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Christian Unity & the Denominational Divide: With Matt Whitman
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 มิ.ย. 2021
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Such an amazing conversation, truly a blessing. Two of the best channels in a collab together. Would definitely love to see more come out of this!
Listening to this made me think, "How many times in my adult life have I been completely convinced of a theology, only to later discover, I was completely wrong". The answer is a lot. His ending quote is very good. I'll add, "Have grace, you could be wrong".
Those are the words of a wise Christian. Thank you.
Oh man, I've come to so many conclusions that are against what I have been taught...
We won't fully know what all we were wrong or right about until we go home to glory and God tells us what all it really was about. That's why it gets frustrating when Christians from certain camps, generally Catholics and Orthodox claim to have the whole untarnished truth because they were the first. They likely have more error than the rest, because it accumulated over time. Yet I honestly can't say where more error is, the protestant or Catholic side at this point. God will let us know.
Even with a masters degree in theology I always come away from these videos with a lot more knowledge and insight. This was a humbling and thought provoking interview. Thank you Remnant Radio and 10 minute Bible hour for what you do for the broader Christian community.
As someone from the AG, I watch more Catholic and Lutheran channels because of Matt's channel.
I AG too and I do the same thing! Really love learning the history of all denominations.
Thanks for this video guys!
Matt, I love your work and all of the study and questioning you've done over the years.
I came to faith while reading the bible, absent of any denominational affiliation or belief.
Honestly, because of that, the big question of denominations has always been a struggle for me.
Matt's videos have helped me better understand many of these differences and the call for unity amidst them.
The Lord sits at his table like a father with his children.
Little Billy is at the end, yelling that everyone needs to start with the cake first, Suzy is using her knife to eat her macaroni, Joey is tucking in his napkin before only drinking orange juice and not touching any food, Frank is upset at Heather because she isn't using her fork the way he is, and Timmy is sitting in a corner playing with his chicken nuggets.
And at the end of the table, there sits the Lord, shaking his head and saying "well, looks like the family's all here."
Yes, that's a great picture of all our churches, trying to tell each other how they are doing it wrong.
Thank you for having Matt on your show. Many of us in the Catholic and Orthodox communities have developed a great appreciation and affection for Matt through his open humanity and intellect. Tolles gespräch.
I love Matt's channel! This and his are some of my youtube favs.
Grace and Peace to you. I appreciate the utility and necessity of denominations, but I don't think we should settle for them. We should strive to reach the absolute truth of all aspects and facets of the faith. Achieving that would leave no room for denominations.
Absolutely agree brother, I think the great thing about this conversation is that... in saying we should strive for those things, we should also be able to accept that the way we do some things in our specific denominations may not be absolute truth in all aspects of the faith, and therefore should be okay to let them go. If it's only my group that's totally right, and everyone else is totally wrong, then it will just end up being a circular argument (as it already is).
@@reganb979 Great points, brother. None of us have a monopoly on truth.
@@lark8356 this is impossible on Earth until the Lord returns since the denomination ordeal dwindles down to minor changes in beliefs in a lot of areas. Some major ones, but most small
@@Andromedon777 Grace and Peace to you. I agree. We should still try.
Yes! I like catholicorthodoxapostolicpropheticpentecostalcharismaticepiscopalpresbyteriancongregationalbaptistadventistreformedChristian.
i love to hear from people who speak and act with humility from all faiths. As a teacher Yahsuah (the master of righteousnes +++) tells us to love one another as he loves us and love God....
Complete unity did not work and will not work. So let us unify in our differencies and differentiate in our freedom : but let no man/woman try to be God and try to be King/Queen over believers. 🙏❤️.
One Gospel, One New Covenant Church, One People of God
I was looking forward for this! Blessings 🙌🏼🙏🏼
Love this, been really excited for this interview!
Love both of these channels- thrilled you guys sat down and talked. Super encouraging.
Ties up so many emotions I’ve been going through as I’ve confronted my own paradigms. This conversation answered questions from the last three years of my studies so brilliantly leaving me hope filled. What an opportunity we have as a Christian community right now! My favorite episodes so far! :-)
Sweetly outstanding! I've been watching Matt for a long time now and I appreciate that you had him on.
What a fantastic guy. Thank you. God Bless
So glad you had this interview!
What a great conversation-keep up the good work guys.
Loved this interview! Thank you. 😊
I love both channels and have been subscribed for a while. Absolutely wonderful message and interview!
The world needs more of THIS. Well done.
