Re-creation (The Last Day - Part 2)⎮Miraculous Ladybug Season 5 Finale Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- So, we're back with part two. My goodness there is some premium salt in this here video, so strap yourselves in. The finale. Ladybug versus Monarch, Marinette versus Gabe. How disappointing. Man. Just trash. Now listen to me rant. Enjoy.
giving that emotionally abusive, neglectful man a (lazy) redemption arc but claiming a 14 year old CHILD is irredeemable is absolutely insane
@@Diggy-GorganzolaEven if she's the reason half of Paris got akumatized, *who* is the one doing all the akumatization? it's STILL Gabe's fault, Chloe was just a catalyst, at most.
@@Diggy-Gorganzola oh that man's gonna recieve a BOOK of therapy bills with the way he's traumatized the entire city. marinette and adrien ALONE making up a large chunk of it 😭
Is the creator vicariously living out a revenge fantasy through Chloe? Because Chloe's depiction gives major, "loser that got bullied in high school and never got over it" energy with how the creator treats her.
That is because Clohe is the expy for his high school bullies and everyone hating her is a power fantasy
@@flarestorm9417 That's pretty much the gist of why Astruc made Chloe to begin with.
As an aspiring writer, this show will forever be to me an example of what not to do.
As a fellow aspiring author, same lol
Thomas Astruc vs Hiro Mashima, the battle of trash writers.
As someone who loves stories, and has an interest in making a story with my own characters, I agree. Don’t do what this show did.
This is me as well. Chat should of been there and ladybug help him not become a similar villain.
LMFAO so true
The worst thing in this finale by far, is Adrien being absent for the finale of an arc *CENTERED AROUND HIM* . Like Marinette is the main protagonist but this particular arc was set into motion because of HIS existance. HIS Dad was the main villain and HIS mother was the driving force for Gabriel as a villain yet he didn't have any involvement.
His very birth is literally the focal point of the entire show lol
@@kou7191true
Main reason why I was so mad about this finale. Sure the fight was cool, I will admit, but COMPLETELY leaving Adrien from THE ARC THAT WOULDN’T EXIST WITHOUT HIM was just such a terrible idea. I can’t even begin to think about what the writers were thinking of.
I wanted intense confrontation and a fight scene between Adrien and his father, and instead we got marinette doing the fight with his dad and hiding the truth from Adrien “to protect his happiness”, like what??? That’s just so incredibly stupid. I get Adrien would be devastated, but what I think is worse is Adrien thinking his abuser is a hero. Marinette shouldn’t have even listened to Gabriel’s final request, “make sure he remembers the times when I was a good father” when exactly???
@@lasxnaWhen he made those awful pancakes. It is literally the only time Gabe bothered spending time together, and even then, it's something he only started doing a few weeks earlier.
@@kou7191 Also, that one and only time when he hugged him for a few seconds and that one time he let Adrien watch a movie with his mother in the lead role in Gorizila. That's all we have from him being a "good father" through all 5 seasons. I can't help but laugh comparing this to all the times he wasn't a "good father" to him
I'm uncomfortable to the fact that most people in Adrien's life are lying to him.
Nathalie, Gabriel, Felix, Kagami and now Marinette.
The bar is on the floor.
Team Gorilla is the best for life
I’m a villain Chat Noir stan (actively choosing to be one, but akumatized). I highly doubt it would happen, but I’d understand and support.
@@skyworld3393Same, it’d make the show interesting again but there’s no way those writers over there are able to pull something like that off
LMAO YES
FR THO W GORILLA🔥🔥🗣️🗣️💪💪
Marinette has been lying the whole show, she has a crush on adrien but always lied about it even when she knew that he is her partner as a hero. She still didn’t commit to the relationship and continued playing him essentially which is a very big red flag. I know this because i relate, an often dishonest/disingenuous person will gaslight you and manipulate you (whether intentional or not makes no difference, it’s effects and the pain are the same.)
i'm glad others dislike this finale as much as me. WHERE WAS ADRIEN'S REACTION TO ANYTHING?? this was HIS family! he NEEDED to be present
YES! He didn’t even acknowledge the fact that his mother, who was gone for a whole year… just suddenly appeared out of nowhere and nobody in Paris is talking about it?? Natalie magically recovered from her sickness and his father, who was ABUSIVE AND MANIPULATIVE still forgave him?? They did Adrien dirty in this WHOLE FRANCHISE…….
Not to mention, where was Felix during all this? He could've tried to rescue Kagami and Adrien. I mean wasn't it his goal to free them from their controlling parents?
@@Blou1372I mean, he was told that he sacrificed himself to save the world but not about how he was Monarch.
@@kierahenley2335 which begs the question: WHY on Earth did he bring Kagami back to London after ep. 24? He knew she was a prisoner there and was miserable... he claims he loves her, he has the financial means AND the magical powers to keep her safe and away from her mother... why did he bring her back?
Also he asked Marinette for her help against Monarch, but he did nothing himself for the whole finale.
@@Blou1372 there's a huge chance that the woman we see at the pool party is Amelie, not Emilie.
What was the point of having Gabriel as the main villain if Adrien was never going to find out? So stupid in my opinion.
To have another easy season to make. Script of Adrien founding out
What was the poin of showing us that wish mean end of the world, if it's not the end of the world?
@@football9958Agree. Creating a rift between Adrien and Ladybug.
I am not surprised by this decision unlike others. Not saying it is a good decision.
Not sure about new villain, though.
LIke what would Gabriel be without Adrien if he never gets any character development?
It makes the whole fandom mad because we wanted him to know & fight his dad
At this point I want Cat Noir to be the new villain, because the show literally treats him like Ladybug’s inferior.
let's hope the writers grow some fucking balls for once and make a compelling story with adrien finding out about everything that happened, and getting really mad at ladybug, to the point he becomes the new villain
but let's be real, they won't do it
Now i kinda want villain chat noir-
Shit, it would be completely justified
Holy crap!!!! New idea!!!! Where’s my laptop!?
@@kamilslup7743exactly the same way they had a chance to make CN mad about LB going behind his back with the nobody can know their identity BS even though Alya knows hers.
Marinette: states in front of the whole class and teacher that Chloe doesn't DESERVE forgiveness or sympathy because she's cruel and mean
Also Marinette: detransforms in front of Gabe after kicking his butt and tries to have the cliche "we can fix this together" speech despite knowing every despicable act he's done as both Gabriel and as Monarch
The hypocrisy of this girl (or rather, Astruc) hurts
The writing of this show is a joke.
@@JuniorGustaboyou can say that again this is total BS do the creator of the show actually expect the audience to have any sympathy for Gabriel ?
You're saying that like she likes Gabe. She's doing it for Adrien's sake, the fuck.
@@hadrianhexe9603It was just a bad move to do regardless, considering how much of a threat Gabe was the entire time. Even if he decided to give up right there, he would've most likely been thrown into prison for the rest of his life, and that doesn't really help Adrien either.
@@Umbrannathan Regardless Adrien was gonna get hurt but it wasn't like Gabriel was redeemed. Nobody knew what he did in the first place and Marinette was protecting him from that.
And that makes him /very/ different from Chloe, who regularly and shamelessly acts like a menace out in the open. Everyone knows the type of person she is, But for Gabe he already had his mask, so for it to be revealed that he was hawkmoth, that would've destroyed Adrien even more and it makes sense why Mari wouldn't let that happen.
I was so disappointed that Cat Noir was not even included in the final confrontation, we are literally constantly told in this show that Ladybug and him are equals and need eachother.
He was in a white room. What else was he supposed to do?
@@Diogo85 Have plagg destroy it
@@Diogo85 Have Plagg unlock the door, like Tikky does many times for Marinette and what he must have done in order to get the ring out of the room.
@@user-bs2ds9vm2m That would alert Gabriel and Tomoe.
@@roxirock5455 Didn't he actually get the ring out of the room?
The fact that Gabriel got “redeemed” but Chloe’s arc was thrown in the trash is beyond ridiculous, utterly ridiculous.
yall still about this? move on and get a grip
I think what annoys me the most about Chloe's arc isn't the lack of redemption but the gall to waste the audience's time with episode after episode hinting at it while implying that she'll undergo some character growth, only to ignore it and practically say 'nevemind'.
@@fawzinazih6817I think it makes sense that when talking about the writing on this show, they would compare it to previous writing choices?
@@fawzinazih6817nah cause this show as a whole fails at alot of characters arcs, like Alya is Marinettes best friend but doubts her about Lila and they cut out an apology it's not just Chloe they fr just giving characters who would in itself count as unredemable are now being redeemed of course we gonna be pissed
@@fawzinazih6817 it's called bad writing. Chloe had a lot of fans and her arc was done very well, for that to get thrown out the window without ever being resolved pisses people off, sorry that you don't care about writing being coherent and good
Adrien deserves the truth, and nothing but the truth. By lying to him, the show is essentially saying that no, Adrien doesn't deserve that. That he needs to be coddled and have his choice on the matter made _for_ him.
_"But Steve,"_ one may respond. _"Adrien would be sad if he finds out. Isn't it better to lie to him and keep him happy rather than despair that his father's Hawk Moth?"_
Let him. He needs to feel all the pain, anger, and sadness that comes with a revelation like that. He needs to feel it because it's not healthy to bottle these emotions up.
And he has friends, family (Emilie), Nathalie, people he can turn to for help.
Exactly! I understand why people are making the argument that he could get akumatized, but he has to know. Marinette’s trying to protect his happiness, I know, but it’s such a terrible decision, how would he ever grow as a character??
And I can’t judge yet since we haven’t seen much other than the epilogue, but I imagine this is very traumatic for marinette, having to hide all that from the person she’ll spend the rest of her life with. Honestly, what would be even worse is if we don’t see her feel any remorse at all in s6, that would just be sad at that point.
Agreed. But hopefully he doesn’t get akumatized by LIE-la at that point.
It sucks that nobody in his life is telling him the truth. I hope he finds out in the future and holds it against marionette. That it might ruin their relationship bc the fact that his father is a hero now ugh
@@lunarialoonatic I genuinely hope when (or rather, if, because I can never trust the show after that finale) he finds out about his father, and the fact that marinette hid it from him, that he just absolutely despises marinette for a while, and not just them making up after the end of the episode.
@@lasxna You should know by now that Miracukous Queen God Marinette can never be in the wrong for more than 5 minutes in this show, and that any grievances that Chat Noir had with her will immediately be dropped as she either supplies him with empty platitudes, gaslights him into thinking he’s being dramatic, or is immediately forgiven because he’s in love with her and “she had good intentions”.
Chat Noir legit is never allowed to criticize Ladybug. Even when she screws up majorly like in the Season 3 Finale or the Season 4 Finale, Chat Noir has to comfort her. Other times, like when she screwed up in Chat Blanc, he’s kept in the dark and therefore never even gets to learn of her mistakes. And the worst of all is like in Scarabella’s first appearance where Chat Noir is gaslit for being cautious about a stranger showing up with the Ladybug Miraculous WITH NO NOTICE FROM LADYBUG AT A TIME WHEN HAWKMOTH CAN MAKE SENTIMONSTERS.
Enjoy Season 6! Marinette will keep the secret from Adrien for episodes, occasionally asking if she did the right thing only to be backed up by Tikki and every other Kwami to reinforce that nobody thinks she’s in the wrong. When Adrien finally does find out, he’ll confront her and she’ll argue it with him. He’ll forgive her within an episode, as Plagg will tell him that he’s just a worthless sidekick who should go grovel for Ladybug’s forgiveness. He’ll then apologize and break down and Ladybug will of course comfort him, humanizing her in the eyes of the audience and brushing over her horrible judgment.
Tell me that doesn’t sound like something that Astruc would write.
Imagine being the author and complaining about people not getting that “some characters are beyond redemption” and then one year later you redeem a literal terrorist 💀
Imagine being a writer, saying that you’re trying to impart lessons that are harsh truths (AKA that some bullies simply can’t be redeemed), only to later excuse a girl lying to her boyfriend about how cruel and horrible his dad was just to “spare his feelings”. Legitimately so disgusting that the show has endorsed the idea that you should lie to people to protect them from harsh truths.
