to a problem.... whereas PS5Pro is a More$ = MorePerformance = MoreSelfWorth (the tech-cultural war aspect from Mobile Phone industry that has been a cancer in tech IMO).
I’m with y’all.. it’s way too overpriced BUT you know it’s gonna run FF7 Part 3 so much better 😭… not to mention GTA6. I hate to do it but I will probably be getting one eventually. Gotta see Digital Foundry’s breakdown of the console first before making the decision..
1:36:03 Jacob saying "the composer did a bad job" cracked me up! oh janet...
groceries and gas is insane 4 years now paying double everything takes a toll
Gonna need to see Justin Wong teach Ben an infinite
I know it’s like the least of concerns when it comes to the PS5 Pro and it’s problems but I think the fact that they call it PSSR for “Playstaion Spectral Sampling Resolution” when it should honestly be PSSSR irks the crap outta me. Like PlayStation has always been abbreviated as “PS” but for whatever reason it’s just “P” in that. Hell the PS5 Pro isn’t even called the P5 Pro.
Not to be the “umm, actually” guy, but Super Sampling tech isn’t just anti-aliasing; it’s rendering at a much lower resolution, then up sampling to your display’s output. It’s what gives you 4K/60, as even a $700 USD console couldn’t typically do that at a native resolution.
i lay my ps5 on its side with the stand thing and it's great
I do the same.
Lets all give Sony $800 so we can play games we all have already platinumed. As long as we all rebuy our games OR give Sony another $80. Sony are effed in the head. Oh and Canada and the UK are getting boned.
Now if Capcom can figure a way to rerelease Tatsunoko vs Capcom
I've been waiting for that one for a long time.
I'm a demon in that game lol, my favorite of all the vs games including Marvel would love to see it back
This is Sony’s version of DLSS, which by the way, is amazing and is absolutely worth it.
You’re right but most layman don’t know, don’t care until it’s in their face with tangible results
The slashes on the Pro are racing stripes. It means it goes, like, hella fast as efff boooooi.
Nintendo has the chance to do the funniest thing ever:
"$299."
I would love to see Hanson keep quizzing the panel during the community questions to hum a gaming tune.
I don’t get all the hate for the pro.
It’s called the “pro” not the “mini” or the “amateur”
I also agree with most people that it’s not going to be a worthwhile upgrade for people.
Personally I own a base ps5 and a solid gaming pc - if I really want to run a game at high fps and high fidelity - I’ll run it on my pc.
But some people just want to play on a console.
You can always sell your ps5 for $350 and buy a pro if you want the upgrade.
Most console players are not pixel peepers so it’s not a big deal.
But Monster Hunter Wilds is my big, anticipated game of 2025 - I’m sure it will run vastly better on the pro. If I didn’t have a pc, something like the pro would be much more interesting to me.
I watch this channel specifically for that 20 second intro. I need more of it.
That price made me double think buying one. I bet the PS5 Pro will be a major hit for GTA 6
Warcraft and Starcraft borrowed all their ideas from Warhammer.
Yeah that was the joke Ben was making...
Can’t wait to get a third job 🥹
$700 is too much, but in fairness, my base model PS5 cost me $630 after I bought a 2TB SSD. Had they said the Pro comes with a 2TB SSD, that would have helped, at least a little.
I was right there with Haley on the storage because I thought she was saying PS5 Pro should have 4TB of storage for that price. SSDs are not that expensive
The 2 TB Series X costs $600.
@@Feanaro5503 Wow, I had no idea about this, but I just checked and you're correct. Games media should be talking about this in their discussions about the price, as this kind of explains the price of the PS5 Pro being more powerful, but still doesn't have a disc drive. It's a very valid discussion point, and not addressing it is kind of negligent. Thanks for sharing!
@@prettyhatemachine101 Storage isn’t cheap, that is why the Switch only has 32 GB.
@@Feanaro5503No, that type of storage is super cheap. SSDs, especially the ps5s speeds are really expensive still.
Always good deals for Black Friday on those. Keep an eye out
In this weeks question submission email, you said you were going to talk about Yars Rising on this episode. Did that get pushed back to next week for some reason? Because I like that game and would love to hear your thoughts on it.
Hey, Kyle and I played a bit. Neither of us were super excited about it and we were a bit tight on time this episode, maaaybe next week.
I so desperately wanted Leo to be able to say what he wanted to when the PSSR discussion started. We were all thinking it.
Back in the PSSR?
has anyone at minnmax played tactical breach wizards? would love to hear you talk about it
Yes! We're planning on talking about it next week.