Hey Matt, just in case you're lurking around these comments, I just wanted to say I have the utmost respect for you. I commented something on your first "conversation with a Catholic" video, which I meant as constructive pushback. I'm sure if you read it, you took it that way, but in the off-chance I contributed to that weight of pressure constantly on your back, just know that I'm not on your back, man. I love you very much, what you're all about, and what you provide to the family of faith. (Little Easter egg to show I've been listening to the podcast ;) )
Thank you for this topic. Thoroughly enjoyed it.
This really changed the way I look at demnominations in a good way !
Great conversation! Would love to hear from others (suggestion: Peter Leithart) on this topic of unity / denominationalism too.
"Finding the Right Hills to Die On" has been a really helpful book for me when it comes to practically working through theological differences and triaging which differences are the most important.
I love this topic. Great job!
Right on! It’s happening in Colombia.
Love Ten Minute Bible Hour guy!! Woo
This was a beautiful conversation.
Thank you
I guess the internet is worth keeping around😉
Social Media should be got rid off, period. Watch out for the upcoming Social (Media) Credit Score. All comments made on their page, will be used against them in the future CCPs Credit Score coming to a Western Country near you.
@@balung What does that mean?
Great Interview
Matt’s observation of the Church’s role in first figuring out the divisive problem of our age mathcjes well with Paul Vanderklay’s Estuary project. It’s encouraging to watch how God is still moving even in this weird internet age 🙌🏿
Around 26:00: "Through the efforts of some dude...who had a thorn probably literally jammed in his side, because I'm a Bible literalist..." Love Paul. Love Matt.
"Why not?" Love brother Lewis.
This was so good. This is a collaboration bigger then Marvel Cinematic Universe.
It’s the Christian TH-cam Channel Universe. CYCU.
Cameron Bertuzzi should join them haha
Haven't watched yet but I'm super stoked! I've been a big fan of the 10 minute Bible hour for a few years now but I'm an even bigger fan of Matt as a human being. He just seems like the nicest most respectful guy on the internet.
You are gracious. Thanks for liking my internet stuff and for being nice to me.
@@MattWhitmanTMBH I enjoyed it when I saw Destin from Smarter Everyday comment on your video "This is good internet" lol
I recall emailing him years ago thanking him for being such a wonderful Christian example of a great leader and influencer for exploration and Christ. You are in the same boat. The Lord is softening a lot of ours hearts by your journey. Keep going.
Matt is awesome, great interview. In my opinion the problem with denominations is 1) many lead people astray to heresy (non-trinitarians), 2) there is serious disunity which is not what Jesus wanted, 3) the disunity leads to people leaving the church entirely for the secular world. We are divided, and the secular world is conquering. I’m praying for unity, and the starting point is these types of discussions…
I wouldn't say point 1 is valid in that vast majority believe in trinity
Hey guys, love the show, just getting around to this one -- Josh, what you and Matt were talking about without using the word is "theological triage," arranging Christian doctrines by importance into first, second and third order.
First order doctrine separates Christian from non-Christian (the Trinity, bodily resurrection). Second order doctrine separates denominations (infant baptism, spiritual gifts). Third order doctrines don't -- shouldn't -- separate anyone (eschatology, who wrote Hebrews).
Al Mohler wrote a good article about this in 2004. I just wrote a seminary paper on it so I'm the world expert, of course. It struck me that this concept of theological triage is behind a lot of what y'all discuss on the show, although I've never heard you mention it directly. If you have sorry, missed it. Keep up the good work!
Brother Matt, doing the Bible. An ecumenical spirit is the mark of a true man of God.
Christians are Centered on Doctrine not Jesus Himself. Yes Doctrine is about Jesus but Christianity is supposed to be about following the person of Jesus not just being correct or finding cool knowledge about biblical facts. Love for one another should actually be more important.
I had a seminary professor who talked about making sure you know what bucket you put your theology in. One is your convictions, then your persuasion, and lastly your opinions. Many of us put everything, even our opinions in their conviction bucket. Make sure you know your buckets and put a your beliefs in the right place.
Brilliant
I can tell that Josh has been to black churches. I love how he encourages his guests. He knows what I'm talking about.
The last pastor I worked for was black i spent three years . And I spent a year doing digital marketing for the Potters House back in the day. So.... yeah.
Not sure what “black church” mannerism your picking up on though.
@@TheRemnantRadio I was referring to when you say "come on" when you hear something that you like.
@@lark8356 I'd say that's just a charistmatic background thing, haha. "Come on" "so good" "wow"
@@reganb979 Could be, brother. This reminds me of some fodder for trivia. The Pentecostal movement was birthed out of the Azusa Street Revival, which was lead by an African American preacher named William J. Seymour.