It’s exactly what Gabe did to Adrien too, lying about Emilie’s disappearance, Nathalie’s illness, and his own identity as Monarch. Are we sure that Marinette isn’t Gabe’s true kid? She’s the one who fought him, she’s his main rival, and she’s the one who convinced him to “change” his ways. Like maybe Marinette and Adrien got swapped at the hospital or something. Just saying.
@@Doomzdehseems she would be natalie and gabe’s daughter
@@Doomzdeh I like to call Marinette, Gabriel 2.0
The fact that it took them 8 years only for this entire Arc to end like this is so disappointing... What's the point making Adrien the son of antagonist if he won't figure it out? Truly a mess of a show
Not to mention, that there still was no revealing of their secret identities. They teased us three times with the revealing and in the end? Nothing. What's the point of teasing the audience so often with the revealing, only to not doing in the end? Besides from Adrien not being at the end fight, that was one of the points, that really pissed me off
Every single time I think this show can’t get any worse…it gets worse and Adrien not finding out his father is Hawkmoth is probably the worst thing this show has ever done and that’s saying a lot because this show has done some bad things
Have you ever seen the first spiderman movie? It ends in the exact same way.
Imagine Luke Skywalker never having a clue about who his real father was.
@@smorgasbord5715 wait... are you referring to Norman and Harry Osborne?
The thing that absolutely annoys the hell out of me is how the story ends with Marinette being like “Adrien, you get to choose your own destiny” when the entire finale has just been about people DENYING ADRIEN AGENCY and him doing nothing about it.
The only thing he actually CHOOSES TO DO is give up his ring to Ladybug. He never gets to confront his father for controlling and abusing and manipulating him. He doesn’t get to play a role in defeating the villain. He doesn’t even get to learn the truth about his father.
Hell, after his controlling, abusive father DIES Marinette CARRIES ON HIS WORK OF MANIPULATING ADRIEN FROM BEYOND THE GRAVE. And then the writers have the gall to make her say “UWU You make your own choices!”
He may have not have found out that Gabriel is monarch but he did get to confront him in representation and collision
the saddest thing is that it's not the first time marientte manipulates adrian remember episode 100
Season 4 finale didn’t matter at all for Adrien. They made him act spoilt and needy and most of the time it was understandable but some times it was so annoying. And I thought the show would at least treat them like equals again in season 5 but NO. Instead Marinette is the sole main character, everyone else is there as a side character but Marinette is the only one that matters. Is your favourite character more popular than Marinette? NO! Because Marinette is your favourite character and no one else matters! Don’t agree? We’ll write your ‘favourite’ character out the show and make you hate them just so you can like Marinette! They did it with Chloe and now they did it with Adrien. Now everyone will treat CN as a sidekick when his name is in the title🤣🤣🤣
That last shot of LB and CN just looks like it’s there for wallpapers. Not for actual narrative purpose. Because at the end of the day it’s not LB and CN vs Monarch. It’s not even Adrien/CN vs Monarch/Gabe. It’s LB/Marisue the hero and everyone’s favourite character vs Gabe. Stupid show, stupid writing. I’m just watching for closure at this point
I think the from now on is important too bcz gabriel was not emotionally controlling him but physically controlling him with the ring so marinette giving him the ring saying from now on u can make your choices means no one will control him with this ring
You guys remember when this was the "Adventures of Ladybug AND Cat Noir"... yeah, me neither
If Marinette/Ladybug could already automatically master both the powers of the Ladybug and Cat Miraculous the entire time without any training or struggles, Master Fu should have just given her both miraculous to defeat Hawkmoth with.
That's so true.
That’s a more recent skill if they did that at the start she would have lost both
Yea who needs cat noir he’s useless
Tbf she has had experience with the black cat before so it kinda makes sense
'cAt NoIr AnD LaDyBuG aRe PaRtNeRs, tHeY nEeD EaCh OtHeR'
-said no one in the writing team
The fact that Lila can just lie about anything and get away with it is just annoying to be honest
Dare I say
Plot armour
Fr and people still defend her. But don't y'all remember when Lila said and I quote "I won't give up Adrian, unless you get rid of ladybug for me" in the episode Oni chan. Implying that she wanted her Injured, gone, dead. But somehow Mari is the bad one oh ok....
@@Imperial304 That's why I love her. She is the only good villain. I hope she didn't stay in that smooth-brainitis germ filled mansion too much.
It wouldn’t be nearly as annoying if they were smart lies that anyone would fall for. But it’s as if every character is made more stupid just so they could fall for it
Ikr she can be like 'Omg I literally just died yesterday... but I survived, because of your love, it brought be back alive' and everyone would be like 'aww you died? that must've sucked, your life has been so difficult'. How is everyone so stupid aha
The fact that Marinette sat down and talked with Gabe despite everything he did, sympathised with him, offered him a second chance just for Gabe to absolutely send her to the shops and not change at all and win and yet she STILL listened to his final request? I would have made sure he was known as the worst human to walk the Earth if I was done like that
Let's ignore Gabriel's action for a sec. I want to focus on the fact that Marinette decided to talk and sympathise with him. Mari is just so unrealsticly understanding and forgiving, esspecially for a teen. Very forgiving and understanding people exists but it's exaggeration. Marinette is already shown as perfect person and this doesn't make her a likeable character at all. Honestly I would prefer her to take her anger out on Gabriel. After all she had a lot of reasons to be mad at him. I really didn't wanted her to forgive him. I wanted her to beat him up. She even could straight up speed up his death by cataclysming him. Actually it could even be a ground for interesting arc. If she would speed up his death like this. But no, we had to see a character who saw other character doing unforgiviable thing and making her life a torture just for that character to reason and sympathise. She actually could react like that, but it would have to make a sense. Mari had no reason to be so understanding towards him.
@@demondog9660 it just shows the lack of character growth she’s had, and that’s because she was either already written as perfect to begin with, or she never gets hers whenever one of her flaws are on full display. She’s just very hard to get behind
It manages to make Steven universe’s redemption of the diamonds look good by comparison.
@@demondog9660 Or she never had any growth from obsessing over adrien, to whom shdde still is extremely dishonest. Sop she is worse by doing it "for adrien" but she never givs adrien th chance to closur xtremly dishonest.
And her being identical to gabriel in that persoinality, ad never refuting that by telling gadrien the truth. Why is sh ethen having the exact selfish gaslighting "fot your own good" personality as gabe?
unless the show pretends the sasons nver happened or marinette becomes the vollain, i dnt se it having any chance.
@@demondog9660 yes
My biggest peeve is that Gabriel kinda...won. He did it. He got the jewels, he made his wish. Sure, Marinette talked him into not making the "random kill" wish, but he still made one. Like, what's the point? Its like the Thannos snap, without Endgame :P
To me the Moral and message I got with Season 5 was realizing and seeing your Mistakes and trying to set things right as Nathalie realize her mistakes in working with Gabriel and try to stop him from going to far Also we saw How Andre realize how Miserable his life was and offer Gabriel a Chance to go back to the old days but refused it As Gabriel had every moment to see and realize His mistakes and what he could've had but never took the chance to see his mistakes and in reality was left with Nothing as He lost his Friends he also Lost every moment to move away from his plans but in the end was left a broken man with Nothing left
@@comicbookreviewer4856 and Andre sending off his daughter with her abusive mother and upgrading her with a more gentler daughter.
@@liaheben That the thing Chole had every moment to realize her mistake but saw that the Bee miraclous as a golden moment to get what she wanted or saw things as a quick way to get Approval well Zoe saw the downside of going into Chole world and finally got what she wanted after realizing and seeing the Harm of her Actions and got Rewarded for it
@@comicbookreviewer4856 that doesn't change that Andre neglected his daughter and enabled her and his abusive wife, and decided that the best thing was to send his daughter to live with her abusive mother, like he wasn't responsible of her actions. the person that always was taking care of Chloe was Armand (the butler), not her mother or Andre, her father.
@@liaheben okay first of all, blaming the abused for the actions of his abuser is disgusting, don’t do that again,
Secondly, yes Chloe deserved a redemption but after the events of season 5 i can now say that she doesn’t *want* a redemption and you can’t redeem someone who doesn’t want a redemption.
And if you’re gonna say she doesn’t want a redemption because the writers don’t want her to want it, go look in a mirror and question why Gabriel wanted his wife back, and if your answer is “because the writers wanted him to want her back” then this kids show might be a little too advanced for you
I really do think the writers have a certain disdain towards Adrien. I never liked Chloe, but even I find the whole "Chloe is irredeemable " thing by Astruc to be stupid.This finale is a mess😂.
They tried to force Chloe's evilness in season 4/5 so hard. Such as claiming she locks sabrina in a closet with no light and treats her like a slave when we are shown in season 2 she cares for Sabrina and even protected her from akuma's. As well as the 2 play together. Or how in Malediktator she smiles at Sabrina. She wasn't a perfect friend but she wasn't totally evil like they tried to show in Zoe's first episode (coincidence? I think not). Or how a 14-16 (how old is she?) becomes the mayor and an evil one at that.
How did no one question putting a teenager in charge especially a teenager daughter of the previous mayor. Wouldn't that look like nepotism to the outside world? Or at least make the public think Andre faked his resigning and just did it so chloe can become mayor. Thus making people not want the bourgeois as it looks like they are planning something. Or how Zoe is basically chloe but nice.
Chloe is irredeemable but gabriel is
Makes total sense
on the bright side, it is not the end
-Marinette is the only one to fight Gabriel.
-No confrontation between Adrien and Gabriel.
-Gabriel is seen as a hero
-Marinette lets her guard down when she has given Gabriel MULTIPLE chances to give up
- She thinks its a good idea to keep his secret identity from EVERYONE
- The reveal doesnt happen even though there is no reason to hide it.
- Felix doesnt receive any kind of punishment for helping a terrorist.
- The Guardian instead of helping the heroes train, trains Luka and Jagged Stone.
How do you mess up that badly!?
Maybe smoking good marijuana
I don’t know mate they must’ve been smoking some good shit if this is the sort of story they came up with 😂
Now that you mention it, Nathalie and Tomoe get off scot-free too.
The mastrtraining liuka and jagged stone is really weird, but it sounds lik a wack siestory tht, i mean luka isnt a bad choice?! Its fine, and felix i guess.
Ok that wr randon but how the heck
and miss tsurugi got oconsequences whatever. and gabe pushed adriengami?! i mean they are more healthy than adrie mand marinette but weird?!
Felix's arc is very good without him being punished, what are you on
The fact that Adrien is literally the catalyst for the entire plot, and he doesn't get any relevance in the final battle against his father pisses me off so much
Because the series has allude to him being too weak to accept it or being a sentimonster. Seriously every time he found out Gabe was doing this for his mom-boom he’s turned evil. Chat Blanc or the time guy who gave Gabriel the wish.
Why? He’s a sentimonster and Gabe has the rings.
Basic plot sewn 2-3 times. Now that he has his freedom-that’s where he discovers it and it hit’s different when Lila probably reveals the secret to him. That’s season 6 material.
@darinzion58 The solution here of course is have a plot point where Marinette fights fate and maybe see what she has learned before to prevent a Cat Blanc scenario from happening - that being said Marinette already had the Cat Miraculous so technically she could've told him that without it in his possession.
@@DZ_Mania_2024 if they'd have bothered developing him beyond just going from having an obsessive crush on one girl to to another, maybe he would have become someone strong enough to accept these new revelations
I hate the ending scene because we're supposed to be like: "Omg Adrien is finally free" when he isn't.
He doesn't get the freedom to choose whether he wants to forgive his father for lying, manipulating, isolating, and neglecting him. He doesn't even get to know the truth, which is so messed up.
I hope he becomes a villain because the most important people in his life are lying to him: Nathalie, Felix, Gabriel, and Martinette, heck maybe even Kagami.
So Kagami's mom is redeemable the woman who worked alongside a super villain,abusing and mistreating her daughter and then Chloe *a child* is considered as a person who can never change or become a better person 💀
Chloe deserves to be part of a better show.
If they wanted chloe to be a villian they should have made an effort to. Question has there been throughout the series a training episode? Because honestly if these characters were real not of there lack luster skills would budge.
Like I know some are dumb to believe lila's lies but seriously they are absurd.
Fr where’s her daughter exposing her ass
@@margeryojije7862it’s worse than that even, because astruc went and maked Chloe based on his bully when he was on college (a blonde rich girl) and guy is so rencorous to her that he maked an oc named Chloe after her
Actually I feel that Kagami's mom was the main brain. She is rhe reason why Gabriel even could do all of this.