The PS5 Pro reveal was a disaster. Sony is completely out of touch. The price point was bad enough but not having a disc drive was the nail in the coffin. Not sure who this was made for except the top 1% of PS diehards. Felt like a total misfire.
The Pro will probably make up 10% of PS5 sales once it launches. You're the one who is completely out of touch with the market.
@@Echo__plex The lack of a disc drive in 2024 doesn’t seem “out of touch” to me. Then again, I’ve been gaming disc-less for 15 years.
@Feanaro5503 You're right. People are dying to buy a $700 console with marginal improvements. My mistake!
@jonathanbaird if it is considered the best version of the PS5, and the original version has a disc drive, this feels like a downgrade in that regard. It's not just for games, but also a blu ray player too. Just a strange decision.
@@Feanaro5503 no... lol
i am your beast is also on gog btw
I have only purchased games on eBay. Probably most obscure would be Secret of Evermore for the SNES
I just hate the fomo, playing games and always having that thought in the back of your head “how much better could this look?”
Hey, We really loved our Intellevision console and games. So much so that I had pre-ordered the Amico. I was very upset it didn't come out after all.
The leaks for the switch 2 were saying it looks like the architecture is equivalent to the 3000 Series nVidia chips which would imply it would utilize DLSS which has been an option since the 2000 Series, not to mention a perfect solution for the switch.
Do we think Sony are preparing us for PS6 being 900 bucks!?
Nice episode.
the limits of our wallets
Haley is the most gorgeous person - I just love her natural reactions. As for the PS5Pro; I think that the issue isn't whether it's technically costing that much money, but rather that if that's the cost, perhaps they shouldn't have developed a console that is targeting specifically those people with more money... it's that FOMO and culture war 2 tiered system that is everything wrong with modern consumer technology. More importantly, it's Sony trying to normalise ridiculous costs... whereas if the cost of marginal improvements in performance are getting so high, then maybe a technology leader should use it's market position to change the narrative into considering gaming doesn't need to be about the nth decimal point improvement... rather than doubling down on it (as mentioned - this additional "fidelity" is also coming along with stupidly long development times). It also seems to be saying to devs - don't optimise, we'll just use brute force to solve your PR problems - meanwhile 95% of non-Pro players will get poor performance.
i play most games on graphic mode and don't notice a difference in performance . Valhalla looked ass on performance and i switched to graphic and it played the same but looked way better
So here in the UK with a disc drive and stand it will be £810!!! WTF!
i have a ps4 currently, and it has basically just become my dvd machine… i just play everything on my steam deck. i keep thinking about upgrading to the ps5 and then reminding myself that i don’t like being locked on the couch to play a game on my tv. so the ps5 pro, with the lack of disc drive, and the price point, and the lack of exclusives just makes the decision not to upgrade even easier.
11:40 it’s an enthusiast product, like the pro versions of iphones. You don’t need it but it’s there, and people will still buy it.
I think if it included a dualsense edge, a disc drive, A STAND and maybe even the new Astrobot thrown in preinstalled, then maaaaaybe it would be slightly closer to being kinda worth it for some people. But for this price to not only have no extras but less features than the base PS5 is ridiculous. Btw I also thought it was still only 1tb, you’re not alone Haley
i loved Void Bastards, played it on game pass when it came out.
A bet a PS5 Pro could run a Bloodborne remaster pretty well........
Just saying.
I agree with Jacob on performance mode looking good enough except for Rebirth and Stellar Blade, both of which looked weirdly blurry. Not worth $810 to upgrade my base ps5 tho.
“PS5 Pro pushes limits?!” lol
To update. GameStop is actually giving up to $410 for a disc ps5 now with their pro membership. $385 no pro
Feel like a lot of the negativity towards the PS5 Pro (both online and in the podcast) is due to the price being $700 and the fact they're charging you extra for the disc drive and vertical stand. That outrage is definitely warrented, but I don't think the argument should shift to "no one cares about fidelity as long as its 60fps" and just write off a PS5 Pro needing to exist
Performance modes for most games on PS5 (the non-Sony first party ones) generally have really bad image quality, often times with 720p-1080p resolutions being upscaled and even then may have performance issues that VRR needs to fix. I understand a lot of this is due to improper use of upscaling/engines by developers on tough deadlines, but realistically the best short-term solution is to just have more powerful hardware with a (potentially) better upscaling method in PSSR.