Honestly Matt is a hero!
Josh you too 🤣
Maybe could you please put the guest’s link in the show notes? Thank you!
I found my way online back when the Internet was awash in open protocol collaborative environments; BBSes, forums, list-servs, MUDs, syndicated news groups. I still hang with, and contribute to, open source and open data projects. I like these in part, because I find these (usually secular) environments and projects, with their altruistic goals, to be very Christ-like.
Ironically, when I try to introducing similar open community values and practices to my Christian friends and church, they are shot down as such things "will never work".
I think it comes down to a difference in world view. Whereas, the open community believes most people are good, my immediate Christian community believes people are "sinners". I'm in the middle, thinking sin should be thought of more as a cancer that we all suffer from, individually and as a community -- not our essence.
When he said, of non Trinitarians, “I don’t think you’re wrong,” I thought, “speaking of hateful uncharitable comments… get ready for those.” 😂. Glad the host took the time to allow him to clarify that wasn’t what he was saying for the less charitable who would have taken it and ran with it.
Good conversation. If you believe at any significant level that God is sovereign, then it necessarily means that His will was for a) denominations to exist, and b) that in spite of this, the Church would be unified in His Kingdom.
I feel like this conversation isn't over.....is it just me?
MATT!!!!!
Doctrines turned into tradition is divisive.
Like you got enough to deal with... but check out the story of Lord Blue Tooth.
Really refreshing dialogue.
It really gets me upset to see theology discussions be so toxic.
I mean what's the point of proving your Biblical stance is correct if your behavior is Biblically incorrect?
I just subscribed to Matt's channel. Looking forward to watching some videos.
So I really appreciate this conversation but at the same time, there are still real dividing issues between say a Catholic and a Protestant that do matter theologically. I grew up Catholic and have studied Catholic theology as a result quite a lot. I think sometimes this “Mere Christianity” approach, while helpful in many ways, can also lead people to believe that there are no dividing lines here that matter. Confession in a Catholic sense is not the same as Protestant, for instance. In Catholicism, you need the priest to grant you absolution as an “Alter Christus” or an “alternate Christ” standing in the very mode of Christ, in a sense, for that person. You can see why this is very different than the Protestant view of being able to confess directly to God and whomever else you may have wronged in the sin. As for the mass, the church calls it a “non-bloody propitiatory sacrifice” where they essentially re-offer the sacrifice of Christ again and again to God to atone for our sins. There is some debate as to whether or not that is truly a “once for all sacrifice” or not. Does the concept of Christ’s finished work on the cross matter? Does it effect how you view salvation? Is Mary a co-mediator with Christ? Is she a co-redemptrix? Because those are dogmas of the modern Catholic Church and do matter when it comes to the centrality of Christ as redeemer and mediator. I do think that all of these distinctions matters because it plays into how I view the Gospel, how I view sanctification, etc. it is important. The Reformers and others who challenged these traditions before them weren’t just complaining and weren’t addressing trivial things and we should be careful not to reduce what they did. At the same time, I think understanding what others believe can help us to view them more as people and therefore enable us to have kinder conversations with them about what they believe.
Wow, you are the only one in the comment section to see this. The real question here is what areas of theology must be defended, and we must begin with the issue of justification. How we answer that question is how we define the essence of the Gospel [or more specifically, "what must I do to be saved?"]. The Apostle Paul said whoever preaches a different gospel than he preached, let him be accursed [Gal.1:6]. But today, in the Laodicean church, we say, "forget about our differences, nobody knows all the truth" ... a page right out of the snakes book.
I was very disheartened at what was being presented in this video, and the only ray of hope that gave me hope was your comment. It seems like, in the view of these two gentlemen, the very Protestant Reformation was unwarranted, and both sides really believe the same gospel ... the "can't we just all get along attitude." This is precisely the main reason why the vast majority of the denominational "churches" in America are such a mess....it's all so very sad and depressing...
God Bless!!
Wow, you are the only one in the comment section to see this. The real question here is what areas of theology must be defended, and we must begin with the issue of justification. How we answer that question is how we define the essence of the Gospel [or more specifically, "what must I do to be saved?"]. The Apostle Paul said whoever preaches a different gospel than he preached, let him be accursed [Gal.1:6]. But today, in the Laodicean church, we say, "forget about our differences, nobody knows all the truth" ... a page right out of the snakes book.
I was very disheartened at what was being presented in this video, and the only ray of hope that gave me hope was your comment. It seems like, in the view of these two gentlemen, the very Protestant Reformation was unwarranted, and both sides really believe the same gospel ... the "can't we just all get along attitude." This is precisely the main reason why the vast majority of the denominational "churches" in America are such a mess....it's all so very sad and depressing...