That moment when fanfics are better written than the original 🤷♀
For real. 😌😌
@@hachimenroppi3649 I don't care I just hate the haters 😡
Honestly. 😭
Btw, if anybody has any good fanfic recommendations, just drop’em below. 😙
I'll be writing a fanfic soon called Delirium, it takes place at the point where Jubilation aired, maybe you can look it up later ✨️
>Bad guy wins
>Paris becomes utopia
Absolutely brilliant ending. 10000/10
Like what the hell, we were told multiple times in the show that the wish isn't allowed to happen, yet the writers make the protagonists lose... I seriously don't understand what the writing crew were smoking...
The thing that annoys me is that none of you in the comment section notices how the villain got influenced by the good guys and made the wish.
Some Say “Villains are the Visionaries that the World Needs to force progress. “
Master oogway
To be fair Gabe's wish was not what he originally intended. He probably wanted to wish for a new world recreated in his own image, where Adrien and Kagami are together, Emilie comes back, and the Agreste and Tsurugi companies are the two biggest businesses in the world, but he instead simply decided to sacrifice himself to bring back Nathalie. Although Marinette was extremely smooth-brained when she decided to offer Gabriel a second chance despite all he'd done. I would have made sure to incapacitate him BEFORE talking to him to make sure he'll not ambush me.
Uh, I think it's better than Thanos winning. 😆
I'm just gonna make a list of reasons I absolutely hated this finale in no particular order:
1: Adrien/Chat Noir not being present in the final battle
2: Taking from point 1, he would have been able to learn about his dad being Monarch and about his mother's situation.
3: Everyone was soooooo dumbed down with those damn rings. It felt like all their brain cells ceased to exist. Seriously what WAS that-
I get the whole nightmare/antidote plan was going on but still, it felt so ... artificial? Idk how to put it. Like an easy solution.
4: The final fight was very underwhelming. I didn't feel that "wow" factor or even all that satisfied.
5: Marinette giving Gabriel one last chance knowing full well how dangerous he is and what he has put people through up until this moment
6: HIM GETTING HIS WISH (yeah at the cost of his death, I know, but he still technically "won" this way.)
7: All of Paris and Adrien thinking he was some kind of hero and even erecting a damn statue of him I-
8: No background on what the hell happened to Adrien and Kagami in the mean time???
9: The ending felt super rushed like it was made in 3 months vs what 8 years was leading to
10: Maybe a nitpick but the identity reveal not happening
In conclusion: The bad guy/abuser gets away with no consequences faced and is even hailed as a hero meanwhile his son doesn't know a single shred of truth about ANYTHING and wasn't present for the final showdown against the bad guy they've been taking on as a damn duo since day 1. Adrien 👏 deserved 👏 BETTER 👏 and 👏 Gabriel 👏 deserved 👏 WORSE 👏 😤
Fr. He’s being gaslit by his own girlfriend and his father from beyond the grave, even after he’s dead. 😭
The fact that Gabriel was already dying anyways - it just sped up the process..
Oh and Natalie dying ….
aswell as no real resolution of the after effects of the battle. Aka, whether Natalie lived-and adrien meeting his mother
Don’t forget the whole lack of context regarding Luka and his family as as to why they were training with the guardians.
What happened to adrien and kagami during this and whether they were even aware of what was happening……
Gawd they’re going to neeed to do an inbetween or a background story-to actually make this show worth watching and MAKE SENSE next season.
In my opinion the shows only a money grab now--even though most of its demographic are 12-17 years who actually follow writing and plots.. 😢
@@sherbetbomb3276 Frr. 😭
For real. I also didn’t like what they did to Chloe. She should have been given the redemption arc, and there is no way that Andre should’ve been let off the hook like that! He and Audrey were the worst parents, aside from Gabe and Tomoe.
Say it louder for the ones in the back! This season finale is such a disappointment!
Eight years. Waited eight flipping years for THIS!? Are you pulling on my leg? Sigh. Jeremy Zags movie is my only hope. 🥺
It basically pulled a SVTFOE ending from their SVTFOE Season 4 plotline.
No worries. Archive of Our Own fanfictions of this show can help with the healing.
There's this good Lila's lies are exposed fic on the website called "Crumbling Down". Give it a read if you want.
There is another arc next year
And the movie did it a 200% way better than the show lol
Adrien started out as a complex, three-dimensional character who genuinely tried to be free from his father's control and create an identity for himself. Then they simply reduced him to being a sentimonster controlled by his father. It would have been so much better for Adrien's character development if he actually overcame his insecurities and stood up to his father. They retconned all of that by simply making him a non-human. Adrien is still a great character with a lot of development, but they did not have to introduce the part where his father can literally control him by rubbing the ring.
Exactly.
Adrien started as a co-protagonist reduced to a side kick and then to the Marinette love interest, like I wanted to throw up in some of the last seasons 5 episodes
And even side caracters got more screen time in the finale that him
Side caracters like alya and Nino and everyone on that boat got more screen time than the co-protagonist who name is in the series name
Ikr! The other day I caught myself rewatching some old eps and it was so clear that Adrien had so much potential. It was all thrown in the trashcan, unfortunately.
@@nicolas._.2294 Lol yeah, I can't believe we got more scenes of the freaking houseboat than we did of Adrien. Even Su Han, Fei Wu, and the New York heroes got more action! I'm also disappointed that Felix and Kagami - two characters who had a ton of stakes and connections to the villains - also did nothing in the finale. Perhaps they're leaving Kagami confronting her mom for the next few seasons, but I would have loved to see Felix participate in the fight.
@@babyxblueTo be fair, we were warned that they would do that since he actually got thrown into a trash can.
They really just entierly erased Adrien character’s journey.
And I don’t get it how can some people can remember the first reality but some don’t ?
Nathalie, Kagami’s mother, Émilie, do they remember?
Why Suhan is teaching an ancestral fighting style and secrets to random strangers now ?
Why Marinette is the only one that seems to remember just because she was next to Gabriel when the wish was formulated ?
Why Gabriel decided to sacrifice himself when the actual goal was him living with his family happily forever, since someone had to be sacrificed why him since he’s the one who was supposed to make his wish come true ?
I just don’t get too many things-
Because marrinete is the only character treated as the main character
thye do remember but they all gotta hide their secrets for the sake of adrien and their reputation
Yeah. And Lila who did almost nothing in the whole series just became the main antagonist. Why the fck????!!!!!!!!
I thought that the talk that Marinette gave to Gabriel made him compromise on his wish and that’s why he sacrificed himself
@@football9958I don't like that.
Honestly i don’t get Astruc. He wants Marinette to be the main cararacter but creates a story that is centerd around Adrien. So it’s dissapointing either way; Marinette fighting a battle that isn’t really her own( because she had little to no emotional stakes) and Adrien not allowed to fight his Battle because Marinette is doing it for him.
This is just exshausting
I really wanna know what beef the writers have with Adrien, because he had the potentional to be the BEST character in the entire series...
Also, remember the earlier seasons? We were already complaining about Cat Noir being left out of everything, because the show is about Ladybug&Cat Noir, and at the end of the day they are both equally needed to defeat Gabriel.
Well, we were right. BECAUSE THE VILLAIN LITERALLY WON
I honestly hate the message the finale sends.
Gabriel’s entire arc surrounds his very clear obsession with Emilie and that it clearly isn’t healthy. A good message for a show targeted to kids would be that loss shouldn’t encapsulate someone’s life, yet with Gabriel that’s exactly what happened. The writing condoned his obsessive fantasies. He died but he won, he got what he wanted. He never moved forward, never faced justice, in a sense he got his happy ending, because he would prefer to die than to live without Emilie. Which is just not a good message to send to kids…
As for Adrien, his father being remembered as a hero quite literally erased his progression of overcoming his abuse. He went from being obedient to rebellious to hating his father, hating the abuse he endured…and then in the end wanting to be like his dad?? 💀 like what? I understand perhaps if Marinette told everyone else that Gabriel was good perhaps to spare the lives of Nat, Amelie and Felix. But Adrien should have been told, it was his right.
Now many people are saying that Adrien can’t handle that type of news, we saw it with Cat Blanc and Ephemeral, he’s mentally fragile. But isn’t that Gabriel and Emilie’s philosophy? Wanting to shelter Adrien from the world? Bad things happen, and a healthy resolution would be to tell Adrien and let him heal, let him come to terms with it however long it takes. Honestly the codependency that was seen with Gabriel and Emilie can clearly be seen with Adrienette as well which is very concerning.
As for the Amelie and Emilie situation I definitely think it was Amelie at the pool party, at least I hope so. The whole time Gabriel was convinced that his actions were needed for the whole family, that Adrien and Emilie would want this. But watching Emilie’s video he realises that she doesn’t want to come back and it finally breaks him. He doesn’t want to live without Emilie, he’s not selfless enough to stay for Adrien and make amends with him. He loves Emilie over Adrien, and so he would rather die with Emilie than be alone with Adrien…which is exactly what he did. I feel like Gabriel gave his life to die with Emilie to save Nathalie’s life. Both Agreste parents being dead allows the story and the Agreste arc to come to a more seamless conclusion. And I feel like with both of them dead Adrien isn’t stuck with the turmoil of adjusting with his mom back in the picture when he had spent the entire series getting over her. It’s also easier for the writers if they want to do a prequel show about Gabriel and Emilie, since they’re both dead, they can’t really be screwed over anymore by character inconsistency. 😂
Emilie didnt come back , everyone seem to misunderstand that
I hope that in season 6 we'll see Mayura helping the heroes if felix I'd sick or absent and then, Adrien might use his brain to realize that his father was the villain
This is perfectly worded. States exactly why this finale was so incredibly disappointing and is going to be devastating to the show.
Cat blanc and ephemeral don't even matter anymore BECAUSE AS FAR AS THEY KNOW,THERES NO MORE MONARCH AND NO FUTURE MONARCH. SO NO ONE CAN AKUMATIZE HIM. And as far as they know,no one even has his miraculous,its just lost,and even if someone did its literally meant to be used to turn someone into a hero instead of a villain,so assuming there would be any new villains because of what's known as a LOST MIRACULOUS and the man who would've done it is literally DEAD,its just stupid. So she CAN and SHOULD tell him.
@@dessindenfer1253but in the storyboard, the model is named Emelie Agreste
This a long post, so brace yourselves
I just want to say, that this was possibly the worse way to end Adrien’s current arc. Not only was he not present in the end of the final battle, but his agency in the story is yet again taken from him, as people continue to keep secrets from him and his own father manipulated him into thinking he was a hero.
And for those who say that this will give him an arc in S6, may I remind you that we already had this kind of arc in S4; Marinette keeping secrets from Adrien, and Adrien getting upset about it. This is basically a rehash of S4, and Adrien’s arc in S4 didn’t even have a satisfying payoff! How can I expect S6 to do any better?
And if Adrien is really going to have an arc from this, what will that accomplish? Unless they pull some resurrection or ghost crap, Gabriel is gone for good, it’s not like Adrien will be able to face his father let alone stand up to him now. The only conflict will there be, is between Adrien and Marinette (And maybe Natalie by extend), and again, this is basically the same thing that happened in S4, and perhaps the seasons before that: Marinette keeps secrets from Adrien, and Adrien gets angry about it, it is the same tired drama and I am sick of it.
It’s unbelievable how much this show continues to disrespect Adrien yet also coddle him every time. He can’t know anything, and everyone must make decisions for him. What does this say about children who suffered through abuse? That people can take away their agency because “they know what’s best for them”? That they’re overly emotional and will destroy the world if they know anything? That they should see their abusers in a glorified way because it will make them happy?
Adrien is not a baby, he can handle the truth. People who say that it’s for the best that Adrien doesn’t know, fail to understand that this was what his ABUSIVE FATHER wanted. By keeping secrets from him and continuing to let Adrien see his father as a hero that he strives to be, Gabriel has won, and that is absolutely disgusting.
Didn't you see what happened in cat blanc and emphaerl?
@@virnalassiter382 But it's in a different timeline.