Is this solution worth $700+$80+$30? Hell no lol. But if someone plays their PS5 often and is bothered by the soft image quality of games like FF7 Rebirth, FF16, GOW Ragnarok, Jedi Survivor, HFW, Guardians of the Galaxy, etc, then yeah I dont blame them at all for getting a PS5 Pro if its reasonably in their budget (especially if that person doesn't have a 120Hz TV so they cant play GOW, HFW, etc on their great 40FPS modes)
Exactly. I play a lot of games and this is something that has bothered me for a while.. then I upgraded my tv to an OLED and it’s even more apparent. Playing Rebirth on 30fps because performance was so blurry really sucked.. and I’m noticing it more and more as games come out like Black Myth Wukong. I’m definitely contemplating getting a Pro, especially know FF7 Part 3 and GTA 6 are coming in the future.. If Rebirth struggled to run performance mode on PS5, I already know Part 3 is going to be even more demanding..
FSR 3 frame generation just landed console support, why would anyone want Pro when regular PS5 can do the same thing in near future?
9:09 I'm sorry, but I don't take this statement seriously AT ALL after Jacob said previously that he could not see a difference between the LCD screen on the Steam Deck, and the OLED screen on the new Steam Deck.
This dude needs prescription eyeglasses.
I hear you, but keep in mind how little the graphics change when you primarily play smaller or indie games. My Steam Deck is a cornucopia of little indie gems which I seriously doubt would look appreciably different on a spiffier screen.
@@wittynicknamehere I'm sorry, but an OLED would make the colors on even the most basic NES game pop out.
Not seeing the difference on a OLED screen is legit mental.
This reveal and the sticker shock now makes buying a regular PS5 a sensible idea.
Congratulations to Sony for a record breaking sales number this upcoming holiday season.
... seriously, this reeks of psychological manipulation. Like how costco puts their expensive items out front to make customers feel temoted, and when they aay no, anything else they inside the store would now feel like a good reward for being a good person.
And wven if they sell some of these uvly butts, it'll still be a win.
If the developers want "more" and the PS5 Pro is giving them that, aren't first party titles going to be too heavy to handle for a base model PS5 in a year or two? Will it even be capable of running any of these games in 60fps at all or will we regular Joes have to deal with the fact that we'll need to buy a Pro to even have luxury again?
I mean, that same thing happened with the base PS4 - I had one and performance was atrocious for the last few games, but it felt like absolute insanity to have to buy another, so I just stopped using it for modern intensive games.
At this point I'll never buy a base console again and just wait for the pro to lower the price - with the added bonus that there might actually be exclusive games by then
@@marcosm1223 Yep. This is the way, I'm finding. Let a library build up and the machine's price depreciate a bit, then swoop in on a Black Friday or Xmas bundle. I'm old enough now that I no longer care about being "part of the conversation" on the latest and greatest as soon as it's in the wild.
@@marcosm1223 Yeah, I hear ya. I didn't really have that issue back then, as I only gamed on my PS4, but now that I have a decent PC and framerate has become such n important factor for me, I can't imagine going back to anything lower than that.
They’re getting too close to PC prices at this point.
I don't have a ps5 but designwise... they havent fixed something since the ps4 which is the buttons and the obscure ways you need to hard reset it etc... I still have to get close and squint and see what button is what on my ps4 because the symbols are so tiny
BUT!!
33:31 You are a not sane man. If you get it at the right volume it perfectly blends with the tv. It's like 20% of the experience. WHAT?!
Fow what games sonyyyyyyyyyyy, theyre still showing ps4 games lmao
My only argument for the price point is that Xbox is putting out a 600 disc less series x with a 2tb ssd. For 100 dollars more we would be getting a better gpu and essentially PlayStation dlss and ray tracing. I still don’t agree with this price as I would have bit the bullet with an included hard drive but I’m not spending 800 for the full kit as I am a big physical gamer and that’s too much. I’ll wait for the ps6 I guess.
Not to defend the Xbox because $600 is ridiculous but it does have a disk drive
Algo
That price is bananas.
30 years ago I bought a PC for about $2400 and my console was about $200-$300. Nowadays you can buy a decent PC for around $1000 but a new console is $700+???
To be fair the power you should be comparing it to is a pc equivalent and not a low grade pc, to where the ps5 pro is cheaper by more than just $700 vs $1000. Although even a low grade pc can do much, much more than the more powerful gpu that the pro would have including playing thousands of more games.
That being said the price is still outrageous seeing as that they absolutely could have sold it at a lower cost since its already been reported that Sony allowed the higher cost since it has no competition in the "mid-console generation" upgrade.
I hope people don't support the ps5 pro. It's scary to think of the cost of their consoles going forward if xbox leaves the market.
Adjust for inflation and that $300 console 30 years ago would be like $800 now so you actually paid more.
Well, about $500,but I definitely get the point.
All this love for "astrobot" is mildly confusing. The first game I played on ps5 was "rift apart," which I feel is superior to astro in every way. Mainly story(it kinda has one), progression(upgrade guns and gadgets), and player freedom(choosing what to use and buy). Astro is good no doubt, but the only thing it does well for me is make me miss older PS games we will never see again.