God Bless!!
Wow, you are the only one in the comment section to see this. The real question here is what areas of theology must be defended, and we must begin with the issue of justification. How we answer that question is how we define the essence of the Gospel [or more specifically, "what must I do to be saved?"]. The Apostle Paul said whoever preaches a different gospel than he preached, let him be accursed [Gal.1:6]. But today, in the Laodicean church, we say, "forget about our differences, nobody knows all the truth" ... a page right out of the snakes book.
I was very disheartened at what was being presented in this video, and the only ray of hope that gave me hope was your comment. It seems like, in the view of these two gentlemen, the very Protestant Reformation was unwarranted, and both sides really believe the same gospel ... the "can't we just all get along attitude." This is precisely the main reason why the vast majority of the denominational "churches" in America are such a mess....it's all so very sad and depressing...
God Bless!!
@@rapturebound7369 I’m so glad you agree! I posted that comment because I didn’t see anyone else say it. These things absolutely do matter.
@@maggieprice357 Yeah, it seems like we're the ones they were talking about in the video who are the divisive ones. It can get pretty lonely and scary at times realizing just how very narrow the narrow road is. There are so very few remaining in these last minutes prior to the Rapture who are proclaiming the pure, true gospel ...and willing to take the persecution for doing so.
I'm absolutely convinced that we are witnessing the great falling away spoken of
in 2 Thess. 2 and 1 Timothy 4 ...as I said, it is truly heart-breaking, but it couldn't be any other way .. the words of scripture must be fulfilled. God Bless!!
But as for you, brethren,do not grow weary in doing good. And if anyone does not obey our word in this epistle, note that person and **do not keep company with him***, that he may be ashamed. Yet do not count him as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother. 2 Thessalonians 3:13-15
2 Thess is where Paul talks about the apostasy, antichrist and the rapture...so Paul considered those extremely important issues.
I'm sorry, but as an Orthodox Christian I have to disagree when you say that there were denominations in the first century. All these churches established by the apostles were in communion with each other, and shared a common faith. Denominations by definition don't have unity of faith. The apostles didn't establish different denominations, they established local churches which were all part of the same body. To claim otherwise would be tantamount to saying the the apostles scattered rather than gathering. St.Paul warned us against saying "I am of Paul" or "I am of Apollos" (or "I am of Luther" or "I am of Calvin").
I don't believe it was Luther's dream but the room couldn't agree. I wish, that all Christians would bases theology on the word of God alone. I wish that the age of criticism would end, and Christians would stop trying to put their understanding above what is written in the bible. Also, salvation is a gift from God, not a work. But that statement just made me an enemy of the Calvins, Catholics, the Lutherns, and the Presbyterians. So what can I do?
I like this dialogue, but sad to hear they like denominations. Jesus prayed that we would be one. With denominational separation that is not possible.
Did Jesus "work together" with the Pharisees? Did Paul "work together" with the Judaizers? Paul even said he'd wish that those who were saying you had to be circumcised to be saved, would castrate themselves.
Stop studying traditions and "church history" and just study the Bible- if you have the Holy Spirit and are seeking the truth He will show it to you and you can be assured it is correct. James 1 says if anyone lacks wisdom, let him ask God and He will give it to you generously if you believe.
These interviews are only introducing more confusion into the Body. We are not to be like children tossed to and fro by every wave of doctrine.
Many claim to have the HOLY SPIRIT and almost all differ about many things. If GOD is not author of confusion, HE definitly is not, then unfortunately the vast majority of Christians are lying to themselves, making themselves the authority of scripture.
Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, ***that you all speak the same thing***, and that there be **no divisions** among you, but that you be ***perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment***. For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Chloe’s household, that there are contentions among you. Now I say this, that each of you says, “I am of Paul,” or “I am of Apollos,” or “I am of Cephas,” or “I am of Christ.” Is Christ divided? 1 Corinthians 1:10-13
Holding on to a particular denomination instead of just being a follower of Jesus is error. And Catholicism or the Orthodox church ARE NOT denominations, they are false religions and need to be utterly rejected and taught against. We should love those people enough to tell them the truth.
😂😂😂 heretic! You are the one percent they were just talking about the one which is being preached against that is creating division. There is one sect continuously subdividing and it is NOT the Catholic Church… repent and believe in the gospel (without adding or subtracting to it). God bless.
Denomination are divisions in the body of Christ.. Christians are divided usually due to doctrine