THANK YOU! And the fact that this was all done in terms of furthering Marinette’s role as the main character. 😭 I don’t know why she would choose keep Gabriel’s secret from Adrien, after finding out he’s Hawkmoth, the man who’s been traumatizing her for years on end. You’d think she would would realize that he’s pretty much irredeemable at this point, but no, she has to go in and give him a second chance, all while upholding his wishes for Adrien not to know anything, and simply keep him further in the dark. On a side note, what’s ironic is that this the writers, Thomas, and the show itself love to claim Ladybug and Chat Noir as partners, yet they consistently sideline him physically as well as through the use of him being kept in the dark, which just further removes his agency. Especially after the way we’ve seen his father practically hide him away from the outside world in earlier seasons. In retrospect, even though Ladybug herself has claimed that Chat Noir and her are partners and fight together, physically, in terms of the plot, as well as systemically, he plays so little of a role within the entire show. This is especially present within the reversal of the love square and the show downplaying LadyNoir, in terms of uplifting Adrienette. To be honest though, this really all stems from the abysmal writing of the show, as well as the stupidity and sheer lack of reasonability that Thomas possesses. 🫠
@@virnalassiter382 If the only point of those episodes was to serve as an excuse to never give us a satisfying end to Adrien’s character arc, then they shouldn’t even exist.
What SHOULD have happened in this finale is that Adrien should have discovered the truth, and in the moment where all seems lost, where Marinette is terrified that the events of Chat Blanc will repeat themselves, the heroes find SOME WAY OUT OF IT.
YOU KNOW? BECAUSE THAT’S HOW YOU CREATE TENSION, AND A REWARDING VICTORY FOR THE HEROES?
@@Telepath- I don't think many people really look from the pov of a 14 year old girl ,a guy has been terrorising her city for nearly a year and who just so happens to her bf father after her talk with him , he decides to stop everything and as the only person who couldn't move on from Emilie decides to join her in afterlife and give Nathalie her life back and as a dieing man's last wish he said to keep the image of a good father he tries to create in season 5 remain and asks her to lie to every one and as some one who decided not to let know Adrien know that his blue bday scarf was not from his father but from her just so he can be happy decides to let Adrien keep a good image of his father
It’s the way hot dog Dan contributed more the story than adrien 💀💀💀
So like does Cat Noir never ask who Hawk Moth really was? Or does Ladybug straight up lie to her partner to keep a manipulative man's last wishes
The fact the Gabriel has his own statue after: terrorizing the city a countless amount of times, to the point where he practically traumatized everyone within Paris, as well as neglecting his only son and putting him in solitary confinement in the name of “love”, all the while ridding him of anything that truly made him happy (a.k.a, going to school, having friends, being with the girl he loves) and forcing him to move to another city in a completely different country, is absolutely horrendous and baffles me.
the fact you do not realize all of that information is concealed from the people of Paris, and they think he's an amazing fashion designer who died while defeating Monarch alongside Ladybug
@@ferretonahelmet I do realize that, however, Gabriel should’ve never been redeemed. The fact that the writers even thought to give him a redemption arc baffles me, given everything that he’s done and the kind of father than he’s been.
@@ferretonahelmet the thing is the show makes it seem like he is a hero/has done something good. This is most obvious when Marinette (the main character) fulfills his wish of lying to Adrien that he was a good father. (Heck, he doesn't even say “lie” he says “tell him how good of a dad I was” …the audacity)
@@ferretonahelmetobviously the people of Paris are supposed to be kept in secret about this, but how is marinette, Felix and kagami okay with this despite knowing how bad he was, heck, marinette was the one to tell Adrien his father was a good person
It just feels wrong to have people honour a statue of someone who has terrorized them for so long... If I were Marinette I would be disgusted with myself for not telling people the truth and watching them unknowingly treat the villain like he's their hero...
People say Adrian can’t find out Monarch’s identity because he would get akumatized, but they could’ve at least let Chat Noir fight the dumb citizens instead of just gave him no screen time, or having him arriving late so he doesn’t find out Monarch’s identity until the end, it might even be more emotional.
or adrien could do,if he had to loose the ring, he could tacklle thenightmare trauma and kick ass without his ring. at least.
Ya know? I think i saw a scrapped version of that somewhere.... but with adrien walking in on bugNoir and the she goes to kiss Adrien after (I guess) defeating monarch???..... idk I think i might be wrong, but I SWEAR I saw that as a TH-cam thumbnail for s5 spoilers 💀😅
Watch the movie. Adrien has more depth there than in the stupid show
I’m still so upset about Adrien not finding out abt his father/confronting his abuser. The only reason why the writers chose to do this is def to keep the story moving and create more seasons. But they could’ve had the reveal between Gabriel and Adrien and in the chaos of that moment/the battle, Lila could’ve swooped up the miraculous. There were so many other ways to do this and sadly I don’t think this was the best way
The most frustrating part is that Marinette continues to lie to Adrien about his dad and deny him agency
Gabe willingly abused Adrien for too long and Marinette's just going to ignore/deny that. Adrien deserves to know the truth, yesterday
Well, considering Marinette is sort of a stalker, she could easily manipulate him.
I read a fanfic on AO3 (This House Don't Feel Like Home by CryptTheCryptid) about it where the two are together, but it's because Marinette manipulate Adrien to move to the US and get married.
Don't worry! Adrien does get save at the end.
It's mainly a character bashing fic, but it's a good one-shot story.
The worst thing is that the writers think they did a good job.
At least admit that your show isn' perfect😮💨
Well this might be a bad idea to mention. But screw it! I'm mentioning it. On July 23rd there is some kinda miraculous con. So there's always the chance to confront the show writers there.
They really sat back on their seats after writing the last 10 minutes and thought they made a masterpiece😂
@@libandualeh7621
They really thought they ate that huh!
It’s the worst piece of fiction ever made.
😂😂😂😂😂
@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisTRFWhere
@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisTRF considering how they react to regular criticism online, it'd be pointless.
You'd get some witty comeback that explains nothing, then the whole room will enthusiastically applaud them bc it'll be full of loyal supporters.
I will admit… as a fan for over 6 years… I was NOT SATISFIED with this finale
Everything that I wanted to see such as the identity reveal, Emilie coming back to life and REUNITING with her son, Gabriel being punished for his actions……. NOTHING THAT WE ALL WANTED happened! They couldn’t even give me ONE SINGLE HUG from Emilie and Adriens “reunion.”
And now, Adrien will live a lie.. not knowing that his dad was Monarch this whole time and his mother was dead in the basement. He deserves to know the WHOLE TRUTH! His whole family is the reason why this show EVEN EXISTS!!!!
👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾😤
How do they even explain the fact his mum came back from the dead. Genuinely. Without admitting the truth.
I swear I remember Thomas saying that a reveal would happen in Season 5, and that people were really excited about that. But now here we are; going onto six seasons and still nothing. I’ve waited so long now that I don’t even care about the reveal anymore. I feel the same way about the reveal as I do about Marinette’s & Adrien’s relationship - bored with lost interest. It’s been dragged out now for so long that I didn’t even feel anything when they got together, or when they kissed because the pacing of this show is just terrible lmao
Not to mention the show has never put much focus on Adrian
@@ellenoniell8093cuz no one either than Felix or Natalie saw the emilie coffin. He could say she returned from being on an island alone or something
I hope ladybug viewers are happy]
This show taught us that a abusive neglectful and fully grown adult can be “redeemed” and be let off scot free for hsi actions, immortalised as a hero and all of his said abuse is washed away by even teh protagonists.
While a 14 year old girl who has been neglected all her life is beign treated with such cruelty by the narrative . And is not even given a satisfying ending.
I do hope you all are happy with sticking with this show for 5 labours seasons…and for many more
We really need to talk about how Marinette lying to Adrien and gaslighting him into believing into different idealistic version of Gabe makes their relationship really toxic and messed up on so many levels. It's not a "white lie" when you're actively changing how your partner remembers things and this mixed with fact he was showing signs of PDTS for couple of seasons that was never taken care of is just evil i have no other words for it. I know they're probably setting up future relationship drama but how do you ever forgive that and keep being with person who mentally abused you? You don't.
This is supposed to be end-game relationship? Jesus this show needs to be pulled out of kids TV.
Right, that forshadowing a character goess dowwn a dark path arc, not rlationshipmaterial, and abuse. She does the same things gabe did. Which makes it more tragic.
@@marocat4749 The circle of abuse in Adriens life never ends it would be interesting theme to explore in actually good show but just like with Marinette's stalking it probably will just end up being excused and forgotten about.
@@marocat4749 She lied to him and I will only accept it like this, Marinette knows that Gabe is one of nay the WORST person there, and stoops to his level
@jonelrobinson5189Facts!
She’s been gaslighting him since like season 2 or 3. She knew his identity and knew she has a crush on him and he has a crush on her and pretends she doesn’t and keeps breaking his heart every single time. The fact that he’s still a hero itfp is a miracle (pun intended)
I think what bothered me the most was the fact that Gabriel was being set up this season as if he lost all of his humanity and only cared about his obsessions, rather than his wife, only to turn it all around and have Gabriel do a last minute sacrifice. If this happened during season 3 or 4, I would understand, but season 5, where the creators specifically made Gabriel look like he was going mad with power!!! I guess they are setting up some Spider-Man plot with Gabe and Mari’s secret, and Adrian possibly finding out, and going against Ladybug. I don’t know!!! It’s still frustrating that Chloe is an irredeemable monster, and Gabriel is the hero of Paris!!! I mean, what the hell is that nonsense?!!!
Yes! It didn’t make sense in the end of sacrificing himself! He won but in a way, he still lost….
This season, they made his personality ten times WORSE! Now he doesn’t care if his son is in danger when a villain appears…. He became mad with the powers that he obtained and yet… he was redeemed??…. *sigh* I don’t know what the writers were thinking honestly….
Yes! In the first episode of season 5 he has the chance to save Emily, but chooses to fight Lb and Cat Noir instead.
It's clear it isn't about his wife and son anymore. It's only about his prideful self.
@@roxirock5455 literally my favorite part of that episode was natalie ridiculing gabe for his smooth brain actions
He reverted to early Gabe, from Seasons 1-3. His character basically did a reverse Chloe. Started out kinda sympathetic, went full out evil crazy person in Seasons 4 & 5, then went back to being portrayed as sympathetic in the last two episodes 😅
I just wish that Cat Noir confronted Gabe alongside Ladybug. The writers are just trying him to make feel like a sidekick instead of Ladybug’s partner. Also, why was Gabe redeemed and Chloe wasn’t? It’s just unfair.
@TPRules uhm if Cat Noi/Adrien confronted Monarch it would have resulted in an akumatization of Cat Noir/Adrien
@@marcogeurts9881No. It wouldn't! Cat Blanc was a different timeline! So was ephemeral! It wouldn't be the same! At worst Adrien would try to Cataclysm his father again! But would I blame him? Hell no!
@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaDennisTRF the fact this is a different timeline doesn't change the fact that Gabriel will certainly akumatise Adrien if he find out that Adrien is Cat Noir.
It's litterally one of the most important point of Cat Blanc and Ephemeral.
@@mimiquoi7380No. No. No. No. No. No. No. NO! THOMAS ASSTRUC IS A FUCKING IDIOT! HE CAN'T WRITE WELL! YOU CAN NOT BE THIS STUPID!
@@mimiquoi7380 then that's still the writer's fault, they wrote themselves into a corner by making the fact that cat noir getting akumatized is an instant lose condition and instead of making a way for him to avoid getting akumatized, maybe it would actually add tension, they just completely remove him because it's easier that way
You know the writers are just going to shrug and says “It’s a kids show” when someone correctly points out that the story was terrible.
Does Adrien even know that he is a sentimonster. (I am now refusing to use sentibeing until that is shown on screen) I hope that Adrien gets to completely blow up about find about every secret that is being kept from him. We know that won’t happen since the writers hate him as much as they hate Chloe. The few times he is actually kicking ass in a battle, Ladybug stops him. So zero faith there.
As a stand-alone episode it was really enjoyable. As the end of the whole story arc of the first 5 seasons it was a kick in the balls
This episode really was fifty fifty. It had some good moments. World wide heroes fighting akumatized people with normal people which is cool. Monarch and Bug Noir fight. Plagg and Tikki's true forms. And getting to know Gimmi's personality.