Very dissapointed you guys missed the opportunity to pronounce PSSR as pisser.
No but really the ps5 reveal felt like the ps3 reveal again. Above what most are willing to pay with Sony just assuming they'll keep their spot on top.
The best thing about the ps5 pro is that the ps5's used cost immediately dropped.
Massive difference between an optional more expensive model of an existing console and a new console generation. Anyone who balks at the Pro’s price can get a PS5 Slim digital for $450, or less once the Black Friday deals start.
I like how Sony named their new tech PSSR to show just how much money you’re wasting.
“Is that the new Pro tech?”
“Sure is - A real Pisser!”
The level of ignorance about the benefits of AI upscaling in game graphics was amazing. Tech like DLSS has made a huge difference in PC games in the last few years.
Get a load of this guy!
LOL
Yeah, do literally none of them play on PC?
FSR2/3, DLSS and XeSS are absolute gamechangers.
Sony and Microsoft need to stop sucking shit.
So they should put out an outdated console and release full priced $60 ports and barely upgraded "remasters" like that other trash gaming company Nintendo?
@@smellywaffels1967 Get a life fan boy, your jealousy is showing.
Nintendo is having no problem getting new games and ports/remasters every month.
Why isn't Sony remastering games like Ape Escape/Tokyo Jungle/Fat Princess? Tokyo Jungle is trapped on the PS3, just like MGS4.
Why aren't Sony/MS creating smaller games or more affordable games?
How are Sony/MS going to make games if they keep closing studios and laying off staff?
These are signs of trash companies.
PS5 Pro pushes the limits of your bank managers patience more like......
Bank manager? Did we travel back in time?
I collect physical so PC gaming is not an option im willing to take until im forced to. The Pro coming out as digital only with an disc drive add on that requires the internet to even allow it to connect is an absolute no.
Ill stick with the base ps5.
I live for experiences, not collecting plastic. There are countless amazing creative games on pc that will never get a physical release. I wish companies would prioritize media preservation and customer ownership, but that's still possible with digital distribution. PC gaming is the heart of the industry and the biggest source of innovation. With or without a drive, consoles only give you a taste of that, with a strictly controlled (and unmodded) experience.
@@arckinenso7615 "I live for experiences, not collecting plastic" yet you play games instead of touching grass and actually living an experience. PC sucks, $5,000 for crashing games, hacked multiplayer and no exclusives. Keep paying all that money for the same games the rest of us play for way cheaper.
@@smellywaffels1967 I travel, grow a large garden, and spend time with my friends and family every day. I also play video games that are filled with imagination and wonderful experiences you can't find in real life.
Do you have any real arguments, or just strawmen and other fallacies? I suspect you waste a lot of your life trolling strangers with bad faith comments, so I'm not the one who needs to touch grass.
To be fair to Sony, PC gamers spend more on less all the time.
Lol what?
@@cbender128 Come again? It’s been long proven that PC is by far the most economical of the gaming ecosystems.
A single PC can last 10+ years, games are exponentially more affordable and backwards compatible, and you can use any controllers and peripheral you’d like.
@@jonathanbaird Good luck playing a modern AAA game on a CPU and GPU from 2014.
My bad, some PC gamers.
@@Feanaro5503 My 1080ti (2016) runs many new titles. For those that don’t, I just pay $16 for temp access to a 4080ti via GeForce Now. It’s much preferable to dropping $500-800 every five years, losing my library of games, and having to purchase new accessories.
I always get sold on platformers and immediately am reminded I do not understand the appeal. I played 35 minutes of Astro Bot and put it down.
Still don’t get it. It’s well made, I see that but I do not understand the platformer collectathon. Why do I want this coin? It does literally nothing.
i wish i had the kind of money to quit playing games i purchase 35 minutes into them --- i still wouldn't quit on a game that soon, but the money would be nice...
The coins are to spend on the gacha mini-game to unlock outfits, ship paint jobs and diorama's for your bots.
If you played more than 35 minutes and got to that part you will know the coins actually have a purpose and do not in fact "literally do nothing".
If you are outraged by the price of this thing clearly you don’t know much about the games industry or really capitalism as a whole. For most of us we grew up with consoles that were sold at a loss. We are well beyond those days on top of the highest prices we’ve seen in for all goods. We live in a world where apple put out 3000 dollar fucking vr goggles. These companies are scratching and clawing for every cent they can get and if you don’t like the price of something the loudest message you can send is not buying it and it’s the only message that matters.
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the i am your beast trailer looks so staged... cant trust it