Then the bad parts. Adrien not fighting his dad in the final battle. Adrien not knowing that his dad was Monarch. Gabriel being named a hero after what happened. Gabriel basically winning. Not having Adrien and Marinette reveal their identities to eachother. And more.
For me the best season finalis were season two and four.
Love this, completely agree.
I agree! I loved both seasons 2 and 4 finales! I like this one too, but I feel mad at the fact about how Marinette was stupid enough to not know already that Gabriel was Monarch when Felix told her in the previous episode. Also, I feel like they should've had Cat Noir, Ladybug, and Argos take down Monarch. Like fr.
@@DaRealAngel430 Fr. Why is Felix part of the team now? He has been keeping the truth for a long time and didn't even help.
I like him and want to see him part of the team, but it seemed rushed and forced.
@@roxirock5455 I know! I like Felix as a character cause he gives anti-hero vibes but like in the final fight they should've included him and cat noir! At least give Felix screen time in the finale besides his appearances in the end. It would've been like that if they wanted Marinette to use both miraculouses have cat noir lose his in the final fight then she merges them and the identity reveal happens!
Agreed.
The thing that confuses me about the end is how everyone just forgets about how the alliance rings turned most of the world into supervillians by brainwashing them. Even if they're unaware of Gabriel being Monarch, him and Kagami's mother were still suspicious enough to warrant an investigation. Other companies have been scrutinized for far less.
I'm sure the show will just never address your questions to begin with, but if by some chance they actually do address it you can probably expect them to wave the issue off and say that it's "quantum masking" or whatever that robot girl from New York called it. The magic that keeps people from recognizing or acknowledging or thinking about any details that would expose the Miraculous holder's identity. Even divided among countless rings all around the world, each alliance ring wearer was being granted the powers of at least a dozen kwamis at the same time. Every alliance ring was acting like some sort of proxy supermiraculous. They were all channeling a ton of magical energy. Who knows what kind of tricks that could have been playing on people's minds?
I forget... Throughout this season did the show ever have anybody being able to recognize who had been akumatized when the akuma villain was granted a power through an alliance ring? I'm thinking that they must have done that, I just can't think of any examples. That recognition would go against this "quantum masking" idea. Not that it'd be at all surprising if the show was inconsistent in following its own rules.
That would be a good consequence,miss tsurugi getting under scrutiny and investigation even in the news shown, would be a consequence
@@MuljoStpho I think everyone recognized Gabriel in the previous episode when he akumatized himself. I also think there were more examples like Kagami, Natalie, and some others, but I don't care enough to actually go back and check.
The rings, imo, were an interesting concept, but they still created a few too many plot holes for my liking.
For example, Marinette refused to use the ring after she was almost caught by her friend using her ring as ladybug, but somehow doesn't put two and two together when the same thing happens to Alya and Zoe (especially considering Alya fought Monarch last season as Ladybug) when Monarch ambushed them and stole the miraculous, and doesn't even seem to think about the conclusion that the rings and Monarch are connected in some way. Hell, I don't even think she ever told Cat Noir not to use the rings because of that.
Another point is Gabriel not figuring who Ladybug and Cat Noir are or at least narrowing down who it could be because of the rings. From what I can tell, most of Paris were using the rings and he was never able to track Cat Noir and Ladybug like he could Alya and Zoe because they weren't wearing the rings. It probably would've been easier to figure out their identities based on the very few people in that city who weren't wearing rings especially since his son and Marinette never wore one, and he interacts with them almost daily.
Gabe reset world time was change
everyone believes monarch sabotaged them… it was stated in the finale
That moment when your character arc is about taking your autonomy back from your abusive parent then the writers end your story with taking away your autonomy.
Also: there’s a theory going around that Gabe didn’t actually revive Emilie, and it’s actually Amelie at the pool (one reasoning being that we’d see both twins, especially since Felix is there). Instead, his wish was to join Emilie in death. Which actually makes him an even worse parent (a bar we thought couldn’t get any worse) because that would mean he abandoned his kid to be with his wife (again, totally something that fits him). There’s also the fact that Natalie is alive and clearly healed. Only Gabe died in the wish, so only one person should be brought back, not both Emilie and Natalie.
I like how now both Plagg and Marinette know that Gabe was Monarch but have chosen not to tell Adrien.
Honestly I’m actually a little worried about the messages this show is giving kids; that you should always forgive people who hurt and wrong you no matter what they do or even GASLIGHT their victims into believing they didn’t do anything wrong in the first place.
The number of times Lila, Gabriel and Chloe never face the consequence of their action because “making bad people feel bad won’t make them good” is genuinely concerning in a kids show because it tells kids that behaviour like this is ok and that victims should just accept it
Well bc its a show they kinda need those characters to be bad. However, stating that "being mean to them won't fix the situation" is not saying that it's okay. It is saying yea their behavior is really messed up, but being a bully is not going to make them be a better person. It's just going to escalate the situation. Kind of like "if you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all" kinda thing. Except it's if you aren't going to take the time and energy to teach and reform this person in good manners, then leave it alone.
@@raebaby4600 I get where you’re coming from, you don’t want to encourage kids to be petty or vindictive but these characters behaviours have escalated beyond anything that you can forgive and forget.
Gabriel kept his son and Kagami imprisoned against their will; which is borderline a human rights violation, but he’s now going to be remembered as a hero?
And Lila has repeatedly falsely accused Marinette of theft to the point she was almost expelled from school; something that should be taken much more seriously than the show does. If someone tried that irl that could have serious impacts on a persons future or could even lead to them getting a criminal record. Yet Lila never had any kind of repercussions.
Kids shouldn’t be encouraged to be cruel to people but there is a point where such behaviour shouldn’t be tolerated and suitably punished; because like the show also shows if not challenged it can escalate and cause real damage
@@Halfbad-bf1lt oh no I totally agree that stuff in the show is extreme but I think it's more of the parents responsibility to allow their kids to watch things with iffy ethics but explain how those ethics aren't right and teach them more ideal ones.
@@Halfbad-bf1lt also just last night I was talking to my boyfriend about how shows and movies always portrayed "unbelievable" bullying. I said that I always thought it was just a TV thing until I experienced that kinda bullying irl. I'm over it at this point and it did hurt but it taught me that tv isn't always wrong 😅 and that I should be more understanding of different "extremes"
The concerning thing for me is that both Lila and Chloe received more consequences then Gabriel, Tsurugy (idk if I'm speeling it right, Kagami's mom) and Nathalie ever did and they're both teenagers. What kind of message is that?
So let me get this straight full grown adults who commit terrorism or abuse their power? They're just misunderstood.
Teenagers doing terrible things? They're iredimble.
Both Chloe and Lila get some sorta of punishment, Chloe is defeated and has to leave town, Lila is expelled.
But Mayor Burjua, Kagami's mom and Nathalie get free passes meanwhile Gabriel becomes a hero?
What the f.
I’m glad to see that people were unhappy with this ending as much as me. Good lord I was so disappointed.
And on top of that I felt like Marinette and Adrien’s romance wasn’t worth it in the end. It was more annoying than cute.
I am SO GLAD someone also thinks adrien and Marinette's relationship is more annoying than cute
YES THANK YOU.
5 ENTIRE SEASONS OF THOSE TWO JUST TRYING TO GET THE OTHER TO FALL IN LOVE WITH EACH OTHER WITH REALLY OVER COMPLICATED PLANS WAS BEYOND ANNOYING. And on top of that, it was already disappointing that Gabriel had won the fight but the heroes got a happy ending. It just sounds like the entire story of Ladybug and Chat Noir protecting Paris to prevent Gabriel from getting their miraculous and making a wish was completely worthless.
The last thing I wanted to see in that episode was romance between the 2, how disappointing
@@MakiCookie I will say I want a scene were cat noir's says something similar to lb "I believed in you, I believed in you for nothing for you to fail me fail everyone and everything you love for you to become something you were fighting" with all the emotions cuz she failed horribly
Now this part is just my opinion but felix getting away with what he did bc he has sad backstory and wanted adrien free and acting like Marinette (being a slacker while Mari had a trauma and her terrible actions was caused by it and she actaully changed even tho I still don't support her in that part) was terrible he gave gabriel a chance to win and he did win! At this point Marinette is so naive and forgiving she didn't learn anything from when she was bullied!
@@MakiCookiehelp the way it was developed made no sense too,how did mari suddenly go from chat to adrien in 1 single episode💀
@@justarandomperson8561 I know right? It was a whole hot potato game with who is Marinette’s love interest 💀
From Adrien, to Luka, to Chat, then back to Adrien-
I swear, the first or second episode of season 6 Mari and Adrien are gonna break up and the cycle repeats💀
I love how Emilie was revived in place of Gabriel dying and everyone was just like “Man, Gabriel is such a hero. I could never sacrifice my life like he did. Oh, hi Emilie! Where ya been?”
I’m thinking maybe he wished that she never died and that he was the one to die a year ago. But then again they said he died fighting Monarch. So maybe he just wished she never died or that wasn’t Emily and that that was her twin and he really just wished to die in peace with her?!??
That's amilie
I actually think that he didn't revive Émilie and that it's Amélie in the epilogue
I genuinely felt sad after done watching this finale.
Not because it affected me in any way but because i was sad that i wasted 5 years watching this show, only for it to end like this.
So much potential and ambition wasted for a bunch of lack buster of a writers.
I’ll always remember the days when this series used to be good
But for now I guess it’s the end of it for me.
no because,
1. they killed Luca (like him leaving)
2. Lila can lie and get away with it
3. Chloe can’t have a character development I guess
4. Chloe can be mean and people are blind about it (like Lila)
5. Gabriel is now worshiped even tho he literally destroyed Paris every single day….?
6. no fight scene or anything? like it was just a cut after Gabriel made his wish
7. what about Adrien and Felix being Seti monster? like ep23 was all about that, but I wish they did more.
8. It was nice seeing the Miraculous World characters, but it was tbh, so random
In other words, they rushed so much and I just wished they could have slowed pasted the story.
1. Yeah that sucks and was kinda out of nowhere/unecessary cuz Alya is still here
2. Lila literally got expelled from the school and she now has to present herself as a different person forever
3. The writers are doing Chloe so dirty, I agree
4. And this also sucks, it doesn't make sense and all it does it make everyone seem stupid
5. Nobody ever knew he was Hawkmoth/Monarch except Marinette. Gabriel told Marinette to make sure Adrien never finds out, and it was explained that everyone thinks that Gabriel died while defeating Monarch alongside Ladybug.
6. like 1/3rd of this entire episode is fight scenes idk what u mean
7. i don't think they're done with that yet, the rings still exists and so do the amoks inside those rings
8. I get they did it for callbacks but damn it was so random and unnecessary
@@ferretonahelmeti think what they meant with 6 was that after the wish, there's a major time skip (which honestly bothered me the most)
this show is the definition of a rushed slow burn LMAOOO
Dude somebody literally claimed Gabe didn't have a redemption even though that's exactly what it was🤣🤣🤣🤣
representation was episode 24and revolution which was the previous episode aired after that. But this finale totally forgets about the events of representation.
I said this once and I'll say it again. The final fight should have been Gabe vs Adrien instead of Gabe vs Mary. Literally what happen to Adrien's character growth and him one day "standing up against his father." Plus Adrien has a connection with Monarch unlike Mary. They LITERALLY have the next hawkmoth be Lila, a person that has a strong connection and hatred towards Marinette. And don't get me started on Gabe getting "redeemed" literally a person that abused and neglected his child, manipulated children for his own personal gain, terrorism, didn't care to he killed in the process to get his wish, and literally tried to make his son marry someone he didn't even love. That's just the short list not to mention the child endangerment, war crimes, the attempted genocide and homicide, attempted mass murder, enslavement, and the list goes on and on.
Or at least Gabe vs. both of them.
Somewhere out there, there is an 8-year-old kid, who has a very bad flu, is drunk off of NyQuil and watched this finale. Ten years from now, they will question if this is how the show actually ended or was it all a fever dream.
Am I the only one?
When Ms. Bustier described her eco-utopia I couldn't help but thinking of the film "Happy Feet", which started as a light-hearted tale of a little penguin who just wanted to dance, and at a certain point turned into a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT story about how humans are destroying Earth and we should all give up fossil fuel.
Same vibe here: "we interrupt your regular Ladybug show for an important announcement about ecology..."
It’s dumb
It felt so weird
The biggest problem with the show has always been that this is Adrian’s story, but Marionette is made the main character and takes scenes narratively not meant for her. This whole show can be summed up as making the secondary love interest character of a story the POV main character of an action/adventure story where the personal stakes in the conflict that belong to the real main character, are seized by the love interest who doesn’t have any personal stakes beyond winning their crush’s affection. They way you test a story for who the main character is, is asking if the story couldn’t exist without them. Remove Marionette and the story exists, remove Adrian and there is no story. If the writer wanted a female main character they should have just gender swapped Adrian.
The thematic tone deafness regarding Adrian’s abuse is probably one of the worst things about the finale. If you’re going to write a child abuse victim in a story, actually do your research on the matter to handle it with the respect it deserves.
Gabe sacrificing himself is fine, but practically deifying him as a hero and having the abuse victims gf become the new abuser??? Don’t touch this subject matter if you won’t write it respectfully.
Also, they’re such an eco warrior zealot they decided to skip the actual ending for the characters to try and push nonsensical eco-utopia propaganda on kids. Seriously, they decided intrusive politics should come before giving viewers an actual ending. No respect to the years of fan investment in the story 🤷♀️
Got a chuckle out of you mentioning the lack of ambulances. Eco warriors seem to forget about their existence IRL too, like when they block roads of traffic to “save” the planet 🙃
Marinette was always the main character from the start. Miraculous Ladybug was never just about Adrien. It was always about Ladybug and Chat Noir, hence the title.
And thats why she is a mary sue, making the things that in no way are about hr,about her, breaking the entire worldbuilding, is a mary sue. I am surprised it went that far, but yeah, anyone saying she ist a mary sue, thats a clear mary sue example of breaking the worldbuilding by their gravitas.
@@Diogo85Thomas just wanted to push his imaginary perfect daughter as the main character eventhough the events weren't related to her in the slightest instead of making a main female character as the center of the story.
If he actually cares about ladybug and chat noir as a team why doesn't he show it?
The eco warrior stuff is fine, Paris with trees, recycling, and no litter looks great and sends the right messages. What is NOT fine, however, is the fact that Adrien's abusive father is now respected as a hero, and Adrien himself is supposed to remember him as a good man. How come Adrien never confronted his father? We were waiting for this to happen for a long time!
Yes! 1000 times yes!
Though I still think Marinette's the main character. But it is frustrating that the writers keep robbing Adrien of moments that should be his.
This episode had 2 redeaming qualities.
1. The fight wad preatty good and creative.
A piano was droped on Gabriel. Nuf said.
2. The reveal with the kwamis and the wish looked really cool and i like that it was forshadowed in Dearest Family.
Other than that the amount of stupid is near infinite.
Why was Adrian cut out?
Since when is luca a Guardian?
What purpose fo any of the other heroes serve.
Why do those evil drones even exist if the don't even fight ladybug.
How did Paris become an Utpoia?
Because a school teacher is mayor?
Why wasn't Marinette affected by the nightmare anymore?
What is going on with Lila. Can she see into the future. Did she know exactly what would happen and how she could steel the butterfly.
What was Tzurugues Motive?
Why is Felix on the team??
Didn't he comit genocide like 2 weeks ago?
Isn't he responsible gor everything that happened in season 5?
Because Felix turned out to be good and the teacher became mayor because in episode 23 "Revolution" he was told to become mayor and he won the election
Paris becoming a utopia was b/c it was Gabriel’s wish
@@blancacarrascolopez7305 ah yes, he turned out to be good. Easy. Hey remember emperor palpatine. One of the most evil villians in Cinema? Its fine now. He said he's good now. Who care if he commited genocide.
About lila idk which ep but nathalie sent her everything bc lila had most of paris under her control when she was akumatized
@@thekoy0let's forget he turned it into anti utopia throughout FIVE SEASONS
I dont watch Miraculous anymore…but in the final battle of the AGRESTE arc, Adrien AGRESTE who’s also Cat Noir DOESNT SHOW UP IN THE FINAL BATTLE, HAS ZERO PLOT REVALNCE AND THINKS OF HIS FATHER AS A HERO?? The fact that this is tales of Ladybug and CAT NOIR yet Cat Noir has no presence in the finale is absolutely infuriating
One of my biggest problems with this ending is becuase they made it such a BIG DEAL to do ANYTHING - from the regular fights to time travel - to stop Gabriel's wish from happening -- so why in the world is it suddenly 'fine' for it to happen now???
It literally feels like Gabriel could've been given the ring and earrings at the very beginning and saved a whole lot of suffering if everything is 'better' after he made the wish and was apparently MEANT to make the wish since we didn't have a time travel incident stop it from happening again???
I can see the potential but it's still very frustrating after everything Gabriel has done...if he died that is, there is still the possibility that something went wrong or that he never planned on giving his life in the first place, they said he would appear again in the next seasons and in the original storyboard at the end of the episode you can hear an evil laugh and that's what scares Lila, a MALE laugh...
Wait....... WHAT?!
Making everyone a permanent holder is a very risky move. As far as she knows the main threat is beaten, so why more heroes? It wasn’t clear whether Lila found out about the temp heroes or not through Natalie. With or without this information though, she can easily exploit at least one hero to get the upper hand with the amount there is now.
I think permanent holders are a good idea, provided there are conditions.
---Holders can lose their power for committing selfish and dangerous acts
----Being a holder only lasts for the person's lifetime, after that the miraculous will go to a person who possesses the correct traits.
@@DrawciaGleam02the only problem is that Lila potentially knows who most of them are via Natalie, and will be in close proximity to the holders under a new identity which means Lila could potentially snag a miraculous or two
@@AptMantis2278She might do that because the writers said Heroes won't always win. Bunnix better watch her back because Lila knows who she is.
I think it can work - IF the show stayed compact with the main 7 miraculous: More attention on the remaining holders, and much easier time to track them all without bloating the plot with too many characters. (Despite how much I love the dragon, horse, snake and bunny miraculouses).
This ending was just complete madness. Gabriel wins, gets his wish, and everything is a perfect utopia. He’s remembered as a hero, all the pain and abuse he’s done is waved away. And we end with Adrian and Marionette having there happy romance. Except for the fact that she’s lying to Adrian about the truth about his father.
This was terrible!
Gabriel went from "Supervillain who wants to conquer the world." to "Pathetic old man who can't get over his ex."
My theory is that Thomas got absolutely bullied by 2 teen girls who just happen to look like Lila and Chloe and there was a nice marinette type girl who helped him out.
This has been my theory for years and it' even feels kinda obvious,
What about Hawk moth
@@user-bs2ds9vm2m A teacher he had a love hate relationship with
I think he confirmed that chloe was "inspired by" his own highschool bully, eventhough chloe acts so over the top i have a hard time believing people would bully in the way she does.
Marinettes parents are inspired by thomas himself and his ex wife, so in a way marinette is kind of his fictional daughter in his brain
Point is thomas is pathetic for taking these things to heart so much to a point it ruins the writing
@@navinity3712 I heard about the one with Marinette. Man that with himself and his ex-wife is cringy as heck.
The most ridiculous part was Luka, who had been put on a bus in "Migration" with a flimsy excuse, ending up as a disciple of Su Han along with Jagged and Penny... TOTALLY RANDOM and useless to the plot. They return to do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
Agreed.
That p$$$ me off so much. Su Han choos to train Luka and the other two adults instead of.... I dont know..... MARINETTE??? WHY?
That’ll probably be explained eventually maybe
that was the only thing I thought was cute, what was crazy was that kagamis mother isnt going to get ANY CONSEQUENCES for her maniacal behaviour!!!
I hope adrien becomes a villain
Everyone deserves to get demolished because they hid literally everything from him
Adrien deserves so much better than this excuse of a story arc
You know, a couple of years back, after being thoroughly let down by the show at the end of Season 3, I wrote an essay entitled, "Miraculous Ladybug is No Longer Worth Watching Until We Get to the End...And Let Me Tell You Why". I started out about the things I initially liked about the show, how it was a hodgepodge of Western action cartoons and Magical Girl anime, which, on paper, just shouldn't work. But somehow, it does. I also talked about a few of the things I liked about Adrien, as a character (which the show has evidently gone out of its way in the last two years to try and destroy, for the most part), and used him as an example of what made the show unique, how it took tropes from both Western cartoons and anime and put unique spins on them.
But then, I went on to address the elephant in the room. Thomas Astruc may have been influenced by Magical Girl anime, but he clearly wasn't paying attention to one thing that ultimately has to happen in that genre. Specifically, how "the structure of a story arc inevitably has to shake things up by getting to the part where all the secrets between the characters are laid bare, the final battle with the big bad takes place and everything pretty much goes straight to hell before a happy ending is reached. But while that is AN ending, it's not THE ending, because after that, a NEW arc takes its place, which generally sees the main characters faced with new relationships, new responsibilities, and ultimately, a new, different, more powerful enemy who's inserted themselves into the picture and made it their life's mission to take away everything the good guys have. This helps, not only with world-building, but also to give the audience a chance to actually enjoy the payoffs that came from the previous story".
Unfortunately, that was the rub. Even from the early days of Season 3, it was made PAINFULLY clear that Astruc and Crew didn't HAVE an idea for a story arc after this one (unless they had been sitting on plans for a follow-up movie or two, which would have been nice, but still not an outcome I'd bet money on). So they'd basically been left with no choice but to keep the show running in place, with all the characters left in their assigned little boxes and no one was allowed to move forward, "BEYOND-THIS-POINT", because no one on the creative side knew what that was supposed to look like, beyond how they wanted the series to end.
Essentially, I ended my thesis by saying that I was more or less done with the show and would only MAYBE come back during the final three or four episodes when things would finally start moving forward. And for the most part, as I picked up little crumbs of information here and there, I was largely proven correct. Through Seasons 4 and 5, none of the moments that the show touted as being big, important events actually mattered, because they were just minor detours to eat up as much screen time as possible and ultimately, everything would just go right back to normal (or as normal as this show would get, anyway). But then I found out that this arc had FINALLY ended, and when I checked it out, all I got was, "WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT?!"🤯
I mean, never mind the fact that it isn't actually revealed what Gabriel wished for (Astruc dipping into yet another anime trope, this time, the one where the creator tries to APPEAR higher-minded than he actually IS, by using "cryptic obfuscation" as a substitute for not coming up a genuine ANSWER to give to the audience). But at literally the LAST-POSSIBLE-SECOND...he tries to give GABRIEL AGRESTE...the narcissistic, emotionally-stunted, neglectful-to-the-point-of-being-outright-ABUSIVE, MAIN VILLAIN that he just couldn't let go of for FIVE YEARS, because he couldn't think of anyone to FOLLOW him...an actual REDEMPTION?!?!?!
WHAT in the blue HELL, people?! I mean, I know that, by accounts, Astruc is a vainglorious, self-aggrandizing, control freak, just like Gabriel is, so it makes sense that he'd identify with the prick. But that's hardly an excuse.
Immediately, my thoughts turned back to Seasons 2 and 3, when Chloe was actually growing out of her role as a one-dimensional stock character (and, as I pointed out in my essay, when you’re three Seasons deep and the only one who’s shown ANY kind of overarching character development is “the bratty rich girl”, THAT should have been a signal right there that this thing had already been idling in Neutral for FAR too long). Then we got to end of Season 3, and what did they do? In one episode, they went and ERASED everything they had done with Chloe for the last Season-and-a-half. And when absolutely EVERYONE came after him for it, Astruc tried to justify himself by going, "Oh, but I don't like Chloe and you're not supposed to like her either and she doesn't deserve to have a redemption". 😩
Then why did you GIVE her one, Stupid?! And more to the point...just a minute. You're making it sound like that whole thing with Chloe was an ACCIDENT?! But this thing here with Gabriel was DELIBERATE?! What the HELL kind of ASS-BACKWARDS thinking is THAT?! And then, when Astruc realized that NO ONE was going to take his side on Chloe, he STILL tried to have his cake and eat it too, by introducing Zoe into the mix as a blatant attempt to pacify people and go, "Well, okay, I'll...I'll give you this character and...and she can be like...'Good...Chloe'. Will that make everyone happy?".
NO!!! Because Chloe was the ONLY character that you were actually making INTERESTING!!! I mean, none of the other supporting characters were going anywhere. And of the two that are actually supposed to matter, Adrien is still the one in the dark because he’s being neglected and lied to by the people he cares about the most (and we should certainly bemoan that fact, because it's just shady as all hell and he's always deserved better). And because Marinette's power has always been to reset everything back to zero, whenever she can't do that and there are actual CONSEQUENCES to be faced, her default response has always been to just cut and run (the way this Season ended was just one more example of it). And while I get that this was by design, to keep AGONIZINGLY dragging out the central arc, it just makes her look SO weak and ineffectual, as the central hero. In fact, I can't help wondering if that's a primary reason as to why Chloe got shafted as badly as she did, because she was the only one showing legitimate growth and was actually getting to the point where she would have arguably overshadowed the two supposedly-main characters.
The only thing that I would add here, is that as far as a better ending goes, my personal suggestion would be to just move in the direction the show was originally aiming at, back in Season 2, when Fu revealed the true nature of the Creation and Destruction Miraculous being used together...that it's not omnipotence as Gabriel believed, but equivalent exchange. In order to get what he wants, something else must be sacrificed, but Gabriel has no say over what that is. Meaning that to get his wife back...ADRIEN has to die. Faced with the loss of his son and a wife seeing him for the monster he's become, Gabriel becomes a deer in the headlights and just shuts down completely, leaving Marinette as the only one who can fix everything and bring Adrien back. How does she do it? Damned if I know. But doesn't that ALREADY sound like a better wrap-up to this mess than what we got?
Okay, that's enough of my ramblings. This has already gone on too long as it is, except to say that I think I'm about done with this series entirely. Enough is enough. I'm burned out. This show started out with so much potential, but all that goodwill has just been pissed away. I need to move on with my life. I think we ALL do.
At least, that's just MY thinking on it.
And how are you
Well said.
@@ilyesbendadi2501 Mostly okay, though I'm not sure what that has to do with anything. 😅
@@vedwalker3974 I certainly thought so. And I still stand by every word. Even the recent Special was a disappointment to me. I know most people liked it, and yeah, if judged strictly on its own merits, there were a lot of good ideas, and the story was solid. My problem is, I can't weigh that Special in a vacuum. I have to measure it against what came before, and sadly, as became clearer and clearer to me throughout Season 3, all I saw was more wasted potential.
Let's address the elephant in the room, which is the Special's placement in the chronology. Instead of leaning hard into the upcoming Season 6 and using this story as a jumping-off point (you know, "out with the old...this is what the NEW looks like"), they time-displaced the Special and put it at the beginning of Season 5. Does this mean that Astruc and the rest of the Creative Team have no confidence in the show's new direction? Or did they just never want to go in a new direction to begin with? Whatever the reason, the bottom line is that any goodwill the Special initially came in with was almost immediately stymied by all the show's bad baggage.
I cite the moments between Marinette and Alya, where Alya is essentially continuing her role as Marinette's cheerleader/therapist. Again, while there's nothing wrong with these exchanges, in and of themselves, it's hard not to bemoan the fact that these are EXACTLY the kind of heart-to-hearts Marinette SHOULD HAVE been having with ADRIEN by now (Thomas Astruc appearing to be undaunted in his mission to keep pushing Adrien off to the wayside). The placement in the timeline also sucks the oxygen out of the climax, to an extent, when "Alternate" Gabriel powers up Marinette to keep "Main" Gabriel from invading other parallel worlds. Marinette has just been given all the power she needs to take Gabriel out, once and for all. But of course, she can't actually DO that because she's still got a whole Season full of garbage to slog through. So instead, the whole thing just gets reduced to a cheap comedy bit.
Speaking of not being allowed to do things, however, another scene I took issue with was the moment where "Alternate" Marinette tries to combine the Miraculous of Creation and Destruction, only to have it not work, because Tiki and Plagg's power is being blocked by some shadowy figure from her world called "The Supreme". While the Special tried to prop up this mysterious entity as being some new Big Bad to be battled later on, my take on it was, sadly, a lot more cynical. When "Alternate" Marinette's attempt to make the wish fails, this booming voice from beyond declares, "ONLY THE SUPREME CONTROLS REALITY!!!". And honestly, my personal read on that line was that it was actually Thomas Astruc referring to HIMSELF. No, seriously...think about it for a minute. And just when you thought the man's ego couldn't POSSIBLY get any more out of control, right?
About the only worthwhile thing that came out of the Special (at least, for me) was the fact that they've actually committed themselves to the whole "multiverse" conceit (which honestly, was the only reason I checked it out to begin with). Granted, going this way basically means Astruc's whole assertion that there's only "one proper" timeline and anything that doesn't take place on HIS schedule is a grotesque deviation that can only end in disaster was a total crock from Day One. But the one silver lining to all this is that with multiverse confirmed, it TECHNICALLY means the theatrical movie is canon now. Like most of us malcontents who got out after Season 3, I actually breathed a sigh of relief when the movie came out, because it dared to give us some measure of hope for the franchise, going forward. While not perfect, by any means (the limits of a 90-minute runtime, after all), the film did succeed in improving all the areas where the show has consistently been weak. By contrast, this Special only seemed to accentuate all those weaknesses (hence, why I decried it as just more wasted potential), but at least it removed that "non-canon" asterisk next to the movie, making it (to me, at least) one ray of hope that the franchise has left. They just have to not screw up the sequels, going forward.
One thing about the name "BugNoir" being the cringiest thing ever: in universe, I like to think that realistically she probably didn't have time to think of a new name right in the situation she was in, so she just said Bug Noir putting together Ladybug and Cat Noir
What would be better though? (Genuinely curious what you think, not trying to be rude)
@@Phoenix-em5uyLady Noire, but that was already used for her cat miraculous persona..
@@Phoenix-em5uy I'll be honest, I have no idea...
@@Phoenix-em5uy Lady Chaton
@@Phoenix-em5uy LADYcat
This finale. really really felt like it was written a long time ago, probably around season 1 to 2, back when gabe was a sympathetic character, a character who called off a villain when he thought cat noir was a his son (i know adrian is you know what i meant), But new writers came in and old ones left and the new writers turned what was once a villain with multiple layers to him into a single note abusive asshole who seems to hate his son (despite early seasons showing his relationship to Adrian to be still abusive but more line a emotionally distant kind of way, not a great parent but early gabe at least on some level did love his son). And i get why the new writers would do this, alot of people do forget the plot can be summed up as "teenagers try to stop a single grieving dad from reviving his wife", so i see why some people on the staff see gabe as still that sympathetic character we got early on. But nope he isn't, whether it was Awestruck's doing or a room of writer its clear they BUTCHERED this idea with their incompetence. And their is sooo much evidence from the episode itself to show that yeah this was rthe original series FINALE for miraclous. UGH you know i loved this show once, wasn't a super fan but i did enjoy when new episodes came out... now though i think this might be the last episode of miraclous i watch outside of youtube reviews
FINALLY! Someone who acknowledges Gabriel's gradual shift in character!! I've been saying this ever since Chat Blanc but while Gabe was sort of an ass in s1 and s2, he was never THIS bad-- and that's what irks me about that episode! They also do it to a bunch of other characters as well, like with Nathaniel destroying Marc's sketchbook and insulting it in 'Reverser' despite enduring the same treatment from Chloe in 'Evilustrator'!
Orrrrrr. Thomas Astruc is shitty writer who believes his show is the best thing since toilet paper. He even believes it's more popular than Pokemon.
I have to COMPLETELY AGREE!!! Years ago, we were told that S5 was going to be the last season of this WHOLE SHOW! Before we were told that this was an arc and they’ve planned on making more seasons…….
WHO THOUGHT THAT THIS WAS A GOOD IDEA TO END A SHOW?!?! It literally ends in the worst possible way when they thought ending with a BIG FAT CLIFFHANGER was a good idea to end a WHOLE SHOW!
I love miraculous too… but they way they’ve been writing their episodes for the past 8 years and getting nowhere… this finale was the final straw for me….
i kind of agree that this idea off Gabriel being presented as a good guy would be better with earlier gabriel but… would it though?
He definitely loved his son; that's true… and prevented any harm happening to him but he still injured/endangered many civillians since the beginning of the show. Him seein getting away from justice and EVEN getting elevated as a hero would by no means be a satisfying ending, even if it was earlier Gabriel
@@poransuki8203 yes, it wouldn't be a good ending, but there wouldn't be as much salt in this wound, with earlier gabriel it would be a bit, but this gabriel? they be dumping the world's supply of salt straight at this wound
Ok, Gabriel sacrificed himself to save her. Let’s do basic maths. This guy has tortured over 1M PEOPLE!
Actually.....is 8b people, since thats the ( i think ) real number of people in the world, So he basically tortured all of the world JUST IN THE END TO BE THE HERO!?!?
That wasn’t a redemption: it was a bold face suicide. Emile really said to let it go and let her die. No! He’d rather be the Monster to be called a hero to die and had she’s not be in love with Adrien.. She would of made the better choice! Tell Adrien the truth. The boy hates secrets and lies!
I still think its unbelievable that Gabriel was seen in a more positive light than Chloe. I dont care if people are sick of hearing this, but how am I not supposed to complain when the writing is this bad?
Gabriel has by far done much worse then Chloe, and hes a full grown adult, and unlike him, Chloe actually had a fleshed out backstory and I was able to symphasize with her, but I cant with Gabriel, firstly, he says what hes doing is for his son and yet continues to abuse him, he puts several peoples lives in danger, only to continually fail, and lastly, we dont know jack shit about Emilie , the person hes trying to bring back. They didnt have to redeem him, the story would have made a hell lot more sense, but no, we cant have decent things in this show.
I'm honestly really confused by the Worldbuilding of this show. The fact that two literal gods older than the universe itself have no choice but to answer to a mere human just because they wore the miraculous never made sense to me. Which is even worse when it comes to the other kwamis, I mean, they're all gods with powers beyond comprehension, how does the miraculouses keep control them?
first, the kwamis are not older than the universe, they were created after the universe was created, second, the miraculous are objects that give the kwamis their physical forms so that humans can perceive them, they literally tie them to the world and whoever possesses their miraculous, which is why they are obliged to obey, is like the djinn of the lamp.
@@emanuelbaigorria3932 The thing about that though is that it literally (case in point, Nooroo) makes the kwamis slaves. If they're not unconditionally bound to the person holding their accessory, they're forever hidden inside some box....and apparently, they're not even longer able to control their own powers without a holder either.... wow, such a great way to interact with the physical world, I guess...
PS: yes, they lived happily with Marinette in her house, eating human food, watching tv, etc, but that's very clearly not the way it was "supposed to be"
@@kou7191 the miraculous box contains a pocket dimension where the kwamis can live quiet and free until their miraculous gets a holder, although they prefer the outside world because it is more interesting.
@@emanuelbaigorria3932 Yes, the miraculous box is a pocket dimension, it doesn't invalidate what i said about them being 'slaves' bound to an item, and/or sealed inside said box though.
"Remind Adrien that I tried to be a good father." BULL-HONKEY!!
@@luciawilliamson-waggoner3369 hmmmmm, nope cant think of any!!
My thing is that it seems like there was zero repercussion of Gabriel making his wish, so rlly this whole show has been for nothing, because gave made his wish, sacrificed himself, and like what? Nothing changed. Gabes dead, sure, but big deal if he would’ve sacrificed himself anyway. It’s like what they’ve spent so long trying to convince us couldn’t happen was just kinda like “oh.. okay??” I mean, with an ending like that, looking back they could’ve lent gabe the miraculous, made the wish, and gotten it back, cause apparently all of the “consequences” were non existent and made no real difference in the plot. Thank you for coming to my ted talk.
The ending of Gabriel's plot is a total failure. He makes him a total sociopath and a total bastard all season long and at the end he gets a happening and we have to believe that he's not a bad person at all. The guy in the final brainwashed his servants, not to mention all the rest of the septic tanks he had previously. All his talk about looking into his heart is pathetic because he'd have to have it first. Miraculous takes a stupid approach to redemption, Gabriel doesn't get punished for his sins, and Felix who cynically gave all the Miraculous in the box to Gabriel and is responsible for everything Gabriel did in Season 5. These guys have no idea how to spell villains.
edit:
Lila as the new Hawkmoth is synonymous with the word lack of creativity for me.
they do ALL that, then say that chloe is irredeemable.
@@kamilslup7743 Miraculous Logic:
Gabriel - manipulator, terrorist, sociopath, - redemption and no punishment
Felix - the culprit of everything Gabriel did in season 5 (remember that he didn't have to give him all miraculous to get Peacock) - redemption/absolution and no punishment
Chloe - the girl I have popotowane to change her behavior and create one of the most interesting characters in the cast - the worst evil that evil that walks on earth unable to redeem XD.
@@kamilslup7743Chloe deserves to be part of a better show.
Okay my problem isn’t even how Adrien wasn’t there.
It’s how the ENTIRE show. The writers, the fandom, the characters have all failed adrien. We already know Gabriel was neglectful and the relationship was wonky, then he goes to a public school and mistakes Marionettes stalking and creepy tendencies as fun and quirky and true friendship because he’s been sheltered his whole life. No one sticks up for him and is a true friend to him so he has to settle for the marionette. He was downplayed in the show heavy to boost Ladybugs image. Like how do you sideline chat noir when he’s such a cool character with an incredible power to the point where he isn’t even in the finale. What makes it worse is now that same creepy stalker girl got with him in the end and lied to him on multiple occasions, never telling the truth. Even in the end praising his abusive dad, Adrien has really been gaslit the entire show to care about people who treat him like shit.
Not to mention Kagami also being failed by having to live with her terrible mother but hey at least she has felix…right?
All in all, this was the most lazy ending ever they didn’t even find out their identities in a grand way now that monarchs gone. This finale just signified my displeasure for how the show was going and ladybug as a character. So disappointing.
Agreed.
I can get him not being in the final battle bc he doesn't have to confront his abuser alone or directly, ( ex: Cinderella ) but the fact he doesn't know is just horrible.
Somewhere in an alternate universe, this show is called Miraculous Cat Noir: Tales of Cat Noir and Ladybug, and everything is exactly the same except Cat Noir was the lead role instead of Ladybug, and actually got to face off against his father. Like, think about it... Hawk Moth is basically designed to be _Cat Noir's_ villain. He has no emotional connection to Ladybug at all! Its like the story was written in a way that Cat Noir would be the main hero, but then flipped it over to Ladybug so it would be a "girl power" show instead.
And yeah, there's nothing wrong with Ladybug being the main hero, but seriously WHY is the main villain a foil for Cat Noir if Ladybug is the main hero? Where is her emotional investment outside of "be hero cause its good?" Cat Noir has the tragic hero backstory and everything!
At this point adrien is a sim. He has no personality or agency outside of being chat noir. Yes gabriel controlled him but adrien never broke free on his own, never knew the truth about his dad or got the moment to confront him in battle. Wasted potential. Also if lila ends up being seen as the true evil of the show and not get redemption like gabriel did I will count that against this show. Because chloe and lila are written to be pure evil when gabriel did far worse and got off scott free by dying. He deserved to be in prison and alive to face his consequences for the actions he made.
I hate to say it but I think with this ending Marinette could be considered a criminal as well. I don't know about France, but in my country, when someone knows that a being is involved in a crime (robbery, assault, kidnapping, murder) and does not report it to the police, it makes them an ally of the crime (that is, the person will have to be punished too). The penalty for your crime is less worse than that of the person who committed the crime, yet it makes you a criminal
Same here. Weird how the writers didn't notice *coughs*
Two things that killed Me about this finale: 1. Marinette was talking shit to Gabriel again before taking back the miraculous. Like, did you learn nothing from episode 3, Marinette? Second, why didn't they have an interaction with Emily & Adrian; because now half the fans think it's Amille. There was a deleted scene of Adrien & Emily smiling at eachother, but why did they take it out; it was like 5 seconds?
When I first saw her, I ACTUALLY THOUGHT that was Emilie… but then again… there was no interaction between Adrien and her sooo….. I assumed it WAS Amelie, since she associates with the color black, whereas Emilie wears white! And the woman was wearing a black swimsuit!
I am aware that The script says that it’s Emilie, but there’s also the possibility that they changed their mind, last minute and deleted that Adrien-Emilie stare because they thought it was best to let the audience know that it’s probably Amelie!
Where can you find the deleted scene? Even now I don't know if it's Amelie or Emelie. I thought Gabriel sacrificed himself to bring back Nathalie, and he and Emilie are finally reunited in heaven (although in all fairness Gabriel deserves to go to hell).
@@empirestate8791 look up “miraculous ladybug season 5 episode 26 deleted scene”
I wonder if they left it out to keep it ambiguous. It gives them time to decide whether or not they want her alive or dead-- I doubt they have a solidified characterization for her, and she might be a pain to implement.
@@powerpuff6872 I won't be surprised if that's the case. Most of the Miraculous plot seems to be made up on the fly. Each season is full of retcons and subplots that go nowhere.
Glad I truly am glad Jeremy is doing a reboot movie of Miraculous
One of the plot points that bothers me the most, besides Cat Noir being completely excluded from the finale, is the fact that Gabriel essentially won. He made the wish. He got what he wanted and now he's being remembered as a hero. Everyone is living in an unrealistic, utopian society and singing kumbaya. The heroes' efforts to stop Gabriel were pointless, but the show doesn't even acknowledge this! The writers are trying to pass it off as a win. It doesn't make a lick of sense.😒
Also the shown's name is Ladybug AND Chat Noir. Ever since season 2 all I can see is Master Fu giving credit to Ladybug for being such a great hero. He never said anything for Chat Noir. That still pisses me off even thought master F*ck is now gone. However the show keeps not caring about Adrien/Chat Noir and even thought the entire purpose of the show is Ladybug AND, AND, AND Chat Noir finally defeating Monarch, after waiting for this moment for 5 whole seasons, all i get to see is Marinette fighting Monarch ALONE , she doesn't even atually defeat him she just gets tricked and Gabriel just sacrifises himself, while poor Adrien is trapped in a prison after he literally gave up his miraculous. He doesn't even take part in the finale of season 5. Monarch ( the basic villain) didn't even fight with Chat Noir who is supposed to be a protagonist too. WHAT A TRASH SHOW! Not only Adrien didn't learn his father's secret identity, but Gabriel never learns that Adrien is Chat Noir either! I want to punch Thomas in the face.
EVEN THE MOVIE CLEARLY SHOWS THAT LADYBUG AND. CAT NOIR NEED EACH OTHER TO SUCCEED💀
Okay, I remember watching this and thinking to myself, 'Eight years for this hyperactive BS ending to the Hawkmoth saga?'. The amount of plot contrivances, plot holes and bad writing story-wise is almost laughable. Like did they seriously tried to pull a Dark Knight ending with this season? With Gabe? The guy we've seen abuse and manipulate his son? What are the people at Zag smoking?
The reason that the cover up ending worked in The Dark Knight is quite simple. The story was structured to show us how Harvey Dent starts off as a really good guy that stands against the corruption in Gotham and how he falls into madness. Throughout the movie we se his fall into his Two-Face persona because of the events that broke him both mentally and physically. The scarring of his face, the death of the woman he loves, the belief that if he'd been listened to he would be happy. We never see Gabriel go through anything like that. He starts an asshole, he dies an asshole. Anyone that's seen the series will tell you that Gabe was in for an ass whooping. The audience will cheer more for the heroes to defeat the bad guy if the bad guy is a real bastard, and that's what Gabe is.
From Gabe's first introduction, we see him as a jerk and slowly moving towards the irredeemable SOB that he ended up as. There is no good or redeemable qualities in him and as such you don't root for him. Also, we don't see how the 'death' of his wife changed or affected him to turn him into the smooth brained man we know. So the audience is presented with an image of a piece of work that only gets worse over time. This makes the audience want the heroes to defeat him, more specifically, to see Adrien finally stand up to his father after so long.
Another aspect we need to see is how the cover up affects each story. In The Dark Knight, the cover up has to happen because the revelation of Harvey's actions would've led to all the imprisoned criminals to be let out on the streets once more. This would erase all the good Batman, Gordon and Harvey had done to stop the mob. In Miraculous, the cover up is used for no other reason than to further manipulate Adrien into doing what his father wanted and letting him off scot free. The cover up in Miraculous is not so much for the hope of a better tomorrow like in The Dark Knight as it is more so to give Adrien and the people of Paris an illusion--a lie--that Gabriel was a good man. A lie meant to take away from Adrien's agency in his own life.
Miraculous is a throne made out of missed opportunities, uninteresting writing, non-consistent character development. It tries to combine a fairy tale with superheroes but it fails miserably in creating a story that makes an interesting journey to follow. There's no change, no dark corners that will change the way the characters behave or act against a world that's more complicated than what they believe. Perhaps season six will bring about a new welcoming change, but it might be too little, too late for that lie.
In fairness, I think they were going for a Spider-Man (2002) ending, except the good publicity Gabriel gets is a byproduct and not necessarily the primary intent. However, they didn't even have the guts to follow through with the big reason why that movie ending works; because with Spider-Man fulfilling the promise the audience is shown how that act and the unintended consequences irrevocably changes Harry in the denouement. By contrast, there are no consequences shown here. There is no hint to the audience that Adrien might take it poorly. There's not even a hint that Marinette herself hates the lie. It's presented as an unambiguously happy ending.
I love how he requests not to have adrien know he was a villain so he remembers the times he tried to be a good parents. Yeah I’m sure he’ll remember the 5 times you were a decent human being fondly.
The ending effectively means that:
1.) Master Fu really was unqualified to be a guardian because had he just made himself known to Gabe, the events of the series could have been avoided.
2.) Ladybug and Cat Noir really are the villains, because all they did was prolong the terror on paris with their random superheroing rather than just work with Gabe
3.) The guardians collectively were idiots because apparently they were *wrong* about the wish and were indirectly imprisoning you-know-who by not allowing them to exist.
4.) Chloe is actually the real villain because the changes made by Ms Bustier isn't related to Monarch's reign at all. This means the series actually ended three episodes ago when Chloe was overthrown and this is just the epilogue.
My theory on to how Lila got the butterfly miraculous is that it was magically given to her after Gabe made his wish. It could be the universe's way of balancing itself and while yes Gabe did die, having Paris being made into a Utopia and all of his crimes to be forgotten/ignored while getting everything he ever wanted seemed like too much for one life to pay.
YES! I was thinking that too! He was the villain of Paris, and since the wish proclaimed him dead, it had to make a different person the villain of Paris to balance the situation!
Because, realistically, there is NO WAY for a human being to get down there without no problems and finding the butterfly miraculous underwater before Ladybug who has the upper hand!
not really, lila got the butterfly miraculous, sending the tsurugi robos to look for it, remember that she controls them.
Tbh, I HOPE that's the case. 😂
@@emanuelbaigorria3932 wait, wha-
The finale somehow left me with even more questions then the whole show, it’s kinda impressive because I didn’t know that that’s even possible
0:01 Ladybug and Chat noir's faces lmao i can't
I just wonder how many people is Astruc gonna block on twitter for telling something remotely negative about this dumpster fire of a end of season lol
I expect a lot of them
I don't know, I never counted, I'm not really a math guy you know.
He's just gonna sit on his screen all away blocking people. His ego is too big to be reasoned with.
I was trying to believe the Luka group was from the future 😂. It doesn't make much sense how trained they are.
True it's stupid 😂
Speaking of that, if the Luka group is from the future, then that scene, along Cat Blanc, kinda proves that the writing team doesn’t understand the concept of the “butterfly effect.”
Luka: I thought you can’t interfere with the past!
Bunnix: No, but it’s fine when you guys do it.
That is literally what they say. Like, Astruc, buddy. That’s not how that works. 😂
@@hwtvi3466 Honestly, trying to believe they were from the future was a coping mechanism 😭😂
was anyone else so confused at the sudden time skip that You had to go back to check that Paris didn’t suddenly turn white and that they really did make a statue of gabe?
When Gabriel told Marinette to not tell Adrien that he was Hawkmoth/Monarch it reminded me of that scene from Spider-Man where Green Goblin told Peter/Spider-Man to not tell his son Harry that he was Green Goblin.
Miraculous Ladybug literally is a rip-off of Spider-Man.
I was hoping the finale would prove me wrong. But it’s clear now.
Ladybug is Astrucs favorite child.